BREAKING: Mike Tomlin steps down from Steelers, what’s next?

Summary

Scoop City: Inside The NFL

Episode: BREAKING: Mike Tomlin steps down from Steelers, what’s next?
Date: January 13, 2026
Hosts: Dianna Russini, James Palmer, with guest Mike DeFabo (The Athletic)

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Overview

This emergency episode of Scoop City breaks down the stunning news: legendary head coach Mike Tomlin is stepping down from the Pittsburgh Steelers after 19 seasons. Hosts Dianna Russini and James Palmer, along with Steelers beat reporter Mike DeFabo, dig into how and why Tomlin came to this decision, the reaction inside Pittsburgh and beyond, the future for Tomlin and the Steelers organization, and how this move influences a wild NFL coaching carousel.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. How Did This Happen? Inside the Tomlin Decision

• Rumblings Preceded Announcement:
  • Around the league, insiders and executives sensed Tomlin might step away, but the move still stunned much of the broader NFL public.
  • Dianna: “There’s been some rumblings…leading into this weekend a bunch of people around the league started to learn that this was going to be it for him, that he was going to step away.” (04:05)
• Not a Surprise for Insiders:
  • Many people knew Tomlin had considered this kind of move for years; this season felt particularly serious.
  • Key distinction: Tomlin “stepping away” (not fired, not “retiring”), perhaps more “Sean Payton style”—a pause rather than a permanent departure.

2. Tomlin’s Next Steps: TV? Another Sideline? Time Off?

• Strong TV Interest:
  • Every network has shown interest in Tomlin, especially Fox.
  • Diana: “Fox would be the place for him if he were to decide to do TV just based on the needs they have there…he’s got some good relationships and connections with the people over at Fox.” (07:56)
• Could He Return to Coaching?
  • To coach elsewhere in 2026, Tomlin would need to be traded, since he still has a year on his contract.
  • Both hosts agree: for now, sources expect him to truly step away from football, but everything is fluid.
  • James: “Everybody is fascinated about what’s next for Mike Tomlin. I do think ‘time’ is a word we’re going to use repeatedly.” (06:46)

3. Mike Tomlin’s Legacy: A Culture-Builder and Leader

• Players’ Coach, National Admiration:

  • Many players, even on other teams, say they’d love to play for him.
  • James: “There’s so many players…that play for other teams that go, man, I would love to play for Mike Tomlin.” (10:14)

• Touching Player Stories:

  • Mike DeFabo shares how Tomlin helped former lineman Willie Colon during depression:
    • “He literally saved my life because of the state I was in…he values his players as people. He does not see you as number eight. He doesn’t see you as just some other tight end.” (15:47)
  • Tomlin’s personal touch: knows players’ high school mascots, area codes, background details; connects with people in a chameleon-like way.

• Memorable Quote:

  • Tomlin to Dianna (after a tough question about Le’Veon Bell): “On this team, we only want volunteers, not hostages.” (22:08)

4. Why Are Steelers Fans So Divided?

• Playoff Drought the Main Issue:
  • Nationally, Tomlin is revered, but Pittsburgh fans were restless due to playoff failures.
  • Mike DeFabo: “There are kids…the last time the Steelers won a playoff game, they weren’t even born. So you’ve got a fanbase that’s used to competing for Super Bowls, and they can’t make it out of the first round.” (13:39)
  • Only six NFL teams have a longer active playoff dry spell.
• Locker Room Support:
  • Despite fan criticism, Tomlin remained beloved by players:
    • Pat Freiermuth: “[He] is the best coach that he’s ever played for.” (15:47)

5. What’s Next for the Steelers? The Rare Coaching Search Begins

• Elite Job, Historic Stability:
  • DeFabo: “Being a Steelers head coach is almost like being a Supreme Court justice…there have been fewer popes than Steelers head coaches since 1969.” (19:43)
• Search Direction:
  • Traditionally, a defensive, young coach, but organization may evolve, given recent QB failures post-Roethlisberger.
  • DeFabo: “Until they identify that next coach who can groom the quarterback, they’re really not moving forward as an organization.” (19:43)
• Steelers’ Ownership Already Working:
  • Dianna: “I can tell you that the Steelers have done some work behind the scenes…some conversations with some candidates over the last few weeks.” (25:33)

6. Coaching Carousel: Harbaugh, Stefanski, Raiders, More

• John Harbaugh Watch:
  • Falcons, Giants, Titans are front-runners for the (now-former) Ravens coach (31:06).
  • AFC jobs less likely: “Staying out of the AFC has been part of this.” (32:07)
  • Atlanta’s structure and relationships (ownership, Matt Ryan, ESPN connections) make it a surprisingly viable fit (33:11).
  • Titans job rising in esteem: “The Mike Borgonzi factor has received A’s across the board from candidates because he knows what he’s doing.” (35:22)
  • Location/family/schools (Nashville) are a big factor for coaching candidates.
• Pittsburgh as an Opening:
  • Strong ownership, tradition, but presenting a rebuilding roster and no clear QB solution.
  • Dianna: “Their best players are all over 30…quarterback is the issue.” (38:31)
• Raiders Job:
  • More attractive due to cash flexibility, Tom Brady’s involvement.
  • Candidates noted: Brian Dabol, Brian Flores (44:33), but could go outside the box (Davis Webb name floated).
• Kevin Stefanski:
  • “Has interviewed everywhere…He can be picky.” (42:29)
  • Miami, Atlanta, Tennessee, Giants — all strong mutual interest.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Dianna Russini:
  • “On this team, we only want volunteers, not hostages.” (22:08)
  • “There have been fewer popes than Pittsburgh Steelers head coaches since 1969.” (19:43)
• Mike DeFabo:
  • On Tomlin’s compassion: “He literally saved my life…He values his players as people.” (15:47)
  • “I almost can’t believe that they actually did it just because he has had such job security.” (25:10)
• James Palmer:
  • “There’s so many players…that play for other teams that go, man, I would love to play for Mike Tomlin.” (10:14)
  • “Time is a key factor and really, breaking precedent—both of those things seem to have come to a head at the same time.” (38:21)

