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- [00:12]
Jeff
And this thing's pacing me and I'm like, david. I'm yelling. I'm thinking, it's David. I'm like, hey, is that you? This thing is pacing me like a human, and I'm freaked out. And look, man, okay, I don't know. That was Bigfoot, okay? I don't know what it. What it was. You can call it a Neanderthal as far as I'm concerned. At this point, Bigfoot's not in my mind. I'm thinking, meth head, you know, pot growers. Out of nowhere, this voice was so loud, and it said his name. David. David. Clear as a bell, but. But demonic sounding. I mean. I mean, ear splitt loud. I mean, I. I was so shocked. But I told. I told whatever this was one more time.
- [01:14]
David
If you.
- [01:14]
Jeff
If you don't leave, I will kill you. I am going to shoot. I'm going to kill you.
- [01:32]
David
It looked like somebody was bent over, had their head in the window of the deer blind. It either heard me or smelt me. And he pulled his head out of the tent and stood straight up.
- [01:44]
Jeff
And that.
- [01:46]
David
That shocked me. They don't make people that. That big.
- [02:00]
Jeff
The way it moved,
- [02:03]
David
almost as if it was gliding across the beach.
- [02:07]
Jeff
I' seen anything move like that in my life.
- [02:14]
David
They were screaming at each other in gibberish.
- [02:18]
Jeff
It sounded like a language.
- [02:19]
David
And they were chuntering away, back and
- [02:21]
Jeff
forwards, back and forwards, back and forwards. I know what a bear looks like, and there is no way on this planet that what I saw were bears. 911.
- [02:44]
David
What are you reporting?
- [02:45]
Jeff
Jesus Christ. You better, sir. Gia.
- [02:48]
Guest Singer
Hello?
- [02:49]
Jeff
Get somebody out here.
- [02:51]
David
What's going on now.
- [02:51]
Jeff
Sir, that son of a is about 6 foot 9. I don't know.
- [02:55]
David
Do you see him now, sir?
- [02:56]
Jeff
Yes, I'm looking right at him. Uh oh, Hey, this is Luke Griggs, and you are listening to Sasquatch Chronicles.
- [03:38]
Wes
Ah, it feels good to be home. Last week I hosted the Confessionals podcast, whatever podcast player you're listening to. Check out the episode I did on the. Just type in the Confessionals and it'll come up. It has Tony's goofy face as a logo. But I did a. I did a show on Billy the Kid and how he may not have died back in the 1800s. And I hope you guys get a chance to go check it out, even if you're not into the subject. I poured my heart and soul into that show, and Tony gave me such a hard time for a long time that no one would ever listen to that show. And he thought it was dumb. And I was like, you're wrong, you're wrong. So finally how the whole swap started, I was like, I'm just going to do the show. I'm going to get my Billy the Kid show because you know, my show is more Bigfoot related and his show I think he could take in different avenues. And he gave me such a hard time about it. But I was finally able to get my show and I really hope if you guys are listening to this, please, after this show, go listen to the confessionals. Episode 307, Billy the Kid, the man who Died Twice. And with your downloads, it'll give me more salt to rub in Tony's wound. I'm thinking I can goof on Tony about for this for about another six months before it gets old. So I hope the numbers go through the roof and I can give him a hard time. But thank you for being here. Tonight we're gonna be chatting with David and Je, two hunters from Oklahoma. And it's a really fascinating account. Especially talk to these guys because I could find out really quick. These guys are have been in the outdoors their whole life, been hunting their whole lives. Neither one of them really believed in Bigfoot. Thought it was kind of a joke. And a lot changed the night that they had a run in. For the longest time they didn't know what they actually were running into. And as you heard in the intro, Jeff actually took a shot at one of them and things got much worse. Let the guys tell the story. It's probably one of the more fascinating accounts I've heard. If you've had an encounter and you'd like to be on the show, shoot me an email. My email address is wesasquatchchronicles.com and if you get a chance check out sasquatch chronicles.com you can become a member and get additional shows. Let's jump into it tonight. I want to start off with David. David, thanks for coming on.
- [06:04]
David
Oh, no problem.
- [06:06]
Wes
Yeah, I really appreciate you being here, David. And you know, we'll be talking to Jeff here in a moment. Your brother in law who was with you during this encounter. And I always love having two eyewitnesses of one encounter because you kind of get different perspectives as far as what happened before we actually get into the encounter. Can you tell us a little bit about this property? I know it took place roughly 1998 in Oklahoma, but if you would kind of describe the property.
- [06:33]
David
Well, the land is, it's in no water, really close to Uligaw Lake. It's Right between Oolagawa Lake and the Verdigris River.
- [06:44]
Wes
Well, let me ask you prior to your guys encounter, and I kind of want to walk into the encounter too as well, but prior to what happened to you guys that night, did you ever have anything weird or strange happen to you on the property?
- [07:00]
David
First off, I, I, I feel strange things. I, I was always creeped out when I went there. I always felt like I was being watched the whole time I was there. I always felt like something was pacing me when I walked to my tree stand in the mornings. That, that just never seemed to leave. At least during deer gun season.
- [07:24]
Wes
So with regard to this property, I'm kind of curious. Did you ever have any deer come up missing or any.
- [07:31]
David
Yeah, well, I, once. My, my brother in law, Jeff, he shot a, he shot a little, little buck. We drug it into this little, this little clearing so we could get it out right there. And it was, it was not a very big clearing, but it's, I mean probably 20 foot across. I mean just a little opening in the trees and, and the grass was nice and green there. It's like, it was like a, green, like a wheat field. Oh, right there. You know, it was just kind of oasis in that, in there. So we drug it in there and I, I have to, I have to start, I have to back up a little bit. On the way to this, to this deer hunt, I, I stopped by my parents house. We stopped there and I didn't have a knife with me, so I talked my dad, he said, well I, I'll give you my knife, but you got to bring it back. He goes, he said, if you leave your gun there, you're gonna bring this knife back. I said, okay. It was razor sharp and, and it was a, about 8 inches long. So I, I promised him I'd bring it back. So anyway, so he pulled, we pulled this thing in and I, he goes, Dave, I've never, I've never gutted one before. I don't know if he's pulling my leg or just trying to make me do it, but, but I, I said, well, okay, I'll do it. So I got that knife out, I ran it up and gutted that thing out and, and he's laughing at me the whole time. We're not quiet by any means and because we already got the deer. So he's laughing at me. He's calling me Dr. Dave as I'm doing it and said I was making a mess of it. And so I took that knife and I got, we got it all gutted out and I got blood all over me. I stick it in the ground there beside it and then beside the deer. And we start packing our stuff up to leave to go back. It's just. It's just getting dusk and walking back, we probably got half a mile to walk, you know, back, back there. So we get our guns and all their. Everything that we carry, we always carry too much. And then we have the deer too, on top of it. So we're trying to pack that thing out of there. And we get about, walk about five minutes. It's not very far. And I said, oh, gosh, we gotta go back. Jeff is not very sympathetic with it. Oh my gosh, why you gotta go back? I tell him, I forgot that knife there. So we spin around and walk on, walk back there and I get to the spot and I look down, there's my knife. And I pick it up and I wipe it on my pants. And I look up and Jeff is like. He's just staring. I said, what's wrong with you? And he goes, do you. Do you see something wrong here? And I said, well, what, like what? He goes, is something missing here? I look down at that entire gut pile is gone. And. And there's. There's not even. There's not a trace of it. It's. It's like. It's like something just step out of the air, you know, There was so much blood and everything where it was at, there was. It was just kind of patted down. And there was once one leaf that had one drop of blood on it. Now gut piles are sticky, so I can see all the leaf litter picking up, picking it up off the thing. But I. I don't know, it was. It was just weird.
- [11:34]
Wes
That is weird. Like it picked the whole thing up and walked off.
