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Scottish Watches Podcast #778 : Chatting With An Old Friend
00:49:25
Old buddy Joshua Flagg is here once again and offers an in-depth discussion of the evolution of independent watch culture and the importance of enthusiast-led events in the modern watch...
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the Scottish Watches podcast. We have got a gentleman on the line that I met at the very beginning of things here at Scottish Watches Tours may have been one of the very first events I attended. He put together. And this was back before the COVID pandemic. This was back in the glory days, the good old days. And of course, it was the watch it fair, an event I've talked about at length on the show before because it led us to where we are today. It forged new pathways, we created new alliances, we met people that have remained friends to this very day. We actually caught up with some of them recently at British Watch Watchmakers Day, including the folks at Zero west who reminded me their first ever interview on a podcast was with ourselves back in 2019. But the man at the helm, the gentleman who put everything together and continues to this day is Joshua Flagg and he is with us today. How are you doing, sir?
- [00:46]
B
Wow. Very good. Thank you very much. And I must say, that was. I think that brought a tear to my eye, that introduction. Thank you very much. I think you're overselling it a bit as well.
- [00:55]
A
No, not at all. I try not to do such things on the show and I'm very careful with my praise because very few people deserve it. But the event you put on that you cobbled together really quickly, you were trying to run around dealing with all these different brands, some that had never exhibited before, and they'd come along to your event. I don't think it was your first event. I think you'd actually moved the location or something, so you were up to high doe you'd brought this person and that person in Christopher Wardworth exhibit. Lots of other brands, some have disappeared and some are bigger and bolder and better than ever, including pinion and isotope that have just gone on to incredible things. But we're going to tell everybody to check the show notes. That's where all the information on not just the events but the watches that we're going to discuss today will end up. Thanks to Mizzy Owl. That link will be in your podcast player takes you to our website and you can either play along at home as you're listening or after the fact if you're doing something cool. Relive these fantastic memories with Joshua and myself and find out exactly what we're talking about. But the first thing is to say welcome because you were on the show. We recorded in. This is going to sound dodgy and it's not dodgy. We recorded in a shady hotel room. It was back in 2019 and it wasn't Kim Kardashian style hotel room recordings, it wasn't Paris Hilton. It was all completely legit and above board. But things have moved on since then. You've remained true to your world. You've stuck to your guns on absolutely everything when it comes to the watch world. And many Johnny come lately have popped their heads up, started watch event watch shows, thought they could make a buck off it, realized quite quickly how difficult it is to herd cats. But no, you've got another event happening extremely close to this record. That's why we've launched this one as quickly as possible recording the Thursday. This episode will be out on a Monday. The second thing we're going to do after the show note mention is obviously the wrist check. So if you go on the wrist today for us.
- [02:40]
B
Okay well right now I have an Omega SMP 300 Seamaster Professional. The white dial with the ceramic dial so it's very reflective, very lovely and the ceramic bezel insert as well on the Omega rubber strap. So this I'm a bit of an Omega boy. So it's either this or the 39.5mm Planet Ocean. The previous generation, not one of the, not one of the new planet Oceans. So they're my two go tos. So I tend to wear the Planet Ocean for more like smart, smarter wear if I'm wearing a suit or going out or something. But yeah, my day to day wear is this S&P 300. How about yourself?
- [03:21]
A
Ooh, you are a professional. You bounced it straight back to me. But before I answer I'm going to say to you well done for playing Switzerland there and not getting involved and I'll pick this brand that's coming to my show and I'll piss off all the other brands that are coming to the show and don't have wristwear on. Today I have got something on the wrist similar idea. I did look through the attendee list of who's coming along this year and I thought yeah, I've got a couple of pieces from a couple of those different brands and if I wear one the others might not be super happy about it. You know, everyone's territorial. So I'm wearing something that is relating to not today, not when the show airs, but just a few days back. And that is my R2D2 watch. This is an inexpensive knuckle. It's not inexpensive anymore because in the secondary market, because these limited edition fossil pieces disappeared when they came out a number of years ago on the secondary fetches a pretty penny and this, I believe, was designed by one of their main guys over at Fossil. And he's still there to this day. And that's Ryan White. He put together a design for Disney Star Wars Lucas, which is all part of the same conglomerate now. And it's R2D2 on the dial. And you might think to yourself, yeah, okay, cool. Star wars watch. You've seen a million of them before. Well, this one stands out because it's not a jump hour because it's only a few hundred bucks, it's a sliding hour. So to tell the time, the hour is actually shown in the aperture in the center. And then the minute is actually his little probe hand that sticks out from the centre. Looks like he's doing a bit of a helicopter. And if I take this one off the wrist, I can actually show Joshua what is happening. As I rotate that round, you can see his little hand moves.
- [04:50]
B
Oh, yes, in the eye.
- [04:51]
A
And the hour is sliding. So we're up to 7 o', clock, goes around one more time, goes to 8. But over at the 9 o' clock position there is a little sub dial cut out that shows you the day night indicator. So it shows you if it's light or dark outside. Now, this is an analog watch. It is automatic and it's not super expensive. And lots of kids got right into this one. This was a huge seller back in the day and I can see why, because they've taken an idea that could have been done extremely poorly, very kitsch, and they've made it into a watch that is really well executed, well put together and well thought out because it's brilliant. When I go to comic cons, it's one I try and dig out the watch box to take with me, even though it is mega inexpensive.
- [05:31]
B
Well, may the force be with you.
- [05:33]
A
Yes, a couple of days ago.
- [05:34]
B
Yes.
