Mike (3:04)

Good to be here, Wes.

Wes (3:05)

Yeah, it's good to have you. And I know we have Joe as well. Joe, thank you for being here.

Joe (3:11)

Yep.

Wes (3:12)

And I'd kind of like to start with Joe. I know we're going back to 2018 in Colorado. If you would, would you start from the very beginning? What were you doing and what happened?

Joe (3:24)

We was on an elk hunt. It's a yearly elk hunt we do. And we've been doing it probably at that point, at 15 years we had been doing it. I got certain places I hunt in the morning, certain places I hunt in the evening. This was going to be an evening hunt. And I usually walk, you know, two or three miles uphill. And my second half, I turn around and come back and walk that same, not the same area, but like come back to the camp on a downhill, make it easy. And they were doing some logging this year and I just wanted to go see what they were cutting because it's going to affect the hunting for a few years. So I just wanted to see what they were logging. And you know, the close I got, I could hear the chainsaws and the machineries running and I was probably still a quarter mile out from where they were logging from. And I had my GPS out in my hand and I was just trying to get my bearing of where I was going and just trying to see whether what a logging line was going to start at. I've walked this probably hundreds of times, same area, and I'm just walking and then I kind of look up and I caught something on my eye and I'm like, man, that don't look right. And the more I looked at it, I'm like, you know, there's bears there and I, I've got a bear license. I'm like, well, maybe this is a bear. And next thing you know, this thing kind of turns around. It just looks at me, you know, and it's, you know, at first I couldn't tell if it was standing up, sitting down, but after it turned and looked at me, I'm like, oh my God. You know, he's trying to process what did I just see. And when I looked at him I'm like, well, this ain't a bear. Because of the bear, I'd have probably shot at it. You know, this ain't a bear. And it's probably between 25, 30 yards out. And then I've noticed it's kind of sitting down. And sitting down it's eye level height with me. So put a height on that. I don't know how that would be. And then it turned, it turns kind of back towards where the trees are being cut. And at this point I'm realizing I'm seeing something I've never seen before. So I dropped my gps, I grabbed my phone out my pocket and I pull up and I start recording. I reach down, I grab my gps, I get a, I get some video of it from where I'm at and I just start walking off real quick heading towards the guys that are cutting trees out there. And as I come around the corner, I didn't even know I actually caught video of the second time from a different angle. I caught video of it from a second time and I, I just walked on off and I'm still at this point, I'm like, what did I see? You know, was it a person in a costume? And I'm thinking, there's no way there's a person in a costume at this time of year. Because the bear season's open, and it's rifle season for bear. I'm bow hunting, but the rifle season for bear is open. I'm like, there's nobody in the woods with this kind of suit on that's that crazy, because they're going to get shot. And, you know, I'm just still walking. I pull the video back. I watched the video. I'm like, what did I see? What did I see? What did I see? I don't know how to explain it. I know what I saw. You know? Then after that, the thing is, when I get back to camp, how do I tell my friends what I just seen? You know, because some of them are pretty brutal. Someone would. Would, but, you know, bite into it and go with it. But most of them are just going to beat me up. So I kind of walked out to where they were cutting the trees. I never did find the guys cutting the trees, But I found the tree line, and I wanted to see what a. Where the timber cutting started. And I read the rest of the evening uneventful and got back to camp. And I kind of meant it. I said, hey, y', all, I saw a bigfoot. And then the joke started. And then I pulled the video out. And some of them are like, oh, my God. And then some of them are still, well, it was a bear. And I'm like, man, if it was a bear, I'd have shot it. If it was a bear, I would have known. You know, it had a face. It definitely had a face when it looked at me. And it stayed. It stayed sitting down. It never stood up. It was either sitting on a log on a stump, but it was kind of like. I feel like when I first saw it, I kind of felt like it was watching towards where the trees were being cut. You know, it was a lot of chainsaws running, A lot of machinery run, a lot of beeping, but it's probably 3, 400 yards out. It was like it was watching them or listening to them. And then I just walked up behind it.

Wes (7:30)

And Joe, I know that Mike actually sent me the still shots of this thing. And, you know, when I looked at it, I was like, oh, oh, he did capture something. Will you send me the full video?

Joe (7:44)

I can send you the actual video Now. This was a shorter version. I've since lost the whole version because I'm like three phones out since then. But I got like a, I think it's 18, a 14 second clip of it, but I definitely can send you that.

Wes (7:59)

Yeah, I can't wait to check out the video. So tell me, Joe, this thing turns and kind of looks at you. Would you describe the face, kind of what you remember?

Joe (8:10)

I couldn't tell you if it was hairy, but it was the same color as the fur. But I can make out eyes, cheeks, you know, nose, mouth. I can make all of that out. And you can almost in the video if you, if you go back and forth for a couple of seconds at that time where it's like turning the head, you're going to see the eye sockets, nose and the kind. You're going to see the space, the facial, the facial features. And like above the eyes, the crown of the head went higher than any kind of, you know, like a kind of gorilla. Ish. A gorilla's head's real tall above its eyes. And then when I run around the corner, my phone's still videoing. When you catch it a second time, you get a real good frontal view, like from chest high.

Wes (8:54)

I think what's interesting is you see this saying, Joe, and it kind of turns and looks your way and then looks back at whatever it's doing. It obviously knew you were there, but it didn't really seem to care other

Joe (9:07)

than just acknowledged me. There was no more interaction, just it just turned, looked at me, didn't care about me, you know. And then on the second view, it's just looking straight at me. So I just didn't get up, didn't raise no arms up, didn't do anything, just kind of just, oh, look, that's somebody.

