Brad Garrett Tells His Story | #100

Summary

Secondhand Therapy Podcast

Episode #100: Brad Garrett Tells His Story | September 22, 2025

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Episode Overview

In their milestone 100th episode, Louie Paoletti and Michael Malone, the hosts of Secondhand Therapy, take their deeply honest, irreverent mental health conversations out of the studio and into the legendary MGM Grand, where they sit down with acclaimed actor and comedian Brad Garrett. Famous for Everybody Loves Raymond and much more, Brad opens up with raw honesty, vivid humor, and vulnerability about his struggles with addiction, growing up around parental mental illness, coping with grief, intergenerational trauma, and the often-messy work of emotional healing.

The episode skillfully balances heavy, personal revelations with familiar wit and warmth, creating a poignant, engaging dialogue about why personal growth—and forgiveness—remains so challenging.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Brad's Early Experiences with Family Mental Illness

• Childhood Survival & Chaos:

  • Brad describes “raising his parents,” both of whom experienced distinct but significant mental illness.
  • His father suffered from undiagnosed bipolar disorder and his mother from severe depression, agoraphobia, and bulimia.
  • “I ended up kind of raising my parents who both suffered from mental illness, both of them very different types and in different ways.” (Brad, 05:46)

• Parental Divorce & Emotional Toll:

  • Parents divorced when Brad was 7; he became “an emotional wreck” by age 10—developing tics and heightened anxieties.
  • Therapy became a lifeline, still impactful decades later.

2. The Roots and Realities of Addiction

• Escapism as Coping:

  • Brad details substance use as self-medication—escaping unfinished business, dread, grief, and overwhelming emotions.
  • “I love getting high...because I had trouble turning my head off. But at the end of the day, I knew it was killing me, and it was going to, because I have, you know, I have a very high tolerance for carbs, for really. For really anything.” (Brad, 05:46-07:00)

• Sobriety’s Turning Point:

  • Addictive patterns escalated until blackouts and waking up “with one shoe on in a strange town” forced self-reckoning.
  • A key motivator for sobriety was the desire to be a present, reliable father:
    • “I knew I wanted to be a father...and I knew I couldn't put my kids to bed...high or drunk.” (Brad, 33:00)

3. Inheritance of Trauma & Codependency

• Cycle of Caretaking:

  • Brad and hosts discuss codependency’s origins in trying to “keep parents happy” and feeling the need to rescue, fix, and control family chaos.
  • “It also makes you a control freak. Yeah, which I'm still battling.” (Brad, 13:06)

• Boundaries & Fixing:

  • The difficulty, and necessity, of developing boundaries with family, especially parents who are struggling or manipulative.
  • “How much of my saving and fixing deep down was self punishment?” (Brad, 46:18)

4. Parental Relationships and the Search for Approval

• Complex Love and Envy:

  • Unconditional love, or the lack of it, and its impact. The blurred line between support and envy among family—his mother’s vicarious living and emotional manipulation; his father’s humor saving him despite immense pain.
  • “They were just people that loved with conditions.” (Brad, 15:20)

• Specific Family Incidents:

  • Mother’s bulimia and her strategy for hiding it by manufacturing dinner arguments—a revelation Brad didn’t fully process until his 30s.
    • “She would create an argument at dinner...so nobody would bother her.” (Brad, 20:43)

• Siblings & Divergent Coping:

  • Brad’s brothers chose emotional distance, refusal of therapy, while Brad felt compelled to “keep them both alive.”
  • Heartbreaking story of his brother Jeff’s search for their absent biological father:
    • “‘If I wanted to know you, I would have stayed.’” (Brad, quoting Jeff’s father, 30:00)

5. Forgiveness, Grief, and Moving Forward

• Processing Loss and Letting Go:

  • Multiple losses in short succession: best friend, father, brother—all within 16 months.
  • Forgiveness designed as a tool for personal growth—not erasing the past, but releasing responsibility for others’ suffering.
  • “My forgiveness and my sobriety really only increases my love for those that didn’t have the opportunity.” (Brad, 25:57)

• When Forgiveness Is One-Sided:

  • Hosts and Brad explore how to forgive parents (especially posthumously) when they lacked the tools or capacity to heal alongside you.
  • “They wouldn’t have worked through it with you anyway.” (Brad, 44:22)

6. Addiction, Therapy, and Nontraditional Healing

• Therapy's Role:

  • Therapy as essential to Brad’s self-understanding, but he also discusses alternative routes for healing outside of traditional programs (e.g., AA).
    • “You can love someone more than you can imagine. And people have to want it.” (Brad, 32:48)

• Al-Anon & Family Addiction:

  • Brad describes how Al-Anon offered insight into his mother’s and stepfather’s codependency and addiction cycles.

7. Faith, Religion, and Generational Shifts

• Father’s Religious Conversion:

  • Brad recounts his father's late-in-life religious fervor, how it complicated their relationship, and his skepticism about how faith can sometimes be a last resort or a “cop out.”
  • “I think religion is everyone's last call. I think it's the last thing they grab onto when everyone's left them.” (Brad, 56:29)

• Religion, Afterlife, and Emotional Coping:

  • Spirited discussion about how community, morality, and fear of death feed into religious belief—contrasting the social evolution of other cultures.
    • “I truly think the biggest draw to religion is afterlife. I think if you remove afterlife, what's left? Be a good person.” (Therapist Host 1, 59:48)

8. The Messy, Ongoing Process of Healing

• Healing as a Lifelong Project:

  • Brad and the hosts agree that unpacking trauma and growing emotionally is never finished; it’s constant, messy, and “exhausting—but worth it.”
    • “Are we ever finished? Do you ever want to be finished? Growing, Being. You know, I’m exhausted.” (Brad, 31:46)

• Humor as Survival:

  • Comedy and storytelling punctuate heavy moments, underlining how humor itself is a crucial tool for survival and growth.