- [11:38]
David
Yeah, I'm. I'm trying to rationalize, you know, coyotes. No, we would have heard them with pigs. I've never seen a pig on that property. Drag marks. If something drug it away, Cougar, I don't think it could have got it because it was. It was too much. We. We even cut the. The lower half of the legs off and dropped them on the ground. And those were gone too. So there was not a trace that we'd have been there, except my knife was still sticking in the ground. Jeff, my brother, he says there's a track or something here. And I look there and it's just where the. There's not really track. It's just where the grass is just smashed, going off. And I You know, that's not track. It's too big. You know, Jeff said it looked like a snowshoe there had gone in there. It's, you know. But anyway, we, I, I, Bigfoot, this is Oklahoma. Bigfoot's not in Oklahoma. You know, at least that's what I thought. I, you know, I, I have never, that never crossed my mind. But I, but at the same point I'm tucking it away and just following away because I, I, it's just something weird that happened there. So.
- [12:56]
Wes
Yeah, it's very strange, you know, the gut pile. If a predator is going to come in or, you know, any scavenger, they're going to make a mess of it. They're not just going to pick the whole thing up and walk off.
- [13:06]
David
And not every piece, you know, I mean, there's a heart and liver and, and the four legs and it's just, it's just a freaking mess of 35 pounds of 40 pounds of junk. Yeah, you know, I, I couldn't pick it up all myself without dropping, without dropping pieces of it.
- [13:29]
Wes
What did you think was going on, Jeff? I mean, what was your opinion as far as what's going on here?
- [13:34]
David
Well, it, I, the only thing I could think of is maybe, maybe cougar, maybe mountain lion. But, but, but that didn't make sense either. We started looking around there and we started getting a little spooked then because whatever had run off with that, it had to be watching us the whole entire time we were, you know, playing there. I picked it up and I picked the deer up and he, he cocked his rifle and, and we crawled out of there pretty much. We just kind of walked real slow and he all the way back to camp.
- [14:13]
Wes
So, yeah, it's very strange. Very, very strange. Let's do this. I want to walk into this encounter and we'll get to Jeff here in a moment. But David, if you would just kind of start from the beginning. So you guys have this gut pile situation. Kind of walk us into the encounter. What, what happens next?
- [14:33]
David
Well, I started off, we were running late, so we, we don't get much time off, so we, we were running late. I was already a little perturbed that Jeff, because I wanted to get there before, before dark to try to set up our tent and camp and stuff. You know, we missed around too long and we finally got out there. It was like 10 o'. Clock. You know, it's, it's dark, 40 out there and you can't see your hand in front of your face. It was a Dark night anyway. But there's a canopy over us and you can't see anything. So I cleared out a nice spot and we set up the tent and we have a little fireplace we've already made there. And so we had some wood. So I start putting wood, getting ready to start the fire and everything. And he goes, well, just go set up my crease stand. I said, what? And by this time it's like 11 o' clock at night, 11 or 12, you know. And I said, no, no, we're not doing this. He goes, well, I can't, I can't go there carrying this thing blind in the morning, you know, I will scare everything off. Let's go set up that tree stand. And I, my heart sank, you know, I'm tired. You know, we set up all this thing. It's 11 o' clock and he's excited. So I said, okay, well, let's go. So we have two little crappy flashlights. Back then, the flashlights were just, you know, you could probably see 10 foot in front of you, you know, little D cell batteries and they, they sucked. They were terrible. And I grew. I take the tree stand and put it on over one shoulder and, and have a flashlight in the other and, and he just like barrels down, out, down, down the trail. And I'm trying to keep up with him. You know, we have now it's pitch dark. We haven't been here in a year. We know the property, but we haven't been here. And he's just barreling down to the, through the trees. And so I'm trying to keep up with him. And the minute we tried to stop, turn off the top down into the, the hauler, it, I feel like I'm being stalked and I'm hearing stuff and something, something is just right off pace me to my right. And it is. I, I hear it and I'm trying to ignore it. You know, I'm not letting, I'm not gonna let my fear, fear get, get ahead of me. You know, I'm, I'm kind of stoic. I just kind of let it, let it slide and, but I can't get it. I, it, it keeps, keeps doing. I keep saying, well, that's just a possum or armadillo or something down there, you know, that it doesn't sound like it's on two on four legs. It sounds like somebody walking out there. So I had this unexplainable fear that somebody's walking there. You know, it's like when, when you walk up on Somebody and, and you don't know them and you feel like you're not supposed to be there. But anyway, but so, so anyway, we're walking down through here and I can't hardly keep my light in front of me because I'm swerving around trying to see what is right there behind me. And it's, it sounds like it's like 10 foot away, I mean, right on top of me. So I'm. I'm getting pretty nervous, spinning it around, cannot see anything. And we get down to the bottom of the bottom of the, of the hauler and Jeff, he walks, I guess he remembered the tree from last year because he walks right to this tree and says, oh, there it is. We're going to put it up right here. And I said, are you sure this is the one you want? He goes, yeah. So I kind of, I set my light down and we start putting the pegs in. I'm putting the pegs in and he shot a light on there and I'm scrolling them in there. I kind of temporarily forget about this whatever was stalking me. As scary as I was, I can't believe I did. But I, I'm screwing this thing in. And I decided, well, I better set this. I, I'm the lighter and probably better climber of the two of us. I, I take the, the tree stand, I climb up the tree with it. And this, this tree stand my dad made, it is welded angle iron. They are Cadillacs. They were really good. They were, they were heavy. It was like 40 pounds of solid metal, you know, so dragging this thing up the tree wasn't. Wasn't any easy task. I got up as high as I could and he hand, he hands it to me and I get it up there and set it and I mess with it a little bit and I said, there you go. He goes, well, come on down. I'm gonna try it out. As I'm coming down, I get a little dizzy for some reason. Of course it's dark. Dark is crazy, you know, out in there. And I missed a stomp that I put in and I, I fall. I've never fallen out of a tree ever, but I did that night. And so I, I missed, I missed that stob. And. And I'm thinking the whole. As I'm falling, there's freaking metal spikes all the way down. And so I push off. Well, Jeff tries to catch me and we ended up splatting on the fourth floor right there. And he's mad, and I'm mad, I'm tired and he goes, what are you. I can't believe you fell. I can't believe it either. And he goes, well, let me try it out. I said, do you gotta. You know. He goes, you just fell. I gotta try it out. So he. He goes up the tree. Well, as I'm standing there shining the light, I can hear this something behind me again. There's a little bush there, and there was a little bush that was there, and it was probably, I don't know, about 4 foot tall and about 5 or 6 foot wide, you know, And I kept hearing something, that bush. And I'm shining a light, and I can't make myself keep the light on the tr. On the tree on him. He's got to have light to climb it. And I can't make my. I'm swinging the light around, and then he would yell like, david, give me the light. And I shine it back around. And then I hear something and I. I'm. I'm getting scared. We've been. We've hunted this many years and. And then I. I can't keep the line on him going up the tree. I keep swerving around. He keeps yelling my name. He gets up there. And back then all we had was. Well, I don't even think I had a. Had a phone, but he had a little flip phone. He gets his little flip phone out and he's shining. Shining the light around, looking at it. He goes, oh, yeah, this is good. I can really see. You know, I don't know how I could even say that because you. Because you literally can't see your hand in front of your face. Harley, It's. It's dark. So I said, okay, good, come down. I'm ready to get out of there. I'm. I'm spooked. So he. He comes down. As he comes down, I got my back to him and I'm trying to shine the light over my shoulder at. At him. And he's. And he's coming down and. And I'm shining it forward and. And then back because I'm still hearing something there. And it's. It's really close. Something in the brush moving, moving the leaf litter, moving around. I. I can't. I. I have no idea what it is, you know? So we get down and we trudge back up the hill, up and up to. To our camp is. And we get there. I'm. I'm all exhausted and I. It. It was an extra warm night. I remember I'm just covered with sweat, but I'm starting to get cooled off. It's like 60 degrees and it's starting to get. I'm starting to get cooled off, so I start the fire and I'm in the tent with my face right there by the fire and I, I think this feels really good, you know, And I, I don't want to leave the fire. And he, he goes, oh, dang it. I, I forgot my, my phone. I gotta go get my phone. I said, dude, where. What do you mean? He goes, I, I left it. I think I left it up there on that tree stand. And I said, dude, it'll be there in the morning. Just forget it. It'll be there. He goes, no, no, I actually forgot part of it too. At the bottom of that tree. Before we went back, we got an argument. I lost all sense of direction and I said, well, I'm going back. And I started walking. And he goes, he goes, david, that's the wrong way. And I said, no, I'm going, this is the way. This is the way we came. He goes, you're going to fall right into the lake if you walk that way. And I said, no, I, this is the way. I know it. That's the way we came. He goes, no, no, no, this is it. And I started thinking, you know, I've already been scared and, and I'm not, I'm not. We're not going to get separated out here. And there's, there's really no way we can get lost. There's a, there's a road in one side, there's a lake on the other. There's. And there's a house on either side of the hill from us. So really any way I go, I'm going to, I can find my way out, but I think we're not going to get separated. So, so anyway, we argue about this. So we get back to camp. So now, now I'm just, not only I'm. I've been scared, I'm hot. Now I'm humiliated because he was right and I was wrong.