Wes (9:28)

And I know you were there just kind of scouting around after seeing this saying, do you leave?

Joe (9:34)

I finished hunting. I, I had a goal to where I wanted to be at at a certain time. And then I get there, then I turn around and I got enough time to get back to camp before dark. It's, it's a trek that I've done for years and I've been very successful hunting that area, elk hunting. I know where I want to be till about a certain time and I know how much time because I don't like being in the woods in Colorado in the dark because it's so cold. We're from south Louisiana and that, that's a different kind of. That'll kill you kind of cold up there.

Wes (10:04)

Yeah, it's real cold up there. In the colorado mountains. What did you think about bigfoot Prior to ever seeing this thing?

Joe (10:13)

The only thing I've ever. Bigfoot. When I was eight, nine years old, we went to arkansas and I had a vivid dream of a bigfoot. And I don't remember exactly what it was. Either jumped on the car or threw a rock at us in the dream. And from that point on, I was. I've been in the woods since I was three. And from that point on, I've always. You know, I guess I was a believer. But I didn't say there's no such thing Because I've watched all the shows and the. I don't know if it's. What's the name of the film in California? I've always watched that film. And I. I'm a believer that they're there and it's never seen one and never had any other incidents that I said that could have been one or heard one or anything. And I had family members over the years Tell the stories about central Louisiana that they've had a thing that they've seen. And my daddy had an uncle that had a story and just never dismissed it.

Mike (11:07)

But until.

Joe (11:07)

Till I seen what I seen, you know, 100 doubt I saw something I cannot. I cannot explain. And I. 100 no, it was not a bear. Seen too many bears. I've shot bears. And it was very peaceful. It was very calming. You know, as soon as I seen it, I didn't freak out that second. And then when it looked at me, you know, I'm thinking, man, you know, I can't be seeing what I'm seeing. And you try to process something in 14 seconds, and it's just a little hard. I'm like, what do I do? You know? So my thing at that point was, let's just. Let me just get to these people. Maybe one of these guys are playing around. Maybe somebody's trying to scare these people. But I never did get to the. The actual guys that were logging. And still to this day, when I go back, like last night, I watched the video again last night. It all comes back. And I seen what I seen.

Wes (12:04)

Yeah. You know, from what you saw in the face, what you remember, and just the whole way it acted, its behavior, did it remind you more of a man or did it remind you more of an animal?

Joe (12:18)

It was less of an animal and it was super calm. It like, it didn't even startle. I've startled animals. I've started coyotes and different animals and bears and where you both see each other at the same time, you kind of jump back or you got a reflex off flinch. There was nothing there when it. When it. When it swung and looked at me, it just saw me. You know, he's like, yep, somebody's right there, and just turn his head back towards the noise. But it was more. It was more humanoid, like a gorilla like, than anything else. Just the top half of the head just remind me so much of a gorilla because it was just extended up just like a cone almost, but not. You'll see in the video. And it just wasn't startled. That's just. That's what was weird. You know, every other animal you usually see in the woods either runs, shocks us, freezes. It was none of that. It was calm.

Wes (13:17)

Yeah. Its behavior reminds me much more of a human. The way it just kind of turned and looked at you. Then was like, whatever, and went back to what it was looking at. And you're right. A normal animal, you would startle it, and this thing didn't seem to be startled at all. And, Mike, I wanted to ask you your. Your portion of it, of what happened to you, is it in this area?

Mike (13:39)

Okay. My. My part is. It's a. It's not even over there with him or where he was hunting. This. This. My deal happened in North Texas. We were about 20 miles from the Oklahoma border, and it was a place called Bellevue, Texas. And I would go deer hunting up there with. With some relatives there every year. And this one particular year, we get up there, we. We were actually staying in. The people we were hunting with had. It's kind of rolling hills up there, a lot of open area, just rolling hills with a lot of cattle and mesquite thickets and. And like, scrub oaks, but a lot of mesquite thickets. So we get to their house, and we're standing in a camper basically out in the middle of a cow pasture. And they had a. A pole out there, which. That's where we got our power. And our water was out in this. It was.

Joe (14:30)

We.

Mike (14:30)