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Timestamps for Major Segments

• [03:15] Show begins, Tomlin stepping down context
• [04:05] Diana details rumors and context of Tomlin's decision
• [06:05] The end of an era: Tomlin and Harbaugh out
• [07:56] Tomlin’s TV options and legacy
• [10:14] Why players love Tomlin, league-wide reaction
• [13:39] Mike DeFabo: Pittsburgh’s playoff drought impacts fan view
• [15:47] DeFabo: Tomlin’s player relationships and legacy stories
• [17:48] Palmer & Rossini share personal Tomlin stories
• [19:43] What’s next for the Steelers – search for next head coach
• [21:04] Tomlin’s famous “volunteers, not hostages” quote story
• [25:33] Steelers already prepping for the coaching search
• [29:36] Steelers ownership’s preparedness and candidate contacts
• [31:06] Harbaugh, candidates for coaching vacancies, coaching cycle overview
• [38:31] Pittsburgh’s job appeal, aging roster, quarterback issues
• [42:29] Kevin Stefanski interviews, coaching candidates' strategies
• [44:33] The Raiders coaching job: expectations and rumors

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Additional Observations & Tone

• The conversation is fast, energetic, blends reporting with storytelling and humor.
• Hosts openly share their respect for Tomlin—emphasizing his leadership, character, and unique impact on both players and fellow coaches.
• The episode cycles quickly between hard reporting (“here’s what we know…”) and behind-the-scenes color about personalities, ownership dynamics, and the quirks of the modern coaching search process.
• Memorable moments include personal stories of Tomlin’s interactions—his concern for players’ well-being, his legendary dry wit, and his lasting influence on the Steelers identity.
• The tone shifts to excitement and intrigue as both the Steelers and the rest of the NFL enter an offseason of rare upheaval and opportunity.

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Summary Takeaway

Mike Tomlin’s departure marks the end of an extraordinary era in Pittsburgh—and the start of a high-stakes, highly-scrutinized coaching search. The NFL world is left to ponder how the Steelers will evolve, how Tomlin will shape his next act, and how this coaching carousel—punctuated by major vacancies and seismic shifts—will remake the league yet again.

Transcript

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[James Palmer]

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[Diana Rossini]

It.

[James Palmer]

Oh welcome in to Scoop City. James Palmer Diana Rossini with you. Diana. I just realized this is only our second emergency pod together. Our other, I believe, was for one Micah Parsons, a story that you were all over the entire summer and he gets traded to the Green Bay Packers. An acquisition. Our second one is a departure. It is a stepping away. Let's make sure we are using the Proper terms here. Right. On how Mike Tomlin and the Steelers are parting ways, I will kick this off to you going. We had heard rumblings around whispers, things maybe feel different. When did you start getting the final sense that, yes, a change could possibly be coming and doing your digging? How did it actually go down?

[Diana Rossini]

Hi, James. What a day it's been. I'm having a little bit of a hard time hearing you, to be fully transparent, but okay. We've been working together for a long time, so I know what you want to know and that's how this came together, why he made this decision and, and really what everyone around the league is saying. So why don't we just start with what led up to this. So there's been a lot of chatter around the league because of this coaching cycle being just so saturated. Just there's so much going on, so, so many unexpected openings which I know we're going to dive into later in terms of looking at this whole head coaching cycle as a whole. So let's just get into Tomlin, though. There's been some rumblings that leading into this weekend, a bunch of people around the league started to learn that this was going to be it for him, that this, that he was going to step away. So I don't think people in football were as shocked as perhaps the rest of the world. I think the rest of the world also knew this was on the table because we've been hearing this for years. This year just felt way more serious and the conversations around the league have been, okay, well, if he steps away, is it stepping away? Sean Payton style? Meaning you take a TV gig for a year and then you find a new place. You. You kind of fake retire or do you step away and, and hope that another team would trade for you? The sense I'm getting is this is stepping away to be away from football. Now, this could be something that changes. But those that are close to him have, have shared that this, this is a time for Mike to just take a break from a really successful, long career in Pittsburgh. And, you know, a lot of people around football kept saying there's going to be two major openings this year that would shock you. And now here we are with Jim Harbaugh. Excuse me, with John Harbaugh and Mike Tomlin. Both, you know, both not with the teams that we know them to be with for, for all these years.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, it was. I did something on the athletic on, on their social and put out. Hey, I was hearing week 18, the loser of that game could potential out at their respective location, whether it was 18 years with John Harbaugh, 19 years with Mike Tomlin, we were all having our eyes on that game, not only because one goes to the playoffs, the other one has their season come to an end, but there was just a different feeling around both of those buildings. And to keep your eye on it, I don't think we thought both buildings were going to be making a change in one capacity or another. Yes. Let's make it clear that John Harbo was fired and that Mike Tomlin is stepping away. Dynak, you can hear me now. You hear me? Got me?

[Diana Rossini]

I got you.

[James Palmer]

Okay. Loud and clear. And so I think the most interesting aspect of why Mike Tomlin is departing, what's next we'll get to for the Pittsburgh Steelers. But more specifically, everybody is fascinated about what's next for Mike Tomlin. I do think time is a word we're going to use repeatedly. I do think, like, breaking precedent is something we're going to talk about repeatedly, because the Steelers did do that this year. And when those things usually become part of the discussion, that that's when you can see somebody that's been in a spot for a long time end up departing. When you say it looks like a moment when you speak to people close to Mike Tomlin, that he is going to be stepping away from football for a moment, the first name that everybody thinks of is what Sean Payton, very similar situation. Goes and works at Fox for a year. He analyzes the entire landscape. They go through a hiring cycle there in New Orleans, Diana, and they hire Dennis Allen. He comes in and then he ends up getting landing in Denver. They make a trade which they had to do to acquire Sean Payton. Do you see this being a comparable situation with Mike Tomlin right now?

