B (4:17)

Yeah, I mean that is disappointing.

A (4:19)

I mean when you get, I mean in this league you got to learn how to stack wins and to be able to carry that momentum over, you have to do, I mean it started at practice. You know, we, I probably just being honest like this probably was one of.

B (4:33)

Our first week of practice came out flat Thursday.

A (4:37)

Things like that in that nature too. Sometimes things carry over and when you, when you get in this league, you.

B (4:44)

Have to prove it every, every week and reprove it.

A (4:47)

You know, you got to go out there and keep proving yourself. Your team that you could, you can win this lead. And you know, we didn't do that on all three phases. And you know, today was bad football. You know, we, we didn't, we didn't play good today at all. So that was yesterday. And Jeffrey Simmons says that publicly. Oftentimes that carries a lot of weight in the decision makers that are making those decisions. So they did sit down with Brian Callahan, informed him that he was going to be relieved of his duties. And he is the first head coach fired in the 2025 season after again, a 419 record. I'd like to welcome in my friend Jordan Rodrique joining me now here on this first opening block. I have Mike Sando later, Jordan, we're going to talk all the negative things with him. He's got the Sunday scaries. You and I have the other stuff because it was. What was your take of Sunday? It wasn't our greatest week of football, I think, of the NFL season, but you and I are going to find some things to talk about here.

C (5:47)

Yeah, I, I mean, the morning window got more fun than I think people expected. And then the afternoon window was quieter than people expected. Right. So, like that, that was interesting to me. We had some really fun second halves and fourth quarters, especially. That Panthers Cowboys game was probably one of my favorite games of the weekend. And who knew, right?

A (6:06)

Here we go. Dave Palace.

C (6:07)

It was so fun watching. Yeah, like watching like a quasi shootout between two teams that I don't think a lot of people expected that one to be interesting. But yes, it was a kind of a strange. There was like an hour, you know, I was at the studio over with NFL Daily and there's like an hour extra time to prep before we started recording the recap. And we were kind of like, what do we do?

A (6:27)

We can go right now if you want. I pretty much have it. I know what happened today. It was. Listen, we're going to start off with what happened at the end. We're going to start with the Lions and the Chiefs. The game that everybody was kind of waiting for going, all right, the Lions have looked really good during the last couple of weeks. The Chiefs, I think they're building something. But let's see what happens when they get a test from the Lions coming off that loss to the Jags and they go out and they win 30 17. And I think we saw this offense, I think over the last couple of weeks with Patrick Mahomes start to find its footing. I'm curious what you've seen from that Chiefs offensive unit. And I Believe you're going to say we all jumped to some conclusions here. Probably.

C (7:09)

Yeah. Well, I don't think. I mean, clearly you didn't, James, because it sounds like. Because honestly, and that's what, you know, I noticed too, is you could see the pieces starting to get put together. I think that this was dramatically different than what even the Chiefs had planned to start the season. Starting with Xavier Worthy getting that like freak accident, injury. Injuries happen. Right. But you could tell right out of the gate how big of a factor he was supposed to be in their offense. And not just, you know, what fantasy football people look at targets and receptions and touchdowns and all of that, but the way that he was going to unlock different layers of this passing game, the way that we've been like, you know, grading on the Chiefs to do this for years and years and years. It's a little bit more complicated obviously than it looks. But having him actually affect the passing layers and the passing contours that they're creating, short, middle and intermediate and a lot of the screen game that we know Andy Reid loves to deploy and just having guys back is all great. It's all starting to come to life. And it has been the last couple weeks. First and foremost, because they are protecting Patrick Mahomes better than he has been protected in years. Not just weeks, not just seasons, James years. Even with Jalen Moore, their highest paid backup, probably the high, I think the highest paid backup offensive lineman in the NFL filling in for Josh Simmons in Sunday night's game. Still great protection of Patrick Mahomes and that's what pieces you've been starting to see put together over the last few weeks.

A (8:41)

Yeah, I think you're spot on with Worthy's return and this is what they wanted to have happen right from the start of the season. But in these three games with him back with his 37, 30 and 28 points, I think they're putting up more points. Obviously with him you have to defend every blade of grass. You mentioned the screen game, how they stretch you horizontally with Worthy and some of this speed has been brilliant. But I, I agree with you that it's what's happened in front of Patrick Mahomes that has changed things and you're starting to see some continuity come in this line that had some questions. I talked to some people there. They were kind of like, Trey Smith isn't playing up to that contract in the early portion of the season. He's playing better. We know how good Creed Humphrey is and, and now when they're playing that well, in front of Patrick Mahomes. What are we seeing? We're seeing them getting under center more. They're running the play action, the bootlegs, all of that different stuff offensively can happen and be more effective with the way that they're playing. I wanted to mention this because when I was on with Diana last week, we're talking about the rarities that happen against the Jaguars. And I made a list and I went back to that list now after this game. And I just wanted to say it to you, because it was 13 penalties for 109 yards. That just doesn't happen to a Chiefs team. They do not get penalized in this game. They don't have a penalty in this game that's fixed. The undisciplined play on defense that they had where they just didn't seem as prepared, Jordan, as we usually see them. You know, by Steve Spagnolo, you saw them prepared in this game specifically for some of the screen stuff that Detroit wanted to do. They were flying around, shedding blocks, doing things that you're used to seeing from that defense. And the third one was complimentary football. That's what we love seeing from. From this team. And what happened at the end of the Jaguars game? They go down, they score, they kick the ball out of bounds. Just not good. Complimentary football gives the Jags a better field position. They score this game. I look at what happened around the half, they end up, they're down. What are they down? 10, 6? They get the ball with under three minutes to go. They score, they get a three and out. Halftime. They score and flip the entire game. With that complimentary style of football, what do you expect this offense will look like with the return of Rashi Rice now that the suspension is up? Are we going to another level? Are we now the favorites in the afc?

C (10:43)

Well, you better have two good corners and a fast safety.

B (10:46)

Okay.

A (10:46)

And with the injuries in the secondary around the NFL right now, that's great.

D (10:49)

Okay.