- [25:17]
Wes
Yeah.
- [25:17]
David
So. So, so anyway, so I'm laying there and I, and he says, I'm going back. And I said, dude, you going back, you're going by yourself. I, I'm not going to go back there. So he goes, well, I'm going back. So off he watched marches. He takes his. I said, take your gun with you. And he take, he takes his gun on his rifle with him. It's just a bolt action rifle he takes with him. And he, but he, he marches off. So I'm laying there, I'M getting. I'm feeling real nice. That fires warm on my face. And I'm laying there and just laying on top of my sleeping bag, and I'm just about to doze off, and I hear boom. And I jump up. I thought, what the heck? And I start pulling my pants on, and then I hear boom. He's shooting out there. I'm trying to pull my boots on. I hear something just barreling through the woods. And here comes Jeff. He's running that. He runs right up to me and he. He runs right up and just stands right over me. Face is pale as ghost. And I said, what is wrong with you? He goes, well, well, I. I heard something. I. I said, what? Because I saw something and heard something. Some. There's something out there. I said, dude, you cannot shoot. You can't shoot deer at night. It's illegal. You can't do that. Because I treat him like a little kid. I feel bad about now, but I said, dude, I don't want to hear it. You've kept me up all night, and now it's like 2:00 o' clock in the morning, you know, and I don't want to hear any more about it. He goes, you can't do that. You know, these people that live, I mean, 10 acres, everything echoes down that valley. So I'm sure they're not gonna, you know, they leave here all the time. They're not gonna appreciate us shooting guns in their backyard, you know, and. And you can't shoot it at night anyway. So I. I don't want to hear anything about it.
- [27:30]
Jeff
Just.
- [27:31]
David
Just drop it. So he sits down. He sits on this little bench that I'd made there, and he's sitting straight up. I'm gonna hand it off to him.
- [27:43]
Wes
Yeah, I want to hear from Jeff
- [27:45]
David
tell his side of what. What happened. Yeah, he didn't tell me this till 10 years later. It was 10 years later before he even mentioned to this. And he mentioned it into. In passing. But I said what? I said, you never told me that.
- [28:01]
Jeff
Because.
- [28:02]
David
Yeah, remember that. That night I shot down there. And anyway, so, yeah, if you would, let's.
- [28:09]
Wes
Let's chat with Jeff real quick, and I'll come back to you, David.
- [28:12]
David
Okay. All right, here. Here's. Here's Jeff.
- [28:14]
Jeff
Hey, Wes, how you doing?
- [28:16]
Wes
I'm well. I'm well, Jeff, thanks so much for being on the show. And I know David kind of start. And I want to talk to you a little bit about this property before we get into that. So you guys go back to the Camp. And then you go, you have to, I don't blame you for going to get in your phone, but. So you take off to go get your phone and what, what kind of happens?
- [28:36]
Jeff
Okay, I get down there, I'm on my way back down there and then all of a sudden I hear the pacing again. Here comes the pacing. I stop. It stops. And then it gets louder, then it gets closer. And then I, I mean, I'm telling you, man, that the weeds down there in that river bottom or that, that, that hollow bottom, there's a place where the water collects and there's a place on the north side that the water don't collect. Now when, where the water does collect, that's where I had that, that tree stand in that tree. There was no water there. But I'm just saying when it gets, when it gets high, the water collects down there and the weeds are like chest high. I mean, they're tall, but. But if you get up in that tree, in that bottom, you can see forever. That's why I knew that that tree would be the best tree to be in because we've hunted there before. And I, I thought, man, if I could find that tree and get that tree, stand up in it, I will have a view of this whole hollow. Anyhow, I, you know, I, I get down there and this thing's pacing me
- [29:41]
David
and I'm like, David.
- [29:44]
Jeff
I'm yelling, I'm thinking it's David. I'm like, hey, is that you? And I walk a little bit more and this thing is perfectly timing my, my tromping through the weeds because I'm chomping and I stop real fast and I can hear clunk, clunk. This thing is pacing me like a human. And, and I'm freaked out, you know, I'm starting to think about him being scared and this is freaking me out. And then this thing with the loudest and look, man, I, I can't, I don't know that, that it was Bigfoot, okay? I don't know what it, what it was. You can call it a Neanderthal as far as I'm concerned. At this point, Bigfoot's not in my mind. I'm thinking, meth head, you know, pot growers, you know, some country bumpkin down here trying to mess with me. I don't know. But out of nowhere, this voice was so loud. And it said his name. David. David. Clear as a bell, but. But demonic sounding. I mean, I mean, ear splitting loud. I mean, I, I was so shocked, I didn't even know what to do. I was just sitting there like, I don't even understand what's happening. Is this David yelling his name? I mean, I don't know what to do. And then it laughed with the most hideous, crazy, satanic voice. It laughed like a human. I mean, just. Just. But super loud. And I remember when it laughed, it was so loud that it vibrated my clothing. I could feel that. I could feel it so loud. It was hitting my body. I mean, it made my. It made my clothes move. I mean, it vibrated me like, my body. And at that point, my little voice in my head said, you need to get up that tree, and you need to get up that tree now. And I got up in that tree, and I've. And I. And I. I think I scraped and cut myself all up trying to. You know, I was just going up so fast. I was just hitting them stobs with my hands, and I was pulling. And I got up there, and I've got this little cheesy flashlight, and I'm like, david, if that's you, I'm gonna kill you. You know, I'm screaming and hollering, and then this thing retreats a little bit because I'm. Got good. I've got good distance on it. You know, I'm up. I'm elevated. This thing's probably 15 foot up, maybe 8. I don't know. It was. It's up in the air. It's up. It's up off the ground a ways, and. And I get up there, and I'm shining this light, and this thing, you know, I told you there's. There's. There's tall weeds down here. And I never got a super good look at it. Okay. It was just like a.
- [32:35]
David
It's.
- [32:35]
Jeff
It's like a. It was, like, huge. I mean, it was. It was like. It's, like, maybe four feet wide where it would push the. You know, where I would see it coming out of the weeds. And I shined my light on it, and I was just like, oh, my God. This is nothing like I've never seen before. I couldn't see real good detail, but I could tell this thing just. It's huge. This. This space that this thing is displacing, and it was black. You know, you could see a good contrast because those weeds were tan. They were like a light tan, and this thing was making a good contrast on them weeds. So, yeah, I could see that. I couldn't see real good detail, but I could see that. And after hearing this voice from hell say his name, I'm thinking there's some crazy nuts down here gonna kill me. I mean, I didn't know what I thought was just, you know, I'm not thinking Bigfoot. But I told, I told whatever this was one more time. If you, if you don't leave, I will kill you. I am going to shoot. I'm going to kill you. And it, it kept on trying to test me, so I fired.
- [33:42]
Wes
What was the creature doing right before you fired?
- [33:45]
Jeff
It would, it would come into the, like the range of my light and then it would retreat and, and try to, how should I say? It, it would, it would leave the, the view of my light and then it would come back around and try to like ambush me to another point where I wasn't looking. And then I'd shine the light over there and then it retreat and do the same thing. It was just like, it was, just looked like to me, it was just trying to scare me and it did a good job. I, I am so scared at this point, man. I would never fire my gun at something that I didn't know what it was. I mean, I would never do that. And I've been brought up like that. I just would never even think.