- [05:34]
A
And everybody forgot. Simona, the wife, went crazy because she thought to herself, we could have done something really cool for that. So now what she's done is she's made a calendar that lists off all the key points in the year. So if something ties in, Mother's Day, Father's Day, Halloween, Burns Night, St. Andrew's Day, Valentine, anything at all. She's now got a list and ahead of time we're going to come up with some ideas and some themes and things like that. So the next biggie in my head will be Halloween. And there's always some crazy stuff. Mr. Jones will pop up with something a couple of weeks beforehand because they always. But they are not one of the attendees at your show, your show has got a rather large roster. You sent across all the details. A lot of familiar faces.
- [06:15]
B
Yes.
- [06:15]
A
And quite a few new names that I haven't actually seen before, heard of and looking forward to catching up with. But maybe for people that don't know about yourself, what you do, because you've got a lot of stuff going on. You've got like a website, you do watch reviews, you're getting into the groove with things. You took a little bit of a hiatus and you're back once again. So maybe give us a bit of your background. How did you get into watches yourself?
- [06:36]
B
So. Watches myself, yeah. So I've liked watches for a very long time, since I was young. And one story that I do enjoy sharing is almost like my, my villain origin story.
- [06:49]
A
Can you tell us stories you don't enjoy sharing?
- [06:50]
B
This more fun goes back to in the days of the Argos catalog. I don't know if you are aware of, of such a catalog of dreams. Yeah, exactly.
- [07:01]
A
Circling what you want for Christmas. Circling what you want for your birthday, mate.
- [07:05]
B
Like every other young child in the United Kingdom, I'm sure. Dog ear the page, circle the watch you want. So there was this amazing watch in
- [07:14]
A
there for American listeners. You're thinking of like the Sears catalog, something like that. You would just circle what you want for Christmas. What you want is a gift from somebody and you'd leave it in places that your parents would see.
- [07:27]
B
And it was amazing, like bedtime reading as well, just flicking through the pages. Oh, loved it. So there was this Casio, this one particular Casio in there which was a touch screen data bank and it was 50 quid. So I saved up £2 a week. So I did washing the car and some other chores. Two pounds a week. I got saved up, saved up, saved up. I got my 50 quid and Argos brought out a brand new catalog just in time. And that very watch was not in there. So. So I, I ended up getting another watch. Like a. It was a nice G Shock or something else. Some other Casio. But later on, more recently, I now that I'm an adult and I can do whatever I want. I bought that from that very watch from ebay.
- [08:14]
A
What does it look like?
- [08:16]
B
So it's got a little screen at the top, sort of like a dot matrix and then four buttons, four buttons on the screen. It's just a square and you can touch each of the buttons for a different feature like a date. It was a data bank more than anything. But you could also do Other stuff like calculator, you know, all the classic Casio gadgets and gizmos. That was brilliant. I loved it. When I, when I finally got it, all those decades later or all those years later, I was like, finally, my, my childhood dream has been completed.
- [08:44]
A
I've got a Casio Data bank story as well that I've told in the podcast, but you probably wouldn't have heard that. Okay. And that is quite a similar tale. I had saved up for the newfangled thing, which was a digital LCD watch with the dot matrix display on it and at the databank. And I remember being in a nightclub and chatting to a girl at the time and instead of taking her number because we didn't have mobile phones at that moment, instead of taking a number with paper and pen, I punched it into my data bank.
- [09:11]
B
My first question, did that impress her or did it repulse her?
- [09:15]
A
I think it was absolutely fine.
- [09:17]
B
Ah, amazing.
- [09:18]
A
Yeah, I can't remember too many of the details. That one never went anywhere. From what I can remember, it was many, many years ago. But yes, involving watches, nightclubs, even back in the 90s, that was all about that.
- [09:31]
B
Nice. So, yeah, I've liked watches for a very long time. When I, as I'm sure many of the collectors do, I was flipping watches all the time, you know, buying, selling, keeping it on ebay, getting a nice bargain, selling it for a little bit more so I could get more watches or more expensive watches. And at the time I was a web developer, so I thought, well, I'm doing this so much, I might as well, I can, I can make a website, so I might as well. Uh, so yeah, in 2013, watch it all about was born. Um, and it was just a case of tracking my, my flipping my collection. You know, I'd write up very basic reviews, take really rubbish pictures and just learn on the, on the go. Really fumbled myself, fumbled, fumbled my way through it. Um, and funny enough, Christopher Ward was the very first brand to ever send me a watch to review. Before that it was just fully self funded. You know, I'd buy a watch, review it, flip it, buy a watch and so on and so forth. And yeah, it just, just grew like naturally, I guess. And then 2019, so 2019 was the first watch watch fair.
- [10:38]
A
You got to be careful who you see that name, watch it Watch fair.
- [10:43]
B
Yeah, I've not thought of that before. There wasn't really any watch get togethers, especially in the Midland Midlands. And I thought, well, I might as well, you know, I've got, I Know a lot of people on various forums, people who follow my watch blog. I might as well, you know, if no one else is, why not give it a shot? So, yeah, it was just a case of I hired, hired a hotel room, invited a bunch of brands, we split the cost of the hire and yeah, people came amazingly and obviously yourself traveled all the way down as well, which was, which was incredible as well. And then since then it's just been a case of I'm not an event organizer in the slightest, I'd never done it before, I didn't know what I was doing. So it's been very much a case of learn on the job, gradually honing the skills. This year actually is probably the biggest change that I've made so far, so I'm quite looking forward to it.
- [11:37]
A
How many events have you run then from the inaugural one in 2019 until just now?
