Will The Big Beautiful Bill Make It Through The Senate?

Summary

Ruthless Podcast Episode Summary
Episode Title: Will The Big Beautiful Bill Make It Through The Senate?
Release Date: May 27, 2025
Hosts: Josh Holmes, Comfortably Smug, Michael Duncan, and John Ashbrook

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Introduction

The episode begins with Josh Holmes reflecting on the legislative challenges in Washington, emphasizing the tendency of politicians to avoid action due to political risks. He criticizes lawmakers like Thomas Massie for opposing spending cuts, thereby exacerbating deficits and providing Democrats with talking points.

Key Topics Discussed

1. The Budget Reconciliation Bill and Tax Cuts

Josh Holmes introduces the main topic: the progress of the budget reconciliation bill, a cornerstone of President Trump's economic agenda. He highlights the complexities involved in passing the bill through both the House and the Senate, especially given the narrow Republican majority.

• Notable Quote:
  Josh Holmes [00:00]: “Everybody's going to find a reason to say no to anything in Washington because anything is political risk. Doing nothing is the easiest thing to do.”

Comfortably Smug and other hosts commend Speaker Johnson's leadership in navigating these challenges, praising his ability to unify diverse Republican factions to pass essential components like the "no tax on tips" provision.

• Notable Quote:
  Comfortably Smug [04:26]: “Has any politician been doubted more in their leadership in such a short period of time than this man? And has he. Has anyone delivered more in that period of time?”

2. The Electric Vehicle (EV) Mandate Controversy

A significant portion of the discussion centers around the electric vehicle mandates imposed by California and subsequently adopted by 11 other states and the District of Columbia. These mandates require a substantial percentage of new cars sold to be electric, excluding hybrids, leading to concerns about consumer choice, increased costs, and job losses in traditional automotive sectors.

• Notable Quote:
  Shelley Moore Capito [48:44]: “Next year, 30% of the new cars sold in California and 11 other states and the District of Columbia had to be electric vehicles. By 2035, zero cars sold in these regions had to be anything but electric.”

The hosts express frustration over the federal government's inability to override these state-level mandates, framing it as an overreach that ties America's economic future to California's policies. They discuss the use of the Congressional Review Act to nullify these mandates, highlighting Senator Shelley Moore Capito’s pivotal role in this effort.

• Notable Quote:
  Shelley Moore Capito [49:32]: “We are very pleased about this because what happened was... this doesn't break the filibuster. It doesn't overrule the parliamentarian because we worked really hard to work the right way.”

3. Legislative Process and Bipartisan Efforts

Josh Holmes delves into the intricacies of the legislative process required to pass and reconcile the budget bill between the House and Senate. He underscores the importance of bipartisan cooperation and the strategic maneuvers needed to navigate procedural hurdles like the Byrd Rule.

• Notable Quote:
  Josh Holmes [21:10]: “This is like a... What do we need to see here? And ultimately, how do you get that over the finish line?... if you're actually want to make a tangible difference, you gotta be a part of that solution.”

Shelley Moore Capito elaborates on the bipartisan nature of Medicaid reforms within the bill, emphasizing the need to balance budgetary constraints without harming vulnerable sectors like rural hospitals.

• Notable Quote:
  Shelley Moore Capito [13:14]: “But you know, there are two houses of Congress and the bill now goes to the Senate and Medicaid will take center stage because there are a bunch of Republican senators from rural states who want to make sure that waste, fraud and abuse was written in the right way so that it doesn't hurt these rural hospitals that are struggling out there.”

4. Guest Segment: Senator Shelley Moore Capito

Senator Shelley Moore Capito joins the discussion to shed light on the recent Senate actions against the EV mandates. She outlines the challenges faced, the strategies employed to garner support, and the importance of maintaining consumer choice and economic stability.

• Notable Quote:
  Shelley Moore Capito [49:32]: “We were very pleased about this because... this doesn't break the filibuster. It doesn't overrule the parliamentarian because we worked really hard to work the right way.”

She also touches upon the broader implications of environmental policies on states like West Virginia, stressing the need for balanced approaches that consider both economic growth and environmental sustainability.

• Notable Quote:
  Shelley Moore Capito [54:02]: “Particularly in environmental policies. They're unattainable goals. They're expensive. Who's going to pay for all this?”

5. Audience Interaction and Humor

The hosts engage in lighthearted segments, including a humorous “Question of the Day” where listeners are asked, “Would you jerk off a horse to save your house?” This segment, though offbeat, serves to maintain an engaging and entertaining atmosphere amidst the heavy legislative discussions.

• Notable Quote:
  Josh Holmes [32:56]: “Would you jerk off a horse to save your house? Good God.”

6. The Diddy Trial Brief Mention

While the main focus remains on legislative matters, the hosts briefly touch upon the Diddy trial, discussing its sensational aspects and the potential political ramifications. However, this segment is more for entertainment and anecdotal purposes rather than a deep dive into the topic.

• Notable Quote:
  Josh Holmes [41:05]: “Okay, I don't know how much you guys have been paying attention to this Diddy trial. I've basically like, put it aside. It's everywhere and people are talking about it and like you expect all kinds of different things.”

Conclusions and Forward Look

The episode concludes with a confident outlook on the passage of the budget reconciliation bill through the Senate. Josh Holmes reiterates the importance of bipartisan solutions and the determination needed to overcome political inertia.

• Notable Quote:
  Josh Holmes [53:34]: “That is what makes for big things. She did it with that. Fellas, look, you gotta like and subscribe. I'm just telling you, if you're not liking and subscribing and sending all to your friends. You're missing the worst stuff, the ditty stuff.”

Senator Capito assures listeners that despite procedural challenges, the Senate is poised to finalize the bill, potentially by early July or August, aligning with the administration’s economic goals.

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Final Thoughts

This episode of the Ruthless Podcast provides an in-depth analysis of the legislative hurdles surrounding the budget reconciliation bill and the contentious electric vehicle mandates. Through insightful discussions and expert commentary from Senator Shelley Moore Capito, the hosts illuminate the strategic efforts required to navigate Washington's complex political landscape. Balancing serious policy debates with moments of humor, the episode offers both informative and entertaining content for listeners keen on understanding the intricacies of American politics.

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Be sure to like, subscribe, and share this episode to stay informed on the latest conservative perspectives in Washington.

Transcript

[Josh Holmes]

Everybody's going to find a reason to say no to anything in Washington because anything is political risk. Doing nothing is the easiest thing to do. And you see that with, like, Thomas Massie saying no. Like, no, it's going to run up our deficits, giving Democrats a talking point in the process. It's like, okay, well, I mean, you go home and tell people they have a 25% increase on their taxes and at the same time that you're also voting no to no avail on no spending cuts and everything else. You know what I mean? Like, if you actually want to make a tangible difference, you gotta be a part of that solution.

[Dick Durbin]

He's Donald Trump's number one enemy in Congress. Chicago Senator Dick Durbin. And now Dick Durbin has a new scheme, a government takeover of your credit card. Today, consumers have thousands of choices in credit cards, all with equal, strong security. But Durbin's plan is less competition and less security, and that means more risk for your credit and your identity. Tell Republicans in Congress, stop Dick Durbin's takeover of your credit card before it's too late.

[Michael Duncan]

Ladies and gentlemen, your attention please.

[John Ashbrook]

Keep the fate, hold the line and own the lids.

