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Scottish Watches Podcast #802 : Independent Watch Chat With Pietro
00:57:09
This week we’re joined once again by Pietro from The Limited Edition to catch up on everything that’s been happening since Watches and Wonders. Click here to read along and...
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to the Scottish Watches Podcast. It's time for a returning visitor, returning guest, almost a co host. He's been on the show so many times in the past. We talk about him so many times in the past as well. And he's got so many cool new watches to talk about, because it is. Pietro from the Limited Edition used to be kind of out in his own. He would do his own thing, he would travel around, he would come and meet you, you could come and see him. Now he has built an emporium, a massive place down in London. It was supposed to be a secret. It turned out to be the worst secret in the watch industry. Everybody has headed in, everyone has checked out to the point he's almost outgrown the place within weeks, a matter of weeks since it first opened. We are of course talking about the man, the Myth, the legend, Mr. Pietro from the limited edition. How are you doing, sir?
- [00:43]
B
Hi, Ricky. I'm very well. Nice to see you and nice to see you in great form as well. I'm always impressed by our dynamic and how busy you guys are and how relentless you've been. Like we've been perhaps in enhancing this incredible world of independent watchmaking over the last few years. It's been a worldwide.
- [01:04]
A
Certainly has, and I think it's the amount of caffeine in Iron Brew that keeps us motivated and pushing forward, because it's definitely not the sunshine. We're not solar powered up in Scotland, although it's not been too bad over the past few weeks and months. But there's lots of stuff to catch up on. We were originally going to record a few weeks ago, then you're really busy and we're going to have your stand in, we're going to have Ollie come on and then he gets super busy. It shows you exactly how things move within the watch industry. Just when you think it's the quiet period when all the Swiss people are going to sleep, they're going on their watchmakers holidays over the summer period. Nothing stays still here in the uk across the world. And there are lots of brands to talk about. Some you've heard of before, some are absolutely brand new to listeners, viewers and ourselves. Because you are the guy that discovers the untapped, the undiscovered gems. You bring them to the foreground and then you put a spotlight on them so everybody else can see and be dazzled by them, along with, obviously yourself, the team, Sam, Ollie and everyone else at Limited Edition because it's a growing enterprise. It used to be yourself and a few select partners. Now, the team is global. They are all over the place. I've heard of people chatting over in Dubai about you guys over in America and obviously here at home. But we're going to tell you to check the show notes. That's where you'll find all the images, the links, the pics, the tech spec of the watches and information about places you may want to visit, either in person or collectively. Because there is a big event coming down the line that we're involved in and we want you to be involved in as well. So next up, let's find out what Pietro's been up to, because the last time you were on was probably around about watches and wonders. That doesn't feel that long ago, but we are talking many, many months in the past.
- [02:36]
B
Oh, yeah. And many horological news that have happened in between. Like you're saying, I take full advantage of the summer and I normally go on holiday early enough and actually I've done my holiday, now I'm back and I'm ready to use these summer, you know, deep summer months, like end of July and August to really do what we do best, which is, you know, preparing for finding, you know, the hidden gems in watchmaking, well before Geneva watch days and, well, all the events that are coming in the second part of the year. So I really enjoy this time of the year. I was really, really blessed at a great holiday with the family. We, we traveled down to Italy on a, on a epic car journey. And yeah, and so I've, I've done that. It's been great. And now I'm completely re energized to take on our usual mission, which is digging deep in the world of artisan watchmaking. There's a, there's quite a bit coming up. Besides Geneva watch days, there's also our biggest event because the 10th year anniversary event that successfully we carried out last year has now become an early occurrence. So we are going to have an event in London every single year in the month of September. This year is on the 19th of September. We already have 34 watchmakers signed up for that. It will be a full day in a private club in Mayfair where we're going to invite our collectors to come and meet the heroes, you know, meet the, the, the makers. Because for as much as I like us as the limited edition for what we do, we are only facilitators and we try to enhance and to facilitate the direct exchange between the watchmakers and the collectors themselves. So that's what we're going to do. On September 19, we had an impromptu
- [04:28]
A
inform at Pietro is the new place that we've been talking about on the show for the past few months. I was down for Watchmakers Day and it is usually the only point in time where I'm in London and I have a bit of availability because. And I'll put this call out to everybody that's listening to the show. We get so many invites to come down to London for events, press events, boutique launches, new products or just to meet people, friends, listeners to the show. And I always have to say the same thing. It is easier to get from Scotland to Geneva. It's faster, less expensive, less time than it is to actually get to London. We can jump on an EasyJet from Edinburgh, be across there in a couple hours. To get to London, you have to get to an airport and then you have to fight your way through traffic to wherever it is you're going. So it is a bit of a nightmare for anybody in Scotland to do this on a regular basis. But when we came down for Watchmakers Day, I came around to check things out and I was mesmerized. You had sent pictures, you'd showed me behind the scenes what was going on, but you were still adding the last layers of paint. Your security guard and your architect were actually there on the day I visited, helping out, putting the final touches up. And I think you beamed with pride when you showed me the timeline of the limited edition. It had been printed out in high resolution and adorned one of the walls. And it ran from the humble beginnings to where we are today. And I'm very happy to see that Scottish watches were featured. A little logo on the timeline showing the first appearance on the podcast, along with the limited edition watch that we produced in collaboration with each other just before special operations happened in a certain country. But we don't talk about that too much. We talk about the good stuff in watchmaking circles and we have heard nothing but good reports about Pietros, about the events you've put on. I thought, okay, it's going to launch and then it will just settle back down. It certainly has not done that. And the amount of brands that you are bringing to the fore, and let's just put a pin in this one. It ain't the big guys it used to be. People thought of tle and it's all chaikin, it's all going to be Japek, it's all going to be 20 grand, 30 grand, 100 grand up the way. Not the case. You fly the flag for all the Independence from a couple of thousand all the way up to the stratosphere. And you have to be commended for that because not many people do. They kind of forget where they came from and they move up the ranks and they leave the little guys behind. You don't. You make sure you look after your entire customer base, new, old and future. But what has been going on? I hear there was quite a big launch with the guys. Oh, let me think now. It was space shuttle inspired. It wasn't over in NASA, it wasn't in Houston, but you did something with those Amita guys.