We was all hooked up. You know, we. We had power, water, everything. So we stand out in the middle of this pasture, and when we get there this particular year, we get to the camper and the guy's wife comes over there, and she, you know, we talk for a little while, and she goes, oh, hey, by the way, y' all need to. Y' all be careful out here. She goes, we just. We not long found a calf, and it was skin. Like, skin inside out. And she goes, we. I. I don't recall ever telling me that anything like organs or meat was, was missing off of the calf. But it was just skin inside out laying out in the pasture. And I'm like, geez, I mean dots. You're only going to do that if you got hands. Like so on that note, so we, we proceed, we start our hunting stuff. And there was different areas that he would take us. So he would bring on this to this one area and they would have three stands that he would, that we would be hunting. And they were about 200 yards apart. And when I say a stand, so it's a. The deer stands or box stands that were elevated about 4 or 5 foot off the ground. So this one particular area there was three in a row by 200 yards apart. So he, he puts me out of the first one and then the next two guys go to the next one. So I'm. It was on an afternoon, I'm making an afternoon hunt. And he goes, look, you just, you walk across this, the edge of this car pasture, just follow the edge of the woods and you're gonna get to a right of way that cuts through the woods. It was a power line, these huge tall power lines that cut right through the, through the mesquite thicket. And he goes, you turn in on that power line right away. And he goes, we walk down that right away and you're gonna walk right to the box stand. I'm like, okay, so I get down there and I'll get to the right of way. I'm walking down it and it's about the width of the. Right away was almost, I'm gonna just say it was about 20 yards across. That's as wide as it was, 20, 30 yards across. So I'm walking down there, walking, walking. I get to the box stand, I get in it and I got woods to a thicket to my left and kind of a thicket to my right. And I noticed on my right also at the edge of the thicket, I could see what looked like a little levy. So it was a pond right there. And then in front of me I could just see like a open, like a little pasture in front of me. So I'm making my afternoon hunting. A little while later I see a bobcat comes out. So shoot the bobcat went out there, got him, drug him, put him underneath the stand. I get back in it. So I continue hunting. And a little later on some does came. So I shot at one of the dose and she ran off. I saw where she went. So I'm waiting till it gets dark. I'm gonna go look and see if I can find some blood or something. So a little while before dark, I. I noticed something like, man, I could. I smell something. I'm like, what's that smell? And I just. I couldn't quite grasp it, but it was kind of strong. And I'm like, man, what was that? It hung with. It hung there for a little while, Then. Then it was gone. So anyway, it gets dark, I get down, I go out toward the front of the stand, and I go look. I. I could never find no blood. So I'm like, okay. I look, look. I said, I'm. I'm gonna come back after a while. I'll bring one of the guys with me. And we're just gonna double check me, you know, make sure that I apparently didn't miss or whatever. So I grabbed the bobcat from understand, I turn around and I'm walking back out down this 20, 30 yard wide, right away, back toward the pasture where I came in. So I get about halfway down that. I'm just gonna call it a trail. I get about halfway down Before I get to the pasture. And it's the. The trail was kind of flat. Then it, like, dipped down, and then it was. Then it would, like, come back up, and then you would get toward the pasture. So I get toward where it dips down, and it was. I was like, God dang it. It had. It was the same smell that I was getting from the stand, but way stronger. And here's the weird part. You. It wasn't like you walked into it. And you gradually started smelling it. It's like, oh, I kind of smell something. And then it gets stronger. It wasn't that way. This is. It was weird. It was like you walked into this wall of this smell. Like you opened the door and it hit you. And then I walked about, I'm just gonna say, 10ft. And I walked out of it like a wall. You was in it and out was no gradual getting away from it. It was like. That was the weird part. And I'm like, what the hell is that? And if you ask me. Well, because I know you asked me what it smell like. The best way I could explain it is it smelled like a stockyard. So I just. And I didn't sit there and go, oh, that's a big foot or not, because my mind, you know, especially back then, My mind just didn't work that way. I was well aware of bigfoots and all that, but that did. So I. I Just. I'm like, okay, I'm out of here. I kept going walking. I walk. I'll get all the way back to the fence, across the pasture. I get to the fence where they gonna pick me up, and my. My cousin met me there. He was at the next stand down. So he met me at the fence. I didn't tell him a word. Said, hey, man, I got a bobcat. You know, I shot her to do, you know. I said, it's gonna be a little bit for. The fella was gonna come pick us up. I said, you want to come walk back down in there with me and we'll look to see if we can find some blood? He goes, oh, yeah, man. So I left the bobcat there and kept my gun on, my rifle on my shoulder. And we walk back down in there. We get to that right away, walking back down that trail, and we get to that bottom. Little bottom area, and all in there. Well, it hit us. And he goes, dude, you smell that? And I'm like, yeah. I said, I didn't want to tell you nothing. I just. And it was still there, still is strong. And he goes, bruh, it smells like a. Like a sailborn. And if you know what a sailborn is, it's. It's where people bring a lot of cattle and. And hogs and just livestock for auction. He goes, bruss, it smells like a damn sailbone. So we walk in there, we went. And we went look for the. To see if we could find blood. Never find no blood from the deer. So apparently, I. I missed it. So we turn around, walking back out. The smell is still there. Strong as hell. At that point, when we get back to the. You know, I never would. And we never heard anything. I mean, I shine my light in the. In the thicket right there, where I could never see anything, never heard nothing. So we get back to the fence and we talking. And I said, that's the point where I was like, bro, I think that might. It might be a bigfoot hanging around. And obviously, he's laughing at me. And still to this day, I mean, he was just. He just don't believe in. And he just make fun of me. But I said, dude, I'm telling you. And he's like, dude, that's. That's. That's some damn. It's a hog. It's hogs that came through there. And I'm like, you gotta understand, this was probably almost 20 years ago that this happened at this point, probably 17 years ago. And back then, especially in north Texas, they didn't have the hogs like they do nowadays. They were not there. And. And toward the end of the years, where we stopped hunting up there, the hogs did finally move in, but they did not have them then.

Joe (21:49)

And I've been.

Mike (21:50)

