Friends Thru A Lens: House Parties with Alexandra Haddow

Summary

Sentimental Garbage: Friends Thru A Lens – House Parties with Alexandra Haddow

Podcast: Sentimental Garbage
Host: Caroline O'Donoghue
Guest: Alexandra Haddow
Date: November 20, 2025
Episode Theme:
A hilarious, warm, and deeply nostalgic dissection of House Parties — both in real life and as depicted in Friends. With comedian and house party aficionada Alexandra Haddow, the conversation traverses the house party lifecycle, using iconic Friends party episodes to reflect on what makes a great (or terrible) house party, growing up, the performance of adulthood, and the cycles of friendship.

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Main Theme and Purpose

Caroline and Alexandra explore the evolution of house parties in life and on Friends, considering how age, career pressures, Instagram, and “growing up” affect hosting, attending, and enjoying house parties. By revisiting key party-centric episodes of Friends, they draw out both sociological truths about friendship groups and the comic intricacies of sitcom writing, always with personal anecdotes and relatable asides.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Lifecycle of House Parties

• Early Twenties: Frequent, chaotic, budget-friendly house parties are the norm — often due to lack of money for going out. House parties and pre-drinks are a necessity ("when we're very young and broke, a house party is something had out of necessity." – Caroline, 02:20).
• Late Twenties-Lull (28–32): There’s a “play” at being grown-up; couples’ dinners replace parties; people become anxious about homes being too messy or too nice to share.
  • "It's sort of pretend senility... suddenly it's like, oh, we're having couples dinners. Why?" – Caroline, 05:29
• The “Pretend Adulthood” Phase: Instagram and increased “house pride” encourages both shame of modest living and anxieties over inviting guests. Alexandra adds: "You get a bit of cash, you're like, oh, my house is nice. I don't want to invite everyone over and ruin it." (03:00)
• Full-Circle in Mid-Thirties: People rediscover house parties, now with nicer furniture and booze, less pretense.
  • “When you all come out of that slight coma where you're all kind of pretending to be grown up, it's so interesting.” – Alexandra, 05:40

Parallel to Friends

• The sitcom mirrors real-life friendship and house party cycles:
  • Early seasons: wild, possibility-filled parties.
  • Mid-seasons: “the lull” – focus on couples, jobs, less fun.
  • Later seasons: Full-circle, celebratory parties as adult lives settle.

The Anatomy of a Good House Party

• No “CV Parties”:

  • Good parties aren’t about networking; “no one leaves knowing what anyone else’s job is.” – Alexandra, 06:43

• Mix of Familiar and New Faces:

  • “My rule is 80% should know 80% of the people. There should be a few people that everybody doesn’t know.” – Alexandra, 09:02

• Formality is Fun:

  • Dressing up elevates a party: “There’s nothing more glamorous than a woman in an evening gown sitting on a rug.” – Caroline, 18:41
  • Outfits create occasion: “That's what separates it from just people at your house.” – Caroline, 20:04

• A Little Structure, Not a Regiment:

  • Monica-style over-organization (“writing your most embarrassing moment down”) is a killjoy. Let parties breathe – small shared activities (birthday cake, a toast, a quick “event”) work better.
  • “People don’t want an itinerary on a night out. People want maybe a little event, a tiny theme… a lovely five minute speech and a themed cocktail. That’s the level people want.” – Alexandra, 47:08

• Activity Timing:

  • Icebreakers/comedy/activities should happen early, not after people are a few hours in and want to chatter (49:00).

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Notable Quotes & Moments

On Fun vs. Rest

• "90% of the time when you think you need rest, what you actually need is fun." (Caroline, 08:21)
• “People think they need a bath in a yoga class and they need to do is take a fucking MDMA with their spouse at a Bjorn Again gig.” (Caroline, 08:37)

On Performative Boringness

• “The people that are performatively boring, where they're like, oh, I just can't even have two drinks any more. All right, well, why don't you just go and die?” (Alexandra, 66:25)
• “Nobody wants to have a combative relationship with fun. I'm going to put that out there.” (Caroline, 68:19)
• “Take the vat off… Whatever you’re doing, do less. Take 20% off.” (Alexandra, 69:17)

On Adulthood, Pretending, and Letting Go

• “People overshoot the runway... I own two separate baking dishes, I guess now I make a souffle for my husband’s boss and his wife, and we’re like, is it — this is it?” (Caroline, 06:03)
• “You have to trial and error for a bit. This is not my beautiful house.” (Alexandra and Caroline, 06:23)

On Monica’s Over-Organizing

• “Monica is essentially the corporate quiz at this night. You need minimal structure for a great party.” (Alexandra, 50:13)

On Friendship Dynamics in 'Friends'

• “The older you get, the more you’re like, okay, there’s the bad news boyfriend your friend has… and I have to do my concerned face and it’s so boring.” (Caroline, 29:00)
• “The way in which your friends can care for you like a spouse would… being able to get comfort from all of your friends and your boyfriend in the same way.” (Caroline, 43:05)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

00:59-04:45: Introducing Alexandra as “queen of house parties,” lifecycle of house parties in real life
04:45-06:03: The ‘lull’ of late twenties/Instagram house pride
06:43-09:35: The importance of “no one leaves knowing what anyone's job is,” mixing friend groups; anti-CV-party ethos
13:44-16:45: House parties depicted in early Friends; “The One with the Monkey” and house party structure
18:25-22:24: Formal house parties, costume analysis – the power of overdressing ("There’s nothing more glamorous than a woman in an evening gown sitting on a rug." – Caroline, 18:41)
29:59-32:55: The “Fun Bobby” dilemma – should you go to a party sad? Alexandra’s rule: “Have a drink at a nearby pub with a trusted pal. If you get the flavour, head on out.”
34:26-46:55: “The One With Two Parties” — a masterclass in Monica’s over-organization, the perils of split parties, emotional depth of Rachel’s parents divorcing
53:01-56:22: “The One Where Chandler Can’t Remember Which Sister” – hangover shame, ‘the Fear’, post-party analysis
63:00-65:19: Transition from fun parties to “CV parties”; Monica takes over, parties become less fun
87:14-90:11: “The One With the Fake Party” – the pain of an awkwardly small but not intimate house party, changing sitcom norms
91:01-95:27: “The One With the Soap Opera Party” — the house party lifecycle ends with catering, segmentation of social groups, etiquette of selective invitations
95:50-end: Final reflections, Alexandra’s club night plug, outro

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Memorable Moments by Friends Episode

The One With the Monkey (S1E10) – [15:05+]

• “I want to talk about Marcel the monkey. …Ross was so disliked by the American viewing public…This was the time of the monkey.” (Caroline, 15:54)
• “It comes full circle. At one point, everyone they didn't want to date. Then everyone has a date. And then by the end, no one has a date.” (Alexandra, 15:36)

The One With Two Parties (S2E22) – [34:41+]

• “This is the perfect episode to demonstrate how to have a great house party and how not to.” (Alexandra, 34:41)
• Rachel as a child of divorce, trying to “uphold a fiction” at her own party so parents don’t fight (37:08–43:41)

The One Where Chandler Can't Remember Which Sister (S3E11) – [52:40+]

• “I don't think you see people getting the fear after a night out in the sitcom a lot... I really like it.” (Alexandra, 53:17)
• “There’s a lot of post-match day analysis in this one.” (Caroline, 55:23)

The One Where Rachel Smokes / Late Twenties Lull – [64:24+]

• “You think that being boring is being sophisticated.” (Alexandra, 65:31)

The One With the Fake Party (S5E16) – [86:13+]

• “Rachel loses all her authority, all her cool in this.” (Alexandra, 87:04)
• Dangers of medium-sized gatherings: “It's the worst number of people to be at a house party.” (Alexandra, 89:39)

The One With the Halloween Party (S8E6) – [77:24+]

• “The pretense from everybody has worn off a bit. It's actually just like — let's just have fun.” (Alexandra, 78:50)
• Chandler’s bunny costume: “He looks like a mascot...who lost a big job.” (Alexandra, 79:10)

The One With the Soap Opera Party (S9E20) – [91:01+]

• “Catering is the final furlong, I would say, for house parties.” (Alexandra, 91:01)

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Top Takeaways & Host/Guest Chemistry

• The podcast crackles with in-jokes, lived-in references, cheeky irreverence and affectionate banter — from "For a good time, call Alexandra Haddow" to tear-downs of "performatively boring" friends.
• Alexandra’s rules and advice for house parties are practical, funny, and anti-pretentious, counterpointing Monica’s sitcom perfectionism at every turn.
• Their shared millennial nostalgia connects warm personal memories with Friends’ zeitgeist — whether analyzing "the fear," dissecting the best era for “Spin the Bottle,” or ranking sitcoms.

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Conclusion

A rollicking, insight-filled episode for any Friends obsessive, social butterfly, or house party wallflower. Alexandra and Caroline prove that house parties — in fiction and life — are mirrors: if we understand why they work, we understand a lot about friendship, adulthood, shame, joy, and the cycles, both silly and sentimental, that define our relationships.

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Listen For

• The smart, funny autopsy of why house parties disappear and come back in your thirties (05:16, 64:24).
• Alexandra’s blunt, pro-fun manifesto (“take the vat off!”) (69:23)
• Comic rituals, dangers, and delights of party hosting, from clashing friend groups to the little “high and low” that makes an occasion — evening gowns on rugs, trestle tables and Jello shots.
• Thorough party analysis through the best (and worst) Friends episodes — Monica’s over-organization, the Janice effect, the awkwardness of selective invites, and the challenge of passing from “friends-as-family” to "couples’ dinner purgatory."
• Alexandra’s final plug for her Indie Amnesty club night (96:10).

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For full episode enjoyment, skip the ads and join them "in the kitchen at parties”… or perhaps in a floor-length gown, on a rug, with good friends and no CV chat required.

Transcript

[A]

So good, so good, so good.

[B]

Just in thousands of winter arrivals at your Nordstrom rack store, save up to 70% on coats, slippers, and cashmere from Kate Spade New York, Vince Ugg Levi's and more. Check out these boots. They've got the best gifts. My holiday shopping hack. Join the Nordiclobe. Get an extra 5% off every rack purchase with your Nordstrom credit card. Plus buy it online and pick it up in store the same day for free. Big gifts, big per. That's why you rack. Hello and welcome to Friends Through a Lens, the podcast miniseries where I talk to my real life friends about the show Friends Through a Lens of their choosing. My name is Caroline and I've been put in charge of cups and ice. And it's Rachel's birthday, so it's time to poach the salmon. It's Alexandra Haddo.

[A]

Hello.

[B]

You are here today in a very special context, which is I believe you to be the queen of house parties.

[A]

Thank you so much. That is one of the biggest compliments I've ever received.

[B]

How is it that you've come to earn this title? About.

[A]

Nearly. Actually, it was only about two years ago. I mean, I've always enjoyed them. Yeah, about two years ago. So I'm 37. I was 30. Yeah, I was 35. And I was like, you know what? I haven't been to a great house party in years because I feel like you have them a lot in your 20s. Up to like 27, 28. And then I feel like everyone puts on a play of trying to be old and grown up for a while.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And then you realize, I mean, I never did that, but, like, a lot of people did. And then you sort of house parties just went for a while. I think it's that age that it happens. And I was like, you know what? I'm gonna throw a big Christmas party. And I told everybody about it months in advance. Big Christmas house party. You came, you bought a bottle of Moe. I remember it.

[B]

It was a good year for me. It was, fiscally speaking, very clear.

[A]

I was like, wow, Caroline has really classed this up a. And it was such a great time that now I have one for Christmas and my birthday, but then we just had one for my boyfriend's birthday. So three a year, which I think is.

[B]

You know what's funny, because I feel like it's much more regular than that. But I think. Do I just think that because of the general paucity of people having house parties in their 30s.

[A]

Yeah, maybe. Yeah.

[B]

It's interesting because I Think you are right. I think when we're very young and very broke, a house party is something that's had a necessity because you can't afford to drink all night.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

In someone's gaff. So obviously, when we're young, it's pre drinks, which is often kind of a party of its own.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then you go out and then you might have an afters or whatever.

[A]

Exactly, yeah.

[B]

And then that sort of might. Might go into your sort of mid-20s and then. And I do think sort of Instagram and sort of people getting increasingly house proud has something to answer to this. People stop inviting people over because people are very ashamed of their homes.

[A]

Yes. Yeah, yeah. Or it goes the other way. And when you get a bit of cash, you're like, oh, my house is nice. I don't want to invite everyone over and ruin it.

[B]

There's that in it as well.

[A]

But there's both. I think it's both polarization of that. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

So house parties, as per the show. Friends. I actually do think you see that exact journey mimicked in Friends.

[A]

Yes. I think you're right. There is a lull in the middle seasons.

