Podcast Summary

Episode Overview

Episode Title: Cabochon Group COO Josh Post - How To Break Through Burnout With Essential COO Growth Tips
Podcast: Second in Command: The Chief Behind the Chief with Cameron Herold
Host: Cameron Herold
Guest: Josh Post, Chief Operating Officer, Cabochon Group
Air Date: January 29, 2026

This episode centers on the growth journey and philosophy of Josh Post, COO of Cabochon Group, as he unpacks lessons from his family business roots, the evolution of his leadership style, demystifying finance for operators, and the transition to coaching other entrepreneurial companies. The discussion is rich with personal anecdotes and actionable insights for anyone in a leadership or “second in command” role, especially those managing burnout, balancing operational demands, and navigating complex partnerships.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Growing Up in a Family Business: Lessons and Challenges

[02:25-05:39]

• Origins: Josh traces his roots to a family construction business in Elora, Ontario, joining out of duty rather than design.
  • “I would say I'm, I'm probably an entrepreneur by accident. I would, I would say I started out more as a duty being part of the family business and it sort of evolved over time.” — Josh Post [02:25]
• Role Evolution: Josh did every job—supervisor, purchaser, project manager—before becoming operations head and eventually COO.
• Conflict management:
  • Family businesses often contort around people rather than building processes and roles, which can hinder growth.
  • Learning to address issues head-on rather than delaying conflict is a leadership superpower.
  • “Business has to come first. You have to do what's best for the business, and once you prioritize that, then you have some hard conversations to have usually.” — Josh Post [04:36]

2. Moving from the Floor to Leadership

[07:00-10:19]

• Team Growth: Touches on managing up to 50 employees and later supporting client teams as large as 200.
• Letting Go: The hardest step was shifting from managing everyone directly to empowering others—learning to hire, mentor, and let go of old responsibilities.
  • “I had 45 direct reports, which is way too much. But I didn't want to let it go... I had to let go of managing people... it had to happen for the growth of the business for sure.” — Josh Post [09:25]
• Delegate for Scale: Learning to hand off roles and delegate is essential for business and personal growth.

3. The Mechanics and Emotional Toll of a Family Buyout

[10:19-14:47]

• Role Clarity: Separating shareholder, employee, and management roles is critical.
  • “Shareholder does not mean owner, does not mean employee... once we were able to resolve that through the buyout... business suddenly became really, really easy.” — Josh Post [10:46]
• Buyout Process: It took a year and a half of negotiation and self-examination, and the real sense of ownership only came after the change.
• Post-Buyout: Natural fit for Josh to take operations, his brother Herman to lead sales/CEO activities—as their strengths and interests aligned.

4. Personal Strengths, Modern Leadership & Communication

[07:34-08:27], [13:59-15:43]

• Own Who You Are: At first, Josh focused on fixing weaknesses; true breakthrough came by leveraging his strengths.
• Communication:
  • Directness, quick conflict resolution, and authenticity were key for growth and managing larger teams.
  • Video and honest communication are essential.
  • “Let's just be real. Like I'm not going to try to be someone I'm not. I'm just going to own both of the weaknesses and the strengths for me.” — Josh Post [07:49]
• Managing People: Learned management “by swimming,” reading books like John Maxwell & Dave Logan’s Tribal Leadership, and shifting from books to podcasts.

5. The COO Alliance & Peer Networks

[19:04-20:55]

• Josh’s Path: Joined the COO Alliance after a recommendation and a deep dive—consumes massive amounts of content, gaining from the peer learning focus.
  • “Herman mentioned to me often his suggestions aren't always suggestions... I just dove in. I think I watched every YouTube video you've put out there... and then I had a couple calls with a guy named Jesse... joined shortly thereafter.” — Josh Post [19:31]
• Value: The group’s peer-to-peer aspect and practical content help COOs up-level together, rather than top-down teaching.

6. Mastering Finance as a COO

[20:55-25:42]

• From Operations to Numbers: Josh’s path was unique; he mastered operations first, then learned finance out of necessity.
  • “For me, it was a gift. I knew operations really well... what I had to do was figure out how these numbers translated and talked to the stuff that's happening on the job site.” — Josh Post [21:09]
• Practical Learning: Used YouTube, conferences, mentors, and frameworks like EO, Traction, and advice from experts like Bob Gavreau and Greg Crabtree.
• Key Lesson: Gross profit, not revenue, is the guiding star.
  • “The whole thing changed when I realized that not about revenue, it's all about gross profit. And once I just structured my business around what's the gross profit this brings in and how much effort does it take to bring that in. Everything else just kind of made sense.” — Josh Post [22:27]
• Mentors: Monthly reporting deadlines and honest feedback from finance mentors enabled growth and accountability.