[Michael Duncan]

It's time for our main event.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, a very good Tuesday to you coming out of this holiday weekend. I trust everybody had a wonderful Memorial Day, a very, very good time to remember all the heroes that came before us that ensured we can do things like this in the greatest country in the world, in the world has ever seen. I'm Josh Holmes, along with comfortably smug Michael Duncan and John Ashbrook, left to right, across your radio dial. Listen, if you didn't get a chance over Memorial Day, just sort of reflect on all of the sacrifices that our men and women in uniform have made and those who made the ultimate sacrifice. Take a minute and think about it, because ultimately, that's what all of this stuff is about. It's the reason why we can do all of it and why we can have fun here in the Ruthless Variety program. My sense is, is that Nazi Germany or, you know, what Hamas has in mind for us would be something different than a Ruthless variety program and certainly something less than the liberty and the freedom that we enjoy in this country. So thank you for joining us. We've got a very fun show. Listen, there's a bunch of things that have happened here in the last week. There's a tendency for all of the media to focus in on promises and process, right? They cover what it is that people say that they're gonna do. And then the process by which they go about doing. Not a lot of conversation dedicated to the hard, painstaking work that it takes to get those things done. And if anything, you get a headline the next day like, ah, they passed this and that. Here we go. Everybody thought they were going to do that because, you know, Republicans are Republicans. Two things in particular. You're all aware of the budget reconciliation bill, the tax cuts, which we long flagged as the most difficult part of the Trump agenda because of the narrow majority that House Republicans have and their ability to get that done. And for the last 60, 90 days, you've had every member of the press corps and pundits and everybody else being like, well, I don't know, let's find the three dissidents who say they're not gonna vote for it. And maybe it's up in the air, maybe they can't get it done. But just recall, this is a cornerstone of the economic agenda that President Trump talked about on the campaign trail in 2024. And, like, what unlocks everything that he's doing internationally and everything else. Like, you can settle our domestic stuff without it. There's, like, you know, 24% tax increase on Americans. It's insane. And they never talk, of course, the media never talks about it that way. But a bunch of different constituencies within any majority, but certainly this majority, if you got a very diverse group of Republicans from different places around the country. And finding that balance is very difficult. Speaker Johnson found that balance.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah. I mean, has any politician been doubted more in their leadership in such a short period of time than this man? And has he. Has anyone delivered more in that period of time? It's incredible. I feel like at every turn, that guy is doubted. Back to your whole point of, like, they only focus on promise and process. And the way that the media talks about it is like, oh, slipping.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Comfortably Smug]

You know, Speaker Johnson's majority slipping.

[Josh Holmes]

I'm not sure he has the swat.

[Comfortably Smug]

How can he put it together.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Comfortably Smug]

And time and time again, he proves them wrong.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, just a really important part of process. Now, listen, this is a long thing. This was maybe step three in the process. You needed to get a package. You need to get out of the House committees, you needed to ultimately pass the House. Now it goes to the Senate. It's going to look a little bit different. And then they got to reconcile their differences, actually get to a point where the final process is President Trump signing the big, beautiful bill into law. You know, I wouldn't say we're halfway home, but we're almost Halfway home. And this part is what everybody flagged as a huge problem. We're going to talk about all of that. Another piece. And we've got a guest on to talk about something that happened in the Senate this week. Thin margins as well. But there's this whole electric vehicle mandate and a bunch of states adopting the California standard of mandating. Basically, you get rid of your, your gas powered vehicle.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yuck. Gross.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. But a whole bunch of states did this.

[Comfortably Smug]

Imagine following California into fucking anything.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Seriously, they're like, sorry, no combines. You need to get your fields cleared with a scooter.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Brought to you by California.

[Comfortably Smug]

You know, we're looking for good government management. You know what, let's, let's see what California's.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, I want to adopt what they got going on.

[Comfortably Smug]

It's going so well.

[Josh Holmes]

So. But again, this was a cornerstone promise that the Trump administration had made during the course of the campaign. It was an open discussion. Right. Like environmental rules aren't typically top of mind for most voters. This one was. He talked about it on the stump each and every night that he went out during the 24 election. And it was about making sure that Americans weren't forced to just get rid of the shit that they loved and start importing technology from China in order to get to work in the morning. And people were like, no, I don't want that. Well, I mean, no, talk about that. The EPA has done everything they can do internally to roll these things back. You've seen Energy and Interior do similar things, but ultimately what they needed was an act of Congress and they needed the House to act, which they did a couple of months ago. And they needed the Senate to figure out a way to cobble together a coalition with arcane rules that I'm not gonna get into here. But it was complicated. In order to fulfill the promise, they did it like you probably didn't even know about this. Didn't hit headlines, or at least not something that you're probably.

[Michael Duncan]

That's what the libs were hoping for.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

You know, the libs want to change our society from the top down and they don't want anybody to complain about it in the process.

[John Ashbrook]

And also it flies directly in the face and against the wishes of what the American people have made clear. I mean, you look at what used electric car prices look like, you'll get, how long electric cars sit on dealerships. Talk to someone who owns a car dealership. Like, how much confidence do you have in the electric vehicles you've got to sell and how Much confidence do you have in the gas vehicles you gotta sell? What are people actually buying? So when you have a situation like you're seeing California's already created a problem out of, when you've got a government trying to force your hand, you never get a good outcome.

[Josh Holmes]

Never get a good outcome. But it took an action that you may not even know happened, because certainly the libs don't want you to know about it, that the Senate actually did an incredible job. The leader of that effort is with us here today, Shelley Moore. Capito? She's gonna talk a lot about that, and then we've got some variety. Diddy is gonna pop up. Been too long.

[Michael Duncan]

Oh, boy.

[Josh Holmes]

You knew it was coming, though. Program can't resist this conversation.

[Comfortably Smug]

It's too juicy.

[Josh Holmes]

And there's a little political nexus in there. So we're gonna talk about that. We're gonna have a lot of fun along the way. So let's get into this reconciliation bill quickly. Listen, you all know that all of your tax rates are going up. If this thing didn't get done, Democrats don't want to talk about. Talk about it. In terms of tax cuts. Oh, it's a big tax cut now. It's preventing a tax increase, but it also adds key components. No tax on tips, no tax on overtime.

[John Ashbrook]

Can I ask a question real quick?

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

You know a lot about the Senate. How the hell did no tax on tips get, like, unanimous vote in the Senate? Like, you couldn't get free doughnuts and coffee to get unanimous votes in the Senate. Like, how the hell does that happen?

[Josh Holmes]

Listen, President Trump has a hot hand, and he's the secret weapon when it comes to trying to congeal different viewpoints within a Republican conference in the House and the Senate. I can tell you that not everybody thinks that pro growth tax policy includes no tax on tips. But this was a centerpiece of the Trump campaign. They know who the leader of the party is. They know who has the biggest voice. They know he wants it done, so it's done. Right. I mean, that's really what it boils down to. Other components. I mean, this is a. Look, this is a very populous tax bill. If you think about tax bills that Republicans have done over recent years, nobody can claim with a straight face that this is like a tax cut for the rich. You just can't. It's just not. First of all, it's the same tax rate for everybody other than people who are making their living on tips or overtime or.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah, you know, Democrats will try. And their press secretaries Working in legacy media will do their best effort, but nobody is reading them because nobody believes them. They want to know the actual details. The people who are consuming the information are a lot smarter than the people writing the information would ever believe.

[Josh Holmes]

You know my favorite part about tax debates are, is like when Democrats start losing the argument and all of a sudden you see these impassioned arguments out of concern for our national debt.

[Michael Duncan]

Oh yeah, they care so much about it.

[Josh Holmes]

These are people who like wave through $6 trillion of spending on like green new energy. Like shit that you're never going to benefit from.

[John Ashbrook]

They're like, we sent billions to STACEY ABRAMS Like 20 minutes before we wheeled Bide. Listen guys, we gotta go, we gotta.

[Michael Duncan]

Watch spending a little bit.

[Josh Holmes]

It's like, oh my God, what about the debt?

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, right.

[Michael Duncan]

The only way to fix the climate is to spend $2 billion with Stacey Abrams NGO. Yeah, you can't, you can't do it otherwise. I mean, let's be honest, you know, the climate needs Stacey Abrams. I mean she's the.

[John Ashbrook]

And then like a month ago they're having sit ins to prevent Elon from entering buildings and they're like, no, no, no.

[Comfortably Smug]

We cannot cut our NGOs.

[Josh Holmes]

Well did trans studies in Tanzania critical to our national infrastructure, there's no question about that. But then you know, you think of like attache things that are like hundreds of millions if not billions of dollars of the American taxpayer money that are meant to like just solve political problems for Democrats. Like what, the pier in Gaza?

[Michael Duncan]

Oh man.