- [11:42]
B
Yes. So this will be the fifth and yeah, growing year on year in terms of watch brands and visitors etc. So I thought this is getting pretty serious. It seems to be relatively well regarded in the uk so I thought, oh, I better actually start taking this seriously. So this year I invested a bit new brand like proper branding because it was always just the 12 and 60 watcher watch fair and I thought I want it to have its own thing really. So I invested in like branding for Watcher Watch Fair. Got a new website made as well.
- [12:17]
A
Is this the Cobbler's Kid Shoes? You're a web developer but you got somebody else to help you out?
- [12:21]
B
Yeah, with the, with the design stuff. Yeah, definitely. Because I'm not particularly a designer, so one of my good mates that I've worked with for a very long time obviously paid him, but I said, look, I'd like a professional branding package put together. So he, he helped me out very kindly with, with that. So yeah, it's looking a lot more professional. And this year as well, another sort of upgrade that I'm introducing. When I very first started, I wanted it to be a watch event that I would go to first and foremost as a watch fan. Obviously it is, it is a side, side, side business. It's not my main day to day job, I'm a web developer by trade. But it's, you know, watches the watch event, that's all. I do it for the love of it mainly. So for, for many of the watch events, obviously it is a business and people have to be, you know, it is what it is. So which is why it's, it's quite good in that I Can I have the flexibility? And I'm not financially constrained as much as, as of other events. So what I'm doing this time around is I'm, I'm making like a little mini, mini website app thing to guide people around. Because one thing I do find is when I'm at watch events, a lot of people, a lot of the visitors don't really know what to say or how to start conversations with the watch brands. They'll just like slowly walk past, they'll look and then they'll carry on walking. So I thought, well, how can I help? How can I help aid conversation and connections?
- [13:52]
A
Well, this is something that we talk about as much as we can do. When you go and speak to a brand, or you email a brand, you phone a brand or you meet somebody from a brand, an event, they're there to not only just talk about their watches, but give you background. Never feel intimidated, always walk up because the reason the person's on the other side of the trading table is because they love watches. It's their passion. And it's such a strange industry because as an industry, you know, everyone has to make pennies to pay mortgages and put food on the table. But in the watch industry, it's a collaboration, it's a community as well. And mentioned Pinion, mentioned Isotope, those guys behind the scenes there, even the guys at Christopher Ward. I remember being told the story many times from Mike Frantz about how they had got rid of their previous business, the early Lear center, walked away with a pretty penny. They could have just sailed off into the sunset, but they didn't. They had a passion for something. And 25 years later, almost, this is where Christopher Ward are just now. So if you're coming to an event, don't feel scared about approaching somebody, even if they look busy, they're there for you 100%.
- [14:56]
B
Even if it's a watch that at first glance you may not be necessarily interested in. Because like you say, it's amazing talking to the people behind the stands. So their history behind it, the reasons behind it, obviously all these watch brands who are that, it's not like a cookie cutter template. It's not just they've gone to a Chinese factory, they bought, you know, a standard watch case and dial and they've slapped their logo on it. Each one of these is, you know, custom designed, which is amazing. So each brand has that amazing story in one or two, like amazing facts behind them. So I'm going to collate all of them. And then when you're visiting A watch brand, you'll have them available like conversation starters. So then you can go to someone like McQuade watches, and they're like, tell me about this Damascus steel case. How do you make it? You know, how does it work? Because even if you're not interested in buying it, you're still learning. And at the end of the day, you know, us watch geeks, we love to learn about all things and everything to do with watches. So just asking questions like that. And yeah, I'll be using it for like, the giveaway as well. So each table will have a little QR code, so then you can scan your progress for each exhibitor. You'll be able to add little notes as well and then email yourself all your notes. So as you're going around, you can scan a table and be like, oh, this, this watch from Diatom Watches. This is cool. Because they send every watch that they sell into space. I mean, that's pretty amazing. And then at the end of the day, you can just click a button and then all your notes will be emailed to you. Saves you having to sort of have a million tabs open on your phone and then forget stuff.
- [16:31]
A
And it's like a digital note in a handkerchief. I know when I go to events, I'll take a photograph of the stand and what is there. And when I go to record a podcast with Dave after the fact, I can't remember anything. But see if I have a visual reference or a textual reference, all the thoughts, the feelings, the emotions of looking at that watch, discovering a new thing, they come flooding back. So that is a brilliant idea. And again, you don't want to be trying to write stuff down or take notes when you're enjoying what's in front of you.
- [16:57]
B
Yeah. And I want it to be accessible to everyone as well. I really want Watch it to be the least snobby watch event going. So I'll have like little beginner section on the app as well. Like new to watches, start here. And it gives you like in as short words as possible, like key things you need to know, glossary or whatever like that. Just, just to, you know, make people not scared to come to a watch event. Because let's face it, some watch events can be pretty extreme, some of them could be pretty serious, which I don't want to watch it to be, you know, I want it to be very friendly and enthusiast led. So, yeah, that's a sort of in the works at the moment. I thought, yeah, I can do that. So why not? And, and see where it goes. Just trying to make. Help people enjoy the event as much as possible and increase their length of time, speak to as many people as possible. The giveaways will all be done through the app as well, so they'll have to, like, scan a certain amount of brands. So it's good for the Watch brands as well, because they're sort of like. They appreciate that more people will come to them.
- [18:01]
A
Is this like get 5 stamps and get a free coffee at the end?
- [18:04]
B
Exactly, yeah. Digitally, yeah. So a passport challenge, if you will. So you have to scan 10 tables and then you'll automatically be entered into the giveaways. So it just encourages people basically to speak to the watch brands and it gives them something back for doing it as well.