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Notable Quotes & memorable moments

• “We become very controlling people...and the biggest thing about addiction is surrendering. Well, how can I go from a control freak to now letting go everything that kept me alive?”
  Brad, 13:06

• “There was a lot of love around me. You know, they were just people that loved with conditions.”
  Brad, 15:20

• “The toughest thing I had to probably learn in my life was how to be with myself. You know, it’s the last person we want to be with.”
  Brad, 18:24

• “If one person...could take—and I know that’s why you guys do it, but...if one person listening could take something from this...”
  Brad, 50:40

• “I think religion is everyone’s last call...it’s the last thing they grab onto when everyone’s left them.”
  Brad, 56:29

• “If we spent half the time working on the life that we’re having now, as opposed to rallying for the afterlife, how great would life be?”
  Brad, 61:07

• Brad describing his father’s humor and warmth despite bipolar disorder:
  “My dad, he said to me, when I was a kid, he goes, here, this is called Sammy Davis Live at the Coconut Grove. You got to see this guy one day...I told him, I said, I’m gonna work with this man one day. And he goes, I believe you.”
  (Brad, 41:05)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Brad’s parents' mental illness and early family dynamics: 05:46 – 13:06
• Addiction and sobering up: 05:46 – 07:17, 33:00 – 35:24
• Bulimia and manipulation at home: 19:33 – 21:35
• Siblings and family estrangement: 27:30 – 31:01
• Therapy, boundaries, and regret: 46:16 – 48:09
• Religion, afterlife, and meaning: 56:29 – 61:07

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Tone & Takeaways

The conversation is raw, generous, and darkly funny—never shying away from vulnerability or pain, but always tempered with compassion and self-aware humor. Brad Garrett’s storytelling is vivid and unfiltered, and the hosts match his candor, sharing their own challenges with codependency, grief, and forgiveness. Ultimately, the episode is about accepting imperfection, the necessity of boundaries, and the never-ending journey of healing.

For listeners wrestling with their own family histories or personal growth, Brad’s story is a tender reminder: it’s okay to be unfinished—and you don’t have to hide your mess to be worthy of love, forgiveness, or joy.

Transcript

[Therapist Host 1]

Secondhand Therapy is presented by Pony Bear Studios.

[Brad Garrett]

Jesus.

[Therapist Host 2]

That's a bear.

[Brad Garrett]

It's not.

[Therapist Host 1]

Hello, little bear cubs. This episode of Secondhand Therapy is sponsored by BetterHelp. And, you know, they want us to tell you the benefits of therapy, but it's kind of the show.

[Brad Garrett]

Right.

[Therapist Host 1]

If you listen to us, you know, we're pro therapy. You use BetterHelp recently?

[Therapist Host 2]

Yes, I have. I just signed up.

[Therapist Host 1]

How'd it go?

[Therapist Host 2]

It's great. I got to pick my own therapist. They have a bunch like a. There's like two or three pages of people that I got to choose from and. Yeah, I just started a few sessions ago.

[Brad Garrett]

Nice.

[Therapist Host 1]

Have you used their journal feature?

[Therapist Host 2]

I have not seen that yet, but I'm excited to because I love a digital journal.

[Therapist Host 1]

Who doesn't love a digital journal? Yeah, we're excited to have them as a new sponsor. You know, you went to BetterHelp because you were in between insurance.

[Therapist Host 2]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

So if you're listening to this and maybe you're in between insurance, maybe you don't have insurance. It's just, it's a good resource to start therapy. And if you listen to the show and you've been wanting to get into therapy and you don't really know where to start, Better help's a good option. And they were nice enough to give us a discount code. If you guys. If you're listening and you want to start with BetterHelp, go to betterhelp.com secondhand therapy and you get 10% off your first month. All the info will be in the episode description below. Get in therapy. You know, it's great.

[Therapist Host 2]

Check it out. Welcome back to Secondhand Therapy. I want to remind you that we are not therapists. We are not licensed professionals. This is not a substitute for therapy.

[Therapist Host 1]

We're not experts.

[Therapist Host 2]

And we're not experts. I almost had it. I was very close.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yep.

[Therapist Host 1]

Anyways, this is not professional advice in any way.

[Therapist Host 2]

That's what I said.

[Therapist Host 1]

You didn't. You abandoned it completely. Did I? I'm pretty sure you just stopped. Yeah, we got it.

[Therapist Host 2]

We get. We got there.

[Therapist Host 1]

We're not therapists. We're not experts. This is not a substitute for therapy. This is not professional advice in any way.

[Therapist Host 2]

However.

[Therapist Host 1]

This is an episode.

[Therapist Host 2]

A very special episode.

[Therapist Host 1]

Our 100th episode.

[Therapist Host 2]

100, baby.

[Therapist Host 1]

Episode 100. We can kill ourselves. Finally.

[Therapist Host 2]

Finally, the last episode.

[Therapist Host 1]

And hey, wherever you're listening to this, give us a five star review and follow the show. Yes, please, you fucks. I'm sorry.

[Therapist Host 3]

Wow.

[Therapist Host 2]

Be nice.

[Therapist Host 1]

I'm sorry.

[Therapist Host 2]

Today is guest day. We have a very special guest.

[Therapist Host 1]

We do. We're going, we're leaving. We're packing up the studio. We're going down to the MGM Grand.

[Therapist Host 2]

We're headed to the strip.

[Therapist Host 1]

Pack up all this shit, dude.

[Therapist Host 2]

We're heading down.

[Therapist Host 1]

Cancel it.

[Therapist Host 2]

To the green room.

[Therapist Host 1]

Cancel it.

[Therapist Host 2]

Of Brad Garrett's comedy club inside the MGM grand right here in Las Vegas on the Strip. And we're going to be setting up there and sitting down with the man himself, Brad Garrett.

[Therapist Host 1]

You might know him.

[Therapist Host 2]

You might have seen him or heard.

[Therapist Host 1]

You might have seen him. He was the strangler on Fresh Prince of Bel Air that one time.

[Therapist Host 2]

That is true.

[Therapist Host 1]

He was the banker on Roseanne. He, he was a mechanic. Tony on Seinfeld.

[Therapist Host 2]

I love Tony.

[Therapist Host 1]

He, he, he was in season three of Fargo.

[Brad Garrett]

Yes.

[Therapist Host 1]

Did a couple Jimmy John's commercials.

[Therapist Host 2]

Nothing else to note really besides Emmy winning actor, movie star, comedy icon.

[Therapist Host 1]

That's right. He's also an Emmy winner for one of the biggest shows of all time, Everybody Loves Raymond. That's right.

[Therapist Host 2]

That's right. That's where I know him from.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

And also a comedy icon and a legend, I would say.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

Incredible, incredible human being. So we're gonna sit down and talk with him this afternoon. We hope you enjoy it while you're here. Leave. Go on over to Patreon. Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

Free episode was out on Friday over there.

[Therapist Host 2]

Yeah, you already heard it. Head on over to Patreon. Ad free episodes. A completely different podcast is available with over 50 episodes now streaming for you. And also you can see clips of that show on Instagram. It's on Instagram now. The other show.