- [06:49]
B
Yeah, that was a very brave operation because we are based in Leicester, right? As our HQ is in Leicester. But we never or we seldom consider Leicester as. As a place for really promoting watchmaking. But for the first time, actually, the stars aligned when Amida proposed us to launch together NASA, the official NASA watch that they obviously have released with us. We have collaborated to do the official launch at the Leicester Space center, which is actually the largest space center in Europe. So we were really happy for, for once to be able to do that in our hometown of Leicester, because obviously we have an international clientele as long as our domestic clientele. And so London makes much more sense for us when it comes to having a showroom. For example, we don't have a showroom in Leicester, but in this case we could do something at home. And it's been a resounding success because obviously endorsed by NASA and by Amedia, we were able to launch this piece in its natural environment, if you like. A very limited edition that went down really well. We had over six collectors. They joined us for the launch and it was really good. We got Oliver the watch collector, dressed up as Space Notes, as Sam was as well. And that remains in the collective memory of the limited edition and dare I say, the history of the limited edition. So a very, very good day. This was back in a few months ago, but yeah, it's to say that although we are not really a marketing enterprise, but we have this ability now to really put together the people that are really into this world of artisan watchmaking, independent watchmaking, and elevate the experience as well. When there are real concrete elements that can be put together and not just based on a marketing narrative, if you like. This was one of those examples and it was humbling actually to have such a stage to be able to launch a piece like that. So, yeah, that was a great experience
- [08:59]
A
and to put people in the frame of exactly what's happened with Amida and limited Edition. It was through you guys that we caught up with those folks at Geneva Watch Days a number of years ago. We sat down, I remember it wasn't in the main area in Boravage, it was round the corner in a quieter, cooler setting. And you properly introduced us to the gentleman behind. We got to see the watches, the prototypes. We got a bit of an inkling as to what was coming next. And then at last year's Geneva Watch Days, the first appointment we had was with Amida. And they utilized. We've talked about this before, but I'll repeat it because it's a great story. They utilized the fact that Boravage was under construction, it was being renovated, I think it probably is finished now, but it was a good multi year process. And some of the rooms that were in this hundred year old hotel, and this is like a stately home, the size of this place, some of these rooms were covered in tarps, they had workman's lights, they had all kinds of generators and paraphernalia around. So what they did was they borrowed one of those rooms, they turned on the workman's lights and they set up almost a mission impossible CIA interrogation room. And they would bring you down, they would lock the door, they would take your phone from you, they would sit you at a table with an investigator and an instigator's light in your eyeballs. And then they would open a briefcase, then they would hand you some top secret documents explaining what it was they were doing. Of course it was all just marketing hype, but it was great marketing hype. It was the way that advertising should be done because it left a lasting impression on myself, on Dave. And when we recounted the tale to people on the podcast, the folks actually listened. They got in touch to say they loved the way we explained the story. And then when the Watch launched, it was just the final sort of icing on the cake. It was a fantastic release. You guys got right in about it. The photos, the video, the actual imagery you got down there, it was sublime. It was excellent. And let me just remind people, this watch wasn't 20 grand, this watch wasn't 10 grand. How much was this one, Pietro?
- [10:51]
B
Between four and five, depending if you consider VAT VAT or not. But that's where Amelia sits. And yeah, that was the appetizer to the launch of the NASA watch. And it was very, very well engineered. You know, they have a, they have a product that is so original that whatever they do, they can be creative in so many ways. Sometimes people People make comparisons with, within, you know, this shape of what is called a driver watch that Amelia proposes. They really have their hands on the history of this particular shape. Such, you know, as, as. As well as Girard Perregaux, for example, with a casquette. With a casquette watch. But actually driver's watches were, you know, launched for the first time by Cartier. I think it was back in the 30s, if you like. So as always, you know, when. The same as when you talk about the octagonal shapes, when you talk about the tonneau shape, for instance, some of these shapes have become very identifiable with one brand that in modern days managed to put it, you know, out there to everyone's attention. But most of these shapes actually have their roots in the history of, of watchmaking. And Amida is one of those cases. So when you think a driver watch, you're thinking MB and F, of course, in modern times, in contemporary times, but I mean, they were doing driver's watches back in the 70s, at the end of the 70s, so was Girard Perregault. One of them was doing mechanical, the other one was doing quartz. And in those days, Girard Pergolt won the battle because Amida went down, because of course, the quartz revolution happened. But these days Amida is taking his revenge and is doing really, really well. We're very pleased to be their official, official partners here in the uk and
- [12:35]
A
it's a great partnership because they produce great products and you know how to utilise and look after anyone that's interested. Somet sometimes when people deal with brands that are off the high street, it's not Tag, Heuer, Breitling, Tudor, Rolex, Omega. When it's something a little more left field, they know the basics. Like if you talk to somebody about a chaikin watch, they can give you the top line. They can tell you it's a module inside, on top of a net of movement back in the day. But with you, you actually know the creators, you know the designers, you know the people at the company itself, the founders, the CEOs, and you've been across to see them in their home turf. You've watched the watch has been designed, prototyped and created, put on the wrist and you've taken it from cradle to grave. Most people don't do that. And that's one of the reasons, especially here in the uk, as much as you are much further afield, it's always best to speak to you instead of perhaps somebody that is. There's lots of pretend agents out there. Let's Just put it that way. I would always think my money with Pietro, because he actually knows what's going on. He isn't just one of these people that has created a website, pretends they know what they're talking about and then try and fleece the customer. That is not the operation here. But let's talk about something else. Let's talk about the wrist check, because I have spotted you're wearing something rather funky on the wrist there, and I can't quite make out what it is. So you're the guest, you go first. What's on the wrist?