- [18:21]
A
Should we tell people when the event's happening and where it is? Because it's happening at a key weekend for all those fathers out there. Yeah.
- [18:28]
B
And I had no idea about this until you told me. So the Watch event is happening in the Midlands, Solihull, which is just on the east coast of Birmingham, and it is happening on June 20, which is Father's Day weekend. So Saturday, June 20.
- [18:44]
A
So you've got a lot of time, everyone listening just now, to tell your significant other and your kids that this is what dad wants to do. So for Dad's weekend, this is where dad is going.
- [18:53]
B
Exactly. Enjoy a nice outing with your loved ones. Easy to get to. So it's right on the outskirts. So it's like minutes from the M42, M40, M6, M1. All of the motorways you could ever dream of. It has. It has good public transport links as well. And. Yes. So it's like six and a. Six or seven weeks away now, I think. I don't know exactly. So I implore you listeners, please purchase a ticket@watchitfair.com and come along and have a fantastic time, even if you don't have a father or a son to bring with you. Come anyway, because we will have a jolly good time altogether.
- [19:32]
A
Well, if the first event, which is the only one I've been to, which is terrible because we kind of like ships passing in the night message once a year and you go, hey, Ricky, my event's coming up. Any chance you can mention it on the show? And I say, sure, give me a call next week and tell me all about it. You never call, I never talk about it.
- [19:49]
B
It's just one of those things, isn't it? Which is why it's great to finally on here and properly talk about it.
- [19:55]
A
Yeah. So I'm looking forward to traveling down. It's been about a year since I was last in Birmingham. It was, oh, Autosport last year in January. Not the greatest of times in Birmingham at the nec. So this will be my first jaunt back down. Looking forward to it. Taking the wife with me. Going to make a decent time of it because, again, well, let's actually talk about some of the brands out there because you sent me the list ahead of time and I looked at it and thought, how are you managing to put this together as a side gig, a side hustle? And this isn't your main job because this is bigger than some of the Watch shows I see in different countries.
- [20:28]
B
Yeah, well, I am in a very fortunate position because I run 12 and 60, so I have, I do have a lot of connections to many, many Watch brands already. But also I have that kind of selling point as well. Almost like gravitas in the industry. I don't want it to come across the wrong way. But I suppose rather than me just being a random dude saying, hey, I'm creating a Watch event. Do you want to. A Watch band would be like, who are you? No way. No thanks. Whereas at least I can say, you know, I've. Watch event. This is Watch at Watch Fair. This is the fifth one. You know, we run 12 and 60. We have tens of thousands of visits to the website every month, blah, blah, blah. You know, there is a bit of weight behind it already, thankfully, so that's. I'm, I'm, you know, I'm grateful to that. But, yeah, it is a lot of work. Work that starts, you know, six months ago. Started inviting brands in, like, October, November last year, searching for venues as well. Because each time, each time I want it to get better as well. So, yeah, every time it's been in a different venue at the moment, which is. Which is a bit annoying.
- [21:33]
A
They tell you to never come back.
- [21:35]
B
No, not that. It's just that I'm like, this wasn't. This place wasn't good enough for a Watch event that I would be proud of.
- [21:42]
A
So run us through some of the heavy hitters then that are coming along because there are names there that we all know and love. You've got Bamford, obviously. You've got. Oh, God, I'm looking at it. You've got Pinion that we mentioned earlier. You've even got some of the weird and wonderful guys like micro mil Spec that we've talked about length in the show. But run us through the who's who of the Watch affair?
- [22:03]
B
Well, yeah, I mean I don't know if we, we probably don't have enough time to go through all 43, 44 brands coming, but we could probably pick a few highlights. But obviously disclaimer. Every watch brand is a highlight. So if there is a watch brand listening and I haven't mentioned their name, please don't take it the wrong way. But some brands that I'm particularly excited about seeing is first of all Marie Sequoia. Very big, obviously Swiss made brand. I reviewed their Acon Ventura which was a fantastic watch. The Acon range is a brilliant range as well.
- [22:38]
A
Which iteration of that watch did you review and when?
- [22:42]
B
It was a couple of years ago now. So I don't know if it's been renewed or not. So it's. That's a good question. You asked me.
- [22:49]
A
Reason I ask is I own one Maurice Lecant watch and it is a Ventura. It is the bronze with the pea green dial and the brown straps.
- [23:00]
B
So this one was the, the blue, the blue one. I'm having to rack my brains now. It's like hundreds of watches ago. So it was blue, I remember that had like a glossy dial. I don't know if it had the blue bezel insert as well.
- [23:15]
A
I hate the way that certain people, not everybody, but certain people dismiss Maurice Lacroix as a looky likey ap because for the money they are so well put together. I remember when I first got mine and I went to see our friend in Glasgow, Martin Walpole at Martins of Glasgow. Funnily enough, Watch Emporium repair center, service center. And I said what do you think of that? And he popped his loupe out and had a look at it and went yeah, this is put together just as well as a Rolex.
- [23:41]
B
Wow, okay, well that's saying something. I mean I visually and like you say put together, I, I think it's a better watch than the Oris Equi. I know that's quite, quite a statement because I know so many people love that and fall over the Orisa Key. But I would prefer to have a marissaquoire micro mil spec. I think we were chatting about that earlier as well. I mean they, they create watches for the military so you know, they're not gonna break anytime soon. Full Omari as well, Very like elegant brand which I'm quite looking forward to seeing. One watch brand in particular. So this is for Martin. Probably won't appreciate me sharing this, but MD watches, Martin design watches. He's from Ireland and he was supposed to come to the event last year and one week before he said, yeah, I'm just prepping everything and my passport's expired so I, I can't make it, which is a shame. But they are really, really impressive watches for the money. So that's one brand that I'm really looking forward to seeing. Ember watches as well there at British Watchmakers Day. And John's design, he's a furniture designer I believe and you can tell because his product design is absolutely fantastic. Like his cases. Oh and just the colorways, amazing watches, love them.