[Josh Holmes]

Right. They like collapsed and harmed service members as a result of just the absolutely ill conceived notion that you were doing something to help because you needed a constituency within the United States, a pro Hamas constituency. To think that you weren't like pro Israel.

[John Ashbrook]

It's unbelievable. And the thing is getting that like no tax on tips, the fact that that's a component I think really underscores and it's going to make it a lot harder for Democrats to be like, no, this is a rich person.

[Comfortably Smug]

Well, yeah, and so I think that was obviously important to the President. I think also for conservatives, House Freedom Caucus members and stuff like that. There were also some deals that they made on the spending side which I think improved the bill dramatically. You know, it was originally these Medicaid reforms were going to start I think in 2029 and they, they backed them up, moved up to 2026 and stuff like that. So we're going to see the savings of cutting all of that fraud out of the system a lot sooner in the Bills package.

[Josh Holmes]

Now if anybody who says Medicaid cuts, these are work requirements, right? These are things that we all agree.

[Comfortably Smug]

On, literally part time for able bodied with no dependents and no disability.

[Josh Holmes]

These are things that everyone agrees and they keep saying Medicaid cuts throw people off.

[John Ashbrook]

It's another 80, 20, like Democrats are super, super committed to the 20%.

[Michael Duncan]

But you know, there are two houses of Congress and the bill now goes to the Senate and Medicaid will take center stage because there are a bunch of Republican senators from rural states who want to make sure that waste, fraud and abuse was written in the right way so that it doesn't hurt these rural hospitals that are struggling out there. And so what they want to make sure is that everything that was written so quickly in the House to pass it by this deadline at Memorial Day doesn't hurt their rural look, the Senate's.

[Josh Holmes]

Going to take a different path, no question about it. But I just want to speak to the Medicaid thing for a minute. Look, it's a bipartisan. Medicaid is a bipartisan thing in large part because red states across this country balance their books in large part out of federal largesse. If you're wondering how he got $36 trillion in debt, it's not just Social Security, Medicaid, Medicare, all of that, that's the predominant driver. But it's also what's happened, I would say for 15 years basically since the financial crisis in 08, which maybe since 9, 11 with all the federal funds that went into building up law enforcement and all those things is ultimately states have never had to make a difficult decision. Everybody's like, well why don't you be, why don't the federal government operate more like states? We have to balance the budget each and every. Well, I'll tell you why. Because the federal government doesn't have a federal government that's backfilling all their dumb fuck decisions, right? Which is what a lot of these states have been doing. And so there's a revenue like Medicaid is a state administered program except for the fact that the federal government is the one that is predominantly funding it. So what people in the House of Representatives has suggested is that maybe we have some kind of a cost sharing agreement here where you guys, the promises that you're making through like Medi Cal, the worst offender of all of them. But all of these various state based Medicaid things, I don't know if you guys have to make tough budget decisions, fucking make them. Don't count on us just sending Blind bundles of cash like Obama did to Iran.

[John Ashbrook]

They're like, no, why should we have skin in the game?

[Michael Duncan]

Right? And I remember joking with one of my good buddies in college about, hey, did you ever notice the highways in West Virginia are as paved perfectly in a way that none of the other highways around this country are? And it's because Senator Bob Byrd for years was the most powerful appropriator in the United States Senate, and his highways were funded and paved by the federal government because he was so powerful. And we always joked about that. But there's a lesson in there in that this president deserves to get his bill passed through the Senate. And the only way to get it passed through the Senate is to make sure that a lot of these rural state senators are not overlooked. And there are so many of them who are concerned that the fine print about Medicaid and rural hospitals and everything else underneath that doesn't hurt their constituents. So I just think you got a.

[Josh Holmes]

Lot more sympathy for that than I do.

[Michael Duncan]

Well, it's not about sympathy. It's about reality. It's about how do we get it across the finish line. If you can't convince somebody to vote yes, you're not going to get what you want.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

And I think that we're going to see play out over the next two months. A lot of these rural state members.

[Comfortably Smug]

Say, I think they're gonna get to yes, dude. I mean, look about what we want. Look at the people who got to yes in the House. I mean, like, you mentioned him, I believe, on. On the episode last week. But Chip Roy. Chip Roy got to yes on this.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Comfortably Smug]

And he did the smart thing, which is he didn't deal himself out.

[Josh Holmes]

That's so smart. It's the distinction between Chip and. I've known chip for 15, 20 years, but it's this distinction. Distinction between Chip and Massey where if you want to shape the package, if you want to be in that room to the end to figure out how to bring those Medicaid reforms from 29 to 26, you need to stay in that conversation.

[Comfortably Smug]

And Chip. Roy also got reimbursement for border states who've been dealing with that whole invasion during the Biden years. And he wouldn't have gotten that additional reimbursement on border security if not for being in that room and continuing to negotiate, not throwing up your hands.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, look, guy catches a lot of heat.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

And.

[Michael Duncan]

But he's. But he's also not a pushover.

[Josh Holmes]

Right.

[Michael Duncan]

And I think the other lesson that can be learned by what Chip Roy did that I know will be taken by these rural state senators is yes, we don't think illegals should be getting money that belongs to American taxpayers. Yes, we do not think waste, fraud and abuse should be in the system.

[Josh Holmes]

But.

[Michael Duncan]

But we don't want things written in a way that hurts people who shouldn't be hurt and so they will be listened to.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah, I think we just gotta be for. I mean, my philosophy on all this, be for the most conservative thing possible.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah, that's exactly right.

[Comfortably Smug]

Be for the most conservative thing possible.

[Josh Holmes]

Also be for what's going to happen, which is this thing's going to get done. So figure out how to be a.

[Michael Duncan]

Part of that process, get on board for the big win.

[Josh Holmes]

Exactly. When we come back, we're going to talk a little bit about the rest of this process. You mentioned a little bit about the Senate. We'll talk about that and where it goes from here right after this.

[John Ashbrook]

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[Josh Holmes]

Bill, White House obviously taking a bit of a victory lap, as is the House of Representatives about moving this centerpiece of the economic agenda forward. We've got multiple steps. The Senate's got to pass this thing. They're going to have a different look. It's not like at this point you can't fault them. They've done a bunch of different work on this too. They're going to have a little different look. I think the main contours are going to be the same, but it's going to be a different deal. And then it's up to House and the Senate to reconcile their differences. And you know, whether that is a formal sort of conference committee or whether or not it's done informally, ultimately there'd be a substitution that's gonna have to pass both one more time before it gets to the president.

[Comfortably Smug]

Explain that part, the substitution part, so people understand.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, so I mean, look, the House and the Senate ultimately need a product that can pass both sides.

[Comfortably Smug]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

Generally speaking, the way that that works is the Senate's gonna pass something that doesn't exactly match what it is that the House is doing, although they've been talking. So I think there's going to be a lot of similarities in it at that point. In order to make a bill become a law, you have to have some kind of a manager's package. And whether that goes through a formal conference committee where you have members of the House and the Senate that sit on a committee together and actually hash through the differences and pass that out and then it goes to both chambers, or whether or not there is a negotiation of the leaders of the two with the committee chairman of both sides, and they come up with a mutually agreeable solution that they think can pass, then it's what they just call a substitution. It's just a manager's package where you put it there and they vote both sides. They're not going to take like a ping pong approach, which is the other thing that you hear ultimately when you're trying to make a law. If the House has a different view than the Senate, they keep sending back and forth different variations without meeting the middle. That's not happening.

[Comfortably Smug]

No. And that process allows you to basically cut to the chase.

