When Technical Expertise Becomes Product Owner Micro-Managements | Somya Mehra

Summary

Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast: Agile Storytelling from the Trenches
Episode: When Technical Expertise Becomes Product Owner Micro-Management | Somya Mehra
Host: Vasco Duarte
Guest: Soumya Mehra
Release Date: August 15, 2025

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Introduction

In this insightful episode of the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast, host Vasco Duarte engages with Soumya Mehra to delve into the dynamics of effective and poor product ownership within Agile teams. The conversation centers around identifying anti-patterns in product management and exemplifying best practices through real-world experiences.

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Identifying Product Owner Anti-Patterns

Soumya Mehra begins by sharing a challenging experience with a product owner whose technical prowess led to micromanagement:

"We were working on a project... the user stories are created by the product owner and the developers and product owner says what he or she wants to achieve, not how you want to achieve."
[01:41]

Initially perceived as helpful, the product owner's technical directives began to suffocate the development team's autonomy:

"He was just controlling everything. So the thing was when like and the developers... they were hesitant to say no, stop, you are not the one to do it."
[02:30]

Key Issues Identified:

• Micromanagement: The product owner dictated technical solutions instead of focusing on "what" needs to be achieved.
• Erosion of Trust: Developers felt their expertise was undervalued, leading to decreased morale and autonomy.
• Communication Breakdown: The team became reluctant to voice their concerns, allowing the anti-pattern to persist.

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Addressing and Resolving the Anti-Pattern

Soumya outlines the steps taken to rectify the situation:

1. Individual Coaching: Encouraging team members to assertively communicate their discomfort with the product owner's overreach.

   "I started coaching them [to say no] in a good way... I will be there to protect you, just say it out loud."
   [04:10]

2. Direct Communication with the Product Owner: Initiating a candid conversation to delineate roles and responsibilities.

   "I had a talk with the product owner... you are going out of your role now. You have to take a step back."
   [05:15]

3. Establishing Boundaries: Agreeing that team members would respectfully interrupt when the product owner deviated from their role.

   "If in the meeting you see I'm going out of my role, just tell me that, hey, let's get back to it later and I will understand that."
   [05:50]

Outcomes Achieved:

• Restored Team Autonomy: Developers regained control over their tasks and decision-making processes.
• Enhanced Collaboration: Open dialogues fostered a more cohesive and trusting team environment.
• Sustainable Practices: The team could maintain healthy boundaries, preventing future instances of micromanagement.

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Showcasing Exemplary Product Ownership

Transitioning from challenges to success stories, Soumya highlights the traits of an outstanding product owner:

"Honesty, transparency, and trust was the utmost thing that he wants to do."
[08:15]

Attributes of a Great Product Owner:

1. Clear and Timely Communication:

   • Maintains open lines with stakeholders and different teams.
   • Transparently shares delays and dependencies to manage expectations.

2. Effective Backlog Management:

   • Organizes the backlog with well-defined epics and user stories.
   • Ensures that relevant information is accessible, facilitating independent progress by developers.

3. Prioritization with Rationale:

   • Clearly explains the reasoning behind prioritization changes.
   • Builds trust by demonstrating that decisions are made in the team's and company's best interest.

4. Supportive and Available:

   • Remains accessible to address queries and provide guidance.
   • Empowers the team by fostering an environment where they understand "why" tasks are undertaken.

Impact on the Team:

• Increased Motivation: Team members feel valued and understand the purpose behind their work.
• Enhanced Efficiency: Clear guidelines and accessible information streamline the development process.
• Strengthened Trust: Consistent transparency cultivates a reliable and dependable work environment.

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Key Takeaways

• Avoid Micromanagement: Product owners should focus on "what" needs to be achieved, allowing developers the autonomy to determine "how."
• Foster Open Communication: Encourage team members to express concerns and address issues proactively.
• Emphasize Transparency: Clear and honest communication builds trust both within the team and with external stakeholders.
• Effective Backlog Management: A well-organized backlog with detailed epics and user stories enhances team efficiency and clarity.

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Notable Quotes

• Soumya Mehra on Micromanagement:

  "He was just controlling everything... they are not having the collaboration."
  [03:50]

• Host Vasco Duarte on Addressing Issues:

  "Start investigating... and open that conversation as early as possible so that we can resolve it without major conflict."
  [06:21]

• Soumya Mehra on Product Owner Excellence:

  "Honesty, transparency, and trust was the utmost thing that he wants to do."
  [08:15]

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Conclusion

This episode underscores the delicate balance product owners must maintain between providing guidance and allowing team autonomy. Through Soumya Mehra's experiences, listeners gain valuable insights into recognizing detrimental behaviors and implementing strategies to cultivate a healthy, productive Agile environment. The contrasting examples of poor and exemplary product ownership serve as a roadmap for Scrum Masters and Agile Coaches aiming to enhance their team's dynamics and overall efficiency.