- [34:24]
Wes
Yeah, and you don't have to explain yourself by any means, Jeff. I would have shot too, honestly. Especially if I hear some demonic voice saying my, my brother in law's name.
- [34:33]
Jeff
You know what, it wasn't just the voice. It was the, it was the magnitude of the voice. At that point I'm thinking that's, you know, when I got up in the tree and had about two seconds to put in my head. That's not normal. Nobody could be that loud. No, but nobody could be that loud. It was like a speaker coming right towards me and it just, just, it just engulfed me, you know, And I was like, no, this is not right. This is not right. And, and I thought, man, you know what? I'm, I'm gonna fire. I, I computed those thoughts and made up my mind to fire in about five or 10 seconds. And I told it, man, I am gonna shoot if you don't stop this. And I shot and I shot again and I, I, I don't know, I think I hit it. I mean, I'm, I'm close, you know, but you know, anybody could point a rubber band gun and pull it and hit somebody 10ft away.
- [35:31]
Wes
After you shot it, did it vocalize or anything afterwards?
- [35:35]
Jeff
No, it crashed and it destroyed everything in its path, retreating. But I mean, it made no bones about getting out of There.
- [35:44]
Wes
And so what kind of happens next is that when you leave and you head back to camp.
- [35:49]
Jeff
When. When I heard it leaving and anybody could have heard it leaving, I mean, it was not trying to be stealthy or anything. It was when it leave, it crashed. And when I saw it going north, I got the heck out of there and went south. And. And you know what? I have amnesia from that point. I don't even remember pushing a tree out of my way at that point. I was trying to get back to camp so fast. I mean, I have no memory. I don't. Can't even remember. I know it's rough country down there. It's a struggle. And I have no memory of when I got down out of that tree getting back to the camp. I just remember I've got to get back to camp. This thing went that way. I'm going the other way. Thank God my camp was the direction I needed to be going away from this thing. I probably would have spent the night in the tree. If this thing would have went south,
- [36:38]
Wes
I would have fired, too, honestly. And I'm against firing at night, and I'm against hunting at night, and I would be more of an ethical hunter. But in your situation, Jeff, I absolutely would have started shooting. I would have given warning like you did, and then I would have started blasting. Especially if it's the behavior it's making, because it's not. It's almost like it's hunting you.
- [36:58]
Jeff
Yeah. The voice was so loud. I just can't say how loud the voice. I wish. You know, it's one thing for me to say, Wes. This voice was very loud. It's another thing for you to be there. And. And have you. Have you ever been on, like, an aluminum boat or something or aluminum chair or, you know, a concert chair, and the music's so loud it kind of tickles you, you know, it vibrates the chair, and you're like, oh, my gosh, that's freaking loud. My shirt did that on my chest. I mean, I was like, I don't even know what to say about that. I mean, I just thought, that's not possible for something to be that loud. That's the part that creeped me out, I guess, more than anything. I mean, that. That just was like, there's no way something is this loud.
- [37:44]
Wes
Yeah. And the laugh is creepy, too, when you hear it.
- [37:47]
Jeff
Oh, yeah. My heart about melted when it laughed. I was like, oh, my God. What are they laughing at me? Because I'm scared. You know, at this point, I'm just trying to make sense of it and I'm thinking, what is this thing doing? Is it laughing at me because I'm scared? You know, Is it trying to scare me? You know, I don't know.
- [38:06]
Wes
Let me ask you before we get to going back to the camp, you've heard the Sierra sounds, Jeff, of. You know, when you listen to it, everyone kind of has a different take on it. Of Ron Morin. Have you heard that before?
- [38:17]
Jeff
Yes, I have.
- [38:18]
Wes
And when you hear it, there's one where Ron's mimicking what they do and I don't know what the creature is saying, but when you hear it, it sounds like he's saying, watch this, watch this. And he goes, aha. And Ron mimics it back. Was a voice similar to that or was it more clear?
- [38:37]
Jeff
It was very similar to that. It was. I mean, it was real similar to that. Real deep low, you know. You know, I think on the Sierra sounds there's one where it says something and Ron Morehead says something and it goes, you know. You know, it sounds like he's saying Rock Roy or. Or ship ahoy or. I don't know. But he goes. I mean, it was, it was. Sounded like that, but it was just so freaking loud. I don't know how close they were, but. But this thing was, you know, it was close. And I firmly believe that this thing was around whenever me and David, who went down there the first time, I think that's what he was hearing and I think that it was probably belly crawling or, or you know, how they get down on all fours and they move. If this thing would have been on all fours, it could have been four feet away from David and never would have knew it because then treat them. Them weeds were so tall, you know.
- [39:34]
Wes
Yeah, no, no doubt about that. Let me ask you though, what did you think was going on? I mean, what did you think it was and what did you think was going on at the time? I realize you've had time to think about it and kind of look into Sasquatch, but at the time, what did you think was going on?
- [39:49]
Jeff
Honestly, with my upbringing and what had happened, I thought this was some kind of demonic encounter. I know it sounds crazy and when I think of demons, I think of, you know, maybe like a shadow, you know, doing something or, you know, seeing a shadow and, and feeling the evil, you know, from it or something. I mean, this thing was wide. It was tall. It was very, very wide. That's not what I would associate with a demon. I'm thinking grim Reaper looking, you know, something looks like the grim reaper. That, that's what I'm thinking. When I think of demonic stuff. I, I don't think of a big hairy four foot wide beast. I mean that just. I was just confused. I guess that's, that's the best thing to say. I was confused on coming back to camp, but I thought it was some kind of demonic encounter. We were not even thinking about Bigfoot and, and I had no. There's no way I could have told. As much as I trusted him and I love him and he's family, you know, I just, I was like, man, I can't tell him what happened. He's gonna think I'm a freaking nut. I didn't tell him for a long time.
- [41:02]
Wes
Yeah, I get where you're coming from, Jeff. I 100% understand where you're coming from. David, let me ask you real quick. So Jeff comes back to camp and what happens next?
- [41:13]
David
Well, it, I couldn't sleep. Then after that he couldn't sleep. We hear something circling the camp. Not just one thing, but it's like, like, I don't know, like five or six different things.
- [41:28]
Jeff
Absolutely.
- [41:29]
David
And we're shining light, trying to see what it is. You know, the fires lighting it up pretty good. But like I said, we just had these little cheesy lights and we're trying to shine it out there. Whatever is there is staying out of the light and it's staying out of our flashlight range. We are surrounded by forest, complete forest on, on three sides. And there's one little opening because we were right by the edge of the property, right by the fence. But we can see the, the neighbor's house. We were right there and he's got his house lit up like crazy. So if anything would have crossed that one side, we would have seen it. But these things are making a distinct effort not to go there. Where, where we can get a good look at. Sounded like it's on all fours. These things are that are surrounding us. They're all around us going back and forth and, and they're not saying anything. Not doing besides their motion and moving the weeds and leaf litter. We, we. It's not making any other sound. And you know, first is it's not too bad but this went on for a long time like, like for an hour or two.
- [42:56]
Wes
And are they just kind of. So there's four of them and they're just circling your guys camp?
- [43:01]
David
Right? They're circling our camp and they're just kind of. They're kind of Slowly creeping in and it feels like I ought to be able to shine a light. And it's. I should be able to see it, but when I do, it's nothing there. I'm signing it all over. And, and he is doing the same thing. And we're, we're. We. We thought about leaving, but in order to leave we had to get. The truck is backed right up to the camp. But in order to leave we had to get in, get our stuff, get in the truck, get to the gate and somebody's going to get out and unlock the lock because we locked herself in. So nobody else come in there. And I'm. I'm not about to do that, you know. And I'm looking at him and I'm thinking he's not going to do that either. We're staying right here by this fire, you know. And so I. I told this to this one lady, one. And I. I've just recently started telling this, but. But she said, well, why didn't you go out there? I said, you understand, I don't know what this is. You're. Nobody's going to go out there with even the pack of coyotes, you know, that are surrounding. Because kites don't do that. They. They don't just keep on it on. You know, they're gonna look for something and. And run off. And you know, before this had happened, I figured we were just going to stay up anyway, so I started cooking some little hot dogs on the fire, some weenies on the fire. And I thought, well, we've got to do something. We. We can't sleep like this. We can't leave like this. We're going to run out of firewood if we don't do something. You know, my buddy Jeff, he. He likes the. A nice good fire. So he throw. He throws that. Those logs on there and, and it's. There's. There. It's going pretty good, but we're. We don't have enough for all night, you know. Of course now it's. It's. It's three or four in the morning, so we don't have that long to wait. I figure I have to do something. I remember in the back of the truck there is a. There's some antifreeze I've already got on Jeff about shooting in the night. And we can't even see what we're at, what we're shooting at. And they're moving around fast. So I take, I take that antifreeze and I make some. Make them a nice little green weenie
- [45:40]
Wes
what does that mean for the audience?