[Therapist Host 1]

If you want a little taste.

[Therapist Host 2]

If you want a little taste. Also we have merch available, all that fun stuff. And you can always contact us, mail us whatever you got. All that information is in the description. We're glad you're here.

[Therapist Host 1]

Along with the better help link and.

[Therapist Host 2]

Go to therapy on Patreon. There are after. After the pod episode like episodes. Yeah, whatever things.

[Therapist Host 1]

There's usually like an extra 10, 15, sometimes 45 minutes. Sometimes we keep yapping after the public episodes are done. So go check us out if you're.

[Therapist Host 2]

Interested in any of that. Head on over to Patreon.

[Therapist Host 1]

It's a good way to support podcast.

[Therapist Host 2]

Enjoy this episode. We appreciate it. We love you. Thanks for being here.

[Therapist Host 1]

Enjoy, enjoy.

[Therapist Host 2]

You be nice.

[Therapist Host 1]

I'm sorry. I'm so excited to go talk to Brad.

[Therapist Host 2]

Happy 100.

[Therapist Host 1]

Happy is it, though. Hello, my little bear cubs. And welcome back.

[Therapist Host 2]

Secondhand therapy.

[Therapist Host 1]

And we know that when you look back now, being sober.

[Therapist Host 3]

What.

[Therapist Host 1]

Why Were you. Were you escaping feelings? Were you.

[Brad Garrett]

I was escaping feelings, reality, unfinished business, dread, grief, you know, things that I wasn't ready to unpack fully, you know. Yeah, I grew up really quick. I ended up kind of raising my parents who both suffered from mental illness, both of them very different types and in different ways. And I love getting high. There you go. I love being buzzed because I had trouble turning my head off. But at the end of the day, I knew it was killing me, and it was going to, because I have, you know, I have a very high tolerance for carbs, for really. For really anything. So everybody would be under the table, you know, hours before me, and I was, you know, doing a fifth of vodka and half a bag of weed. And, you know, sometimes a little this, a little that, and it just, you know, when I started blacking out and, you know, waking up with one shoe on in a strange town, you know, it was like, wow, I'm gonna have to. Because, you know, I would party heavy when I was down, and I would party heavy when things were great, you know, like any other addict.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, we don't need reasons.

[Therapist Host 1]

Yeah, there's always a reason.

[Brad Garrett]

There's always a reason.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And it was just, you know, I just knew. It was interesting. I knew I wanted to be a father. You know, that was just always in my DNA. And I had a great relationship with my dad growing up, though it was. It was complicated because he was bipolar. And, you know, when I was growing up, nobody knew what that was. They just thought he was, you know, kind of, you know, off the wall and spontaneous and. And. And fun and, you know, highly emotional and. But he was, you know, I was like, not just his kid. I was his wingman in life. And the relationship of father, son to best friend blurred a little bit, though, to be quite honest, I needed it because, you know, my mom lived in bed. She was, you know, manic depressive, recluse, agoraphobiac, bipolar as well, but had the fits of rage and the. Just huge swings where my dad, you know, he was so ahead of his time. I mean, when my parents got divorced, it was really rough on me. And, you know, my mom played everything out out loud, and it was.

[Therapist Host 1]

How old were you when they got divorced?

[Brad Garrett]

I was 7. And I really started struggling, and by 10, I was an emotional wreck. You know, I had a bunch of ticks that I would do, actually, if you spent any time with me. People thought I wanted them to Steal third, because I would be like this and scratch, you know, and then we'd bunt to the black fella. I have to throw a little of it in so I don't go for it. Yeah, so my dad was so smart, you know, he knew that when I was 9 or I needed some therapy and he was in therapy, believe it or not, which in the late 60s, it was almost like a. Yeah, it's very taboo. Very taboo, you know, but I needed it. I needed it. And he found me an incredible therapist who I was friends with up until five years ago when he passed, which really, that's the movie, you know, a nine year old becoming a 60 year old and he still hangs out with his therapist. But so my dad was. Even though he struggled, he was always rallying, rallying to get there, but he wouldn't do the meds, which he desperately needed. And to be honest with you, he was diagnosed very late in life and bipolarity even, Gosh, he was diagnosed, what, maybe 25 years ago. They didn't know what they were doing yet for it. And the meds were very different and extreme, and it was different cocktails and let's try this. And it just, you know, it wore him down. It wore him down. But he had a heart of gold and an incredible humor, and it kept me alive. I loved my mom dearly. I'm not sure what happened. I think 90% of it was chemical. You know, it's either nurture or nature, they say, but I usually think it's both or a little of each. You know, we had interventions with her. You know, she was really into the downers and the sleeping pills and, you know, I had two older brothers, and we all tried to really, you know, they kind of just. They were over it. They were done. They kind of moved on. And me being the youngest and the last left in the house, kind of felt a responsibility to keep them both alive, striving. Okay. You know, I think a lot of us become comics because we, we live in a, in a, in a childhood where we're trying to keep our parents happy.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah, yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

You. You've talked about that.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

I felt that responsibility with my mother. I felt a lot of responsibility with my mother about. She, you know, she, she was.

[Therapist Host 3]

You.

[Therapist Host 2]

Know, I was just. Her whole identity, her whole world, and I think she wanted to hold on to that as long as she could. And the older I got and the more freedom that I had then, it was like the more trouble for her.

[Brad Garrett]

That's what I went through. Yeah, boy, she, you know, she lived vicariously through, you know.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, it's interesting when, when parents kind of watch their child ascend in something that an industry maybe they were attracted to. It's a very fine line between support and envy.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And it was difficult. My dad could have been a stand up. My dad was incredibly quick and funny, but you know, his childhood was being beaten by his father. My, my dad was, you know, beaten up by a very tough dad. Often a lot of emotional abuse as well and verbal abuse and you know, the poor guy just, you know, dealt with a lot that my mom, I just think there was heavy duty chemical stuff which was on both sides of the family. My, my mom's side, my dad's side. So I could snap any fucking minute. I mean, you know, I'm just letting you both know you're not that far from me.

[Therapist Host 2]

So do you think that triggered any codependency in you? Like that caretaker vibe that you had with your parents?

