James Boyd (2:22)

No, no, I feel like you gotta add like, I don't know, like either like 50 pounds of muscle or like 50 years in life or like I

James Palmer (2:29)

thought you were going to say 100 pounds of fat. Like it's just a guy named Jimbo. Just looks like. And so then I see, I see Brady out later that night and he yells from across the room, he's like, jimbo, Jimbo. I'm like, oh, no. Welcome in to Scoop City on a Thursday. James Palmer here with you. It's gonna be a Thursday road trip. We'll have a couple of guys joining me throughout the show, which is also the season finale of Scoop City. I sad story, but stick to the athletic for everything you need in terms of the NFL, it's got you covered better than anywhere else. And we have that today in this show as well. James Boyd's going to be joining me. Why did they use the transition tag? Is there any fear of losing Daniel Jones as they negotiate this contract? And in this process, could they be losing Alec Pierce who has maybe one of the most robust markets of any player in free agency? We'll go through both of those as well as Anthony Richardson's future possibly elsewhere. Also with the Packers, Matt Schneiderman and I break down, is Malik Willis going to really worth what he is going to get paid and what else could we see happening in Green Bay? Also an in depth conversation about Romeo Dobbs and maybe some of the teams that could be interested in him. All right, let's get this road trip started right now with one and only James Boyd. All right, an old regular of the show, James Boyd joining the show now. It was nice to see in person in Indianapolis, by the way. That was nice.

James Boyd (3:57)

Yeah, that was nice. You know, not a lot has changed since then.

James Palmer (4:01)

Let's get into what hasn't changed since then. The thing at the top of my list is everybody was going back and forth on, you know, if a deal isn't getting done with Daniel Jones and we all knew that they were working on it and working hard on it, that it was going to be a franchise tag. Then it started as the tag deadline got closer, was shifting over to the transition tag. Now, there's a couple reasons you could do that, James. Right. Like obviously you're going to try to lower the annual on the long term deal with maybe having the transition tag instead of the franchise tag. But my main thought is, was there any fear at all from Chris Ballard and company that the transition tag and putting that on Daniel Jones that they could lose him?

James Boyd (4:43)

I don't think that there's a ton of fear, but there is some because they tagged him at all. I mean, you had two prime tag candidates and you probably thought in the back of your mind, just in case another offer comes in, we want to be able to match that. Now, obviously with the transition tags of the franchise tag, there's no draft compensation if you weren't able to match a deal and Daniel Jones left. But I think at this point they're going to hitch their wagon to him, which they have done. Um, this is more, I guess officially now it's towards working and getting the long term deal done. But yeah, I think it was kind of a move to be a little bit more frugal perhaps, you know, try to save every dollar you can and take that and retool your roster. But right now, as things stand, technically it isn't really all that settled. You just have them kind of in straits a little bit. But he could still leave.

James Palmer (5:37)

Yeah, I, I the part that sticks in my side maybe. And this is why they were able to do it. You know, if you do that and so everybody listening, obviously the transition tag is lower than the franchise tag. The franchise tag locks somebody up. If somebody wants them, they got to give up two ones to get them. If somebody wants to make an offer sheet on the transition tag, the Colts, if they don't match it, don't get anything in terms of compensation. So a little bit more of a benefactor to the teams that could be looking for him. I can look at the injury and recovering from the injury. James, right going, another team's going. Well, we could make this big offer to Daniel Jones, yet we don't get him in our building to work every day with our players because he's hurt, he's coming back from injury. Does he learn our system right away? I could see the Colts almost using that to their advantage. We know our offseason a little different than somebody that would pay big dollars to bring him in. And so maybe they're playing that into their advantage a little bit and obviously it lowers the price hopefully for, for Daniel Jones and you can sign resign Alec Pierce and that's where we get at. We saw a very different Alec Pierce on my good friend K. Adams show. I mean, a very, a very like, I was like, oh, okay. Do you feel like he's like, has the chances? As we've gotten closer to the start of the new league year, the chances of him returning to Indianapolis have stayed the same or have they gone down?

James Boyd (6:51)

I think they've decreased. And to go back to your point about Daniel, I look at it like they're trying to basically call his bluff. You're saying you're worth this much money, go out there and get a better offer and we'll see if we'll match it, which they probably will. At this point, your backup plan is non existent. You don't have a plan B at all. I mean, people around here keep trying to tell me that Riley Leonard has something to him and I'm like, he's not Tom Brady.

