Becoming an Elite School Business Official: All About the SFO Certification

Summary

Episode Summary: "Becoming an Elite School Business Official: All About the SFO Certification"

Release Date: November 19, 2024
Podcast: School Business Insider
Host: John Brucato

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Introduction to the Episode

In this insightful episode of School Business Insider, host John Brucato delves into the realm of professional certifications within school business administration, focusing particularly on the Certified Administrator for School Finance and Operations (SFO) Certification. This prestigious credential is celebrated for upholding the highest standards of knowledge and professional competencies among school business officials nationwide.

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Meet the Guests

John welcomes two distinguished guests who bring a wealth of experience and perspective on the SFO Certification:

• Matthew Lentz: The seasoned Chief Financial Officer (CFO) at Esperanza in Pennsylvania. With nearly 25 years of experience in school business administration, Matt is a certified SFO and currently serves one of the largest special districts in Pennsylvania.

• Rebecca Brooks: The CFO at Elizabeth School District in Colorado, who is contemplating pursuing her SFO Certification. Rebecca has been part of the district for almost two years and is an active member of the Colorado chapter of ASBO International.

Timestamp: [02:08] - Rebecca Brooks introduces herself, emphasizing her passion for school finance and involvement with ASBO International.

Timestamp: [02:52] - Matthew Lentz shares his extensive background in school business administration and his commitment to fostering strong communities through education.

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Understanding the SFO Certification

John initiates the conversation by asking Matt to explain what the SFO Certification entails.

Matthew Lentz describes the SFO as a nationally recognized credential that signifies a high standard of professional competency in school business operations. He emphasizes that it is more than just a certification; it serves as a "launchpad for career advancement and recognition in the field".

Timestamp: [03:58] - Matt elaborates on the certification process, highlighting the rigorous preparation, relevant experience, and ongoing professional development required to obtain and maintain the designation.

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Motivations for Pursuing the SFO

The discussion transitions to Rebecca's interest in the SFO Certification.

Rebecca Brooks shares her journey from an accounting background to discovering her passion for school finance. She explains that while she initially pursued a CPA, she found her true niche in school business administration. Rebecca notes the growing demand for the SFO Certification in job postings, viewing it as a strategic move to "stay in the niche" of school finance for her ongoing career.

Timestamp: [05:04] - Rebecca discusses her intention to pursue the SFO Certification as a means to enhance her career prospects and solidify her expertise in school finance.

Conversely, Matthew Lentz recounts his decision to obtain the SFO Certification after 13 to 15 years in the field. He sought to validate his extensive practical experience with a formal credential, aiming to "demonstrate that I have the knowledge to be a chief school official" and to broaden his impact beyond traditional finance roles.

Timestamp: [06:17] - Matt explains his motivation to advance into more diverse and leadership-oriented roles through the SFO Certification.

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Career Advantages of the SFO Certification

The conversation delves into the tangible benefits of obtaining the SFO Certification.

Matthew Lentz highlights the recognition and credibility that come with the certification. He shares how it not only provided personal acknowledgment but also elevated his standing within his district, leading to advanced roles such as acting superintendent.

Timestamp: [07:19] - Matt discusses how the SFO Certification facilitated his promotion to CFO and opened doors to additional leadership opportunities.

Rebecca Brooks envisions the certification enhancing her ability to manage various aspects of her role, including food service, transportation, and human resources. She believes that the SFO will equip her with the necessary skills to handle the multifaceted responsibilities of a CFO in a smaller district.

Timestamp: [11:09] - Rebecca articulates her goals for the SFO Certification, aiming to expand her knowledge beyond traditional finance to encompass broader operational areas.

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Challenges in the Certification Process

John explores the hurdles candidates may face when pursuing the SFO Certification.

Matthew Lentz reflects on his preparation journey, noting the scarcity of certified SFOs in Pennsylvania during his time and the reliance on ASBO's online resources. He found the online test format challenging yet manageable, appreciating the ability to navigate questions flexibly.

Timestamp: [12:50] - Matt discusses the initial challenges of studying for the SFO exam without local peer support and his positive experience with the online testing format.

Rebecca Brooks anticipates similar preparation challenges, particularly in areas like human resources and transportation, where she has less experience. She plans to attend a prep class and utilize ASBO's resources to strengthen her knowledge in these domains.