I've killed hogs. I've been around a trailer full of them that were. That were caught, and we would. We would kill them and clean them. And wild hogs, and they didn't smell that strong. They didn't smell like that. You know, I've been right up against dead ones. I've been with javelinas, which is your south Texas version of a hog, and they got a little musky smell when you get close to them. But it. It sure as hell wasn't like this. And I've been hunting all my life, and, you know, I've never seen a bigfoot personally, But I was. To me, I think there was one hanging there. Now, the rest of that story goes what My. One of my other cousins who was also there, Was hunting in the. In the. In that middle stand one afternoon. So, like I said, there was three in a row. He was hunting in the middle one, which was up 200 yards from the one where the smell hit me that night. So he's hunting on the evening hunt. He ends up shooting a little buck. Shoots it, kills it. And it got dark on him. So he's out there in the dark by himself, and he's waiting for this. The fella to go get him. And once he gets back to the camp, he starts telling me, you know, he's like, hey, Mike, he said this. This was during the rut. And for people that don't know what the rut is, that's when, you know, the bucks are chasing the does. It's mating season for the. For the deer at that time when we were there. And a lot of times when bucks are chasing those, they. They. They make this grunting sound like kind of. Kind of thing. I've never obviously, been hunting. You don't hunt deer at night. So to tell you if that. How much that goes on at night. But it does go on during the daytime. I'm sure it's a lot less at night. So he asks me, he goes, man, does the bugs grun at night? And I'm like, well, I'm thinking they do, bro. But, you know, he goes, cuz, man, I went to go get my deer, and he said there was something out there. And he said I could never see it. But he. He said it was loud and it was just like this. And he said, and this guy's been very experienced hunter, Been hunting all his life. He goes, and he's heard deer grunt. I think he was just kind of trying to feel me out on. He goes, it scared the hell out of me. And he said, I hurried up, I grabbed my deer, and I. It was about 100 yards for him to get to his gate. And he said, I drug it back to the gate. And he said, man, he said, ricky couldn't come quick enough to pick me up. He said, it scared me. So if you want to know what my opinion is, I think it was that same thing from 200 yards down that whether, you know, I'm sure it had to hear him shot. It's a rifle shot, but probably knew there was a dead deer there, smell, and it was probably maybe coming to try and take it, see what was going on. But I think it was that same thing that I smelled. And he never. He didn't lay eyes on it, but he's this weird sound that he heard, you know, so that's kind of, you know, my story on. On what happened up there in north Texas.

Wes (24:48)

Let me ask you, Mike. I mean, you and joe are experienced guys out there, and you pull up to this ranch, and she starts telling you this story about this calf that was killed, and it was skinned inside and out. If you don't believe in bigfoot, the only other thing that would do that would be a poacher. And I don't see a poacher doing that. I mean, a cat's not gonna do that, I don't think. You guys have bears. Do you guys have bears in northern Texas?

Mike (25:17)

There was not bears up there. And as far as it meant this. This was so rural. His closest neighbors and when I say close a half a mile, would be his parents. And this is very rural. And could it be a poacher? Yeah, but I'm not sure I would understand what the point in poaching a calf and just skinning it, shooting it and leaving it, just to shoot it and leave it. Maybe if you're a poacher, I could maybe understand that. But to skin one inside out like that part, I would not understand.

Wes (25:53)

Yeah, you would burn up a lot of time on someone's property. I mean, what's the point on skinning the animal, especially a calf, on someone else's property? You know, most poachers I know, I don't know personally, Most poachers I've ran into, they're hunting, but it's out of season. And they're actually eating it. So I don't. Like, a poacher in, like, the United States means the same thing as, like, you know, people hunting game in Africa or, you know, poaching elephants or. It's the same word, but I think it has a different meaning because, like I said, I've run into poachers, but it's always out of season and they're killing to eat. It's not just killing to kill. Not that I agree with it. And, you know, I have family and friends in Dallas, in the Dallas area, and I go down there a lot. I'll probably be down there sometime this year before it gets too hot. But you sneak on someone's property in northern Texas and you shoot their calf, they're gonna shoot you. I mean, the, the people in North Tech, they will shoot you if you go on their property and. And kill their calf.

Mike (27:01)

Exactly. You will get shot. And. And again, if you're gonna be a poacher and you're gonna do some. Something like that, this is just my opinion that you.

Joe (27:09)

You're gonna.

Mike (27:10)

Typically that person is going to do it from a vehicle, and if you're going to do something dumb like that, they're going to shoot it from the vehicle, kill it, if that's just their intent, and then just, they're gonna take off and leave. You're not gonna. You're not gonna shoot it or. Just because she didn't say anything about bullet wounds, you know, she said this thing was. It was just skin inside out. Like, it wasn't. She didn't mention, you know, in her husband's. They've lived there all their lives and they had never seen anything like this.

Wes (27:40)

Yeah, it really doesn't make sense. Did you ever follow up with her as far as, like, hey, did anything else ever happen on that property?

Mike (27:49)

No, and I never really talked to her that often. She. She just never came around much. Mostly it was Ricky the fella. And man, you know, all the years we hunted up there, he. He never ever. He was a pretty straightforward guy. You know, I think if he would have heard something or saw something, he would. He would have definitely have told us. And the only thing that ever. That ever came out of his mouth about something like that, it was just a. A joke he was playing. There were some fellas that would stay right behind his house in a tent, and they were from further south Texas, but they would come up there and pay him to hunt, and they would go up there, stay in tents, and they were hunting the area. Kind of behind where our camper was. They had some tickets back in there, and Ricky, he was letting them hunt back there. And he just said one. He said, man, them guys are some spooky fellas. He said. I told him, you know, never go around the creek back there. And he said one night I went and messed with him in their tent. And I said, man, that's a good way to get killed, man. People get scared they're gonna start shooting. And he goes, yeah. He said, I thought about that after that probably wasn't a good idea, but he was just messing with them guys just as far as that little bit went. But he never led on to us that there was anything that he had ever saw or nothing. Like, nothing.

Wes (29:02)

Let me ask you, Joe. I know that you're an experienced guy, just like Mike, and you know, when eyewitnesses report this smell, it's 99% of the time exactly how Mike describes it. You walk into it, take a couple steps, and you walk out of it. Which is weird because that's not really how smell works. You know, it's like, oh, something stinks, and you're looking for it, looking for it. And as you get closer to whatever stinks, the smell gets worse. This isn't how this smell works at all. It's exactly how Mike describes it, Being kind of an experienced guy out there. What's your take on that when you hear people walk in and out of this smell?