- [13:49]
B
Today I'm wearing this. I've been wearing this for the last 10 days, so I wasn't necessarily planning to wear it today on purpose. I just love this piece. This is the gos sky is the Limit. So the name of the model is Sarek, Geos is the brand, Sarek is the model, and Sky's the Limit is the nickname that we've given to this piece because this is one of our anniversary pieces that we launched last year. We only made five pieces of this one. And the dial is actually the illustration of a sky. The sky is being generated by cutting a solid piece of mother of pearl that without any laser engraving or anything, happens to depict the shape of the clouds. I don't know how clear it is here, as I'm trying to show it, but, yeah, it's quite mesmerizing. It's pretty amazing, actually, because it plays in so many different ways with the light and it's a bit of an analogy, a metaphor of what the limited edition has been so far. You know, Ricky, when we started this, we sounded a bit like a bunch of lunatics, you know, thinking that one day artisan watchmaking would have taken over high street, you know, big brands. But today, today, you know, people were laughing at the time, nobody's laughing now, when most of the collectors are actually enjoying the experience of getting close to independence, even more so than the typical experience of high street, High street brands kind of watchmaking, with all respect, we. I think we have contributed to create a niche. And when we started to say that watchmaking was a form of art, it was even before the UNESCO actually, actually officially gave the patronage, the certification, if you like, to watchmaking as a form of art. And now, like any form of art, new watchmakers, new artists are proposing their own art every single year. So we are now switching from a situation where there were quite a few not, you know, not very many independent watchmakers back in the day. And now we have the opposite. A situation where there are so many out there that it's difficult to keep track of of them. So sky's the limit was a way to say that when you think big, you know, only sky is the limit. You know, for as long as you believe in the idea that you are, you are pursuing.
- [16:12]
A
I thought that was the watch you were wearing. I wasn't 100% sure because we're doing this over video chat. You're not in your usual place. We're using the camera that's built into your laptops. I couldn't quite make it out. That is the watch that you graciously allowed us to have for two weeks so that we could talk about it in the podcast. We could get our own images. And we were blessed because the sun split the sky. The week that we had it, we managed to get some shots with genuine Scottish sunlight hitting that dial. And it was one of the best photos that I took that I posted earlier on because it was just so captivating, the way that everything about it lit up. It was almost as if it was electroluminescence. It was something a sea creature under the ocean that just glows and glistens as it flows along. That was an absolutely stunning piece. And the metalwork as well. Got to commend the metalwork that goes hand in hand with that dial. So on the wrist today, I have got something that is blue, because blue is my color. Everybody knows that. And it is the Scotland colours as well, although this is an azure blue, so it's not exactly the same hue. But this is my Elise Nordan Diver X Skeleton Azure edition. Now the Diver Last year, the Diver Air was put together by the folks at UN to be the world's latest officially sanctioned and designated dive watch. It won that and it was a crazy. I think it was like 52 grams, including the strap it came with. This one's a little bit heavier because it has got more metalwork inside, it has got a larger frame and it's obviously got a lot of carbon on there, just for the look and also for the fact it's lightweight. This is a watch that I had my eye on for a number of years because I think it was around about 2019, just before the pandemic. That's when UN started to speak to us. They started to send us press releases. They were chatting, they sent us a watch. We did a destroy it. They sent us another watch. We didn't destroy that either. Then we met up with Mathieu, the md. He was over in Dubai and what a story he told us. We had to drag him onto the podcast. We did that and I made the jump. I got myself my first UN a couple of years ago. That was the Freak X Magma edition. And I had my eye on a blue one, but I didn't want to get another watch from the same lineup. So when the time finally came, I decided to go with this one because it's carbon, it's blue, it's titanium, it's dlc, it's a sapphire sandwich and the best of sapphire sandwiches. Just a complete lump of glass on the front and the back and a little bit like one of my favorite movie series of the 2000s, the X Men. This has got the biggest, shiniest X running right through the center of the watch. So, yeah, it is a typical, as my wife likes to say, it's a Ricky watch. It's exactly the kind of stuff I wear. It's blue, it's black, it's massive, it's on the wrist and you can take it in the water and you don't have to worry about it. So, yeah. Today's wrist check for myself is the Olysin Ardan Diver X Skeleton Azure edition.
- [18:48]
B
I'm quite pleased that you're also not buying into trends when it comes to, you know, for the last three years everybody's been telling me that, you know, watches should be 36, 38 millimeters, etc. Etc. Like 10 or 15 years ago, everyone was telling me that watches should be 46, 47, etc. Etc. So I think it should just be what you actually like, what you enjoy on the wrist without following any specific rule.
- [19:12]
A
This is the truth. Wear what you like and it doesn't matter. I take the piss out of Dave all the time for what he wears, clothes wise, but it's what he's comfortable with, he enjoys it, he gets on with life. And the same with me. I was recently on holiday. I wasn't over in Italy because I didn't get the invite with you and your family. I'll forgive that. This time I was in Blackpool for a few days, so that is probably the complete polar opposite. And I wore a big black clock on the wrist. It was a Citizen Attesa, I think it's called. And this is again, it's titanium dlc, but it's got quartz movement inside and I felt safe wearing something like that versus something more expensive. But that was like 44 mil as well. Doesn't matter the size on the wrist check for our episode 800 that went out Last week, I was wearing the tiniest of tiny watches. My vintage 1967 Bulova Accutron Spaceview. I don't even know what that is. Is it 34 mil, possibly 36? Doesn't matter what it is, as long as it tells the time, feels comfortable in the rest, and you look at it and it brings a smile to your face as well as the dial. But bringing smiles to dials, human dials, that is, is what you do best. And over the last few months, as I mentioned earlier, you have had event after event, and instead of having to find a loc, deploy security, get it all signed up, bring your posters, your banners, make it look very tle. Now you've got your own place that can live this way all the time. Less sticking around, more chances for people to see watches. So what big events have you had so far? Who have the movers and shakers within the watch industry that have come to see you in your new premises?
