391: Part 2: She Packed Butcher Knives in Her Purse | Angelique Robledo

Summary

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Serialously with Annie Elise — Ep. 391

"Part 2: She Packed Butcher Knives in Her Purse | Angelique Robledo"

Date: April 27, 2026
Host: Annie Elise
Guest: Angelique Robledo

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Main Theme & Purpose

This episode continues Angelique Robledo’s shocking true story — an account of how, as a pregnant teenager, she narrowly survived a calculated murder and fetal abduction plot orchestrated by someone she considered a friend, Cassandra. The episode is a powerful exploration of surviving trauma, the overlooked red flags in violent crimes against pregnant women, and the importance of intuition and vigilance. Annie and Angelique dive deeply into the harrowing details, aftermath, and ongoing impact of the attack, offering insights for listeners about trust, survival, and reclaiming one’s narrative.

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Key Discussion Points

Picking Up Where Part 1 Left Off

• Recap: The story resumes at the chilling moment where Cassandra asked Angelique to turn around for a "gift" and began counting ominously ([00:55]).
• Angelique’s Instinct: A gut feeling told her to run — “something said run, like in my head it said run. And so I jumped up and I ran” ([01:54] Angelique).

Immediately Suspicious Behavior

• Aftermath of ‘Gift’ Attempt: Angelique saw Cassandra putting something back into her bag, then Cassandra started a loud conversation with someone in Spanish ([02:52]).
• Angelique’s Internal Conflict: She debated whether she was overreacting, citing her knowledge from watching TV crime shows — struggling with whether to alert anyone or dismiss her suspicion ([03:21-04:38]).

Simulated Medical Emergency

• Fake Water Break: Cassandra staged a scene where she emerged from the bathroom with wet pants, claiming her water broke, then retracted and said she just peed herself ([05:56–07:38]).
• Emotional Manipulation: She asked Angelique to accompany her to the hospital, then became evasive when Angelique wanted to inform her own mother ([06:43]).

Mounting Red Flags and Attempted Arson

• Strange Smell and Fire: After Cassandra tried on some clothes, Angelique noticed a burning smell. Upon investigation, she discovered her closet was in flames ([10:08–11:45]).
• Actual Fire: Angelique heroically managed the situation by calling for help, dragging Cassandra out, and trying to extinguish the fire as smoke filled the house ([14:26–15:54]).

Aftermath: Revelation and Investigation

• Shock and Paranoia: Despite the evidence and destruction, Angelique and her close ones, including first responders, initially struggled to comprehend what truly happened ([16:05–19:18]).

• Discovery of Weapons: In Cassandra’s bag, Angelique found two large butcher knives, scissors, disinfectant, and a newborn diaper ([21:18–21:59]):

  “When I pull my hand out, I have two large butcher knives in my hand, and I drop them on the counter. And I said, I told you she was going to kill me.” ([21:18] Angelique)

• Paramedics and Police: Cassandra gave conflicting personal information to paramedics, further arousing suspicion ([18:04]).

Police Doubt and Lack of Immediate Justice

• Questioning Angelique: Due to her past, detectives initially treated her as a suspect and questioned if the fire was an accident or drug-related ([24:03–25:17]).
• Forensic Evidence: Cassandra’s prints were found on the candles used to start the fire ([25:17]).

Realization, Further Investigation, and Police Inaction

• The Plan Unfolds: It’s uncovered that Cassandra was never pregnant; she had faked it all ([25:57–26:12]).
• Angelique’s Own Research: She traced Cassandra’s background, uncovering mental health issues and ties to acquaintances ([27:45–30:33]).
• Police Finally Act: Angelique wore a wire, helping police gather evidence through a call with Cassandra ([30:40–32:39]).

Legal Proceedings and Sentencing

• Initial Escape: Cassandra left the hospital and vanished; Angelique was placed in protective custody during her traumatic delivery ([33:03]).
• Delayed Arrest: Only after Cassandra’s sister returned from abroad and alerted authorities was she apprehended ([38:02]).
• Confession and Motive: Cassandra confessed — her plan was to kill Angelique, perform a C-section, take the baby, and burn the evidence ([35:18]):

  “She confessed everything. Oh, she was gonna kill you. Perform a C-section. The fire was never meant to be a part of this, but it played a role.” ([34:00]).