Joe (29:47)

The two stories I've heard from my family, I said it was a local where we hunt at in Louisiana. The story that they had, there was a smell with their account with Bigfoot. And, like, they said, it was a smell they couldn't explain. And their story was. And it was this. This was. This would have probably been in the 20s or the 30s. It was a. An older guy's uncle had an experience with one, and the one he seen actually said he was walking through the woods. Whatever he's seen, and he said it was a female, actually had a dead hog under its arm as it was walking. And then I think it was my daddy's uncle, which I didn't know the guy because they would have been long dead by the time I was around. He had an encounter with one, and it had a smell. And, you know, the stories are too far back to remember them now, but that's the two other stories I've heard in my life. But back to my story. I made friends with some locals up there in the first couple of years. So these people. I got a 20 something year relationship with. When I got back to town, from my experience, her name's Ms. Pam. I told Ms. Pam, I said, Ms. Pam, I've seen a bigfoot. And all she did was smile. And she goes, yeah, we know they're up there. And she said, we get plenty of stories, Plenty of people see them. And. And I kind of like, you really don't want to tell nobody because of the jokes and this and that. And she kind of understood it, but she reassured me, and still to this day we talk about it, that they're up there because they live there. And it happened about 45 miles south of their houses where it happened. And her and her husband, there is no doubt in their mind what I told them and showed them the videos that, yeah, you saw what you saw. Mine had no smell. I didn't smell anything out the normal. And there might have been a downwind win thing, but as you know, it's just crazy. I know what I've seen. Can't explain it. You know, when I seen what I seen, yeah, I kind of got shook up and, you know, I just felt real weird. It's kind of like sick feeling. And I don't know why that came over me. It's hard to. It's hard to explain.

Wes (31:55)

Yeah. You know, after seeing this thing, did it change your opinion as far as going out there hunting? I guess it really wasn't aggressive. It just kind of looked in your direction and looked away. But how did it affect you as far as wanting to go back out there? Or did it.

Joe (32:11)

I'm gonna tell you what it actually did to me. I've always been afraid of the woods. And I mean, since I was hunting first, my first time deer hunting on my own, where somebody said, here, get right here. The stands 300 yards down there. It's on the left in the tree. From that point on till probably that encounter, I have always been afraid in the woods. You know, when I got on the stand, I lifted my feet up so they went hanging off into the dark. You know, when I walked out, I shot my flashlight. I would talk to myself like I was two people. I was always afraid of the woods, and I'm not really afraid of the woods. I was afraid of running into somebody and just. You don't. I'm more afraid of people in the woods than anything. I've seen mountain lions, I've seen bears. They really don't scare me. But I found after the encounter, I really have no more fear in the woods. I've lost my fear I stay on a tree till 10 o' clock at night and walk out, you know, with a flashlight and I don't have the fear no more. And I don't know if that encounter reassured me that I'm okay, but. No but before that point I was really afraid of the woods now in my tent at night because we tent camp in Colorado, we hear things and I. We had a friend about two or three years ago videoed one night in his tent. He was scared and you could hear the rocks clacking and it went 360 degrees around our campsite. And I've heard things walking around our campsite at night and I've had things. I had. I've had a cow step on my tent one night. A cattle cow. So you. We get weird things like that happen and we find formations in the woods with something stacked rocks up a stacked weird things up and just random. And I've got pictures of that somewhere as it be to find them. But we find things in the woods that just. Just little weird things that are unique and they're stacked up perfectly.

Mike (34:04)

And how do you.

Joe (34:05)

How do you pwn that off? Pack rats or what done it? You know, just some crazy things like that. But no, I. I do not have any more fear in the woods since that encounter.

Wes (34:16)

Yeah, well it definitely sounds positive which is a good thing. You know, I ask everyone on the show what do you think Sasquatch is? What. What do you think Joe? What do you think that these things are?

Joe (34:26)

I got a brother that's real smart and he's real versed in the Bible and a lot of people and I'm probably gonna say it wrong. Revert this back to nephew nephilims and I did some research on that. I don't think they of this world if you want my opinion after doing research and I think that from a different dimension. That sounds crazy different dimension. You know, they just appear they there. I don't. I don't know but I. I really don't know. But I've seen what I've seen. I can't explain it. And what sucks is when you see him when it's hard to talk to somebody about it because of the joking and the laughing. Some people like Mike. I'm glad Mike called me that night when he saw that I posted it one time. He's somebody that you can talk to. That's not going to be the other side of. Man, you crazy. What you mean with what you were smoking? I don't drink. I don't do Drugs, you know, and I'm a normal person and. And I gotta live with this. That's the hardest part. I gotta live with what I seen. Because even like we was at a function last night and when I brought it up that this was going to happen today, there's a million questions and then you get questioned on everything that you say and then. And all you can revert to back is I seen what I seen and I can't explain it and I'm not a religious person and my brother pretty much explained it the best. And when you read it, you know, maybe that's what we're seeing. And I listen to Clear channel at night and listen to a lot of stories and a lot of people revert back to nephulins or whatever you call them.

Wes (35:58)

Yeah, the, the nephilim. What makes you think it's an interdimensional creature? Not that I disagree with you, but what makes you feel that way?

Joe (36:07)

Because of everybody's encounter is kind of like the same, you know, where did it come from? Nobody else sees them. They're never on game cameras, which everything's on game cameras, you know, they're never on game cameras. Everybody's videos blurry. Mine's pretty clear compared to everybody else's. And you know, I've been in the woods my whole life. I've covered thousands of miles and I come across this one one time. No, I've never seen a foot track, a print. I've seen, I've had seen things, makeshift shelters made in the woods. I've got some pictures of those that I found. You might want to see that. If I could dig some of those up, I'll get them the mic to send to you. I have seen stuff like that that's unexplainable, but I don't think they of this world. That's the only way I can explain why you can't catch them, you can't see them. Nobody's ever got one, nobody's ever run one forward. They got to be interdimensional some, you know. You know, they just appear when they appear.