[Diana Rossini]

I do. I do. I think our reporter Andrew Marchand at the Athletic, who covers the media, has, has done a really great job of reporting on, on what's on the table for Mike Tomlin. And it appears that every network has shown interest over the weeks once. I think the TV execs with their fingers crossed, hope and pray that, that he would really actually do this. I know even just talking to somebody last week with the network, they were saying that they weren't sure if Tama would actually really do it. So I, I think it would make all the sense in the world that Fox would be the place for him if he were to decide to do TV just based on the needs that they have there. But of course, you know, you never know what some of the options that he has. He may go somewhere where he's got a better relationship, a better connection, but we know he's got some good relationships and connections with the people over at fox. Look, this is, this is a big day in Pittsburgh. This is a huge day in the NFL, you know, and I think we're going to start hearing a lot more stories coming out over the next 24, 48 hours, not just of what Mike Tubman has meant to the Pittsburgh Steelers, but sort of how everyone's been reacting to it because, again, just because the word was out, I still find so many people in football very shocked today because I think he always flirted with this, or at least he's flirted with this the last few years. And now. And now it's real. And it's hard to imagine the NFL without that guy, without seeing him on the sideline and knowing how respected he is among the coaching circle and of course, just players. Some of those interactions you see in post game with him going up to the opposing quarterbacks and whoever their star players are and even any other guys that he knows from his days of coming up and coming through that he has scouted, that he has met through the draft process, you can just see it. And you've been on the field with me when, when we've watched him do that and the command he has. And we're talking about a coaching cycle right now, and you listen to these owners talk about the things that they look for, and you might as well just put up a picture of Mike Tomlin because that will answer a lot of questions for, well, what does this look like when you talk about a leader, a guy who knows how to have the pulse of the team, how to immediately garner respect by holding the best players accountable. And that's really what he's done so well.

[James Palmer]

Yeah. And there's so many players, I think, that you've talked to him. I've talked to them that play for other teams that go, man, I would love to play for Mike Donlon. Like, I've had that conversation with guys in other buildings. No slight to their current head coach, but they're like, it's just a guy. I would love to play for, just the way he's wired, the way he's built a culture, I want to play for that. You mentioned people reacting across the country, what this means, not just to the entire NFL, but specifically to Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh. Let's bring in the athletics writer, Mike defebo. And Mike has been on our show a whole bunch, and I've asked him this question, Diana a ton of times. Dang. He's not in his car. He's really good when he's in his car. I'm not gonna lie. When Mike's in the car, he's really, really on top of his game. But I know he'll bring the goods here.

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[James Palmer]

Mike, you're there. You're Pittsburgh. I do feel like there's two different perceptions of Mike Tomlin. There's the one that Diana and I have and a lot of national people have going, like, how in the world is this fan base chanting fire Mike Tomlin within games in the second half of the season when everybody else in the NFL is going, we'd love for him to be our head coach? Why is it so different in Pittsburgh than it is in terms of the perception nationally about Mike Tomlin?

[Mike DeFabo]

Yeah, I mean, I think the best way to describe that is Joey Porter Jr. Plays for the Steelers right now. The last time the Steelers won a playoff game, he was a sophomore at North Catholic High School, before he transferred to North Allegheny High School, before he went to Penn State and played four years there, and before he played three seasons for the Pittsburgh Steelers. So you have people that have grown up, and there are kids. The Steelers produced this video of kids reenacting some of the great moments in Steelers playoff history. These kids were not born when Mike Tomlin last had his playoff win. And so you've got, like, a fan base that's used to competing for Super Bowls and they can't make it out of the first round. And people are going to be frustrated by that, and I think rightfully so. You know, so much people here in Pittsburgh. Here, national media say Pittsburgh is spoiled. This is a spoiled fan base. They don't know how good they have it. To never have a losing season. Imagine if you were the Jets. Imagine if you were the Raiders. Imagine if you were the Panthers. Well, there's only six franchises with a longer drought without a playoff win, and those are some of the teams that I just mentioned, along with the Denver Broncos, who won a Super bowl and might end up snapping that streak. If the Denver Broncos win a playoff game this year, there will be just five teams with a longer postseason drought than the Steelers. So really, it is directly and singularly tied to playoffs and those results, or lack thereof.

[James Palmer]

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[James Palmer]

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[Diana Rossini]

Mike, I was gonna go. I'm doing that. I was trying to be respectful to Mike, and I was muting myself so he didn't hear my heavy breathing.

[James Palmer]

Oh, I thought you had. You were doing, like, a cold cough button thing. Like a whole. Yeah, nice.

[Diana Rossini]

You were like a real newscaster. Yeah, it was very much Mike, you know this team better than anyone on this show right now because you're around them all the time, you're constantly in touch with players. Just the reaction so far that, that you've received since the news has gone on from all the coaches and players and everyone attached to the Steelers, what has it been?

[Mike DeFabo]

Well, I think it's important to note that while there was a lot of criticism for Mike Tomlin from the fan base, there is a big difference between how the fans felt about Mike Tomlin and how players felt about Mike Tomlin. Just maybe an hour ago, Pat Frymuth was standing there talking about how Mike Tomlin is the best coach that he's ever played for. And I think that one thing that's really important and central to Mike Tomlin's legacy and something that I respect Mike Tomlin for more than anything else that he's done on the football field is just that he values his players as people. He does not see you as number eight. He doesn't see you as just some other tight end. And it goes to a ridiculous degree. And I think the best example I could go on and on, we did a story a year ago where we just went surveying players saying, basically, what is your best Mike Tomlin story that sums him up? And I think the very best one we got was Willie Colon was an offensive lineman and he tore his tricep. And it was the second time that he was injured, he was going to be out for a second season. And he said that he was really in a dark emotional state, going into a depression. And Mike Tomlin recognized this and reached out to him and he brought him along with the team. He said, you need to be involved, you need to travel with us. And Willie Colon's quote was, he saved my life. And he said, I'm not trying to be over romantic about this. I'm not trying to make it more than it was, but he literally saved my life because of the state that I was in. And I've seen that countless examples. I mean, Mike Tomlin knows the high school mascot, he knows the area code of where you grew up. Just facts that he will sprinkle in. And he just has this incredible retention for knowledge and ability to connect in a chameleon like way with so many different people from different walks of life. And when you think about a football locker room, that's really the key. If you're going to be that general manager, pulse of the team type of coach, that's what you need to have. And Mike Tomlin, I think was better than anybody else for 19 seasons at just that.