[Josh Holmes]

This is. This is like a. Okay, yeah, thanks for your views. Thanks for our views.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

What do we need to see here? And ultimately, how do you get that over the finish line? Because age doesn't improve. I mean, everybody's gonna find a reason to say no to anything in Washington because anything is political risk. Doing nothing is the easiest thing to do. And you see that with like, Thomas Massie saying no. Like, no, it's gonna run up our deficits, giving Democrats a talking point in the process. It's like, okay, well, I mean, you go home and tell people they have a 25% increase on their taxes and at the same time that you're also voting no to no avail on no spending cuts and everything. You know what I mean? Like, if you actually want to make a tangible difference, you got to be a part of that solution. And I think the House under Speaker Johnson's leadership at this point has demonstrated that solutions are at hand, that they can deal with that. And I think the Senate is too. I think they've had a pretty good. The one thing I've really respected, for those of you who are listening to this, who are sort of on in under the hood and appreciate like the little pieces of legislative activity and whatnot. It was always the most difficult part, serving in Senate leadership to try to get your people just piped down while the other side's dealing with it, you know, because somebody would say something that was egregiously offensive to your people. Like, for example, that Lalo character where he's like, yeah, we're going to go increase taxes on the top bracket so I can get my state and local tax deduction. Like, there's probably 40 out of 53 senators who are like, fuck you.

[Michael Duncan]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

Like, I will never vote for any of that.

[Comfortably Smug]

There's no Republican senators in New York the last time I checked. Right, right, right.

[Josh Holmes]

But like, instead of doing that, which could cause ripples, they just sort of sat on it. You haven't heard a breath from a Republican senator. Credit to Thune. Honestly and tell and the committee people of saying, like, lay low, let them do their business. You're going to get a shot here. And when you get your shot, then we got to come to the middle. Let's not like break all the china while we're doing it. I mean, this is. This is very much under the hood, probably more than you need to know. But that's. That's like the art of getting big things.

[Comfortably Smug]

Well, yeah, it's never smart to negotiate hypotheticals in public before you really even have your shot to do the thing. It's just not smart tactically. Right. Like, if you're a ball coach, you're not going out talking about your playbook, you know, before the game.

[Josh Holmes]

Totally.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah. You mentioned if you're a ball. I always. I think you guys agree on this. I always look at politics, like sports, and I always think about, okay, what's the game clock say? And I. And I've been trying to think, what is the realistic time frame for when the Senate will actually pass something and go back to the House and then go back to the Senate and get it done? And is it the end of the year is at the August recess. There's a lot of talk back and forth about that, but one thing someone told me today is that the X date may be pinned to when Scott Bessen, our great Treasury Secretary, has suggested that the debt limit needs to be addressed. And that, my friends, comes apparently sometime in July or August. So we're looking at.

[Josh Holmes]

Because recall, it rides along with it. You're absolutely right. The thing that forces action in Congress are must do things right.

[John Ashbrook]

It's the only thing. The only. It's so frustrating. The only way Congress is like, oh, shit, the House is on fire. I guess we gotta get up and do something.

[Comfortably Smug]

Master procrastination.

[Josh Holmes]

It's incredible, but it's also human nature in many ways, and that you know that anything that's significant is gonna be controversial, and anything that's controversial when you're in the world of politics is to be avoided. And so they never really want to do anything unless they absolutely have to. So that's why you butt up against deadlines. That's why the end of the year is a big legislating time. That's why the August recess is a big legislating time. That's why things like debt ceilings and then September 30, fiscal year things are big times because you're up against something that you have to do something before it happens.

[Comfortably Smug]

I get it. I never move the trampoline in the backyard till the landscapers are coming.

[Josh Holmes]

Exactly.

[Comfortably Smug]

No, it's true.

[Josh Holmes]

You could do it any day of the week.

[Comfortably Smug]

Literally any day. Kids never bounce on the thing anymore. Dad and mom sweat it out there to put the thing together, and they never use it.

[Michael Duncan]

No, I know.

[Josh Holmes]

It's a real. I hate that.

[Comfortably Smug]

And now I got a bare spot in the lawn underneath it. I moved the thing. I gotta seed it. I just hate it.

[Josh Holmes]

So, look, I think the middle of July is where they're talking about with this debt ceiling. For those of us with experience of that, there's always extreme circumstances, right? Extenuating circumstances where you can figure out how to buy a week or two or whatever, which tells you August 1st, the deadline. And I heard all week, over the last two weeks, everyone telling me, like, now this is like, they're having huge trouble in the House. It's an end of the year deal. Just because that's the only way that this. They're going to have to do something. Before that, I was like, I don't know, man. It feels like they're closer together on this. And they have been an awful lot of things, like, I think you're going to get done this week. And then, sure enough, they do, which also tells me August 1st, you think so? I do. Now, there's a chance that you have to hold people in over August, and there's nothing more unpopular internally in the House and the Senate.

[Michael Duncan]

But here's what I will say, and I think you guys will all agree with me, if they don't get it done by August 1st, they need to keep working until it happens. Like I'll tell you right now, that's what they'll do. I never had an August recess. I worked on Capitol Hill for years and years and years. I never had an August, recess. We always had to work right through it. And I think this time they're gonna have. And, no, this is gonna be a very unpopular thing to say. I'm gonna get a lot of nasty grams in my text messages. But I feel like everybody has to keep working because Trump's agenda is so important.

[Comfortably Smug]

I don't care if we get nasty grams. I haven't had resets since middle school.

[John Ashbrook]

That's what I'm saying, since elementary. I think until every illegal alien is out of the country, no recess for Congress.

[Michael Duncan]

There you go.

[John Ashbrook]

You know, I think the public support that.

[Josh Holmes]

There you go. There you go.

[Michael Duncan]

Laying down the gauntlet. This guy doesn't mess around. Come on.

[John Ashbrook]

Recess. We're talking about recess.

[Josh Holmes]

We're talking about recess.

[Comfortably Smug]

We all know how hard Smug works nonstop.

[John Ashbrook]

Why can't Congress work half as hard?

[Comfortably Smug]

Hardest working man in show business.

[Josh Holmes]

What did I say today? That 4 o' clock pud pulling thing can't be rescheduled. I love you so much.

[John Ashbrook]

While I'm in traffic driving back from the swamp, I'm gonna think about that.

[Josh Holmes]

So our question of the day. You just heard our timeline. Our question of the day for all of you is when does Trump sign the big beautiful bill? When do you think that's going to be? Frankly, I think he, I think he comes back day after Labor Day and they put ink on that. But I'd be interested in what you all think. You all have business, you know, you've got a plan for what your tax situation looks like, or you've got a job and you want to make sure that you've got some cash in the bank in order to fund kids softball and school and everything else. Like, when would you do it? I would do it tomorrow if I could, but interested in your prognostications on all of that, we'll be joined by Shelley Moore, Capito, to talk about the second thing that we talked about. And we're going to get to that. But we're also just going to talk a little bit of our last question of the day. Wonderful episode, by the way.

[Comfortably Smug]

Great episode.

[Josh Holmes]

Jillian Michaels, great guest. Incredible in your questions and answers right after this.

[Dick Durbin]

Qualcomm is designing and developing the next generation of AI connectivity and low power high performance computing right here in the US we support President Trump's call for America's industrial revival, an agenda focused on restoring strength, scaling innovation, and securing our company competitive edge. Our partnerships with Aramco Digital and Humane reflect that mission, putting US Technology to work, transforming global industries and proving that American leadership still sets the standard. Qualcomm Engineering Human Progress.

[Josh Holmes]

Hardworking Americans know when it's time to roll up our sleeves and get the job done. Now is the time to unleash our nation's energy, to create jobs, secure our future, and make life better, more affordable, and full of opportunity for all Americans. That's the power of America's oil and natural gas. Learn [e-mail] paid for by the American Petroleum Institute. So, Jillian Michaels, lovely human being, Very easy to talk to. Genuinely normal.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah, very much. Not dc. Not dc. You know, the way she talks and, and everything. I loved her. It was a breath of fresh air.

[Josh Holmes]

You always wonder when somebody has, like a prime time network television show for a number of years. It's like, number one, you figure that that kind of exposure makes somebody weird.

[John Ashbrook]

Exact opposite.

[Josh Holmes]

She's the opposite.

[John Ashbrook]

Most normal person. For being like one of the most famous people, recognizable people on earth.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

And it struck me when she was talking about, like, the way Megyn Kelly just destroyed Jake Tapper, that would be like the best show ever. Like a good Cop, Bad Cop, Julian Michaels, Megyn Kelly show. Like, who'd be the good cop? That's the thing. If you get. If you're getting grilled by Megan and you get caught lying, you're dropping and doing 50.