C (10:51)

Yeah. So also part of. You know why I commend the Lions for how they played the Chiefs last night with getting a lot of that speed and space specifically back, because the Lions are on like they're five and six deep at corner right now. And that can't go unsaid, I don't think. But with the Chiefs, it's. It's everything. And you mentioned it. Everyone always thinks that this is like a football cliche. It kind of is. But it's really true that every blade of grass thing. Right. And the way that that this works is first of all, thank God Patrick Mahomes is no longer the leading rusher of this team. The run game is still not great, but it's happening more under center, which is good, which gets the play action and the bootlegs going, which helps Patrick Mahomes move his spot. Patrick Mahomes moving his spot unlocks an entire new level of misdirection that not only can create explosive pass plays down the field, which Rasheed Rice will really help with, but also the entire width of the field is now available. Because we know he can make throws across his body. We know that in a second he will shovel pass out to the flat for a screen that's as well blocked as you'll see because all of these receivers buy in on that, even the little guys. And you'll also see him just basically force the flow of a defense to move back and forth a little more than they were able to. And that really helps when you have speed players back and explosive playmaking players. We're seeing again, we're seeing this come together in pieces and we know that the offensive line now is playing well enough and disciplined enough, to your point, James, that they can move and create those types of pre snap misdirections and at snap misdirections without getting flagged for it. You need a game where it feels good like that in order to keep kind of building that forward. I thought it was interesting they said on the broadcast last night that Creed Humphrey was one of the people that had like sort of a come to come to Jesus moment with the rest of the line in the locker room and got the offense hyped up and got the, you know, got everyone really on board and hyped up. You don't usually see that from a center. They're kind of keep to themselves in their own position rooms. But it was interesting and I think with Rasheed Rice adding that horizontal or that vertical threat, but also all the horizontal movement with two of these players that can do all of these different things, that is hell for a defense.

A (13:06)

I love that you gave that creed a little bit of love there because I talked to some people before the game that were. There are people a part of this organization that did not know what was happening with Josh Simmons and that he was going to be departing because of a personal matter and not playing in this game. So it was very last minute for the adjustments that they needed to make up front. And you're exactly right with the shallow crosses that Rashi Rice is so good at, those need some time sometimes. And the way Patrick is moving back there and then moving his spot I thought was a great point. So I think all that coming together is really going to be interesting for defenses that hopefully they're healthy when they're facing the Kansas City Chiefs. On to the Pittsburgh Steelers and the 4 and 1 Pittsburgh Steelers. Jordan and everybody I believe is under.500 in the division. It is an interesting, interesting AFC North. Do you believe what we're seeing from Aaron Rodgers in the Steelers offense is sustainable? And we will continue to see this group grow and succeed as this season goes on.

C (14:11)

At his advanced age, like, this is the that was the best game he's played in years, honestly. And yes, the entire Achilles tearing thing, minor blip on the timeline there for Aaron Rodgers, but the way that they were moving him on someone like the long boots was telling to me because he seemed really comfortable throwing on the move in ways that he wasn't even when he first came back from the Achilles. And I think that's understandable considering you just had a ligament pop off of the back of your leg.

A (14:43)

Stop talking about Makes my Achilles always feel weird when people talk about that.

C (14:47)

I have a twinge. As I was talking like my, my entire body started trolling, wiggling my ankles right now.

A (14:53)

Just like thinking about the Achilles, I'm.

D (14:55)

Like.

A (14:57)

Change the subject, but stay on the subject.

C (15:00)

Yeah, exactly. Well, so, okay, so they're running the ball better back to back 100 yards rushing games, which was oddly a rarity in a from a team that really wants to be physical and uses a lot of the heavier personnel that they have. But also it really helped Aaron Rodgers set up like we kind of talked about, just talked about with Pat Mahomes. He could move a spot and he can make a throw from any, any arm angle that you want, but you really needed to get his legs in action to help create some of that downfield passing game. You have to give him that time on that boot action to be able to create that downfield. And you saw like I saw angry Rodgers come back out, but not angry at other people, which we've seen a lot of the last couple of years, but angry at himself when he missed DK Metcalf on that deep pass attempt. It was a vastly underthrown football. Something you're not necessarily thinking, okay, Aaron Rodgers may be the test of time starting to wear, wear in, but then follows that right up with again moving off of his spot and moving his launch point and finding DK Metcalf for what actually will work in this offense. And that's the yards after catch play that's creating after the catch for all of these guys from the tight ends that they love to use to the running back in the past game. Jalen Warren is great after the catch and then. And Aaron Rodgers just has to understand too that that feels good, winning feels good, but also that creating those types of plays less so, the deep air yards, balls, I think that is a more sustainable way for this Steelers offense to play. And so between that and the life and the sort of like, I don't really care about the penalties the defense got yesterday or Sunday because I thought they were playing more inspired than I've seen in the last couple of weeks. And certainly getting guys back helps. I think putting all of these things together at once bodes very well. Even though it is still very early. But it bodes well because of the advantage they have in the division.

A (16:48)

Yeah, they really do. And I love that you talked about the deep shots because that's something that just has lacked. I'll give them credit for the short passing game. I think they've been effective with it. I think he's gotten rid of the football very, very quickly. And obviously they're utilizing how quick of a release Aaron Ott has, how quick his mind is pre snap. A lot of these throws to dk, and you mentioned the yards after the catch, that he leads the NFL in terms of the receiver group in yards after the catch. And that's because a lot of this stuff is they're putting him closer to the formation, more condensed sets. And Aaron's seeing it quick and he has a unique set of skills. The unique set of skills are he's massive and he's really fast and not a lot of people have that. And they hit DK with these little, you know, just a rock step and the ball's out and it's quick and they've utilized that. I was wondering if this offense was going to continue to move the football if they weren't going to take any shots downfield. And how is everybody going to start coming up in this. And now that they showcase that a little bit in this game, I think that helps this offense move. What also stood out to me is I mentioned how quickly he got rid of the football coming into this game. The Browns had 13 sacks without blitzing this season. He was not sacked in this game. That's the second time this season he wasn't sacked. I mean, that is. That stands out to me. Honestly. He's moving a little better. Like you said. And at the same time is this line that had some question marks but has some talent coming together in front of him. We'll see. I was concerned about the defense at the beginning of the season with the number of points they gave up and I think just the first two weeks. Jordan, do you feel you touched on it real quick, but do you feel like this is back to a Steelers defense? And I just got to say this. How much does Jalen Ramsey just feel like a Steeler now that you've seen seen him playing as a Steeler?