[James Palmer]

It makes me. Diana, can I tell my Mike Tomlin story? Can I. Can I tell one here? I have one that's similar to that. You know, it made me want to want to tell it. And since Mike said it, I was covering an LSU pro day a number of years ago down there in Baton Rouge, and one of my best friends is from Baton Rouge. She gave me a little tiny hole in the wall type of restaurant, you know, that serves alligator and all sorts of different type of things. And I go in there with my producer that's with me, and we go and have a meal. I said, hey, this place is supposed to be real small, family friendly, quiet. We sit down, in comes 10 minutes later, Mike Tomlin with three guys that are on LSU's roster that are going to be participating in that pro day the next day. And they sit down at a table next to us. And I can't help but just kind of hear things and eavesdrop to what Mike's talking to these three players about. And I'll sum it up by this. He more or less told the three of them when they sat down, there's a very good chance none of you are Pittsburgh Steelers, but I wanted to take the three of you out so you could pick my brain and maybe I can glean some knowledge on the three of you to help you stay in the NFL as long as humanly possible. These are guys that aren't even going to be on his roster. And he just goes, I want to help you be a better NFL player and a better man while you're in the NFL. What pitfalls can you avoid? What landmines do you need to sidestep? I will give you all of that over this meal. And those aren't even guys that he is most likely going to draft. It just, it just. That's just kind of how Mike is wired in terms of the organization now that they won't have that in the building anymore. Mike, like, what are they looking for? How do you think they go about this process? Because, surprise, surprise, this isn't something they actually do very often. So what do you think is next for Pittsburgh? As some people may say they're behind the eight ball with this late announcement. I don't really think think so because of the way the process is now, but perhaps what is next for the Steelers?

[Mike DeFabo]

Well, I don't think they're behind the eight ball in the sense that I think this is going to be a marquee job. Because people recognize that being a Steelers head coach is almost like being a Supreme Court justice. It's kind of a job for life. You know what I mean? There have been fewer popes than Pittsburgh Steelers head coaches since 1969. And I think that that's a good way to understand it in terms of what they'll do. I think that this is really an interesting point for the franchise because they are a franchise very much tied to their history. When you talk about why do the Steelers do something, it's often the answer is because that's how they've always done it. So historically, what would they be looking for? They would be looking for a young coach. Maybe they would be wanting a defensive minded coach since they always have seen themselves as a defensive minded team. On the flip side of that, I wonder if maybe they're willing to start evolving a little bit. And I think the biggest thing is Mike Tomlin is in this situation because they were unable to identify, draft and develop a quarterback. Whether we want to admit it or not, the coaches that have quarterbacks are the ones that get pay raises, that get promotions, that move on to better, better positions. And the Steelers inability to find a replacement for Ben Roethlisberger has left them where we sit right here today. So to me, I think what they should do in the modern NFL is look on the offensive side of the ball and who is the coach that you can hire? It's going to help get that quarterback because until you get the quarterback, nothing is going to be solved. Like, while fans might be happy that you pushed Mike Tomlin or that Mike Tomlin chose to walk out the door. Sorry, let me rephrase that. Yes, it was his decision to walk out. While fans might be happy that Mike Tomlin is not having a Tomlin Tuesday, saying the standard is the standard and repeating the cliches that have frustrated them for so long, I think that until they identify that next coach who can groom the quarterback, that they're really not moving forward as an organization.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah, I think the Tomlin isms are going to be very, very missed because he just did such a good job of like keeping this so entertaining. And. And yeah, Mike, I'm sure you have a notebook full of them. You probably dream about them. You have nightmares about those things.

[Mike DeFabo]

I do.

[Diana Rossini]

I have a quick. A quick Tomlin story. So at the time I was at ESPN and we would sometimes interview coaches before the game for our pregame shows and I'd asked his communication director if it'd be okay if he did an interview with me, he said, yeah, he. You can do it, but no Le'Veon Bell questions. So it was week 13, week 14, Levy on Bell still wasn't there. They're playing the Ravens. And Mike had gone that whole season and never commented on Le'Veon Bell. He had. That was his choice, right? Because remember, Le'Veon was sitting out that year, and he did a masterful job of avoiding the question. So I essentially was told, you can ask anything but the Bell stuff. And I was like, fine, whatever. And so I'm wrapping up the interview, and this annoying voice in my head was like, you have to ask the Levy on Bell question, which was a mistake. And I did. And I. And I asked, you know, you still don't have Le'Veon Bell out here. How's that affected the team? And he looked at me and he said, well, on this team, we. We. We don't. We only want volunteers. Not. Not hostages. And he storms off. And we had. We exchanged some words, and he didn't talk to me for. For weeks. And I wrote him a handwritten note and apologized. And I see him later at the combine, and I run out. I see him through a window, and he's on the street, and I run out. I'm like, coach, Coach. I'm like, I, I, I. You have to understand, I had to ask that question. He's like, oh, I wasn't mad at you. I wasn't ever really mad at you about it. I was mad. I broke. I went the whole season, and I never said anything. And then I. I had to answer it. I was like, oh, man. But it's still one of my favorite things.

