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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to Scottish Watches Podcast. This is an exciting episode. This is one that's been in the wings for a very, very long time. Listeners may remember many, many months ago, I can't remember how many myself, we announced that Jonathan from the Edinburgh Watch Company was retiring from the industry, not from the watch community. Nobody ever retires. You can't go. It's like the Mafia. Once you're into watches, you're in for life. But he did get rid of all the stock, he did sell up and he has moved on to pastures new. So welcome back to the show in an unofficial capacity, Jonathan from the Ex Embr Watch Company.
- [00:33]
B
Good afternoon, Ricky, how are you? And thank you very much for having me. It's great to be back.
- [00:37]
A
It is. And we're recording this one in kind of this new studio. I'm kind of a little bit beside myself just now. Reason will become apparent later on, but I've been out for an experience in a very fast sports car. First thing to tell everybody is to check the show notes. We're going to be talking about a lot of things that have happened in the past, some things that are happening in the present, potentially some things in the future, and obviously a lot of wristwatch chat. You want to see the pictures, links to things and yeah, all that good stuff will be in our show Notes link will be in your podcast player. Click the link takes you to our website page designated for this show and you'll see all the stuff Mezzea will put in there. Wow. Right? The reason I am beside myself is because Jonathan came over to see me with one of his new toys. And anybody that's been following Jonathan for a number of years will have seen many, many pictures, many, many video clips of him piloting very fast cars round racetracks, drag strips, the Nurburgring, all kinds of stuff. And this has been going on for many, many years. You've actually, in the past, sponsored and looked help them on their motorsport trajectory, their careers. I remember pictures you sent to me where you had Edinburgh Watch Company logos on the gloves of race competitors. So this is something that is intrinsically linked into your past, your present and your future. But should we do a wrist check before we get on?
- [01:52]
B
Absolutely. So today I'm wearing.
- [01:55]
A
Is that a Daytona that you said you'd never take off the wrist? No.
- [01:59]
B
You know, going back to February, as you mentioned earlier, February was the sort of last day of trading for Edinburgh Watch Company and the very last watch the company bought was a Rolex Daytona 116500 ceramic with a white dial. Probably my all time favorite watch, one I'm lucky enough to have before. But my watches always got sold to buy cars. And when this watch came back and it was the last watch, I thought, go on Jonathan, treat yourself. After 10 years, that's a retirement gift yourself. And I bought it and I put that on my wrist that day and it's not been off until yesterday and it's just the most beautiful watch and I feel very, very lucky to have it. But I don lot of watches left because they all got sold. But I sort of cherry picked some of my own and ones from the collection and I was looking at them the other day and I just thought, crikey, I tried them all on and then I put the Daytona back on again because there was nothing quite so nice to wear as the Daytona. But I thought you got to give these ones a go. So I'm wearing the Sea Dweller and it's the SD4000 which is the 1160, 600. And I remember when that watch came out, I think it was around about 20, 16, 17. And to me I think it's just that that perfect divers Rolex and many, many years ago I gosh, when I'm going back, that's back to when I was about 21. I, like many youngsters then had a dream of a Rolex and for me it was a Rolex Submariner and back then this shows how old I am. It was £800 and it was in the window of Watches of Switzerland on Princess street and they had a Submariner date and I think they had the non date and they had a Sea Dweller. But I wasn't quite such a watch geek then as I was now and I didn't quite get what the Sea Dweller was. I think it was about £1,700 back then. So the Submariner was the one for me with the date and I bought it and gosh, I felt like James Bond. But the Sea Dweller I think is something a bit special. It's a little bit different, it's a little bit bigger than a Submariner. But having seen the deep SEAS and the 50th anniversaries and of course the regular Submariner, I think the SD4000 is a very special piece. It's not too big, it's a little bit thicker. It hasn't got the Cyclops on the glass. It's got the benefit of the Glidelock class. It's super accurate. It's got almost like a matte black dial on it. Ceramic bezel, which for me, being in a wheelchair and I'm always pitting things and banging off doors, it's pretty tough. And I've had this for a number of years and I absolutely love it. And I think as a diver's watch, it's just an absolute great one. So the other thing, too, I love the Daytona. And now the dates aren't so important to me now as they were before. I like a reasonably accurate watch, but when you wake up in the middle of the night, it's very hard to tell the time on a Daytona because the lume on the index markers is absolutely tiny. I must say, this one's a whole lot better. So I'm going to give this one a bit of wrist time. Um, so what you wearing?
- [04:49]
A
I was captivated there by your storytelling, and that is something that I have missed because it's been so long since we've done something together I wanted to come across years ago when you were going to the ring. Never had the time, never had the opportunity. But you mentioned there about watches and waking up during the night. Do you actually wear your watch when you sleep? That's a question that I don't think I've ever asked you.