James Palmer (7:14)

There's only one of those guys. If he had something to him, why did they bring in Philip Rivers?

James Boyd (7:19)

Exactly. There you have it. I mean, you're reading my mind, James. We share a name, we share the same mind. But the way I look at it,

James Palmer (7:25)

when I come to share my review, I think you're brilliant.

James Boyd (7:27)

Go ahead. Well, right now there's a lot of things moving as far as the coattail. And when it comes to Alec, I think it has decreased. And that's just because of the market. I mean, when you hit free agency, it is very rare for you to be a good player with not a lot of red flags and hit free agency because typically those guys just don't get there. Even George Pickens did not get fully two free agency. He did get the non exclusive franchise tag. So for Alec, listening to him on the Cha Adams show up in Adams, it was jarring because James, he never talks like this. He never talks about himself. He's one of the worst quizzes sometimes. I know, but it's funny, he took the same approach or a similar approach to when Jonathan Taylor was in his contract saga. Both guys are very big team dudes. They never complain about their role. They're always team first. But then when it was time to get paid and generational wealth was on the line, both of them kind of changed their tune a bit. So I don't blame Alec for basically making a public statement and saying, I think in no uncertain terms, you got to pay up to get me and you have to have a plan as well.

James Palmer (8:35)

Yeah, I think that's exactly true. And when I look at the landscape right now, what are your options? I know there's this is a deep wide receiver class. It certainly is. But also the Colts don't have a first round pick. And so when I look at the landscape of the position, you can trade for AJ Brown and that's not a certainty. Howie Rosen's price is through the roof. You could try to get Mike Evans, to my understanding, as early as this morning, there's a very likely chance he goes back to Tampa. So then that really just kind of leaves Alec Pierce sitting there at the top really of the market. And we know how prices go up when that's really the case. Is he worth what teams are looking to possibly pay for him? Because in Indianapolis, I don't know if you heard the same thing. I was talking to GMs that were like, he's going to get the Christian Kirk he got what money, you know, mean when it comes around some people, you know, I'm calling around the league yesterday going it may get close to 30. Is he worth that?

James Boyd (9:35)

You are worth whatever anyone is going to pay you. Great. I'll give you a real answer though, jokes aside. I'll give you a real answer and I always say, just as an aside side, I would much rather in life be overpaid than underrated. I don't ever want to be paid for what I'm worth because I'm probably not worth as much as a guy like Alec Pierce. But again, it's supply and demand. You hit free agency? He's arguably the top free agent wide receiver even over Mike Evans because of his age.

James Palmer (10:00)

Yep.

James Boyd (10:01)

And I don't think that he is a proven solidified like if you sign him, he's your number one and you just trust that he can be that player. He's ascending in that direction. But what he does have is a very unique talent when it comes to down the field and I want to make that very clear. He's not just a deep threat. He is the best deep threat in the league and one of the best we've seen over the last 20 years when it comes to yards per catch, explosive play rate and just flipping the field for your offense. So from that perspective, he is worth a lot of money. I don't think he's worth what he'll get necessarily. But at the same time, that's the risk you run if you're the Colts more than any other team of letting him hit free agency. Because now that price is going to go up and we know that teams are desperate and even if they aren't that Desperate. Let's take a team like the Patriots, for example. They have a ton of CAB space. They have a young quarterback on a rookie contract. What's stopping them from quote unquote, overpaying to get a guy like Alec Pierce and trying to take that next step to not only get back to the promised land, but leave there with something. So that, to me, is why I think he'll get paid and perhaps he's worth it in the eyes of some talent evaluators. But is Alec Pierce a true number one receiver? Like what I put him, when he gets paid, he's going to be in that same range, you know, if it's 30, as guys who are superstars, you know what I mean? Like, he's not Jamar Chase, he's not Justin Jefferson, he's not perhaps Nico Collins and. Yeah, or exactly. A.J. brown and others. So is he that level? No, but again, I do think he can be a very good player for you. And just also the way he affects the defense with his speed allows I think, other guys to kind of be a little better in their roles as well.