[Brad Garrett]

Huge. And it also makes you a control freak. Yeah, which I'm still battling. I'm still working on that. I'm still working on all my shit. You know, some stuff came up a few months ago that I never really unpacked about grief. You know, my best friend, my dad, my brother, all passed within like a 16 month period. And I just tried to keep everyone buoyant and you know, I was, you know, look, I think most performers are control freaks. You know, we're in a business that we're attracted to that has zero rules, zero control. And it's like I'm going to control my destiny, which we can only do about half of it. Right. But when you grow up and there's chaos, as a kid, you're trying to raise your parents, keep them safe, when it's supposed to be the other way around. And you white knuckle shit as a kid because you're like, wow, this is heavy, I gotta walk to school. But you know, she's on the ground looking for, you know, we don't know what. You know, my dad is being sued every minute from one ex wife to my mom. My mom is sending the sheriffs to my dad's work for more alimony. And you know, this is all going on and how do I navigate that? So I think we become very controlling people because that was our survival. So then you hit addiction. And the biggest thing about addiction is surrendering. Well, how can I go from a control freak to now letting go everything that kept me alive? And that's the Transition that I'm still, you know, going through when I was able to tap into my gratefulness because I. You know, I do have to tell you, as weird as it sounds, there was a lot of love around me. You know, they were just people that loved with conditions.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

So there wasn't a lot of. You know, I know it sounds trite to say unconditional love, but, you know, they did the best they could. They had no tools. You know, my dad wasn't hugged. He wasn't loved. He wasn't cared for. My mom was. But she hated men. And she had three sons and three husbands. And when you don't like men, I think what happened. Which will leave a mark. But there are many people who get over this. This is traumatic. But she found out that my grandfather, something I've never shared, by the way, never shared this. My grandfather was having an affair. And my mom and her sister found out before their mom. Oh. And what was interesting about this is my mom supported her dad and turned on her mom.

[Therapist Host 3]

Wow.

[Therapist Host 1]

Interesting.

[Therapist Host 2]

That's a lot to carry, too.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, that's a lot to carry. And we would talk about it, or I would try to talk about it, and it was like, he was the greatest man in the world. He had a he. You know, she validated it almost. It was. And this is what is so interesting about the human mind. She did not like men. And when there was a breach of what her father did in this family, she sided with the man. And the only time in her life, you know.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And we would. But I tried everything, you know, I would. We tried to get her to therapy even when I wanted her. You know, my therapist when I was a kid was like, you know, it'd be great to have your mom in here. You know, my dad would always show, and we would deal through stuff and things like that. And I never forgot my dad before he passed. He was on his sixth marriage, which just went south before he passed six, baby. Right, Exactly.

[Therapist Host 1]

And every man needs a hobby, you know.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, exactly. And that's kind of. And it was so funny because by the sixth marriage, no one showed. And he was like. My dad kind of talked like this. It was between my voice and Raymond and Robert's voice on Raymond, he goes, where is everyone? And I said, dad, it's your sixth marriage. You know, you have 11 toasters, nine blenders, people. It's just you, me. And when my dad kind of went a little south mentally, and it happened later in life, and there. There were some very painful things for him for me, you know, he burnt out so many people in his life because of his illness. You know, when you're bipolar, it's really tough to hang with someone after a certain amount of time. Yeah, he had huge issues with women, you know, big time, obviously, but he needed to be with anyone. Yeah, he just, you know, the fear of alone. The toughest thing I had to probably learn in my life was how to be with myself. You know, it's the last person we want to be with. That's why we do what we do. Yeah, I was, you know, I, I, I didn't, you know, when I was alone, the voices were, were a cavalcade of regret and guilt and shit, you know. You know, my. See what was so weird is like my mom also, bless her heart, also suffered from bulimia. We didn't know this.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

So what she would do. This is heavy. This will help you. You know, you may leave here high fiving strangers when you hear they. But my mom, she was, you know, a very attractive woman and a hell of a kisser and. No, she was very, she's very attractive. And I remember her when I was seven, looking in the mirror, like when she was 33, the first wrinkle, the first thing, she would freak out, you know, and she had a real issue with, with any kind of aging at 30. She was just crazed about it. And a beautiful woman, but she was bulimic and she didn't want anyone to know it. But we lived in a small house growing up, and after every dinner we'd hear her, you know, throwing up and my brother's room, my middle brother Paul, who, you know, was up against her bathroom, and he would go, why is mom? And to hide it, she would create.

[Therapist Host 2]

An argument at dinner so nobody would bother her.

[Brad Garrett]

And she would, to blame us. She, she would come up with these, these issues that didn't exist and she would blame us and get us riled to where we hit back. My brother Paul, he was the inward one. My brother Jeff was like, I'll this. He'd split for three days. And I was, you know, the peacekeeper. Yeah, yeah. You know, doing Cosby to her before he was a rapist, you know, to settle her down. And she would just be like, I can't take this. You'll never understand me. You're, you're terrible sons. You're killing me. She said a lot. So we would think when we heard the vomiting that was created from the.

[Therapist Host 1]

Argument, I was like, she was trying to tell. Yeah, create the illusion. It Was emotional.

[Brad Garrett]

Thank you. Yeah, thank you. And I didn't get this till I was, like, in my 30s.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

I didn't put it together. I thought it was, you know, really, you know, and again, you know, it is emotional and psychological. Bulimia and body image and everything else. It's a very painful reality. And. But it was like, oh, my God. Because, you know, we were always felt responsible, not just for our parents, but for their shortcomings.

[Therapist Host 1]

And it's also. I mean, as It's. How can you, one, look at it objectively, Right. As a child, and two, even come to the idea that your mother is not only lying to you, but manipulating you? That's a hard reality to face. When I know you. You kind of.

[Brad Garrett]

You guys good.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, I know.

[Therapist Host 1]

Because you had. You had phrase it as I hadn't put it together.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

And even if you did, I. I would run away from that till I. In my 30s, too. That's a really hard thing to face.

[Brad Garrett]

It is. And I've. I had. I've battled with trust with women my whole life, big time. So did my father, you know, but trust was just. Just a huge issue for me. And she would also, you know, she had this thing where she wanted to be loved and accepted so much that she had this flirtatious, coquettish, manipulative thing she would do to other men, whether you were someone who just. She just met. And she would do this in front of my stepfather, in front of her boys. You know, she would be a little playful with our friends.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Which was odd.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Nothing ever inappropriate, but things that were taken that way.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Because they were on the fence of being a little out there for a mother. But. But she would do this, you know, she. She hated men that she loved setting them up and why. She would flirt with a guy she would never follow through with. Obviously my stepdad, who was incredibly insecure. Poor guy. So she would hurt two at once. The guy she was hitting on and, you know, her third husband, who was my stepdad. And again, a guy that was never hugged, never loved. You know, he would hug you like a robot type of thing. You know, that Christian hug, they don't want you to touch their boobies, that type of stuff. But. But the older I get, I unpack more, which is usually as people age, they do the opposite. You know, I never want to stop working on me. I owe to myself. I owe to my children. I went to Izzy, my wife, because I just want to be the best form of it. And I spent so Many years hiding. You know, there's a big difference between responsibility and surrendering. And people think that when you surrender, you can let go of all responsibility, which really what surrendering is for me is taking responsibility, because I'm getting rid of the baggage and the shit and. And the addiction and the lies and the bad script and everything else. But with that comes a responsibility that I'm trying to tap into more, and a forgiveness and a forgive. You know, the shame that we carry is crippling, and, you know, I feel a lot of it.