- [05:07]
B
I do. I wear my. I never take it off, which is, you know, I just don't. I mean, it's a waterproof watch. It's got the screw down crown on it. I don't take it off for anything, really. Well, yeah, if I'm going into the. If I'm going to wash my car, I will take it off and put it somewhere safe. But aside from that, no, I don't. And that's what I love about it. It's just. It becomes a part of you. And I think, you know, when you. You change watches all the time, it's like changing your shoes. You're wearing your office shoes and then you. You put a deepsea on. It's like putting a pair of climbing boots on this along with the Daytona. They just settle. They just become a part of you. And that's what I like about, you know, lightweight ceramic watches and carbon fiber watches. They just. I don't know, I'm. I used to love big watches. I don't like big watches so much. I think 42, 43 is about my max. I want the watch to be there when I want it to be there, to tell the time and admire what I'm looking at, but otherwise just go back up my sleeve and be hidden. And I don't want to feel like I'M carrying a brick around on me and I think this is about the right balance for that. And the Daytona is even better. I mean, it's, it's super slim, isn't it? Just fits underneath your shirt cuff. And it's the edges on the Daytona because they're quite smooth compared to like a Submariner or a GMT master, they've got much sharper edges on it. And the Daytona is just. It's a piece of magic.
- [06:30]
A
You're making me remember the one I had that I got rid of to buy a house. But yeah, the Daytona I had the white golden Oysterflex and it was different from the steel. They don't tell you this, but it's actually slightly larger in size. They say that it's a 40 mil for the normal Daytona, it's more like 39 and a bit. And it was the shape, it was like a Jagg E type. It had that sculpted silhouette of a cheetah or something. The way the lugs worked compared to, like you say, the tool watches that Rolex normally do, the sub, etc.
- [06:59]
B
They're more like a yacht master, I think, to wear. But, you know, you talk about the one that got away, this, this Daytona, but look at, you've bought a beautiful house on the back of it. And funnily enough, I was driving across here today thinking about a watch that I've had a few of and one that you had and it's probably, if you were to say, well, what would you like to buy next? It's the Amiga Apollo 8.
- [07:22]
A
I have one for sale, funnily enough.
- [07:23]
B
I know you do know you did, but, yeah, I remember it well. I think that's a lovely watch. I think, again, it's nice size. I love the black and the yellow combination and, and as sports car fans, we, we love yellow seat belts and carbon fibers, so it just fits in quite nicely. Not that we would love a watch to match our car, but I think that's another great watch. The only thing about it is, as much as I love it, I'm a little bit lazy when it comes to watches. I do like an automatic and I always subconsciously worried if I had a manual, God, would it sort of stop, would it run out of power when I to be somewhere? But I missed something. But again, being retired now, Ricky, it's not quite so important. So I think that one is probably one that's going to come back soon.
- [08:05]
A
We'Ll have a chat. There's one in the safe in Glasgow, so we'll Have a chat later on about that. But my wrist check for today is actually picked by Jonathan himself. He asked ahead of time if I could bring with me the Czapek. So I am wearing my Antarctique, a pickup from earlier this year. Myself and Dave were across in Switzerland. We were going to see Raf at Formex to do a factory tour. Look behind the curtain, see exactly how watches are put together, especially with the technologies they work with. Carbon, meteorite, ceramic, all these space age race tech things. Everything comes back to cars with us too. And on the way I stopped off at the boutique in Geneva for Czepec. I never actually realized they had a boutique in Geneva because it's hidden away, it's not on the main streets. And if you're going across to Geneva, watch days, watches and wonders, or you're just taking a tour or a trip with the family, it's well worth popping in. They have got their entire history, not just the past decade since they revitalized the brand, but they've got the entire history from back in the day, back when it was Czapek and Patek. So one to check out. And we did check out. We stopped off, we popped in and I picked up my first Czapek, my antarctique passage Dudrec. And it's the one that has the index markers at the 12 position. It doesn't have the numerals because I like symmetry, Everybody knows that. And this is one of the most symmetrical watches I've got. Color matched date disc. It's got the date position at the 6 o'. Clock. And everything about it is just the way you would expect. We were examining it and I'm as guilty as Jonathan for having too many watches and not enough wrist to wear them at the one time. But this one, it just flows. It's like a royal oak, the way that the bracelet contours and fits to the wrist. It's angular, it's got sharp edges, but it doesn't feel that way. It looks that way. And the thinness that's due to having a micro rotor in the back in the movement. And unfortunately you can't wear this watch back to front as much as I would like to because the back is just as beautiful as the front. There'll be pictures in the show notes of this one, but this is my first Czapek, probably my only Czupek. But Jonathan asked if he could check this one out. So I'm glad I went and I picked it up from the safety Deposit box. That's my wrist check for today. And it's now back to the the shore.
- [10:04]
B
Well, it's interesting you talk about that. I love Czapek from years ago when they first came out. I think they're the most beautiful design and having not apart from my watches I wear myself, I've not really seen and touched many watches for the last few months. And I also always say to customers, you know, how does that watch make you feel when you look at it, when you touch it, when it's in your hand? And when you presented it to me today, the weight just felt perfect. The elegance of the dial, the beautiful blue dial, the dome bezel, that sapphire crystal back, the micro rotor, the bracelet, the balance between the satinized and the polished and then the micro adjustment on the clasp, it just really all comes together and then you look at the side of the case and it's sort of indented in there and it really is really quite magical and I think it's a little bit different and I think it's a great choice and I really admire that. Very envious of that one, Ricky. That's a, a good call. I think you've trumped me actually with that one today.
