Second in Command with Cameron Herold

Ep. 524: Daniel Quinonez – Leading Change in a 140-Year-Old Industry & Future-Proofing The Trades

Date: November 4, 2025
Guest: Daniel Quinonez, COO of Plumbing Heating Cooling Contractors National Association (PHCC)
Host: Savannah Brewer (Co-Host) with intro by Cameron Herold

Episode Overview

This episode centers on Daniel Quinonez’s role as COO at PHCC, a 140-year-old trade association, and his mission to modernize, future-proof, and lead cultural change in the trades. The conversation delves into how AI is transforming the industry, the value of apprenticeships, challenges of succession in family businesses, and Dan’s “be nice” leadership mantra. It’s a rich look at leadership, business transformation, and why the skilled trades remain an attractive—and critical—career path.

Key Themes & Discussion Points

The Legacy & Importance of PHCC ([03:07])

• PHCC: The oldest U.S. construction association, supporting plumbing, heating, and cooling contractors nationwide.
• Members range from single-truck outfits to companies with thousands of employees. The organization's reach includes homes, hospitals, data centers, and more.

“It's an incredibly exciting and wonderful organization. What a great history and I'm very proud to serve it.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [03:07]

Origins:
Started in New York in the late 19th century, the association convened tradesmen to set standards for safety and sanitation, evolving into an organization that’s integral to public health and the built environment ([04:38]).

Career Pathways & Value of Apprenticeship ([05:57]–[10:22])

• PHCC operates as a community, supporting both union and non-union members and providing resources/training.
• Focus on apprenticeship and upward mobility: Many successful members began as apprentices or technicians and grew into ownership and leadership.
• Entry without a college degree: The value of hands-on experience in trades, contrasted with the uncertain return on a college education.
• High earning potential and entrepreneurial opportunities abound in the trades.

“It's virtually impossible ... to become an owner without having been out there doing the nitty gritty work.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [08:36]

“Young apprentices can make, once they graduate, can easily get up into the near 100,000 a year in salary right now. And the job security is incredible.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [09:38]

The Impact & Opportunity of AI ([10:22]–[11:28])

• AI is not a disruptor but a “partner” in the industry:
  • Streamlines call centers, assists with documentation/reporting, and enhances training.
  • Tools like AI-powered answering services improve customer flow and efficiency.
• Despite automation, the physical nature and complexity of the work mean the jobs themselves remain secure and in demand.

“AI has not hindered this industry at all. Where it's helped, AI has become a partner... to make AI almost a thought partner in their business, almost an essential part of your business.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [00:00]/[10:28]

Changing Perceptions of the Trades ([11:41]–[13:31])

• The main obstacle to recruiting young people has been parental bias toward college.
• As white-collar AI automation grows and job markets tighten, trades are regaining prestige and attractiveness.
• The industry trains for both technical and customer-facing skills, preparing tradespeople for entrepreneurial roles.

“The obstacle ... has been the parents. For so many years ... they frowned upon the trades, particularly plumbing or even H Vac. They're like, why would you want to do that?”
—Daniel Quinonez, [11:41]

Dan Quinonez's Leadership Journey ([14:03])

• Grew up working in a family bar, learning the value of hands-on hard work.
• Transitioned through public affairs, government, association management, and eventually into the PHCC.
• Ability to relate to “salt of the earth” contractors and their everyday challenges.

“It was easy for me to understand it, having a background and, you know, where I was from and how it was ... easy to relate to the struggles they go through each day.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [14:03]

Driving Organizational Change in a Legacy Institution ([17:46]–[24:15])

• First 90 days as COO: A whirlwind of adapting old systems, advancing a modern vision alongside CEO Cindy Sheridan, the organization’s first female CEO.
• Challenges include overcoming inertia, outdated technology (e.g., legacy Excel spreadsheets), and ingrained customs.
• The core focus is on growing membership and expanding modern, online educational offerings, e.g., the PHCC Academy.

“It's trying to take an organization as old as ours and bringing it into this century, understanding that technology needs to be an ally.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [23:00]

The Evolving COO Role and Succession in the Trades ([25:48]–[31:05])

• Private equity is reshaping the trade landscape, buying out family businesses and adding layers of corporate structure.
• In many companies, the COO role is being created explicitly as a succession plan for future leadership—keeping experience and company culture intact.
• Risk of legacy and name loss when a family business has no interested heirs.

