
Antti Horelli: Achieving Productive Serenity - Sign of Scrum Master Success Read the full Show Notes and search through the world's largest audio library on Agile and Scrum directly on the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast website: . Antti describes...
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Pasco Duarte
Hi there, Pasco Duarte here, your host. I wanted to share a story with you. You know how sometimes Agile just feels like following another checklist when like processes and frameworks feel more important than what we are trying to achieve and sometimes even like handcuffs. I was talking to a customer of the Global Agile Summit and he used a term that kind of stuck in my he said, I have Agile fatigue. And I've heard that a lot from people since then. But here's the thing, it doesn't have to be this way. So we started thinking and at the Global Agile Summit, which is happening this May, we're bringing together practitioners who've actually done that, who've broken free from this, you know, install the framework kind of mindset. We want to focus the summit on real life, first person stories of Agile all succeeding that inspire you to action. We're talking real experiences, practical solutions, and of course, amazing insights from leaders like Gojkoacic, who will be one of the keynote speakers, and Jurgen Apelo, who will be one of the keynote speakers as well. If you're ready to leave the Agile fatigue behind, just join us in Dalit. The early birth tickets are now available@the globalagilesummit.com and mark your calendar. We will have workshops on May 18th, that's a Sunday. And then the conference itself will happen on May 19th and 20th of 2025 in Tallinn, Estonia. So let's make Agile exciting again. And remember, go to agile globalagilesummit.com that is, and get your early birth ticket. Now. It will only be available until early March, so grab it now. And now onto the episode.
Vasco
Hello everybody. Welcome to our yes, Thursday. This week we have with us Anti Horelli. Hey, Anti, welcome back.
Antti Horelli
Hello, Vasco. Once again, nice to be here.
Vasco
Absolutely great to have you. And today we're going to talk about success in a minute. But first share with us what's your favorite retrospective format and why?
Antti Horelli
All right, in general, if you think about your recurring Scrum team retrospectives, I don't have a particular favorite. I think I just like to make some, make them different, keep people kind of, you know, alive in the situation, make them think. But if I have a retro about kind of some sort of longer project or maybe multiple sprints or something, then I like to use this timeline method. So we start the sprint by putting putting a timeline on the wall from the start of the period we're looking at. It might be the start project, it might be something else to where we are right now. Then we together put in the most Influential happenings that have been there or. And then we'll maybe brainstorm them with the whole group. Put stickies up first, like concrete happenings, deliveries, critical meetings, things like that. Then maybe even. Even like phenomena, something more a bit fuzzy, but put those also in there. Something people noticed happening about at this point, even though it wasn't like one certain moment in time or one concrete thing. Then also sometimes I've drawn like a feeling curve throughout the project. Like draw a curve like here. I was really happy, I was really enthusiastic. Then everything went wrong and I was really frustrated. And you can kind of get the mood of the whole thing through that. So that would be maybe my one favorite.
Vasco
Absolutely. Why do you think it's important to bring in that concept of the phenomena, as you called it? So like this fuzzier things that people kind of started noticing, maybe dynamics that were happening or whatever.
Antti Horelli
Well, I think that's the kind of things that are a bit more tricky to point at. You can't say the time that. The critical thing, the moment that easily, but they really do affect what's happening. For example, the dynamics inside the team changed somehow, and that absolutely affects the work the team is doing. So you somehow have to tackle those as well. And maybe you can learn from that, since it's a retrospective, next time, maybe you can learn something from that. Do it, do it better, prepare for it, or if it's something good, positive, then make sure it's that happen in the next project as well.
Vasco
So in the old project management world that I come from, we used to call this early signals. Of course, in retrospective, they might not be early anymore, depending on how often you are doing this type of. Having this type of discussion in the retrospective. But if you do it regularly enough, like referring to things that you can't really put your finger into, actually can be a very effective way to discover underlying dynamics that are not yet obvious. Right. Hence the name weak signals. And I think it is great for us to be open to that and to somehow incorporate that into the retrospectives. Because even though you can't describe exactly, you can point at something. And when more and more of those things start coming up, then you start to realize that, oh, actually there is something bigger going on here.