James Palmer (11:42)

Yeah, that's a really good point. I think T. Higgins is at 28. He's right there in that range. You know, George Pickens is at 28, 27 on the tag. All the guys were listening. I just know more about them as a receiver in terms of what they're going to bring me. I love that you brought up New England, by the way, because what is Drake May's best trait?

James Boyd (12:00)

Deep ball.

James Palmer (12:00)

I mean, that's. That's his best trait. And so you want to pair quarterback with. With receiver. I mean, I'm not sure there's a better spot. And then when. Also look at these numbers, and this is what I think Indianapolis is having to deal with is you mentioned New England as a perfect example of teams that just got there. And when teams just get close, what happens? They go, we gotta move, make this move to get us over the hump. I think Buffalo is in the exact same boat. Like a spot that would go, we need this to get over the hump. We've been right there and oftentimes those teams, they overpay. It's going to be fascinating to see what happens with Alec Pierce, because I know the quarterback spot is so important to him too, about where he lands, including in Indianapolis. And obviously everybody in India would like to see them run this back. Speaking of, maybe people that they could bring into Indianapolis or keep, what about Trey Hendrickson and his relationship with Lou Anarimo? Edge is a need. Trey is, I consider like Andy Dufresne when he came out of the poop tunnel like, free at last and like, so excited to now go somewhere where he can go after everything that's going on in Cincinnati. Could you see them making a play at Trey Hendrickson?

James Boyd (13:05)

Yes, I could. I do think that is a real possibility, a real name that has come up within the cold front office. But logistically wise, you have to make sure you get all your Ducks in a row with Daniel Jones and Alan Pierce. So for the sake of the argument, let's say they nail those two players down and then you're trying to figure out how we create enough cap space to go get Trey Hendrickson. I think it should be a target for them. And I get that Chris Ballard after the season said, hey, our defense has to get younger and faster. You also have to just get better. I mean, you don't have any edge

James Palmer (13:37)

rushers on your players.

James Boyd (13:38)

Yeah, yeah, I'm like, I get that. In an ideal world, James, of course, if we were GMs, we would just draft every young player that will be great and cheap and win it all every year. It's not that simple. So I think there's a balance there where, yes, you want to get younger in some areas. Can you draft the linebacker? Can you draft a safety to fill some holes? But when it comes to edge production, which the Colts have whiffed on throughout the draft for many years under Chris Ballard, the only one you have on your roster right now, it's worth something moving forward to me is Liatu Latu. So how do you find that next dude? Even if they're an older guy, if it's a one year flyer, whatever, take a swing on him, try to bring him in here and see if Trey Hendrickson coming off the hip surgery can kind of turn back the clock a little bit and give you some production. Because the three guys that are unrestricted free agents on the edge for the Colts, Tyquan Lewis, Sampson, Abu Calm and Quitty Pay, they combined for nine sacks last year. Latu. Latu had eight and a half by himself. That's just not enough production from three of your top four guys.

James Palmer (14:32)

Yeah, that's a great point. And I always look at it this way, and I'm curious if you do too. Like, everybody's sitting there in Chicago going, you know, we have the betting favorites to land Max Crosby, but we have so many different needs on defense. We got to get corner and secondary help and all these things. But I'm Always in the factor of if you can get to the quarterback faster than anybody else, your guys on the back end don't have to cover very long. And oftentimes you can maybe save yourself on the back end a little bit by not overpaying there. And a guy like Trey Henderson and Latu working together, you're going, okay, well, like maybe we can't swing for the fences in some of these spots we need, but they may not have to cover very long. Can we be economical other areas because of the way these guys impact to play so quickly. And so I think that part's just fascinating. All right, before we go, I got to ask you about Anthony Richardson. Like, this has just been such a fascinating thing to see, no pun intended, and what's gone on with him. So since, since the combine, do you think he has a market? Because when I look at the other quarterbacks that could be available that could play for the minimum, he carries, a $10 million cap hit, yeah, I do