Justice Hindered: Failed System

• Miranda Rights Blunder: The confession was thrown out because Cassandra was not read her rights. She was only charged with arson, not attempted murder ([42:28]):

  “The cops didn't read her her Miranda rights at the time of her confession, so that has been thrown out.” ([42:28] Angelique)

• Plea Deal: Angelique chose to have Cassandra sent to a psychiatric hospital (ASH) rather than prison — hoping she’d get treatment and not reoffend ([43:04–44:50]).

Confrontation and Compassion

• Courtroom Speech: Angelique read a letter in court, telling Cassandra she forgave her, hoping this act of compassion might prompt reform ([46:05]):

  “I don't want to live my life hating somebody for somebody that was mentally ill or somebody that made a mistake.” ([46:05] Angelique)

• Cassandra’s Response: No remorse. Simply said, “No, Your Honor,” to the judge ([47:02]).

Cassandra’s Release & Aftermath

• Cassandra Released: After multiple psychiatric evaluations deeming her "unwell," Cassandra miraculously was considered stable shortly before her sentence ended ([52:44–53:24]).

• Angelique Faces Her Again: She attended Cassandra’s release hearing, confronting her and giving powerful testimony to keep stipulations on Cassandra’s release ([54:25–55:18]).

• Minimal Supervision: Cassandra was released under minimal supervision, lived close to Angelique, concealed her past, and Angelique avoids contact ([56:18–57:57]).

The Horrifying Discovery: Motive was Trafficking, Not Personal Obsession

• Gang Ties and Transactional Motive: On reviewing police reports and tapes years later, Angelique learned Cassandra had been conspiring with a gang to abduct and sell her baby for money, not out of personal obsession:

  “She talks about how there was a buyer waiting across the border in Mexico for them… All I was was a transaction. All I was, you know, you were the carrier. I was the carrier.” ([62:06–62:24] Angelique)

Recovery, Motherhood, and Advocacy

• Ongoing Trauma: Angelique describes years of PTSD and dissociation, unable to enjoy her son’s earliest years ([38:47]).

• Telling Her Story: Initially, Angelique faced disbelief and stigma. Gradually, she reclaimed her narrative by speaking publicly and on social media ([67:06–68:33]).

• Empowerment and Community: Sharing her story brought both empowerment and support from the survivor community ([68:33–69:06]).

• Intuition as a Lifesaver: A central takeaway:

  “I hope they take away the intuition part. I hope that they understand... I’m very thankful that I listened.” ([70:09] Angelique)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Intuition:
  “Something said run. Like in my head it said run. And so I jumped up and I ran…” ([01:54] Angelique)
• On Realization:
  “I told you she was going to kill me. I told you.” ([21:18] Angelique)
• On the Legal System:
  “The cops didn't read her her Miranda rights at the time of her confession, so that has been thrown out.” ([42:28] Angelique)
• On Forgiveness:
  “I refuse to allow myself to have hatred… please, like, do better.” ([46:05] Angelique)
• On the True Motive:
  “This wasn’t about her trying to steal your child for herself… It was strictly a transaction.” ([62:06] Annie Elise)
  “She was gonna get paid, and she was gonna stay in Mexico and not come back.” ([62:19] Angelique)
• On Survival and Advocacy:
  "It's your story, it's yours to tell. You shouldn't ever feel like you need to stop talking about it." ([66:11] Annie Elise)

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Important Timestamps

• 01:54 — Angelique describes the “gift” incident & her gut-instinct escape
• 04:38 — Angelique’s internal debate: paranoia vs. self-preservation
• 05:56–07:38 — Cassandra fakes her water breaking
• 11:45 — Discovery of closet fire and frantic response
• 16:05 — Aftermath: confusion and disbelief; Cassandra flees
• 21:18 — Discovery of butcher knives in Cassandra’s bag
• 24:03 — Police treat Angelique as possible suspect
• 25:57 — Revelation: Cassandra was not pregnant
• 27:45–30:33 — Angelique’s research uncovers Cassandra’s past and connections
• 34:00 — News of Cassandra’s confession and actual murder plan
• 42:28 — Miranda rights error, confession thrown out, arson charge only
• 44:50 — Angelique’s compassionate plea for treatment, not prison
• 46:05 — Angelique’s emotional courtroom letter of forgiveness
• 47:02 — Cassandra’s final “No, your honor” — showing no remorse
• 62:06–62:24 — Angelique learns the plan was for baby trafficking, not personal obsession
• 70:09 — Major message: “Trust your intuition”
• 71:40 — Angelique’s warning: “Please don’t join this club” (re: fetal abduction victims)