[James Palmer]

Oh, that's great.

[Mike DeFabo]

And, and that is still maybe one of the best Tomlin isms, and I love that you're the one that got it out of him. I think they've made some money off of T shirts from that. So I don't know if you should get some royalties or what.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, that.

[Diana Rossini]

Oh, I'm gonna. Oh, I'm going to investigate.

[James Palmer]

Another handwritten note coming Mike Tomlins way. I need royalties. Mike, let's go. I don't know if he made the T shirts either, or. Mike, appreciate you joining us, man. Thank you so much for. For everything you've. You've given us about the Steelers throughout this. This season on Scoop City. We were kind of prodding you about Mike Tomlin over the last several weeks, and you were kind of staying kind of firm to going. This is most likely the. The result that would happen. It's Kind of what ended up happening is if he was going to depart, it was going to be on his terms and he wasn't going to be fired and he was going to have a say in the matter. And, and that's where it's at. And now you're going to have to go back to working that beat, doing something you've never done before, which is be a part of a head coaching search. So I think you should call the likes of maybe Dan Duggan, maybe Vic Tafer, some people that have been through this year. And you're out. Diana, right here at the Athletic that have handled a lot of coaching searches at their respective locations and maybe get some advice on how to cover these coaching searches because that's something you just haven't done.

[Mike DeFabo]

Yeah, I think advice and maybe a support group because it's going to be an eventful and emotional couple of weeks here. But yeah, it's going to be fascinating. I almost can't believe that they actually did it just because he has had such job security. And also Tomlin, just as such a competitor, backed into a corner. I feel like he's the kind of guy that typically fights and that's what surprises me maybe most about his departure.

[Diana Rossini]

Well, I can tell you that the Steelers have done some work behind the scenes knowing that this was on the table. I know that they've had some conversations with some candidates over the last few weeks. So I, I think that's, that's good for the Pittsburgh Steelers and good for Mike Tomlin because it was kept pretty quiet. But, you know, we'll see what their next plan is because you know, those interview slips, they're probably already in the fax machine as we speak, Mike, so look forward to seeing all the reporting you do.

[Mike DeFabo]

Absolutely. Guys, thank you so much for having me.

[James Palmer]

No problem.

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[James Palmer]

The fax machine Diana that's what we're going to. We're going back to what? Doomerville, right? Didn't get the facts in in time.

[Diana Rossini]

Why do we even say put a slip in? Just say you emailed the other. Like why don't we just say they put in an email or they put a request in? Like the slip is. It's so aged.

[James Palmer]

You're right. It's a great point and I love that you had that nugget there. So let's lean into it a little bit because one of the reasons why candidates are going to be now looking at this Pittsburgh Steelers job is because of what then? The ownership. And ownership is a huge part of coaches when they're looking to land in a certain location. That's obviously part of why people are looking at the Ravens the way they're looking at it, because of the way Steve Bashadi is wired. You could say the same thing about the Steelers ownership and I love that you put that out there. Is there anything else you can say about that? Because good ownership is always prepared. Good ownership always has a plan in some sense. And you're saying that, yes, they have had some sort of plan in here in place as they've kind of been feeling out this process for some time.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah. They've had communication with several different candidates that they could potentially be interested in. Some of it was just feelers to see if these coaches would want to work for the Pittsburgh Steelers. So that's why I don't, I don't think that this was as shocking to them as it was to the rest of the world because they had to operate over the last few weeks like this was on the table because it truly was. I don't know if Mike Tomlin actually walked into Mr. Rooney's office and said, this is it for me. Prior to the last 24 hours. We'll say like, I, I don't know if he gave him that big of a heads up, but the Steelers front office knew enough and knew that this was, was realistic enough for them to make those calls. You don't make those calls unless you really think coach is doing that.

[TurboTax Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

So we will, we'll see what they, what, what their net kind of collects here over the next few weeks. And not surprising, it's going to be a lot of the names that we're seeing already. I can tell you. You know, we can quickly rip through to some of this John Harbaugh stuff. I don't get the sense that that's a real thing. Right. Because remember, for a coach, Mike Tomlin is. First of all, let's just start with the fact that Mike Tomlin is. Still has a year left on his contract, so he is stepping down. Okay. So in order for Mike Tomlin to then coach for another team, they would, he would have to be traded.

[James Palmer]

Yep.

[Diana Rossini]

So in terms of that, I think that's just important to keep in mind as we're talking about all the candidates because I've seen some people on Social be like, well, where's he gonna go next? Look, a team could do it.

[James Palmer]

I mean, call the Steelers.

[Diana Rossini]

I mean, right. Just give the Seals a call. But as for, for the coach, for the coaches that are up for it, obviously John harbor is the hot name. And the sense I'm getting now is the Falcons, the Giants and the Titans are the lead dogs in landing John Harbaugh. Based on the conversations he's had with all these organizations and he's has spoken to almost everyone. I think the Cardinals is still on the list, but I don't think he's had as much serious conversations as he has with the teams I just listed. So we'll see when the first official, official, official interview is. They're supposed to be Thursday or Friday this week. Okay. I think it'll be very telling as to which team he meets with first.

[James Palmer]

Oh, you think there's enough in there?

[Diana Rossini]

I think they're trying to wait here. They're not trying to drag this out. He is well aware he is holding up the rest of this coaching hiring cycle. So he's obviously the name that we're watching. But interesting though, the Atlanta Falcons, the New York Giants and the Tennessee Titans. And from what I understand, staying out of the AFC has been been part of this.

[James Palmer]

Oh, really?

[Diana Rossini]

He doesn't want to have to see his brother.

[James Palmer]

Oh, interesting.

[Diana Rossini]

Doesn't want to have to do that matchup.