Timestamp: [15:04] - Rebecca shares her strategy for overcoming preparation challenges by engaging in structured prep classes and utilizing digital flashcards.

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Maintaining the SFO Certification

The discussion shifts to the ongoing commitment required to maintain the SFO Certification.

Matthew Lentz outlines the recertification process, which mandates 45 contact hours of professional development every three years. He emphasizes that these requirements are seamlessly integrated into daily professional activities, such as attending ASBO webinars and participating in unstructured learning opportunities.

Timestamp: [25:46] - Matt explains the recertification process, highlighting the manageable nature of accruing the necessary contact hours through existing professional development activities.

John adds that maintaining the certification aligns with the professionals' continuous learning and commitment to excellence in their roles.

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Perception and Growth of the SFO Certification

The conversation addresses how the SFO Certification is perceived within different states and its adoption among peers.

Matthew Lentz notes that while Pennsylvania has its state-specific certifications focusing on areas like accounting and payroll, the SFO Certification offers a broader knowledge base that complements state credentials and is recognized nationally.

Timestamp: [21:19] - Matt discusses the integration and added value of the SFO Certification alongside state-specific credentials in Pennsylvania.

Rebecca Brooks observes that in Colorado, the SFO Certification is slowly gaining momentum, with approximately 30 to 40 certified individuals in the state. She expresses optimism about its increasing recognition and encourages her peers to pursue it.

Timestamp: [22:21] - Rebecca comments on the growing, albeit gradual, adoption of the SFO Certification within Colorado's school business community.

Matthew Lentz also addresses common misconceptions, such as the belief that extensive experience negates the need for certification. He argues that the SFO provides formal validation of expertise, enhancing credibility and professional standing.

Timestamp: [23:17] - Matt counters misconceptions by emphasizing the added credibility and comprehensive knowledge base provided by the SFO Certification.

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Impact on Organizational and Personal Growth

The SFO Certification not only benefits individual professionals but also positively impacts their organizations.

Matthew Lentz shares how his certification fosters a culture of professional development within his team, inspiring staff members to pursue their own certifications and contribute to the district's success.

Timestamp: [18:48] - Matt explains how the SFO Certification has become a point of pride and a catalyst for professional growth among his staff, enhancing overall organizational capability.

Rebecca Brooks anticipates that earning her SFO Certification will strengthen her ability to handle diverse challenges and demonstrate her commitment to continuous improvement, thereby enhancing her contributions to her district.

Timestamp: [19:57] - Rebecca discusses how the SFO Certification will enable her to support her district more effectively and showcase her dedication to professional growth.

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Future Professional Growth and Opportunities

Looking ahead, both Matt and Rebecca envision the SFO Certification playing a pivotal role in their career trajectories.

Matthew Lentz plans to leverage his certification to drive innovation within his organization, particularly in areas like artificial intelligence and organizational restructuring. He aims to continue demonstrating leadership beyond traditional financial roles.

Timestamp: [29:09] - Matt shares his vision for utilizing the SFO Certification to spearhead new initiatives and expand his leadership capabilities.

Rebecca Brooks looks forward to the certification enabling her to seamlessly transition between various operational areas, enhancing her flexibility and readiness to tackle unforeseen challenges. She also sees the SFO as a gateway to new opportunities should she choose to explore them in the future.

Timestamp: [30:12] - Rebecca articulates her aspirations for the SFO Certification to broaden her operational expertise and prepare for potential future opportunities.

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Conclusion and Encouragement

John wraps up the episode by encouraging listeners to consider pursuing the SFO Certification, highlighting its benefits as demonstrated by his guests. He commends Matt and Rebecca for their dedication and contributions to the field of school business administration.

Timestamp: [30:52] - John summarizes the discussion, reinforcing the value of the SFO Certification for professional advancement and organizational excellence.

The episode concludes with heartfelt thanks to Matt and Rebecca, leaving listeners inspired to explore the possibilities that the SFO Certification offers for their careers and the communities they serve.

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Key Takeaways:

• The SFO Certification is a nationally recognized credential that enhances professional credibility and career advancement in school business administration.
• Matthew Lentz and Rebecca Brooks share their personal motivations, challenges, and the positive impacts of pursuing or holding the SFO Certification.
• The certification fosters a culture of continuous professional development and can lead to broader leadership roles beyond traditional finance responsibilities.
• Maintaining the certification requires ongoing professional development, which aligns with the daily growth activities of school business officials.
• The SFO Certification is gradually gaining recognition in states like Pennsylvania and Colorado, with increasing adoption among school business professionals.

