Why I Know the Right Thing — and Still Don’t Do It | #116 - Secondhand Therapy

Transcript

Michael Malone (0:00)

Secondhand Therapy is presented by Pony Bear Studios. For ad free episodes, head on over to patreon.com secondhand therapypod for the best.

Buddy (0:09)

Coffee in Las Vegas, visit Grouchy John's. Two locations, one in Green Valley, one in Centennial Hills. This episode of Secondhand Therapy is sponsored by BetterHelp. Yes, BetterHelp is an online resource for therapy.

Michael Malone (0:25)

Yeah. And I don't know who would have guessed it.

Buddy (0:28)

Who would have guessed it? I don't know if you know about the show, but we're actually very pro therapy around here. Very pro therapy.

Michael Malone (0:35)

That is the rumor that's going around.

Buddy (0:36)

It's helped me a lot.

Michael Malone (0:39)

Tell me more.

Buddy (0:41)

It really has. You don't notice a change in me, Is that what you're saying?

Michael Malone (0:44)

I do.

Buddy (0:44)

Okay, then. Has it helped you?

Michael Malone (0:46)

Absolutely. I'm in Better Help right now and my therapist is awesome.

Buddy (0:51)

Your therapist sounds pretty great. I'm not gonna lie.

Michael Malone (0:53)

He did. I'm so happy with him. And like, whenever we have to reschedule or something changes, it's so easy. It's like, literally, like clicks and it's done. I have to call mine Boo.

Buddy (1:05)

It's terrible. But here's what I will say. I was always very much an in person therapy kind of set up for myself. Yeah, I'm on telehealth now.

Michael Malone (1:20)

Way better. Oh, yeah, dude.

Buddy (1:22)

Doing therapy like from your couch or like where you're in your space where you're comfortable? Oh, dude, I'm. I'm doing way better.

Michael Malone (1:28)

That's one of the best parts of Better Help is that I get to do it from my cozy little corner chair.

Summary

Secondhand Therapy #116 – Why I Know the Right Thing — and Still Don’t Do It (February 2, 2026)

Episode Overview

In this episode of Secondhand Therapy, co-hosts Michael Malone and Buddy (Louie Paoletti), two best friends who are not licensed therapists, dive into the perennial dilemma: "Why do we know the right thing to do, and still not do it?" Through laughter, genuine vulnerability, and their signature banter, they unpack issues around self-sabotage, motivation, permission, routines, and self-worth — all with direct references to recent therapy sessions and real moments from their lives. The discussion touches on food choices, gym routines, emotional habits, the challenges of building community, and lingering parental influences.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Emotional Memory and Triggers

Coffee Shop Moment ([08:39]):
- Michael shares a moment when a song at a café triggered unexpected emotion: “A song that I had not heard in a dog's age... it came on and I almost started crying in the coffee shop. And it's the dumbest thing.” – Michael Malone [08:39]
- They reflect on how certain songs or smells can unexpectedly evoke powerful feelings.
Buddy notes, “If that does happen, it's usually A song or a smell. Yeah, those are the ones that'll hit me the hardest.” – Buddy [11:08]

2. The “Knowing Better” Cycle: Self-Sabotage and Overwhelm

Therapy Session Recap & Food Choices ([16:59]):
- Michael struggles with self-control, even when the “right choice” is obvious:
  - “I don't know why I'm not choosing... the better choice. Even when I know it's the better choice. I have a really hard time with that lately.” – Michael Malone [16:59]
- He uses a recent burger ("...I'm halfway through the burger being like, 'What are you doing?'") as an example.
- Buddy recounts a similar moment at Jersey Mike’s where Michael ignores advice not to get a cookie ([18:02]).
- Michael describes the all-or-nothing mentality — if he breaks a routine (misses the gym/journaling), he defaults to a “bad” choice (like eating fast food). Overwhelm from wanting to fix everything at once leads to cycles of demotivation.
Routine, Checklists, and ADHD ([19:34]):
- Michael’s therapist suggests focusing on "one big thing" (the gym) to reduce overwhelm, while still having a few minor daily tasks. They discuss the tension between doing too much (overwhelmed) vs. doing too little (underwhelmed/loss of motivation).
- “We’re trying to find a balance where it's not overwhelming, but there's also enough to do that I'm not, like, underwhelmed and then under motivated to do anything.” – Michael Malone [21:04]

3. Experiencing vs. Completing Tasks

“Doing” vs. “Experiencing” ([28:05]):
- Michael recognizes he treats self-care as tasks to “get done” instead of experiences to be present for: “Even these things that I am doing in my routine, I'm not really doing them right. ...I'm not experiencing the morning walk. ...I'm focusing on getting the fuck out of there so I can mark it off my list.” – Michael Malone [29:13]
- His therapist assigns homework: When doing these activities (gym, walks), pause to record notes about how he feels — focusing on the experience, not just completion ([31:19]).