“If you don't have a number two in place ... the organization will struggle. When you over rely on one person, it could cause incredible dissension and problems.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [27:20]

Leadership Philosophy: “Be Nice” ([31:19]–[36:50])

• Rooted in the principle that effective leadership is about calm, respect, and listening.
• Being “nice” doesn’t mean avoiding difficult conversations or standards—it means leading with empathy and respect at all levels.
• The reputation built on kindness reaps long-term professional benefits.

“Be nice just means, you know, not avoiding difficult conversations. But, you know ... be calm. Listen to what folks are saying.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [31:23]

• The show recounts stories (including third-party anecdotes) underscoring the business power of “nice” leadership.

Balancing Kindness with Accountability ([37:14]–[42:51])

• Accountability is established through clear metrics, buy-in, goal setting, and collaborative planning—whether teams are remote or on-site.
• Growth is tracked in membership, course participation, and sales.
• The organization has grown PHCC Academy users from 100–200 to 15,000 in five years, with significant revenue milestones.

“It's about accountability. It's about having your metrics. What's your goal?”
—Daniel Quinonez, [37:14]

• Advocates for the importance of cultural buy-in, and acknowledges that sometimes people or teams aren’t the right fit for transformation, but departures should be handled with respect.

Preparing Tradespeople for Business Leadership ([43:23])

• Moving from technical roles into business ownership/leadership depends on learning business finance, HR, management, and law.
• PHCC offers coaching and business education to new and aspiring owners to ensure success beyond the trade itself.

“The number one issue that I see with contractors that struggle the most in building their business ... is business finance.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [44:08]

Excitement for the Future ([46:49]–[49:24])

• Dan is passionate about seeing new programs, educational launches, and witnessing young people’s lives transformed through the trades.
• Upcoming events: PHCC’s Connect Conference, apprentice competitions, and continued expansion into international opportunities through World Skills.

“What's not to enjoy? ... It's work. Can I get paid to do what I love? You know, I sound like a baseball player.”
—Daniel Quinonez, [49:21]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On AI’s role:
  “AI has not hindered this industry at all. Where it's helped, AI has become a partner in our industry...”
  —Dan Quinonez, [00:00]

• On pathways in the trades:
  “You don’t have to go to college. You can grow quickly, you can gain that job security that you’re not going to have.”
  —Dan Quinonez, [12:22]

• On succession and legacy:
  “If you don't have a number two in place ... When you over-rely on one person, it could cause incredible dissension and problems...”
  —Dan Quinonez, [27:20]

• On leadership and being “nice”:
  “Be nice. Stay calm and you know, be nice because at the end of the day you never know where you're going to cross into somebody on the street somewhere.”
  —Dan Quinonez, [33:25]

• On mentoring and coaching:
  “The coaching and the mentorship is so important ... there are people that have been doing it 20 years longer than I had and showed me the ropes on things that would have taken me years to learn on my own.”
  —Savannah Brewer, [45:50]

Important Segments & Timestamps

• [03:07]—Introduction and history of PHCC
• [05:57]—Association services, apprenticeship, and career trajectories
• [10:28]—How AI is helping, not replacing, tradespeople
• [11:41]—Changing perceptions: College vs. trades
• [14:03]—Dan’s personal/professional backstory
• [17:46]—First 90 days as COO; vision for modernization
• [19:15]—Day-to-day COO responsibilities
• [23:00]—Challenges modernizing a legacy institution
• [25:48]—COO role, private equity, and succession trends
• [31:19]—Leadership philosophy: Be nice
• [37:14]—Balancing accountability with a positive culture
• [43:23]—Supporting technical professionals in learning business acumen
• [46:49]—Future outlook: apprentice competitions, global engagement

For Listeners Seeking More

• Learn more about PHCC at phcc.org
• For coaching or to connect with Dan, visit the PHCC website
• Interested in leadership courses mentioned on the show? Check out Cameron Herold’s “Invest in Your Leaders” and COO Alliance (investinyourleaders.com)

Tone & Energy:
Conversational, grounded, and inspirational. Dan brings a practical “salt of the earth” approach, and Savannah matches with curiosity and insightful follow-ups.

Summary prepared for those interested in leadership, business transformation, the future of the trades, and modern approaches to team and organizational culture.