- [11:05]
A
Well, Rolex usually beats everything, I'm quite happy to admit. Owned a couple of them in the past. Don't have any in the collection just now. But you're right, you know, I had to screw the nut as we say in Scotland, to be level headed and think, okay, you can't sleep in a watch, you need a house for that Henceforth. I got rid of most of the collection of all the way it's still there but that might be gone by the end of this episode. But what has been happening? You decided that you were going to retire from the industry, not the hobby. What was the thought process behind that?
- [11:33]
B
That's a great question, Ricky. And there's not one simple answer to that. And I guess there will be people around the world listening today's audio that might be approaching that big 60 number that may be thinking the same as I did. And I think it perhaps was the fact I was going to be 60 that sort of started the thought. And of course that's the age you used to retire at. But of course it's crept up and up and up now. So I think that was the start of it. I started this business back in 2014 following a love of watches and it was my third career. I'd had a career in the merch trade and then 18 years in banking and then starting my own business, which was a. I have to say, it's the best part of my career. Absolutely. Loved nearly every minute of it. But I don't know, I think when you get to that age, then you perhaps sometimes realize, I'm not going to be here forever. Have I got my health? Have I got my happiness now? And sort of the nature of the business I had. I didn't have a shop and I didn't have any staff and I'd built this business up. It wasn't just an online business. I spent most of my time with customers, so it was very physical, too. And I could have worked until I'm 70 or 75 or as long as I wanted to, really. But I just felt, you know, is this the time now where I could stop and, you know, we have to be honest with each other, you know, can you afford to stop? And I'd been reasonable. I mean, I've enjoyed my life, but I. It was, you know, having chat with financial advisors. They said, yeah, you can stop if you want to. And then I just. And then once that, that thinking starts, it sort of builds up a little bit and you just start to think about what the future looks like and the things you want to do. And my wife's retired now and we've got a dog and I. Well, could I go and pick up tennis again? And I've really enjoyed my. I'm a big car guy, as well as my watches, as you know, and I've been lucky enough to go across to Germany quite a lot. And I just thought, you know, just, if you can do it, do it. And so I made that decision and I think that was the most difficult thing. It really was borderline. And then I thought, well, how do I do it? Do I go and sell my business or do I just close the business down? I'm very proud of what I built and. And I've done that through having amazing customers that have trusted me. They've had beautiful watches and we've had a really fun time together. I've had lovely people working with me to do that. Of course, I've had my wife supporting me to allow me to do that and bring up the children. And it's been a really a lovely 10 years. So I thought, well, do I go and sell the business? And again, those listening who have sold a business, it's not straightforward. It's always very subjective and you need to go and put it on the market and then what is it worth and how long does it take and everybody getting to know your business and then do they want you to work with them for the next few years and pay you over a period of years? And I just thought, am I chasing the last penny here? And then what are the risks? What do they get it wrong? And what do they upset my customers and they ruined my brand I've built up. So I just thought, no, I'm not going to do that. And yes, I may have made more money, but I'm just going to close the business. So how do I do that? So I went and spoke to two BQ watches, I spoke to Spencer and a very substantial long term trusted operator and I said, Spencer, look, I want this to be straightforward and easy. These are the watches I've got. This is what I want for them. I want you to buy them all. And he had a think about it and he said, yeah, I think we could do something. He came up with a colleague, we had all the watches prepared and he was really happy with them and he literally wrote me a check for them and he bought them all on the back of that. He made life easy for me. And I just thought, well, where do my customers go? And I want them to be looked after by someone that has the stock, the finances, that can buy their watches, that can help them. He was the guy that could do that. Not everybody has the ability to do that. And he could. And so on the back of that I said, look, what I'm going to do for you is I'm going to write to all my customers and I'm going to say, look, this is what I've done and here's someone that can support you. And I did the same with Instagram and Facebook and YouTube, et cetera. And I hope that's been good for Spencer. And you know, he got some of my. You remember that lovely gold Speedmaster I had, the one that David Scott. Oh, the 50th anniversary one. Oh dear. That was a difficult one to let go. But you never know, there could be another Speedmaster around the corner, as we said. So off they went and I think majority of them now have got new homes and it just felt a nice way to, to do it. So the company closed and, and that was that. So, you know, I've got that retired badge now and I don't have any regrets. No, I don't think so. I look at life a little bit like a book, chapters in a book. I had that lovely time in the merger. Being a car guy, it was great. 18 years in banking and then Starting something myself. And Ricky, you've started Scottish watches yourself. You know what it's like. And many people listening might have that dream of getting out that corporate life and going, doing something for themselves. And it takes balls to do it. And I'm really glad I did. And I just built it on what felt right to me in the way I'd been brought up. And I guess there were three elements to what I did. There was watches, people and money. And I've loved watches since I was probably 12, as it were. But watches, they were what brought the customers to me. And that bit in the middle was about customers and it was about building new relationships with customers and enjoying that chat. Because I had thousands and thousands of meetings with customers where we'd sit having coffee together and getting to know each other and finding something of interest, probably cars. And my watches were curated. I didn't buy from auction, I didn't really even buy from trade. I bought from the general public. And I bought my watches based upon how I felt about the watch, how I felt about the seller, all the provenance to allow me to make the decision to invest in that watch. Then we prepared the watches thoroughly and then we presented them to our customers so the customers were happy. And I never really got watches back. I might have got back one a year. And then the customer makes a decision to buy that watch from you. They may be in Southampton, they've seen your watch on a website, but you've built up an element of trust through your social media or whatever, and they send you £10,000 before they see the watch, now that you know that's to be admired. And they did that. And then off the back of that, you have the money to live on and go and enjoy. So it was really quite simple, really, but it was great fun. And no, I'm not regretting it. I think sometimes when people are considering their own retirement, that they, they have plans about buying a holiday home or doing this, that and the other. I haven't thought about that. Right now I'm just doing what I want to do. And as I say, I'm going to hopefully start playing tennis competitively again and going out walking a dog, doing things with my wife and, and with the children, and hopefully continue doing my driving and so forth, and we'll just see what, what comes around, you know, that's not to say I'll never work again. It's not currently a plan, but you never know. You could be sitting, talking with someone that has an idea and you can do something And I think that's what's love. So that's sort of where I am today.