C (18:30)

I love it so much actually. It's a great point because I don't think that they should be a Steelers defense the way that we're used to seeing a Steelers defense. We're used to seeing a Steelers defense be very, very good, but not really evolve very much, especially down the season. And that's been part of the issue. The offensive issues have been the issue. Right, but that's also been a part of it too. Is, is that defense not changing or not being as, as, as. As quick to ad. Evolve or morph into these like sort of shape shifting defenses that we see especially in the post season where you do need to design bespoke game plans for different teams and you need to play more matchup based football especially, I mean not even just in the postseason now. Teams are doing it in December. And so I think that having Jalen Ramsey is a really important key to unlock that. He's made plays on the ball obviously coming back from, you know, having a little bit of a hamstring issue, but he's made splash plays in nearly every single game right out of the gate. And he's playing a hybrid position for them that a lot of teams use, but not a lot of teams are able to do it with Jalen Ramsey. And so that star position, the safety corner, he can move outside. The intent of it is to make him an unavoidable football player. So he will either travel to cut off some of your motion, the routes that are attached to your motions, or he will stay right in the middle of the field as sort of this like slot safety who is going to make the quarterback try to throw to the perimeter, or you can try to throw at him if you want. I personally wouldn't. Yeah, and he's a really good tackler still. He's one of the best when he's playing corner, he's one of the best tackling corners coming down from the perimeter into the flats in the NFL still. And when he's playing Safety. He tackles like a safety should tackle. So I think that this is interesting because it moves them forward in the matchup based football element. It's a team that, you know whether or not this can sustain and I think it will. And particularly because of what they're dealing with in their, their own division, they have such an advantage there at this point. They're putting themselves in position to play different styles of defense based on how their opponents want to run and pass the ball. And that when this group is healthy, that is what I'm starting to see a little bit more from this defense between Jalen, but also a lot of the other guys coming back and having Nick Herbig playing the way that he is. I just think that this is a team that wants to be more evolutionary. Right. Wants it and they have the skill sets to do it. And now go do it. Especially after we get through October, November.

A (21:02)

That's fascinating. That's great because there were a lot of questions there in Pittsburgh about Minka Fitzpatrick and was he slowing down with age and how was his role fitting into what they want to do. And I think what you're saying now is brilliant and we're going to look back at it on the back end of the season where we've seen them just kind of get stagnant as a defense the last couple years. We'll see if they continue to do this. Let's get to Sam Darnold before we go, because I have loved what I've seen from Sam up there in the Pacific Northwest. I mean, it is just, it is just super fun to watch. And guess what? They protected the ball against the Jaguars. Nobody can do that, but apparently they were able to do it. What have you seen from Sam so far working in this Clint Kubiak offense that that gets you excited, that this is the type of player that it wasn't a one year thing last year and that this is now who Sam Darnold is.

C (21:50)

Yeah, I love it. I think we both, the second you said his name, we both just started grinning. James, because it's fun to watch people who've been through some stuff do grit.

A (21:59)

It's so true.

C (22:00)

We love the human part of it too. And that's just awesome to me. You know, we gave Kevin o' Connell a lot of, I think rightfully so credit for what he designed with Sam Darnold. And I always call, say this about Kevin, like just the relentless and sort of radical positivity that he instills into the quarterback, believing them, not, not coddling them. But believing in them to where they start to believe in themselves. I think all of that should be commended. I think this offense is a better fit for Sam Darnold. This Clint Kubiak offense is a better fit for Sam Darnold because they are in 12 personnel almost 70% of the time. So 20. The two tight ends, they only need to layer their route concepts to two different receivers. So he's got one, two. If you want to hit a receiver, you got two reads. And they're layering the routes to where they're sort of setting these like very, very long pick plays. They're not pick guys. Don't aggregate me. Yeah, yeah. But they're setting these like really long defense twisting plays up either in the short game or in the intermediate or the longer game. With the best receiver in football right now, most explosive receiver certainly in football right now outside of Puka Nakua, and that's Jackson, Smith and Jigba. And they're also setting that up with, with Cooper cup, who can do just about anything you ask of him, including dive in and grind it out on the on the run game. So I think that this the way that they set things up and then you have the tight ends that are steady and people keep forgetting to cover AJ Barner for some reason. And they, they are just like. It just fits the run game. Even when it's not efficient, they keep at it. They don't abandon it. It is all of these things set up answers for the quarterback, set up confidence builders for the quarterback. They're protecting him well. They give him a run game that is physical even when it is not super high percentage of success rate and they're trusting him to throw the ball and they're giving him multiple answers out of heavier personnel targets that are very friendly to a quarterback. And I think that all of those things, it just works and it's fun to watch and they're for real. And it's also like Sam is making throws. You know, they're giving him options, but he's holding safeties with his eyes. He's looking off defenders because he knows what he's supposed to do. And it's like this confidence that's mutual between him and the scheme and you love to see it. It's raising all tides over there.

A (24:22)

Before I get to JSN because I have some notes on him that I wanted to get to. I just thought of this while you were saying it. Do you remember last year in New Orleans, those first couple of weeks where Clint Kubiak was doing a lot of what you're describing. They were in a lot of these 12 formations and you had just two receivers going downfield and they were explosive as all hell in those first couple of weeks. And then I think they had a number of injuries that just kind of derailed a lot of what they were doing offensively. But this is a really big staple of what Clint can do and how he can make life easy on his quarterback by setting things up the way that he sets it up. And I was talking to somebody just last night, a coach, and they were just like, he just looks so comfortable. Like, he just looks so comfortable in how he's operating this and the way they're setting it up for him. Okay, now to jsm. Do you remember when. And you covered the Rams for a long time and when they got Cooper cup, everybody thought, well, isn't this the same player? Like, why would you want both guys that play kind of on the inside and what are you going to do with this? I love that John schneider and Mike McDonald had a plan for how they were going to do this and that it also coincides with the way the league is adapting. He's playing outside now. JSN is a number one, I think, like 75% of his snaps or something like that. He's playing, playing further outside, but he's also still moving around. He's still playing in a little bit more condensed spots. He's playing at the numbers, maybe not outside the numbers. And do you think it's interesting the way that this role you mentioned, Puka Nkua, I put him in kind of the same vein to where these number one receivers are playing the position a little differently than we saw number one receivers play it 10 years ago, where they just sit outside and we're going to see what we can do. The way that he has been moved around, the way PUK has moved around, I think they had a distinct plan on how they wanted to use Cooper cup and use jsn. And I think it's been fascinating to watch him more yards through six games than any player in Seahawks history. Have you seen kind of this evolution as well in these type of players that are. That are playing the wide receiver and the number one wide receiver this way? Jordan?