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Notable Quotes:

• Matthew Lentz: "The certification wasn't just a credential; it was an opportunity for recognition within the district and a moment to reflect." [07:19]

• Rebecca Brooks: "It's always been a struggle. A lot of job postings, if you want to continue to move up, require either a CPA or an SFO certification." [06:10]

• John Brucato: "Anyone listening, I would encourage you to pursue your SFO if it's something that you have considered or have heard about and are really looking to take the next step in your career." [30:52]

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This episode of School Business Insider serves as a comprehensive guide for school business professionals considering the SFO Certification, offering real-world insights and encouragement to elevate their careers and impact their educational communities positively.

Transcript

[John Brucat]

Hey there, insiders. If you're loving these episodes, don't keep them to yourself. Like, subscribe and rate the show. Think of it as your good deed for the day. No spreadsheets or budget meetings required. Every rating helps us share the secrets of school business magic with the world, or at least school business leaders. So hit that subscribe button and leave us a review. It's like extra credit, but way easier. Thanks for helping us spread the word and support smarter schools everywhere. You're listening to ASPO International's School Business Insider. I'm your host, John Brucat. Each week on School Business Insider, I sit down with school business officials and industry experts from around the world to share their stories and explore the topics that matter most to you. Find out what it means to be a school business official and get your insider pass on all things school business. Hello everyone, and welcome back to School Business Insider. Today we're diving into the Certified Administrator for School Finance and Operations, or the SFO Certification, a prestigious designation that represents the highest standards of knowledge and professional competencies in school business. This certification isn't just a credential. It's a launchpad for career advancement and recognition in the field of school business. Joining us are two leaders in school finance. Matthew Lentz, the the seasoned Chief financial Officer at Esperanza in Pennsylvania and a certified sfo, and Rebecca Brooks, Chief financial Officer at Elizabeth School District in Colorado, who is considering earning her SFO in the near future. We'll discuss the value and the impact of the SFO certification, its role in elevating school business officials, and the insights and advice Matt and Rebecca have on pursuing the credential. Rebecca and Matt, welcome to the podcast. I'm so happy to have you today.

[Rebecca Brooks]

Thank you.

[Matthew Lentz]

Thank you for having us.

[John Brucat]

So before we get into really the SFO certification, exploring what it really means being a school business official, why don't we take a moment and just have you both introduce yourselves. Rebecca, could you start?

[Rebecca Brooks]

Sure. I am the Chief Financial Officer at Elizabeth School District. I have been there for almost two years next month. I have kind of spent several years in school business at other districts and other positions to get to this place. But I have really also enjoyed joining the Casbo board in our Colorado chapter of asbo. But I love school finance.

[John Brucat]

Great. Well, you're in the right place. We all love school finance on School Business Insider. Matt, how about you? Why don't you tell the audience a little bit about yourself?

[Rebecca Brooks]

Sure.

[Matthew Lentz]

So, I'm Matt Lentz. I have almost 25 years of experience In Pennsylvania as a school business administrator. I'm currently CFO for Esperanza, which is the second largest special district serving the city of Philadelphia's school district, and previously was working in some of the suburban districts, in particular in Montgomery, Bucks county in suburban Philadelphia. I only been in school business for my entire career coming out of graduate school. And I like the diverse nature of school business as well as in Pennsylvania, the diversity of entities that I've worked in and have been able to impact not only students, but I believe that good schools build good communities. And so I've really enjoyed the work that I have.

[John Brucat]

Wonderful. Well, so happy to have you both on today. So Matt, kicking off you, as I mentioned in the intro, you're a certified. Can you start by maybe just explaining what the SFO certification is and what does it really represent in school business?

[Matthew Lentz]

Sure. So the SFO is a certification. You apply to participate in that and complete both preparation as well as have an appropriate background. I feel that for the credential, it's a standard that is recognized nationally and is an elevation of our profession to identify candidates who not only have experience and backgrounds, but meet this set of requirements and also the continuing professional development that is required to maintain designation once you complete the initial application and pass the exam.

[John Brucat]

And so Rebecca, I know you were interested in something sparked your interest in pursuing the SFO certification. What was that? And what do you kind of hope to gain from pursuing or potentially pursuing the sfo?

