SER Historia - "Lo que cuentan los mapas"

Date: October 30, 2024
Host: Nacho
Guest: Kevin Whitman (Mapologist & Medievalist, Universidad de La Laguna)
Main Theme:
An engaging discussion on the multifaceted history, art, and mysteries of maps—exploring their roles as objects of art, tools of power, and windows into human knowledge, with a special focus on medieval cartography and their broader humanistic impact.

Episode Overview

This episode of SER Historia explores the captivating world of maps ("cartografía"), revealing how they're much more than geographic guides—they are artifacts at the confluence of history, art, science, and secrecy. Host Nacho is joined by Kevin Whitman, map specialist, who brings depth and passion to the evolution and hidden stories within ancient and medieval maps.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The First Maps: More Cosmology Than Cartography

• Historical Background: The episode opens with a discussion of early maps like those from Nippur and Babylon in Mesopotamia.
• Symbolism Over Geometry:
  • "[El mapa de Babilonia] es más bien un mapa cosmológico... que de la concepción puramente cartográfica."
    (Host paraphrasing Javier Gómez Espelosín, 00:20)
• Insight: Ancient maps prioritized worldview and mythology over precise geography, communicating more about how cultures saw themselves at the center of existence.

2. Personal Journey into Map Study

• Kevin Whitman’s Path:
  • Whitman describes his gradual, deepening fascination with maps, rooted in childhood imaginings and solidified during postgraduate study.
    • "Yo siempre tuve ese amor por los mapas, que creo que es el que tenemos todos desde que éramos pequeños y abríamos el atlas..." (Kevin Whitman, 02:54)
  • Specialization in the mythic “Islas Afortunadas” (the Canary Islands) led him deeper into medieval cartography.

3. Map as Complex Object: Art, History, Philology

• Transversality of Maps:
  • "Un mapa por definición es un objeto transversal... geográfica por supuesto, pero también... arte, historia, filología..." (Kevin Whitman, 05:46)
  • Maps require analysis across multiple disciplines (art history, geography, philology, literature), enriching their interpretation and impact.
• No Regulated Cartography Studies:
  • The diverse backgrounds of map scholars—none from a single field—enrich the perspective and understanding each brings.

4. Maps as Instruments of Power and Secrecy

• Sensitive State Information:
  • In the Age of Discovery, maps held immense strategic value—often guarded as state secrets by crowns like Castile and Portugal.
  • "Esa información era casi un secreto de Estado... en el contexto de la Casa de Contratación de Indias en Sevilla, era un modelo secreto." (Kevin Whitman, 07:50)
• Espionage Stories:
  • The "mapa de Cantino" is cited:
    • Stolen by agent Alberto Cantino from Portugal to Italy in 1501, reflecting the high stakes and intrigue around mapping new lands.
  • "Tuvo que salir en secreto de Portugal con el mapa escondido, cruzarse la península ibérica para llegar a Italia..." (Kevin Whitman, 08:38)
• Rapid Obsolescence:
  • Due to the speed of new discoveries, maps became outdated quickly, prompting constant updates and reinforcing their preciousness.

5. Emotional Impact of Historical Maps

• Physicality and Aesthetics:
  • Host Nacho likens maps to "una especie de ordenador del siglo XVI": a Renaissance computer packed with coded information.
  • For Whitman, the tactile experience of handling ancient, illuminated manuscripts is "indescriptible":
    • "Esa intensidad del color, esa intensidad de la representación, es una sensación indescriptible y que una pantalla de ordenador... no te puede ofrecer." (Kevin Whitman, 11:10)
  • Digitalization facilitates research, but the aura of the original cannot be recreated on screens.

6. Philosophy and Memory of Maps

• Discovery vs. Perception:
  • Whitman begins his book "El Atlas de Mercator" with a Marcel Proust quote:
    • "Un viaje de descubrimiento no es buscar nuevas tierras, sino tener una nueva visión del mundo..." (Nacho citing Whitman, 11:45)
  • Suggests that the true adventure in maps isn't where they lead geographically, but in how they reshape our understanding of reality and identity.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the multi-layered nature of maps:

  • "Un mapa es arte, un mapa es historia, un mapa es fundamental a la hora de estudiar la toponimia de un lugar desde un punto de vista ya más histórico, incluso filológico."
    (Kevin Whitman, 05:46)

• On secrecy and espionage in cartography:

  • "La información geográfica y cartográfica... era casi un secreto de Estado... El famoso padrón real... un modelo secreto..."
    (Kevin Whitman, 07:49-08:38)

• On the irreplaceable experience of original maps:

  • "Encontrarte con esos documentos en vivo... es una sensación indescriptible y que una pantalla de ordenador... no te puede ofrecer."
    (Kevin Whitman, 11:10)

• On the philosophical meaning of maps:

  • “Un viaje de descubrimiento no es buscar nuevas tierras, sino tener una nueva visión del mundo...”
    (Cited by Nacho, 11:45, originally from Marcel Proust)

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:20: Early Mesopotamian maps and their symbolic nature
• 02:53: Kevin Whitman’s path to mapology—personal and academic origins
• 05:01: Difference between "mapa" and "plano" explained
• 05:46: The interdisciplinary study of maps
• 07:49: Maps as state secrets during the Age of Discovery; espionage narratives
• 10:24: Emotional encounter with ancient maps
• 11:45: Philosophical reflections—maps as shifts in perception

Overall Tone & Takeaways

The episode is dynamic and passionate, demystifying maps as stuffy relics, instead casting them as living testimonies to human curiosity, artistry, and ambition. Both host and guest converse with warmth, respect, and infectious enthusiasm, interspersed with anecdotes, historical intrigue, and philosophical reflection, making clear that every old map holds not just lines—but stories, secrets, and whole worlds.

Recommended further reading:

• "La huella de los mapas" by Kevin Whitman
• "El Atlas de Mercator" by Kevin Whitman

Summary by an expert podcast summarizer, capturing the richness and excitement of SER Historia’s journey through the history of maps.