In this episode of ScaleUp Radio, Kevin Brent sits down with Jules Herd, founder of Five in a Boat, to unpack the real reasons scale-ups stall and what founders must do differently to grow sustainably.

Jules shares hard-earned insights from working with Series A to C tech businesses, revealing why marketing often isn't the real problem and what actually needs fixing underneath.

Key Takeaway

The one key thing: Growth stalls when founders try to scale without upgrading their thinking, their team, and their focus.

Standout Message

"Marketing doesn't fail because marketing is broken. It fails because the business behind it isn't ready."

The Problem: Founder Mistakes That Stall Growth

Many scale-ups hit a ceiling not because of market conditions, but because of internal decisions:

Treating the business like a job Founder dependency limits scalability and prevents the business from operating independently.
Lack of audience focus Trying to target everyone results in wasted time, budget, and diluted messaging.
Promoting loyalty over capability Early team members are elevated beyond their skillset, creating gaps at senior level.
Avoiding calculated risk Founders hesitate to invest in key roles or decisions, ignoring the bigger cost of inaction.

The Solution: What Founders Must Do

Jules outlines practical steps to unlock growth:

1. Bring in Experience

Secure mentors and non-execs
Gain external perspective to challenge assumptions

2. Take Calculated Risks

Assess upside vs downside properly
Make informed decisions rather than avoiding them

3. Invest for Resilience

Example: UK manufacturing shift to reduce supply chain risk
Focus on long-term stability, not short-term savings

4. Build a Scalable Team

Hire specialists (CFO, CMO, Ops leaders)
Delegate effectively
Balance scrappy startup mindset with professional expertise

The Pivot: Five in a Boat's 360° Model

Jules explains how Five in a Boat evolved:

Clients paused comms work due to deeper business issues
The business pivoted to a 360° advisory model
Built a flexible structure combining core team + specialists
Positioned as a practical, accessible alternative to large consultancies

What makes it different:

Integrated approach across growth challenges
Deep operator experience
Radical honesty with clients

Passion Project: On the Edge

Outside of her advisory work, Jules hosts On the Edge:

Focused on resilience and defining life moments
Explores when people chose to jump, were pushed, or stayed
Aims to turn stories into a wider podcast platform

Personal Motivation

Jules is driven by a powerful legacy goal:

To show her daughter the importance of ambition, resilience, and learning through failure.

Smart90 Recommendation

If you're tired of ending the week busy but no further forward, I run a quarterly planning session called the G90 Summit, a structured half-day where founders and leadership teams get clear on the three to five things that must happen in the next 90 days, and commit to them.

I run them quarterly. Find out more and reserve your place at Smart90.co.uk/summit.

Scaling up your business isn't easy, and can be a little daunting. Let ScaleUp Radio make it a little easier for you. With guests who have been where you are now, and can offer their thoughts and advice on several aspects of business. ScaleUp Radio is the business podcast you've been waiting for.

If you would like to be a guest on ScaleUp Radio, please click here:

https://bizsmarts.co.uk/scaleupradio/kevin

You can get in touch with Kevin here:

kevin@biz-smart.co.uk

Most founders I speak to feel busy but stuck; plenty happening, but not always clear on what genuinely matters most this quarter. If that sounds familiar, the G90 Summit is worth a look. It's a structured half-day session where we help founders identify the three to five priorities that genuinely matter over the next 90 days and build the systems to deliver them. Quarterly, virtual, and £97 a seat. You can find out more at http://Smart90.co.uk/summit .

Jules can be found here:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/juliaherd/

https://www.fiveinaboat.com/

Resources:

Traction by Gino Wickman - https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/traction-get-a-grip-on-your-business-gino-wickman/3561744?ean=9781936661831&next=t

Crossing The Chasm by Geoffrey A Moore - https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/crossing-the-chasm-ga-moore/1986221?ean=9781841120638&next=t