C (26:28)

Yeah. Conversely, it's kind of what annoys me about all the opining coming out of Arizona right now is everyone's mad because Marvin Harrison Jr. Is not getting, you know, he's playing like the perimeter guy and he's not being. He's not a true X Because he's not getting the volume or whatever. That's. That's not how this is played anymore for years. This is. You see it because this is, this is not a new phenomenon. This is the cycle of football that has been going on for years and years and years. It's. It's like you go from, okay, now we're going to have these power slot players. It's a. Nate Tice coined the phrase power slot where you have a Cooper cup who's playing in the slot, but he's a big receiver. Cooper Cup's a lot larger than people think. I don't know why people still think he's like a smaller guy. He's not. And, and you have him playing like this position that they call the F, which is in the slot, but you're also a tight end, but you're also a fullback in the blocking structure on the run game, but you're also a perimeter receiver. And everything else flows around where you are at on the field. And the rest of the roster is built, the passing game especially is built in complimentary layers to what you can do. And that requires versatility from multiple players on the offense. And I think that, that when you're looking at someone with JSN's talent now, I don't know if they're calling it the F specifically, it might be Cooper who's still playing that, just a sort of a smaller role than. Than he's used to in that regard. I don't know if they're calling what JSN is doing that because Kubiak and Shanahan tree cyst verbiage is a little bit different with their receivers, but what they're doing with him is very similar to what we've seen. The evolution of these guys who can be a mismatch for all of your middle of the field players from the slot and can also be a mismatch for your perimeter corners on the outside. And you can do both guys. You can have both. It's incredible. Like it's the world of football that we're in now and that's exactly what they're seeing with JSN. I remember two years ago when Mike McDonald was coming in and I was talking to a couple members of that new coaching staff that they were coming in and they were just absolutely blown away by jsn, who was still under the radar at that time and certainly had promising tools and traits and all of that, but maybe at that time still trying to figure out who this player could be. And one of the assistant coaches predicted, and I'm paraphrasing slightly here, but predicted that 2025, if they continue to try to build and they were sidetracked a little bit I think with what Ryan Grubb was doing versus what Clint Kubiak's doing. But if they were going to keep building the way that they wanted to, solid run game, versatile receivers who are also get their stick their faces in the blocking game, good tight ends that fit the scheme, then JSN was going to have a breakout season and be the best receiver in football because of the skill set and the, and the character traits and all of the things that you would want in a star football player. And I think that this is cool. It's like, I love that we're talking about the Seahawks as the most explosive offense in football right now, maybe barring the Colts. Right. What I think I have some. Sam Darnold is. Yeah, and Sam Darnold is fifth in EPA for drop back right now, which go sick. Right. And, and, and it just, it works. And it's like number one in yards per se. Yucks.

B (29:47)

And the couch.

A (29:47)

Right.

C (29:48)

Yeah. And the Seahawks and the Colts, who I know you're gonna talk about later in the show, are two of the most explosive. They're up there with the Lions and the Chiefs in terms of explosive offense. So like, I love that they're in this conversation and part of it is because they had this long term plan for this very special player. They stuck with the plan. They're. They're not deferring to maybe more veteran players and trying to force square pegs into round holes and all of these things. They're maximizing what works around this player as well as his very, very special skill sets as well. And I think that's a sign of a good team.

A (30:23)

I think it's great. I remember going to JSN's Pro Day and a lot of the evaluators were like, I don't have a comp. And man, do people in the NFL panic when they don't have a comp. Right. Jordan? They're like, oh no, I don't know who to comp him to. And because he's built kind of differently, right. He's got this really thick lower half. Guys were telling me. And it's just kind of the way he's built is a little bit differently. But if you have a plan, sometimes outside of the box from what people freak out about can really develop into something special. Right now he's on pace for over 1900 yards for the season. So we'll see what JSN can do within this offense. But it has been fun to watch. It has been fun to have you on the show as always. Coming up, Mike Sando is going to join us. You should just stay and listen to that part, Jordan, when Mike comes on because we're going to do the negatives. Like I told everybody. Mike and I are going to talk about the Sunday scaries, the jets, the Dolphins, the Cardinals. That's all coming up next on Scoop City. Have you heard of Gold's Belly? It's this amazing site that I order from all the time where you can get the most iconic famous foods from restaurants all across the US and they will ship it anywhere across the country. See? Covering the NFL for years and years and years, I go to all these different cities. When I'm covering the super bowl in Miami, I go to Joe's. When I'm at a pro day in Austin, Texas, I get Franklin's Barbecue because these places are so iconic. But, but the problem when I go back home to Denver, I am now miles and miles away from all of my favorite restaurants. Well, with Gold Belly, I had the opportunity to then get them shipped to my house. This has happened multiple times and it's outstanding. The biggest part of this for me is I grew up in Philadelphia. It is home for me. And if you want a taste of home, I have an opportunity to get a Pat's cheesesteak straight from South Philly right there. Wiz wit get it sent to my house and I get it in exactly as it was when I was growing up. It brings back memories. It makes me feel closer to my family. It makes me feel closer to home. So if you're looking for the perfect gift or want to impress your friends and family with an epic meal, the next time you host, go to goldbelly.com and get 20% off your first order with promo code Scoop. That's goldbelly.com code Scoop for 20% off your first order. Think Enterprise software is too costly, too complex and takes too long to get up and running?

D (32:41)

Think again.

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B (34:10)

Yeah, well, I think it starts with.

A (34:12)

The leadership in helping articulate that for the guys. And then what we're expecting out of the guys, right? We're expecting this. Are we getting that? Are we not getting that?

B (34:22)

We have guys showing up to player only meetings late. Guys not showing up to player only meeting.

A (34:28)

Like, there's a lot that goes into that. Do we have to make this mandatory? Do we not have to make this mandatory?

D (34:34)

So.

B (34:35)

So it's, it's a lot of, it's.

A (34:37)

A lot of things of that nature that we got to get cleaned up. And it starts with the little things like that. Now, Mike, you've covered this league for a long time. When you hear that and you see it post game, what's the first thought that goes through your mind and who's probably, I guess you can't tell me who, but do you probably know who you're reaching out to for some thoughts after you see that?