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Takeaways and Final Thoughts

• Trust Your Instincts: Angelique’s intuition quite literally saved her life. Both she and Annie underscore the importance of “listening to your gut.”
• Trauma is Trauma: Healing is non-linear; survivors are not obligated to move on or stop telling their stories.
• Legal System Failures: Due to procedural errors (Miranda rights), Angelique’s assailant was never fully prosecuted for the true horror of her plan; only arson, not attempted murder, was charged.
• The Danger of Underestimating Red Flags: Angelique’s story urges heightened vigilance, especially for pregnant women subject to “friendship” from questionable individuals.
• Resilience & Empowerment: Despite immense trauma and skepticism, Angelique has found empowerment by reclaiming her story and raising awareness.
• Fetal Abduction Awareness: This rare but terrifying crime deserves more social and law enforcement attention.

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Resources

• Angelique Robledo: Linked in the show notes for her TikTok and story time videos.
• Angelique’s case folder (documents, interview/extras): Available via Serialously Patreon.

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End Note:
Angelique’s story is not only a testament to survival and intuition but also a call to acknowledge and improve the systems meant to protect victims. The episode blends harrowing narrative with emotional insight — a must-listen for true crime followers and those seeking hope and wisdom through survival.

Transcript

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[Annie Elise]

Hey, true crime besties. Welcome back to an all new episode of Serial Asleep.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Hey everyone.

[Annie Elise]

And welcome back to part two of of Angelique's story. Over here on Seriously with me, your host, Annie Elise. Now in part one, if you're either catching up or you missed it or you just need a refresh. We walked through everything leading up to the moment we left off at Angelique's life as a young pregnant teenager. The relationship that she was building with her new great friend Cassandra, and how it seemed like a very normal friendship slowly started taking a very unsettling turn. And we left off at a pretty chilling moment too, when Cassandra had brought Angelique into her bedroom, told her to turn around for a gift, and then started counting. One, two. Now, if you haven't listened to part one yet, I highly, highly recommend going back and starting there so that you have the full context before continuing. But with that, let's pick back up right where we left off. Here is Angelique.

[Angelique]

So finally I go, cassandra, are you going to show me? And she goes, yes. And she puts one hand on my shoulder, on my left hand shoulder, and she leans me forward so much that my stomach is huge that I can't breathe. And she goes, 1, 2, 3. And right when she does the 3, I literally jump up off the bed and I. The reason I jumped though is because something said run. Like in my head it said run. And so I jumped up and I ran to my, like, ran to my, like my light. I turned the light switch on and I look at her and she's putting something back into the bag and I'm like, what are you doing? And then all of a sudden, what a coincidence, her phone rings. It's whoever she's been talking to this whole day. The phone rings and she's like just talking to somebody in Spanish and. And I remember sitting there looking at her and just like observing and just watching her and she's just having a full conversation with somebody still on Your bed still on my bed.

[Annie Elise]

The bag next to.

[Angelique]

Next to her? Yes. Just blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Just talking. And then she's grabbing the bed. She's getting off the bed, and, like, she sounds like she's almost arguing with somebody. And then I literally take. I literally. Like, I'm standing there for probably good about 30 seconds until I turn around and walk out of my room and to collect myself, to understand what just happened. So now I go and I sit at the table, and I'm. I'm so dissociated at this point. Yeah, I'm doing. I'm just filing my nails. All I'm doing is sitting there. I'm replaying it over and over again in my head. You stood there. She didn't give you anything. What was it? Is there something in her bag? Are you crazy? Like, you didn't take your nap today? Maybe. Maybe you're delirious. Like, maybe this isn't even actually happening. So I am fighting back and forth with myself, but I'm a very big. I'm not a true crime junkie, but I'm definitely, like, an SVU junkie. So I've watched a lot of, like, SVU where I've known that you don't. Like, you don't let the murderer know that you know what's gonna happen, because if you do, you're gonna make them. They're gonna make a mistake, which could be. You know, it could be really bad. So I was like. In my head, I was like, okay, don't alarm her to where you think something is wrong, but also, don't be stupid and not realize what's going. Like, what could be happening at this point.