- [45:41]
David
Well, I. I split this. This weenie, and we feel. I feel I just dunk this thing in antifreeze, and I fill it all up. I'm gonna poison whatever's out there. I figure if. I've always heard that if. If one of. If coyote. If it's sick and one of them starts acting funny, the rest of them will attack. And, you know, at least that'll get them attention away from us, and maybe they'll move off or something. I don't. I don't even know what it is, but the only thing I can come up with is very big coyotes. And so I take this thing and. And Jeff's looking at me like, do you really want to do this? And I said. I said, you know, I. I have never done this before, but I don't see much. You know, we gotta do something. We can't stay like this. So I pick that thing up and I chunk it out into the woods as far as I could throw it. And immediately I. I hear something move where I didn't even know something was at. And something moves, and before you can hear it, it's. There's something on all fours. It's going to. You know, this was going. And something just took off on two legs, ran over to. To where that weenie is. Within half a second, boom, it's there. I'm shining a light, trying to see. I threw it out there. I couldn't. There's no. There's no way I could see. But I'm trying to shine a light out there. So anyway, Jeff looks at me, and I look at him, and then we. We hear a cough. And not just a cough. It goes. This thing is, like hacking up a lung at this point. I. I'm thinking, this. This. This is a man. This is not a coyote. This can't be a coyote. Or it's. There's a very big freaking coyote because it is a really deep. You know, I'm not. I'm not that. I'm not thinking Bigfoot. I'm still not thinking Bigfoot. I'm thinking that this. It has to be a coyote. I've been all over these. Those woods, and I've never seen nothing like that. And. And it has to be a coyote. But it's going through my mind that that sounds like a man. And my buddy Jeff, he says what I'm thinking, which is what he usually does. He goes, that sounds like a man. I said, that is not a man. He goes, we just killed Somebody. I said, dude, you shot at somebody. He goes, yeah, but that sounds like a man. And I said, it can't be. He says, somebody, somebody's dying out there. And the whole time we're having this conversation, we're here. I mean, it's just going off.
- [48:54]
Wes
Did they stop circling at that point when the saints went on?
- [48:57]
David
Yeah, it's. Whatever was around us completely stopped circling us. We never heard them leave. It just, they just, it just stopped. Whatever it is, is, is slowly going away. We can tell tell it's, it's moving away slowly and it's coughing and hacking and up along the whole time. And Jeff goes, that, that's some, that's some kind of man. Now. I, I had no idea of his encounter before. I had, I have no idea. I know he shot at something. I thought I was shooting at a deer in the dark, but I haven't, I have no idea that this, I said, dude, if that's a man. And they're running around two hunters with, with guns in the dark and they're picking up stuff off the forest floor, they deserve to die. He starts laughing and then I start nervously laughing and he's laughing and pretty soon we're both laughing as this thing is hacking up along, going away. And I did too. The tension was so, it was, it was so thick you could cut it with a knife. I, I, I know, I know that you're probably going to get bad calls about to redneck stone stuff out in the woods, but.
- [50:32]
Wes
No, I'm all for you guys giving Bigfoot antifreeze and hot dogs, but so you, so you guys, so this kind of ends. It leaves, I'm assuming.
- [50:43]
David
Yeah, it leaves by this time. It's like, it's, it's still dark, but it's, it's almost sun up. We've, we've with these things pretty much all night and it's almost sun up. Sometime we, we finally do drift off to sleep, but it's just out of exhaustion, not because we wanted to.
- [51:05]
Wes
Yeah, rough night. I don't blame you for passing out. So the morning comes and you guys get up and what kind of happens next after this?
- [51:14]
David
We, we go, we go to get that, that tree, stand in the light. We go down there to get it, and it's ripped off the tree. It's broken at the welds. The chain is still attached to the stainless steel hook laying on the ground, but it's totally ripped off the tree. There's just no way it would have taken a truck to pull that thing off there, this thing was built and it ripped out the wells.
- [51:50]
Wes
Yeah. That's insane. You're right. It would have taken a truck to bring it down, you know, and to do the damage you're talking about.
- [51:56]
David
You may have been able to get a four wheeler, but back then, yeah, we would have saw tracks. I don't think we even had four wheelers back then. I think it was back then when we had three wheelers, you know, I mean it's that long ago.
- [52:11]
Wes
So when you see this whole thing, you're in confusion, I would imagine kind of what's going through your head. And then I'd kind of like to ask Jeff kind of what he thought when he went back. But what, what were you thinking at this point, David?
- [52:23]
David
I, I don't know. I'm, I'm just chucking enough to. I don't know what it is. I don't know what happened. I don't know how this came out, how the tree. I, I don't know what that was that we poisoned. I don't know. I don't know what any of this is. But I'm still, I'm still not thinking Bigfoot. I'm still not thinking that. I'm, I'm thinking holy mackerel, how did this get out of there? You know, I'm just scratching my head and I, I really just didn't have an answer. I didn't have, I didn't, I didn't have a thought that I didn't know how that could have happened. I don't know what could have happened. I know that, that I couldn't have pulled that trees, that tree stand out without climbing up the tree, lifting it up and taking the chain off. There's, there's no, there's just no way. And I certainly couldn't reach it because it was, it was up there so high. I, I have no idea. And so I just, I just ignored it. I ignored it. We kept hunting that area after that happened. Of course we were, we didn't hunt it too much longer. We were a little, it got a little creepy and, and my, my father in law sold the property finally.
- [53:48]
Wes
But, but yeah, let me ask Jeff real quick and I'll come back to you. David. Jeff. So you guys go to this tree stand. You, you see the condition it's in. And David kind of talked about this. The condition it's in. I'm really curious what's going through your mind as you walk up and you see your tree stand being basically ripped apart. What Are you thinking at this point?
- [54:10]
Jeff
Yeah, man. And I weld, okay? I know that how. I know how he built this thing. I mean, this thing was like quarter inch angle.
- [54:18]
David
We still have three fans he made.
- [54:20]
Jeff
Yeah, we still, we still got them. I mean, me and you, I mean, I've heard you say you weigh like 230 or 240 or something, I think. But I promise you, me and you and David could get out on the end of this, this deer stand and jump up and down. And we're not going to break that weld. You know what I mean? This thing is built. I mean, there is just no way. And when I seen that them welds were broke, pulled loose from the metal plate, I was like, okay, you'd have to have a horse or a four wheeler to do that or something. You ain't gonna hang off this thing and break it. And I just didn't know what to say. I mean, at that point I'm like, oh my gosh. I mean, what the heck, you know? And David still don't know about my little demonic encounter, I call it, you know.
- [55:10]
Wes
Yeah, let me. So let me ask you about that. So when you headed back to camp and David kind of explained what was going on, were you thinking about what happened to you at the tree stand or did you think this was something separate going on?