D (35:00)

Oh, for sure, yeah. I mean, and sometimes I'm not even reaching out. Other people are reaching out. Do you see this? You know, in the league, that sort of a thing, you know, And I think the Dolphins have been an easy target because there's a lot of people in the league who look at Mike McDaniel with his, you know, capri pants and just sort of the quirkiness. A lot of sort of old school people in the league have been rolling their eyes at him anyway. And so I think this feeds into the idea that, hey, whatever McDaniel's in his third or fourth year and we're having problems with who's in control of the team. Right. And so there's two levels of the criticism here, I think one is to, hey, you're kind of breaching protocol here, taking this to the media when you've got a C on your chest. You know, I think we saw Andrew Whitworth, we saw some other prominent former players say, what are you doing? You're telling on yourself here. So that's the first reaction. But the second one too is just the context of the team and the perceptions around McDaniel and, and, you know, the idea probably that his strengths are not, you know, everyone gets hired for different reasons. He was brought in to kind of be a nice guy because they had had Brian Flores, who, you know, good coach in his own way, but was hard on everybody and too hard on Tua, you know, and was had it not being a great environment, right. People, people thought it was too New Englandy, just too hard ass. Right. And so you bring in McDaniel to be the opposite of that. But this is one of the axioms or lessons of coaching, maybe parenting too. It's hard to come in and be the nice guy then try to get stern. Right? We were, Joe, we were talking before about her, about our dogs. Wonderful dogs, right. I've got a couple golden retrievers or something, and we love them. We would never strike our dog or, you know, you wouldn't haul off and throw your kid down or something, but they got to sort of know who the boss is too, right? And so I think that just the, the, the way things have unfolded with the Dolphins, where they wanted to get a kinder, gentler sort of coach, but now you're having some leadership issues. And two is probably a little bit of a nicer guy too, right? I mean.

A (37:07)

Oh, yeah.

D (37:07)

He's not, he's not naturally a hard ass type guy who's keeping everybody in line. Right. So I think that we've just sort of reached a point where they're 1 in 5. They haven't gotten through in the playoffs. We've seen their window kind of close. Tyreek Hills out. It's a frustrating time, so I think that's percolating.

A (37:25)

Yeah, I think you're right. And this also connects back to this offseason. Right. And what was a very. It wasn't a secret that we're going to try to get rid of certain players that we think might be a difficult situation in the locker room. We'll try to move on from some of those, we'll try to change this culture within the building. I did the same thing as you, Mike. I talked to a lot of people around the league last night about this, specifically wanted to talk to some veteran players that have been around for a long time. And there were a few things that jumped out at me that I wanted to fire at you that I thought was interesting. One universally, everybody agreed you never talk about what happens inside player only meetings. You just don't do it. And these guys have been around that I talked to for a long time. The second part I thought was interesting where two players separately told me there has to be somebody that he's. He's had it up to here with that. That is they're not just late for the player only meetings, but they're late for everything. And that was a reason the two guys thought, well, that's when the quarterback says something because there's this guy, there's just nothing else we can do. And I've had. And I've had too much. I said at the same time, isn't it on you as the leader to handle that in a different setting? They did admit, probably yes. And maybe this is something that is irked to it to the point that he wanted to say it publicly. We'll see what ends up happening.

D (38:33)

Maybe he wants somebody cut from the team, maybe not or something like that, or just wants some backing from the organization. You never know what's going on behind the scenes. And certainly. And there's always different agendas with teams, every team. So yeah, there's more to this that we don't know. But it's still a bad look, certainly.

A (38:50)

It certainly is and we'll see. What a big part of this that I don't know if it's talked about enough is Tua's future. I mean he's guaranteed $54 million year. And if there's changes, we obviously know the two will most likely be sitting in that quarterback spot in 2026. So it'll be interesting to see what ends up happening and what happens with them at the trade deadline if there's going to be some players heading out of that locker room will be interesting another team. These are the Sunday scaries, Mike. And so that's why we're handling the negative stuff with you because you bring such a pleasant demeanor to us to try to cheer us up with the jets and cheer up jets fans if you can. With with a start to our Sunday that made most people in London go, I'm glad I like soccer And I like our football because it was a rough one for the Jets. What did you make of what happened with this offense and that they're sticking with Justin Fields?

D (39:41)

Well, they owe him $10 million, fully guaranteed next year. So you know, some of these decisions and then they have Tyrod Taylor as a backup. Nothing against Tyrod Taylor, a good backup, but you probably don't want to go 14 games, you know, whatever. They got 12 games. He's not a 12 game starter either. So I just think that it was, it was such a weird decision to, to give Justin Fields that type of a contract. But you know, I think that maybe in this case Aaron Glenn's made his bed because I think that a defensive minded head coach doesn't mind bringing in the hey, let's win with the run game quarterback. It certainly he defended Justin Fields in that division. I think Justin Fields had 200 yard rushing game games against Aaron Glenn. So I don't think that's a move that's made without the head coach, the defensive mind of the head coach who wants to win a certain way being on board with it. So I think it's up to Aaron Glenn to find a, find a way to make this work better than it is. And I would say this, I think Justin Fields has not been terrible the whole season. You know, and they put up some points, you know, at in different games this season. I think they've played a generally difficult slate of opposing quarterbacks. You know, I know Aaron Rodgers isn't at his best, but they played some other really good guys. So I just sort of feel like they're going to have to kind of just wet it. I think Aaron Glenn's demeanor is good for that. That market's difficult. We've already seen some stuff stirred up with players and do they believe in him? Obviously the end to half stuff doesn't help you when you have that stuff swirling. But I do think Aaron Glenn has the demeanor to handle this. I think I wrote in the column he sounds like he's built for this. So it's really just a matter of can they ride their way out and not get caught up in all of the, the narratives and then you know, just you, it can't be that bad with your quarterback every week. And I'll say this, it hasn't. So you know, I understand why they're sticking with Fields, but I don't understand why they may gave him the contract that makes it so that they sort of have to stick with them.