[Rebecca Brooks]

I do intend to pursue the sfo. And honestly, early in my career I interned for a CPA and had an accounting degree that I was working on. And I very quickly realized I did not want to be a cpa. I don't want to do the tax piece. It's kind of a love hate relationship with accounting for me when you include that tax piece. And so I found my niche when I found school finance and school business office. And so it's always been this struggle. A lot of job postings, if you want to continue to move up, require either a CPA or an SFO certification. Early in my career, I thought my only path was a cpa. But this SFO certification is becoming more and more recognized. Seeing it more and more in job postings and it really represents the niche that I plan to stay in for the rest of my career.

[John Brucat]

Wonderful. And Matt, you know, a lifelong school business official, what ultimately led you to pursue the SFO certification?

[Matthew Lentz]

Sure. So actually I pursued it and I obtained it at the point that I was 15, about 15, 13 to 15 years in the career, I felt that it would further convey all of the real world practical experience that I had and solidify that with a credential that would demonstrate that I have the knowledge to be a chief school official as well as to further advance my career at that point and to take on more diverse tasks in school business that may touch finance, but aren't directly finance related to accounting and auditing. Similar to what Rebecca mentioned.

[John Brucat]

It's great. So, you know, for those unfamiliar with Matt, you talked about it a little bit. What are some of those concrete career advantages of earning the sfo? I mean, Matt, from your experience obtaining it, and then Rebecca kind of projecting, what do you think you'll be able to kind of glean from that? So, Matt, maybe we can start from you.

[Matthew Lentz]

Sure. So I think that the benefits when you're thinking of achievement and growth was it was recognition for myself and my entity. And I say that because I think that a lot of times we aren't good. We're behind the scenes. We're not good at promoting what goes into the outcomes that we provide for districts for clean audits and budget development. So, you know, completing it was an opportunity for recognition within the district and then also, you know, a moment to reflect. And it actually was one of my specific goals in the district I was in at the time to both obtain it as well as to then apply that kind of knowledge that I had to take my position to the next level. So that was when I then became the actual cfo. Also took on additional roles with some transitions with our assistant superintendent and landed in the the view of the school board that I was a very capable, competent administrator who was ambidextrous, so to speak, that actually during the superintendent transition, I was asked and approached by the board to be the acting superintendent, knowing that I had this different depth of experience from that. Then in 2023, I was approached by a board member for my current school entity because this role involves a complex relationship and organization that is not necessarily complex with taxes because we're fiscally dependent upon revenue from the School District of Philadelphia, but also has some limitations because we are fiscally dependent on what we own for properties, how we manage our instructional day, and also utilize our revenue stream that is not finite. We can't increase taxes, we can't do a referendum. And so again, that was something that I had previously not necessarily directly dealt with, but definitely this throughout those skills that I had as a part of me as well as, you know, we're retaining and being current with trends through my professional development for school districts.

[John Brucat]

So it really just isn't a narrow focus of finance. It really sounds like you were able to advantage yourself in more of a leadership capacity too. And it's not just you and your colleagues that are noticing this credential, but those potential and future employers are really looking at. All right. Matt has taken the next level of school business and leadership and that really seems to be a draw for other institutions. I mean, do you feel that really has been your experience?

[Matthew Lentz]

Yes, absolutely. And actually in particular, I can comment that my approach about the opportunity that I'm in now actually came from an individual who was or is the CFO of a very large healthcare organization and they were a provider of our healthcare, that he recognized that I had these pieces just through our relationship and our discussions that that elevated made him come to me and say, listen, you know, you're it. I'm going to connect you with them. And so, you know, that was both very humbling for me as well as tied directly back to the work I had done to obtain the designation.

[John Brucat]

That's great. And you know, Rebecca, with you considering this, this certification, you talk to it again a little bit. But what specific skills or competencies having. I'm assuming you've looked into it obviously, but what are you hoping to kind of get out of this, this certification to help develop you further as a cfo?

[Rebecca Brooks]

Absolutely. I think I've definitely touched on the finance piece. However, there's so much more to it that honestly, as a relatively new CFO for a smaller district, you are kind of a jack of all trades, wearing very many hats. And so there are areas that I would like to really increase my experience and understanding in those especially being like around food service or transportation or human resources that are kind of on the periphery of what we do in a traditional finance situation. But things that I definitely need to increase my knowledge in those areas.