[Therapist Host 2]

You know, what does forgiveness look like now that you're sober and you have like this better lens to look through and stuff like that? Like, what does forgiveness look like now for you?

[Brad Garrett]

For me, it's focusing on the growth, forgiving my time. I lived in a very selfish world, making people know that the shit I might have been to them, it was mostly to myself. Because I was what they call that happy addict, that happy drunk. I'd walk into a bar, I'd buy a round for the bar so no one could see I was the alcoholic type of thing. So I think the surrender and the forgiveness kind of go hand in hand. Mostly it's forgiving the people that made life difficult for me, you know, because my growth only increases and my forgiveness and my sobriety really only increases my love for those that didn't have the opportunity. I wish. I wish my dad was able to get on the right med to do the right therapy, you know, I wish my mom would have been open to an antidepressant. I mean, she lived in bed, you know, and it was odd because when both parents passed and I literally thought of this today driving over here. This is the power you guys have over small talk.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

When my mom and my dad passed, I was the only one at their bedside. Wow.

[Therapist Host 3]

Really?

[Therapist Host 2]

No other siblings, no other family members, nothing.

[Brad Garrett]

My oldest brother had passed. Paul was stage four and couldn't get out of bed. My mom didn't know Paul was dying. Paul couldn't make it to the funeral, he was so sick. And she had full blown dementia at that point, my mom. And that was okay. And with my father, I was very protective over him when he passed. He tried to have a relationship with my brothers. They were from my mom's first marriage. When my dad and my mom had me, I was his only real natural child. My brothers were half brothers or stepbrothers. But my mom loved to conquer and divide, right? So anytime there was a relationship with men, father, son, brothers, whatever, she would try to Sabotage the relationship. So my mom bad rapped my father so much that it made it very difficult because my dad adopted my brothers, who were technically half brothers, but they had a brutal thing. Their father walked out on my two brothers to never return. And my brothers were never into therapy. They would never look into therapy. They had no addiction issues. They, they just got through life. They white knuckled it. I begged them, I said, when your dad walks out and never returns, you know, I'm fine with it. Fuck them. I don't, you know, it was that thing. And I'm like, it isn't, it isn't. It's eating away at you. It's, it's, it's, it's. You know, I don't have to tell you guys. But I could never get them to see that. And one day my oldest brother, one day my oldest brother Jeff was really just an exceptional human, decided, I'm gonna go find my father. Spent a couple years finding him, doing the detective thing everywhere else, finds out he's 20 miles away, shows up and goes, hey, I'm your son, I'm Jeff. He goes, hey, Jeff, what's up? He says, you know, where you been? Type of thing. And the thing with my oldest brother is he was straightforward. It wasn't, it was just like, I had to see, I had to know how you can walk out on two kids, kid, kids. And never. And he motherfucker said, jeff, if I wanted to know you, I would have stayed. Jesus. And he called me that night and he goes, can you believe this motherfucker? But it was like, it was like, you know, you're talking about an old friend who doesn't remember going to high school with you. I said, jeff, this is, this is. And it's funny, my middle brother Paul. When Jeff went on the search, Paul's like, I don't want to be on that. I'm fine. My life is working. My life is. I don't want to be on that journey. He's going to, he's going to fucking reject you again. And Jeff goes, well, fuck him. At least I'll be able to face him, let him reject me again. This time not as a seven year old, but to my face.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And sure enough, that bastard did that. And you know, again, you know, this is stuff we carry. And, you know, there are people that find other ways to deal. There are people I believe that really can work out their stuff. You know, they feel without therapy and I admire that, if they can really, really do the work, therapy doesn't Work for everybody. Just like when I came clean, I didn't take the AA route. I didn't. I went to a couple meetings, and though I believe in it 1000%, there's nothing better than AA. It fucking works. You know, there's a hundred ways to get clean.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And there's three ways to unpack your shit. Maybe. But without someone on the outside with an objective, and hopefully you find a good therapist. I was very lucky. You know, I had a great therapist in my life, and I found an amazing one in my adult life. But it's, you know, it's tough to unpack shit because I think it's ongoing. I don't think it's. Because, you know, are we ever finished? Do you ever want to be finished? Growing, Being. Being. You know, I mean, I'm exhausted. There's no question. You know, I do take breaks. I do take things. You. It's funny, you know, it's. I'm so grateful. I'm so lucky. I just wish I could share. Could have shared this with other people. But, you know, you can't. You can't. You can't force anyone to get clean that needs it.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

You can love someone more than you can imagine. And people have to want it. You have to want it. Whether it's a career or. Or a good marriage, shit takes work. And, you know, it's hard. It's hard, but, boy, it's worth it. I think one of the things that really helped me stop using, and it's weird, but I knew I wanted to be a dad. I know I'm circling back, and I knew I couldn't put my kids to bed. I know it sounds so cliche, high or drunk. And I said, you know, I'm gonna. I'm gonna clean up because this is something I want. And I, you know, I cold turkey, I white knuckled it. I did a lot of therapy, but I was ready. See, I was ready. I was lucky. I never. I didn't have an ugly bottom. I had a very revealing bottom. And I was. I was ready. And I jumped into a marriage. This is where I could have used aa, they say. But thank God I did because I had two kids that are literally my life. But I was so euphoric after eight months of sobriety, of heavy using for many years, that the clarity was coming back. And there was. There was a tinge of gratefulness that to be alive as opposed to now, it's just, you know, daily obnoxious gratefulness is. I could walk to Starbucks.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

So, you know, that, that really, really helped it. But, you know, the real work began when I stopped drinking. I thought stopping the using would really just be instant healing.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And it was medically, physically, I'm lucky to be alive, literally, because, you know, I was using shit that would have put anybody else in an alcoholic coma or, you know, I never could have done the weed today. Thank God I stopped that. Weed was my main thing, man. I would, I would roll over and light a bowl and I went to bed with it. I might, I loved, I just loved escaping, you know, I loved escaping. I didn't party in high school. I had my first joint at, at, you know, 20, which is odd.