[B]

Yeah. And during that lull, the house parties get very bad. And it's kind of fascinating when you see it because, like, ultimately, this is a show that takes its characters from the average age of about 25 to 35. It ran for 10, 11 years. And so it does. And this show is always sold on the concept of that period of life where your friends are your family and everything. You have endless time to hang out with them, and no one's taking their jobs that seriously. And I think everyone's pretty much unanimously agreed that, like, once the pressures of, like, real life comes in on the show, like, once they have to have kids and more serious careers and all that and get married, it does feel less effervescent. You know what I mean?

[A]

Yeah, 100%.

[B]

And with that, the house parties as well.

[A]

Yeah, absolutely. And that's. And I do think a lot of the stuff in Friends comes full circle as well. Like you were saying, there's a slight lull in the middle. There's a slight lull in real life as well. Like, when you're in your 20s, most of you are probably single. And I remember being in my 20s, and because most of my mates were single, they. It was like, if you got. If you sometimes, if you liked someone and you knew that you were going to have a relationship with them, you almost felt a bit left out because you were like, oh, obviously I like this person. I want to be with them. But everyone's single and that's the. That's the craziness and the drama and stuff like that. And so the house party is full of possibility.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

And then when you're kind of Me, when you grow up a bit, you may be like, you know, you're either. You don't want to bring people around because you're ashamed or. Or you've got a nice house and then like half. And half of you, like, there's half of you that are in a relationship. And I think you're all a bit like fragmented around the leading up to 30 and everyone's kind of panicking about 30, which is in. Is in the Friends party universe as well, the 30th ones. And then when you kind of all come out of that slight coma where you're all kind of like pretending to be grown up, it's so interesting.

[B]

I think I would love to people to write onto the comments on the Instagram or whatever about whether or not everyone. I think from 28 to 32 is when I noticed it the most in my gang.

[A]

The exact age, I would have said as well.

[B]

It's sort of pretend senality kind of thing of like, suddenly it's like, oh, we're having couples dinners. Why?

[A]

Yeah, what are you on about? You're barely born.

[B]

You're barely born.

[A]

Yeah, and I never had that. And so I'm glad that everyone now is kind of, I think, come full circ. And then you're in your mid-30s and you know, you're like, oh, we can afford some half decent booze and we've got a nice couch. Come around.

[B]

Right, Right. There's kind of, I think when you. When you start getting fragments of adult life in your late. Let's say this isn't the kind of a. People living in an urban environment, which is obviously the world of friends and the world that most of my listeners are in.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's like people overshoot the Runway. They're like, okay, I moved in with my boyfriend. Yeah. I own two separate baking dishes, I guess now I make a souffle from for my husb. Husband's boss and his wife. And we're like, is it. This is it.

[A]

This is my.

[B]

You kind of have to trial and error for a bit.

[A]

This is not my beautiful house.

[B]

And you do sort of have to let go then after a while, like. And if you don't let go, God help you, because you'll find Yourself at what I described earlier on as a CV party. There's nothing worse than a CV party. Just people you don't know standing around comparing their cv.

[A]

I think the mark of a good party and I think, I hope this is what happens at parties is that nobody leaves knowing what anyone else's job is.

[B]

Oh my God. I remember. You're just like you to me. Like if there was a contact in my phone that like, just like a good time, for a good time, call Alexandra Haddo.

[A]

For a good time, call this number that is written on some phone boxes.

[B]

I think you are for. You are literally for a good time.

[A]

Like the why not?

[B]

I remember one time I left a restaurant with you and we were with our two men and you were like, do you know what I love about that meal? No one even pretended to order water.

[A]

Because you know, you were saying about this pretend senility. Did you say? Yeah, that's a constant bugbear of mine where it's like, you know all those memes that are like, you know, oh, the best thing is when somebody cancels on you and you don't want to go out anywhere.

[B]

Oh my God.

[A]

Drives me mad and it's like get better mates or get more interesting.

[B]

That radicalizes me that. You know what I mean? Yeah.

[A]

Ishan Akbar, my good friend and comedian was on his Instagram today and he's doing preview of a special recording and he said, look, I'm doing a show tonight, top secret comedy, 6pm, it's a pound. He was like, six till 7pm you'll be home by, you know, you can come off to work, you'll be home by 7:40. Don't give me this about not coming out on a Monday. You live in London. And I was like, yes, this is the thing. No one's saying go on a. Go on an all night rave seven days a week.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

But just, just be a, open your mind to a bit of fun.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And that doesn't have to be getting wrecked.

[B]

Yeah, but just. Can I tell you something that I read on Substack the other day and changed my life?

[A]

Please do.

[B]

I think it changed my life in the sense of it put it into words. Something I've been thinking for a long time already, but some rando girl said it better, which is 90% of the time when you think you need rest, what you actually need is fun.

[A]

That is absolutely correct. That is the. That is, yes. I'm going to get that.

[B]

Tattooed people think they need a bath in a yoga class and they need to do is take a fucking MDMA with their spouse at a bjorn Again gig.

[A]

100%. Because that's the thing. I think what people equate is going out of the house with spending a whole night with people you don't know and staying out till 4 or spending.

[B]

A ton of money. Yeah.

[A]

It doesn't have to be like showing.

[B]

Off or social pressure.

[A]

Just open your mind a little bit.

[B]

Like social.

[A]

Social pressure. Like you say, that's the CV party. There should be no social pressure at an actual good house party. Because what it should be is, My rule is 80% of the people should know. 80% of the people. There should be a few people that everybody doesn't know.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's how you make. That's. But that's why when I have a house party now, every people that have met at my house parties before then hang out and then it's not.

[B]

I have huge relationships with people I only know from your parties and it's like, oh, it's you again. Lovely.

[A]

And also, crucially, don't invite anyone that treats it as a CV party. No, no, no.

[B]

Sometimes you find out too late, though. Yeah. Well. Well, let's get to the friends, then. I mean, I had to ask everybody on this miniseries, do you have a relationship with Friends?

[A]

Yes, I do. I. I am a massive, massive fan. I. Yeah, it was, I mean, genuinely in my 20s for a while, I would say. I. I would say I watched Friends every day.

[B]

Yeah, I think so. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, for a good few years.

[A]

Because it was always kind of on, like.

[B]

But also when you live with flatmates, it's the one thing you can all agree on.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Basically like it. Do you know what? I think I wrote about this, my first novel in Promising young Women. There's a scene where the. The heroine, Jane, is, like, watching TV for the first time with her flatmate and she's getting excited because they're watching Friends and they get sort of high off the residual friendship coming off of Friends and they order a pizza together and it's the first thing they've done. And like, that's. I remember that happening to me in house shares. Like, maybe we're. The energy is sluicing off the television into our awkward house share. Maybe we could be there. Maybe we could be them.

[A]

That's essentially it, isn't it? Yeah, I think that's what. That's part of its appeal. My boyfriend's never watched Friends.

[B]

My boyfriend's never watched Friends. He's watched like. I'm trying to bully him into an episode of this podcast, which is Friends through the lens of someone who's never.

[A]

Seen Friends that's Came and Joey on. But. Yeah. And I. That fascinates me because I'm like, how did you avoid it?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, it was. It was just so. It was everywhere. And I remember one of my pivotal friends memories, I guess, was my mum and dad, who, you know, they're not together now. They're friends now, but when we were growing up. But, you know, I never felt like they had very similar interests. And I remember my dad had gone out to, like, the cinema and to have a few pints with his mates or whatever. And him. The next day we were all hanging out and on the Saturday morning, and my dad being like, what happened in Friends last night? And my mum telling him and them, like, really bonding over. Because it was with the Ross Rachel kind of.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That time where it was almost like a drama as well as a sitcom. It can really.

[B]

You can dip into that sometimes. Yeah.

[A]

That's what makes it a good sitcom, I think. And that's a really pivotal moment of me being like. And I was a bit too young to watch it, so I was like, oh, I can't wait to watch this show. And then, you know, and then I got into it, obviously. But I genuinely think the first five seasons of Friends are in my top three sitcoms of all time. I think it's fantastic.

[B]

What else is in that tier?

[A]

I would say Gavin and Stacey.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Tell you what, that is a show that knew when and how to take its bows.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Do you know what I mean? Comes back for the right amount of time at the right time.

[A]

Yeah. Even that. I thought the final special of Gavin and Stacy was in floods.

[B]

Oh, my God, I was fucking in floods.

[A]

Yeah. I love that. The other one I didn't think was that good.

[B]

No.

[A]

I think. And I think everyone's forgotten about it and we've all just, like, quietly. I just.

[B]

I mean, I know this is a show about Friends and not Kevin and Stacy, but I think the genius thing of that, that very last finale, which I hope will be the last time we ever see them, because I think it's a good place to le them was like, there's this whole bit of, like, trying to get a coach through a field or whatever.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And like, it's all just them again in the back of a car arguing about what route to take.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Yeah. I was like, this is like. It's getting. It's, like, so cinematic because you're trying to, like, drive this, like, bus through a field and, like, it's actually shot really beautifully. But it goes back to exactly what the show was always about, which is travel admin. Yeah, like family and travel admin.

[A]

The reason it's a brilliant sitcom is it's kind of a show about nothing. Yeah.

[B]

It's a show about driving from England to Wales a lot, basically.

[A]

And, yeah, it's hilarious, like, and it's great.

[B]

But I think to your point of, like, not really enjoying it so far, after they sort of all settle down and pair off is because the premise of the show fundamentally changed because inevitably the characters are going to get pair off and settle down. That's kind of what happens realistically with time and people. But once you reach a point where people's main solace isn't their friends, it is their husband or their, you know, their immediate family, the premise of the show has changed. And so you kind of can't enjoy it.

[A]

In the same way we're all Joey in the last five seasons because we're all like, why is everyone moving on?

[B]

Come on.

[A]

Why can't we just have 10 years where they're all shagging people? They shouldn't be like, come on.

[B]

So I'm gonna treat this episode with you as the sort of, like, house party agony. And, yes, because you've had a lot of them. I know you're saying you only had, like, a few since you were 35, but actually, I feel like I remember a lot more than that.

[A]

Yeah, but that's what I mean. There was. There was a break. You came to a great one I had when we used to work together years ago, where it was my friend, Franz Stagto.

[B]

Oh, yeah, that was a good one.

[A]

But that was probably like, eight, seven, eight years ago. And then so I started them off again.

[B]

Oh, right. Okay.

[A]

So there was. There was a bit of a gap. Yeah.

[B]

When we.

[A]

And then I realized how much I love them and thought, why don't we do this all the time?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, great. I mean, we're coming up with the Christmas season, so this is everyone's sign to plan a bloody house party.

[A]

Yeah, you must. It's honestly the best. There's no closing time, there's no queues. It doesn't cost you loads, and you have the best time.

[B]

Yeah. And so we're going to basically go through kind of chronologically what we've both deemed to be the kind of iconic party episodes of Friends.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you are going to sort of diagnose them we're gonna agony ant them. We're gonna see what we could have done better.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That makes have some questions about what was done wrong. I'm so thrilled.

[A]

I am as well. Finally my skill.

[B]

I know. Okay, so. Season one, Episode ten, the One with the Monkey this is Marcel's debut into the Friendsaverse.

[A]

I know, I couldn't believe that.

[B]

And it's also the New Year's party where they all decide that they're not going to bring dates and it's just going to be a small dinner.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And then it sort of snowballed out of control. It becomes a formal New Year's Eve party, like a big party. And then they all have nobody to kiss it at midnight. And then they inevitably. I think Chandler kissed by Joey.

[A]

Yeah, Joey kisses Chandler and someone takes a picture. And obviously that's gay.

[B]

Oh, yes, the gay panic of friends.

[A]

But yeah, and that's the. It comes full circle. At one point, everyone they didn't want to date. Then everyone has a date. And then by the end, no one has a date. So all kind of fucking phenomenal in 24 minutes or whatever an episode is.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, it's so good.

[B]

It's such a good like premise reversal. Yeah.

[A]

It's incredible.

[B]

Whatever they call that in the technical screenwriting books that I have bought and not read. I think this is like, I want to talk about Marcel the monkey. Because we recorded an episode on Ross the other day and we forgot to mention a very important Ross factor. Go on. Which is that Ross was so disliked by the American viewing public that they. And this was. This was like the time of Ace Ventura Pet Detective. This was the time of Dunstan Checks In. This is this the 90s. It was the time of the monkey.

[A]

It was the time of the monkey.

[B]

Yeah. And they said, how are we gonna make. We've given all these kids series contracts. How are we gonna make everyone like David Schwimmer? Let's give him a monkey.

[A]

That's why they gave him the monkey. That is some. That is some coked up thinking right there.

[B]

Let's give him a monkey.

[A]

Let's Michael Jackson him give him a monkey.

[B]

Why not? Wow.

[A]

That is because I remember not thinking it was a strange storyline at the time. And now I look back and when you kind of actually say it, I'm like, what? Why did he have a monkey?

[B]

If we ever do a return series of Friends through a lens, we'll definitely do animal husbandry in Friends because the chicken, the duck, I love that they never just Have a fucking cat and a dog. When they get a cat, it's like a hairless cat and it's horrible.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. There is friends, animals, isn't there?

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

Knock knock.