A (41:46)

Yeah. And they weren't the only team that was interested. I mean, Pittsburgh was interested in bringing him back. Not at the price. You mentioned that the jets ended up going and paying, but there was that Arthur Smith did like about Justin Fields that he thought he could work with when they were looking at different options before they landed on Aaron Rodgers. And I also am curious what the Broncos learned about a mobile quarterback and facing Jalen Hurts the week before. I just think their style of play as a defense and handling a running quarterback was really, really good. And that's one of the best defensive units in all of football, specifically up front and how they can cage the quarterback in nine sacks is nine sacks sacks. You mentioned going into halftime and specifically that is Garrett Wilson. Then I think after the game, I thought it was interesting with Garrett kind of saying maybe we should just play with nothing to lose. I'm reading that as a receiver going, maybe we should just throw it up to me and I can get some touches. I can kind of see that as well. But I thought it was interesting in your piece talking about the contracts that they gave before the season to both Sauce Gardner and Garrett Wilson.

B (42:44)

You can look at it on one.

A (42:45)

Side of the coin of going, we're going to try to establish a culture and sign our players early and show that you're homegrown and you play well, you stay here. Right. That's kind of what Darren Mujee came from with George Payton. But it was an interesting take in the article as well, that you could look at it from another side of the coin also.

D (43:01)

Yeah. Which, which was, hey, what have these guys done for you? And you paid them. You paid them like top five players. Are they top five? Right. And so it's interesting, I got a text from another front office executive today saying, hey, you know, enjoyed the column, but I think, you know, it's easy to pile on the jets. And there is another side to those, those deals, you know, when you're doing them. And so I can see why they like, like, let's just say this morning they hadn't done those deals. Are they then fighting a bigger battle at 06 with those guys, not just being a little bit frustrated, but like questioning whether they want to be there? Right. And is that another level of headache that. That's a, that's a. The flip side of it. But yeah, one of the takes in my piece was just like, why are bad teams go doing early deals without getting like a break on those deals? Right. It wasn't like they got them at a super nice rate. They went high for a couple of guys who haven't won anything. Not that it's their fault, but this team, you got to be selective and careful about who you pay and when you come in and just pay guys that haven't had success as part of, in the team context, there can be a downside to that, too.

A (44:18)

Yeah. It's not like I mentioned Muji coming from George Payton. It's not like everybody in Denver in that front office is going, man, did we really get Nick Bonito on this deal? Did we really sign this early deal on Nick Bonito? That's a good contract that you do early when you're starting to turn your corner in terms of an organization like the Broncos are with Sean Payton and that group, the Cardinals. It was an interesting game in Indianapolis to say the least. We have orbital fractures pre game. We have concussions pre game. Just unbelievable. I don't know, Mike, before I get to that, actually, I do want to ask you, have you ever seen anything like this in pre game of a game before?

D (44:53)

No. At first I was amused, you know, and I thought, wait a minute, these are human beings getting hurt. So I mean, it's, you know, but it's crazy. I've never seen, Yes, I think we've seen, seen someone get hurt in pre game. That type of thing has happened before. But to have them be two guys and have it be a concussion and then, you know, a band breaking your orbital, I mean, yeah, you know, I've got one of those, I've got a little, you know, pull up bar over here with the, the, with one of those things you could do, you know.

A (45:22)

Yeah.

D (45:22)

And I'm like, you know, I, I, I.

A (45:24)

Did you work out a little differently this morning, Mike?

D (45:26)

Being like, yeah, I'm gonna watch out for those bands, you know, I mean, my gosh, it just seems so fluky. But yeah, that was a weird part of it. And then the game itself was weird, you know, to have to have the, you know, the Cardinals playing without Kyler Murray and putting up over 400 yards leading through three quarters and then ultimately cardinaling it here. Four straight losses for them by a combined nine points. You know, it's like they're not as bad as their record, but you kind of, as Bill Parshel said, eventually you sort of are what your record is. So really tough situation for them with the coach in his third year coming off the $100,000 fine. They've got some, they're going to have some decisions to make there.

A (46:09)

I think you're exactly right. We've seen Jonathan Galen Gannon improve this group each of the last three years when we're in year three, like you mentioned, but you're seeing the way they're playing and they, you know, improved in the win column in each of the first two years. I remember talking to people around the league, even last year and even in that first year, it was, I don't like playing the Cardinals. They play hard for them. They're a physical team in a sense of the way Jonathan Gannon has him playing. But you mentioned, how do people around the league and yourself included, think about this fourth quarter when you're a negative 25 point differential team in the fourth quarter? Are you just getting almost there and your team is close or are you losing these games at the end and it's a concern?

D (46:48)

Oh, it's definitely a concern. What's interesting about it is I think it's always been held against Kyler Murray as someone who doesn't finish, doesn't handle two minute well and that sort of thing. But Kyler Murray didn't play in this game. So I've sort of set this Colts game aside against this, this Cardinal game aside against the Colts, because I think it is in a different category when you have your backup quarterback and I almost give you credit for going on the road four in one team that's amped up, that's really balanced, you know, has an efficient quarterback with a good run game, a good defense, and you're there at the end, you're leading. I, I feel like under normal circumstances you're saying, hey, that's an impressive Cardinal 1 performance on the road. And so I'm going to set that one aside. I just, I think the other three that you're losing are a bigger concern to me, to losing all those than going on the road and really laying it on the line and, and being right there with a good team when you have your backup quarterback should ideally be something you could build on.

A (47:43)

Yeah, let's hope too. And I, I just got the sense in the early portion of that game that Marvin Harrison Jr. Was going to have himself an afternoon back where dad played in and he goes out with the concussion early. You're really thin at the running back spot. It was, I think, somewhat impressive in some measures about the way they went out and played. We'll see how the rest of the season kind of plays out because I think our eyes are a little bit on the Cardinals and how this thing kind of goes with Kyler Murray and Jonathan Gannon. Mike, appreciate it. Enjoy your Monday get a chance to breathe here. Spend some time for yourself and we'll chat with you again soon.

D (48:15)

Thank you. Really enjoyed it. Awesome.

A (48:17)

Thanks, Mike. Coming up, James Boyd's gonna join us, talking to us about that Colts offense. What is working? What is not working? What part of it does he say is not getting talked about enough? Coming up next on Scoop City.

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A (50:27)

All right, welcome back to Scoop City on a Monday. I'm James Palmer. We had to bring in James Boyd for this because we don't see this very often. James, we're going to start. Even though The Colts won 31 27, they have the best record in the AFC. We have to talk about pre game. I've never seen anything like this. How did you find out? Take me inside. Kind of like inside the big barn. The roof was Open, which was great. And how you found out about Anthony Richardson and Trevarius Ward, what happened.