- [24:54]
A
These are guys that do the pink and blue things.
- [24:57]
B
Yeah. But I think he does regular colors, colorways as well. But we don't, you know, we like the exciting, exciting colors. So yep, Watch Gecko are coming. So they're bringing a few watches as well, watch brands as well. So they're bringing micromill spec. They're bringing Full on Mari as well. But they're also bringing Boulder too. So I'm quite looking forward to seeing Boulder. I reviewed a couple of Leon's watches and they are really, really solid, well made watches as well. And then there's just like a huge collection of British built watches. Watch brands now. And the number of watch brands now where it is constructed in England or the United Kingdom, sorry. Is just incredible. Like just three years ago it would not be as many as there are now. So yeah, Brunel, they're a very new watch brand. We've always got great British watch company Colin with his completely handmade watches which is impressive as well. What else have we got? Abinger Adley or Alfaro? They're, they're made in the United Kingdom. Aria Nostalgia. So that's Kieran from Top tier ticker off YouTube. So again, another British put together band. Pompeak Schofield obviously Pinion, where Pierce actually makes them all himself now. Maestone, yeah. Jan Szarnowski as well. His watches are beautiful and he makes them all himself.
- [26:27]
A
So how do you get in touch with these brands? Do you have existing relationship with all of them or certain amounts? Do they then pass you on to another brand? Because as I say there's lots in here that I know. There are lots in here I've never heard of in my life. And we get approached on a daily basis. We get hundreds of emails from different brands, existing and brand new. And I'm thinking who are these folks? Yeah, okay, we know this person. We know that Boulder like to see them in real life. Ferland, Mari, we went to their atelier when we're over in Geneva. There are so many standouts here and it's a mix and match. Bruce Lacroix, they're huge. They're in the high street, they're across the world and then you've got the likes of, as you say, pinion. You've got MHD who I spoke to, he used to be a designer at Morgan Car Co. So you've got everybody a couple of ways.
- [27:13]
B
A lot of them are previous contacts. But I just have one gigantic spreadsheet where I a Google sheet where every single watch brand who I ever have spoken to, I'll save their, their details. But also I have a specific section for British watch brands. I appreciate that. Due to Brexit it is difficult for non United Kingdom brands to come over because they probably have loads of paperwork to do or import issues or whatever. So I do have a dedicated section to British watch brands and whenever I'm scrolling Instagram or Facebook or whatever, if I find a British watch brand that I've not heard of before, if it's brand new, I will save their details as well. So I just basically have this central, central spot. So then I just email everyone, you know. Well, I, I do it in phases because obviously I don't want to email everyone. And then a thousand people, that would be amazing. Like a thousand watch brands say, yeah, okay, we'll come. And then I'm like, oh crap. So I do it in phases.
- [28:10]
A
Yeah.
- [28:10]
B
Like I say it starts in like November last year where I just start, I pick a date and then I'm like, we're gonna do it this date. Let me know if you're interested. And then gradually more people say, yes, no, maybe again, I'll keep a track of what who said what. If I haven't heard back, I'll chase them up. It is a lot of manual labor and I really should sort of automate a lot of it. But I guess part of the charm is that it's just me.
- [28:33]
A
It's just you that does that. You don't have anyone helping?
- [28:36]
B
No, no, it is just me.
- [28:38]
A
Well, let's go through some of these companies because it's always good to find out a little bit more about some of the brands. And you've got heavy hitters, you've got Bamford, London, we know all about them.
- [28:47]
B
Yeah.
- [28:48]
A
Amber got to meet them a couple of times. You get Golby Watches, met them a couple of times. Simona chats with them behind the scenes. And you've got Sidereous. We actually met up, up with the main man behind the brand. He came across to Edinburgh last month, he was doing some family stuff. We came across, we had a chat with him, he bought us a coffee. Lovely gentleman. So looking forward to catching up with him.
- [29:07]
B
Nice.
- [29:08]
A
But then there are other brands in there that are kind of hiding away. You've got Doxxer, you've got Timor Pompeii. You mentioned Skofit. Share Watches. We talked about share Watches a few days ago on the podcast because they have got the greatest idea ever. And we won't go into it too much just now, but if you want to get your kids into watches and we're not talking flick flags, we' talking about baby G shocks and all the rest of it. Proper stainless steel with a crown on the side with an analog display. These guys are absolutely kicking out the park.
- [29:38]
B
Yeah, it's really, it's, it's amazing what they're. What he's doing a proper watch for kids who want to learn how to, how to read the time. Which is, which is great. But also share. Have you seen his dive dive watch that he's.
- [29:50]
A
I have not seen anything. It was actually Simona that was speaking to them behind the scenes and she said, have you seen these kids watches? The idea they've got is fantastic. He's trialed it on his own own kids. And I thought that is amazing. And when we went across to Watches and Wonders, when we were speaking to some of the brands and the CEOs, they weren't just talking about today, they were talking about their future customer and Rolex and all these huge players, they do it best. They're not trying to sell to you, they're trying to sell to your kids. So when your kid goes to college, university, starts a business, gets a great job and goes for the first luxury watch in 20 years time, they want to be the guys that have ingrained. And my nephew, when he was like 10 or 12 years old, was talking about Hublot because it was written the waistline of different boxers and was asking me, what's this brand here? What watches do they do? So this kind of marketing thing, you know, it gets them young.