[A]

Ooh, who's there?

[B]

A Boost Mobile expert here to deliver and set up your all new iPhone 17 Pro, designed to be the most powerful iPhone ever.

[A]

You called that a knock knock joke. This isn't a joke.

[B]

Boost mobile really sends experts to deliver and set up your phone at home or work. Okay. It's just that when people say knock.

[A]

Knock, there's usually a joke to go with it.

[B]

Like I said, this isn't a joke.

[A]

So the knock knock was just you knocking?

[B]

Yeah, that's how doors work. Get the new iPhone 17 Pro delivered and set up by an expert wherever you are. Delivery available for select devices purchased at boostmobile.com, terms apply. Another thing that's very notable about this house party that I wanted to ask you about is that it.

[A]

It's a formal house party, which I approve of.

[B]

Go on.

[A]

I think if you're going to have a house party, there's so many advantages. Right. You're not going out, you're not spending loads of money. There's probably comfy seats around. You can sit on a rug. Okay. At your choosing, at your leisure, anytime during the night.

[B]

Importantly, there's nothing more glamorous than a woman in like an evening gown sitting on a rug.

[A]

Exactly, exactly.

[B]

What's sexier than that? Everyone just came listening to that.

[A]

I know. Silk on a rug, you know, which.

[B]

Is exactly what Monica's wearing. She's wearing a floor length silver halter. It looks like the most expensive thing on the Reformation website as a compliment.

[A]

It really does. Yeah. And I think, hasn't it got like a kind of teardrop cutout above the breasts?

[B]

It's like the best she's ever looked. Yeah. And I say that a lot with her because she sometimes early seasons Monica, you're like. Are you like Lana Turner? Are you like.

[A]

Yes. She is, like, unbelievable.

[B]

Like 1950s movie star.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Crazy.

[A]

And at the time when I first watched it, I didn't really clock.

[B]

No, because you were just looking at Rachel. We were all just looking at Rachel.

[A]

You were. And I was always a. You know. Yeah. I was always, like, trying to not have Rachel as my favorite because I was, like, boring. But then I didn't read. Chandler was just always my favorite.

[B]

Yeah. But formal house party.

[A]

Yes, sorry, Formal house party. I. Because I think when you've got all these amazingly casual and chilled options available to you, like, whatever drink you want, whatever. Wherever you want to sit, whoever you want to talk to, it's nice to just look as good as you can possibly look. Do you know what I mean? I think it's like, it brings, like, a sense of party to the house. Because the rest of the time you're in your house in, like, a tracksuit.

[B]

Right. Yeah, that's the thing. The thing about throwing any house party is that what separates it from just people at your house.

[A]

Exactly. Exactly.

[B]

And outfits is a big part of that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I think must remember going into the Christmas season.

[A]

Yes. And I, I, Yeah, I'm a big believer in that. Like, when people say, what should I wear to your house party? I'm like, dress up. Because I'm like, why the fuck not? Do you know what I mean? Like, so many times, so many things at the moment of people being like, oh, you know, just don't bother. And wear slacks and go home early, bestie, we live in hell.

[B]

Go home early, bestie. We live in hell.

[A]

Yeah, I kind of. I think I've kind of stolen that from my friend Milo Edwards, who said, every advert these days is like, do you want a coffee, bestie? We live in hell. So props to him for that. But. But he's got that kind of attitude of like. And I'm like, no, like, dress up and go around to your mate's house and have a fucking great night. I think it lends a sense of occasion also, by the way, you can take your shoes off at any point if they're hurting. At a house party, even if you're.

[B]

Dressed up or if you're the host, even more glamorous. You can take your shoes off. If you're in an evening gown, your shoes are off. Glamour. Glamour. I also love what Phoebe's wearing. She's wearing a kind of gold medieval renaissance. Looks like she's Doing Shakespeare in the park, but it's like braided through with a glittering fabric and her hair is ringleted.

[A]

She does look like she's doing Shakespeare.

[B]

In the park, but like the most fabulous version of that. Yeah.

[A]

And it's a testament to her character and dressing her there that you don't even really look at it in a good way. Like, when you actually analyze it, you're like, God, she looks phenomenal. But you're not like, why is she in almost fancy dress?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. You know, early Phoebe is styled so well.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Towards the end of Phoebe, you get a lot of, like, what I theorize to be somebody who has, like, been poor their whole life and has never stopped shopping in charity shops. And so nothing really quite fits properly. And some things are just kind of novelty. But, like, she's never gonna get out of that friend of mine.

[A]

Bon.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

By the end. You know what I mean? Bon Marsh. Eh, don't know. But just like. Yeah, like a lot of kind of like V neck, fuchsia jumpers with a little embellishment hate. Do you know what I mean? It's like, that's not Phoebe.

[B]

Early Phoebe, with the kind of waistcoats and ringlets, long dresses. They've been the best styling ever.

[A]

Yeah. 100. I think she looks amazing. And you were kind of in a lovely semi. You were like a sort of sexy milk maid at my party recently.

[B]

Again, an outfit that I never wear out because I always feel like I'm a little bit in a costume, but in the context of a house party. Gorgeous. And what makes this house party feel so real and good as well, is that they're all way too dressed up, but they're essentially there to watch telly. Because the whole thing is that the American thing, which I believe is where the whole kiss at midnight thing comes from. Again, one of those things where I cannot tell whether it came from America or American sitcoms. The idea of having someone to kiss at midnight, now that you're saying it.

[A]

I don't know whether it was intrinsic.

[B]

Or from tv so much of my life, I'm like, did Americans invent this or did American writers invent it for sitcom?

[A]

I don't actually know.

[B]

For example, the phrase bite me. American sitcom is full of people saying bite me with the tenor of fuck you. And is it just because American sitcom writers wanted to have something that sounded as extreme as fuck you?

[A]

Yes, because they say it was such venom whenever they do say it in Friends. But I've just realized not. I've just Realized they don't swear, but I've never really consciously thought of that. That they have to have these six people who are in their 20s who would obviously be effing and blinding the whole time. And they have to be like, you know, even if they're talking about. I think they say the word sex but if they're talking about anything specific with sex, it's all innuendo.

[B]

Well, this is the kind of. This is what. It's so impressive from a writing perspective because you have these, again, six people who are in their 20s and they're supposed to be, like, on the loser end of cool. Right. But, like, still cool. They're dating, they're out, they're going to parties. They're having parties as we're talking. And so. But in order to have that feel like a realistic portrayal of people in their mid-20s while simultaneously appealing to children and old people. Like the audience for sitcom is everyone. Yeah, it's like ages 12 to 90 kind of thing. And to not offend any sensibilities is such a feat because they still do it. And there's like these weird things. We were talking the other day about the way Friends treats smoking. Feels so out of contact with everything. With how people in their 20s would behave in New York in the 90s.

[A]

They do, like, if you substituted every mention of a cigarette in Friends with smoking crack, it would.

[B]

The reaction would be the reasonable response like, chandler, no.

[A]

Chandler, you tried so hard.

[B]

You got.

[A]

You stopped.

[B]

You were out of it.

[A]

You were out of it. He started doing it because his parents split up. What, smoked a cigarette. A tiny, succulent cigarette. What's the crime? A tiny, succulent cigarette.

[B]

And there's a whole bit where it's another party episode, actually, the one where Rachel smokes where she smokes to be cool with the fat fashion girls.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The way this is talked about, it made me wonder the whole thing, like, oh, these people smoke and they're. They're bonding and coming up with all these professional fashion things and ideas and planning trips and shoots while they're smoking. I was like, is this a tongue in cheek thing about fashion and Coke? Because if you didn't do coke in fashion in the 90s, I imagine that would be tricky.

[A]

I wonder if this is all kind of coded because I'm just. I am thinking of. Bite me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Of like the. Is this all the kind of. You know, it's a bit like when you do your online shopping and it's like, we couldn't find you an apple. So but is it all, like, right? Every time someone would say, fuck you say bite me. Every time it's smoking, it's coke. Every time. Because even when in another party episode, Monica gets. It's the one where they all turn 30. Monica gets drunk because she doesn't realize Chandler has thrown her a surprise party.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And he's like, oh, my God, your parents are in there. And she's like, my parents have never seen me drunk. Bearing in mind this is her 30th birthday party and she acts, and then her parents react as if she is admitting to a class A drug addiction.

[B]

Yes. Right. It's so strange. And then another one is where it's like the one where Ross gets high. And the whole thing is that the Gellers don't like Chandler because they believe in college that Chandler got Ross high. And it's like, okay, that was 20 years ago. Yeah. Or whatever it was. But it makes you think that, like, okay, I understand that we need these. These sort of, like, taboos or whatever to exist within the world of the show to create friction. But it does seem, and especially with the subject of house parties, in order for a house party to feel exciting and dangerous, it needs to be exciting and dangerous. In order for a sitcom to make a show that can play to 9 year olds and 90 year olds, nothing can be truly dangerous. And so there's the elevating of things like smoking a fag.

[A]

You're totally right. You've got to kind of create the jeopardy layer. You've got to create the, like. Oh, the badass stuff. Next time I have a house party, should we put the Friends rules on everything? So if I see anybody drunk or smoking one cigarette, I'll be like, caroline, no, no, Carol, you were so. You're out of this, man. We went to the meetings.

[B]

The meetings. We all went to smoking rehab with you. Come on.

[A]

We were happy for you.

[B]

You were free.

[A]

But, yeah, no, it is absolutely insane. And I like this episode as well because there's loads of talk about them being single and they're trying to be like, we're not. We're not going to bring a date to the party. That's it. And essentially they're. They. They want to have a date free New Year's Eve so there's no pressure to kiss. And then they all end up with a date. And then by the end, none of them have a date.

[B]

I think many people have these awakenings when they come back to Friends. Like, for example, realizing how hot Tom Selleck is as Richard Good lord. Good lord. But also realizing that Janice is a babe.

[A]

Yeah, when you watch it, she looks.

[B]

Fucking unbelievable in this episode.

[A]

She looks amazing. And when you're watching it, you're like, ugh, Janice. And then you watch it back as, you know, kind of with a break and with some clarity and you're like, yeah, she, I think they were like, she was supposed to be, you know, not that attractive. I mean, I know she's supposed to.

[B]

Be annoying, which, sure, it's the voice.

[A]

Right, which makes her less attractive, but.

[B]

Like, but she's kind of the most beautiful woman I've ever seen. Yeah, yeah. And she's got these like bee stung lips and this big pile of dark hair. She looks like if Amy Winehouse never found drugs. She does look like that actually. Do you know what? Amy Winehouse is the response that you would have psychologically as a person if anyone was as mean to you as those friends are to Janet. It's like she does nothing wrong. She just has an annoying voice. You live in New York, people have voices.

[A]

She just likes Chandler.

[B]

Her one crime is to like Chandler a lot.

[A]

And, and I also think, and this is kind of where it is all set up of like, she is. I mean, I think the reason the Janice storyline is so good is because everyone's been somebody's Janice and everyone's had a Janice.

[B]

Go on.

[A]

And it's your mates that are like, oh, for fuck's sake. Like, not again.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

And I think you were saying as well that it's not necessarily that they hate Janice, it's that they don't want to have to talk about Chandler leaving Janice again.

[B]

Right. The older you get, the more you're like, okay, there's the bad news. Boyfriend or girlfriend your friend has. But like, and you leave and then we have to talk about you and there's just not that much to talk about. And then I have to be do my concerned face and it's so boring.

[A]

And we know we're gonna slag them off and then you're gonna get back with them in five to six weeks. And so the cycle continues.

[B]

I've had to be that friend for you.

[A]

You have.

[B]

For your jamis.

[A]

You have, you have had to be it for my Janice. If he's listening.

[B]

Hello.

[A]

You know who you are.

[B]

You have your Monica now though, which is the first and last time Joey will ever be compared to that woman. Yeah, Janice has this like very heartbreaking time where he like breaks up with her again at this party and she says one of these Times. Chandler, it's gonna be your last chance with me one of these times. It's gonna be your last chance with me. And of course, at that point no one can know she's gonna appear every season.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

With another chance of Chandler Bing. Another shot at love with Chandler.

[A]

And this is just. This is just the beginning. Yeah.

[B]

The final big question I have for you vis a vis house party etiquette and this specific episode is regarding Fun Bobby, who was a real recurring character in early Friends. And if I can remember correctly, it was always that Fun Bobby was Monica's ex boyfriend, but it was always a reason why he couldn't be fun that day.

[A]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you have this like, you have the character of him in your head without actually ever seeing that character because you're imagining what you've been told he is.

[B]

We've never seen him be fun once.

[A]

Yeah, he can't be like the fun. It has to be imagined levels of fun. Because you probably can't emulate that in a sitcom because you know you'd be having one cigarette.

[B]

Exactly. One cigarette and a cheeky line. But he comes to the party and oh my God, Fun Bobby is here. Yay. And Fun Bobby's grandfather has just died and then he bums everybody out and brings the whole tone of the party down. And that's how Monica loses her kiss at midnight. My question for you is, do you think it is better to go to a house party in a bum out mood and hope that the winds of the party will raise you or do, do you save everybody from your bum out mood by abstaining and staying home?