7. Navigating CEO/COO Dynamics (Especially as Siblings)

[27:28-29:15]

• Alignment: Herman and Josh are highly aligned on values and mission, though their working styles differ (visionary/people vs. structured/operations).
• Weekly Ritual: A one-on-one breakfast meeting to align priorities, air issues, and prevent miscommunication. The key is regular, structured dialogue, often outside the office.
  • “Once a week I sit down with breakfast and bring in the three things that are on my mind that I want his to put on... If you got a problem, tell me now. Otherwise it's going to happen.” — Josh Post [28:46]
• Partner, Not Subordinate: Emphasize same-page meetings that foster partnership and strategic focus.

8. Fractional COO & Advisory Work

[30:11-33:27]

• Origins: Began advising a peer group connection, then formalized as a fractional COO role for outside companies.
• Outside Perspective: External COO/advisor is sometimes more respected and effective than owners-internal, as they’ve “done it before.”
• Small Business Gaps:
  • Companies often outstrip their structural/process growth.
  • Many try random solutions without fixing the business model’s core levers.
• Impact: Value is unlocked by clarifying the business model, plugging leadership gaps, and implementing simple, measurable changes.

9. Consulting Lessons—The “Critical Few” and Enabling Real Leadership

[34:11-36:19]

• Clarity First:
  • Understand the essential levers of the business—how it really makes money—and share this model with the whole team.
  • “For me, the first thing is to understand the business. The levers, how the model, how the business itself functions, how does it make money? Most business owners don't know how their own business works. Once they understand it, then it's like, okay, we're not done, actually, why don't we tell the team how this thing works?” — Josh Post [34:19]
• Leadership Commitment:
  • All-in effort means focus and clarity, not overwork.
  • Monthly advisory/owner rhythm and connecting big-picture strategic decisions with daily choices keep teams aligned and accountable.

10. Advice to His Younger Self

[36:19-37:18]

• Stop Forcing Fit:
  • Don’t try to force people or situations that aren’t right; honor what you see and accept reality more quickly.
  • “I would say if I gave myself advice, I would say stop putting round pegs and square holes. I think it's really important to walk through doors that are already open rather than continue trying to bang doors that are closed.” — Josh Post [36:34]
  • “Life gets a lot simpler when I stop taking responsibility for everybody else's problems.” [37:18]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Business has to come first. You have to do what's best for the business, and once you prioritize that, then you have some hard conversations to have usually.” — Josh Post [04:36]
• "I had 45 direct reports, which is way too much. But I didn't want to let it go... it had to happen for the growth of the business for sure." — Josh Post [09:25]
• "Shareholder does not mean owner, does not mean employee... once we were able to resolve that through the buyout... business suddenly became really, really easy." — Josh Post [10:46]
• "Let's just be real. Like I'm not going to try to be someone I'm not. I'm just going to own both of the weaknesses and the strengths for me." — Josh Post [07:49]
• "For me, the first thing is to understand the business. The levers, how the model, how the business itself functions, how does it make money? Most business owners don't know how their own business works. Once they understand it, then it's like, okay, we're not done, actually, why don't we tell the team how this thing works?" — Josh Post [34:19]
• "I would say if I gave myself advice, I would say stop putting round pegs and square holes. I think it's really important to walk through doors that are already open rather than continue trying to bang doors that are closed." — Josh Post [36:34]

Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | Description | |----------------|------------------------------------------------------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 02:25-05:39 | Early family business journey | Roots, operations, and key family business lessons | | 09:25 | Letting go and scaling leadership | Transitioning from direct management to leadership | | 10:46-13:44 | Navigating the partner/buyout dynamic | Separating roles, the emotional buyout process | | 15:54 | Early leadership development | Books, learning by doing, and growing into a people manager | | 19:31 | Discovering the COO Alliance | How peer learning and the COO Alliance shaped Josh’s growth | | 22:27 | Finance shift: Gross profit over revenue | Focusing on gross profit as the key lever for business health | | 28:46 | Weekly alignment meetings with CEO brother | Maintaining partnership, clarity, and structure | | 31:27 | Fractional COO experiences | Value and gaps in small/mid-sized businesses; advice versus action | | 34:19 | Consulting focus: Understanding levers, leadership | Critical first steps in fixing a business | | 36:34 | Final advice: Honor fit and reality | What Josh would tell his younger self |

Summary Takeaways

• Understand your business model and share it widely.
• Prioritize business needs over personal comfort or legacy systems—don’t force roles or people to ‘fit.’
• Effective leadership requires self-awareness, direct communication, and the courage to let go and delegate.
• Continuous learning—through books, mentors, and peer alliances—is non-negotiable for modern COOs.
• Regular, structured COO-CEO communication is vital for alignment and operational success.
• Fractional/consulting roles reveal unique blind spots—sometimes outsiders effect change more easily than insiders.
• All-in commitment isn’t about hours worked, but about focus, clarity, and ensuring leaders drive strategy, not just firefighting.

This episode offers a candid, actionable roadmap for second-in-commands and operators striving for sustainable growth, improved team health, and personal evolution, whether in family businesses or high-growth entrepreneurial firms.