- [20:38]
B
Yeah, you're right. It's a different life. For as long as we were very comfortable where we used to be, because, again, we didn't want to have a watch store, we wanted to develop a community from the ground up. And because we were based in such a small niche, which were the independent artisans, it was good enough for a number of years. But now that these small niches become arguably actually the most dynamic segment of the market, we needed to innovate. We needed to create now a place that we can call home and that can reflect and illustrate what we have already become. And that's when Pietro was born. And that's why Pietro is a bit of a hidden gem in central London, where anyone that loves watches can contact us to come and visit. And every day he will find a different curated collection. You can see here behind me, but there's a gallery here. We have something like 30 different watchmakers, give or take. And every day we curate a collection based on who's going to come and visit us and the taste that this group of people may have or this individual person may have. And so we have shaped it the way we think we are, which is very customized way of looking after people as opposed to standardized way which you typically, you know, no criticism or you typically find on the high street. When, if you go to Hong Kong, you go to Melbourne, then you go to Dubai, and then you go to New York and you go to Medellin, one particular famous brand will look exactly the same across those locations. So we are trying to do exactly the opposite. And yeah, obviously this became Very quickly our heart, soul and people are coming in and when we do an event, you know, without bragging, but it's always an event in the strict sense of the term. So we get any given event, 50, 60, 70 collectors coming here and celebrating different cultural themes related to watchmaking. The last one that comes to mind was of course, the launch of the, of our Arnold and Son London Skyline edition, which was a very ambitious project because it's. I don't know if you've seen, I mean if, if you're listening to this, if you already seen the watch, but this is a watch that actually combines the view on the London skyline from 260 years ago when John Arnold, who is one of the most important master watchmakers ever existed, was very close friend of Abraham Louis Breguet. So he's that important, was operating in London. So how the skyline used to look in those days and in the same watch at night, he will have the vision of how the skyline looks today when unknown and son celebrates 260 years and the limited edition has just celebrated 10 years. So we found an engineered, very clever trick to show two different sides of. Two different. Yeah, two different sides of the same story. And humbly paying tribute and homage to something that is obviously bigger than us. Because talking about John Arnold and talking about the limited edition for as proud as we can be is two very different things. So we have made sure we have kept the two things separate but in the same watch. And I think it really works. We have launched 20 pieces. We have pre sold now, I think 13 of them. So a few of them are still available. They come in either gold, pink, gold or stainless steel. Very affordably priced because again, the focus on value, even if we have bigger, bigger overheads these days, we are still focusing on value. We want every single of our limited editions, special collaborations to make the collector aware and to give the true perception of great value. So these are priced starting 14,500 for the steel version and a little over 23,000 for the, for the gold version with Aena as one of factual movement, beautifully finished mother of pearl dial with painted, of course, skyline both for the day vision and the night vision. So I'm very proud of this piece. And the event turned out to be a bit of a historical celebration, if you like. And yeah, it was, was really, really good.
- [25:00]
A
This is a watch that we hoped we could get a hold of ahead of time, but we couldn't. We did ask Sam and it was unavailable as much as your wrist check. We did manage to get that one prior the Arnold and Son collab. It was something we didn't expect. And we have learned not to ask too many questions ahead of time because you play your cards very close to your chest with your collabs or limited editions at the limited edition. And when this one came out, it was the fusion of completely contemporary design with the past. And we've told the story, I've told the story very badly about Breguet and Arnold switching sons so that they could learn the disciplines of watchmaking crafts on two opposite, not opposite sides of the globe, opposite sides of Europe. And how that is a true story. That sounds made up. It sounds like a movie, you know, a Netflix documentary. This should make a Netflix documentary about watchmaking. It's like the Zenith story about them hiding the plans and the tooling behind a false wall in the attic when the quartz crisis happened and they were going to destroy everything. And this one guy KE these are the cool stories that turn out to be true within watchmaking circles. Maybe we should do a miniseries. Maybe you should get involved in this, Pietro Mean you could tell some tales from the past. But yeah, going back to the watch itself, loved it. Couldn't believe that you managed to produce it at such an accessible price. That's the new word, accessible price point. In a day and age where a Rolex sub is about 10k a GMT is around about the same Daytona, they've gone up and up and up. You can get something with a custom in house movement super limited edition, something that will stand on your wrist completely proud, look different to everything else that is out there. And it ain't 25 grand, 30 grand or 50 grand any longer. That is just phenomenal. And we've said before when you take a watch that maybe there are quite a few of them out there, lots of models and designations. It's at one price point when you then have to customize it that's completely new tooling, research and development, testing. There are designers involved in it that change things up. So the price has to increase. But you haven't done that. You haven't loaded the price point to the point where people would look at it and think, I'll just go with a normal one. It stands head and shoulders above. So well done on that. And one quick final point. As Pietro was explaining about the name of his place, Pietro's don't think this was some wet dream that Pietro had. He was just going to use his own name and get out there. Look at me, I'm great. And billboard like biff. Tannen in Back to the Future 2. This was the staff, this was the team at the Limited edition that pushed us through behind his back. Lots of names were floated and I think he was on holiday. He was away when Sam and the rest of the guys went, no, no, no, Pietro's is going to be the name of it. So you didn't really have much of a say in that.