[A]

My advice would be to have one drink, possibly two, at a nearby pub with a trusted close pal. And if you get the flavour, head on out.

[B]

And that trusted close pal has to be trusted enough that they can be like, you're not well.

[A]

Yes. Go home.

[B]

You know what, mate? Go home.

[A]

This isn't for you tonight.

[B]

Yeah, you're being a bummer. And I say this with great love, you're being a bummer, but also has the chutzpah to go party alone.

[A]

Yeah, exactly. Mine would be Jamie Finn.

[B]

Mine would be Jan Co. Yeah, she'd be great.

[A]

Yes, exactly. And, and that, yeah, that's exactly what you need. That would be my advice to you. Because sometimes a house party like that, especially if you know people and you know it's a sort of a friend group of yours can really, really kind of like flush everything out, brush away the cobwebs and make you feel like, you know what? It's going to be okay. But if you're just a little bit too sad, it's the worst place you can be.

[B]

God.

[A]

Because you can't really be a wallflower like you can in a bar.

[B]

You know what the worst part is? I remember going to one of your parties years ago where I was talking to your friend Sash, and I was not in the good way. I can't remember why. I just. I said. He was like, how you been, man? I haven't seen you in a long time. And I was like, you know what? Pretty depressed, actually. And I thought that I was doing that thing. I thought I was almost like charming my way through my own mental state, but in my head being like, do you know what? If I'm just frank about how I feel, then we can all have a laugh about it. And he just said to me, don't bring that to me. And then just talk to somebody else. And I was like, do you know what? I don't know you well enough to bring that to you.

[A]

Does that sound like a total freak out? Someone's telling me something important.

[B]

No, don't bring that to me.

[A]

Oh, no, you're right.

[B]

We all have to learn about boundaries. And I had to learn that day. Sometimes you have to relearn about boundaries.

[A]

He wouldn't say that now because he does know you. I also think a big faux pas in this episode is Joey's date bringing her kids to a party unasked.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Absolutely not. Never.

[B]

But in the context of that, she met him, he was a Christmas elf. Maybe she just thought that hanging out with kids was a thing.

[A]

She just thought, he loves kids. I can just bring them round to a cool New York 20 somethings house party.

[B]

It's also funny in the sense of, like, I don't think. I mean, that's obviously a crazy situation for a sitcom. I don't think people are really bringing their. Their kids to parties, but there is like a moment where someone in your 20s goes out with someone with a kid and thinks they can just sort of do it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And thinks that, like, their life can just mesh in. And it's like, it can't mesh.

[A]

We can just do the exact same things as before. No, you can't, I'm afraid. But yeah, and I do. Final thing I will say about this episode is I do love the fact that they're watching the TV at midnight because I have been to New Year's parties where, you know, we're in a really cool house with really Cool people and everything. And then it's Jules Holland's hood nanny on. And then the fireworks on the London Eye.

[B]

It's so cute. This is the thing. I think this is a delicate art of a house party of like a mixture of the high and low. An evening gown and telly.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

You know, too much high. It's pretentious event.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And it feels like a CV party. Too low. And it feels like, well, I'm just round your house.

[A]

Absolutely bloody round your hands. Yeah. Tiny little activity 60% of the way into the night, I would say.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Bring everyone around.

[B]

And that activity can be singing someone Happy birthday.

[A]

Yes. Bringing out a cake.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

Yes, good one. Exactly.

[B]

Let's move on. The one with the two parties Season 2 Episode 22 so this is when Rachel's parents have just split up and they, they come to her surprise party and in order to keep the parents apart, they have to separate the party across two flats.

[A]

Yes. I think this is the perfect episode to demonstrate how to have a great house party and how not to. It's a direct comparison because the boys end up having quite, you know, it's not supposed to be in their flat. End up having quite an impromptu, you know, kind of a slightly more laddie, unorganized party with, you know, they're all kind of having a mad dance and they're all a bit pissed. And then Monica's trying so hard for the organized fun. And this is really where we see Monica, you know, become, you know, she's Monica from the start, but as in, like, this is her in a party situation. Being the most Monica you can possibly.

[B]

Be, it is bad. And I love how this whole episode begins with this like, protest from them. Cause they're all in the diner and Monica says, I'll get candles and my mom's lace tablecloth. And seeing as it's Rachel's birthday, I'll poach a salmon. And Ross says, why are our parties always about poaching things? And it's this very like, well observed dynamic of like. Like sometimes your most organized friend is not your most fun friend. But the most organized friend often puts their, like, chips on the organizing and volunteers to do it. But it's like, no, we can't poach things tonight.

[A]

I know. And often what you need is you need the fun friends to come up with the idea and then the organized friend to implement it. But with the chaos of the unorganized friend. So it's a logistical nightmare because oft, you cannot have both. And yeah, and I feel like as well, when I was younger, I didn't really, when I watched this episode, you know, when it was on or whatever, when I was a kid, I didn't really get the. Oh, her parents can't talk to each other. Like, whatever. Why can't everyone just kind of grow up? And now that I've had friends whose parents have split up and like, can't be in the same room together, you know, like, you know, you have like people that are getting married and like both parents won't come to the wedding.

[B]

You just think, really sad.

[A]

Get over yourself. This is so sad that you can't do that. You're an adult. Whatever. And I really empathize with Rachel in this episode now. The fact that, you know, she's the adult now, like, she has to be the one that's, you know, that's keeping them apart and it's. And everybody is like tiptoeing on eggshells, you know, because of the. Because of these two adults that have split up, you know.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And there's a bit where she says, because this is when her and Ross are still going out. And he says, well, who cares? That's just like, let them hash it out. They're grown ups. And she goes, goes, I care. You know?

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And she's like the thing of, like, she's just seen them fight at her sister's graduation. She's like, if I watch them do it again, I'll die. And I've, I've definitely spoken to people who've had that where they're like, they're just one witnessing one more fight or one more awkward conversation with their parents away from like a total mental breakdown. They're like, I would rather uphold a fiction, actually.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Rachel has a moment in this episode where she really seems like she's gonna break down or whatever. And also, can I just say, the actor that plays Rachel's dad.

[B]

Fit.

[A]

Firstly fit.

[B]

We have not been focusing on him as a culture.

[A]

We must find him.

[B]

I'm sure he's dead.

[A]

Possibly, actually. Yeah. But also, whoever played that character, so formidable. I mean, I'm scared watching him.

[B]

He feels like one of the great psychopaths of cinema at the movie. He feels like he could be in.

[A]

Like an Alfred Hitchcock.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, right.

[A]

Some kind of soulless monst.

[B]

Right. There's this bit where like Ross is trying to keep him busy and he sits down next to him in the armchairs in the boys flat and says to him, like, so Dr. Geller how's the cardiovascular game going? Just cause he's a heart surgeon or whatever. And then he turns to Ross and he goes, it's not a game, Ross. A woman died on my table today.

[A]

I would honestly speaking to that man, and I always use this analogy, would be like, when somebody watches you type, you start making mistakes.

[B]

Like, speak. Yes. And Ross, like, David Trimmer is so good at that. In this whole episode you're watching worse.

[A]

Than your average self when you're in front of somebody being like that because you're so overly thinking.

[B]

Someone watching you type is so crass, isn't it?

[A]

Because you know when someone is that, you know, antagonistic and that kind of against you, you start saying stuff where you're like, I don't know the end of the sentence. What am I gonna say? I've panicked. I've gone totally off piste.

[B]

The bit of that episode that never fails to fucking make me laugh is that when. And he's like keeping Dr. Green away from the girl's flat. And so Ross goes into a bedroom to get Dr. Green's glasses, cigarettes and jacket. And on the way out, he gets waylaid by Rachel's mom. And she's like, oh, those look like my husband's things.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Ross is like, no, no, I wear bifocals and I smoke cigarettes. And then he just like has that. And he looks so mental. He looks like Cat Stevens or something.

[A]

I was gonna say he looks like when you put a glasses and a.

[B]

Hat on a dog like that exactly how he looks. Do you know what I mean? The way like that David Schwimmer, like, nominally a handsome man, can make it look so mental that he's smoking a cigarette and wearing glasses. No actor has done it like it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Ever since.

[A]

It is like clowning almost.

[B]

Yeah. And then he just goes out into the hallway and he's wearing them and like that cigarette is so in his mouth, it looks like it has like goo and residue on it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean? And Dr. Green is just there just staring at you.

[A]

Yeah, I just. Oh, everybody's met somebody like that. And obviously it's a, you know, hyperbolized version of it. But you're just. You're in his shoes and you're just like, oh, no, don't fuck it up.

[B]

Like, I know, I know the spinoff that came out of Friends was Joey. But there's another spin off where for whatever reason, Ross and Dr. Green just hate each other.

[A]

Just open some kind of practice together.

[B]

Dinosaurs and heart Medicine, dinosaurs and arts.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because I just love watching them react to each other. And it's great in the later seasons as well, when he comes back and he doesn't tip the waiter and Ross does. It's just electric, those two.

[A]

Yeah, he's absolutely brilliant. I'm gonna look into that actor.

[B]

But then that bit where, like, he's trying to go to the other. It's constant shuttling.

[A]

Oh, it's incredible physical comedy in this episode. Yeah.

[B]

Where the boys, like. He's like. He's like. They keep trying to make excuses to keep him in the thing and they're like, no. He's like, shut up, everyone. I'm doing what I want. Because he just can't be contained. And he marches across the hall and they dance him across the hall.

[A]

Yeah. They're like. Like trying to shout, kind of above.

[B]

Rachel's mum, like, who's literally like a Bob Fosse amoeba. Just like all the legs moving at once.

[A]

It's like when you're trying to get your drunk mate into a club and you're trying to kind of up your drunkenness by, like, two points so that they don't see and surround them so they don't seem like they're off their nut. I am dancing. For anyone listening, it really is.

[B]

It's one of the great house parties of Friends, but it's also one of the greatest episodes of Friends, I think.

[A]

I think so, yeah. It's brilliant. There's so many stuff. There's so much stuff going on and I really like as well. There's a really sad moment, really poignant moment in this episode as well, when Rachel's sort of having it out with her mum about the divorce and, you know, about how they can't be in the same room and all this sort of stuff. And Mrs. Green's says, you didn't marry your berry honey, I married mine. And you're like, oh. It's like one of those things where you're like, oh, my parents are human.

[B]

Awful. Her. I think she actually says that line in a previous episode. Like, a few episodes previous. No, but there's more of that in there. I can understand why you would confuse. Because it's like there's all these bits where Rachel is just sort of zoned out, listening to her parents complain about each other. And it's cutting between the two parents and it's like her mom is like, you work and you work on a marriage and it goes to Dr. Green. You work and you work on a boat. And then it comes to this really lovely moment where it comes to the very end where she is. Rachel's having, like, a complete melter in the. In the corridor with Chandler. And he's just like. Yeah. Like. Cause he's been through it as well. Yeah.

[A]

Cause he's, like the poster boy for it. Yeah.

[B]

And it's like they have very few moments together. I think everyone likes when they're alone together because there's very few reasons for them to be together. Those two. And it's always nice. And he's like. Yeah. Like, it's really horrible. And she's like. She has this very, like, lovely bit about how she's never gonna have a 4th of July again with her parents on the boat.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Where everyone just, like, shuts up and watches the fireworks together. Yes. And he just gives her this big hug. And then Ross comes out and, like, transfers the hug onto her. The way in which your friends can care for you like a spouse would or, like a partner would. It's like those. They're offering the same level of support. It's like.

[A]

Yeah, it's this.

[B]

And they've been through it. It.

[A]

They've been through the same thing as you. Rather than your parent kind of helping you through something. It's like, no, you're my peer here and you've gone through this thing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm kind of like, I am your parent in this scenario because I have been through it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I know what you're feeling. Yeah.

[B]

It's really not. And it's like, there's so much in. I guess I naturally. This miniseries, you keep talking about, like, the nature of friendship. Anyway, it's impossible not to with this. But, like, something really nice about the way the hug transfer happens of Chandler and Rachel to Ross and Rachel and the way he kind of, like, passes her over like a little kitten.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's like. It's like, not. I think there's this perception with friendship and with romantic relationships that the romantic relationship is the thing where you get the ultimate comfort from. But there's this nice thing in this episode where it's like, oh, they're not ranked. Do you know what I mean? There's, like, a level thing of, like, being able to get comfort from all of your friends and your boyfriend in the same way. Which, when you get older and people get married and again, why the premise of this show was fundamentally always going to date, you do disappear more into your heteronormative or whatever. Or your marriages or whatever. Partnership you're in.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you don't get the same solace from friends that you used to emotionally, because often you stop telling them stuff because life gets harder and more embarrassing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And especially has you. You're in slightly different stages. You know, you don't want to tell your friend that's in the throes of this, like, horny, new, amazing relationship that, you know, maybe yours is. Has an issue or something like that.