[Therapist Host 1]

Did you like it immediately?

[Brad Garrett]

Oh my God. I just thought it was a great, you know, it stopped the voices. It didn't, you know. You know, I was able to call my mom if I had three hits.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

You know, I started going to Codependence Anonymous a couple months ago.

[Brad Garrett]

How is that?

[Therapist Host 2]

It's been life changing for me. It's love that I. Every week I, you know, we've talked about a little bit, but every week I, I sit there and we, we cover the topics and I go, man, this doesn't, this isn't about me. And then I hear people start to share their stories and I'm like, oh, this is, yeah, that's. And I end up sharing and it's just so relatable and it's so great to hear other people sharing, you know, these, these similar struggles that I couldn't, you know, place. I didn't know why I felt that way or those actions and things like that. But one of the things that almost turned me away from it was that Higher power talk and the opening. And lucky enough, I was very lucky with this woman who came to me after the first session that I was at at and she said, she goes, hey, I'm also not a religious person. She's like, I just picked up on your vibe. She's like, I, I can tell you're not also not religious. And she's like, when they're talking about higher power, it's not necessarily God or whatever. She's like, it could be anything. And if she hadn't spoke to me about that, I think I would have, yeah. Turned away. But it was so refreshing to hear that it wasn't like this religious based program and that that was scary to hear as an atheist, you know.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, totally. And that's where I kind of bumped. You know, it's funny, I did a lot of Growth in Al Anon. I started going Al Anon because I had people in my family that were struggling. And this is during when I was many, many years sober. It was actually just got a few years ago. And the Al Anon actually not only helped me with the people in my life that were presently struggling, which wasn't. But it helped me go back to. I never looked at my mom as an addict. I looked at her as someone who had trouble sleeping, you know, and at the end of the day, her biggest supplier was my stepdad. And talk about Koda. When we were doing an intervention, you know, we went to him and we went, where is she getting all of this?

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And he went, her doctor, her doctor. I called the doctor and I go, I don't know what you're doing, but you don't understand that. My mom. And it was. He said everything but fuck off a doctor. So I went to my stepdad, who ended up being another big pill person who did his daily sleeping pill. He so insecure, like I said earlier, he kept her rummied, man, because when she would go two days without it, she threatened to leave him. If you don't. You know, this is codependency 101.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And so he kept her high. And when all of this became just like. I couldn't go see her when I was a kid, right? You know, to say hi or what's going on, because it worried me. Is she sick? I didn't think at 11 she has a pill problem. I figured something's wrong with Mom. That on top of the vomiting and the huge swings and, you know her, you know, so it was just this constant fucking charade that, you know, we had to pivot. That's why my brother just got. Because my oldest brother Jeff was nine years older than me. Paul was six years older. And, you know, they got out when they could drive, they got out when they. So I was there many years alone, you know, that's why my dad's like, I gotta keep them out of here as much. And my dad's like, you can move in with me anytime. You know? But I had a mom that said, if you leave, I'll die. Right?

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

I knew my safe haven was my dad. And, you know, man, and I know your love and your thing with your mom, because we used to talk about your mom early.

[Therapist Host 1]

Did you see the way his head just dipped just now?

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah. Yeah. You just fucked up. I get it.

[Therapist Host 1]

You know, I fucked him up earlier.

[Therapist Host 2]

Well, we're talking about conditional love and unconditional love earlier and that. That. Yeah, mom had a lot of conditions.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, and the flirting and the. And the stuff and the things that would happen, you know, when I started working and I was opening for different acts, a lot of these acts were the acts that were in her generation, you know, the Sammy's, the Franks. And I loved that music because that. I wasn't in a Zeppelin or Pink Floyd. My dad, he said to me, when I was a kid, he goes, here, this is called Sammy Davis Live at the Coconut Grove. You got to see this guy one day. I was 9, and he goes. And I go, why are there two albums in here? He goes, kid, it's a live double album. There's nothing like it. And that was my. That was my thing. And it's funny how we. I wanted my dad so happy. I told him, I said, I'm gonna work with this man one day. And he goes, I believe you.

[Therapist Host 2]

Holy shit.

[Therapist Host 1]

That's huge.

[Brad Garrett]

And that, you know, I tell you, the power of you can. And it comes from a guy you idolized. You see, my dad saved me with all of his stuff. He never, you know, and so, you know, my point is, stuff is powerful, and the mind is powerful, and what we believe is powerful. And I'm telling you, man, your mom is your image of women. Your dad is your image of men or pals. And, you know, you got to tinker. You gotta tinker with it. But I remember the love and the closeness you had for your mom. Because when we used to. You know, you and I, we clicked very early on for a lot of reasons. And I loved how you wore your heart on your sleeve. I loved how you were so honest and resilient. And I remember when you were going through the thing with your grandma and your mom, and I was like, this fucking guy, man, he can rally. He's a warrior, you know? And I still feel that way about you having nothing to do with how great you are on stage, because you. You are a force. I've always felt that way about you. But the way you would, you know, I would see what you were going through, and it really made me look at some of my shit. Because I'm like, man. Because I knew the love you had for your mom. And then as we got to know each other a little later, I saw behind the curtain a little bit.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And what it was doing to you, and. It's a trip.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

I mean, that's what we've been dealing with on the pod recently, is talking about Mom. And what he has been on me lately about is I get, I will defend her when we talk about the honesty and have an honest look at her actions or her behaviors or conditions or things like that. I'm very quick to be like, yeah, but it wasn't. She, you know, she never meant to do this or wasn't malicious or she.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, I did that with my dad.

[Therapist Host 2]

Yeah, it was, it's always defending her. And he's had to kind of check me a few times and be like, hey, it's.

[Therapist Host 1]

Yeah, we can, we can just talk about how it affected you. Like, we're not attacking her.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

It's really hard for me on two fronts.

[Brad Garrett]

Two things.

[Therapist Host 2]

It's really hard for me to not feel like it's an attack because she's no longer here, so she can't. It's like, who's going to stick up for her if I'm, if I'm, I'm not going to.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

And then also the other thing, when we're talking about forgiveness, it's like, you know, I'm unpacking a lot and learning a lot about our relationship and conditional love and these things and how do you forgive somebody for these things when they're not here to work through it with you? And that's something we've talked about a lot about. Like, they don't need to be here. You can.