4. Permission, Allowance, and Self-Value

Recurring Struggles with Permission ([30:03]):
- “The battles that I have with myself is like, okay, I'll allow you to go to the gym, but you gotta go in and get out... Like, I’m not experiencing the gym. ...I'm focusing on getting the fuck out of there so I can mark it off my list and be like, 'Okay, I did it.'” – Michael Malone [29:13]
- They note recurring patterns: needing to give himself permission, but only in a transactional or restricted way.
Buddy’s Challenge: Building Value from Within ([46:32]):
- Michael ties his self-worth to external validation/status, especially in “onstage” persona:
  - “If I'm meeting somebody just out in the world, I don't feel like I have any [value]. That's what it is. There's no value. Because how do you know how productive I am or whatever? What have I done? I have no value?” – Michael Malone [46:32]
- Buddy challenges this: “How do you know how productive and valuable the person you're talking to is?” – Buddy [46:38]
- They examine the unhealthy link between productivity, value, and feeling ‘allowed’ to be present.

5. The Impact of Family Dynamics

Parental Influence: The “Spoon/Knife” Analogy ([54:15]):
- Buddy uses a powerful metaphor about Michael’s relationship with his mother:
  - “I think unconditional love is like, if you were to give somebody love, you would give it to them on a spoon. And I think what your mom did was made you lick it off a knife. You know, she gave it to you, but my God, did you have to be careful.” – Buddy [54:24]
- This metaphor hits Michael hard, leading to a moment of reflection and emotion.
Linking Self-Care & Self-Worth ([57:32]):
- “I don't value myself because I'm not doing the things for myself that I need to be doing. Like lotioning my fucking legs.” – Michael Malone [57:32]
- The difficulty with even minor self-care tasks echoes larger issues about self-worth and self-compassion.

6. Building Community and Overcoming Social Anxiety

Onstage vs Offstage Persona ([41:32]):
- Michael draws distinction between “Comedian Michael Malone” (confident, accepted) and “real life Michael Malone” (socially anxious, wallflower), and longs for a genuine, present community.
Fear of Rejection and Real Connection ([43:54]):
- Buddy suggests Michael’s real hesitation is a fear of rejection; that he might crave community, but is scared of another “licking the love off the knife” situation.
The conversation circles back to how we attempt to offer value (“help and advice...or comedy stuff...even if we don’t ask, he'll give it to you” – Buddy [56:37]), instead of just offering authentic presence.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On Familiar Struggles:
- “Does this feel like new discoveries?” – Buddy [32:14]
- “No, it doesn't feel like new discoveries. It feels like there's some actionable things behind it.” – Michael Malone [32:22]
On Performing, Value, and Vulnerability:
- "It's because that person is, for lack of a better term, like he's verified, you know what I mean? Like he's—people are vouching for him." – Michael Malone [45:30]
- "If I'm meeting somebody just out in the world, I don't feel like I have any [value]. ...I have no value?" – Michael Malone [46:32]
On Self-Sabotage and Overwhelm:
- “I can't get out of that cycle. ...If I didn’t journal or if I didn’t do the morning walk or get up early enough, then it. I'm gonna have a burger. Or the other way around.” – Michael Malone [18:12]
The “Spoon/Knife” Analogy ([54:24]):
- “She gave it to you, but my God, did you have to be careful.” – Buddy [54:24]
On Self-Care and Self-Worth:
- “I told myself that. Lotion your legs. I went, nah. And I didn’t do it.” – Michael Malone [34:25]
- “Why am I not doing these things for myself? I don't know.” – Michael Malone [34:32]

Important Segment Timestamps

| Timestamp | Topic / Moment | |-----------|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 08:39 | Michael describes being unexpectedly moved by a song in a coffee shop | | 16:59 | Michael shares his struggle: “why do I know the right thing and still not do it?” | | 19:34 | Discussing routine, overwhelm, and advice from Michael’s therapist | | 28:05 | Michael identifies he rushes through, rather than experiences, self-care activities | | 29:13 | Focus on permission and allowance: “I'll allow you to go to the gym, but you got to go in and get out.” | | 31:19 | Exercise: mindfully record the experience of activities, not just completion | | 41:32 | Michael’s struggle to build “real-world” community vs. confidence as “comedian Michael Malone” | | 46:32 | On self-worth, status, and the feeling of being “valuable” only when productive | | 54:24 | Buddy shares the “licking love off a knife” metaphor for Michael's experience of conditional affection | | 57:32 | Michael's admission: failing at self-care is directly linked to self-worth |

The Tone: Vulnerable, Witty, and Unfiltered

The episode is marked by signature back-and-forth, self-deprecating humor, and poignant honesty. Michael is openly exasperated with himself but keeps the tone approachable. Buddy mixes gentle challenge with supportive teasing, questioning Michael’s motives and offering new perspectives (sometimes via tough love, often via memorable analogies).

For New Listeners

This episode is a perfect illustration of Secondhand Therapy’s “funny, honest” approach: listeners get direct access to the inner battles of two best friends trying to be kinder to themselves, and to each other, all while knowing there are no magic fixes. The lesson is in the trying and in the talking.

Closing Reflection

Michael and Buddy leave us with the reminder that personal growth isn’t linear and that simply “knowing better” isn’t enough; compassion for our messy humanity is essential. Their closing question — did Michael make more progress in therapy or in the podcast? — encapsulates the show’s spirit: sometimes the best therapy is a real (secondhand) conversation with someone who gets it.