[Annie Elise]

You knew something's weird here. Something's going on. I don't know what it is, but something's not right.

[Angelique]

Something's not right. But I will be very honest. I was also 18 years old, a teenager, and there was a part of me that did feel like, what if I'm wrong? What if I accuse now this new friend who's friends with all of my friends and myself and my husband's crazy one, and I call the cops on her, and then I look like Angelique? All she was doing was giving you a gift, and there's a gift in there. Like, she gave me gifts earlier. Like, what would make this different? So we've already established she's weird.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

Yeah, we've already established that she's a weird person. So, like, I don't know. That part of me was in the back of My head, but it wasn't going away. So I wasn't just going into this thinking, like, oh, la da, da, da, da. Like, I'm just gonna. No, that's not how I went into this. I went into this very, very smart. Yeah. So then I'm sitting there and I'm doing my nails, and she comes out and she goes, my husband. That was my husband. And I was like, oh. She goes, he's gonna surprise. He's surprising me and coming down here to go to dinner with me, but I have nothing to wear. And I'm like, she's leaving. Gosh, she's leaving.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

Oh, my gosh. Finally, she's not trying to kill me. Like, she's going to leave. So I was. Got so excited, so I was like, oh, you can try something on in my room. Go look at my room. I didn't even want to bring up the gift. Like, at this point, whatever you have in your bag, I don't want.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I didn't even bring it up. I. I didn't. I didn't want to. I was too scared to bring it up. I just knew at this moment she was going to go. Now, I don't know how in depth you want me to go, but there was another incident that happened, like, right after that. So I don't. I don't know where this. So I don't know where it fits into my story. There was a moment, and I don't know if it happened before we went into the room or if it happened after, but there was a moment that she went into the bathroom and she came out with water on her pants and tried to fake like she. Like, her water broke.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, and she told you her water broke?

[Angelique]

She's like, I don't know what's happening. And I'm sorry. Like, I.

[Annie Elise]

No, it's okay.

[Angelique]

I don't remember if it was before or after. So, Like, I never really tell people in interviews because I keep. Like, I can't distinguish when it happened.

[Annie Elise]

I think that's absolutely fair that you don't remember that.

[Angelique]

Hello.

[Annie Elise]

I mean, with everything you went through. But. Okay, that's obviously a very big detail.

[Angelique]

It is. Because at one point she called somebody and was like. She asked me. Like, she started freaking out, like, oh, my gosh, I don't know what's happening. I was like, oh, my God. Like, did your water break? Like, you're seven months pre. Like, you're six, seven months pregnant. Like, this is bad. And she was like, I don't know what's going on. Will you come to the hospital with me? And I was like, yeah. Like, I'll. I'll come to the hospital with you. Like, whatever you need. She's like. She goes, okay. And she goes, well, let me call somebody. She goes, hey, come get us. Okay, Bye, and hangs up. Who's this person that she's calling?

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And then I go, well, I need to call my mom really quick. I need to. I need to let her know what's happening. And I start to grab my phone, and she goes, wait, you need to let your mom know. And I said, yeah. Like, I. She's like, you're 18. I was like, yeah, but I. I live with my mom. Like, I gotta let her know.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

She goes, well, let me go make sure I didn't pee myself. And then she goes back into the bathroom, comes out, and she goes, false alarm. I think I might have just peed myself. And I felt really bad. I didn't feel bad, but I had done that, like, tw. So I had been. I'm gonna raise my hand with guilt that I have been the woman that went to the hospital thinking that my, you know, water broke. And unfortunately, when they come back and say, it's not water, it's urine, and you're like. You're like, are you sure? Can you run that test again, please?

[Annie Elise]

So she was doing a lot of things, though, to almost, like, simulate that she had gone into labor. And then when you were saying, I'm gonna notify my mom, she starts walking it back, saying, oh, no, I just peed myself.

[Angelique]

Yes.