Wes (37:07)

Yeah, there's a lot of weird things that go on and sometimes in people's encounters with these creatures and it makes me wonder what they are. You know, you come across any other animal on the planet and they're gonna probably flee from you. And when it comes to predators, if they don't flee, you're in trouble. And I think out of all my years hunting, I've only come across one black bear and it was by mistake. But it wanted nothing to do with me, thank God, because I would have lost that battle. And I didn't realize black bears could move that quick. You know, we were talking earlier about this thing's behavior of just kind of looking over in your direction and looking back at the tree line. It almost sounds more human like than any other animal I've ever run into.

Joe (37:54)

It had no worries of me at all. There was no shock in the face, there was no shock in the body language. I was, I was shocked a little. You know, like I said, I dropped my GPS on the ground to grab my phone and you know, I'm. And if you're trying to play this quick in your head, what am I looking at? What am I looking at? What am I looking at? It was, it had no concern of me. And almost every video you see, there is no concern of the human. Once the encounter happens, they acknowledge and they just kind of walk off or do what they do. Now I'm the one that kind of briskly ran off but it never, it never left. And I've been back to that spot to try to find the exact same spot because I had the GPS trail but I never could find exactly where it was sitting at because they did do some log in there and the trees are different the next time I went.

Wes (38:45)

You know Joe, through all your experience of being out in the woods, have you ever seen these balls of light that we talk about on the show?

Joe (38:54)

It was there in New Mexico. We've seen some lights that I can't explain. There was three lights in a triangle shape. And this is totally different from what we're talking about now. But I had, we had a witness, you know, I had a thermal scope with me and we could not pick these lights up on the thermal scope, which I can get a 747 at 40,000ft with my thermal scope. And that's the only lights experience I ever had. I've never had anything in the woods light wise. I don't think anything else that's ever happened in the woods. I've never ran across a smell that was, that kind of scared me. I've heard noises, I've heard screams. I've heard things like that over the years that, you know, I wrote them off as coyotes or foxes or cats. But no, I've never seen lights. I have seen things stacked that, like I said, those things I find like somebody position things for you to find it. Yeah, a person could have done it, but I found things like that and I found shelters that Were made. I probably found shelters four times in my life. Kind of like a lean to a person would make, but more rough. Like a person would take a saw and cut trees and branches and shape them and try to geometrically make it look like. Like a little stick built in a house. These things were like they just grabbed whatever they can grab and kind of just stack them up into like a pyramid or tippy TP style Just for like a quick shelter. There was nothing that was humanly cut, but it was definitely strategically stacked.

Wes (40:26)

Let me ask you, Mike, Kind of going back to your encounter for a moment, what do you make of that smell of you walking into it and walking out of it?

Mike (40:37)

I have not. Excuse me. I have not ever smelled anything like that before. And what do I think it is? And why do some people smell them and some. Some don't? I think it's possibly that it's maybe something they put off when they are unsure or something, or if they get scared or they. Maybe they're scared. And it's. I don't want to say almost like a skunk does when they've threatened or scared of something, you know, they spray. They just may be able to emit this. And they don't smell like that all the time. I. I really. That's my best guess on it. I don't know. Like I said, I've. I've been around. I've been around a lot of hogs in my life, and I ain't never one smelled like that, Especially that strong. They didn't have the hogs up there like they do nowadays. It just. They. They weren't around. And something else. I couldn't explain that. Not that this would be. I wouldn't think it'd be bigfoot related because it'd be. I mean, I know they're supposed to be fast, but I don't know. But when we first started hunting up there, we'd be driving down these country roads or, you know, either early in the morning or. Or in the dark, Coming back after the hunt. Those country roads were loaded with rabbits, Loaded with cottontail rabbits. The first couple of years we went. And then it just seems like toward the end, you know, middle. Toward the end, when we stopped going up there hunting, you, if you saw one, you were lucky. And I don't know if that would be more attributed to, you know, A coyote explosion population, but which I didn't see it personally, you know, hunting. I mean, we would see a few here and there. I just thought that was something that was odd. Like the rabbits vanished. It was odd, man, because, like I said, those roads were cut. They were covered in them first couple years, but, yeah, as far as, you know, smelling anything like that. In years past, you know, I've heard some weird stuff like Joe was just saying. I've heard some. You know, I guess I could call it a scream. Now, this was not up there.

Wes (42:37)

This.

Mike (42:38)

I do. We do a awful lot of hunting in Mississippi. I'd say about 30 minutes east of natchez. We do a lot of hunting. I've heard some stuff, you know, on our place that in broad daylight now, not in the dark, and you're just coming. It would be coming through the woods, and it would be just this high pitch.

Joe (42:56)

I just.

Mike (42:56)

And it would just keep going. And you could tell it was. It was not in one spot. It was moving through the woods. It's just this high pitch. I just kind of wrote it off because, you know, I do believe in bigfoot, obviously, but I'm not one of those guys that, like, everything I hear or see, that's got to be a bigfoot. That's not me. I don't. I just don't operate like that. But so I kind of wrote those things off as man.

Joe (43:19)

That's.