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Connect with Soumya Mehra

Interested in learning more from Soumya Mehra? Connect with her on LinkedIn to engage further and benefit from her expertise in Agile coaching and Scrum Mastery.

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For more actionable insights and inspiring conversations with Agile practitioners worldwide, subscribe to the Scrum Master Toolbox Podcast and join the vibrant community at scrummastertoolbox.org.

Transcript

[Vasko]

Hey there, Agile adventurer, just a quick question. What if, for the price of a fancy coffee or half a pizza, you could unlock over 700 hours of the best agile content on the planet? That's audio, video, E courses, books, presentations, all that you can think of. But you can also join live calls with world class practitioners and hang out in a flame war free and AI slop clean slack with the sharpest minds in the game. Oh, and yes, you get direct access to me, Vasko, your Scrum Master Toolbox podcast. No, this is not a drill. It's this Scrum Master Toolbox membership. And it's your unfair advantage in the Agile world. So if you want to know more, go check out scrummastertoolbox.org membership. That's scrummastertoolbox.org Membership. And check out all the goodies we have for you. Do it now. But if you're not doing it now, let's listen to the podcast.

[Host]

Hello everybody. Welcome to our Friday TGIF and product owner episode, this week with Somja Mehra. Hey Somia, welcome back.

[Soumya Mehra]

Thank you for having me again here.

[Host]

Absolutely. So product owner is the focus of today's episode. We'll talk about great product owners at the end. But first share with us what might have been potentially the worst product owner anti pattern you've witnessed in your career.

[Soumya Mehra]

I have only one example throughout my career where I have met a product owner who was very difficult to handle. This product owner was technically strong product owner. So I'm not saying it's a bad skill to have. It's a very good skill to have in a team. Like if you're having a highly technical product owner, things go bad when you try to control your team with your technical thoughts. So the problem over here was like we were working on a project. I don't, I don't want to take the name and the details about it because it's an anti pattern, but yeah. So the thing was, as we all know, the user stories are created by the product owner and the developers and product owner says what he or she wants to achieve, not how you want to achieve. What we were seeing over here was slowly transition of product owner controlling and telling people like, hey, use this kind of, like to achieve this, use this kind of library, use this kind of refactoring and that's how you will achieve it. At first the devs thought like, okay, maybe he's helping us because he's a technical guy. So they allowed him to do that. And even I was thinking like, okay, it's he's just helping it out in some of the user stories so it's fine, we don't need to call it out loud about it. But then it started happening in every feature, every task. Like all the user stories were defined by this person and he's just controlling everything. So the thing was when like and the developers, because they allowed the product owner in the start to do it now they were like hesitant to say no, stop, you are not the one to do it.

[Host]

So they started feeling that it was too much direction, too much controlling but they didn't feel comfortable enough to voice that exactly.

[Soumya Mehra]

But at the same time they were feeling like they are losing control over their work and the product owner is not trusting them to do like not trusting the whole team that how to do that work. I noticed it and then during my one to one I confronted the people like how you are feeling and they had the same kind of feeling. So here what I did, I started coaching them try to say no in a good way. Maybe when he, he's doing like, he's trying to say like how to do it, you can just say like hey, we'll come back to you again and once we decide how to do it we'll have a talk with you. Right? And those were the few examples which I was telling them and I told them that whenever you are saying just tell it, I will be there to protect you, just say it out loud because maybe he's not aware of it like you are not liking it. Once this was done then I had a talk with the product owner that hey, this is the kind of situation and I think you are like going out of your role now. You have to take a step back. You are a product owner, not a developer, not a tech guy anymore. So just say what you want and if the team wants then you give your technical aspect, otherwise let it be there. And I explained him like what are the disadvantage now? The refinements are silent, people are not talking because you are the one who is speaking all the time telling them what to do, how to do, when to do so. We are not having the collaboration. At first he was like are you the only one Soumya who is thinking this way or the team is thinking also? Then I was very happy. Like I had a talk with my team members before so I told him like I already had a talk with the team members and if you want you can have a good talk with them and you can get you know, the feedback from them. If you think like I'm the only one thinking like that. And then he was like, no, no, no, I was just asking, but yeah, I'm fine. And then we come up to a conclusion where he said like, okay, if in the meeting you see I'm going out of my role, just tell me that, hey, let's get back to it later and I will understand that. Okay, I was going out of my role and that's how we started tackling the situation and then it got better.