[John Brucat]

Yeah, yeah. And I was able to achieve my SFO certification earlier this year and I feel that it really relates to both of what you have said already and it really rounds you out as a leader and really test your competencies outside of just finance. There's a lot to do with the district management and operations. There's a lot to do with the leadership risk management. So it really does kind of offer an all encompassing test to like who you are as a leader. And you know, similar to you, Matt has been recognized in my area as a really prestigious designation and there's a lot of weight that goes behind holding your SFO credentials. So Glad that both of you are kind of really realizing that. Both holding it, Matt and Rebecca kind of pursuing that yourself. Matt, what did you find most challenging in the certification process and what advice would you have to someone preparing for the exam?

[Matthew Lentz]

I think for me, the challenging piece was reviewing information in preparation for the exam without necessarily, you know, being able to. At the time, there was not as many sfos have somebody from my state who had achieved the designation. And so I talked to individuals from other states. ASBO Online has some great exam preparation resources for candidates, but that was, I think, really the challenge because I put off doing the test thinking that, well, you know, I need to look at this more or, you know, we don't really do something like this in Pennsylvania. I have to, you know, brush up on, you know, what that would be. And, you know, really, I think, you know, the resources were most beneficial to me from ASBO in review and preparation. And at the end of the day, you know, I was fine. I think the second hesitation just was that it is an on. It was an online test. And I guess I age myself now to say that I had not taken tests online before, but actually I loved the format and how I was able to do it because it allowed you to skip a question mark it come back to it. And I actually found it was one of the best formatted tests based on how it's delivered to you to take based upon having that ability to look at that and then revisit and consider some of the answers and choices.

[John Brucat]

Yeah. And I'm sure your experience was similar to mine, but it's very much a heavily proctored and regulated exam, too. So even though it's remote and virtual, I remember having to kind of turn my laptop around, making sure my desk was clear. There wasn't anything that I would be referring to. So obviously ASBO International takes it very seriously. It is a very serious exam in terms of really testing your abilities. And Rebecca, for you, I mean, having done a little bit of your preliminary research, what are you kind of anticipating as some major challenges? Kind of just really kind of dipping your toe in the water here?

[Rebecca Brooks]

Yeah, I really just. The preparation similar to what Matt said, honestly, and making sure that I'm as prepared and knowledgeable in the areas that are a natural weakness for me. But I am going to be attending a SFO prep class in December, which I'm excited. I think that has a combination of kind of your own pace videos that you can watch along with there's some kind of live question and answer and kind of guided information, and then you get access to the digital flashcards. So I'm excited to really kind of dig into that once I have access to that in December. And then my own plan originally was to take the test in the summer when it kind of slowed down for our district. I don't know that that happens anymore, but that was the goal. But I may move it up a little bit, since I'm going to be kind of more focused on it in December and January. So we'll see. But just making sure I'm prepared and really gaining that knowledge in the areas I don't have that experience, so to speak.

[John Brucat]

Are there any areas encompassing the SFO that you really need to hone your skills on? So, for instance, when I took the exam, I realized that I need to brush up on my risk management skills a little bit, because that's not where I scored as highly as maybe I had thought. Are there specific areas that you really need to focus on, do you feel?

[Rebecca Brooks]

At this point, I definitely need to focus on the human resources transportation aspects a little bit more in the food service, but I feel like the human resources areas and transportation are the two that I'm the weakest in. I have the least amount of knowledge and experience there.

[John Brucat]

And, Matt, reflecting back to your exam experience, what was it exactly in terms of where you thought you were going to land and where you actually did? Were there certain areas that you're like, oh, this kind of highlighted some. Some pieces to the work that I need to kind of brush up on, or did you just totally ace it and you were good?

[Matthew Lentz]

From my recollection, no, I think that for, you know, in preparation, you know, I. I utilized kind of an approach to look at each area, you know, determine what, you know, what I looked at, kind of content guidance in the prep manual, what I felt I was fluent with, what I needed to look at. Again, in particular, I think for me, when I got to the exam, it was really some of the ancillary services, but in particular, the questions that dealt with enrollments and demographics and planning and things like that, because I did that in my district, we went through that, but also we always contracted with a demographer. And so, you know, that piece, again, I think it was a consideration that, you know, probably to advise somebody who's looking at participating to actually, you know, consider what you feel you touch and you deal with every day versus what you don't, which is similar to what Rebecca has mentioned with regards to some of those human resources items and things like that.