James Boyd (15:34)

think that there is a decent market for him. I was asking around about this throughout the combine and kind of behind the scenes as well since then, and the question I was throwing out there was basically, if you're a gm, if you're an executive, would you rather take a swing on Anthony Richardson for let's say a fifth or sixth round pick or take someone in this draft class with a fifth or sixth round pick at quarterback? And the majority, not a great majority, but the majority were like, you know what, we would probably still hit that swing on Anthony because of the blue chip traits. Incredible arm, you know, can run like the wind, has durability issues, but at the same time, you're not going to get a guy with that many traits in that late of the draft. And it's a one year flyer. And if you do move on from him, if you're the Colts, that cap hit gets split in half. So if you trade them, the new team only has to pay about $5 million to keep them. So would you take a one year, $5 million flyer on Anthony Richardson for a six round pick? And at this point I think that is a real possibility. And it does sound like the culture willing to work with Anthony. And it isn't all about draft compensation. Like, I don't think they're gonna hold him hostage. They will not do that. And at this point you're just waiting to see when the other shoe drops for him. And it's unfortunate because he was their highest drafted player since Andrew Luck. He was supposed to be their new Andrew Luck. And honestly, James, he was the last question on this appearance because it's a footnote for everything else going on with the franchise. So quite the fall from expectations to reality for Anthony Richardson.

James Palmer (17:05)

I don't like this, James. I'm supposed to be the one that ties everything together, so. Well, you're doing it for me. That was perfect. You're exactly right. You're exactly right. I mean, the guy completely completed 47% of his passes last year. I think it's the lowest in Colts history. Yes, Last night. So it's just. It's. It's. It's been an enigma to watch. But you're right. With talent and traits like that, everybody's going to say, what, Let me get my hands on him. Let's wait till we coach him.

James Boyd (17:32)

I'll throw this in there. I was told that he can see, and this is they. I was told that the Colts were given medical records, that he has 2020 vision when using both of his eyes. Now, people were yelling at me like he wears glasses. What do you mean he has 2020? You can wear glasses and have 2020. I'm not an optometrist, but trust me, that is a thing. The point is he can play football, is what I was told, and his vision has recovered to the point where that is no longer a concern. Now, I would say other teams will want to see some of those records

James Palmer (18:00)

as well before they want to do their own due diligence.

James Boyd (18:02)

Yes, exactly. But it sounds like that has moved in the right direction. So if that was a hurdle, it's less of one now. Now it's all about again, do I take a swing on this guy who could be still a great talent in this league, but obviously has had some struggles to even meeting the baseline of being an NFL player at this point?

James Palmer (18:20)

Yeah, he's got to win over a locker room, too, which has been a little bit of a struggle.

James Boyd (18:24)

No tapping out in the future.

James Palmer (18:26)

Exactly. Listen, I understand the seeing thing on this monitor. I wouldn't even know who you were if I wasn't wearing corrective lenses. With these corrective lenses, I'm a fighter pilot. I got like, 2015. I'm rolling. Exactly.

James Boyd (18:35)

You said keep pushing my glasses up, but, yes, I need these.

Matt Schneidman (18:38)

Exactly.

James Palmer (18:38)

Yeah. I got the contact, James. Awesome, man. Stay on top of it. Everybody read everything he's doing on the Athletic because this is one of the most interesting teams this entire offseason with Daniel Jones, Alec Pierce, Anthony Richton, everything that's going on. Could it be Trey Hendrickson well, we'll find out. We're going to move on in Scoop City to Matt Schneidman's going to join me to tell me, really, is Malik Willis worth what teams might pay him? We got packers talk next.

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James Palmer (20:59)

oh, another regular of the show joins us once again. Welcome back to Scoop City. James Palmer here with you with Match. Have been joining me talking a little Packers. The first guy we have to talk about, Matt, is a guy who's not going to be playing in A Packers uniform. But everybody is fascinated. You saw him more than anybody. Like is the price. How curious are you with the price for Malik Willis once you finally see a deal?

Matt Schneidman (21:28)

Very curious. Because there was some chatter just among the fan base last season that the packers should start Malik Willis over Jordan Love. Now, Malik Willis was phenomenal. In the limited starts he made over the last two seasons, he proved that he can be far more than just a running quarterback, which is kind of the reputation he came to Green Bay with when they traded a seventh round pick for him on the eve of the 2024 season. Now, you and everyone else knowing or listening to this podcast knows that it's different for a quarterback to play an entire season when teams have tape on you and teams have full weeks to scout you, as opposed to just making sprin spot starts here and there. So I'm very intrigued to see not only the deal he gets, but also kind of how he performs if and when he has to be that full time starter for a team.