Mike (43:19)

Could be a bobcat or. Or we got a lot of gray foxes, because it wasn't nothing that, like, rumbled my chest or went right through me to sound, you know, but it was. It was pretty loud, and it was weird. Something that I didn't hear often, that's for sure. That's kind of the only experiences that I've ever had, you know, on my place in Mississippi now. Yeah, I know. I'm sure you've seen this video. And this. This video came from about probably 30 minutes from where we hunting up there was in the homochitta forest, and this guy walked up on one, and it was kind of in a swampy area, and it was. It was stooping down. I think the guy might have been hog hunting. It was in daylight, and the thing was stooping down. It had an old rotten tree in front of it. It was kind of in the water. It was old cypress tree, and the. The bigfoot was peeling the bark of it, like he was trying to get in there digging stuff or grubs or whatever. And then when the thing stood up, the guy took off running. I know you had to have seen that video, but that was very close to where we hunt. It was in the. In the homochitta forest in Mississippi. Now, I've talking. I've Talked to actually a game warden up there about two weeks ago. Just to feel him out, man. I said, man, if these guys, if anybody, they. If they heard some stories and they gonna know. So I asked him and he was just. I don't think he was hiding anything from me. He said he had, he's, you know, he's grown up there. He said, I've never seen nothing, you know, in my life. But he said there was one story where of a man had told me that he had one behind his house. And he didn't elaborate on it. He just said, yeah, I talked to a guy not too long ago, Said he thinks he's got one behind his house, you know, rooting around back there. And that was the only bigfoot store he could tell me. He did tell me that. I was just telling Joe this earlier. He said he was standing on the edge of her. Not to get off the bigfoot subject, but this is UFO related. He was. Him and a coach was standing on the edge of a football field by a school. And it was. It was dark. But he said, you know, they had the stadium lights and stuff. And he said there was this, I don't know, 40 foot tree line, 40 foot high tree line right in front of him. And he said all of a sudden they could see this object coming over the top of the trees. And he said you could tell it was moving because it was over the tree. So you could tell it wasn't just sitting there, it was actually moving, but it was very, very slow. And he said it was triangular shape and it was either black or very dark in color. And he said it was humongous. He didn't give me a scale, but he just said this thing was freaking huge. And he said as it come over the top of the trees, he said it. There was no sound, no sound from this thing at all. And he said, you know, a lot of people say, yeah, they see him and then just. They take off and they go on. He said, not this one. He said it just like it evaporated. It was gone. And he said they both saw it, but I just thought that was weird.

Wes (46:10)

That is interesting and I appreciate you sharing that, Mike. Have you ever seen the balls of light when you've been out in the woods?

Mike (46:19)

I haven't. Now my dad, this happened when I was just a little boy. So my daddy and a good friend of his was frogging one night. Now we live in south Louisiana. So there's a lot of marsh out here. And so they was in some duck ponds One night and they were frogging, catching frogs, and it was in a little mud boat so they going along. And he said all of a sudden, out of nowhere, it's just. He didn't say it had a shape to it, as in like a triangle or nothing like that. He said it was like a ball of light. But he said it was huge, big. And he said it come out over the pond where they were. And he said it was whatever, five, you know, five, 10 foot off the water. And he said it was following them. He said they would. They would move in the boat as they frogging. And he said it would. It was following them and they would stop. It would stop and they take off again. And it would take off and it just kept doing that. And he said it did it for. For quite a while. And he said the next thing, you know, kind of like I was just telling you, this one didn't evaporate. He said it just. It just shot off into the sky and it was gone. That's the only ball of light story I have. I. I haven't seen anything like that personally.

Wes (47:25)

Yeah, you know, Mike, you were talking about one of those creatures. It was on video where it's kind of in a swamp and it's tearing apart the. The bark on a tree. First time I watched that, I was like, that's real. That's one of them. And it's interesting that it's in an area where you guys hunt. Let me ask you, what do you think Sasquatch is? What's your take?

Mike (47:46)

Yeah, so I. I've got a lot of things on that, man. I've always believed in them all my life. Probably the first time I ever saw anything big for related would have been. It's probably, I guess in the 70s when I was a little kid. The Patterson Gimlin film, it was like coming to a. They must have made a little short movie about it because it was coming to a movie theater and down here where we live. So that was my first thing on. And I can remember me asking my dad about it. My daddy said, he never said, oh, that's not real. He just said, oh, that's. That's over there in Northern California. We ain't got that over here. I guess he was trying to not scare me because we. We hunted, you know. So then as years went on, like I said, always believed in it. And then in the past 10 years, I really started reading more on it and watching all these. You know, now with the Internet, there's so much information and Then a lot of years ago was when I came across your site, and I just. It was. Your site for what it was was always my favorite. I just kept. Got there because there's a lot of them now. But I always kept going back to, you know, your show, and I learned a lot from it. So as far as, you know, once you start reading in the Sasquatches, it's not just like. It's a big. There's so much to this deal, man, because you got all the cloak and stuff where they look like they can be like the Predator movie where it's. It's pixelated. Right. I don't know what that's about. Can they turn it on and turn it can, or is that just another creature that's. That's just stays in. I don't know. I do think they. Flesh and blood. My honest opinion, I. I know they bleed because of all the stories I read, and there's enough stories out there where people have shot them and there was blood. So can they be from. From out of. Can they be part of the UFO thing? Very possible, because a lot of people say they see unidentified. Like flying saucers or whatever you want to call it, UFOs, or they see lights, and then these things appear. So could there be some correlation with that? Yeah, absolutely, I think. I mean, because nobody knows. Are they living. Are they living. All living in caves or underground? Well, I know a lot of Mississippi don't have caves. So where. Where are these things during. Where are they going during the day? Why are they not seeing more? Because there's a lot of sightings in Mississippi, man. I'm talking a bunch. I really don't know what these things do where. You know, where they stand all the time, because it ain't just one. There's several of these things. And I. I think they're more on the. Could it be like a human ape cross? I'm gonna say there's a good chance on that. I think they're more on our end than the apn. I think they're actually more from. From everything I'm seeing and reading, I think they're more intelligent than when you are. For one thing, they can do more things, like with the infrasound thing. And I think that's probably what happened to Joe and him not even realizing it because he was telling me how. Nauseous. Nauseous. He said, bro, after the fact. Not like instantly like after the fact. He goes, dude, I got so nauseous.