[James Palmer]

Okay, I got you. Let me ask you this because I've kind of heard those similar teams, there was some people that believe the Dolphins believes into that group a little bit, but the three that you mentioned are kind of the three that I've heard as well. And he's been doing all this work where he's been looking at what his quarterback situation is with each one of them. I believe he was also correct. If I'm wrong, kind of when he looked at the Raiders going, all right, that's most likely going to be Fernando Mendoza. So that's kind of what I'm looking at in the quarterback spot there and the way he weighed all of it, but sticking to the term quarterback. How would he be in Atlanta with the way the new structure is in place? Because when he was in Baltimore, Diana, he reported only to Steve Bachotti. He did not report to their General Manager, Eric DaCosta. He just reported directly to ownership in the way it is set up in Atlanta. Now the general manager and head coach will report to Matt Ryan. Is that something John Harbaugh, a man who likes a lot of control, would be completely fine with if Atlanta was it.

[Diana Rossini]

This is such a fun game to play because there's so many little connectors.

[James Palmer]

Yes.

[Diana Rossini]

So, for example, Matt Ryan is very close to Sean McDonough from ESPN. They're very, very good friends. Sean McDonough also happens to be very good friends with John Harbaugh. He is a middleman in this of hey, my buddy likes you. You like my buddy. You know, here's what we can offer.

[Babbel Advertiser]

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[Diana Rossini]

So I don't necessarily get the, the feel from his. From Harbos camp that that's going to be a problem.

[James Palmer]

Okay.

[Diana Rossini]

I think for John isn't power hungry in this search. From what I can gather, he's had multiple conversations with people in Atlanta. He's had multiple conversations with Joe Shane with ownership. He met for lunch with Chris Mara according to our, you know, Conrad the athletic. So he, he's trying as much as he's listening. He's also selling himself too of like this is, this is what I want this to be and this is what I can bring to you. But I, I think the Falcons one surprised me a little bit initially that that was going to be a top choice. Not, not because of the roster anything because that, that is. You could. They should be putting that out in front. That's the best thing going for Atlanta.

[James Palmer]

Defense has changed. You're right. Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

But I think he does like the fact that it's set up the way it is and I think that Matt Ryan factor is going to be important and could be really good for Atlanta in order to, to get John Harbaugh there. But I think that the Giants are relentless right now. They're doing everything they can to get him in that building and to just say yes.

[James Palmer]

Oh, okay. I like that. And also there is an aspect that I didn't bring up. I brought up that, you know, it's just, it's a caveat and it's just different than what he's used to over the years. But there is also an open general manager spot in that building. Can I maybe bring who I want to bring in with me, general manager wise? I like that. And then the third team. I just want you to tell everybody who's watching and listening and just why are the Titans intriguing? I think there's some things to like I obviously there's Cam Ward there. I think Mike Borgonzi has actually been a highly respected evaluator and kind of scout type of GM for some time in the way that, you know, he looks at roster building. I guess he's got a new stadium coming. What are the, what are the selling points that make him think the Titans are a viable option?

[Diana Rossini]

The Titans hiring Mike Borgonzi was the best thing that they could do for themselves from just an image standpoint. Right. People don't know a lot about the Titans. They. It's unbelievable how many questions have been asked about ownership there and what does it look like and what's the setup. No one truly understands what it is, but the Mike Borgonzi factor has. Has. Has received A's across the board from candidates because he knows what he's doing. He's very clear about what he's looking for. I haven't gotten a sense that ownership has been a problem in terms of candidates interviewing there, which I think is. Is really good news for them because I think there was a time that it scared off some coaches of. I'm not sure. I've heard a couple things about her from. From as of late. I feel like it's. It's really shifted. So I think in these interviews, a lot of good information is coming across from their side to the candidates, and it's kind of getting around. Cam ward is 1000% the. The factor there that. The belief that all these coaches have in his ability and. And the kind of coaching they think that they can bring. But I would be remiss, not to mention that com. The community of Nashville is. Is such a sale selling point for these coaches. It is hard to find a wife of any wannabe head coach of the Tennessee Titans that does not want to live there.

[James Palmer]

And great point.

[Diana Rossini]

The Titans are smart and they. So I'm sure they're picking some of these coaches up at the airport and like, taking them the long way through Franklin and like by Carrie Underwood's house, by Taylor Swift's house.

[James Palmer]

Dolly Parton, my wife was obsessed with.

[Diana Rossini]

Going to Dolly because it is beautiful. It's a growing community. It's got great food, it's got great music. Like, it's. It's a party there and it's fun and they've got great schools. You know, I'm not selling Nashville to. To our viewers. But. But that is a. It's a. It's a. It's a really big factor. And I think football fans have sometimes forget about that stuff. Like there's real life components when a lot of these coaches are making decisions.

[James Palmer]

That's a great point. I mean, I think all of us.

[Diana Rossini]

Have all the power.

[James Palmer]

They really do. Let's be honest. And you and I have talked about it. Other people, like, I can't wait till the super bowl in Nashville. Like, we're all waiting for that super bowl in Nashville and like, what that week's going to be like. And we're all kind of jonesing at it in a sense how about what the Steelers organization is as. As a selling point? I, you know, I was getting texts from people going like, okay, I'm kind of curious what this is as a job. Obviously ownership is a big part of it, but you are going to be going through a rebuild. I mentioned time at the beginning of this and that being a, a key factor and, and really breaking precedent. Both of those things seem to have come to a head at the same time. Right, Diana, that it goes all right. Maybe it's time we know everything that's gone on over 19 years. Mike laid it out very, very well. This is an aging roster that we're seeing with, with a lot of guys that they brought in thinking they could just push them over the hump. Whether it is Darius Slay and it didn't work. Work out, or it's Jalen Ramsey now or it's, you know, it's the quarterback in Aaron Rodgers and Hayward and, and T.J. watt and all these different names.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah.

[James Palmer]

You don't have a quarterback. You do have great ownership. How appealing in the early conversations did you have about this opening in the Pittsburgh Steelers?