[Host]

But yeah, this is another great example of you taking action before things go too far. Right. Like this is a great story and I think also an encouragement for all of us to when things like this happen to actually, you know, start investigating. Out of curiosity, how do you feel? Do you see the same things? How do you feel the relationship with the PO is going and then talk to the PO and say, hey, have you noticed that? And kind of open that conversation as early as possible so that we can resolve it without major conflict. There's always going to be some conflict and that's okay, right? Nothing is perfect and that's fine. That's why we're here to improve things. But if we tackle it early enough, there's the opening for making it better before the conflict takes over.

[Soumya Mehra]

Yeah, that's true. And as a scrum master you have to make sure whenever you are reaching people with these sensitive topic to make sure and clear the stage. Like you're not being biased, you're not blaming them, you are here to help them out.

[Host]

Yeah, yeah, we are here to help.

[Soumya Mehra]

Yeah. If you collaborate nicely then it will turn out in a nice way. Only we are not here to, you know, put blame on you. So just set that stage up and then start the discussion in a lighter way.

[Host]

But there aren't only bad product owners, right? There's some amazing product owners out there. Soumya. So tell, tell us a story of. Not a story. Describe for us the best product owner you've ever worked with. How did they work?

[Soumya Mehra]

Yes. So I have worked with many good product owners throughout my life. I was lucky enough to work with great product owners and good product owners. So one of the product owner like one of the story that I would like to share on is we were working on a project where the project like to complete that project we were having dependency with multiple teams within the organization. So this product owner needs to have a clear communication, timely communication with different teams, with his team and with the stakeholders. And when you see like there are dependency, you know that you know the timeline is going to be not on time because you are dependent on some other team to complete certain thing and then give it to you and then you can, you know, do give it into the production. And generally what I see is like product owners are a bit scared to talk about this with the stakeholders. But with this product owner he was like I want to be very clear and honest and on time on sharing this, these results or news with the stakeholders because I don't want the trust to be broken. So he was somebody who for him the honesty, transparency and trust was the utmost thing that he wants to do. So being a scrum master, I never ever had to tell him that hey, there is a red flag, we won't be able to make it. We need to take talk to the stakeholders. He used to do it on his own telling them that hey, this is the situation, this is the clear picture. This team is having this kind of issue. So once they complete it, we'll get the feature and then we'll work on that feature and then we'll go on production. So this gives you a trust builder, trust between the product, another stakeholder that they think that okay, it's not like a never ending project. He said he will deliver it maybe one week later with the team and they deliver it and there is a reasoning why they are getting delayed. So this part was taken care of. Then the second part is having a clear communication with your team telling them what to do and why we are doing it and having one of the best skill about the product owner is the like it's a. More I think it's underrated but how they tackle the their backlog. If you see like in the project where there are so many teams involved, so many interdependencies happening. The product backlog is a never ending backlog. It's not managed. But in this case I saw this, this product owner having proper epics with the description and then the user stories in it. So that even when whenever the dev is looking at the user stories he can go to the EPIC and see whom to contact, which team to contact for which problem. Even if obviously the product owner was always available for everyone to answer the question. But he made sure if he is not there, everything is there. The information is there for the developers to look at into it. So the proper prioritization, backlog management, proper communication and then telling the team why we are doing it. If there is a change in a prioritization, he used to come forward and say like why we are doing the change in the prioritization? What importance it Brings like people are not thinking like oh, he changed the prioritization. We don't know what they are doing so it might not be beneficial. They are just doing it because the stakeholder told them, giving the reasoning why we are doing it to the team. And that I think whenever when you do this communication, when you build this trust with your team and with the other teams, your efficiency and your way or way, how the team is working, you can see the improvement in it, the motivation. The people are highly motivated because they know that whatever the product owner is doing, it's doing, he's doing it for them, for the company and then they also know why they are doing it. So I think that was one of the most, one of the great example of great product owner that I have.

[Host]

Worked with and how the proctor was able to consider the different aspects like the stakeholders, the clarity on the backlogs, the information that is always there for the team to know who to talk to if they need to talk to someone and then of course the collaboration and communication with other teams that they dependent on really great topics for the product owner to focus on and help the team with. That's a great story. Somja. We're getting close to the end but before we go, where can people find out more about you and the work that you are doing?

[Soumya Mehra]

You can find me on LinkedIn. I'm active over there, so search my name. Soumya Mehra on LinkedIn and with a Scrum master role over there, you can find me there.

[Host]

Absolutely.

[Soumya Mehra]

And connect me.

[Host]

Absolutely. That's exactly what I was going to say. We'll put the link on the show notes. So everybody go and connect and ask follow up questions. Grow as a community. Because it is as a community that we can learn from each other, grow our experience and knowledge much more easily and faster and then of course improve the companies, the teams that we work with. Thank you very much for being with us Somya, and for your generosity with your time and your knowledge.

[Soumya Mehra]

Thank you for having me and giving me this opportunity to share my thoughts and stories with everyone. Vasco.

[Vasko]

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[Vasko]

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