- [18:34]
A
And when you're talking about prior history in the motor trade, what kind of vehicles was it back then?
- [18:39]
B
Well, I started off when I was about. Well, actually there's probably. There's a trade I was going to go into that I didn't. In my childhood, I spent a lot of time on a farm and I wanted to become a farmer and they had a very, very beautiful estate and it was real gentlemanly farming and I just thought, I quite like this, I can have my own Range Rover and do a. A of bit of shooting and a bit of farming and worked for Clarkson. It did, but I didn't have Clarkson's money and I didn't have a farm either. So I thought, hang on a second, I'm working as a student on a pig farm, spreading slurry on a farm. And I thought, no, this isn't for me. So I went into the Motor Traders and I worked for a luxury sports car dealer, a lovely chap called Kenny Dunn. And I think I was about maybe 19 and I was caught. I was a gopher. Well, I'd never heard of that word, gopher, but it was go for this and go for that. But it was go up to Aberdeen and bring back an Audi Quatro. Well, it wasn't the worst thing to do at 19 and it was really good fun. So I spent some time there and then I went to work for Volvo for many years and then I worked with Aston Martin, Bentley, Lutas and Lancia, and then on to Saab for nine years. So quite a varied career before I went off and joined the world of banking.
- [19:51]
A
How do you see the differences? I know time has changed, money has changed and people have changed, but the differences dealing with Bentley, Aston Martin, those types of clients, hotel versus what you do in the water, what you did in the watch trade, Rolex buyers, people like that, those are luxury items.
- [20:07]
B
I think there's a lot of similarities, really. What does a customer want at the end of the day? And I think this is what sadly, watch dealers, car dealers sometimes miss, is just be nice, be honest, be genuine, be interested in your customers, be fair, prepare your product properly. Not everybody does that and I think that that's. I've been brought up in a professional career, working through the bank. We had to perform all year out and so I'm used to doing that. And I worked with high quality car dealerships as well, where we had very exacting standards and I Took that into my watch life. There was no excuses for an underprepared watch, cutting costs, et cetera. So I think going into a Porsche Bentley dealer, you should be greeted enthusiastically, knowledgeable members and build that relationship. And they're just the basics and then the cars really sell themselves if they're good cars. So I think that similarity is there, but, you know, that's how I saw it.
- [21:11]
A
I'd love if that was true. But unfortunately, having dealt with many dealers, watches and cars, it's few and far between. Thankfully, where I picked up my latest car at the start of the year. The guy I bought that from, he was amazing. I'm going to actually have to do a proper show where me and Dave explain the story because it keeps getting kicked down the road. But the guy that actually sold me the car car was actually the owner of the company and he never cracked a light. He didn't let on about this at all during the sales process. And I wasn't Billy Big Boss going in saying, oh, I do a podcast, I do a YouTube, blah, blah, blah. There was nothing like that, no pretenses. I just went in to buy a car and he was amazing. So, yes, I will be giving full props to the dealership. Non official dealership. This was not Porsche. This was from an external third party dealer who had a lot of nice vehicles for sale. But let's bring things forward again from the motor trade to how he actually started the business, because it's a long, long, long time since you told me the story way back, probably half a decade ago, but it was more than 10 years plus that you started Edinburgh Watch Company. What was the impetus? What made you jump and decide to go on your own back then?