- [55:24]
Jeff
Man, I, you know what? I think that all this stuff was just coming to a head. I mean, I was like trying to take each thing as a coincidence or. Oh, you know, it's just we have made an excuse for everything that has happened up there. And at some point you got to be asking yourself, I mean, honestly, when I saw that, that, that place where David was cleaning the deer, when I seen that big gigantic print that was squat that had meshed the grass down right there, that thing was a. I mean, it was. They were just like, that's too big to be a print. And I'm like, well, what the heck is it then? I mean, I'm trying not to go there, but it's like in front of my face and something I wanted to point out when David, you know, David's telling you, I'm cleaning that deer. I shot that deer, Wes. I shot that deer that he's cleaning. And I had to wait because this deer was trying to climb in the freaking tree that I was in. Yeah, I shot that deer originally. And, and I, I did that with a 223 because this guy was telling me I couldn't bring down a deer with a 223. And I said, man, it's all about shot placement. I promise you, I'll kill one with a.223. And. And I. I look back on this, and you wouldn't believe by listening to your show how many parallels I make to so many different things that happened to us up there. Wes. This. This deer was so close to me. I was like, are you kidding me? I mean, I could have reached out and touched the thing it was pushing back. I had cut me some shooting lanes out of a cedar tree, and I was gonna sit in this cedar tree one day, and. And I thought, you know, this would be a good place. It's kind of on a knoll, and I could cut me some. It would just be an alternate place. You know, I'd have my dream stand. I'd have this. This place where I hunt with the cedar trees at. And I cut me some shooting lanes out of it, and I could lean up against it. I made me, like, a little place where I could lean up against the cedar tree at the base of it, and I had shooting lanes all over that hollow. I had a good. I had a good field of view from where I was at to see the other direction going back towards that tree that the deer stand got ripped out of. So I originally shot that deer, and that deer was pushing back the limbs that I was in. It was pushing back the limbs on the tree that I was. I was in that I was sitting underneath. And I was like, are you kidding me? I mean, I couldn't believe it. I mean, to be honest with you, I was asleep, and this thing woke me up, and I was like, what the heck? At first, I was fixing to say, way to go on running my hunt, Dave, you know, because I thought it was David coming up on me, and it's this freaking deer. And I'm like, holy crap, this is a deer. I mean, I'm looking at with my peripheral vision going, okay, what is going on here? And then I'm seeing fur. Well, this deer gets about 8 foot in front of me. I had my gun in my lap. You know, all I had to do was just move the barrel a couple inches, and I. Bam, bam, bam. I pulled three times, and that deer jumped up there and landed on its back. And I thought, what the heck? I got her. You know, when I started coming up to meet that tree stand, that's when it ran towards David, right up this old logging oil field road. I mean, and David, I guess, heard me firing was coming to me, and that's when he drilled it with a 30. 30. It didn't get up after that. It was done.
- [58:50]
Wes
It kind of reminds me of. And I'm. I'm real curious what you think about this, but you've heard the Mike Woolley encounter. Mike's passed on.
- [58:57]
Jeff
Yes.
- [58:58]
Wes
But when he describes this deer coming up and running right to his tree stand and he was in shock. He couldn't believe that his luck. But I think it was running from something much worse. And in your situation, it kind of sounds like the same thing.
- [59:14]
Jeff
I know. And that's what makes me look back on this now and say, man, that deer, it was trying to seek refuge or something. It was trying to get to a safe place. And I don't know if it thought it would be better to be safer by me, you know, which unfortunately wasn't true because I did drill her. I got her three times. But I guess that 223 wasn't enough to just put her, put her down like at 30. 30. But, you know, David falling out of that tree. I've never seen him fall or get clumsy or So I mean, I guess something can happen to anybody. But, you know, we talk about this infrasound and people getting confused, and I just couldn't believe he fell that tree. I mean, man, he's. This guy's crazy. He's always doing something, but he's always. He's always good at it. You know, he's always very coordinated, and he don't. He don't fall out of a tree like that. His sense of direction. Wes, he was trying to go towards the river. And I was like, david, the road's right here. There's no way you could go that way and make it to camp, you know, but again, I'm not telling him that. I mean, I'm not thinking about ultrasound or infrasound or whatever back then. I'm looking at it now going, my gosh, all this stuff was in our face. I mean, it was right in our face, and we didn't even know it.
- [60:34]
Wes
Why didn't you tell David about what happened that night or even like. Because I think it took. I think David said it took like 10 years for you to tell him. Why not tell David what happened?
- [60:45]
Jeff
You know what? I. I just couldn't. I was still trying. I was still wrestling with what happened. I mean, I. Again, I. I not sure what. What bigfoot is. I don't think anybody is, but. But I mean, even back then, I wasn't thinking it was a bigfoot it was a Bigfoot. I just. I just wouldn't allow myself. I used to make fun of people that talked about aliens and bigfoot and stuff like. Matter of fact, we both did. I mean, we would just be like, yeah, man, if I ever see a Bigfoot, I'm gonna put my crosshairs on. I'm gonna blow its freaking brains out. You know? I mean, we. We wouldn't. We. We never. It would have already been done by now. We had that conversation, and. And we just. I wouldn't allow myself to go there. But I kept on trying to think this was some kind of a demonic experience. You know, I was thinking more of that than I was Bigfoot, but then I start seeing all this. This, you know, the tree stand getting ripped down. I just. That just really took me back. I couldn't believe that something could rip that from the tree. I'm wanting to go there, you know, but I needed a little. I need a little help. I needed this. I needed to feel good that somebody wasn't gonna, you know, make fun of. I just. I don't know. David wasn't wanting to go there. I know that. Yeah, I know he wasn't. But to be honest with you, your. Your show has. Has opened up so many doors. I mean, you are doing a good job here, man, because like I said, I. I've got, like, 20 things wrote down on this piece of paper that your show confirms. I mean, it's like. It's like, this happened to me. This happened to me. This happened to me. And lo and behold, on this episode, there it is. On this episode, there it is. On this stuff. I mean, it's just over and over and over, and I. And I. I can't believe that, you know, I mean, I get you said, you know, I'll never. I'll never. I heard you say one time, wes, I'll never get mad at somebody for not believing me if they haven't seen one. And I've just got to keep on telling myself that, because I've tried to tell people about this, and they. They. They won't even hear it. They won't even hear that I have a witness on some of this stuff. And, you know, I. I get it. Unless it happens to you, it's hard to believe. I don't know what to say. I mean, I guess I thought, well, David didn't see what I saw, and he sure as heck didn't hear what I heard. And I don't know how this is going to be. He's probably Going to think I'm in that job. Yeah.
- [63:16]
Wes
No, I get it.
- [63:17]
Jeff
I mean, even though the. The weird stuff was happening, and to be honest with you, our first year there, we heard chop. We heard knocks. I thought it was chop. And you know what, Wes? It was down in that valley that we were hunting in, and I thought it was somebody chopping wood. And I looked straight at David and I said, you've got to be kidding me. Somebody is down here cutting wood on opening day of rifle season. I was hacked off, and we went looking for him. Amazingly, we never found anybody.
- [63:46]
Wes
Yeah, well, I think most people probably pass it off as someone chopping wood. I want to ask you real quick, Jeff. When you were on this property, David talked about the feeling of being watched and different weird things that happened to him. Did you guys ever hear any vocalizations outside of the night of the encounter when you guys were hunting the property?
- [64:06]
Jeff
No, I don't think I ever heard any vocalizations. Now, we'd hear some strange noises that sounded like coyotes in a way. I mean, we'd hear the coyotes go off, and then we'd hear some weird sounds that sounded like. I mean, you know, I. I live out in the country. I never heard coyotes sound like that, you know, but I thought, well, maybe there's some dog. Maybe there's some dogs that spread in with the coyotes, and they sound different up here. I mean, I would. I would just think something like that. But one thing I didn't. I didn't say was when we. We switched locations one time and David had set up a stand, I never hunted west. Down by the river, there's a Vertigas river that goes into Lake Hooligan. And David always hunted way on the west end of the property or more towards that area. And I never did. I always hunted more towards the road or the north side or whatever. David's like, man, you've got to see this place. There's another holler down there that you can see forever. And we went down there and put up another stand down there in that holler. And I'm gonna say the next day or the next two days, I don't know. It was. It was a couple of days later, after we had put that stand up, there was an oak tree that was bigger around than me and David together. This. This oak tree was so big, and I. And I still in my mind, even if things. These things are real and they do exist. I get it, okay? But I. Something. Two tractors shouldn't be able to pull this oak tree. It was a healthy oak tree. It wasn't, it wasn't a dead one, but this thing was broke off about four or five foot up off the ground. It would, it had not fallen over and pulled its roots out of the ground when it fell. This thing has been snapped. I mean, it's been broke about 4 or 5 foot up off the ground. David wants to add time, I guess.