Wes (50:40)

And.

Mike (50:40)

And I'm like, I Don't even know if I mentioned infrasound to him at that point. But I was like, he probably. You probably got hit with it and didn't even know it. So. Yeah, I think they're more on. On a human line what they are nobody. And when you got to watch how you see when you say nobody knows. Because I think somebody out there knows. I think the government knows all about these things and they have been for a long time. They probably have them not only just dead bodies, but who knows, man? They may have lamy and I don't know what they're doing, but I guarantee they know these things exist. There's a million reasons why. I mean, I can understand why they don't want to just come out and say, hey, man, you know, bigfoot's a real. And what that would do to the economy is crazy. It's gonna. It's gonna trash everything. Nobody's going to want to go in the woods. So there goes your hunting industry, all your national parks. Nobody's going to want to go out there. They're gonna have to stop logging, you know, because they're gonna try and protect these things. Right now you got a smart humanoid thing out there that's. So they're going to protect all these. So all the logging industry's gone because these things are everywhere. I mean, it's. It's gonna escalate with trash everything. If you think about would crash the economy.

Wes (51:55)

Yeah, I think the opposite would happen, you know, if I said, here's a GPS location of a family group. Are you guys gonna say no or are you guys gonna be like, yeah, let's go check it out. And I'm not saying to shoot one. I'm just saying because the curiosity of it, I think the public's curiosity of being, hey, let's go see. One would overtake the fright of I'm never going in the woods again. I'm never doing this again. And when it comes to the lumber industry, I guess it depends on what kind of an animal this thing is. If it is a normal natural animal. And I could be wrong. I mean, to your point, Mike, I mean, you could be a 100% right. And I do think that they're very physical. You know, if you took Mike's theory and combined it with yours, you both could be right.

Mike (52:45)

Right. I mean, and it depends on. You got. There's gonna be both sides of society. Some of them's gonna be curious. I'm gonna. I'm gonna want to go check it out some of them's gonna want to try and kill it. That's obvious. But then you can have the ones that are scared, you know, and they're not gonna want to go nowhere. Because if anybody does any kind of reading and you see how many missing people are in these national parks, if some. And I'm talking about a lot of people, anywhere from kids to grown ups, There's a lot of people come up missing in national parks and, and then just in the woods in general, but national parks, a lot. So can you attribute all that to bigfoot? Absolutely not. I mean some of it's going to be weather related. Some people just get lost or. Or whatever, or get hurt, you know, fall down or clear, whatever break, you know, and they just end up dying out there. But so it, the, the effects of it could go out of the way. But I mean, I think a lot of people that come up missing out there is because of these things. Not all of them, but I think a lot of them. And I also think that bigfoots are like people in a way as. As far as the sense that you got good people and you got bad people, meaning you got murderers. So on Bigfoots, I think it's the same thing. They're not all the same. They don't all look the same. And they got different personalities. Some of them are friendly and, and some of them. I think you get them in the wrong and they will kill you. You know. Now what they do with you, do they actually eat you? I don't know all that. But do I think some of them will kill you? Absolutely.

Wes (54:18)

Yeah. Like I said, you could be right. I mean it's. It's one of those things. I. I think it would crash economy if it was a normal natural animal out there running around. But I don't think that's why it's being covered up. And you kind of said it earlier so you think it's more of a. Something that leans more closer to us than an animal.

Mike (54:42)

I do, man. I. I do. I think they have a lot more towards us than an animal. They had. They have their own language. We don't understand it. And is it something that old or ancient? I don't know what it is. Some of the best ones that I've heard, I think it was from the 60s with. Was from northern Cal. I think in the Sierras. The Sierra sounds. Is that it?

Wes (55:06)

Yeah.

Mike (55:07)

The Ron Morehead stuff where they. You can hear them, man, that the voices are weird. So I mean they have their own languages. I don't know, man. I just think they're. And they can avoid it. I. I think they've studying us more than we studying them. If you want my honest opinion, if you've been in the woods long enough, even though you've never seen one, I guarantee you they. They've seen you. That's just my opinion on it.

Wes (55:33)

Yeah, I agree with you, Mike. I think they've been watching us more than we've been watching them. And it's been a real pleasure having both of you guys on. And Joe, thank you for coming on. And if you would send that video, I'd sure appreciate it.

Joe (55:47)

Yeah. While we were sitting here, I found a couple of those. Those shelter pictures, and I'm gonna go back on some older phones and try to find some of the other ones that were shaped like teepees. But we'll keep in touch.

Wes (55:58)

We'll.

Joe (55:58)

It was pretty neat.

Wes (56:00)

Yeah. Thank you again, Joe. And thank you, Mike, for coming on and kind of setting this whole thing up today. Like I said, I really enjoyed chatting with both of you.

Mike (56:09)

Yep. Thank you, Wes.

Wes (56:12)

And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is wesasquatchchronicles.com and if you get a chance, check out sasquatch chronicles.com you can become a member and get additional shows. Until next time, everyone.

Mike (58:57)

Sa. Sam.