- [27:27]
B
True story, true story. When he was proposed to me, I felt like, yeah, exactly like he said, no, I'm not going to go on a massive ego trip, you know, and use my name. But I think it was the driver of that decision was Oliver. So the watch collector. And he said, obviously, Ollie being based here in London, all the hidden gems, they're called with the name of a person behind. You know, I'm not going to make samples, but let's. Some of the clubs, like George's or Scott's or, I don't know, even Annabelle's, you know, I'm not strong fellows. Yeah, I'm not comparing myself in any way to those, to those names, but it was this thing of giving, giving that hidden gem kind of secret place where if you're into watches, you know, let's go there, I'll take you there. And Pietro, of course, it's invariably linked to what we have been over the last 10 years. I couldn't. I couldn't say no. When, when in the future we're going to open in New York or in other parts of the world, you know, eventually we will, we will work on a different. On a different name and I'll try to shrug a little bit of that pressure off my shoulders.
- [28:36]
A
Who knows, you may have Ollie's opening up next and in Sam's place, but we'll find out in due course what happens there. But let's also remind people you don't just stick to where you are just now. You are an international trendsetter globetrotter. You go all over the planet looking for new people to showcase to the world, but you take some of the brands you're already working with to other events. You are talking with us about something perhaps in Scotland in the next X amount of years, months, days, weeks, whatever it may be. But you also went to Hands On Horology and you had a great time there.
- [29:08]
B
Yeah, absolutely. Hands On Horology. I mean, we were. When I asked myself about what strategically the limited edition should be, I always go back to what we. What was the first initial. And the initial idea was to promote independent artisan watchmaking as A as a category, because I truly believe that the destiny of watchmaking is in the hands of the true artisans. I think that any attempt or form of trying to industrialize artisanship is destined to fail. That's my humble opinion. I may be wrong. Ultimately is destined to fail. And it go through always phases of up and downs. Whereas I think the irrational emotional reason why people all over the world, including us, are so much into this hobby that is completely anachronistic in the functional sense of the world, because nobody needs a watch to read the time, of course, but we relate to it because of all the rest that goes with it. The stories of the people, the way they do things, the time that they spend doing something that again, is arguably not the most useful tool anymore. And so I believe that if we stick to this philosophy, then any direct or indirect way of promoting that is in the DNA of what we try to do. So sometimes we find ourselves pushing brands that we don't even represent or watchmakers that we don't even officially represent. Why? Because we just love. We love what we do. I was wearing a Studio Underdog for the most part of my vacations in Italy, for example, like going back to your example in Blackpool, you were wearing Cities and I was wearing a Studio Underdog. And do we represent Studio Underdog? No, we don't. But I do like Studio Underdog. And when I talk about Studio Underdog, I just talk about it as a free. As a free collector. And so we do at all levels. When we have a program called Discovery Tour, like you were making reference to where we would. To international events where we bring hidden gems or new watchmakers that we may collaborate already with or we may not for the sake of developing and nurturing the culture of watchmaking. Obviously we try to do it not to create any friction with local retailers that may already have some of these brands on board in their own country, we're very careful with that. But we try to just give a positive contribution and to do our thing, which, you know, from day one has been promoting independent watchmaking from when Constantine Chaikin wasn't known by anyone in 2015. And we, we keep banging on, you know, Amerigon, about Chaikin Strela. Strela now, four years waiting list, you know, has become one of the huge names. But for years and years it was one of the names that would not. Was not even kind of considered beyond the. The 1015 watchmakers that would know about Strela worldwide. Now, now things are changing and we will keep playing that role, that positive role, if we can help it.
- [32:10]
A
So who are the new people then? You are always linked with the story of Dave finding you, finding a chaikin watch and you meeting him to sell him the watch. And you talk too much about the watches that were nothing to do with what you had with you, that forgot to sell him the watch and almost left without. But the new guys, the untapped gems, undiscovered gems that you found recently, then who are they? Who would you like to talk about on this show?
- [32:33]
B
In terms of the. Both in terms of brands and in terms of solo watchmakers, there's an incredible dynamism that can't even be compared to 10 years ago when we started. So I am really honest when I say that it's difficult to be on top of everything these days. So one of my main objectives at Geneva Watch Days is to try to make sense of all of this new talent that is coming out. And this talent is coming from both master watchmakers that have been hidden behind the big brands, and they want to find their own. Own fame and their own kind of satisfaction by proposing their own art. That's one. But also, there are movement constructors that have been out there that have not been and have not been, how can I say, operating on their own. And they are finding now that strength and courage. And plus there are some of the older watchmakers that for years and years, they were not really considered or they didn't have the visibility they deserve. And they are now all of a sudden finding themselves playing the role of stars. You know, like if they weren't doing exactly the same thing they were doing 15 years ago, it's just the environment that has changed. So there are these three main waves, I think these three main categories that are getting really, really interesting. There are names. I'm gonna go into the maybe the movement constructor category that is really, really showing some incredible developments. You know, this is where Simon Brett, you know, the Mat Cleger, for example, the Stephan Pierre, Roger Bastide. These are all names that are. Have had instant success. Samuel Solak as well. They've had instant success. They normally work on subscription, so they would release a number of pieces that is normally between 10 and 15 or 20 for the first edition, that if you jump. Jump on it on time, that you can have some luck in the future for further additional allocations. And this is where a lot, really, a lot is happening. I want to add there is a lot of dynamism with the Chinese watchmaking, you know, with the controversy About Swiss made. Swiss made is by definition a very controversial concept. You know, to call a watch Swiss made, you only need to justify 60% of the value has been made in Switzerland. You know, it's more complex than this, but in a nutshell, this is what it is. So for years and years and years, quite a few brands have used Asian suppliers, you know, for either parts or movements or whatever, because they could still justify the Swiss made by the work that was done in Switzerland, by assembling or by finishing or by, you know, producing part of the watch or whatever. So this has created an effect, a maturity of the Asian watchmaking industry that is now happening. Now they are ready, they have learned and they have developed sometimes even products that can be also superior, depending on which brands you talk about. So the barons of these days, the farmerhood, we discovered a young talent recently, a guy that is 18 years old and he's already produced a tourbillon and he's already produced his own debuted edition when he was only 18, he's now 19. And this guy is Ricky Hong. And Ricky Hong is one of those young Asian watchmakers that is really making an impression. And we are lucky enough to be the only partner of Ricky worldwide, except for Hong Kong, where Ricky is based. So there's a lot of research and there's a lot of dynamism within the young, either movement constructors or watchmakers, where we want to still play a role and where we want to kind of help people to make sense. Because also not everything that comes out is amazing or is worth investing or considering for a collection. So very humbly, I try to build my knowledge so that I can actually then transfer it to people that either trust us or want to hear from us. But to be able to do that, I need to know the people, meet the people, understand how they operate in the example of farmalhood. There is a fair controversy on the fact that they were promising to start delivering by the end of last year. They haven't delivered yet. So we are looking at visiting their Shanghai premises very soon on the back of, you know, they have won a gphg, so it's a big thing. So we are going to go and visit over there, understand exactly where we are with the production because, you know, don't get me wrong, 80% of the new watchmakers are late in some forms to their initial promises in terms of delivery, lead time. So we like to be on top of that and to be able to give genuine information to our audience, make sure that everyone is informed and can make Educated decisions. So it was a very long loop to answer a very simple question. Ricky, I hope it was clear enough.