- [22:14]
B
I guess to some extent my hand was forced in that I was made redundant from RBS where I'd worked for 18 years. I'd hoped to go and join another bank, but it just last minute didn't happen because of budget, et cetera. So I was out looking for various roles and seeing various headhunters to the extent I almost thought about becoming a headhunter myself. But I've loved watches for years and years and years and I've admired the good watch dealers out there and thought to myself, I would love to be doing what they're doing. Well, the opportunity presented itself. I got made redundant. They gave me some money and I thought about it and I thought about it again and I took a brave pill and nothing was really happening. And then I overdosed on the brave pills and my family, my friends Said Jonathan, you can do this. You love watches. You know loads of people you've been in sales and marketing, most of you are like life, go and give it a go.
- [23:05]
A
And what year was this and what was the industry like then?
- [23:09]
B
Well it was back in, in 2014 so I left the bank I think around about April time and Edin Ro watch company was formed in September and it was a time when there was a lot of importing going on. So this was when the gray market was going on when dealers, a lot of the pre owned dealers like myself were going to Italy and buying their Rolexes from Italy and with significant discounts compared to UK and we were selling submariners and GMTs and datejust except etc behind list. Crazy thoughts eh? And we could still make something on it. And that's where we started. But then things changed. The euro, the competitors of the pound versus the euro. I think head of Rolex Italy maybe lost his job and there was too many watches coming out of Italy for example, they were no longer competitively priced and then the availability. So what I was always careful to do was not put all my eggs in one bar basket. So I thought well if that suddenly stops and I can't get watches what I'm going to do? So I always had a collection of more pre owned watches as well from varying luxury brands from Amiga and Breitling and Cartier et cetera. So it wasn't just a one man Rolex show. So the market was, it was good, it was buoyant. If you can actually go back even further Ricky, and think about, remember when the days of importing great cars, BMWs and Volkswagens et cetera, there's a massive market and then that's like when Motorpoint first came about, they were bringing you know, cars from all over Europe back here at sick prices. But the market changes all the time and I think what's important is that you can be agile and actually move with the market as well and not be have a, you know, a poor position in one place. So I was fairly balanced in what I did. But that's basically what, that's how the market was where I started. And then you know we, the business gradually, you know, built up and then sadly, you know, when the pandemic came along, really awful time for everybody around the world. I didn't have a shop, I didn't have any staff so I didn't quite know how it would look like but I wasn't impacted anywhere near like the unfortunate position of, of many dealers who had lots of staff and lots of stock who had to close their doors, at least initially. However, as time progressed and people were at home and they couldn't go on holiday and they couldn't go and buy a car, you know, within 24 hours, the royal Mail was still working, they could have a beautiful watch on their wrists and they had the money to do that. So I was one of the few businesses that were very, very lucky. We got through the COVID situation and it was a very, very successful time for the business when people did that. But of course, you know, there was a, you know, a massive step change on, on the back of that, that, you know, debts had to be paid back and the money wasn't so available anymore. So again, it's. How do you ride that change as well? And so it's just about then the watches are going to become cheaper, but then you'll need to sell them less expensively as well. You can still have a margin in it, but it's just having the flexibility to deal with that change. And so that's taking you through that 1920 period. And then I would say since then, the market has without doubt been tougher. And not just for watch dealers, but for car dealers, for hospitality, for tourism, most businesses. And of course, course, the other thing too is where it really got tough, I think, for businesses is people's costs. When the pandemic was here, they couldn't get the parts for cars. The delivery, the supply was screwed up completely. So everything becomes so much more expensive. And it's only now that that started to calm down a little bit. Well, it was until the minimum wage went up and national insurance went up. So it's a tough industry now. And I think. I think we were talking earlier on about the market. I have to say I'm not as close to the market as I was. It was interesting to talk to you and hear your point of view on it. That £10,000 is still an awful lot of money. Crikey, £5,000 is. And I think people are really having to think twice now about what cars they buy, what holidays they go on, what watches they buy. And most of the watches that you talk about, okay, you talk about all sorts of watches, but if we just talk about the luxury sector, these are discretionary items. We don't need these watches. Our car hasn't suddenly broken down and we need another one. It's just probably another watch we want to add to our wrists. And I just think people are having to, you know, think twice about that now. And I Guess that's going to happen for, for the foreseeable, but I'm not close enough. But that's just my, my gut feel.
- [27:33]
A
Yeah, we went out, I'm going to reveal what happened. So Jonathan came to see me today and he decided to take Mespan in his new car. And I said yeah, yes. And for a guy that is 60 plus, he knows how to drive, let's put it that way. And I've seen videos that he sent me, I've seen Misha at the Nurburgring with one of your previous cars where you took him out and you gave him a jolly good scare as well. So that was the first thing. And then we came in, we were talking about how the market, not just with watches but with cars has changed. It wasn't so long ago that if you wanted to pick up maybe a Ferrari Lamborghini or one of the Porsche GT lines, you'd have to get go in and you would have to suckle at the teat of the dealership and you would have to buy all the stuff they asked you to buy a little bit like trying to get a Rolex where you'd have to pick up the earrings and the jewellery for the wife and things have changed. You were telling me that certain cars were 100, 150,000 pounds over list when they were new, plus you had to buy the Taycan and all the bits and bobs beforehand. Now on the second hand market or the pre owned market, they're sitting 10 grand, 20 grand over and they're not flying away like they were before.