Antti Horelli
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, if in a retro, you can say not. Not just that, okay, this specific thing happened, but I have a feeling about this. I have a feeling like this. And that's really valuable. Yeah.
Vasco
And this can in the end help us make better decisions. Whether it is like, for example, in the Was it the. Yeah, the Tuesday episode. Right. Like this, when you got the whole team together and things didn't really work out. Like having this feelings discussion. Not necessarily feelings, but like intuitions, questions, you know, we can bring that up in many different ways. It could have highlighted what was going on before it took a dynamic of its own.
Antti Horelli
Absolutely, yes.
Vasco
Right. That was the retro. But of course, we're here to talk about success for Scrum Masters. So, Anthy, share with us, what does success mean for you as a Scrum Master?
Antti Horelli
Yeah, really awesome question here. I had a. Kind of. A lot of tidbits, but now I try to formulate it somehow. I guess if you think about being a Scrum Master, working on the team level, I like to aim for something called productive serenity. I'm not sure if this is term. Maybe I just.
Vasco
I like the term, though. Explain that to us.
Antti Horelli
In Finnish, it would be two of tabatunas. But it's this feeling like if you have the team, team is working and you walk into the room, like in the world where they're still in one room and there's a lot of stuff happening. It's only very serene, it's hands on the keyboard. But then there's these small discussions happening and then someone notices, okay, there's a problem here. And then they get together and solve that problem. Maybe it's things like the work process flows nicely, outcomes come together, value is delivered, people are excited about what they do, but they're not overstressed about what they do in the team. The feeling of things just in general clicking and when they don't click, because that of course happens when there's a problem, then people can address it with kind of a serious coldness. Like, we don't go into panic, we. We take it seriously, but we take it as a problem we need to solve, not as something to like, make our blood pressure go through the roof. So I guess that would be the short version.
Vasco
Absolutely. And one of the things that I really like about this, how you describe it, productive serenity, it's that the implicit image at, in my mind of a lot of things happening in the background, but they don't surface as conflict, stress, rushing or something like that.
Antti Horelli
Yeah, exactly. And the team is able to kind of self. This kind of implies the team is able to self organize, to meet these things, kind of take care of them. If something comes up, a couple of people take care of it, and that's kind of okay. And then when something bigger comes up, then there's bigger discussion the product owner goes to talk to hire management or whatever is necessary and all that happens. Yeah. And also one side note of this is that everything, even if me as a scrum master is not there, if I'm sick for a week, this still continues. This is sustainable. It's kind of in the team. It's not something kind of someone has to prop up.
Vasco
Yeah. There's this phrase from famous basketball coach John Wooden who used to say to his players, be quick but don't hurry. And that, that like. And I think the productive serenity that you described is something that feels the same. Right. It's like you see a lot of things happening. A lot of things happening. You see movement, but you don't see people in a hurry.
Antti Horelli
Yes. There's no panic. There's no like, you know, you know, running, like grimacing, running and grimacing. It's, it's, it's like a positive. You might be running at some point, but it's a positive feeling like you're getting good things done, not, not, you know, trying to survive bad things.
Vasco
So you've described a couple of behaviors already. Like for example, most of the work happens with hands on keyboard, but people are getting together to discuss when there's problems to solve. What are some of the behaviors you want to see in the teams that are productively serene?
Antti Horelli
Yeah, I think a lot of small discussion is one thing. Like anyone can feel that if there's question, they throw it up and then the correct people kind of get around to talk about it. So that's definitely one thing. And it's not up to any one person in the team to kind of pinpoint or observe what, what are the things, what are our problems, what are our big hurdles, what are the landmines we're running into. But it's kind of, it comes up in from everyone as necessary and people self organized to take care of that also. Well, okay, I guess that all ties into psychological safety. That's kind of maybe implied here as well. And maybe, maybe getting kind of everyone's brain engaged with everything that we're doing. Or at least. Well, not, not everything fully, but like in a good way. Like people collaborate on some level on everything and then, but are also able to focus on the thing that they need to get done. So kind of the optimized teamwork, optimized communication inside the team.