[B]

Or you don't want to tell your friend who's renting that you're having a problem with your mortgage. Yeah. Or like, when you get older, the comparison. Like, Dolly always refers to the 30s as, like, the comparison generation. Because when people's situations just change, whether it's romantically or where they're living or their jobs or their family, and it becomes this thing where you. You want to protect your. The taste or the kind of comfort level of everyone.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So people just share less.

[A]

I wish I did, in a way.

[B]

I mean, not you people. Yeah.

[A]

I think I've held. Upheld that tradition quite well. But. Yeah, but I do know what you mean. It's completely true. And I also. The. I feel like this. The little bits in this episode, like that Chandler and Rachel bit, have kind of seeped into common parlance because a few weeks ago, my friends Roddy and Rich went for a drink together and then they said, oh, we're out having some sake in some Japanese bar. And my friend Jamie Allison just said, this feels like a Rachel and Chandler episode. What's going on? They never hang out on their own.

[B]

That's so funny.

[A]

So it is that thing, like you say, it's nice to see them have a kind of a serious moment together because they're never really on their own.

[B]

No. And, yeah. Bonding over that little thing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Such a small bit of this episode. It's so good. The bit with Phoebe trying to smuggle people out.

[A]

Oh, that's fantastic.

[B]

So there's like. If you really think of, like, the physical, like, what's. Again, what's achieved in 24 minutes. We said it a minute ago, with the. Everyone swearing they won't get a date, then getting dates, then losing dates by the end of the episode. In this, not only do we have the shuttling back and forth of Rachel's parents, we also have the shuttling back and forth of guests who are nameless.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because Phoebe, she's everybody nameless. She's, like, smuggling them. Like she's smuggling them out of Europe during the war. Yeah.

[A]

And they're like, oh, can I take a drink? And she's like, no, they have everything you need in there. Like, just take. Just take nothing. Take nothing. It's absolutely.

[B]

If you take. Cause she'll get suspicious.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

You and you. But not you, not you.

[A]

Not yet.

[B]

No.

[A]

It's so good. It's absolutely brilliant. And then, you know, Monica kind of goes madder because she finds out. And it's just amazing because you can never tell your friend that's bad or boring at a party that they are.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you just have to do your best you can. Yeah.

[B]

Her little game. We're writing down your most embarrassing moment. And then we never hear about anyone's embarrassing moment because she gives them a lecture on markers.

[A]

And there's a brilliant bit as well where right at the end, Mrs. Green, who kind of thinks she's had a good time because, you know, she's been in this awful marriage for 40 years or whatever, and she's like, oh, she says something like, let me know what poem you make with my 10 words. You just know. You're like, oh, my God. People have come to me because I run a club night and stuff like that. And I, you know, and I hopefully throw a good house party and I run comedy gigs and do comedy gigs and stuff. People often say to me, I've had this idea for a night, or I've had this idea for a party or I've had this idea for whatever, like some kind of event. And they tell me like four things they want to do during the night. And I'm like, like people, you know, But I can't think of it. But what I'm saying is they'll be like. So I thought we could all. You have to show such and such to get in, you know, and then you have to. And then what I thought we'd do is, you know, kind of like emotional charade, charades or whatever. And then I thought we could all get, like, at one point we could all get into groups. And it has to be that you do. I'm like, people don't want an itinerary on a night out. People want, like you say, maybe a little event, a tiny theme. If it's like a book launch or something like, like that. A lovely little five minute speech and a themed cocktail. Absolutely. That's the level that people want. They want a little common ground. They're there anyway. If they're at a party, they probably want to be there. Like, don't interrupt their night with activities that you think are going to make it unique. No one gives a right. And I'm not talking about an activity specific night. I'm talking about any type of party. And that's what like Monica's doing here and that. It's just, you know, you go into the other room and you can just let loose because it's a party.

[B]

Have you ever had a situation where there was like a game like that where it went well, I guess when people invite you around for a murder mystery, it's different because you know what you're doing.

[A]

Oh, that's totally different. And I enjoy those things because I know I'm going round for that. In fact, since I last spoke to you a couple of days ago, I was booked to do a quiz for like a corporate networking, mingling night. It was like a party. Right. And the mistake that everybody makes with stuff like this, when you have comedy at a court. Corporate or, you know, something. Something like a quiz. And a quiz is quite good because you can still kind of chat.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's like, you know, it's kind of informal camaraderie teams. Exactly.

[B]

Funny team names.

[A]

Exactly that. Funny team names. And, you know, I'm a comedian, but I wasn't doing it like completely straight laced or whatever. It's like, it's a. It's a good idea for something where people might not know each other. And it's a bit. Network isn't like that. They did it. The people have been there since five. They put me on to do the quiz at nine. Do you think one person cared or listened to, to anything I had to say? No, because they've been at the thing for four hours and they now don't want to be told to sit down and shut up and listen to somebody else.

[B]

If you're gonna do a thing like that, it has to be early in the night. People are still getting lubed up.

[A]

It has to be the first thing. It has to be the first thing as people are getting a drink, then after it, they've got someone to talk to. Someone they don't know about, about what just happened. The comedy set or the quiz or whatever.

[B]

Or the bit of paper that's been handed.

[A]

Yeah, whatever it is. And the place we met, where we worked the launch night of that, they were like, we're gonna have then a talk here, then a talk here, then a talk there. And I was like, no one will listen. People are stood up, having a drink.

[B]

Do you think they get involved? The instinct is to chat.

[A]

The instinct is to chat. That's why you're there, people haven't seen each other in a while, all that sort of stuff. So yeah, just. And Monica is essentially the corporate quiz at this night. You need minimal structure for a great party.

[B]

It's so funny though.

[A]

You need lots of other things, but you don't need any itinerary.

[B]

And also it's very relatable as well. So to this time of life when it's funny with the friends because some of the friends have jobs and it means nothing to them. Like for example, Phoebe being masseuse means nothing. Chandler's job, no one knows his name.

[A]

Trans monster means nothing.

[B]

It's just sort of like a vague sort of gesture to like, who, what kind of a person they are. But like Monica and her food stuff, her food career is like very intrinsic to the Monica character because it's all caught up with her weight and her eating. It's actually quite bleak in many ways. But like, like it's that point of your life in with your career where you don't essentially have a career yet, but you have all this frustrated ambition. So she's putting all this like frustrated food ambition into her friend's party. Who doesn't care?

[A]

Who doesn't care. Which is why.

[B]

Why Rachel has a birthday flan.

[A]

Is that not the saddest thing you've ever heard in your life?

[B]

I know, it's. But it's so a 25 year old who desperately wants to work in food.

[A]

I know, I know. And at the time I think. Is she working at the diner?

[B]

Yeah. With the big fake tits?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So she's like, I've got no creativity in my actual job. I'm gonna bring it into my life.

[B]

Everyone will appreciate. And they keep referring to it as like a custard based Mexican dish. Which is so funny because like flan. Now we all know what flan is, but do we all know what flan is because of friends? Because of friends?

[A]

Yeah, I wouldn't. I don't think I would know.

[B]

But there's something quite cute about it. Knowing how like how fancy this show ends up getting. Like that in the kind of credit scene in this whole episode is just the credits playing over the flan with like, happy birthday, Rachel. And then like a volleyball hits it.

[A]

It's really stylistic at the end, isn't it? Yeah, it is.

[B]

But also kind of quaint and shitty, you know, like that's exactly how a birthday plan would look in someone's apartment. Yeah.

[A]

Because how many times have you brought out a birthday cake and somebody has one Slice on the night, maybe two. And then it just sits there, withering, withering, withering with the candles on like a 45 degree angle.

[B]

God. I remember when you and I used to work together and there was like a clutch of birthdays. All, every woman we worked with was the same star sign for some reason. A few weeks where it was just Collins every day. I still can't eat Colin. The caterpillars.

[A]

I can't, I can't. I actually think I've got an aversion to it now.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

I'm immediately transported to having to set an alarm in the morning to get up for a job I didn't want to do.

[B]

I can't even eat one of those boots without wanting to gag boots. The next one we have is season three, episode 11, the one where Chandler Can't Remember Witch Sister.

[A]

Now in terms of actual parties in Friends, I think this is not only one of my favorites because they do actually get, you know, Chandler gets really drunk. I think it's the most British because it's quite diy. It seems kind of, it's kind of yucky.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's just like a sort of like icky house party with a big drinks table.

[B]

Yeah. Arranged by boys.

[A]

Yes, exactly. Yeah, yeah. It's your mates that have quickly gone, oh, it's Joey's birthday, we're gonna throw him a party.

[B]

And.

[A]

Yeah, and it's, you know, and Chandler has the fear the next day about the fact that he can't remember which sister he again. Maybe it's sitcom thing. Fooled around with.

[B]

Fooled around.

[A]

What does it mean?

[B]

Did you finger her?

[A]

It must mean fingered. But you're right, all that sort of stuff. And he says like I fooled around. I also, I don't think you see people getting the fear after a night out in the sitcom a lot.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

And so I really like it.

[B]

So for Americans, what is the fear?

[A]

The fear is.

[B]

Liliana wrote a song about it.

[A]

Yes, she did. The fear is when you wake up. Do you know what the worst type of fear is? You wake up after a big night and you, your memory hasn't really caught up with you yet. So just like, oh, what a night. And then what happens is like you start to realize you don't remember some of the night.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then the worst thing in the world is sometimes I've. This happened to me a couple of times. You get a text from someone you didn't even realize was on the night out saying, saying, how are you feeling today? And then the Fear sets in.

[B]

That's terrible.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And then you realize that you were, like, out of control, you know, what you said. So you just, you're just panicked that I don't have the thing of like, oh, everybody hates me. Which I think is what most people say. But I think I have the panic of like, oh, God, I said some weird stuff and people are going to be talking about it today.

[B]

I said some weird stuff would be a big one. Yeah. Because for me, I rarely don't remember something. Like, I'm generally compensated. I get giddy, I get excited, I get silly, and I say mental.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And I love saying mental. I will never stop.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I will also never stop getting the fear about it.

[A]

And I also think, though, that 99 times out of a hundred, people love it. The fear is unwarranted.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because also whenever I've seen anyone else in a situation where they've been way more drunk than everybody else, nine times out of 10, like, they're, they're fine. And you're, you're, you're laughing at them and it's silly, but you're not laughing like, oh, I don't like that person, or they're an idiot or whatever. You're just like, yeah, Steve's had a few. Do you know what I mean? Like, he's having the time of his life.

[B]

I actually can't even talk about the fear for too long without remembering times I've had the fear. And then I get the kind of hormonal drag of having the fear again. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[A]

It's horrible.

[B]

Just remembered one time.

[A]

Yeah, it's absolute worst. And you're texting around everyone being like, was that all right last night? But yeah, Chandler has this. When he walked in, it's kind of like the. One of the best things I like about house party as well is the, Is the post match day analysis. You know, like, there's a lot of.

[B]

Post match day analysis in this one.

[A]

Yeah. There's a. I love about dissecting the house party and the tribes that formed and who became friends with who and all that sort of stuff and who, you know, snogged who or whatever. And I think that they're doing that a lot in this and they're trying to help him. You know, they realize their friend's fucked up and he's like, oh, my God, I've got to try and remember which sister. And they're all kind of. There's like a great camaraderie in the delirium. After the party and Chandler's like, you know in that place that we've all been where he's panicking and. Yeah, it's brilliant. I think I love this one.

[B]

I love looking at that drink table so much because again it's such a English or Irish. It's a Western European drinks table because it's a lot of like 2 liter bottles of mixer with the cap off. Yeah.

[A]

And like room temperature.

[B]

Room temperature. And just like the trestle table is like sticky and I don't think there's.

[A]

Even a cover on it or whatever.

[B]

No, there's no cover on it. I do think that boy apartment is one of the best observed spaces.

[A]

Oh yeah.

[B]

If you look around that flat, everything. Nothing matches anything else. It all looks like shit they found on.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And it probably. I mean, I mean it's not because it's an LA set but you know what I mean? Like just living in New York, that's what you would find. Like a random, random tribal mask in there for no reason.

[A]

Yeah. The set designer of that. Because the girls apartment is nice and lovely but the boys apartment is so.

[B]

Boyish and the older you get the shitter it looks as well. It's so brown and beige and yellow.

[A]

And I would say that in fact I was doing an interview earlier today and I walked past my friend's. It was called Ladies Pad. A friend's house that three boys I know used to live in. Shout Out Hubert, Jamie and Rich. And it was the worst flat I've ever been in in my life. It was a new build. The actual flat was nice.

[B]

They just.

[A]

They had like a camping chair in the front room. It was just a nightmare. I was like, guys, you could.

[B]

And like one.

[A]

One bit of art on the walls like that was in the wrong frame. And I was honestly. It was so bleak. So, you know there's a lot of.

[B]

Panic in this episode about friends getting off with your siblings.

[A]

Yeah, I think it's. It is always a weird thing. My sister has been with her boyfriend for like a million years. So I've never had it. And I don't think she's ever had it the other way around. But I can't imagine that I would be that bothered unless it was someone really horrible. But in terms of your friends.