- [28:38]
B
I think the other thing too is if you think what the interest rates were a few years ago and now if you went into a Porsche dealer, you're probably talking about 11% and the appetite's just not there as well for lending. So it's really tough. So those monthly payments that are people making interest rates going up, their mortgage payments, they're making businesses who are buying these cars, their costs have gone through the roof, particularly if they've got a lot of stuff. And so I think that the trade have got it tough and so. But the upside of that is that the cars that you couldn't get before are now becoming more available, they're now becoming more affordable. Affordable. And the same with the Rolex watches as an example, which is good. It's nice that people don't have to pay crazy money to get the watches they want and then be exposed by the fact that they could depreciate horrendously because the market's changed so much, so hopefully it's in a more balanced position. But aside from that, we all love our watches and we love our cars and that's never going to change, which is lovely. And there's so many beautiful cars coming out just now and beautiful watches that will be here for the rest of our lifetime and beyond. So I think it's still a great and lucky place to be.
- [29:48]
A
People ask me and they say to Dave, likewise. Do you ever run out of things to talk about on the show? Do you ever have sleepless nights thinking the podcast is due this week. We have got nothing to tell listeners and it never happens because my email inbox is just crammed every day with brands that we know, brands we like, brands we talk about, and brand new brands that nobody has ever heard of before. Last week we recorded a show and there was a company called Block rg. Never heard of them. They were launching a watch that was around about £350,000. That's quite a big ask in this day and age. But it was a cool looking piece and if you were into that aesthetic, you like Richard Mille, you wanted a tourbillon on the wrist, something that looked like a glass capsule, more of an ornament, more of a jewelry piece. Perhaps you could pick that up. In the same episode I talked about the new Casio G Shock 6900 series, the Fantastic Four Limited Edition in white and blue. And I was equally praising that because it doesn't matter the cost, it's how it looks and how it makes you feel. As you mentioned, discretionary purchase. It doesn't matter if it's 100 pound G shock, it's still luxury. You don't need that. You can tell the time with your phone. It's just something that makes you feel good and it's something that will not evaporate, it will not depreciate to Nothing. Unlike the NFTs from a few years ago that have completely disappeared along with people's money. But tell us more about your motorsport endeavors, because we never really got into that in the last episode, which was many years ago, you got a bit of a bug for motorsport and you have been across to Germany, but that's not always the case. You've done things in Scotland, more so down south because they have many more racetracks that you can utilize. But where did you decide that now is the time to get into this? Because you got yourself a Hyundai, even got yourself a Porsche GT car back in the day.
- [31:29]
B
Yeah, I think I could probably blame my father for that. My father loved racing and he raced when he was very young and I think when I was about 19, 20, I started racing Ford Fiesta Challenge cars up here in a sort of Scottish championship. So probably like many young guys who love driving and love to sort of go on track. So it's been in the, in the blood for a very long time and I've enjoyed my cars through the years and you know, had various cars going along there. I wanted to, I just love driving, you know, I, for those that don't know, I, I broke my back back in 1997 and I put myself in a wheelchair so I'm sort of paralyzed from the waist down. But very luckily the, the, the upper body, apart from a bit of a paunch, is working quite well and it still allows me to drive and I, I ski and I play tennis as well. I just sit on my ass all day. Ricky. Apart from that, life is pretty similar, funnily enough.
- [32:21]
A
You mentioned the bike accident. I didn't know if that was an area you wanted to bring up. Yesterday marks the 10 year anniversary of my life changing bike accident where I ended up in hospital for four or five nights. Broke everything, coccyx, arm, fingers, wrist, all kinds of bits and bobs. And it was good to reflect yesterday about how that changed the trajectory of my life and about still here.
- [32:43]
B
Like yourself, I had a lot of fun riding motorbikes. Did I ignore the fact I could fall off one day and what that would mean? Not totally, but you just tend to put it at the back of your mind. And I often see myself with bikers and saying to them, look, do you wear an air jacket? You know, if you don't, please go and buy one because I think it would make so much difference. And for those that don't know, it's, it is the helmet, you know, around your, your body that very, in a millionth of a second sort of very quickly explodes and protects your body and that sort of thing.
- [33:12]
A
So it's like an airbag for your bag?
- [33:14]
B
It is an airbag, absolutely. But I think, yeah, I just love driving and I do go to Germany in my wife's opinion, far too often. It's no different probably than someone going to play golf or going to play tennis. It's about people. I love people. I love being around the right people where we have a common interest and going out on track with your friends and having a bit of banter at the end of the night is just great fun, really is. Locally we have people racing up here in Scotland over the last four years, Edinwatch company sponsored a classic sports and saloon championship which was great fun to do just being involved with then. And then we worked with a lovely company called Destination Nurburgring that had pre track days a year out in Germany and I've been sponsoring them for the last few years as well. So that's been really good for the brand in putting Edinburgh watch company out and amongst a sort of community of sports car guys that love their watches and they can afford these sort of watches. But that's now stopped and. But I'm still going out there. I still love driving. And that Hyundai you spoke about, which we've had two and a half years of really good fun in it, that one's sort of being retired now.