- [30:38]
B
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Funny enough, watch it. Watch Fair last year was Darren Sher's very first event. So I'm glad to see that he's going from strength to strength because he was at British Watchmakers Day as well. So he's obviously, you know, things are going well for the brand, so that's nice for a.
- [30:54]
A
No. We caught up in real life at Watchmakers Day and we'd not seen each other physically for half a decade and it was like, oh, remember that, remember that? And all the memories we're flooding back. We actually met up at Watchmakers Day in front of the Zero west stand and I've relayed on the show recently that we did the first ever interview with Zero west before they really hit the big time. And now obviously they've created so many amazing watches, they do so much in the house and they've got such a fantastic establishment which we will be visiting later on this year when we do our watches tour of the uk. So that is coming along nicely. We're just trying to get all our ducks in a row figure out on the Google Maps where we go first, where we stay, who we're having breakfast with, lunch with and then who we're having dinner with. Because there are so many brands, we're going to try and cram in at least a couple per day, otherwise we're going to be away from the office for a full month doing that. But as you mentioned three years ago versus just now in the uk and a large part of it is everybody helping each other out when it comes to I've got an idea for a watch, I've got an idea for a brand. The guys who kind of kick things off big in the UK, like the likes of Christopher Ward and then fears 10 years ago, studio underdog five years ago, they're the ones that people remember, they're the ones that people talk about, but we can't forget everyone else. We've got the one man band, the people that have started things up and they've got a full time job, they've got kids, they've got pets to walk at night and they still do it. The passion drives them forward and there are many folks in here looking at your name that even Adley. I didn't know anything about Adley until Watchmaker's Day and I kinda saw what they were doing. I looked at the crazy crystal and this faceted thing that looked like the diamond that sits above the head of the Sims. And then Simona said to me when we were planning a show recently where we went to a local, I don't even know what you'd call it, it's a car collection. But it's more than that. It's almost like a living museum of cars, motorcycles, bicycles. And we were doing this show and I said it would be good to get different brands involved. We know a thousand ones that do cars, we know a few that do motorcycles. And she said, well, Adley are a bicycle watch company and I thought, I've got no idea what the hell that means. Got in touch with a gentleman behind the scenes. He sent us some watches up. We had a great chat on the phone, included it in the show and lots of people were like, holy Jesus Christ. Never knew who these people were. So this is a great opportunity to stumble across these untapped watch brands. These hidden gems.
- [33:19]
B
Adley. Exactly. I'd never heard of them, them before going to British Watchmakers Day and you know, I was like, that's unusual. So I just went up to the, to the table. I personally wasn't looking to buy, but I was like, I'm going to talk to you. And yeah, just. If you look at their watches closely, the design is, is absolutely brilliant. Like there's so many little design cues, so much thought has been put into it. And because it's so custom, you know, it. I don't know how much effort it would have taken to put those watches together. Like so many custom parts, price wise, getting it all, you know, developed as well. So it is always. So it's worthwhile speaking to every single watch brand you meet, 100%.
- [34:03]
A
You mentioned Piers earlier on at Pinyon and I remember it was at your event that we first connected because he was showing this mammoth gauntlet thing and I was looking at it going, you know how they do the joke about is this a school for ants from Zoolander? This was like, is this a watch for King Kong? It turns out behind the scenes, the folks that were running the Fast and Furious franchise had got in touch with him to say, listen, we need a watch, but we need a big watch. We need a watch for John Cena's wrist in the upcoming movie that will be out in a few years time. And he had to get this watch strap custom designed because it was almost like a belt for your waist. And he was showing this off and he was talking about he's done stuff for Doctor who and he's worked on this project and that project and this is what it's all about. I was in the privileged position of walking around with a microphone and being able to throw it in people's faces to ask questions, hiding behind the mic. But everybody, that's what you should do. Think about it. Go to these people, ask them what makes you different. What was this watch here? Why does this look unique? Why does this not compare to everything else that's in this room? And then move to the next brand, ask the same question. Because oddly, what they do with faceted crystals, what they do with their crazy case designs, the way they incorporate bicycles, even the. Not the bag, even. I don't know how to describe it. It's like a normal satchel or a wallet, a leather wallet that some of their watches come in. It's to be reminiscent of messenger bikes in London. And that was his thought process. He wanted to make the packaging resemble that. And there are so many of these guys here mentioned mhd. We've spoken with a gentleman behind the scenes there numerous times. And he was a designer at Morgan, the car company moved from there. Does this, does that. When you look at his designs, you see that. That flowing through. You've got the curves, you've got the cutouts. It looks like it's fabricated parts that would fit an Aston Martin.
- [35:51]
B
Yeah. And like mhd, his watch cases, like, at a glance, at walking past the table, you might just glance and be like, oh, yeah, okay, nice. But as soon as you look closely, the cases are phenomenal because he. He has. He calls it an exoskeleton. So I've reviewed a couple of Matt's watches and. And it is very much like, almost like the Bremont tip trick case.
- [36:16]
A
Triptych.
- [36:17]
B
Triptych. Thank you. And a little bit like Hublot's case as well, where, you know, you have these outer skeletons and then an inner barrel with knurled edges. And it's amazing when you get to see it and you're looking at it in the. In the metal and then you see the price and you're like, flipping it. Okay, this is so reasonable compared to everything else. And then you. You think, like, how are they doing this for. For this price and living a life as well, you know, so it is amazing being able to. To speak. To speak to the people behind it. And.