[Comfortably Smug]

It's bad cop and worst cop just ball busters.

[Josh Holmes]

It all depends on what you done.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, I love it. Each one of them have their thing. No, you're right. That would make for.

[Comfortably Smug]

That'd be a funny show.

[Josh Holmes]

Worst Cop, I'd like to put it, like, it's not necessarily about the fats, which Jillian has majored in screaming at the fats, but, like, if just emasculating, like those sort of like, agenda.

[John Ashbrook]

Just bring in the journos. It's like Jurassic park when they had to feed the raptors. Like, bring a journo in a cage.

[Josh Holmes]

Like, all the.

[John Ashbrook]

Lower them down, lower down. And he sees it's Jillian and Megan.

[Josh Holmes]

Like, all the people, all the younger generation that shows up at HR and is like, I'm not feeling appreciated. And I, you know, I just need a little bit of thought process put behind what you have in me and all these things. Like, then you're like, congratulations, Jillian and Megan have something for you.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, you're in the cage, you're getting dropped into the little raptor enclosure, and.

[Josh Holmes]

It'S Jillian and Megyn Kelly, and those two are gonna spend the next hour yelling at you.

[John Ashbrook]

I mean, for folks who haven't seen it. You have to see Megyn Kelly interview Jake Tapper. It was amazing. So amazing.

[Josh Holmes]

But they would make a formidable.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, great.

[Josh Holmes]

All right, so our question of the day. How do we make America healthy again? Plus we added the horse component. I just threw that in at the end. But it seems like the people.

[Michael Duncan]

What was the horse question?

[Josh Holmes]

Well, we had that poor unfortunate couple in England who had a house that was zoned for horse semen extraction and they didn't provide any. So they were in the unfortunate Hobson's choice of either having to figure out how to extract the horse semen or lose their home.

[Michael Duncan]

So the bonus question that we asked people to respond to is, would you jerk off a horse to save your house? Good God.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah. This is off the rails.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. So we had all of that, a.

[Michael Duncan]

Multi part for the audience and nobody disappointed.

[Josh Holmes]

And when you liked and you subscribed and sent your answers, we read them. We start with a voice.

[Michael Duncan]

Okay, first comment comes from Rat Boyd. And that comment says, take the high fructose corn syrup out of Coca Cola, put back the real sugar and the cocaine. We just have the best listeners.

[Josh Holmes]

The answer to making America healthy again is legalizing cocaine. That's the view here on the ruthless variety.

[John Ashbrook]

They make that the formula for their diet Coke. And they're like, seriously, people start losing weight when they're drinking.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, super productive. Yeah, it's amazing if you've noticed.

[John Ashbrook]

Clean your house, go dancing all night.

[Josh Holmes]

A little bit of a weird jaw curl, but other than that, very productive. Smart.

[Michael Duncan]

Best sense of humor dunks.

[Josh Holmes]

What do we got?

[Comfortably Smug]

This is from Keith Kravitz. Keith writes, taxed, unhealthy processed foods to subsidize healthy food costs. To make healthy foods cost less than unhealthy. Same as they did with cigarettes to pay for commercials. To get people to quit, you have to incentivize healthy eating. It will save our health care systems billions. It's interesting.

[Michael Duncan]

It's very interesting. And what a lot of people don't know is that Keith is actually Lenny's younger brother and he's taken a very line on health care in this country.

[Comfortably Smug]

I don't think I agree with, with Keith. I don't tend to think we should be taxing people's choices.

[Josh Holmes]

Not a huge fan of state sponsored incentives.

[Comfortably Smug]

This feels like a Mike Bloomberg thing.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, it is a Bloomberg thing. But it's an.

[Comfortably Smug]

But I think, I think it gets at an important component of this is like people. Maybe I didn't realize this, but people do not really have good nutrition education in this country.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

We had the food pyramid.

[John Ashbrook]

It was all bullshit.

[Comfortably Smug]

We just really don't understand what health.

[John Ashbrook]

Again, it's because, I mean, the food pyramid is a perfect example.

[Josh Holmes]

You eat 75 loaves of bread.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, fine, but that's. And it's. The reason that it got created like that is lobbyists.

[Comfortably Smug]

No, it wasn't. It wasn't lobbyist.

[John Ashbrook]

It was because there was an Italian friends with.

[Comfortably Smug]

It was an Italian. It was an Italian being, like, eat pasta for seven.

[John Ashbrook]

It was Italian servings.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah, that's exactly what it was.

[Josh Holmes]

What the.

[John Ashbrook]

Working for big ravioli.

[Comfortably Smug]

Big ravioli. Yeah. You need all your.

[John Ashbrook]

Your big spaghetti on the case.

[Comfortably Smug]

That's right.

[John Ashbrook]

Hey, I'm telling kids to have like 40 bales of spaghetti.

[Comfortably Smug]

Larry Lasagna. I think it was Ph.D. larry Lasagna.

[John Ashbrook]

Larry Lasagna.

[Josh Holmes]

Trying to get some food over here.

[Michael Duncan]

Drawing a pyramid here.

[Josh Holmes]

And the fat. And the fat milk maids were pretty effective.

[John Ashbrook]

Well, I mean, I think dairy, I think, has been like, from. From what folks are saying now, if you're focusing on natural foods, like dairy has. Has apparently been been treated like avoid dairy when actually unfair.

[Comfortably Smug]

Unfairly maligned.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

While carbs have been shoved down people's throats. And I mean, like, like the comments out. I mean, processed foods have just been a problem. A problem. And the first thing in kids, what.

[Comfortably Smug]

Sugar does to your body.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Comfortably Smug]

Is something we need to think more about. The way it spikes your, you know, blood sugar levels and stuff and the way that, like, hunger begets hunger and that sort of thing. Just look at it like, educate yourself.

[Josh Holmes]

It's distilled in a. Some kind of a tin apparatus and put forth in a silky evening beverage with maybe one block of ice.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

In which case it's fantastic.

[Michael Duncan]

The sugar. I understand, but I don't think our listeners in Wisconsin will be very happy with the dairy piece.

[Comfortably Smug]

Wait, no, I think they've been.

[Josh Holmes]

No, I think. Did you hear what they say?

[Comfortably Smug]

Unfairly.

[Michael Duncan]

Oh, you want more dairy?

[Shelley Moore Capito]

What's more dairy?

[Michael Duncan]

Oh, well, put smug on the ballot for Supreme Court in Wisconsin next year.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah, that's right. He's a cheesehead.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, it's probably more appealing than that guy's platform, which was like, make your last vote count. Was that.

[Michael Duncan]

What was that?

[John Ashbrook]

Make your last vote count. The Democrats, like, we count them after the.

[Comfortably Smug]

I should just be in charge.

[Josh Holmes]

That's what I think that is. I listen, I would get on board. I'd be a secretary for that movement.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Okay, third mug.

[John Ashbrook]

This is from Fixed Point. They write, I can't afford to lose my home, so I've preemptively acquired a horse. Gotta practice. Good job.

[Michael Duncan]

Wait, what is he gonna do?

[Josh Holmes]

I can't afford to lose my home, so I've acquired a horse.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah, what's his last sentence?

[Comfortably Smug]

You need a backup plan.

[Michael Duncan]

Gotta practice.

[Comfortably Smug]

Gotta practice.

[Josh Holmes]

There was also some comments that I saw in there. There was like, maybe we confused the Jillian Michaels message about, like, working out and doing all of that stuff with the horse guy and all of that. We can accomplish both at one time. It's an aerobic activity.

[Comfortably Smug]

My God, you know, it's so funny. It's so funny. So we were doing the production meeting today, and Sarah in our office was sitting there and we were talking about the story, you know, this horse semen, you know, extraction facility, and the people are gonna lose their house. And we were like, basically the question is, Sarah, like, you, you gonna jerk off some horses, save your house, would you? And she was like, this is the funniest thing. She's hilarious.

[Michael Duncan]

Without skipping a beat.