[John Brucat]

And you did mention a little bit. But, you know, when we think about the direct impact on our personal careers, the perception of what we're doing and how it affects us as school business officials in our district. Can you speak to a little bit more on how maybe your district has benefited from you having your sfo?

[Matthew Lentz]

Yeah, absolutely. So I think the designation itself is a point of pride, but also in particular is something that I've been able to foster in the staff that I've hired who have the desire to grow into the profession. And so, in particular, I recently had a controller who reported to me who I had elevated from a manager position to that position. I was able to then direct and have that individual not only be a part of asbo, attend conferences and that interest, which, again, kind of sets on both an environment of lifelong learning in the business office, professional development, and as well as the knowledge and skills to provide for some succession or transition, you know, within that organization there.

[John Brucat]

And, Rebecca, how do you think earning your SFO certification would enhance your contributions to your district? And does your school district. Is your board, your superintendent? Do they understand what the SFO certification is? Have you approached them about it? I mean, what is kind of your experience been kind of leading up to this so far?

[Rebecca Brooks]

Yeah, absolutely. I do anticipate that my district will consider this a definite addition and improvement. I don't know that my superintendent has shared it with my board, but I do know my superintendent is a strong supporter of the SFO certification and the ASBO organization as a whole. And so I do think there will be value there. With us being a small district, we don't have a lot of staff in our business office, but I would like to also grow the SFO certification. I think it will also just show that I'm willing to make the efforts to grow in the areas where I'm not experienced yet, being a relatively new SFO or cfo. Sorry. And just kind of letting them realize that I'm willing to put the effort in and continue to grow and build those areas so that I can support the district as best I can.

[John Brucat]

And then, so what about the. Your local areas, districts, and your colleagues and in your respective states, is the SFO certification that you see a lot of your counterparts pursuing or obtaining? Or is this something that's kind of new to your area? Matt, what's going on in Pennsylvania with the SFO certificate? Right.

[Matthew Lentz]

So the SoO certification has really taken off. We've had a Pennsylvania certification, but again, that certification allows you, as an individual, to become certified, but based upon areas that you meet with regards to your knowledge, skill set and role. So, for example, there's many people in Pennsylvania that are more of that accounting focus, and so that's what their certification is. We also have different designations and certifications in PA for payroll. And so taking the SFO really brings that together and allows the knowledge base and your certification to be broad based as well as dovetail on the state certification.

[John Brucat]

Great. And what about Colorado, Rebecca? Are you seeing a lot of your colleagues going forward and obtaining the sfo? Is that new? What is the status for Colorado?

[Rebecca Brooks]

So I think it's been in Colorado for a little while, but it's kind of slow growing. So I don't know how long the oldest person that's had it has been, but I do know that it's gaining, it's gaining some momentum, but not as fast as it should, considering what it is. And so I want to say we have between 30 and 40 SFO certified people in the state, but I also know some of my fellow CASBO board members are pursuing it at the same time as me. And so I hope it continues to grow. I think it's a very valuable sort of.

[John Brucat]

Yeah, absolutely. And Matt, I mean, if there are any. Can you identify any kind of common misconceptions you've encountered with the SFO certification and how would you address those?

[Matthew Lentz]

Sure. I think the first misunderstanding that individuals have is that it's not necessary. They say, again, I was seasoned in my position in tenure. And so they say, well, I've done this 15 years, everybody knows me, they know my skills. And again, I think that, you know, they're missing out, that the certification really solidifies that as well as the preparation and ongoing requirement for professional development really helps to build you and elevate you as an individual with your credibility. And in particular, you know, anytime you're speaking about budgets or you're speaking about challenging situations in your district, this really is something that, you know, the public sees. You know, I put it on presentations and again, helps to give a context that, okay, our CFO knows these areas because of this. So I think that, you know, has helped is helpful even with a track record experience. I think the second piece is just that it's not applicable because it is a national certification. And again, I'd encourage folks that even if you have a state certification or other recognition at the state level, it is applicable because, you know, our financial statements and our audits, you know, roll up to a national level. And that, you know, this really, I think, is a reach from most people with at least one area that the exam is focusing at. So it really again builds on anything you may have initially at the state level.