- [36:52]
A
And yeah, there's a couple of names here that do stick out to me because I don't remember seeing them at other British watch shows. And we don't go to every show because you. I wouldn't say you kickstarted it. You definitely did help with the genesis of watch shows within the uk and then every. Tom, Dick and Harry gave it a blast. After the pandemic, when free money was running everywhere, people were buying NFTs and whatnot. But there was a brand out there from Italy run by a guy called Ricardo. Great name that. Out of order. We did a collaborative piece with them a couple of years ago to celebrate Barbara's 50th birthday. What's on her wrist. And we've remained in touch ever since. And in the background of my studio over in the corner I've got one of their GMT shakers which has got this iridescent color all over it. So we did a collaborative watch. It was on the rocks, let's call it that because Scottish people are known for drinking for some reason. Really don't really know why, I don't know what kind of bad reputation, I
- [37:48]
B
don't know what kind of drink you need.
- [37:49]
A
And Barbara Plumbo is known for having a tipple or two. So it'll be good to see out of order here in the UK because they have not but stayed still. They have been releasing banger after banger at inexpensive price points, accessible price points. We're talking a few hundred bucks here, there and everywhere. But you've also got Bamford in there. They do all kinds of things at all kinds of prices and all the way through. So who would you say are the entry budget points? Who would you say are. Well, who does the most expensive watch? Who would be the really the top tier when it comes to intricacies, custom designs, blah blah, blah.
- [38:25]
B
Go field a great British watch company because obviously they're custom made and they have a part of a plain spit five built into it. There's a few, there are like you say, there are a few Bamford models which are between two and three grand. I think like they're automatic chronographs, Escudo watches. I think they can. Some of their models are maybe up to a couple of grand as well but there's nothing over that. So again I like it, it. I like it to be a wide range. Whether you're coming here and you've got less than 500 quid that you want to spend or you're coming here and you like a serious collector and you're like I fancy going for a considered purchase between one and two grand. You know you've got. Got something for everything for every. Got something for everyone here no matter, no matter your budget. So you're asking about cheapest watches. So there's some, there's some around the 500 quid mark such as Abinger I think are about 500 quid. Alpharo there's we've mentioned. Oh Maestone watches are around that mark as well. Show watch obviously is probably the cheapest there. Their kids watch is 100 quid. I think just under 100. Yeah a bit of a. Bit of a mix. There's bold timepieces as well. So they're, they're not a brand. They are like a vintage watch. Reseller. So, you know, even if you're into your vintage watches, they'll have quite, they have quite a big collection that they bring every year as well. So there'll always be some vintage picks there, there too, which would be quite nice.
- [39:53]
A
Well, we've talked about the brands, we've talked about the event itself, but tell us more about your website because people might not know about it, they may not know what you do on there. Give us the run through. Okay.
- [40:03]
B
Yeah. So 12 and 60. So it was, it was what you're all about. And then sort of joined forces with James Morvale who currently works for Pharaoh Era and we renamed to 12 and 60. That was, I don't know, four years ago maybe. So yeah, 12 and 60.com so 1, 2 and then the word and. And then60.com and there's watch review site basically. So people who send watches over to review and myself. And there's another guy called a guy. Another guy called guy who actually, funnily enough, only lives around the corner in rugby. He does some brilliant watch reviews on there as well. And then if there's like a story that I find interesting or something worth sharing, then I'll publish that as well. But yeah, it's a lot of work doing this, the day job, arranging. Yeah, arranging the watch event. The family as well. I've got two children, married with a dog. As you. As you heard earlier, people wouldn't get
- [41:04]
A
to see this because this is not for YouTube. This is only an audio, this episode, but a little bit like the BBC news article that was on television where a guy is getting interviewed and you see his, his kids running in, in the background, popping their heads. And this has happened numerous times as we've been recording this.
- [41:20]
B
Yeah. And I'm like trying to shoo them away as quietly as possible and they're just like poking their heads around the corner like, no. And then before this call I was like, right, I'm going on a very important call, please don't disturb me. And you know what kids are like, they, they forget like three minutes later, they're like, where's Mummy? Or whatever. And then obviously, yeah, the dog was woofing away earlier when someone knocked on the door. So. So yeah, it is a passion project, but it's fun.
- [41:49]
A
You love it. I mean, if you were to look at it, let's dispel the myth that putting an event on, especially if you're doing it yourself as a hobby, as a side gig, it's not a huge money spinner in Actual fact, if you work out over the last six to 12 months, the amount of hours that you've invested in it versus after everyone's paid, after all the taxes are paid, everything else is done properly, at the end of the day, you're probably working for less than minimum wage for the hours you put in.
- [42:15]
B
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So you do have to have the love driving you. And then every year by, by coming up to the event, I'm like, flipping heck, I. I'm. I'm exhausted. Then the event happens and you're rejuvenated and you're like, tell you what, this was, it was all worth it. It was absolutely fantastic. Absolutely loved it. And then straight away afterwards, you just like, like you're buzzing and you're ready to go again. So, yeah, that's why, that's why I keep on going, going every year.
- [42:44]
A
Does your wife think you're crazy?
- [42:47]
B
With all of the, with all of the stuff that I do? Yes, probably. I would definitely have a much simpler life without it.
- [42:54]
A
Is she into watches herself?
- [42:56]
B
No.
- [42:56]
A
Does she understand the plight?