[Comfortably Smug]

Without skipping a beat. She was like, can you imagine having kids in that house? And like, they won't do their chores and stuff? And you have to say to them, do you know how many horses I jacked off to put this roof over your house?

[Michael Duncan]

Ungrateful kids.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, my God, that's good.

[Comfortably Smug]

It was all time.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, that's so good.

[Comfortably Smug]

I'm so glad we don't have an HR department.

[Josh Holmes]

No, it's true. We people argue that maybe we should have one, but I don't think so. You wouldn't get this guy.

[Comfortably Smug]

You wouldn't get that.

[Josh Holmes]

When are you also, you gonna get a tax bill broken down and then a horse jerk off segment?

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Only here, Smug is horrified.

[Josh Holmes]

No, he's thinking about, like, if he knocked out the horse. Remember, this is how the whole animal kingdom thing started. Whether or not that would improve your chances of keeping your house, I. I don't know.

[Comfortably Smug]

Hey, it's not below the belt if somebody like Sarah likes it. Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

[Josh Holmes]

That's exactly right. When we come back in Variety, the Diddy trial will be the first time that the fellows weigh in on any of that. We've been tempted before, but, like, we're kind of watching, keeping a distance from all that. But it's. It's come into our circle here. It involves President Obama, which.

[Comfortably Smug]

Larry Sinclair.

[Josh Holmes]

He's rested and ready in the back of a limousine.

[Comfortably Smug]

Google it. If you don't know what I'm talking about. Google it.

[Josh Holmes]

You never wanted to Google it. I'm just Tom Warner.

[Michael Duncan]

Don't do it.

[Josh Holmes]

You don't. Don't do it.

[Michael Duncan]

Please don't do it.

[Comfortably Smug]

I'm a real wild card this episode.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, we have a detail on all of that right after this.

[Comfortably Smug]

You did all the right things. You worked hard, you worked your way up and you invested your money in a 401k or other retirement plan. Your future is all set, right?

[Josh Holmes]

Wrong.

[Comfortably Smug]

The retirement system as we know it is currently under attack from misguided policymakers in D.C. the Trump tax cuts are set to expire this year. Renewing them will be a big fight in Congress. Right now, the tax code protects 401ks IRAs and other plans that help you save. Some people want to change that. Your representatives in Congress must protect the tax advantages that more than 100 million Americans rely on to save for retirement. You deserve policies that build on the current retirement system to secure your financial future, not jeopardize it. If Americans know one thing, it's resilience. To stay resilient, we need immediate action from our leaders. Head to helpusretire.org to take action and reach out to your representatives in Congress. Today, Help Us Retire is sponsored by the Investment Company Institute, representing asset managers, serving individual investors.

[Josh Holmes]

Okay, I don't know how much you guys have been paying attention to this Diddy trial. I've basically like, put it aside. It's everywhere and people are talking about it and like you expect all kinds of different things. But I've also lived in the world with like the Epstein thing and all that. Tell me when you've solved the case.

[Comfortably Smug]

Right. I read baby oil and freak offs and then I just, I put it down and I was like, no, yeah, I don't want to know more.

[Josh Holmes]

Just you tell me when you've solved all this and have an executive summary. One thing caught our eye and this is according to the New York Post in graphic one, Sean Diddy Combs took drugs every day, including Obama shaped Ecstasy pills. Ex assistant says. So what you're looking at if you're listening and watching on YouTube are a green, maybe an orangish pink, I don't know, or in a blue face of Barack Obama and it's like Flintstone pills.

[John Ashbrook]

But they're Obama's head and their.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, they've been imprinted upon Ecstasy, which look, that's innovative. He's apparently custom made his drugs which. That shows a certain amount of class there at the freakoff party that they've got sort of a bespoke version of these drugs.

[Michael Duncan]

Politically relevant.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, right. There were various pills, but in one form of a former president's face combs. A one time personal assistant, David James said in a Manhattan federal court of what types of ecstasy pills he saw his boss take. Which former president, the prosecutor, Christy Slavik asked President Obama, James responded. James was named by the prosecution star witness, R and B singer Cassie Ventura, as Bad Boy Records founder's trusted assistant who helped arrange these freak offs. And you recall like the whole backstory of this is that this dude had like parties all the time, got everybody naked and drugged up, banged in unspeakable ways, including at one point very unfairly maligning the star of Family Matters. Really? They remember that? Remember the debt? Now the cop guy, he's denied all allegations. He's denied all allegations. But this came, popped up a couple months. It was Carl Winslow.

[John Ashbrook]

Wait, he was at these.

[Comfortably Smug]

He was America's dad?

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. No, like Carl Winslow and, and like some dude who'd apparently been at these things was like. Yeah. Did he banged Carl Winslow? No, he did.

[Michael Duncan]

Didn't happen.

[Josh Holmes]

No, no.

[Michael Duncan]

In real life.

[Josh Holmes]

No. And immediately Carl Winslow was like, that never.

[Michael Duncan]

Right? No. But like for me, Winslow's a hero.

[Josh Holmes]

It was a real, like a dagger. I mean, one of the few times that I've paid attention.

[John Ashbrook]

All these Hollywood people, all of them are just weird, to quote weird people. And they're all in on this.

[Comfortably Smug]

To quote from the theme song of Family Matters, it's a rare condition in this day and age to see any good news on the newspaper page.

[Michael Duncan]

I thought that is a love and tradition loving tradition.

[Comfortably Smug]

It's even harder to find.

[Josh Holmes]

It got me to think about it though.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, where it's like, like some guy clearly had a. Some kind of a mistaken identity with Carl Winslow and somebody who thought was Carl Winslow that was allegedly banging on.

[Comfortably Smug]

That's horrifying.

[Josh Holmes]

Getting banged by Diddy.

[Comfortably Smug]

I feel like my childhood's getting banged.

[Josh Holmes]

I know. Please, no, no, stop. But like, so it just kind of opens the aperture. How many people. There were 80s sitcom guys closely resembling Carl Winslow. Could it have been? Because it's like if it wasn't him, can you imagine? Imagine was like the butler from.

[John Ashbrook]

So here's the thing. So you guys remember how there was that. I guess was it on Epstein island or in his house, that painting of Bill Clinton wearing a dress, I guess, wearing the Montana, I think it was.

[Comfortably Smug]

In his house in New York.

[John Ashbrook]

Okay. And like, everyone knew, like, Clinton's connected with the Epstein thing, this Obama thing. I mean, to me, this seems like, you know, Bill Clinton address, but with.

[Comfortably Smug]

The Diddy thing, I don't know, I think it's a novelty that drug dealers.

[John Ashbrook]

You know, they're involved in Hollywood and things like that.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, to Smug's point, though, there were many rallies for President Obama where he rolled out Diddy.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

And he rolled out Jay Z. I guess you're right. And there was an effort on behalf of the Obama campaign back in 2012 to sort of use their star power to help pack the house for his various rallies.

[John Ashbrook]

I mean, they're strangers now. They've got Netflix deal. And, you know, there's all these stories going around of Michelle Obama's considering divorcing Rock Obama. That pops up right when the Diddy thing pops up.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Oh, that's interesting.

[Comfortably Smug]

My only thought, I mean, it might.

[John Ashbrook]

Have been like the day after Diddy got indicted that those things started getting out.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, look at you connecting the dots like A Beautiful Mind.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[John Ashbrook]

I mean, there's no coincidences. There's never any coincidence.

[Josh Holmes]

Always Sunny in Philadelphia, Charlie Kennedy.

[Comfortably Smug]

Charlie. Charlie Kelly with all the string. Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

I think.

[Comfortably Smug]

I think.

[Michael Duncan]

I think America looking into.

[Comfortably Smug]

I think America owes. I think America owes Suge Knight an apology. He called this from day one.

[Josh Holmes]

He was the only OG he fucking.

[Comfortably Smug]

Knew at the Source Awards. He was like, no, yeah. Not. Not. Don't go with that producer who wants to be all up in the videos.