James Palmer (22:16)

Yeah, it was interesting. Like right after those starts happened during the season, I was talking to a GM and I was like, what do you think it could be? And that was what, like back end of like December, I'm having this conversation. He's like, I could see 15 to 20 with incentives built in for sure. And now we're starting to see that number just climb and climb. Is there any growth that you saw? Like what, what, like whatever fan base lands him? What type of player do you think they could see after everything that maybe he Learned from Matt LaFleur flung being in that room with Jordan Love?

Matt Schneidman (22:51)

Yeah, I think if you're looking for where he improved the most and where most of that growth was, I remember doing a story late last season about how Malik kind of revitalized his career in Green Bay. And the One thing Matt LaFleur pinpointed, kind of the biggest strides Malik had made was his footwork. That was something they really needed to hone in on, really needed to work on. And remember when Malik came to the packers, his first quarterback coach was Tom Clements, who was the quarterbacks coach for Brett Favre, for Aaron Rogers, for Jordan Love, a guy who is obsessed with the fundamentals. So Malik getting his footwork down, getting that balance down, really helped his accuracy, which is why you saw him go from a guy who the packers barely trusted to throw when he first made starts early in the 2024 season to a guy when he made his final start for them against the. Well, it wasn't his actually was his final start, Week 17 against the Ravens this past year, he comes out slinging it. Two explosive pass plays on the opening drive to Romeo Dobbs and Christian Watson, I believe so. Just that growth of his footwork, which improved his accuracy and then allowed the packers to really trust his arm more. And I think any team that gets him should know that you're getting a complete quarterback. Like I said, he's known for his legs and he's going to use those, and he used those well with the Packers. But I think you're getting more of a complete package and his price tag is going to reflect that.

James Palmer (24:18)

Yeah, I think part of that, too is the poise in the pocket. A little bit seemed to be different.

Ryan Reynolds (24:22)

Right.

James Palmer (24:22)

Like, he just seemed a little bit more comfortable and in control than maybe we were used to maybe seeing him or maybe we're a little surprised by. So that's another added part. You mentioned Aaron Rodgers. I just have to say this, this is off topic. Do people in Green Bay still care? Like he goes on Pat McAfee the other day, do people in Green Bay, are they still interested in what's going on with Aaron Rodgers?

Matt Schneidman (24:41)

Yeah, I think people will always be interested here in Green Bay with what's going on with Aaron Rodgers. I think there might be a little bit of fatigue, especially when he starts talking about his life in the bedroom and some other things with his extracurriculars. But look, I think the reason people in Green Bay might still care is because the most likely place he goes and plays next year is for the coach he played, I think, 13 years for here in Green Bay, Mike McCarthy. So I think that aspect of it intrigues Packer fans. But there's also the aspect of, okay, if he retires here this off season, he's going to retire a Packer. Aaron Rodgers told us on a zoom call last year before the packers played the Steelers that he's going to retire a Packer. They can start the clock from whenever he retires. Four years from then, he'll be back to be in the packers hall of Fame and probably see his number become the seventh ever in packers history to go up in the facade at Lambeau Field. So, look, he spent 18 years here. You're never going to diminish what he did and never take away that relationship between him and the fan base. But I do think some of the fans are probably relieved that they don't have to tune into McAfee every Tuesday to see what Aaron's gonna say, even though I, I, that's not A slight on Pat. I'm a big fan of the show.

James Palmer (26:02)

Yeah, a lot of people are big fans of the show. I mean, the ratings are through the roof for Pat. I'm a big fan of Pat. But what I wouldn't do is if I go on Pat McAfee and I am telling you how upset I am about all the extra paparazzi to get pictures of my wife and the drones flying over my house and all the attention. Probably the thing I wouldn't do is say that on a show that everybody loves and everybody's watching. But that's just my opinion on how I would handle that aspect of my, my private life. You mentioned Romeo Dobbs and where do things stand with, with his market, do you think? And what would you say about his time if it's over in Green Bay? Was what

Matt Schneidman (26:43)