- [37:33]
A
I like your answers because I don't have to try and extract blood from a stone. We do have guests on and we cherry pick who we bring onto the podcast because they have to have something of value and merit for you, listening at home, or if you're watching on YouTube, watching us at the weekend. And sometimes the person can be phenomenal at creating a watch, a dial, a design, a movement, putting it all together. They can't articulate the words properly to describe the process. And we get a lot of emails saying you should bring this person onto the podcast or that person. It doesn't equate. It's like sometimes there's a journalist who is phenomenal at putting words on paper or words on screen, but you put a microphone in front of them, them and they freeze up, they clam up because it's not their area of expertise. It's like taking a presenter on television and asking them to act in a movie. Looks kind of similar, but it's a different set of skills that you need. And the fact that you can take one question and elaborate out and go across and weave an articulate story between lots of different things, pull the paragraphs together and deliver it on the podcast. That is why you're here all the time. But let's move to the main event, the big one. I thought the big one was last year. Turns out that was just the prelim. That was the test phase. You decided to go bigger, bolder and better than before. And like you say at the beginning of the podcast, this is going to be an annual event. I know how long it takes to put together annual events. It takes six months every year to make an annual event. So you're bitten off a lot. Hopefully you can chew it and swallow it this time. Tell us all about the 2026 edition.
- [39:00]
B
Yeah, I mean, when we decided to be the ambassadors of the artisans, one big gap that there was was the fact that these ambassadors were never represented in some of the biggest exhibitions worldwide. And more than that, there was in London in particular, an exhibition that was even remotely trying to do that. After the experience of SalonQP, that was, I think it was good for a number of years and then it kind of dissipated because the big brands were not helping to make it viable. Now the big difference is that SalonQP and all the big exhibitions, the business model is obviously for them to sell space to the brands, to join in and to make it Viable and beneficial for everybody. We have this unique advantage that we don't need to make money on watchmakers to make an exhibition viable because we obviously sell watches. So if we're good at what we do, then at the end, if we sell watches, then everyone should get the benefit that it deserves. So this is to say that it's quite complicated to put together a Dubai watch week, you know, like. Like Siddiqui is doing in Dubai, which is absolutely, incredibly outstanding. It's not something that you can do very easily. So we started, as always, ground up by just giving representation and visibility to our watchmakers that we already represent and being open as well to host some that we may not represent. Anyway, long story short, last year, the event, it was arguably an incredible success, made us very proud. But the last thing I wanted to do when we finished, mind that we were gonna open the showroom a cup a few months later. I was never thinking to do it next year straight away. But Oliver, again, Oliver is a big driving force within the limited edition. Although he's not employed by us, he's one of our partners and. And a guy like all our partners, collectors that are very, very passionate. It. It totally made me understand that we could. We could pull it off. We could pull it off. Why? Because we have the full endorsement of the brands, the watchmakers that we work with. And secondly, because last year was a bit of a proof of concept. It just was a smaller first configuration of what we're going to do this year. This year, obviously, because you can never stay still. We're going to innovate and we're going to divide it in two. There will be two holes. One hole will be dedicated to the premium, premium watchmakers. So the master watchmakers and the master brands, names such as, you know, I have the list here because I need. I need kind of 35 names, but names like Bernard Lederer, Felipe Piculic, Langenhein, you know, Constantine Chaykin, Cedric Yonr. These are the David Kando. These are the premium watchmaker, Osilo and Sarpaneva, Stepan Sapanera. I'm so happy we can have Sapaneva with us this year as well. This would be in the ballroom on their own. And then on the other side there will be the discovery area. Discovery area. That will see some of the exciting, I don't want to say micro brands, but like more entrepreneurial, new, often attainable watchmakers such as, you know, Space1, for example. We have an incredible success with Space1Amida that we just, we mentioned Gaga Laboratorio awake. You know, all those fun atelier wen, all those fun watchmakers that keep this hobby so interesting and so fun because you know it better than me, Ricky. You know, it's easy to fall in love with, you know, the ultimate. I don't know, Felipe Piculic one, phase two, you know, 40K watch, beautifully finished. He now is manufactured, you know, he ticks all the boxes and of course it is gonna cost 50k. I'm very passionate about the fact that, you know, people coming from the middle, you know, middle class background like myself, you can have fun, you can collect even at attainable price levels. And these attainable watchmakers, they keep the hobby really fun and not always scary. You know, how many 50k, how many 100k, how many 200k pieces can you potentially buy in a year? So. So yeah, we will have these two areas separated. The event is a private event. We're not going to sell tickets, we're not going to ask for money to anyone. You just have to register yourself by sending an email to samhelimited edition.co uk for as long as we have space available, we're going to say yes. And for as long as you have, you have, you know, you, you know, collecting watches is your hobby and it should be, it should be great fun. Same thing with Pietro's, our showroom. The showroom is public in the sense that anyone can make an appointment and come here and visit and have an experience. We are not a high street shop, so you just can't rock up and just come in. And this is for both security reasons and also to make sure that people with a hobby of watchmaking come here and we can actually allocate the time that is needed to seriously talk about watches as opposed to just, you know, walk in, have a look around and walk, walk out. So everything is driven by the same spirit for both the day of the independence and the visit to the showroom. And your man is Sam for the day of the independence. If you are, if you're thinking that you're free on the 19th of September and you're in London, just get in touch with Sam. Whereas if you want to visit the showroom, we are in the Oxford Circus area, very close to Time and Tide. Our friends at Time and Tide that are just next door and obviously specialize on a set of different watchmakers than us, we are in the same district in the Oxford Circus area. And you can get in touch with Liam. Liamelimited.co.uk and Liam would be your host. For you to see and visit our space here in London.