[B]

I've had it happen a few times. That's just what happens when you have a brother who's close in age. Age. But like. And to be honest, it's kind of whatever. Like I guess it's different when it's a Older brother and a younger sister. This is more of a protective vibe there. But I. Because me and my brother are so close in age. I remember when he used to have house parties when our parents were away because he was cool and I was not. And he used to invite loads of girls around. And some of those girls, because I'm only the school year below him, would be from my class. And I would literally be upstairs alone in my room trying to fucking play Everybody Hurts on acoustic guitar. And these girls from my class would come up to the stairs and be like in their tarsy clothes or whatever and be like, hey.

[A]

Oh, that is a nightmare. That is a living nightmare. I would hate that.

[B]

It was, in a word, character building.

[A]

Yes. Oh, my God. Now I know I'm so successful because.

[B]

I have such an axe to grind with so many people.

[A]

To be fair, when my sister got with my brother in law, now he's in my school year. He wasn't in my school, but he was in my school year. And a lot of my friends knew him. And my sister had. She was like the cat that got the cream when she first got him because he's four years older.

[B]

Oh my God.

[A]

Than my sister. And my sister was always like, oh, do you know so and so. And I was like, yes, Charlotte. Like I've known them for ages. And she was like, oh, right.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Well, I was out with him at the weekend and it was very like.

[B]

Oh, my God, Charlotte. She was a bitch.

[A]

Yeah, she was rubbing it in my face. But it worked out.

[B]

So.

[A]

Yeah, but it's very. It's very like, you know, Italian Catholic.

[B]

Right. Cause this is the only time that we go, we see the whole Tribbiani family.

[A]

Yeah. And there's a brilliant bit as well. You mentioned the other day when we were talking about this, about Joey's grandma. He's saying like that she's really formidable.

[B]

She's the sixth person to have spit on Mussolini's corpse. So brilliant. There's so many good bits, which is incredible. Good bit. There's another line. I think it's from this episode, maybe the previous one, we're talking about where Joey comes up to Chandler in the middle of the party and he says, hey, I have a question for you about volleyball. How much do you like that gray lamp in your room? It's like just such beautiful joke writing.

[A]

It's incredible, isn't it? But yeah. And I think. I think there. And there is also a little bit of that 90s overprotective. You touched my property. Which means Like a female family member. But, you know, it was 1995 or whatever when it came out, so it is. Yeah. It's great the way it all sort of plays out. And Chandler kind of tries to rectify it and then snogs another sister, doesn't he? Yeah. I just think it's great. I think it's a really sloppy. It feels impromptu. A house party.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That kind of something mad happens at. And, you know, someone gets way too drunk.

[B]

There's Jello shots.

[A]

There's Jello shots. And they. Yeah. The most American thing ever. And they're, like bright blue, I think.

[B]

Yeah. And they look like they're in sort of ketchup dishes.

[A]

Yes, they do.

[B]

They're almost in ramekins or something.

[A]

You get, like a burger restaurant. Yeah. And Gunther is there, obviously.

[B]

Gunther gets an invite to every party. Yeah.

[A]

It's because it's the only, like, sort of extra person that's in France.

[B]

But that's kind of crazy when you think about. Yeah.

[A]

There's no, like, you know, you got Mr. Heckles in, like, series one.

[B]

There are very few, like, reoccurring characters. Really?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

There's like the Super Trigger. Yeah.

[A]

Trigger. Yeah.

[B]

Mr. Heckles. He dies. Gunther. And a lot of people are kind of two or three episode wonders. Yeah. Do you know what I mean?

[A]

I mean, even David, who, you know, maybe gets within the New Year's party one. We're supposed to believe that he's like, this great love.

[B]

The love of her life.

[A]

I think just because they kind of forgot to give her, like. Like a romantic storyline.

[B]

Do you know what just occurred to me, literally in the shower today?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you remember when Phoebe went out with a cop for a while?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

For what felt like ages.

[A]

Yeah. And then they were gonna move in, and then he shot a bird. He shot a bird.

[B]

Yeah. Such a funny way to close out a romance.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Shot a bird.

[A]

Brilliant, though, if they were like, well, we're not gonna make this guy a proper thing, so we need to get rid of him fast. But, like, it's been a really good relationship. So what would be the worst thing for this character to do? You know what I mean? Yeah. So she has, like, little relationships, but there's no kind of. You know, Ross and Rachel are this. And then, like, you know, once she.

[B]

Gets with Mike, that's kind of it, then. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. And I think they were like, oh, we'll bring David back as if he's some great love. And I think the plan was probably to ham that up and make David the one. But I think Paul Rudd was just so unbelievably attractive and, like, and, you know, handsome, and everyone loved him that they were like, oh, now we're gonna make it Paul Rudd.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Like, I think they thought that the audience would think it was more of a harder choice than we thought.

[A]

And nobody did.

[B]

Listen, we love Hank's. But it's Paul Rudd.

[A]

Yeah, it's Paul Rudd. Yeah. Without a doubt. Yeah.

[B]

So jammy there.

[A]

Like, just imagine being Jennifer Ryson.

[B]

Must have been livid. I know. I've been kissing Ross.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I've been kissing David Schwimmer for 10 years. Kudrow was snug. And Rod. Yeah, you'd be livid.

[A]

Do you reckon they said to Lisa Kudrow, who do you want your, like, final love to be?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

She was like, can we get Paul Rudd?

[B]

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Additional terms supply.

[B]

Hi, it's Paige Desorbo from Giggly Squad. You ever stand in front of your closet and just say, I have nothing to wear while you're literally surrounded by clothes because same. So I started listing pieces. I'm over on Depop and honestly, it's been amazing. You can sell what you're done with and someone out there will love it. And the best part about it is there's no seller fee, so the money you make actually stays in your pocket, which feels very chic. It's also insanely easy. I listed something while watching TV and it sold before the episode even ended. So download the Depop app and list your first item today because your old outfit could be someone else's new favorite. Depop where taste recognizes taste. Payment processing fees, boosting fees still apply. For more info, visit depop.com. Okay, so we've. We're kind of halfway through the sort of party going time. We're at the end of season three. We started strong with our New Year's party. It's like lots of 20 somethings trying to be fancier than they are. Very relatable. Then we're kind of like plateau kind of spiking with the sort of manic energy of like the. The two parties and the. The sister and all that. The kind of madness. And now we're gonna talk about the sort of downslide moment that you mentioned at the top of the podcast, which is that strange moment in your late 20s. 20s when you decide you're 50. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. And you think that kind of having fun is a marker of immaturity and juvenility. Is that a word? And yet. But you're not. Like, you're sort of trying to be something that you're not. And it makes for a shit fucking party.

[B]

And this is a shit fucking party. Yeah, it's one of a few shit fucking parties around this time. But the episode is called the one where Rachel smokes, which we mentioned already, where Rachel does lines of cocaine. And the main thing about this party is that it's Monica takes over. No surprise. And her and Phoebe were supposed to plan out together, but Phoebe can only be in charge of cups and eyes. Yeah, the cups and ice is funny. Like it's funny to watch. But in terms of. You watch the vibe of the party, people are standing around to reggae music and like this is where for all the party episodes from here on out. Out tend to. There's no mayhem. There's just people standing in groups and often people saying that they're having a bad time.

[A]

Yeah. And I think, I mean, maybe they didn't do it on purpose, but maybe it is a comment on that thing where you. You're trying to be something that you're not. And therefore it's just. You think that being boring is being sophisticated.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you think that all this drama and, you know, somebody getting too drunk and everything is, oh, that's beneath you. And it's like, no, that's why you have a party.

[B]

This is where we downshift into cv part parties.

[A]

It is a CV party again.

[B]

It's a comparison generation where a comparison era of one's life where. Where the horses are beginning to separate in the race or whatever. People are getting fancy jobs and they're not getting fancy jobs. And so see, parties become worse because they are about comparing your cv.

[A]

Yeah. And you long for the time in the future, which will happen in three to four business years where people.

[B]

Where like people. People move away.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then. And then I remember you saying this to me. I can't remember. Maybe it was on A podcast or maybe it was on a show, but you were like in your 30s. The dance purists emerge. And it's so true.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because the people who like, still want to go out and really like tear up a dance floor and be a bit silly and mad or whatever are kind of left. All the dancing poseurs have gone.

[A]

And the people that. Yeah, the people that are performatively boring, where they're like, oh, I just can't even have two drinks anymore. All right, well, why don't you just go and die? Do you know what I mean? Like, people that are kind of trying to show off to you about how they, how they don't have fun anymore. And you think, what is your aim here? Because I don't. I would go and go and not have fun somewhere else. And I think they eventually, yeah, they all like, you know, like, you're so.

[B]

Funny and merciless when it comes to people who don't want to do what you want to do.

[A]

It's not that.

[B]

It's not that I love it. I don't want you ever to change. Okay. Yeah.

[A]

I do genuinely think. Do whatever makes you happy. And for some people that are staying in every night and go for it. But it's almost the people that are trying to persuade themselves that they're not. They're not as fun anymore. That's what does my head. I've got mates that genuinely. They are just like. They're a cat. They're all a sofa in pajamas 340 nights of the year.

[B]

Yeah. And they love it.

[A]

Crack on.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I go around to theirs when I want to do that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And also what's nice about those friends as well is they want to hear about the gossipling at the party.

[A]

Absolutely. Because they've got no desire to be there. They're not trying. But it's the people that, I think they're trying to persuade themselves of something.

[B]

You get this very often with reformed party girls where particularly like the kind of women who did a bunch of drugs in the 90s, had sex with famous people, lived it all, wore the tiny outfit and then they come through the tunnel of that and because they're sort of. They weren't really able to find. They. They're not all addicts, but they are. They find it hard to have a relationship with moderation. And so they just sort of disappear into wealthy marriages where they then become mummy at full time mummy again. Nothing wrong with it. But they. The way they talk about their past is if they were a Kind of a reptilian creature and anyone still a laugh is a reptile.

[A]

That's exactly it. And that's what I don't like, because I think, as in, you know, if that's genuinely what they want to do, then that is absolutely fine.

[B]

Nobody wants to have a combative relationship with fun. I'm going to put that out there. Nobody does.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

And if you are performing that there is something rotten in the state of.

[A]

Denmark, there's something wrong. That's exactly what I'm getting at. It's the gap between what you say you like and what you actually like that people can see through a mile off. That's what I can't. By the way, I hate the word inauthenticity because I feel like wellness cunts have just co opted that. But like, it's the inauthenticness of the people that pretend that they suddenly want this life of like 2.4 children and a white picket fence and I want to live in some godforsaken town where there's one pub and then all they do is complain about it while saying like, oh, no, but no, I needed to do that. And then lo and behold, seven years later, without a doubt, some, some bomb goes off in their life. Whether it's like a divorce or they do, or they, they want a new partner or they're like, I need to move back to zone one immediately. Like, or do something because you can't, because you're essentially. You've kept yourself in this box for so long. Yeah, that isn't you. Whereas actually what you needed to do was just like, take it down. Take the vat off.

[B]

Like, you know, this is a phrase that you've introduced me to this week. Take the vat off. Just take the vat off.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Basically, like, whatever you're doing, do less. Take 20 off.

[A]

Take 20% off and you would have been fine and you could still have.

[B]

Fun without doing take the vat off.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And obviously, like, it is different if you're an actor saying, yeah, but that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about people who, you know, suddenly they're like, oh, you know, oh, this is Henry and I've married him. And you're like, what?

[B]

No, this is Henry and I've married him.

[A]

No, you haven't.

[B]

Where? What?

[A]

And yeah, that's, that's what I can't understand. But I think essentially to bring it back to the episode, I think that's who Monica is being in this episode. Episode. She's like trying to be this adult thing. And this is how adults have parties and this is how adults have fun.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Tuscan finger food.

[A]

Yeah, exactly.

[B]

Off.

[A]

Get a prawn ring from Iceland and enjoy yourself.

[B]

You have the prawn ring.

[A]

I love a prawn ring.

[B]

It's a symbolic thing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Also, something very interesting about this episode is that Rachel comes in and she's like, oh my God, Wow, surprise. Because it's a month early. And she goes, guys, Chandler's birthday is before mine.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And everyone's just like, oh, some people are going to have a big birthday party thrown for them. And some people aren't. And that is indicative of life, I think. Do you know what I mean?

[B]

It's really tough, that one.

[A]

That's an allegory, I think, as well. Because the thing is, as well, Chandler is, I would say, a really main friend. He's like a big.

[B]

They're all a main friend.

[A]

I know, but what I mean is.

[B]

Like, he's the center of love. Interpersonal drama.

[A]

Yes. And he's literally in one of the two main flats. You know, like Phoebe and Ross are coming kind of.