- [66:08]
David
Here it was so big that I couldn't step over. I, I crawled underneath it. There's a little opening where you could slide underneath it, underneath this tree. And it was, it was probably six foot around. Two people couldn't put their arms around this tree. It could have been just a coincidence. It could have been just the wind. That's what I chalked it up to at that time. But I don't, I just, I don't see it now.
- [66:40]
Wes
Let me ask you, David. So how much longer did you guys hunt this property and did this type of behavior, I mean, being paced out and that sort of thing, did that sort of thing continue or did you guys give up hunting that particular property at that point?
- [66:54]
David
Well, we hunted probably three or five more years and I don't really know, but we stopped hunting there. And to believe it or not, to start hunting the Kiamichi Mountains. We never had any trouble out there. Just this one section it got to where that we wouldn't, we wouldn't get anything. And I'd get there and it would be dead silent. And there's not, I'm not hearing squirrels anymore. I'm not hearing, I'm not hearing anything anymore. I don't, I don't know. There's this. It was just so weird.
- [67:34]
Wes
Yeah, it's very strange. Very, very strange. David, what do you think that these creatures are? I'm kind of curious on your opinion.
- [67:43]
David
Oh, I, I, I don't know. Back when all that happened, I didn't even believe there was such a thing. And I wasn't going to let myself believe there was such a thing. Now, since I've been listening to accounts, I, I do believe, I believe there's something out there, so, something that, that I've yet to see. But I've seen the evidence all around me for, for years and just wouldn't, wouldn't come up with an opinion. I, I gotcha.
- [68:20]
Wes
And that's a fair answer. Would you, would you want to see one?
- [68:24]
David
Yeah. Now, now I'd like to see one just, just for my own benefit. But like I, like I said, not, not like we did not like close. I, I feel like that thing could have touched me, whatever it was. When we're walking down to the. I feel like it, it was, I feel like it was within two foot of me at times. It was. I don't want, I don't want that again. I, I'm, I'm a Christian man. Everything I see, I, I see through the light of the Bible. I really believe these are, these are Nephilim. I don't know. I, But I don't believe that these things are God created. I don't believe the giants in the Bible were God created. I don't believe that when King David killed the lion, man. I don't believe those were God created. I believe that those were created by fallen angels. I just, I just, I don't know.
- [69:30]
Wes
But what makes you believe that?
- [69:33]
David
Just because it's. I believe that because of what I read in the Bible. I, I believe the Bible 100%. I've had miracles happen around me. I've. I've seen miracles. So personal experience tells me this is true. When, when I read Genesis 6, when I, when I read about Exodus where it talks about them coming into Canaan and the, the spies going in saying we can't take this land because we are as, as grasshoppers to, there's, to these giants. These, there's giants in the land and we are as grasshoppers to them. And then it talks about them carrying out a cluster of grapes so big that two men had to carry them out one cluster. So it takes a lot, it takes something big to feed that. I really believe that there, that these things are leftover. Leftover Nephilim.
- [70:41]
Wes
Yeah, I hear you. And I think a lot of people have that opinion that it is a Nephilim. And, you know, if you read the Bible and other ancient texts, it does talk about giants at one time or running around and that they would return. And so I think a lot of people have that, that idea that these things are the Nephilim and, and there's nothing wrong with that. I think that they could be, you know, we just don't know. One of the questions I want to ask you before we jump back to Jeff. What do you think the intention was that night of those things coming in and circling your camp the way they did?
- [71:16]
David
I think we were in imminent danger then. I think we were stalked and I think that we were. We have been missing in that valley. We're making a ton of noise. We're missing something up for them and they were going to eliminate us. I, I really believe that I believe they had a chance several times, and they didn't take it. But this. This is a recent conclusion, because back then, like I said, I was. I was blind. All that.
- [71:47]
Jeff
I'm.
- [71:47]
David
It was like this recently. It's like a veil was ripped from my face that I could see this, you know, Holy mackerel. Yep. We. We experienced that same thing that the other hunter did. We. We've seen that, you know, and. And I didn't even have an opinion before that. And now when I look back, you know, people. People make. Can make fun of us all they want to, but that's the only conclusion I come up with.
- [72:14]
Wes
Yeah, I agree with you. It definitely doesn't sound very playful, the behavior. And I'll come back to you, David. I want to ask you, Jeff, from your perspective, what's kind of your thoughts? I mean, what do you think was going on that night? What do you think the intent was?
- [72:30]
Jeff
Well, looking. Looking back, we had that 50 acres, and it was, you know, there was a. There was a house on the. The end of the property a little ways off of it, you know, and then there was a house on the north end a little ways off of it. But as far as the Vertigas river pretty much butted up against the end of our property. They had a waterway that led to a nice lake and then 1200 acres of public hunting land on the other side of the river. So I look back on this, and I'm like, wow, these things had the perfect refuge, the perfect place where nobody went to go hunting for these deer and whatever else, and nobody would mess with them except for when we went up there. So I think we rent their little. I think they had a perfect place to. To hunt and. And to have access to the water. I always hear they like to follow waterways, you know, listening to your show and other shows, and these things could travel up and down that Vertigo river, get on that 50 acres, and let the public hunters chase all the deer over to that 50 acres. And I think that we run it and we messed it up for them, and they were trying to get us out of there.
- [73:42]
Wes
Do you think the intention was to hurt you, or do you think the intention was to scare you to leave?
- [73:47]
Jeff
Well, you know, I. I think they just wanted us to leave. Okay. But again, these things. I mean, let me. Let me just say this. If these things are responsible for one person being chopped up and ripped apart, I think they all need to die. I. I think if there's something out there that can run 35 miles an hour and weighs a thousand pounds and want to be quiet and are quiet when they can be quiet and, and can, can break trees as big as that oak that we just talked about. These things don't need to be running around. They need to be kept in check. I mean I personally, I know that that probably is not popular, but I just don't feel that these things need to be out there. And I don't feel that they're natural. They're not like any other animal we have on the face of the earth.
- [74:42]
Wes
I want to ask you a little bit about that before I ask you what Sasquatch is or what you think it is. Jeff, would you want to see one again?
- [74:51]
Jeff
Yeah, I would want to see one in my crosshairs with 180 grain bullet locked and loaded. I mean I, I just, I, I have a, I have a, I have a. These things run my, my, my peace of mind if you will. And I, I just hate it. I hate it. I, I don't. I just feel that they need to be wiped out. I can't stand the fact that there's something out there that can at will end me so easy. And, and yeah, they don't a lot of the time. But look how many people we, we read about that go missing in these national parks and all these people that go missing without a trace. I think there's a lot more going on here than we know. And I think the government's doing a real good job on keeping it covered up. You know, I talked with a guy up in Wyoming and he said, you know, when a grizzly takes somebody, that's how grizzlies got their name. It's a grizzly scene. You can tell that they attacked somebody and ate what they wanted and left. When a pack of wolves attacks somebody, it's no problem. We can follow it. It's a nasty, it's a nasty place where this took place. It's a, it's not clean. These people that are coming up missing, they're not finding them. They're not even finding a shred of them. Something that could rip this, that could break this oak tree off the into. Like we, we talked about earlier would have no problem picking up a three ton boulder and lodging what's left of me underneath it. I mean I don't, I don't care what kind of search party you are. They can only get to certain locations. And if you got a three ton boulder up on the top of a mountain, what are they going to do? They couldn't they couldn't mess with that. I mean, it's just my wheel spinning. Wes. I don't know any of this.
- [76:36]
Wes
Yeah, yeah, no, I understand. What do you think. What do you think that they are, Jeff?
- [76:42]
Jeff
I don't know. I mean, I. My personal. I just have to do the smell test here, and I'm a pretty rational guy, but when I do the smell test on these things, they are like no other animal. And there's. There should be no animal that can give me this. This fear and in this intimidation. It's almost like, you know, I. I didn't say this earlier, but I have seen these things in the daylight, and I didn't know what I was seeing. I think I did. I mean, I can't say. Oh, yeah, tell me about that.
- [77:19]
Wes
When did this happen, Jeff?