- [44:56]
A
I'm going to come along to both. Already been to the London premises, but I want to see it now. It's operating. I got there on the cusp of launch. As I mentioned, you still had the architect in with one of your security guys. And security is something that we highlighted when we spoke about your place before. London is getting better. We recently had the two gents from the flying Squad, that's Metropolitan Police, they deal with watch crime, they deal with jewelry heists, all that kind of stuff. Not just when it comes to retailers, but on the street operations. And they have said that thanks to the operations they put in place over the last number of years, they're getting the convictions. It's starting to scare away the would be give it a go, guys on the street. Now it's more a case of moped, mobile phone theft, the quick, easy buck, but it still got that kind of edge when people think about London because of what has happened. When you go to Pietro's, the security is up the wazoo to get in. It's a secure entry system, then you're within the building, you actually have to get to Pietro's within the building. Then you've got a security guard there. You come in, doors are open, doors are locked. So at every single point, it's like going to a Rolex boutique. Think of it that way. Think of the intricacies they have got with their security systems, their cctv, their staffing. It is completely safe. So when you make an appointment, you turn up, you don't have to worry. And that is the biggest thing. This is a hobby. Hobbies are fun. You shouldn't be thinking about, oh, my God, what happens if the worst was to occur. So that's something you'd also worry about, flipping it over to your big event. This year we again, when I sat down with yourself and Sam and we were butting our heads together, come up with some ideas. We are doing, and I've mentioned on the show before, a tour of the UK. This is going to be. We've not decided 100% yet, but either starting in Glasgow in Scotland or starting way, way up north in Skye, the Isle of Skye and working our way down, stopping off and bumping into friends in their own place. It's great meeting at shows, it's great meeting in Geneva, big events, watchmakers club, blah, blah, blah. But going to meet the guys at Stu the Underdog at the Doghouse, going to see the folks at Christopher Ward at their place. Going to see Nicholas at Fears in Bristol or at Garrick. The main man himself, Mr. Brailsford. It's just I want to go and see these people in their home turf, at home, where they have got the advantage. We're away, they're playing from home and we get to experience what it is and they can show us things, they can show us their designs, they can show us their materials, how they put stuff together. If they've got workshop facilities. I know Dave obviously at Garrick does have, we can learn a little bit more. And as we go along we're going to record content. Not quite finalize the details in my head. They're still percolating, but it's going to be a Netflix style documentary, both an audio and a visual format. So it'll appear on YouTube because it's very visual going and seeing these people. And obviously we don't want to let anybody that listens because predominantly still on audio podcasts, people listen in the car when they go to work, when they go to the gym, when they're doing their chores, etc, etc, so we don't want to leave anyone aside. But the culmination point, the final, the finale of our little tour around the UK is going to be this event with Pietro with the limited edition down in London. So I think this will be the cherry on top, the finale, the grand finale of the tour. I'm bringing lots of very Clarks in the words together for this one, but it's going to be exceptional. We've done a couple of test runs, we have done a couple of things with the likes of ebay and we've traveled down south so we know roughly what we're doing. We've got some good camera equipment, we've got our bags ready, we know what equipment needs to come with us as well as what we need to survive. So that is going to be excellent. That will be happening sooner rather than later. Ending up at the big event with Pietro and that's where we're going to record a live podcast on the night itself. So lots and lots of things to keep keep looking ahead towards as much as we've got Geneva watch days probably in our periphery at the moment, the next big thing is obviously coming down and seeing you. And speaking of Geneva watch days, what have you got up your sleeve for that?
- [48:40]
B
Yeah, so we are organizing actually now as we speak because should have done it before but I just got back from the holiday, like I'm always scared because I don't want to fall in the trap of clogging my agenda, you know, from day one until the last day and not having the time to take those spontaneous situations that inevitably happen, happen depending on who you're gonna bump into over there. And it's not, how can I say, it's not a cliche. It's actually the, the reality. The, the less, the less I clog my agenda and the more I enjoy those events and the, the most I get out of them. So obviously I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be supported by the team. Now, like you mentioned before, we have a team that border. We both borderline 20 people now are the limited issue. So there's a, there's, there's quite a lot happening behind the scenes. But I would be there, Oliver would be there. Oliver and Sam would be taking care of creating content for all the brands. My team, that takes care of all our suppliers. So Kelly and Mark, Mark Tolson, who was joining us from, obviously from Watches of Switzerland, which is another thing I can't believe happened last year is the last.