[Diana Rossini]

They're black. They're best players all over 30. As you mentioned, TJ Watt, Aaron Rodgers, Cam Hayward, Jalen Ramsey. We don't know the future of Aaron Rodgers just yet. I know. Think they've wanted Rogers back the whole time. Right? They've. They've said that. I mean, since the show started. Have we seen anything from Rogers yet? I don't think so. Right. He hasn't made.

[James Palmer]

But he's made his relationship with. With Mike very, very clear. And his, his role in getting kind.

[Diana Rossini]

Of like Roger's way right now. I like the older version of him. He's leaned into the brotherhood of the league and, and he's protective of his teammates and his coaches. And that screams to me a guy on his last. On his back nine, back hole. Right. Like there's not much. That's usually what you see in veteran players when they start kind of behaving this way. And the way ESPN handles the. Handled it on camera last night, right. Oh, definitely felt like it was his last game. I don't know very much anything.

[James Palmer]

Very much so.

[Diana Rossini]

You know, and, and we'll see what the path for. For Rogers will be next. If he's gonna. I'm. I think if we could guess we're gonna have to wait. He's never done anything. No Post haste, quickly. So I'm assuming there'll be some dark whole visits and conversations to be had before that but in terms of the. The likelihood that these top candidates are going to want to be in Pittsburgh. Look, ownership is such a big factor for. We've talked about this on the show last week about how coaches want a quarterback and a good owner. Quarterback, good owner. They've got one. But that's still. That's still good because there are some places that don't have either.

[James Palmer]

Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

Now do I think it's going to be a big draw. The way we've seen. We'll just say for the examples where Jim Hart where John. Why do I keep doing that, by the way?

[James Palmer]

Because it's the same thing. It's not your fault. It's their father and mother's fault. That's who you should be really annoying.

[Diana Rossini]

But I usually don't do that. Like, there's such different human beings.

[James Palmer]

Well, they are.

[Diana Rossini]

I think it's because the Chargers fired Greg Roman today. So it's like in my head as well.

[James Palmer]

Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

So I. I just think the ownership there is good. It's a great city. It's a great community. Anyone, any coach I've ever talked to talk to there, like assistants. They've always said, like, their families love it. I think all that stuff will line up. I just. I think their competition are going to be. These teams with these quarterbacks have got uber potential.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, it's true. And the thing that makes this cycle so fascinating is that these two jobs that have become open, that haven't been open for roughly 20 years, they look at the searches at least the last time. They went about them very differently. Nobody was hiring special teams coordinators when the Ravens went and hired John Harbaugh. And a lot of people I've talked to, and I think you've talked to, too, is don't be surprised if they go outside the box in terms of how they go about this search and this hire in Baltimore. Well, Mike Tomlin was the last interview that they did during that coaching search 19 years ago, the very last interview. He was the young defensive backs coach that some people liked and they like young defensive coaches. Mike talked about it, but there were other people that really. I think Ken Wisenhunt were the kind of the front runners for that job. So both of them do look at this a little bit differently than some other teams that we're used to seeing look at these jobs. And I think that makes it even more fascinating about who lands in both of these spots. I want to ask you about Kevin Stefanski. You've kind of been all over his kind of run in Terms of. He's interviewed everywhere. I believe he's done a lot of his first round. Maybe four or five of them. I think. Diana, this is the other coach in the division. The only one that remains is Zach Taylor in the entire division. This is a two time coach of the year. And Kevin Smansky. A lot of people thought, and I think it's accurate. What happens with John Harbaugh, then Kevin might be the next shoe to fall. Do you think that would be an accurate way to maybe predict the way this goes down in terms of.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah, I think obviously Kevin Stefanski is a big name and it appears he's almost interviewed at every single opening.

[James Palmer]

I think so.

[Diana Rossini]

I'm. I'm sure by the time the show wraps up here in a couple of minutes, Kevin Stefanski will have a slip in his fax machine.

[James Palmer]

Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

From the Pittsburgh.

[Babbel Advertiser]

There it is.

[James Palmer]

I love it.

[Diana Rossini]

We'll see about that. We should do a story on that. Just like that process of like, what does that look like? How do you, how do you get informed? Right. Like you're just sitting in your office.

[James Palmer]

If you're your current coach, carrier pigeon comes. It'd be great if like a pigeon flows in with a message. That's the way it should go. All right.

[Diana Rossini]

I talked to a candidate today who found out a team was requesting him on Twitter. He didn't even know about it. And. Wow. Asked me to call the team because he wanted the team to call him.

[James Palmer]

Okay.

[Diana Rossini]

I'm like, okay.

[James Palmer]

All right.

[Diana Rossini]

But yeah, Kevin's been everywhere. I think Kevin can be picky. He should be picky. I know he really liked Atlanta. He loved Tennessee. He. He was with Miami. Baltimore went well.

[James Palmer]

I think Miami was today.

[Diana Rossini]

Started this thing off with the Giants, which feels like 15 years ago now.

[James Palmer]

Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

And they really liked him. So I think he is gonna probably get offers from a lot of these teams and. And you know, we'll kind of see how the shakes.

[James Palmer]

Okay, then before we run, because we're kind of winding this up here. The team that doesn't get mentioned very much. So in all of this, I just feel like I'm looking at the map of the United States and everything we're talking about is just like east coast essentially and like this west as we're going is Nashville. And it's just the Raiders job is just right there. And when you talk to people around the league, it's kind of going again. The Raiders job is open, but perhaps it has a different feel to it than in seasons past. And I've Gotten that from people around the league going, all right, there's more liquid cash. There's different aspects of the job, including Tom Brady, that maybe you look at this job a little bit differently. When I look at the candidates now that are out there, there's some big fish. Tom went after the biggest fish last year and didn't land Ben Johnson. Do you think the Raiders have the ability to make a splash? I've actually heard some sneaky conversations about Davis Webb, which would be like an outside the box type of move for sure. But he's intrigued some people. I'm just throwing that as out as a name, as many.