- [34:22]
A
What is the story here? If somebody had said to me, you five years ago, 10 years ago, Hyundai race cars, Nurburgring, you'd have been laughed out at the place.
- [34:30]
B
We would. I know Hyundai have done a phenomenal job in. They've got a great range. I mean the 5N, the electric car is an absolutely ballistic missile. But the, the i30M, which is the car I have, which is a bit of a. Bit like. It's like a Golf or a Ford Focus. It's just a really good car. It looks good, it drives phenomenally and they spent a lot of time developing it at the Nurburgring. So basically I just took it home.
- [34:55]
A
Ricky, is it a bit like back in the day people laughed at Proton cars, then Lotus brought out the Proton GTI by Lotus.
- [35:01]
B
Yeah, I think it is. And the car is outstanding. They have a ring taxi out there, which Hyundai sponsor and you pay €100 and you get tickets taken around in this stock Hyundai by an incredible driver and that sold it to me. So we've had a lot of fun out there. About two and a half years driving that, but you know, I sort of taken what I could out of that car and I've been lusting after this particular Golf for the last six months. That is a golf club sport that's been built by a race team down south, which to all intents and purposes is a racing car for the road. So I'm really looking forward to getting that next week.
- [35:34]
A
You showed me the pictures of this and I thought, why is he showing me this fast and furious Max Pro style Golf? I'm not really interested than that. And it was only today you said you don't know what's under the hood.
- [35:44]
B
No, it's an absolute what they call a sleeper. It's Going to be a wolf in sheep's clothing. And I'm really looking forward to taking that one out. So, yeah, cars are very much a part of my life now. They're really good fun. I still absolutely love my watches as well. It's just really, you know, talking to you and I mean, I listen to the show a lot, you know, particularly when I'm driving, going places. I love listening to the show and I feel. Do you know, when I listen to some of your guests on the show and I was driving across here, I thought, bloody hell, Jonathan. He's got amazing guys coming to talk about that. And then he's still. And then he's got me. So I feel very honored to. To be here. But we've got one thing in common. We just love watchers, don't we? And. And I think that's. I think it's what it's about and I think it's lovely. If I just may say to you as well, an admiration for what you've built and you've not done it yourself, you've done it with great people around you as well, with. With David and others helping you, et cetera. It's just a lovely, lovely show and a community you built. So it's just really nice. Nice to have almost when we both started, almost about the same time together, didn't we, when we did that first show. And it's been great just to see your own progress, Ricky, as well, and, you know, hats off to you for the way it's going.
- [36:48]
A
Well, thank you very much. But I do remember that first meeting. It was before COVID so my memory was still functional back then. And you had a friend that had a restaurant in Cumbernauld, I believe, and you asked if we could use the function area on a quiet night to go and record. We didn't have proper microphones, we didn't even have a proper recorder back then. But we still. I sat down and I got the inside scoop on Jonathan and Edinburgh watch. But I'd met you before that. I had actually bumped into you numerous times. Porsche and the Glen, which is an event that happens annually here in Scotland for Porsche owners and aficionados. I had got my first Boxster and I came along and I'd seen you and I didn't know who you were and I wasn't even into watches. I just walked past, looked and went. They were pretty cool. Moved on, Same again. Ignition. Scotland was an event at the SEC, which was. Oh, God, that must have been like 2016, 2017, before I got into watches, definitely. Well, before the podcast bumped into you there, I think you had a surprise mystery guest stop by then, a certain.
- [37:43]
B
Mr. Coultard that came on our stand and he tried a Rolex Daytona on, which I was very excited. It was a. Remember those lovely rose gold ones with a chocolate dial? And he had it on his wrist and I really thought he was going to buy it. And Sammy said, there's no way he's going to buy that, Jonathan. He gets them free from Rolex. But it was a nice thought and we got some good photographs and you know what, he was absolutely lovely. He was really, really nice. So, yeah, you talk about those events and the things we happen. I think, you know, as I built the brand, they're getting out. And the Royal Highlands show was probably my most successful event. An annual show with about 240,000 people that came along and we had a stand set up with, you know, circa 50 watches on show and I had some really lovely people working with me and we just had really good fun. And the farmers are great fun. They came along and of course, you know, the husbands were out there buying their combines and the wives were looking around and you know, the husbands would come along and they would look at the watches and think about it and trying to get negotiate and they go back and say, well, I'll go and check and see what the wife thinks. And of course the ladies used to come along and they'd look at the watches, they'd try them on and they go, yeah, I'll take that. No mucking about, no, I need to go and speak to my husband. We'll just take it. So we'd see them year after year coming back and it was great fun. I kind of missed that, you know, it was good fun but like everything, it is all about a balance and sadly, you've got to consider the risks as well.
- [38:59]
A
It was the Highland show that you were talking about some nice people being there, but I remember a story about some not so nice people being there.