Vasco
Yeah, it's a set of paradoxes. Right. It's like it is. People are working well alone, but then they come together when they need.
Antti Horelli
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's really, it's difficult to quantify and it very much does depend on the situation, where the team is and all that. So once again, communication optimization like we talked in on the earlier episodes.
Vasco
Yeah, I really like that image of like this. Not necessarily antagonic ideas, but contrasting ideas, like working well alone but then coming together. I think this is a great example, like the productive serenity being quick but not hurrying. I think that having that in mind, like really finding the balance so that the work flows through the team.
Antti Horelli
Yeah, absolutely.
Vasco
Great imagery and great metaphors. Thank you for sharing that with us, Anthy.
Antti Horelli
Thank you. That's really something to aim for.
Pasco Duarte
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Host: Vasco Duarte, Agile Coach, Certified Scrum Master, Certified Product Owner
Guest: Antti Horelli
Release Date: January 30, 2025
In this episode of the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast, host Vasco Duarte welcomes Antti Horelli to discuss the concept of success for Scrum Masters, specifically focusing on achieving "Productive Serenity" within teams. The conversation delves into effective retrospective formats, the importance of recognizing subtle team dynamics, and the behaviors that signify a Scrum Master's success.
Timestamp: [02:16] - [03:58]
Antti begins by sharing his approach to retrospectives. Rather than adhering to a single favorite format, he emphasizes the importance of variety to keep team members engaged and thoughtful. For longer projects or multiple sprints, Antti prefers the Timeline Method. This involves:
Notable Quote:
"I just like to make some, make them different, keep people kind of, you know, alive in the situation, make them think."
— Antti Horelli [02:27]
Timestamp: [03:58] - [05:43]
Vasco inquires about the significance of including "phenomena"—the more nebulous team dynamics—in retrospectives. Antti explains that these subtle changes, though harder to pinpoint, significantly impact the team's performance. Recognizing and addressing these phenomena can lead to:
Notable Quote:
"Those are a bit more tricky to point at. You can't say the time that... but they really do affect what's happening."
— Antti Horelli [04:14]
Timestamp: [06:39] - [10:11]
The core of the episode centers on Antti's vision of success as a Scrum Master, which he terms "Productive Serenity." This concept embodies:
Antti elaborates that Productive Serenity is characterized by:
Notable Quotes:
"It's this feeling like if you have the team... it's only very serene, it's hands on the keyboard."
— Antti Horelli [07:05]
"There's no panic... we take it as a problem we need to solve, not as something to like, make our blood pressure go through the roof."
— Antti Horelli [08:21]
Timestamp: [10:11] - [12:12]
Antti outlines specific behaviors that reflect Productive Serenity within a team:
Vasco reinforces these ideas by drawing parallels to John Wooden's philosophy: "Be quick but don’t hurry." This encapsulates the essence of maintaining momentum without succumbing to unnecessary stress.
Notable Quote:
"It's a set of paradoxes. Right. It's like it is. People are working well alone, but then they come together when they need."
— Vasco Duarte [11:51]
"There's no like, you know, running, like grimacing, running and grimacing. It's, it's, it's like a positive."
— Antti Horelli [09:54]
Timestamp: [12:12] - [12:52]
The episode wraps up with Antti emphasizing that Productive Serenity is an attainable and sustainable state for Agile teams. He highlights that even in his absence, the team can maintain its workflow and address challenges effectively, showcasing the robustness of the practices implemented.
Vasco thanks Antti for sharing his insights, underscoring the importance of striving for Productive Serenity as a measure of Scrum Master success.
Notable Quote:
"That's really something to aim for."
— Antti Horelli [12:46]
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