[Brad Garrett]

Because they wouldn't have worked through it with you anyway.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

They couldn't go there or you wouldn't have this. Yeah.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

They don't have the capability.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah. That's what, that's what a lot of it is.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And, you know, when I forgave myself for. And I, you know, again. Yeah, I was, I wasn't sure what I was forgetting myself for except maybe some. A little bad behavior a couple times. But I put everyone before me when I was an addict. Yeah, I was there for everyone. I was such a high frequency functioning alcoholic that as close as I was with my father, he didn't know how big my problem was. My mom didn't want to know. My brothers didn't want to know. I had no one to go to. To go, I need help. I want help. They were all oblivious to it. And, and I think they acted like it wasn't a problem because I was the glue to the family. And if they admitted that the glue was very fucked up, then they'd have to step up. They knew if mom had a problem, Brad would fix it. You know, if. Dad, someone called the cops on my dad because he went off. You know, Brad's gonna go up to Oregon and find him in the woods. Literally. And I loved that. I loved. I was able to do it. You liked being needed, to feel needed to feel important.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

It was a reflex. I have reflux, but it was a reflex. I was so used to. Okay, I was a fixer. I was a fixer, you know? You know, and then I had a religious friend once tell me, you know, saviors get slaughtered. You know, if Jesus couldn't pull it off, you sure couldn't. And then he ended it with, and you killed our king, which didn't help. You know, that never helps. But, you know, it's interesting how much of my. How much. Here's something you'll love. How much of my saving and fixing deep down was self punishment? How trying to fix and save people who you knew were going to jump.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And maybe grab your arm on the way down. This is something that I had to learn to release. For the most important person in my life, ironically, is how it happened. Where I went, I can't do it for you. I am. I am. I am here. I needed boundaries with people in my life. I needed boundaries with my mother. It's funny, she was the most damaging. And I got my boundaries with her way too late. I needed it with her the most, but she. She pushed my buttons the hardest. So she kept me at bay when I really needed the boundaries.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

That's why when people say, God, I have no regrets, I'm like, you're so full of shit.

[Therapist Host 1]

Yeah, that's the dumbest shit I hear people say.

[Brad Garrett]

I have never heard that in my life. I've lived with no regret. Well, either you're an incredibly selfish fuck or you've lived in a very boring life. Yeah, life is full of regret, just like it's full of victories and everything else. If there's no regret, then you're not looking back and going, boy, I could have been better at that. That could be a regret. It doesn't mean you beat yourself up. But when I learned healthy boundaries, that was one of the quickest ways of not fixing people, but being there for them, being the strength they need. Because when we let the ones we love shit all over us, which we do all the time, and I still see myself slipping, though the ones who really abuse that, unfortunately, are no longer in my life. But what a different relationship it would have been. Do I have regrets? Sure. Would I have changed it? Well, I don't know. Because when I Went to get my dad when he was having a psychotic episode in Oregon. And, you know, Oregon, they don't know about loud Jews, let alone a guy off his meds. And you pull up to your dad's little cabin and it's surrounded by cops and, you know, they're yelling, give us your guns. And he's doing one liners with them, literally doing shtick. Jewish vaudeville shtick, okay? And you pull up and you look at it and your heart breaks. And you want to just take them and hold them. And the cop goes, don't you move. You know, it's revealing. It's revealing. But how do you have boundaries with a guy who's literally out of his body? You know, Because I was the last one standing with my dad. I was the last one, you know, he burned everyone out except those Jesus freaks. And I'm saying it with, you know, is. But those fucking Jesus freaks. Excuse me.

[Therapist Host 2]

You don't need to.

[Brad Garrett]

But. But I will tell you, they love it when you're weak.

[Therapist Host 3]

Oh, yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

They love it when you're weak because it just proves their bullshit even more. Because I remember when he had a breakdown and I hate that I'm talking about him, because he was my hero and I love him to death. But if one person. I know this sounds so corny, Listening. Could take. And I know that's why you guys do it, but in Oregon, it was like he goes to jail or he goes to this place, you know, where they have no tools and no ideas and everything was experimental. This is 30 years ago.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Or we take him to a place where he's going to have to be in a 5150, whatever the. He's out.

[Therapist Host 1]

Is it psychotic hold?

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah. So he was on a psychotic cold and they lied to me. And they were like, we're gonna watch it for 24 hours and you can pick him up tomorrow. I wasn't, you know, I wasn't that schooled on how that worked until, you know, now I. I know all the ins and outs. This is one of the first episodes that went, you know, brutally south. So I go there, 24 hours later, I got a shit. Gonna take him back home with me, get him out of the woods for a while. And the congregation is in the parking lot singing He Shall Overcome.

[Therapist Host 3]

Oh, my God.

[Brad Garrett]

Okay. I go there.

[Therapist Host 1]

So helpful.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, it was so great. I show up and to them, they knew me. They knew of me, and, you know, my dad, God bless him, he was so far gone at this point with the religion. It was like, we gotta get Brad baptized. So, you know, I pull up in the parking lot. You know, I see them, I go, leave me the fuck alone. They start laying hands on me, okay? I get squirrely.

[Therapist Host 1]

Is this. Is this. Like, you're pretty well known at this time.

[Brad Garrett]

Thirty years ago, actually, I had just. It was just. Just. I just did the pilot. Okay. I just did the pilot for. No, I didn't do that. I didn't do Raymond. I did another pilot, which. And I had a show that aired three episodes. Was taken. Was it Raymond? Was it Raymond? Because. Okay, it was. It was before, but. But it was. But I've been on Star Search.

[Therapist Host 1]

Yeah, you were.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, I was doing stuff like I was doing the Tonight Show.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Not well. Couple episodes of Seinfeld, I did it. I did one episode. Well, well, that was right at the time. I did Raymond. And those came at the same time.

[Therapist Host 1]

Interesting.

[Therapist Host 3]

Okay.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, but. But I. You know, Star Search was big if you're. You know, if you were in Bread. And so those people saw it, but it was like, you know, I'm fighting off these, you know, these missionaries.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

I got my dad in here in paper shoes. You know, he's looking out the window, and I think I'm gonna, you know, end up in their mind, you know? So my point being, when he gave me.