I know Romeo Dobbs isn't your stereotypical number one wide receiver, but on a team that doesn't really have that true number one. Since Devonte Adams was traded in 2022, Romeo Dobbs over the last four seasons has led the packers in catches, receiving yards and receiving touchdowns. He's available, he's trustworthy, he's not the most explosive guy, but he's got solid hands. He can win a 50, 50 ball and he's a big time playoff performer. Some of his biggest games have come in the playoffs for the packers, even though they haven't gone on deep runs. So that' another guy that I think is going to price himself out of Green Bay. I really would be absolutely stunned if he comes back because they have Jaden Reed, Christian Watson, Matthew Golden, Dontavian Wicks, Savion Williams still under contract for at least next season. And Romeo Dobbs, obviously a 2022 fourth round pick, is set to hit unrestricted free agency. He has said in various media appearances that he wants to be back. Packers probably want him back, but it's just not a realistic scenario where he fits into their price range.

James Palmer (27:47)

Yeah, I could see teams like I got team like. Can you see a team like San Francisco going after him like somebody like that?

Matt Schneidman (27:53)

Yeah, I would say Buffalo, but they just acquired DJ Moore, so maybe they're not in the Romeo Dobbs sweepstakes anymore.

James Palmer (28:02)

Yeah, they may not be. They may not be. When I look at Rasheed Walker and we talk about guys getting priced out, I as I ask around, it sounds like this, this number might be something that we go, whoa, is he. I mean, I know everybody's overpaid in free agency, but is he going to be Worth what, what he gets out there on the open market.

Matt Schneidman (28:25)

You know James, with Rasheed Walker, he's a serviceable starting left tackle in the NFL. He can get the job done. He's not going to be anything spectacular. But those guys don't just grow on trees. We saw Dan Moore get a ridiculous contract last season. I say ridiculous just because, you know, he earned it, but nobody expected that. I think that's going to be the thing with Rasheed and the packers return on investment. They drafted him in the seventh round in 2022 and now they're probably going to get a 2027 third round comp pick back for him. He did a very admirable job, especially as a seventh round guy coming into the league, stepping in for David Bakhtiari when Bakhtiari, a five time all pro, had recurring knee injuries toward the end of his career and Rasheed really gave the Packers a sturdy option at left tackle. Is he the best left tackle in the NFL? No. But he can get the job done. And those, like I said, Ben, Brian Gude Kunst has said this too. Those kind of guys don't grow on trees. And he's going to get paid like it.

James Palmer (29:28)

Yeah, exactly. And I actually, I love that you brought up the comp pick. That's an aspect of this that probably isn't brought up enough. When you take a seventh round pick and you, you get serviceable time out of him and, and you get, you know, starter level, quality play and then you turn that around to a third round pick, that's part of your team building as a whole in the long term, in the way a lot of these things play out in certain buildings. With that said, there's not a lot of room to work with here, Matt. Like, is anybody coming to Green Bay? Is there anybody you're going to be welcoming at the airport? I don't think there's a whole lot of, a lot of dollars to throw around here.

Matt Schneidman (30:04)

Yeah, they're a little bit over the cap right now, I think. According to over the Cap. I know there was a report out there today from ESPN that they restructured Xavier McKinney's contract. So that probably gets them under the cap. But Brian Gude Koons told us at the Combine recently that he feels really good about what they can do in free agency and their flexibility. And he said he thinks the packers can do whatever they need to do now. Are we going to see an off season like the one they had two years ago when they signed Josh Jacobs and Xavier McKinney or the one in 2019 when they signed Zadarius Smith, Preston Smith, Adrian Amos, Billy Turner. Probably not. But I don't think the packers necessarily need that high end talent to close that super bowl gap, if you will. We've talked about it on this show before. Micah Parsons, Tucker Kraft, Zach Tom Devonte Wyatt, their best player at four different key positions did not finish the season because of injuries last year. They're presumably going to get all those guys back, knock on wood, if their rehabs go well. So if they can go bargain bin hunting for some depth, that interior defensive line and cornerback and inside linebacker, if they lose Quay Walker, I think that can still be considered a successful free agency.

James Palmer (31:18)

Do you have your name? You have any names you're looking at there, Matt? I know you mentioned Quay Walker. That could be somebody they can't. They can bring back. Right. So.

Matt Schneidman (31:25)

Right.