- [49:50]
A
What's the story here?
- [49:51]
B
Well, Mark was the, obviously the head buyer at Aurum Group and Watches Switzerland for years and years. And yeah, so handling the head buying for like 200 stores in the UK, specialized in luxury watchmaking, you know, the likes of Patek, Rolex and, you name it over in the UK and the US and then he moved on and he retired and then he got bored and he called me one day, he called me, said, you know, why, why don't we do something together? And I thought he was joking and that he ended up, he ended up joining us, which for me was a, A revelation because not only by definition, we, we have been like antagonist a little bit to the world of, you know, how can I put this?
- [50:41]
A
High street luxury.
- [50:42]
B
Yeah, High street luxury. Yeah. But which we love, you know, we, we love, we love those brands as well. You know, if you're a watch collector, you like a nice watch, you know, you don't care what category that watch belongs to. But we always been preaching that there was much more to watchmaking than just what you see on the high street. And then one of the guys that was one of the big decision makers to who. What would be on the high street and what would not be on the high street. And actually, Mark tried to introduce at Watches Switzerland many times, the, the Independence tenants back in the day now has decided to join us. So he's the head of the suppliers at the limited edition. He's going to come to the junior watch days and make sure that we meet all the supplies and, and he talks, he will talk the business and I'll go around and try, try to meet people, see watches I'm interested in and, and create, generate opportunities for the future. And I need to have the freedom and the oxygen and the bandwidth to be able to do that. So that's how we are roughly organized. We will have a collector's dinner like we always have every time we take 15 to 20 collectors privately and meet some of the watchmakers, you know, a couple of watchmakers every time in a private location in Geneva. And we, we spend some valuable quality time in that way. And yeah, that's, that's what gonna, gonna happen. Funny enough, we have one of our partners that actually gave us his flat to use during the event. I'm not going to mention names, but we are becoming completely organic to our partnerships. And it's very refreshing because it feels like going from a home to another home, just in a different place, in a different context.
- [52:25]
A
Organic is the word that I actually had in mind as you were chatting there, because we've done both ways, we've tried it both ways. We booked our scheduling to the Gunnels and this is because of watches and wonders where, because there's so many media and press and they've got to be careful with who they invite and who stays where and blah, blah, blah, and keeping costs down. We have to be regimented. It's literally back to back to back appointments, running from one place to the other, trying to strategically on a map go well, if we're in iwc, then we can move to Vacheron because it's right beside it. Instead of running for five minutes. At Geneva watch Days, I've learned that the best way to do it is what you've just done said it's to take your time, be organic, see what happens and let things develop in front of you. If you are being organic, you can create more. Your mind starts to roll. You bump into somebody, you spot a sign that says that a brand you've never heard of is exhibiting at a hotel around the corner. And you just walk around. You walk in, you say, have you got time? Most of the time they do. They invite you in and you discover new things. And that is what Pietro always does. He is the gem finder and we've done this a number of times. Our scheduling for this year's Geneva watch days is a little bit more sparse than usual for that. They're giving ourselves time to discover, just to walk around, find things and fall over what we've not seen before. Bring that to the audience, bring that to you, listening, watching at home, and then develop the story because there's been a ton of people we've met and those people have become friends, not just colleagues in the industry, and we've had them on the show. We've had you on the show multiple times for many, many years. And that's something we're doing with as many creators are telling good stories and are actually producing the goods. There are some people that are bad actors in every walk of life, every industry, and we've alluded to a few of them in this episode because we're keeping giving them a wide berth because they're not to be trusted. If you hear about people on the show that we talk about, with over 800 episodes in our back catalog, we're here for the long game, not the short one. So we talk about people that we trust, we bring people on the show we trust because we don't want to put our necks on the line for people, Johnny, come lately who are just in there for a quick buck and neither is Pietro. So, looking forward to Geneva watch days, looking forward to planning this, that and the other. We've actually got a trip to Italy coming up later on in the year as well. There's another event happening that we are going to be involved with and more details will come on about. Well, details may actually be out already because an Instagram post will go out probably a couple of days before this episode drops. But we have come to the end of an episode. I think you've covered pretty much everything. The last thing to ask you to tell people is where they can find you because you're on every platform available.
- [54:51]
B
Of course, we have covered everything because we never have an agenda when we get online for these chats. So whatever we say is going to be right anyway. So, I mean, at the risk of repeating myself, but yeah, you can find us now in the Oxford Circus area. If you contact Liam, you can find this email liamelimited.co.uk or if you send us a message through our Instagram account, or if you're watching our YouTube channel. We're very humbled with the success of the YouTube channel. We have recently achieved 300,000 subscribers, which I was never remotely even contemplating to get. To get to such a number. Just. There are so many ways of getting in touch with us. If you love artisan watchmaking, you will find us. Anyway, there is a website, thelimited edition.co.uk and yeah, get in touch if you love artisan watchmaking, independent watchmaking. I think we still a good address for that.
- [55:53]
A
The best. Definitely the best. And if you want to find out any more about them, look in the show notes. They're linked in your podcast player and Obviously they're in YouTube in the description at the top and in there you'll find the links to The Instagram, the YouTube channel, the website, all that information that we've talked about plus images and links directly to the watches that Pietro and myself have discussed over the last hour. Always a pleasure Pietro. I'm not going to say too much more because I'm going to keep all the chat for when I see you in real life and probably written about one month's time over in Geneva. That's where we catch up the most and yeah that is about it. So thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. We'll catch you guys again soon.
- [56:28]
B
Thank you Ricky. See you soon. Sam.