[Therapist Host 1]

Conservatory conservatorship.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

I had to get. Thank you. I'm not big on the school. I had to finally get that and to get it from a guy that's a fanatical Christian to give anyone power over Jesus, you know, because that's how we looked at it, you know? Wow. He had a great line that I'll never forget because he was so loving to me. This is a guy that was. I mean, this is a guy that was beaten, you know, by his. By his Russian Jewish father, immigrant. Okay. He would. You know, I'd hug him, I'd kiss him. He was a bear. He was a bear of a guy from the Bronx and so loving, but he had a great line, you know, when he really. When I knew he went off the deep end with religion. He was always great and always great to me and always said and always gave me little nuggets. So intellectually smart with zero education. And one day I was leaving him, you know, in his apartment, and he was fighting cancer, and I go, you got everything you need? I lived down the. I got him an apartment right near me. He didn't want to live with me. I got it. He was. He was a strong dude. And he goes, remember, you're my second favorite son. And I said, which is so Robert. This is. You know. And I said, I know. I'm hearing that a lot, dad. And he goes, no, not Raymond. You know who my favorite son is. And I went, I do, dad. It's Jesus. And I said, I know. And I said, you have good taste. I said, because the guy, you know, does a lot of sleight of hand with the wine and the water and the bread from the. You know. So we had humor. And I would make him laugh about the Jesus thing, but it for sure, it for sure took part of our relationship from me because he lost a lot of his humor when he became fanatical and he lost, you know, his belief in everything, became so myopic because if it's not in the book. And then he started teaching Bible study, and then he started to feel that he may have a healing power, you know, and religion and bipolarity, not a good mix. But it's funny, you see that a lot. You see it in homeless people. You see it in guys that come out in prison that saw the light. I think religion is everyone's last call. I think it's the last thing they grab onto when everyone's left them.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

So. So I'll ask you, there are people who grab onto religion that are able to turn it around.

[Brad Garrett]

Yes. What do you turn what around though?

[Therapist Host 1]

Their life.

[Brad Garrett]

Hey, whatever works. That's how I look at it.

[Therapist Host 1]

I wish I had faith, you know?

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, yeah. But, but, but, but you know what all religion is when it works. There are some great lessons in there.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

Surrendering, doing the right thing, loving my neighbor. Without your cock.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, there are things that are a great way to. It's when it becomes an excuse. It's when it becomes your go to. When it becomes judgmental. You know, supposedly Jesus didn't judge. He hung out with.

[Therapist Host 2]

Lepers and prosthesis lepers.

[Brad Garrett]

You know, if you didn't have a limp, you couldn't join them. You know, that was the thing. But man has a wonderful way of spinning it. And my father. My father spun it, you know, because of the mental illness he had. You know, the third Testament that he had written, that was kind of like what he thought Jesus really meant. Interpretation is what makes you hate religion, because that's when you take it away and you spin it, you know, your own. Your own way. You know what I mean? It's like this fucking administration that all they could say about those babies that were killed at that church the other day was, we will pray for you. We will pray for you. Fuck you. They were shot when they were praying. Yeah, you just. See, that's where religion is, the ultimate cop out. God wanted you in heaven. Well, you. I wanted them in my house. I wanted to put them to bed. They were my kids. Don't tell me what God wanted. That's where it gets dicey. And you see more and more people leaving churches, leaving religion, because it doesn't add up in a society where mental health, thanks to people like yourselves, is starting to become the forefront of true happiness and what it really means, you know, parents see a child struggling, I'll put him in little league. Yeah, let's take his insecurities, his fears, his self doubt and put them around a bunch of guys that could hit a fastball. Yeah, that'll. That'll help them. Yeah, they have no idea because they didn't have the tools, you know, So.

[Therapist Host 2]

I was in Scotland last. Last fall or two falls ago. And one of the best things, I was asking about all the churches, because there's churches everywhere, beautiful old churches, and.

[Brad Garrett]

I love going to them. Oh, my God, I love going to the cathedrals. Yeah, I love it.

[Therapist Host 2]

And they're everywhere in Europe.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

You know, and because we were in London, we were in Scotland, and so we were looking at all these churches, and I asked somebody, I said, well, you guys aren't religious here, but there's a church on every corner. And they said the best thing. They go, yeah, we evolved.

[Brad Garrett]

Wow.

[Therapist Host 2]

And I was like, God damn, I wish America.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 2]

Like, they were just like, yeah, we don't.

[Brad Garrett]

Why can't we.

[Therapist Host 1]

I have a theory.

[Brad Garrett]

What is it?

[Therapist Host 1]

I think, I truly think the biggest draw to religion is afterlife. I think if you remove afterlife, what's left? Be a good person. I think everybody's so scared of life ending that they need an idea that it'll keep going somehow or that they'll.

[Therapist Host 2]

See somebody that they've lost or what? You know, that after whatever, you're marketing that. Afterlife.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah.

[Therapist Host 1]

I think if you remove afterlife from religion, what's left? Morals, principle.

[Therapist Host 2]

Like, what is a little community there? I think.

[Brad Garrett]

But there is a little community, you know, very judgmental, but yeah, there's a.

[Therapist Host 2]

Lot of parameters that go with it.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, that's the problem. That's the problem, you know, no solutions, you know, no. You know, so. And you know, when my dad was. Was operated on first cancer. This is in like nine. I was 20. It was 1980.

[Therapist Host 1]

Jesus. I'm just kidding.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah. His scar was across.

[Therapist Host 1]

Of course it was.

[Brad Garrett]

Right.

[Therapist Host 2]

So later, when he got religious, he was, baby, I'm already branded.

[Brad Garrett]

To a T. Yeah, to a T. Yeah. You know, to a T. So everything.

[Therapist Host 2]

They love a sign.

[Brad Garrett]

Yeah, they love a sign, man.

[Therapist Host 1]

They'll make it.

[Brad Garrett]

And that's. And that's the thing. But, you know, if we. If we spent half the time. Time working on the life that we're having now, as opposed to rallying for the afterlife, how great would life be? You know, I mean, that's. That's, you know, that's the key. You know? I mean, there's no afterlife. You know, I believe that there's something about the soul and the spirit and the stuff. I'm big on that. And the universe shit. I mean, I just, you know, I know there's something else. It's. It's not a. It's not a guy in a beard. Right. You shouldn't. But I believe in the power of man.

[Therapist Host 3]

Yeah.

[Brad Garrett]

And. And hope and. And renewal and all that stuff, because I've seen so many incredibly powerful people get that second chance. And when you listen to them, it sounds like they've been to heaven and back and going, heaven. Heaven can be here. You know, it's just dealing with man.

[Therapist Host 1]

And we know that. Jesus, that's a bear.

[Brad Garrett]

It's not.