James Palmer (31:25)

Do you have anybody from the outside in any of those spots that you think could be, could be a target,

Matt Schneidman (31:30)

you know, an underrated spot? I think is running back for the packers. And I say that because, you know, they're bringing back Josh Jacobs, he's going to be their feature back. But they're not tendering Emmanuel Wilson. That's out there, I believe. I think that was in ESPN reported, so I'll just want to give proper credit. And he was their backup. He's a great backup if he prices himself out of Green Bay on the open market and he showed flashes of being a potential starter or, you know, part of a shared backfield next year they need a new backup running back. And Brian Guda kunst and Matt LaFleur strongly believe in splitting the carries. You know, Josh Jacobs has gotten more carries than say Aaron Jones did when it was Aaron Jones and Jamal Williams or Aaron Jones and AJ Dillon. But guys like Rashad White or Kenneth Gainwell, he'll probably be too expensive. There are some veteran running backs who are pass catching running backs who could fit in as, as a running back too, on this team. I think you look at a couple linebackers and Brian Guta. Kunst was asked at the combine which positions he thinks need the most depth on team and he said secondary and inside linebacker. Eric Wilson had a really good season with the Vikings. He spent time with the packers before Nakobe Dean from the Eagles maybe. And a couple corners I'd be interested in are Josh Jobe from the Seahawks, Monteric Brown from the Jaguars. Guys that aren't going to break the bank, but guys that can come in, sign deals from anywhere from, you know, 8 to 10 million and compete for a starting job, if not win one. So there are a couple spots where the packers could probably upgrade in the starting lineup. But like I said, I think this free agency more than anything is going to be about filling kind of that second tier on your depth chart for the Packers.

James Palmer (33:15)

And I don't know why. Maybe I'm a nerd, Matt, but I just love those moves during free agency. Like the strategic kind of like, hey, this didn't, this wasn't a bottom line ticker news alert everywhere across the NFL. But these make our team better and these are the ones that kind of fill some holes. But you don't break the bank. I gotta ask you this before we go. Like, like what kind of year is this coming up for Jordan Love? Like, is there some pressure you're feeling in Green Bay? Is it just what, what is the, the 2026 outlook for. For Love right now as, as the packers are putting this together and hopefully getting those names back that you mentioned, that would be craft specifically huge for Love.

Matt Schneidman (33:54)

I'm going to go back to that Denver game and you and I were both in the press box at that game in Week 15. Jordan Love entered that game third in MVP odds behind Matthew Stafford and Drake May, and he tore the Broncos up in the first half of that game. You know, the packers were up by nine. And then Christian Watson goes to the hospital, Micah tears his acl. You know, the Broncos just have Love under siege. Zach Tom also went out that game, their best offensive lineman, and Love had no time to throw in the second half and things kind of fell apart. And then the next week against Chicago, he suffers a concussion and misses the rest of the regular season. I say that to say the way the season ended with Jordan Love off the field and then how the packers collapsed. No fault of Jordan Love. He played phenomenally in that playoff game in Chicago. I think people forget just how good Jordan Love was this season. And what I'm trying to get at is I don't think he has much left to prove. Sure, anytime you haven't gotten over the hump yet, it's going to be on your quarterback to get you over the hump. And that still stands. But if we're still debating what kind of quarterback Jordan Love is and where he ranks in the hierarchy in the NFL, I don't know that that's an argument worth having. I think this year he established himself when healthy, when upright. And you can make these excuses for other quarterbacks too, like a Justin Herbert when healthy, when upright. I think Jordan loves a top five quarterback in the league. He proved that consistently throughout the course of this past season. So he's long since proven that he's the guy. Now it's just about can he lead the packers over the hump. And it's not just on him, but it's certainly on him because it's the most important position in sports. I think right now he doesn't have to prove that he's the guy anymore or that he's elite. It's okay. Are you a championship caliber quarterback? That's what's next for him.

James Palmer (35:44)

Well, and Malik Willis isn't in the building anymore, so he doesn't have to worry about that.

Matt Schneidman (35:49)

Exactly right.

James Palmer (35:54)

Awesome. Matt, appreciate you joining us as always, man. It's always a blast having you on the show, brother. Enjoy the gaming chair, throw on a little Street Fighter, maybe a little more combat or something. And enjoy the room, buddy. Always love reading everything that you do. Appreciate you stopping by.

Matt Schneidman (36:10)

All right. Thanks, James. Appreciate it.