[Josh Holmes]

And you can't help but think that Tupac made his way through purgatory into the pearly gates in order to pull the strings on some of this stuff for retribution of what they did to that poor guy.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah, exactly.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, I mean, I gotta tell you, though. I mean, I. You don't have the time to follow all. We should probably roll Hollywood hen here at some point to give us, like, an upshot of what's happening, but it just seems like whatever it is, I'm not gonna like it.

[Comfortably Smug]

No.

[Josh Holmes]

You know, but he throw Obama's face on some drugs.

[Comfortably Smug]

Talk about it pretty cool.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Comfortably Smug]

I'm just shocked it was ecstasy. I thought the kids were into pure MDMA now.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, maybe that's what. Maybe they're shorthanding it. Yeah, they might be short.

[Comfortably Smug]

Possible. But ecstasy is kind of a throwback as a term.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, it's like a 90s.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Maybe a 90s drug.

[Comfortably Smug]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Of choice. I would know anything about that. Anyway, just a reminder, he's racketeering Conspiracy, sex trafficking for fraud, you know, prostitution, everything. The whole thing is, is pending. And we'll wait to see how that all plays out. But anytime they put a political figure on some drugs, we're here for you.

[Comfortably Smug]

We're here to talk about it.

[Michael Duncan]

And also, also in the great tradition of the ruthless variety program, we have hard transitions into our respectable guests.

[Josh Holmes]

I think she'll appreciate it. Ladies and gentlemen, Shelly Moore Castle. So we mentioned at the top of the show how we wanted to spend a little bit more time not just on the campaign promises and the process and all of that stuff, but how these things actually get done. And one of the things we've talked about for the last, gosh, feels like year and a half, two years, electric vehicles, California mandates like this, just sort of offshoring of American resources to China to ensure that you can get to work. Well, one of the people who has been in charge of all of this to making sure that a campaign promise goes into actually putting this thing into action and getting something done. As our next guest, a very good friend of the program, Senator Shelley Moore. Capito. Hey, welcome.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Wow, Great to be on.

[Josh Holmes]

It's a good week.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

It's been a great week. It's a good victory for sensible people and it's a good victory for the Republicans.

[Josh Holmes]

It really is. So, look, just to put this in, we've talked about this a couple of times on the show before, but this bizarre electric vehicle mandate, and then a whole bunch of states decided what they were going to do is basically hook their economic future to California. Now, why anybody would want to do that?

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Don't know. Don't know. Yeah. Makes no sense. Right.

[Josh Holmes]

But it's not just as simple as a new administration coming in and waving a wand and saying, we're getting rid of all of that.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Not in this case, no.

[Josh Holmes]

It required action House and Senate, a congressional resolution to do all that. Tell us about this process.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Okay, well, let me kind of back up here. California, because it has special dispensations under the Clean Air act, because back in the 60s, it was, the air was so bad. So their California Air Board can apply to the EPA to accept themselves out of the national standards. So it used to be that they would say, we can't quite get to the national standards. Give us. Now it's like we want to go far and beyond. So under Governor Newsom and the car about there, they decided they wanted electric vehicle mandate in order to lower the emissions. And so that means that next year, 30% of the new cars sold in California and 11 other states and the District of Columbia had to be electric vehicles.

[Josh Holmes]

Next year.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Next year.

[Josh Holmes]

I mean, that's the wildest part of this whole.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

It's wild. And it doesn't include hybrids either. So a hybrid is now a gas powered car in their minds. Then by 2035, zero cars sold in California, 11 other states and the District of Columbia had to all be electric vehicles that are more costly. Gives consumers no chance. They don't work.

[Josh Holmes]

Right.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

In areas, say, Northern California, where it's more mountainous.

[Josh Holmes]

Not to mention what happens if you pull up in a West Virginia stop and you're like, right, like your friends are never gonna get the end.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

No, no, not that. And then like, can I plug this into your, you know, grill your outlet over here?

[Josh Holmes]

No, no.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah. Go to the local tractor store and say, hey, but you know, it just doesn't work. And, and so, and plus, you want consumer choice. Very expensive. A lot of people stand to lose their jobs. They don't care.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

So what happened was they applied in May of 23. Think of the timeline here. California did for the waiver. They did not get granted until December. Why Michigan? Remember, that was the. I went up and campaigned for Mike Rogers, really good friend of mine.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Very, very close race. And Senator Slotkin, now Senator Slotkin kept saying, I'm not for an EV mandate. Well, if they'd pulled this out, then it could have made a difference in that race. And they knew it. So they knew how politically charged this was. So in December they say, okay, you can have the waiver. And they put it into effect in January. Lee Zeldin and the President, with our encouragement, came back around and said, well, that's a rule. And they submitted it as a rule to the Congress and that put it within this Congressional Review act that we can take down within 60 days. And that's what we did. And you know, the Democrats kept calling process hilarious.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, I mean, all of a sudden they're concerned with like, filibuster.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

I mean, they all tried to kill the filibuster two years ago, every one of them. And then they come back in saying, you horrible people, you want to kill the filibuster.

[Michael Duncan]

Which is so good.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

It's such a joke. And so anyway, we didn't kill the filibuster at all. We provided a narrow exception that says, this gao, I don't want to get too into the weeds, can't make a determination. The executive and the Congress can. This gives us a check on the executive. And so it's gone. It's gone as of this morning.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, I mean, look, a lot of this is malfeasance by the Democrats to begin with to try to craft something that they feel like is outside of the bound, and this is what they do in environmental policy all the time, is try to figure out is there a way you can craft something that's basically undoable and untouchable, you know, and that they thought they got there, you, your staff. And I'll just say this just for you. There's nobody better to lead an effort like this because your relationships within the United States Senate.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Oh, thank you.

[Josh Holmes]

Which get, you know, look, it gets hairy. Colleagues have different points of view, but you've got great relationships with people across the ideological spectrum as well as with Democrats and everything. If you're talking about it, it's a serious thing.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Well, thanks, thanks.

[Josh Holmes]

And I think ultimately getting people beyond the process component that they may have had reservations about because the substance. No reservations.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Right. Well, that's why they wouldn't talk about the substance all day yesterday when we were arguing this on the floor, there was no talk about the substance because they know it's, it's like an 80, 20 polling issue. That's why they didn't bring it out. And I forgot to say we did get one Democrat, if you can guess who it is, Michigan. And Gary Peters is leaving. So, you know, he is under no obligation there. So I think, you know, common sense just went out the window over the last four years.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Particularly in environmental policies. They're unattainable goals. They're expensive. Who's going to pay for all this?

[Josh Holmes]

Right.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

I mean, you know, you're. Even if you're out in California and you're in the service industry, how are, you know, and I'm talking about at the lower levels, how are you going to buy an electric car? You're not.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, it doesn't work. I mean, for the stuff, you go sit on a highway for eight hours with your pickup truck, like there's no plug in in the middle of the.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Well, they had a truck mandate, too, and that came down.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Deb Fisher from Nebraska led that. So, you know, we were very pleased about this because what happened was with the different ways of looking at this, if you kept focusing on the process, that's where they knew they might be able to pick out some members. This doesn't break the filibuster. It doesn't overrule the parliamentarian because we worked really hard to work the right way. And so that's why we were able to get everybody.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, I was really, really.

[Michael Duncan]

I don't know where they come up with these ideas. It's like there's some ivory tower somewhere where they're like, everybody in the world has to come pay for the ideas that we come up with. Regular people, you're gonna pay for.

[Josh Holmes]

Also, it'd be great if we could make sure that China's the primary beneficiary of everything that we're doing, which is, I mean, literally, if you were trying to come up with something that's antithetical to our domestic advantage in the world, it's stuff like this.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

You look at like energy generation, you know, close down federal lands, close down Alaska, close down offshore. Who does that hurt? That hurts the people that have cannot pay another $50 a month on their heating or cooling bill. That hurts the retiree in rural West Virginia or Kentucky or wherever. And under the auspice of trying to help them, you know, because they're going to be healthier. There's got to be a balance. And balance is not something that the last four years have seen any.

[Josh Holmes]

No, no, there are no interest in.