B (51:01)

Yeah, so I'll admit, James, I am not someone who gets to the game super duper early, but I did get there before the inactives come out, which is an hour and a half before kickoff. And when the enact this came out, the big news was supposed to be, oh, A.D. mitchell is inactive. We had kind of assumed he was probably going to be benched formally this time with Alec Pierce turning to the LINEUP Considering the blunder 80 Mitchell had in LA against the Rams dropped the ball before the goal line. But then we see Anthony Richardson. Everyone goes, wait, what? And we hear from the Colts PR that they will tell us something in a few minutes. And we're waiting and waiting and waiting. And then they finally released that he had a pregame injury involving a stretching band before the game. And then from there it was like, okay, well what is the extent of the injury? And we didn't, we weren't able to find that out until after the game when Shane Stocking comes out there after a big win, moved to 5 and 1 on the year and he says, oh, by the way, Anthony Richardson has an orbital fracture. And you're like, wait, what? Like that is because in my mind I'm thinking, okay, did the band hit you in the eye? Did you get like a scrape or a cut or something?

A (52:04)

Scratch?

B (52:04)

Right, no. Yeah, James, you literally have to react like, oh, he broke his face. That is literally what an orbital fracture is. And so that was the, the big news, you know, coming out of inactives. And then maybe about 45 minutes before kickoff, we get word that your various ward isn't out there on the field warming up. We're not seeing him, you know, do his thing. And you know, fans start sending you stuff. You see photos and stuff from Twitter and it's like, oh, oh, by the way, here's my Twitter slash X photo of him on the ground. What happened? Do you know anything else? And then we found out that he ran into Drew Ogletree, the tight end for the Colts, accidentally and he gets knocked out of the game. His second, his second concussion actually this season. So wild start to that game, Wild pre game before the start of the game officially. And yeah, just a really unique scene. And a lot of the players told me after the game, after the win, it was kind of unnerving for them to have to rally around those two guys and try to figure out, okay, how do we recalibrate our minds and go out here and Play this violent game that usually during the game someone else would go down.

A (53:08)

Yeah. Did you talk to anybody in the locker room that saw what happened to Anthony Richardson? I mean, because he was inside, essentially the locker room area. Right. And there's other parts to that, but there's a lot of guys get loose inside that, inside that, that area. Did you talk to anybody that. That saw this?

B (53:23)

Yeah, the only one who I believe that I spoke to that had saw what happened to Anthony, and I don't even think, like paying attention to him all that closely was Josh Downs, the wide receiver, who's very good friends with Anthony, you know, same draft class. And so they bonded throughout the years. And he was like, yeah, it was kind of, you know, wild, I think is the word that he used to, you know, see that and experience that. But for many guys, they had known, so they found out, like me and you did. Wait, what happened? You know, through the grapevine, you heard the whispering, the murmurs and things like that. And Zaire Franklin, the Colts team captain defensively, he said he had to kind of rally the troops and tell them, hey, we got a job to do. We understand we're hurting for our guys, but, you know, no one's going to feel sorry for us when we gonna get out there on the field. So, again, very unique set of circumstances that you just don't see every day. And for the Colts sake, they hope they never see it again.

A (54:10)

Yeah, you keep getting tested, the coast keep getting tested and they keep passing these tests. This is another one that's kind of one you're not expecting. But the. The team groups finds themselves in a dog fight with Jacoby Bursin, set revenge game that I don't know if they knew they were expecting.

B (54:26)

What.

A (54:26)

What did you see differently from this defense? Is there a concern from you, from what you saw now that you're going to have Justin Herbert next week?

B (54:37)

There is certainly a big level of concern just with the amount of injuries you've had in secondary, the attrition you've had at that position. I mean, you came into the year feeling like cornerback was one of your deepest positions, and then you already lost a ton of them throughout the year, and then you lose one before the game yesterday and then by it happening before the game, but sort of on game day now, you have to wonder if Javarius Mooney Ward is going to be out for next week's game against the Chargers in la. So that is a huge loss potentially right there. They did play undrafted rookie Jonathan Edwards in Ward's place and he got burned a lot. I mean, Jacoby Brissette had a field day against him and he looked like an undrafted rookie. I mean, the guy made the team. He's kind of a, a underdog story. But you know, underdog stories don't always have the happy triumphant ending. And so I do think it's a reason to be concerned about this cold secondary because the amount of injuries that have piled up, it's hard to really find adequate replacements. And then on top of that, I think the linebacker group, beyond, you know, the injuries to the secondary, they've been suspect all year. I know Zaire Franklin's coming off a second team all Pro appearance, but he's never been all that great in coverage. And then you look at the rest of their group, they've just been shuffling linebackers in and out of that rotation. And they just recently signed Jermaine Pratt. He starts for them and starts next. As I hear Franklin in this past game, he didn't look all that great either. Had a team high in tackles, but I mean, how many of those tackles were impact plays? And then lastly the pass rush just not getting home. Lay out to Latu, you were the first defensive player drafted a couple years ago and you've got one sack through the first six games of the year. That's just not going to cut it. So I mean outside of deforest Buckner and Grover Stewart, the on on the interior defensive line, there's not much happening up front.

A (56:20)

Yeah, well, they keep putting up points. That's helping them, right? They're putting up a ton of points. I was looking at it. They scored 30 points or more in four games this year and 29, I think it was against Denver. So almost at 30. They scored 30 or more points in three games last year. I mean this is a dramatic difference in the way Shane Steichen and Daniel Jones are running this offense. I wanted to get your take on. What stands out to me is their ability to throw the football on first down because of the way teams know Jonathan Taylor is back there and that they can run the football as well as they can. I, I is there a sense in this offense that they are very good at running the ball when you think they may throw and throwing the ball when you think they may run?