James Palmer (36:13)

Every time I talk to Matt, I learn something that's important when you have these conversations on shows like this coming up. I hope you learned something from this. Got a couple of news and nuggets to get to why DJ Moore headed to Buffalo in a trade, I'll tell you that. And why this quarterback landscape is going to be all about football and not money. Rare during free agency. All that coming up next on Scoop City.

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James Palmer (38:38)

All right, welcome back to Scoop City. James Palmer here with you, closing it out and closing out on the last episode of the season. Couple of nuggets of news I wanted to drop here just for you to keep an eye on with the league year right around the corner. First off, the Bills get ahead of things in terms of the free agency wide receiver market. Making a trade for Bears wide receiver D.J. moore had a long conversation with Joe Brady at the Combine. He actually told me, yes, I'm looking to help help Josh Allen any way I can. This is certainly it. Dj Moore can play at a high level. Still talking to people around the league. What I kind of understood about what was going on in Chicago was there was some issues with the chemistry between Caleb Williams and DJ Moore, some issues with the connection as well. He's still really respected in that building. There's still everybody in Chicago thinks he can play at a high level. The Bills certainly think so. I was getting some texts from people inside that building tell me that this guy is an absolute stud. We are stoked to have him. He's an on time receiver professional. He does everything essentially right. I'm not entirely sure the play style fit Caleb Williams style. And when you go and draft Colston Loveland, you go and draft Luther Burden III Ramadunze. Obviously this young nucleus is growing with Caleb Williams and I was hearing rumors about DJ Moore potentially landing elsewhere at the Combine and even predating the Combine. So now Josh Allen has a new weapon. Also keep an eye on Khalil Shakir getting used a little bit differently. Joe Brady also told me he'd like to to expand his slot receivers role and that might be one of the most underrated receivers in all of football. He is outstanding if you ask people around the league. So it'll be interesting to see what Joe Brady'd like to do to make that group around Josh Allen even better. The other point I wanted to bring up is when the new league year rolls around, it is going to be fascinating about where all of these quarterbacks land. Two years ago we had an instance where we didn't think would really come happen very often and that's Russell Wilson was cut by the Denver Broncos and all that dead money was paid for by the Broncos. Is essentially a veteran quarterback with a Super bowl and a ton of games played and started in Pro Bowls galore available for the league minimum. It was a big deal two years ago. This year it's going to be fascinating to see what happens when we could have four, possibly five players in that exact same situation and the first one obviously being Kyler Murray. The quarterbacks and keep an eye on this are going to have the power over the teams. Why? Because money is not a factor. So they're going to have the ability to go out there and really pick the best situation for them. Not financially but in terms of a football sense. So where does Kyler Murray believe he can rejuvenate his career in 2026 to get himself back on the map? Maybe with a different team in 27 or perhaps that same team in 2027. Same for Tua Tuga Violoa or Geno Smith or Kirk Cousins. And the list could go on and on about different guys that could land in different spots. It's a fascinating quarterback landscape because we still don't know where Aaron Rodgers is going to be be if he ends up retiring. Well, let's just say he probably comes back. He'll drag it along on Pat McAfee several more times. But if he doesn't come back, the Pittsburgh Steelers and Mike McCarthy are now in play for one of these guys as well in a team that is still put together pretty well. So it's going to be very interesting to see where these players land that have the option to really make the best choice for themselves in terms of football over finances because the financial side of things are already paid by their previous team. All right, I just want to throw that out there because it's going to be fun to watch when the New Year league year starts. I want to thank Chase Daniels all season was outstanding. Breaking down quarterbacks and so much more for us. Diana Rossini taking us inside all of the news and nuggets and behind the scenes of how this league works. Nobody's better at getting now, you know, getting those stories and making sure they break stuff and getting us the inside scoop on everything around the NFL and then all the writers and everybody at the Athletic. Nobody does it better. It's the best stable of talent you have on the planet covering the NFL. It's right here on the Athletic. I loved having all of these guys on the show. It was out outstanding. Make sure you continue to read the Athletic, continue to go to everything that they have on the site. Because really, again, nobody covers the league more in depth inside more buildings than the Athletic. All right, enjoy free agency. This show's done for the season. The new league season starts next week. Take it easy everybody.

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James Boyd (42:56)

Why?

Bill.com Spokesperson (42:56)

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