[Diana Rossini]

Do you. What do you think with a. A newer, less known name person? Just because the way this cycle is working against the Raiders, because we talk about the things that these candidates are looking for, I don't necessarily believe they're getting check plus pluses here, you know, and so I think this is going to make it really hard. Tom Brady may have to do his best work in the next few days here to. To, you know, reel in the best candidates and. And we'll see. And I think a lot of us expected it to be Brian Dable, Brian Flores, but as of right now, that. That's still not a reality. That's still not something on their radar. So we'll. We'll see if that winds up being it, because in my opinion, I think that'd be a home run higher at this point. I. I just. I don't know what the hesitation is.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, it's. It's fascinating the way it's going to go. Tom's going to have to like, emulate kind of John Elway with his years of slinging cars and making. Making deals to go out there, that negotiating thing.

[Diana Rossini]

I just saw him on Sunday.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, he.

[Diana Rossini]

He's so kind. Like, it's. I know that's such a dumb thing to say about some, but, like, you just expect Tom Brady to be a jerk. He's just so not. He's not good dude.

[James Palmer]

He's not used to everyone. Everyone in that Patriots locker, we'd always ask me, like, where you been? Like, he wanted to know what other stops.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah, yeah.

[James Palmer]

Recently he's like, where you been? What stops you?

[Diana Rossini]

He's probably just trying to get intel. He didn't really like you.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, it's all. It's all strategic. And I thought he crushed that call. Okay, I got one more question before we bounce, and I have to ask this because you were at that game. You were in Philadelphia. You didn't get to do the show because you had a bit of a tum tum issue. It sounded actually way worse than I described it, but I want to keep it clean for the show. That Eagles offense just did not perform in that game. Kevin Petullo has now been let go of his offensive coordinator duties. Let's just make sure because it was laid out to me in a text from a source that he hasn't been fired, just that could possibly happen, but just relieved of his offensive coordinator duties. What have you heard about a potential landing an OC there? Because there's some people in that building. I've talked to Diane. That said, I'm curious how appealing our job is as an offensive coordinator coming in. Mainly because of what Kellen Moore did two years ago. Yes. Led them to the super bowl, then ends up getting another job. But it was not Kellen Moore. His offense, you were seeing it in a very different fashion. And other offensive minds saw that, I'm told around the league because he couldn't run the things he wanted to run because of the way things are set up personnel wise was awesome. I think I got him the job. That's my point.

[Diana Rossini]

He didn't care what anyone in Philly thought or directed him to do. Kellen just ran that offense the way he wanted to do it, and it worked out really well. And I think the pattern that you're seeing in Philadelphia that works for them is somebody outside of the building, somebody that's experienced part of the Sirianni group. And that's not a slight against Sirianni. It's just. It's actually kind of human nature. When it's someone that's close to you, you tend to over saturate them, over inform them you're in their ear. You're so comfortable with them because you're so close that I think he was. He'd be a little bit more standoffish, a little bit more willing to hand it over to somebody that isn't someone in a close circle. And so names I'm watching for. I want. You know, I'm interested to see if Philly's gonna put in for Mike McDaniel, the former Dolphins head coach. Clay Kubiak is a name that I've been hearing that would. Would definitely make that locker room happy based on talking to some guys in there. Obviously, this was not a surprise. Everyone knew this was coming. I just think the fact that they're keeping him on the staff tells you to the relationship that he has with Nick Sirianni. Right. Usually After a season like that. And look, we could do a whole show about this. I've talked to enough players in that locker room, and it is hard to find people blame to. It's hard to find players that blame Kevin Patillo. So I don't think he's completely free of any issues. I think he's made plenty mistakes. I'm sure if he was with us right now, he would say that, but I didn't. Especially on Sunday night when I talked to the guys. I didn't get this whole, Kevin's got to go. Not at all. In fact, the opposite. I got more. It's not his fault. But if there is a team that needs a just refresh, recharge, revamp in every way this offseason, it is that Eagles team. They are too talented to not be playing in the playoffs.

[James Palmer]

Very good. Like a reboot, one of those. Like, hey, you know what I need to do? I just need to unplug it and plug it back in, and then it's going to just blow on it low in the cartridge.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah.

[James Palmer]

Let's get Super Contra up and running. I don't know why it works. Maybe because Nintendo had a really strange situation where it went in and locked down. Mine only works. Mine still works now from 1988 with a game Genie in it, and it holds it tighter so I don't have to blow in the cart.

[Diana Rossini]

Have you ever gotten an iv, by the way?

[James Palmer]

Yeah, I did this summer. Yeah. Like a whole bag of saline today. Yeah.

[Diana Rossini]

A million bucks.

[James Palmer]

Yeah, because you were. You were down and out yesterday, lady.

[Diana Rossini]

Yeah, you were grossing here. But we're back, baby. We're back.

[James Palmer]

Yeah. Here she is. She's back. She's gonna be back tomorrow when we do a show Thursday. You gonna be with us Thursday night? I don't know. Maybe. Maybe I can convince you to.

[Diana Rossini]

We'll see.

[James Palmer]

We'll make a road trip around the NFL on Thursday like we do every single Thursday. But, yeah, we got tons more coming up. Diana's going to continue to dig. She's back. She got the iv. She's ready to roll. And we're going to have a show for you tomorrow as well, with much more on what's going on with a lot of these openings we didn't get to. These other offensive coordinator openings you mentioned. Greg Roman didn't get to it. There's still the. The Bucks are still looking for somebody. Like, the Lions are still looking for somebody.

[Diana Rossini]

Busy time of year, man.

[James Palmer]

Unreal. All right, well, tell Kev you'll see him in a month. And I'll see you, though, tomorrow.

[Diana Rossini]

See you tomorrow.

[James Palmer]

See.

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[Diana Rossini]

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[Adam Grant]

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