- [39:07]
B
I remember, gosh, I don't think we ever spoke about this one before, but I remember, I don't mind saying now, but I remember we were at another Scottish show, I won't mention the name of them, but prime Scottish event which we were exhibiting at and we had a wonderful show and again had the chance to meet lots, lots of customers trying on watches, etc. And it was really good. However, as we were closing down, of course you can look at things and reflect on things and hopefully do things better but unbeknownst to me, as I was closing down the stand I was being observed by, by a couple of gentlemen who had their eyes on the prizes as it were. And suddenly the lady next door to me was exhibiting, shouted to me, jonathan, they've got your black bag. And I thought well I don't have a black bag. And I looked down, I thought well I don't have a brown case. So I looked down the grass and suddenly saw this young lady, he wasn't that young, he's about 40. And he was walking down there with my brown case underneath his shoulder. And of course I then shouted at the top of my voice to my colleague to come and help. Well, earlier on in that day there was a lovely chap that came across the stand and he was about 6 foot 2, big strong rugby player who by chance was exhibiting across from me and he heard me shouting, realized something was going on, looked down the grass walkway and by now saw this gentleman running with my case. Well, it was picturesque to watch. He took off after him and he did this most wonderful rugby tackle, brought the guy to the ground, people surrounding him. My chum came up and got the watches from him. We surrounded this guy and we literally got him red handed. So I got my watches back and of course the police then came along and I want to be low key, I didn't want to bring the name of the show down, I didn't want this to be spoken about, etc. So we got the watches back and he was arrested and off enough then and a year later, which is typically the time it takes, it went to court and this was an absolute no brainer. I had more witnesses than you can imagine. We had to account what watchers are there, what was still and everybody giving their statements and the, the judge at that point said right jury, look I think we've heard everything, go and make your decision. And of course his defense lawyer was doing a jolly good job as well and perhaps trying to put a little bit of doubt in the mind of the jury as it were and they came back with case not proven. I could not believe it. Well they said, well you thought the case was brown but you thought it was black. Was he actually holding the case at the time when you tackled him or had he dropped it and he got away? It. There was also an accomplice and was it the accomplice or was it him? So the defense lawyer did a very good job. He's had a life of crime and he's no doubt probably doing the same thing. But the thing about it for me is it's happened, no one got hurt, we got the watches back and that is just a risk of exhibiting, as it were. And as you know, that's not the only one. We had a slightly, a bigger one down in London. But these are the things that can happen when you're a watch dealer and it is very much risk and reward, but it's about thinking about how you do it. It's, et cetera. And I guess, you know, when we talked earlier on about, well, why did you stop? I guess that's something that isn't there so much anymore now, you know, when people thinking about becoming a watch dealer, there's, there's so many things to consider about it. But, you know, I think, in summary, I had a wonderful ten and a half years. I'm delighted to have been able to do that and, you know, move forwards.
- [42:25]
A
The risk that you took being the dealer and then people looking at you being in a wheelchair as well, that multiplies that dramatically. And it's, it's lucky, as you say, that you had people beside you working with you, somebody that spotted something happening there and then a massive chap who can run and tackle somebody professionally. But that doesn't happen for everybody. And that's why most recently we've had a couple of the police officers from the Metropolitan Police flying Squad on the show to repeat the mantra of to be safe, to be sound, to watch what you're wearing, watch what you're storing, and watch what buying and selling. And that is something we're going to continue to beat the drum on. But before we finish up, is there anything else you want to chat about?
- [43:06]
B
I don't know. I think we've covered quite a lot, haven't we?
- [43:09]
A
We have.
- [43:09]
B
I think it's. Yeah. No, I just. I'd probably like to just take this opportunity to look back over 10 years and thank my customers who've many of them become friends, for trusting me and giving that opportunity as my business grower, who I've had days and days of conversations with. You know, you've really given a very important part of my life. I've really, really enjoyed it. And the watch community are a lovely bunch of people and I've really, really enjoyed it and I very much want to stay a part of it. I'll still come to shows, et cetera, and we'll see what the future looks like. But no, thank you. Thank you for having me on the show. Thank you for listening to what I've said and hopefully Your consumers will enjoy that. And it's been great fun.
- [43:54]
A
It certainly has. And this has been a long time coming and I think to put the bow on the end of the show and to everybody know who maybe has never met Jonathan in the past, hopefully you do in the future events. He is a watch enthusiast and it's not all Rolex, Daytonas and Sea Dwellers. He has got a studio underdog in his collection. I remember bumping into him just a few months ago and he was wearing a studio Underdog, a watch that's been in his collection since he first heard about them on our show many, many years ago. And he was asking about the new Christopher Ward Loco, another watch that is relatively, in the grand scheme of things, pretty inexpensive. So that is us at the end of, I wouldn't say an action packed show. This has been more like a version of this is your Life. If anyone remembers Eamon Andrews or in later years, other presenters of that TV show, I'm dating myself not quite as much as Jonas, admitting that he is 60, but definitely does not drive like somebody of that age. Anything else you want to add before we finish up?
- [44:49]
B
No, I think it's just farewell and thank you very much for having me. It's been great talking to you again, most definitely.
- [44:56]
A
Thanks so much and we'll speak to you soon.