Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast: Agile Storytelling from the Trenches
Episode Title: From Command to Collaboration, An Agile Leadership Team's Transformation Story | Zvonimir Durcevic
Host: Vasco Duarte
Guest: Tsvanimir Durcevic
Release Date: April 2, 2025

Introduction

In this episode of the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast, host Vasco Duarte engages in an insightful conversation with Tsvanimir Durcevic, a seasoned Agile Coach and Certified Scrum Master. The discussion centers around Tsvanimir's transformative experience with a leadership team transitioning from a traditional command-and-control management style to a more collaborative and Agile approach.

Background of the Transformation Process

Tsvanimir begins by setting the stage for the transformation story, highlighting the context within which the change was necessary.

[01:15] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "The leadership team was supporting a part of the organization that had already embraced Agile. However, they themselves were operating with a traditional management style, making decisions unilaterally without involving their teams in the change process."

The organization consisted of four major teams that needed to restructure their communication and collaboration mechanisms. Recognizing the gaps in their current approach, the leadership sought Tsvanimir's expertise to guide them towards a more inclusive and Agile-friendly management style.

Identifying the Need for Change

Tsvanimir emphasizes the importance of moving away from traditional management where decisions are made solely by managers based on their expertise. Instead, the focus shifted towards involving team members in the decision-making process to foster ownership and collaboration.

[03:10] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "Sometimes what happens is that managers don't approach the people they manage to get their input. Involving people in the change is what really makes it possible."

Implementing Edge Theory

To facilitate this transformation, Tsvanimir introduced the team to Edge Theory, a change management framework developed by Arnold Mendel, which he learned through his Organizational and Relationship Systems Coaching (ORSC) education.

[05:08] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "Edge Theory is about recognizing the boundaries between what is known and what is new. It's like a mountain with two sides, where crossing the edge symbolizes embracing new roles and behaviors."

Key Concepts of Edge Theory:

1. Primary Area (Known): Represents the current roles and behaviors that team members are comfortable with.
2. Secondary Area (Unknown): Symbolizes the new roles and behaviors that the team needs to adopt.
3. The Edge: The transition zone where team members push beyond their comfort zones to embrace change.

Tsvanimir utilized Edge Theory to help the leadership team identify and navigate their transition from a traditional to an Agile leadership style.

[05:02] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "We visualize the change as a mountain. To move from our current role to a new one, we have to cross the edge, which involves experimenting and learning in new ways."

Facilitating the Transition

The transformation process involved several key steps, facilitated through coaching sessions:

1. Self-Reflection and Awareness:

   • Encouraging leaders to recognize behaviors that signify discomfort or resistance to change.
   • Identifying the need to shift from directive to collaborative leadership.

2. Creating a Safe Space for Dialogue:

   • Establishing protocols for constructive conflict to ensure all voices are heard.
   • Building trust within the team to foster open communication.

3. Defining a New Identity:

   • Developing a shared vision for the leadership team's new role as a support team.
   • Creating a "third identity" that embodies the collaborative and Agile principles they aimed to adopt.

[08:19] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "They had to create their own new identity, sometimes called a third identity. What is the new identity of their team, of their leadership? They call themselves support team."

4. Vision and Action Planning:
   • Articulating the team's vision and the concrete actions required to achieve it.
   • Aligning individual and collective goals towards the new leadership paradigm.

[08:51] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "We tried first to create alignment, understanding their vision and the concrete actions needed to reach this new leadership style."

Challenges Faced During Transformation

Transitioning from a traditional to an Agile leadership style was not without its challenges. Tsvanimir highlights several obstacles the team encountered:

1. Resistance to Change:

   • Some leaders were hesitant to relinquish control and adopt a more facilitative role.
   • Overcoming ingrained habits and beliefs about management.

2. Interpersonal Conflicts:

   • Differing opinions and perspectives led to conflicts that needed to be managed constructively.
   • Implementing conflict protocols to ensure debates remained productive.

[10:19] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "We created a conflict protocol to ensure that disagreements were handled constructively, allowing everyone to voice their opinions without fear."

3. Consistency in Messaging:
   • Ensuring that all leaders communicated the new vision cohesively to their respective teams.
   • Aligning individual conversations with the collective vision to avoid mixed messages.

Outcomes and Lessons Learned

The transformation journey yielded significant positive outcomes for the leadership team and the organization as a whole:

1. Enhanced Collaboration:
   • Leaders became more collaborative, involving team members in decision-making processes.
   • A shift from command-and-control to a servant leadership model.

[11:44] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "The leadership team started to talk from the experience as a unified support team, creating a new identity for their system."

2. Increased Trust and Engagement:

   • Building trust within the team led to higher engagement and ownership among team members.
   • Empowered leaders fostered a more motivated and proactive workforce.

3. Sustainable Change:

   • The use of Edge Theory provided a sustainable framework for continuous improvement and adaptation.
   • Leaders were equipped with the tools to maintain and further develop the Agile transformation.

[11:44] Tsvanimir Durcevic: "They started to talk from their new identity, which significantly improved their interactions both within the team and with other parts of the organization."

Conclusion

Tsvanimir Durcevic's story exemplifies the profound impact that thoughtful leadership transformation can have on an organization's Agile journey. By moving from a traditional command-based approach to a collaborative and supportive leadership style, the team not only enhanced their own dynamics but also set a foundation for sustained Agile success within the organization.

[11:55] Oscar: "Teams create that third identity. It was a great story. Thank you for sharing that, Tsvane."

This episode underscores the importance of self-reflection, structured change management frameworks like Edge Theory, and the critical role of leadership in fostering an Agile culture. Leaders looking to drive meaningful change within their organizations can draw valuable lessons from Tsvanimir's experiences.

Notable Quotes:

• Tsvanimir Durcevic [05:02]: "We visualize the change as a mountain. To move from our current role to a new one, we have to cross the edge, which involves experimenting and learning in new ways."

• Tsvanimir Durcevic [08:19]: "They had to create their own new identity, sometimes called a third identity. What is the new identity of their team, of their leadership? They call themselves support team."

• Tsvanimir Durcevic [10:19]: "We created a conflict protocol to ensure that disagreements were handled constructively, allowing everyone to voice their opinions without fear."

• Tsvanimir Durcevic [11:44]: "They started to talk from their new identity, which significantly improved their interactions both within the team and with other parts of the organization."

This detailed summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the episode, providing a comprehensive overview for listeners and those interested in Agile leadership transformations.