- [77:21]
Jeff
Well, it happened periodically as we were hunting. And as a matter of fact, it happened so often that David got tired of me telling him that I saw a deer and I didn't have a shot, because in my mind, I was thinking I was looking at the rump of a deer, and it was on the other side of a tree, and the deer was quartering away from me, not giving me the rest of his body covered up by the tree. Right. So I always. I would. In my mind, I would always think I'm looking at the rump of a deer when he eats a little bit more or eats all them acorns, and he goes a couple more feet. I'm gonna get a. I'm gonna get a shoulder shot. But it never happens. It was the same scenario every time. And I firmly believe what I was looking at was not a deer's rump. A deer's rump is square. These were large, round, black. And again, yeah, deer's not black. These were large. But I was thinking, you know, in the canopy of the trees, it gets dark. Where we're hunting on that river bottom, there's oaks that are 80, 100 foot tall. Down there, all you have is canopy. And I was just thinking, I'm looking at a shadowy, a shadow deer, you know, and that's why it looks so dark. Never once did I think I'm looking at the face of a. Of a sasquatch. You know, I never thought that, but I. I know that these things were peeking at me. I mean, I. I think that. I think that they were. They would peek at me and. And, you know, sometimes I would see it move. And that's what made me think, this is a deer, because I'd see them give me A little bit more. Give me a little bit more. I never. I never was close enough to see eyes, but I would see this, and. And there's been a couple of occasions where I've seen more than, you know, I've seen three or four or five at a time. And I'll be like, okay, there's no way this many deer could be. I mean, I just couldn't explain it. And. And I'd ask Dave, did you see anything? Yeah, maybe. Let me guess. You saw a deer, but you didn't have a shot. I'd be like, gosh dang it. So I didn't want to talk about that. You know, that's the reason I never really talked about. Because I couldn't explain it. And now I look back on it, and you know what? On one of your episodes, there is Caveman, I think. I don't know if it's caveman or somebody else, but somebody talks about the Tree Peakers, and there's an actual. I think they talked about an actual Indian tribe that calls these things the Tree Peakers, or they have a name for them that means tree Peakers, or they peek at you behind a tree.
- [79:50]
Wes
Yeah.
- [79:50]
Jeff
And when somebody asked this guy, like I said, I think it was Caveman, I might be wrong, but he said, they're counting coup on you. They're counting who on you? They are. They are letting you know they are in control of the situation because they caught you off guard, they saw you before you saw them, and I don't know, maybe it's some kind of sick, twisted entertainment they get, you know?
- [80:14]
Wes
Yeah. Let me ask you, knowing what you know now, would you. If you could go back in time, would you still hunt that property?
- [80:23]
Jeff
Yeah, I would do it with superior firepower. I really would. Because I. I almost feel like it's. It's. I know. I'm. I'm armed with knowledge now. I am. I'm armed with knowledge, and now I know what I could do to help even the. The playing field here. And. And I think I really would. I really would. I've told David not too long ago, I wish we had access to that land again. Now, the beauty about this is we could. We. We can go up there and get real close to it, because there's 1200 acres of public honey land that goes down to the backside of that property. So we could get real. I bet you they hunt all over that Vertigo river and that public hunting land as well.
- [81:04]
Wes
Yeah. Be careful going back, guys. Definitely be careful going back. And I want to Ask David one last question. But Jeff, thank you so much for taking the time to, to come on and share the encounter. God, what a night. But thank you again for taking the time to come on.
- [81:21]
Jeff
Thank you for your, your programs. I really do, man. I mean, I, I, I thank you so much from the bottom of my heart because I never would have known what I would always, I've never had closure, you know, and nobody's got proof. But you know what? I can promise you, I see so many different parallels on your programs. That happened to us. That's happened over and over and over and over and I couldn't explain it. And I think you're doing an amazing job, man. And if you ever get, if you ever want to go to Oklahoma and you want to come to experience some of the best largemouth bass fishing of all time. We have 350 acres out. I mean, don't put that on there, if you don't mind.
- [82:02]
Wes
Yeah,
- [82:04]
Jeff
but yeah, we got, we got 350 acres out there, man. And we have got some trophy large mouths out there. I mean, we caught ten fish over. No, I'm sorry. We caught seven fish over ten pounds in one year. And you know, there's people that don't land a 10 pound bass in their lifetime.
- [82:22]
Wes
Yeah, I appreciate it. Thank you so much, Jeff. I might take you up on that offer. I've always wanted to go to Oklahoma, but thank you for the kind words and thank you again for coming on, man. I really enjoyed talking with you.
- [82:35]
Jeff
Okay, Wes, well, it was good talking to you and I appreciate it. Here's David.
- [82:39]
Wes
Thanks again, Jeff. And David, I wanted to ask you real quick, you know, 10 years later, Jeff goes, hey, here's what happened that night and I'm kind of curious on how. So this is 10 years later, how did that conversation go? And kind of, what were you thinking after hearing him tell you? What, what happened to him?
- [82:59]
David
Well, he, what he said was he go, we were listening to your program and I don't know how we found your program, but we were listening to it. And he goes, remember that time at that, that thing talked to me in the dark? I said, what? And he goes, you remember when I was shot? I remember that like it was yesterday, you know, I said, well, no, I do not. You did not never tell me that. And he, then he elaborated on it so was in passing. He didn't mean to even tell me. We were listening to it to an episode or something where they heard something repeat like, like an anobia or something where they Repeated their name. And he, and so he said, remember that one? Talk to me in the woods? And I said, no, no, I do not remember that. So that's, that's when we started piecing all this stuff together. It was just like, it was like a shocker.
- [84:03]
Jeff
So it was your program, Wes.
- [84:05]
David
It was your program that caused us to get so creeped out.
- [84:09]
Jeff
This.
- [84:11]
Wes
What were you thinking, David? I mean, what was kind of going through your mind?
- [84:16]
David
I was thinking that made all the sense now because I, I was holding stuff back too. I didn't know what, what happened and couldn't explain stuff. And it just, we started adding things up after that. But it wasn't until he shared that before I even had to. Had the, the courage myself to tell him what I felt and what I've seen. And, and you know, I mean, if you told somebody, well, I got scared in the woods, you think, well, you know, you got scared in the woods, big freaking deal, you know, but not like this. I've, I've never, never been scared like that before.
- [85:01]
Wes
Yeah, I mean, it's a terrifying night. That whole night would have scared, would have scared me. I mean, and I, I'm not giving Jeff a hard time for firing either. I'm like you, David. I'm probably, I don't want Jeff take it the wrong way. Probably more level headed and, and Jeff is more of a gunslinger, it sounds like. But in that situation, in that situation,
- [85:18]
David
we've always known that about it.
- [85:20]
Jeff
We both agree.
- [85:21]
Wes
Yeah, I mean, honestly, in that situation, I would have shot too. I absolutely would. I would have given warning and fired just like he did.
- [85:28]
David
We make a good team because I, I hold him back a little bit and he, he brings me out of my shell some. So we do make a pretty good team. So.
- [85:39]
Wes
Yeah. Well, you guys be careful out there. And I really enjoyed talking with Jeff and David, I really enjoyed talking with you too as well. Thanks so much guys for coming on.
- [85:50]
Jeff
You're welcome.
- [85:51]
Wes
And that's it for tonight, everyone. Remember, if you've had an encounter, shoot me an email. My email address is wesasquatchchronicles.com and if you get a chance to check out Sasquatch Chronicles.com you can become a member and get additional shows. Till next time, everyone.
- [86:30]
Guest Singer
This is my bless her out memories of you dear and turn your eyes closer to skies I'll miss my bright memories of you dear I sound as a human inviter the lights on and make power grow wider the lights on so but must be a little wiser the lights are doing something quieter with the lights on this is my. Memories of you, dear Close at the sky Memories of you. Put the lights on this is my
- [87:57]
Jeff
home
- [88:01]
Guest Singer
Memories of you, dear under your eyes Close up the skies I'll miss my eyes Memories of beauty Sam.
- [88:40]
Jeff
Sa.
- [89:05]
David
To.
- [89:23]
Guest Singer
Smiling as I found the kitchen.
- [89:57]
David
Sam.