[B]

I always think tertiary friends. Yeah. Slightly out of it because, well, they were holding parties. We haven't even talked about the party that Ross throws for his. In his building. Oh, God, yes. Because we've just been focusing on the two main flats. But the party where he just moves into Ugly Naked Guy's flat. He is expected to give money to the retiring of the caretaker, the janitor or whatever. He's like, I've just moved in. I don't know this caretaker. I shouldn't have to give $200 to him.

[A]

Which. I'm sorry, I was agreeing.

[B]

Principles. My principles. Yeah.

[A]

$200. If it was $20, I'd be like, yeah, sure, I've just moved in. 200.

[B]

$200 for a guy I've never met.

[A]

I was on. I was on board with the roster.

[B]

I was on board with roster.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

But then it just spirals out of control and he throws a party and then someone. And then his. Your man's retirement party is the same day.

[A]

Yeah, it just completely goes off piece.

[B]

Like, I also, it's not a real house party episode because the house party doesn't really happen. I mean, there is a house party. It just happens on another floor and it look massive race and it looks great. Yeah.

[A]

That pilot would be in top three.

[B]

I think, Howard, if we saw any of it.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, Howard.

[B]

The.

[A]

You know, wherever it is, the super. Yeah, yeah, I totally forgot about that one.

[B]

Gosh.

[A]

Yeah. But what was it? Yeah. So sorry. Chandler. Them forgetting his birthday. It's so funny because he is, like, such a. You know, he lives with Joey. He's in the kind of main physical, you know, the main logistical two flats where a lot of the storylines happen, and yet sometimes there are these digs kind of thrown at him.

[B]

Yeah. That no one really likes it.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Which is so weird. I think we've talked about this elsewhere, but, like, this idea that, like, I think most people have this relationship with Chandler when they're young, being like, God, I wish I was that funny guy. Would be so amazing to be that funny. I wish I was his friend. I wish I was his girlfriend.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And then as you get older, you be like, I would not be friends with that man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I would not make it through a conversation with that man.

[A]

What?

[B]

It would.

[A]

I would like to be a work friend of him.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But just the constant zinging.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

It's so strange how the older you get, the less and less you value that in a person.

[A]

I know. And we both were talking about this the other day, that actually, you really like Joey as you.

[B]

Yeah. Every episode we've done on this podcast so far, everyone's been like, I really love Joey this time Rush.

[A]

You're like, you're solid, kind of fit mate that you probably would sleep with.

[B]

Yeah. And it's just, like, easy to be around.

[A]

Yeah. Just nice, like, good, solid, solid, stupid.

[B]

Bit of a laugh. Relaxed.

[A]

Yeah. Never gonna have men's mental health.

[B]

He will never have men's mental health.

[A]

He's always your mate that you call. Do you want to go for a beer? Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Lovely. Stunning.

[B]

This is something I've been talking about a lot with Gavin, with watching the Traders, is that I'm so obsessed with that guy Joe, the rugby guy.

[A]

Oh, I've seen.

[B]

Sorry, you haven't been watching it? You don't watch it.

[A]

I'm the only one in the uk, But. But I have seen. Seen a lot of stuff about him. People don't like him, do they?

[B]

I love him. I think I love him because. And this is where it's relevant. I. My favorite genre of man is the thoughtful meatball.

[A]

You've been investing in thoughtful meatballs since 2014.

[B]

Oh, I have.

[A]

On your story.

[B]

I have a vested interest in Thoughtful Meatball Incorporated. The thing about. Okay, we've just gone through the era of the ratball. Probably a recession indicator, and the Idea that, like all these guys, like Miles Teller and Jeremy Allen White and these kind of like.

[A]

Can I just say very quickly. Jeremy Allen White was on Graham Norton with the personality of a fucking plant.

[B]

He doesn't seem fun.

[A]

God, he seems like a boar.

[B]

Anyway, these boys with interesting faces and sort of spindly bodies who. He's not spindly, but you know what I mean? Like, just sort of like sinewy, pretty and unusual and like, what is he thinking? And like, they've never been my judge personally, because my personal experience with men like this often tends to be. They've grown up being called gay.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And that has made that by. By unthoughtful meatballs. Thoughtless meatballs. So they. They've grown up with a chip on their shoulder. They think that girls don't like them and they think that other men think they're gay. And so they are passive aggressive to women and they suck up to other men. They are. It can often be cowardly. I'm not saying that this is a blanket thing. No, no, no. I'm just saying lots of men who discover through the rat phase that they're apparently high. Yes. Have a kind of a toxic vibe. And this is where it comes from.

[A]

Had a kind of a not hot at school, got hot after school kind of rage. Bitterness. Yeah.

[B]

Bitterness and rage. Yeah. Now they're cleaning up on the apps. And they want to punish everybody.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

They want to punish everybody. Yes.

[A]

That is. I think that's a fair assessment.

[B]

Bring in the thoughtful meatball. The thing about thoughtful meatball is that a real thoughtful Meatball has been 6 foot since he was 12. He's been shaving since he was 9, and he has a pituitary gland that has been working overdrive since the day he was born. And so he's probably been brought up by people who are like. The thing is, is that our child scans as a man and we must treat him to tread gently through this treacherous world because women will fear his murderous bulk.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

So we must treat him to. We must teach him to speak softly to women and open the door and be a gentleman because otherwise people will find him scary and weird.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, I do know what you mean. I think those guys overcompensate for the fact that find them physically imposing and therefore think they're going to be like, kind of macho or Tess.

[B]

And they're often very gentle and very thoughtful.

[A]

Yes, yes. And I bet they hug like a dream.

[B]

You can just lose yourself in there.

[A]

Gavin O. Day's hugs.

[B]

He's a thoughtful meatball. All right.

[A]

He is thoughtful meatball. I hope you play like nice lift music as you do that pitch. It's like. And here enters the thoughtful meatball. The thoughtful meatball is. Has been scanning as a man since 12. Reach out to your thoughtful meatball today.

[B]

Check in on your thoughtful meatball. I've always loved a thoughtful meatball man. And I just think something about that Joe guy is really. I'm like, it's the age of the thoughtful meatball. Fair play.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Also, Travis Kelce is a thoughtful meatball. I'm not sexually attracted to Travis Kelce, but I enjoy a thoughtful meatball.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Why not?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Cuz he's smart enough to know how dumb he is and he knows what side his bread is buttered on. Whereas rat boys always think they can do better.

[A]

Yes. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

They want to test the limits of how far this rat attractiveness will take them.

[A]

I do think Joey's a rat boy. My boyfriend. But I think he's like a.

[B]

He's a rat man.

[A]

Like a happy snake.

[B]

He's such a happy snake. Yeah, yeah.

[A]

Thoughtful meatball and happy snake.

[B]

We gotta move on. All right. The One with the Halloween Party Season 8 Episode 6 that's where Ross Comes as Sputnik or Spudnick.

[A]

Yes. I think this is a classic. It's come full circle. Cause it's quite a good party and they're a bit older, you know, even just me picturing it now, I feel like there's kind of quite nice food and drinks about. It's like, you know, everyone's kind of looking like Monica looks really glam again as like she's in like a cat lady.

[B]

Cat lady. Yeah.

[A]

And I think and as well, you know, this is when it's come full circle and some people have had, you know, that relationship where they're pretending to be grown up too soon and stuff like that. Like Ross brings Mona. So it's like a date scenario. Phoebe is single. She falls in love with Ursula's fiance, played by Sean Penn.

[B]

Sean Penn. Academy Award nominee, I'm sure.

[A]

Yeah. So there's like, there's drama going. Not drama, but you know what I mean? There's like, there's romantic excitement going on. On. Even though like Chandler and Monica I think are like married by this point and you know, all that sort of stuff. So there's like, there's like stability and then you know, people that are in there kind of at this, by this point like mid-30s or whatever.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Still dating and kind of Doing this. You know, this dance. Yeah.

[B]

I think it's their kind of first relationships. The first major marriages or whatever. Like, Ross has been divorced three times. Jesus. Things have broken. Like, people have been humbled by life. Enough to just be.

[A]

Absolutely.

[B]

Yeah. Enough to wear a spud costume.

[A]

Yeah. The pretense from everybody is sort of worn off a bit. It's actually just like. No, let's just have fun.

[B]

Do you know who I don't get in this episode?

[A]

Go on.

[B]

Chandler.

[A]

He's the bunny.

[B]

He's wearing a pink bunny outfit. And he, like, just looks really unhappy. And it's like, oh, it's so stupid and embarrassing. You're in a pink bunny. It's like. It's a costume party. It doesn't really work.

[A]

Yeah. It's really strange. And I don't. He looks like a mascot that, you know, is for a football team or something like that. That's like. His thing is to be, like, grumpy that. That he's doing this job. He, like, lost a big job and now he's like a mascot. You know what I mean? He's like. He's fallen from grace. Yeah. And he's kind of like. You're right.

[B]

It's weird.

[A]

It's weird.

[B]

Yeah. Ross's costume. Great. Yeah.

[A]

All of the rest of them, I think, are pretty good.

[B]

Have you ever gotten the ick with someone over their Halloween costume?

[A]

That is a great question.

[B]

It's a question you only ever ask someone if you have an answer. Ready to go?

[A]

Oh, go on. I was gonna say. Cause I don't. Not off the top of my head. I don't think I have.

[B]

But, you know, remember when me and Gav. Early doors were still going out together. We still were keeping things office.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And we had a annual Christmas party. And the Christmas party was always costume. Yeah. And he wanted to go. He went as the Ghost of Christmas Present. But he was a ghost who was dressed as a Christmas present. So he was in a big cardboard box that looked like a gift. And I was like, this is the unfittest thing I have ever seen in my life. Just like being with a man who is, like. Got a huge prop.

[A]

A big box.

[B]

A big box.

[A]

Yeah. Oh, no.

[B]

I remember. I was just like, I think I gotta break up with you.

[A]

That would give me the ick as well. Actually, I don't. I haven't had it yet, but maybe it's coming. Yeah. Not that I can think of. I used to love whenever I was going out with someone at uni or something. Like that. I used to love dressing them up in drag. Not in a sexy way. I was just fascinated to see what they would look like. Yeah, but, yeah, the big present. No, absolutely not.

[B]

It was that. It was like a big. It was so big. And it was like a big prop that was always around. And then when the prop was off, the outfit made even less sense. Yeah.

[A]

And it's just like, they just look like morph because they're just in, like, tight clothes. Yeah, yeah. I love that. In this episode, Joey is dressed as Chandler.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

He's like, I'm Chandler.

[A]

And everyone's just like, oh, yeah. Okay.

[B]

It's so fun.

[A]

And also the fact that Ross and Chandler have an arm wrestle in this episode.

[B]

Oh, yeah. And they're both equally as strong or equally as weak.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And again, there's just that natural assumption that, like, Joey is, like, the coolest and the most masculine and the strongest. And, like, even Chandler's wife, like, Monica's just like, you're the strongest, apart from Joey.

[B]

I love when they look to Joey for masculine concerns.

[A]

I love that. I love this. In fact, there's a great bit in the one, I think, where Chandler pulls Joey's sister. It's one of my favorite lines of all time. And I use it, I would say, so much in life where it's the first episode that Rachel meets Mark.

[B]

Oh, yes.

[A]

And Ross is jealous and he's just at the party. And Joey's, like, not even in the same conversation as him. And Rachel's like, how dare you suggest that this man would only be nice to me because he wants to get me into bed or whatever. And then Ross just turns around to Joey and goes, hey, Joey, are men ever nice to strange women just to be nice? And he goes, no, only for sex. And he's like, thank you. And I'm like, that is such a brilliant piece of, like, anthropological study.

[B]

It's so good. And also what I like about that as well is that you get this B side from Monica being like, does that mean he gets to. Yeah.

[A]

Which is completely true. Which is the other half of that.

[B]

The other half of that. Which men do not want to hear.

[A]

Yeah, no, they don't. But, you know, it's so just brilliant. Like, Joey is like your mate that you would call in a breakup when you're ready to be told the truth. And there's. There's a bit in another where the one where they all turn 30, which there's a house party in, where Monica gets drunk, where Phoebe actually realizes she's 31.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And she's like, oh, my God, I've lost a year. I haven't done any of the stuff I was going to do by the time I'm 31. I haven't had the perfect kiss. I haven't met a Portuguese person. And then, like, Joey, she goes, like, sort of walks us, walks home because she's sad. And then he just, like, follows her and says, hey, Phoebs. Turns around, gives her, like, the perfect kiss and says, and hey, I'm 116 Portuguese. And you're like, that is the man you need in your life, like, as a friend. Do you know what I mean? Cause there's always a slight flirtation between Joey and Phoebe that's never realized, which is great.

[B]

How it should be. Yeah.

[A]

Which is exactly how it should be. So, yeah, I think there is a case for Joey being the best friends character.

[B]

I was listening to an interview with Matt LeBlanc earlier today, and he talked about how he was worried he would get written out of the show because. Because in the early seasons, it was always just him trying to see one of them naked or trying to get with one of the girls or whatever. And he was like, as soon as he sleeps with one of them, which inevitably he will, there'll be no dramatic sort of steam left in this engine kind of thing. So he kind of made it. He was like, saying to the writers and the creators a lot, like, no, he's their brother. He sleeps with everyone in New York except for them.