- [42:57]
B
She understands, but she doesn't. It's not her thing. She. No, but she's, she's very, she's very kind and loving towards my condition, should we call it? Yeah, condition, addiction, you know, however you want to call it. So I suppose because it's 13 years now, she's had to, unfortunately had to get used to it. Oh, one other thing that I did want to. To mention that's just come to mind. I don't know about you, but other watch events tend to be sort of like a time limit, like British Watchmakers Day. It was three hours. So I was on, like, I think the two o', clock, two till five. And then before I knew it, five o' clock came and I had to. I was getting chucked out. I was like, I haven't even spoken to anything, spoken to everyone. So, you know, with, with the whole idea of arranging an event that I would want to go to, you know, it's a whole day event and a lot of the events nowadays are sort of time slots as well.
- [43:54]
A
There is a reason for that and it is health and safety, because they can't have so many bodies in a venue at the one time just due to fire risks and whatnot. It's true. True.
- [44:03]
B
It is true. So we'll let them off, shall we?
- [44:06]
A
Yes, we'll let them off. I understand and I fully get it, because I felt terrible at Watchmakers Day because people came in, they were super excited, they went and had a look at this, that and the other. Oh, that appeals to me. This appeals to me. And before you know it, over the tannoy system, right, everybody that's got a blue band has to off. It was like going to the swimming as a kid when you had different coloured keys for your locker and they told you to get out.
- [44:27]
B
Yeah, exactly.
- [44:28]
A
Did you ever have that? Did that happen down south?
- [44:30]
B
Down south? No, actually, I don't remember that.
- [44:34]
A
Oh, okay. Maybe it was a Scottish thing because we weren't used to washing ourselves and been in water. Was a novel experience. Yeah, we got turfed out. But no, listen, I am really looking forward to this event because we did briefly catch up at Watchmaker's Day. We did spend a little bit of time standing blocking the Zero West Stand as we reminisced about 2019 in the Glory days before we knew what Covid was. And there's a new one just around the corner. Apparently there's a ship that's got a problem somewhere nearby. Why? Let's not talk about that. But this is really exciting for me. It's like coming back home. Podcast was maybe four or five months old at the point in time I came down. I brought a portable recorder with me. I was using hokey gear. It was my side hustle as well. It wasn't even a business, it wasn't making any money. It wasn't paying Dave's wages, Mizziel, my wife's, myself. It was just a bit of fun and thankfully a little bit like yourself. The podcast, Scottish watches, what we do, it is still, still fun. We would still do this to this day, even if our expenses weren't covered and it was coming out of our own pocket and we were doing something. So I was still doing wedding photography. I'd still love watches and still do things. And you've got exactly the same thought process.
- [45:39]
B
Resonates a lot with the people who listen to yourselves as well. You know, you can tell the. The enthusiasm is there for the love of it. You're not doing it because it is your job or for the money or whatever. For the grandeur that does come with you.
- [45:54]
A
I could do onlyfans and make more money to be fair.
- [45:57]
B
Have you got nice feet?
- [45:58]
A
As we come to the end of this episode, we should probably just ask you to tell us where people should go to find out more to book their tickets if they're traveling. You mentioned obviously there is transportation links, but because it's at a hotel, they can actually book a room at the hotel because it's super inexpensive. There's private car parking, yada yada and emerged to tickets cost.
- [46:17]
B
So tickets are on. Event rights are seven pound fifty for general admission. That's plus.
- [46:23]
A
That is insane. Why so cheap?
- [46:26]
B
Because, because again, if I was going to a watch event I'll be like flipping heck rob dogs. I'm not spending 20, 25 quid if you know what I mean on a, on a, on a ticket. So yeah, seven pound fifty plus eventbrite fees. Unfortunately for general admission there's a VIP ticket for 12 pound fifty but that does include a drink as well and you get access an hour earlier like a VIP slot. So yeah, it's a hotel called Voco St. John's Hotel in Solihull which is an IHG Group hotel. It's very nice, very modern, very clean, recently renovated. So the rooms are really, really nice. And yeah, a room is under 100 quid for a night which you know, if you were traveling down to London you wouldn't be able to get a hotel in Mayfair for less than 100 quid. Well you might be able to, but you wouldn't want to stay in it. Go to watchitfair.com for all the information
- [47:18]
A
it fair not watch it.
- [47:20]
B
No, no, please don't go to that domain. Although I should probably reserve that and set up a redirect just in case. Watch it fair.com for all of the information on there, all the brands obviously, like I said, we haven't gone barely scratched the surface as there's 43, 44 brands coming and yeah, there's a link on there to buy your tickets as well. So June 20th, Father's Day weekend. Bring your loved ones, bring yourself even if you don't want to bring your loved ones and just come and have a wonderful day with everyone else of like minded loves of our combined love of watches. So yeah, looking forward to seeing everyone there.
- [47:56]
A
Fantastic. And if you want to check out we're up to we're out twice a week. It hasn't deviated or changed for many years. Mondays and Thursdays a podcast rolls out and then at the weekend we try to get the videos out for Saturday morning around about 9am 10am UK time. But sometimes if there's just too much stuff to cram in it appear on a Sunday and over the course of watches and wonders. It was a little bit late because there was just so much action packed stuff to go inside. But yeah, that is exactly what we're up to. We're online obviously. Scottishwatches.co.uk, drop us an email there. Infocottishwatches.co.uk and we're on Instagram so you can find us there. Ottottishwatches so that is it. Thank you so much for joining us and we will literally see you in a few weeks time.
- [48:35]
B
Amazing. Can't wait. Look forward to seeing you and thank you very much for having me on the podcast seven years later.
- [48:42]
A
Fantastic. We will see you soon. Catch you later.
- [48:44]
B
Cheers. Ricky.
- [49:07]
A
Sam.