B (57:03)

Yeah, I think our guy Ted Win here at the Athletic tweeted something throughout the game saying like Shane Steichen is the best in the league at getting his players wao wide ass open. And that's basically what he's done. And so when you talk about, you know, what they're scheming up on first down in particular, you know, Shane Steichen and Daniel Jones have both been very coy. They don't want to give away any trade secrets. Right. Or anything that's going on. But that is true. They've been dominant on first down, which gets them into those second and shorts, those third and shorts, which allows you to have your full menu at your disposal, whether it's running the ball, whether it's lining up Tyler Warren in the backfield, whether it's throwing a Tyler Warren or a plethora of your wide receiver receivers. So I do think that this offense has been clicking at all cylinders and one of the biggest reasons why they're clicking on first down in particular is that yeah, Shank can scheme up the play call and he can get a guy open, but can you deliver the ball? And Daniel Jones, unlike what they've had in the past with these quarterbacks that have come to come here through on like these one year deals, he's on one year deal too, but he keeps playing like this, he might be here a little bit longer. He's someone who's been on time and on target and giving these guys a chance not only catch the ball but do something great afterwards. So that to me is what stands out about this offense, unlike last year, is that you're not really seeing receivers have to do much besides just, you know, run, get open and catch an easy pass. He's putting it right on him. I mean, he had a mistake yesterday early in the game, threw a pick that was probably his worst throw of the season, but bounced right back again and let him on two, you know, big touchdown drives late in the game. And I believe that was yesterday Mark Daniel Jones's first fourth quarter touchdown game winning drive since 2022. So the guy is turning back the clock a little bit, but also looking like and improved version of himself.

A (58:45)

Yeah, it's been great to hear everything coming out between these receivers and pass catchers and their relationship and their chemistry with Daniel Jones and the, the conversations and dialogue that's happening during the week and how that's translating into them making adjustments in games. So I'm going to give the O line a little bit of love. Have we seen kind of a little bit of a resurgence in Quinton Nelson and getting outside the formation and some of the stuff that they've been able to do in the run game? Are we seeing, seeing a group kind of find its footing in front of Daniel Jones? A little bit as this year's going on.

B (59:13)

Absolutely. I feel like James, we have that same name, telepathy, because I had a chance.

A (59:17)

We're on it, man.

B (59:18)

I had a chance to ask Shane Steichen about Quinn Nelson last week, and I said, hey, how unique is this guy because he is on a Hall of Fame trajectory, seven straight Pro Bowls to start his career, probably will make it again this year. I mean, he's been All Pro at least five times. I believe he is probably the greatest offensive lineman the Colts have had in their team history. And he's still in his prime. And the way Shane described him was like, we look at him as another skill position player. We look at him like if we get him out in space, that can help the other guys. You don't say that often about a left guard, but as you've seen James, especially on the film, when they pull him and he's running around the edge and he's getting up to that second level, he's just mauling people, and it's like, hey, come follow me. Because it's either first down or it's pay dirt for a touchdown. So he's been outstanding. He has been throughout his career. But, yes, you do feel like the energy around him and the rest of this group, they're no longer the team that for so many years, it felt like would start slow, have to scratch their way back, maybe get into the playoff picture, maybe try to, you know, get some help from other teams. They're helping themselves just by going out there and whooping teams. And so even yesterday, you know, being down one of your starting cornerbacks an hour before the game, you know, kind of having that scary scene with Anthony Richardson, they still found a way to win against an Arizona defense that, that, you know, had been stingy. I think they entered that game with, like, the fourth best scoring defense in the league. And the Colts still hung, you know, 30 plus points on them.

A (60:42)

Yeah, it's been, it's been really fun to watch. I talked to a defense coordinator that was prepping for them and has gone over a bunch of film, and he's like, I, I, I'm pulling my hair out going, I, I don't know where you defend them. It's not that they're balanced. That's the wrong word. It's that they see what you're doing defensively and they adjust to throwing the ball or running the ball to, to what you're doing. It's not just balance. It's the ability to change back and forth to react to what you do as a defense and it's been fun to watch and we're going to get a chance to see him. I feel like each and every week we're having you on here, James going, well, maybe now's the time they turn into a pumpkin. Well, I got the Chargers and Justin Herbert and they're off of a big win and Jim Harbaugh. So we'll see what they can do out there at Sofi. I know you'll be out there. Enjoy the California kind of sunshine, man. Nice having you on as always. You're going to what? You, you were going to say something?

B (61:26)

No, absolutely. I mean, just to add real quick, the vibes are high here in Indiana. I mean, you got the Indianapolis Colts were 5 and 1, the IU Hoosiers are 6 and oh. So everyone around here is used to a lot of winning these days, which feels so weird because again, Indianapolis Colts, they were irrelevant the last couple of years. IU football, are you kidding me? They were never really good as they are now. So a lot of good energy and a lot of good football being played. But as you just said, James, when it comes to Indianapolis Colts in particular at the NFL level, it's definitely a week to week league. There are no cupcakes, you know, in this league. It's, it's very weird in that way. And I'm kind of waiting for them to have that let down game and they just haven't had it yet. And certainly that'll be another big test come, you know, next week against Justin Herbert, who, I mean, just to give you a little teaser there, James Zaire, you went on a podcast and said that Justin Herbert, he doesn't think that he's a top five quarterback in the league. Said that on one of his podcasts earlier this year, said he would take Baker Mayfield over Justin Herbert. So I'm sure some folks out in LA have remembered what he said and might want to have something to say to him directly in that game.

A (62:31)

Oh, you. Are you saying Jim Harbaugh likes bulletin board material?

D (62:36)

He loves it.

A (62:36)

Who's got it better than us? Nobody, brother. I appreciate you joining. We'll have you back soon. I want to thank Jordan Rodrigue for joining us. I want to thank Mike Sando for joining us. We had a monster Monday show on Scoop City. Make sure you tune back in when we join you on Wednesday. I think Chase is going to be back back on Wednesday, so we'll talk some quarterbacks. How about that?

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A (63:27)

Hi, this is Robert Mays from the Athletic the new Peloton Cross Training Tread plus is built to take your training to the next level. I've had a peloton for the past five years. It has completely changed the way that I work out. It's completely retrained my relationship to exercise. It's in our basement. I use it virtually every single day. I'm a huge fan of the platform. I'm a huge fan of the library of classes that are offered. I cannot recommend the program enough if you're looking for a way to change your workout routine and really lock in to improving yourself physically. Powered by Peloton iq, it plans your workouts, tracks your progress, corrects your form and gives you real time coaching so you can push harder and see real results. And with Swivel Screen, you can go from running to strength training with one smooth spin. Keeping your routine balanced and your body ready for anything. Let yourself run, lift, flex, push and go. Explore the new peloton cross training TREAD plus@onepelaton.com PURA brings smart fragrance and function together. Premium scents, smart app control and sleek design. And here's the best part. Your first set of fragrances is free. Hurry to pura.com now and upgrade your home today.