[A]

Except for them. Yeah.

[B]

And he never does.

[A]

No. No. Not even Rachel when they tried that weird storyline.

[B]

Thank God he talked about that as well. He was like, everyone hated that. Every member of the cast hated it. We all hated it, really. Apparently, one of the creators, David Crane, he was like, it's like playing with fire. It's dangerous and we shouldn't do it. But once we've stopped, it'll be very exciting that we did it at all.

[A]

Yeah, it was. I hated every minute of it. It was like watching your. It's like kissing your sister. I mean, it was like that.

[B]

Yeah. So it's interesting as well. Like, you can really, really feel as the. You know, no sitcom should run for 10 years, really.

[A]

Yeah. I would die on that hill.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. As I was watching the later episodes yesterday, so many of the plot lines come from characters having dreams. And that is, like, the first. Like, there's a whole episode where Phoebe's mad at Ross and she can't remember why. And then it Turns out it was a dream. The reason that, like, Rachel wants to kiss Joey is because she had a dream. Like, there's a load of dreams. That is the first lesson of, like, creative writing is like, don't make anything be come. Come about because of a dream or be solved because of a dream.

[A]

No, no, it's. It was totally farcical and not in the same way that we're talking about the physicality and stuff in the early ones. By the end, I just. I didn't actually enjoy it. I was just kind of watching it because I felt like I wanted to ac what actually happened to them and follow the whole thing. And, you know, you. You're invested by that point and you feel like you can't really. Really.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Abandon it. But at the same time, I never re. Watch anything from, like, I'm kind of.

[B]

Like, sort of enjoying. They are not as fun because, again, they're not about what the show is about. Which is about the part of your life where your friends are your family.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Once you start pairing off people that those people become each other's family and people split into subgroups and it's just not as effervescent in the same way. But, like, I'm interested watching it back now as like someone in their 30s with a flat or whatever. And like, you can see Ross's thing and be like, have a really, like, yeah, he should stick to his principles or whatever.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I've seen this.

[B]

He should not tip somebody he's never met.

[A]

100%.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I remember even at the time, like, no, I've on Ross's side of them being like, oh, am I stingy or whatever. No, definitely not.

[B]

Yeah. So it's fun, like, looking back on it from that perspective.

[A]

Yeah. One that I wanted to bring up feels very personal to me because I feel like I have been. Rachel in this one. Is the One with the Fake Party.

[B]

Season five where Emily is going away.

[A]

Emily has been there for, you know, 10 days or whatever and her and Ross have had this whirlwind romance. Rachel really fancies Joshua, her client, but he's kind of leaving. He's almost done. So she has to try and find a way to kind of, like, move things along and kiss him. And so she creates this entire, like, going away party for Emily. And. And it's just. It's a brilliant episode, actually because you see Rachel, who traditionally is the cool girl, you know, she was the cool one at school. Monica was always the, you know, the uncool friend or whatever. Rachel loses all of her authority, all of her cool in this. And I feel like there's so many times where I've orchestrated a situation for a group of all of us just so that I can try and pull somebody 99% of the time unsuccessfully. Because if you try that hard.

[B]

Yeah, it's the turn of the X song only through this party for you.

[A]

Yeah, it's. Oh, I've metaphorically and literally done that.

[B]

I love how diplomatized Rachel gets by Joshua in general.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like he becomes her reason for living. And she just like, she puts on the cheerleader outfit and then she does a cartwheel and busts her lip up.

[A]

And there's the whole thing throughout the whole episode of the boys telling her to take off her bra under her top because they saw it in Flashdance and it's just like this cultural touchstone that they're all like wanking over the whole, the whole episode. And I just. They also. They play Spin the Bottle and I was thinking the other day, I was like, I bet if you were. I bet if you were pissed and you not, not full on, like tongue snogging.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I was like, I bet if you were, you know, if you needed a jolt in your like, friendship group or in a party or something like that, and you played Spin the Bottle as an adult, it'd be a laugh.

[B]

Here's the thing. I was thinking about this, that like, I think culturally the time for adults to play like Spin the Bottle ended in, I would say, 2017. I'll tell you why. First of all, Brexit. No, because I feel like there is now such a. Certainly urban dwelling people are so now over familiar with the language of non monogamy and threesomes and sex or whatever. I feel like it would, yes, it would edge into this place of like, what, so you guys gonna fuck or are you gonna do it or whatever. Like, we can't just have an innocent snog anymore.

[A]

What happened to us? So right. You're so right.

[B]

Do you know what I mean? I feel like for anybody to be.

[A]

Caroline's wisest moments for like at a.

[B]

30S house party, if it were to be like, let's. We're all a bit pissed, we're all a bit silly, we're all a bit whatever. Let's like place them in the bottle for the crack. It would like, people would want to push it to this more intense place. And then the people who didn't want to push it to a more intense place would feel weird. And then the atmosphere would go off. It would be a very specific group of people. Like, oh, let's all just have a little snog and it'll be really funny.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, maybe I'm putting like, just. I'm. I'm putting quite a big slant of innocence on it.

[B]

Right. I think the age of innocence is over. We've left the Garden of Eden now.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

The snake has told us about polyamory and ruined everything.

[A]

The snake has built field and now.

[B]

The snake has built field, left the garden and now we're in field.

[A]

We're in field and, you know, people are selling feet pics. But yeah, I think, I think this is a great episode because I think it's. It's also. What I wrote down is it's also the worst number of people to be at a house party.

[B]

Oh, yeah.

[A]

Because it's not.

[B]

Oh, God.

[A]

So little that you can make a joke of it and there's like four of you and you're actually mates and you're like, oh, it. Let's just hang out and then. Or we can go out to a pub or something.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it's not enough that it is an actual proper party. I think it's like 11 of them or something.

[B]

Oh, yeah. It feels awkward.

[A]

Yeah. There's so much space and light.

[B]

There's so much space in life. Light. A big part of throwing a good party as well.

[A]

It's true. This party has got the big light on in reality and I think spiritually, where Rachel's faking it. Yeah, it's bad. But I also think this is such a example of sitcom time moving on because we're only one. We're only two seasons away. Two seasons in the future of. We were on a break, which is like the biggest cultural moment of our lives. And then suddenly Rachel's like, oh, I want to shag this other guy so hard that I'm going to throw a party for this woman that you've fallen in love with. And we're all supposed to be like, yeah, you'd do that? Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You do that. Sure. Yeah.

[A]

Why not?

[B]

Emily's there looking at pictures of Ross.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's what she's doing.

[A]

And Rachel and her and Rachel are like, woo. Little like bum buddies.

[B]

Bum buddies. Bum buddies.

[A]

Bum buddies. Yeah.

[B]

The final major party that happens and friends is season nine, episode 20, the one with a Soap Opera Party. So now we've ascended to a whole new level, which is that Joey is throwing catered parties on the roof with Chinese lanterns.

[A]

Catering is the final Furlong, I would say, for house parties.

[B]

Like, imagine having a party that was catered and it wasn't even your wedding. Crazy.

[A]

I know. My friend does it. And he's a very, very classy gay man.

[B]

A gentleman of quality.

[A]

A gentleman of quality. Yes, indeed. I've never seen a spread like it. Incredible. But, yeah, I think that. And this is really signifying that they are. They're out of the trestle table of cups. They're having a Days of Our Lives party on the roof. Like, Joey is successful now. You feel like, finally, I'm thrilled for him. Yeah. Your large adult son has fled the nest. Finally. He's gonna be okay. You know, he's not gonna. He's not living paycheck to paycheck. And also, I was like. It's funny because it's a workhouse party party and it still feels too personal to, like, have it in your flat. You have to have it on the.

[B]

Roof of your building. Yeah, yeah. There has to be a separation.

[A]

It's a slight pullback.

[B]

I really feel thrilled for Joey on this as well because he's really learned how to separate work from life by now.

[A]

He's put boundaries in.

[B]

He's put boundaries in. He's like, these aren't my proper friends. These are the friends that I need to impress and keep warm because of my job.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

This is what I do. You don't need to be part of it.

[A]

And obviously they crash it and ruin it.

[B]

They shouldn't be allowed at it. No.

[A]

But I do think this is. This is a very adult. And it's not. To be honest, it's not actually that bad of a house party. Like, because the friends crash it. They kind of bring it down a peg or two. Which makes it quite fun.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the.

[B]

Oh, it seems great. I would. I would want to crash that part.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Definitely. You could. You could. That's what I mean. You could still have a classy house party and it'd be good. The marker isn't, you know, isn't how the food has to be bad or you'll have to dress or whatever like that. I think it's like the. The more high and low end you go, the better, usually, that it can be.

[B]

The problem with having a house party that is segregated to a segment of your friendships, for example.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is that. That is a cruel thing to do.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Would you argue it is sometimes a necessary thing to do? Yeah. Because when does it go from. Like, I had a few people over who are related to this part of my life. Like, for example, you had, if you had comedy friends over, where does that go from like, I had a dinner with 10 friends to tipping over to the point where, like I'm saying to you. What, you have people over and you didn't.

[A]

I know, yeah.

[B]

Where is that invisible line?

[A]

I think it is if you have to, you have to segment something off, you have to say, oh, it's for comedy friends or whatever.

[B]

Yeah, yeah.

[A]

Otherwise I, you know, I mean, it's like when you. I always think throwing a hen or a stag would be really difficult.

[B]

You know, it's really difficult.

[A]

It's difficult because it's like you actually would want lots of people that there, but realistically you're like, I can't plan a night out for 40 people.

[B]

I found that really hard with my hen. Like, because, like, especially in this line of work where, you know a load of chicks. Yeah. And some of them you've been for drinks with and you really like. But like, where is the line?

[A]

Exactly. Yeah. I think it's really difficult. And I think as long as people, I think most people are like, they realize, you know, that you're friends but like.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That your hen is almost kind of. You've got to whittle it down somehow. I think it's the same with a house. Part of, With a. Sorry. With like a, like you say, like a gathering where you're like, how do I segment this off? You know? Right.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Before it just becomes like, Joe. What? Invite everybody.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then it's all fine. Yeah. I think it's. I think for a. Yeah. Hen or a stag is hard, is.

[B]

It's because you have to backwards negotiate from who's invited to the wedding, which that's, that's the way of slitting it down. But then you have to decide which I had to decide at one point. Is this going to be the kind of wedding where loads of aunties and. And families come? The kind of hen party where loads of anti.

[A]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[B]

And like, I, I know some people have that kind of relationship where they like get pissed with their cousin all the time. I don't. And also my mom and sister live in Ireland. Am I going to get them to come to London for a one night out in a Chinese restaurant in an underground karaoke club? That seems like a lot of hassle, you know, And I know that.

[A]

I know that we're like proper adults in our 30s, but I do still think that maybe not having a parent there for like the meal or Something like that. I think that's. That's fine. But I do still think it puts a slight, you know, like, hello, Ms. Putson.

[B]

Hello.

[A]

Like, thank you, Ms. Puts. I think everyone's still kind of on their best behavior when there's a parent around.

[B]

Having a parent at a hendoo is like having a dog at a wedding. It's like, doesn't matter how chill the dog is or how well behaved. It's the dog's wedding.

[A]

It's the dog's wedding.

[B]

And the thing. Thing is, don't insult your mother's dignity by having. Do you know what I mean? It's not dignified.

[A]

It's true, my friend.

[B]

Having her for the meal or whatever is good for the whole night. We're getting Maureen pissed. It's like, I don't think that's very nice. No.

[A]

And everyone does treat her like. Yeah, like a dog ran into your school.

[B]

Yeah, that's exactly how they treat her. And they say, oh, me and Maureen, we're like, tearing up the dance. Were you really? Or were you kind of having a laugh off my mum? Sort of, in a private, not a nasty way, but you were sort of having a laugh. Laugh off her, you know?

[A]

Exactly. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think, just don't do it.

[B]

I'm so glad we're aligned on this. That will not be a popular take.

[A]

No, I think.

[B]

No.

[A]

But I do think if, you know, if your mum lives nearby and you're going for a meal, you're all going for a meal first and your mum brings a pal or something, or like your auntie or whatever. I think that's different. Like you're all just having a meal, you're having a chat, whatever. But once you start getting wasted.

[B]

No undignified.

[A]

Go home.

[B]

Well, this has been the delight of my life.

[A]

I know. We've gone off beast. What a way to end it.

[B]

Alex Hadda, where can we find you?

[A]

Oh, find me, find me in the kitchen at parties. Hey, but really. But really. But really. Come and find me on. On Instagram. I'm lexandrahaddo. Also, if you want a good party, that admittedly isn't a house party, but I also run a club night called Indie Amnesty and we're throwing a great Christmas party on the 5th of December. There's live music, there's dancing, there's great tunes. Come along. It's cheap.

[B]

Fun party. Alexandra. Hallo. Yes. I love you.

[A]

Love you. So good, so good, so good.

[B]

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