[John Brucat]

You make such a great point. I mean, even though it's not mandated and all of our states have nuances in terms of how we do our jobs. What I've noticed, and I'm sure the two of you have as well, just going from national conference, talking to people on this podcast, we all face very similar challenges. We may tackle them a little bit differently, but it seems that a lot of what we do is relatable. So I think that SFO certification really is kind of a blanket credential, really just bolsters what we're doing and can be applicable regardless of what state, what country, what province you're a part of. So you make a great point. And then so talk to me a little bit about maintaining your certification. It's not just kind of a one and done. You get it. There is a PD element to it. Matt, can you talk to me a little bit about that and how it's been going for you?

[Matthew Lentz]

Sure. So you're correct. So there has to be a recertification every three years. And that's a very easy process. You have to during those three years earn and then present documentation that you have 45 contact hours. And you also again, and you know, this is one of those benefits of the certification that you agree to the code of conduct that has to be followed and that all SFOs uphold as part of that meeting those actual professional development needs for the 45 hours has a diverse method as to how you can meet that you get one contact hour is for 50 minutes of educational content. So you're looking at 45 hours of educational learning over three years. So 15 hours a year, it's roughly once a month. And so if you look at it that way, you know, participating in, you know, ASBO's, you know, monthly webinars that they do, you know, that that fulfills that, I'm sure at the state level you participate in those exercises. And then there also can be other, I think they're called unstructured learning opportunities or contact hours, which can include participating and publishing in school, business affairs, providing instructional leadership and service, you know, within the field. And so it's a commitment, but definitely is doable, you know, and most of us are probably doing these different learning opportunities anyways as part of our day to day support for our roles.

[John Brucat]

Right. Another great point. It's not something necessarily extra because to your point, it's probably something we're doing already in our professional development, attending webinars, going to conferences. So it all does accumulate and count towards the sfo. So, Rebecca, for others who might really be on the fence about pursuing their sfo, you really in the thick of it. What factors would encourage you to go for it?

[Rebecca Brooks]

I think that you never know what life is going to bring you. And I think that those of us that have pieces of past history that we have experienced, why not harness that past experience and the knowledge that you have to solidify what certification you can get? I think even Matt alluded to the fact that he got thrown kind of acting as superintendent. You never know what life is going to bring you, and it really helps round you out and bring proof to what your knowledge base is for those that may not understand or be new to you in your. In your life.

[John Brucat]

Great, Great. So, so winding down here as you kind of look forward and ahead in your careers, how do you think the SFO is really going to play a role in your professional growth? Matt, maybe we can, we can start with you. You've. You've obviously experienced a lot of it already, but what do you see kind of down the road for yourself?

[Matthew Lentz]

Yeah, I see long term, continuing to demonstrate to my organization or another organization that I am a financial and operations leader, but an overall leader, and that I'm not afraid of deploying new resources to my entity. In particular, you know, everyone's looking at AI and that, you know, those are initiatives that I can both bring to my organization as well as potentially support new organizations, new concepts with how they're doing, restructuring from an organizational perspective. And I like that. I feel like, again, I wanted more than just to be an accountant. I wanted that diversity of role and ambidextrous positions. And so I think that that is what this will further demonstrate. And again, in particular, I'm cautious as I pick up my learning that it's focused on areas that I'd like to expand and grow into.

[John Brucat]

Great. And Rebecca, how about you? How do you think this will contribute to your performance, professional career growth moving forward?

[Rebecca Brooks]

I really love the idea of being able to more seamlessly pivot from area to area on those things that are currently the periphery of my CFO position? So just being able to more seamlessly handle anything that's kind of thrown at us, I'm really looking forward to that. And I also think it opens up new opportunities for you in the event that you're looking. I'm not, but I think it's smart to be prepared and be open and have whatever necessary certifications or training that is possible.

[John Brucat]

Well, you know, anyone listening, I would encourage you to pursue your SFO if it's something that you have considered or have heard about and are really looking to take kind of the next step in your career. It's served me very well. Obviously, you've heard that it served Matt well, and I'm sure, Rebecca, you'll benefit from obtaining that certification yourself. So I want to thank you both for coming on and really sharing your experience. Rebecca, best of luck on pursuing the sfo. I'm sure you'll nail it. And it was just so great speaking to both of you today. Thank you.

[Matthew Lentz]

Thank you.

[Rebecca Brooks]

Thank you.

[John Brucat]

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