[Michael Duncan]

It, but it's consistent because remember, they've gone to work war against coal families for decades. They just, they have no concept of the damage that this does to regular people. And I don't think they care. It doesn't seem like they care.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Well, I mean, I can go back. I mean, obviously we're the second largest coal producing state West Virginia is and the Obama, Obama really killed us. Hauled out our industry, hauled out our cities, our state capital. People started to leave. We ended up with huge addiction issues and didn't care.

[Josh Holmes]

No, no, no, that's the thing is it's like the whole.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Because we don't know any better and you know, we want, we, you know, we have some of the best environmentalists in our state. Do they look like Al Gore? No, they're the hunter men. The hunter and fisher. People that want to have clean water so they can hunt and fish and eat the trout that they catch in the stream. But just because we don't look like, you know, we're, we're heading to a. What are those called?

[Josh Holmes]

Davos conference.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Had Davos conference. You know, we don't care.

[Josh Holmes]

And you need the horn rim glasses.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

I think that's like a pretty round.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. To be round. Exactly. Not a lot of those floating around west.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

No, but there's a lot of those in university presidents.

[Josh Holmes]

Sure is. It seems like it's uniform at this point. Can I Ask you before we let you go. Taxes, obviously a big deal with reconciliation. Passing the first step here in the House. You felt Democrats and just sort of the general opposition doing, you know, cheering for any sort of problem along the way. And all of a sudden, you know, they got it done despite all odds, comes to the Senate, you guys are going to do things a little differently. You feel confident that we're going to get to a resolution here?

[Shelley Moore Capito]

I'm very confident we are going to have to do things differently. I mean, I think the general public needs to understand we almost have to, you know, process well enough in the Senate. We don't have the same processes. So without getting deep into it, there's gonna be certain things in that House bill we can't, we cannot do or the whole bill falls.

[Josh Holmes]

We don't need the Byrd rule.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Right. The board ruled from Robert C. Byrd from West Virginia, but we don't need to. And so we are, I think we feel that we need to put our own imprint on it. The speaker came to lunch at my invitation on Tuesday.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, that's great.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

He made it very clear that he thinks he can pass it. He did say don't mess with it too much, kind of a deal. And, you know, so that's a not so subtle message, but we realize the constraints he's under. But, you know, we can't lose too many people either. And so we have a lot of independent thinkers at the same time with other ideas. So we should be able to, you know, contribute that to the conversation, pass something on the Senate. And then I think we're going to have to work the differences out. And I think we will, and I think we will quickly. A lot of this has already been talked about.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, I mean, huge cornerstone, sort of economic component to everything that you're working on, everything the Trump administration is working on.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

It's all about growth, pro growth. We saw this after 2017. It got disrupted with COVID We want to go back to that. And it's interesting because the timing is almost the same as it was almost 10 years ago in terms of small businesses pass throughs the real employers in our country and so bringing back manufacturing jobs with the president. So we'll get it done. I'm not going to say it'll be pretty, but we'll get it done.

[Michael Duncan]

Well, no, I know you've worked very closely with the President. He has endorsed your reelection campaign. But. And I know you're also fighting for West Virginia here and you got like two months. I mean, we were talking about Time frame before you. You came on the show of when, when, when could this thing get passed? Is it an August deadline? Is it sometime sooner than that? But I know there's a lot of things you're fighting for in the intervening time. I wonder if you could talk about that.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Well, we do have two things running concurrently there that are going to be pretty steep climbs. Reconciliation. And then our annual appropriations bills, which John Thune and Susan Collins on our side have pledged to move through what we call regular order onto the Florida. So that members can amend and take a look at these bills. And that takes time. But the speaker said, well, this will be on the president's desk by July 4th.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, that's tough.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

That's what. That's four weeks. That's tough. But we're going to probably strive to do that. Realistically, it might slip to August. I don't think it'll let. They'll let it go. If you leave it out for the five week recess.

[Josh Holmes]

Tough stuff.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Everybody's going to come home, come back with a whole new idea of the greatest idea ever. So.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, I talked to four guys at the bar. They seem to think this is a good idea.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah. Like how did we get to. Taxes on. No taxes on tip.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah, right.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Have you heard that story?

[Josh Holmes]

Yes, I have heard that story. Turns out there's a lucky old waitress out there.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Exactly. In Vegas.

[Josh Holmes]

Well, she was a very effective advocate for our industry.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

That's why you get out there.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

It's the importance of. Everybody acts like everybody goes on vacation in August.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Oh, yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Like having served, you know, with all of you and watched what you do, you actually just. It's your time to go back and talk to people.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Right.

[Josh Holmes]

Get input.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

It's good. Live a normal life and reconnect with your family, your friends. Find out who your real friends are and. But everybody's got an idea of exactly what you. And some people think the best thing to do is pass the exact bill. But I don't think we can do that. Nor do I think we really. I don't think we will. Nor do I think we really can from a technical standpoint.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I know you're committed to it. If you're looking for a lawmaker who's not just talking about stuff but actually has the wherewithal to get it done, look no further than Shelley Moore. Capito? Incredibly effective member of the United States Senate. Thank you so much for coming in.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Thanks for having me on. Don't get any of those round glasses.

[Josh Holmes]

No danger of That I saw you brought some stuff.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

I did. I did, yes. So I understand you like to have. When you have guests on you, like things that come from home states.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

So, of course, West Virginia is very well known for our moonshine. I didn't bring you any moonshine. I brought you some beer.

[Josh Holmes]

We worry a little bit about smug with moonshine. I'm glad that you.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

304 beer. And this is a smooth Ambler, which is made in Lewisburg, West Virginia, which is down near where the Greenbrier is.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Very good bourbon. And you can buy it right here in D.C. both of them.

[Michael Duncan]

How about that?

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

And then the 304 is brewed in Parkersburg, West Virginia. 304 is our area code.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, okay.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

All right. So that's the significance.

[Michael Duncan]

I can't wait to dig into that.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

And I thought it was good. It's got the elephant on it.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

You can't beat that elephant on it. I'm told it's a big University of West Virginia branch.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

That is. That is so happy drinking.

[Michael Duncan]

Yeah.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Michael Duncan]

Thank you.

[Josh Holmes]

We know the way to our heart.

[Michael Duncan]

Exactly.

[Josh Holmes]

Appreciate it.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Yeah.

[Josh Holmes]

Shelly Moore. Capito.

[Shelley Moore Capito]

Thanks.

[Michael Duncan]

She's so smart. She is working so hard up on the Hill and obviously getting things done.

[Josh Holmes]

Yeah. I mean, look, this took a lot more doing than meets the eye. Because there were procedural hurdles that were involved. There were a bunch of different things, like on audits, merits. The idea that California can dictate what kind of car you can drive across this great nation of ours is insane. There was no difference of opinion from Republicans on that. But there was a real question about whether or not the method that they had to take in order to get this done opened a Pandora's box for Democrats to just, like, slam dango you if you ever got into power. Of course, we aware of that because of what Republicans did to Democrats after they opened their Pandora's box with the. The courts. And we just, like, shoved it up their ass, you know, so we're like, let's. Less of the ass. Shoving for us would be great. So there was some thought process of which Senator Capito took a lot of thought and worked with leadership to do and convinced colleagues it was the right thing to do and they got it done. Big thing. Got to celebrate. When people get stuff over the finish line, everybody talks about stuff. Getting it over the finish line is difficult to do. Good one. She did it with that. Fellas, look, you gotta like and subscribe. I'm just telling you, if you're not liking and subscribing and sending all to your friends. You're missing the worst stuff, the ditty stuff. Not to mention a full comprehensive breakdown of tax policy.

[John Ashbrook]

Yeah, right.

[Josh Holmes]

This Friday program, you got to get involved. And with that, I think we did it.

[John Ashbrook]

I think so. Absolutely. Banger of an episode, gentlemen. Thank you so much, Senator Capito, and thank you to listeners. Remember, leave your prediction. When does Trump sign the big beautiful bill? Fate. And time for tiebreakers. Winner gets to pick merch item from the store.

[Josh Holmes]

Oh, there you go.

[John Ashbrook]

So until next time, minions. Keep the faith, hold the line and own the libs. We'll see you Thursday. Stay ruthless.

[G]

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