[Annie Elise]

Okay. So whether that happen after the bedroom incident, unclear. But now she's getting picked up by her husband. She needs something to wear. She's going through your closet?

[Angelique]

Yes. I want to say it happened after, because I feel like her trying clothes on in my room had something to do with her leaving with her husband, but also because she had wanted to change. She wanted to change because she had water all over her. I just. And a part of my brain just doesn't remember exactly. I do just remember that, though, because I remember thinking in my head, like, oh, this poor girl just peed herself in, like, my bathroom.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I go into my room, I grab, like, five different outfits, I lay it out on my bed, and I'm like, here you go. You can try all of these on. Whatever fits you, you can have. I don't even care. Like, take it with you. Hasta la vista. Bye.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So she goes into her room, my room, and before she goes into My room, though. There's no reason for this. But I'm a. I love candles. I love them. I just. You know, you feel that moment that you just want to light a candle just because. So I had gotten this new, like, little. It was like a teacup candle that, like, where you put, like, the oil, and then, like, it, like, kind of goes up and lets, like, the fragrance or I don't know what they're called. But, you know, you visually. You can see what I'm saying. So I remember before she went into the room, I took a candle and I lit it. No reason, just lit it. And that's when I laid the clothes out. She went and tried the clothes on. She closed the door. I went back and started, you know, filing my nails more. And then all of a sudden, she comes out, and she goes, what do you think about this? And I was like, oh, that dress looks great on you. Like, you can barely tell that you're even pregnant. Like, you can have it. Like, you. That would be perfect to go to dinner with. And then I start. Like, as I'm talking to her, though, I start walking into my room. And when I walk into my room, I smell something weird. And I'm like, do you smell that? And she was like, what? And I was like, it smells like something's on fire. And I look to the candle, the candles out, but it doesn't smell like a burning candle went out. It just smells like something's on fire. And she's like, no, I don't smell that. And I'm like, really? And I'm like, huh? So then I start looking everywhere in my room. I open my closet. I'm doing this very fast. So, like, I open my closet, see nothing. Look under my bed, see nothing. Open my drawers, nothing. And I'm sitting there, and my brain is just, like, kind of going and going and going. And I'm like, what is going on right now? Like, why it smells like a fire? So then I literally go back as a test because I go and take another candle. Something inside my brain is telling me that something's wrong, and I don't know how to prove it. So I go get another candle, and I light it, and I see what she does. She goes, oh, is it okay if I try this other dress on? And I'm like, yeah, go ahead. But I'm very suspicious now. So she runs back into the room, closes the door, and I'm like, something's happening in that room. So then my pantry is diagonal from my bedroom door. So I go into my pantry and I'm pretending. I'm so paranoid. I'm so paranoid at this point. I'm pretending like I'm looking for chips. So I'm making noise in my pantry, and I'm like, cassandra, do you want some chips? Do you want a snack? Are you hungry? And I'm just, like, leaning over, looking at my door, and I can see her shadow. And it's pacing back and forth, back and forth, back and forth, back and forth. Like it's just. And I'm like, she's fucking setting my house on fire. And I'm so sorry. I don't know if we're allowed to cuss.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

No, you're fine.

[Annie Elise]

You're fine.

[Angelique]

So I was like, she's setting my house on fire. But nothing made sense. Why. And where am I getting this all from? I have no. Like, where do you get. From a candle. Like, it just. It was very weird. So she opens the door, I run back in there, and I look at the candle and I go, cassandra, why is that candle out again? And at this point, I'm pissed. Like, I'm stern. I. Forgetting that she even tried. Like, whatever happened, I'm just mad. Like, what. What is. Can you explain to me, like, what is going on? Yeah. And she goes, what do you mean? I didn't put that out? And she's like, it must have just went out. And I'm like, the fan isn't on. The AC isn't on. How does a candle just go out? And I'm like, and what is that smell? Yeah. And she's like, I don't know. I do smell it now, though. And I was like, okay. So then we start looking through my. She's looking through my room with me. I. I look at my. I go to my brother's room, which is right next door. I start searching his room. I don't smell anything in there. So I go back into my room. I do the same search, but I do it opposite. I open my drawers. Nothing's in there. Look under the bed, look behind the bed. Look somewhere else. Open my closet. And everything is in flames.

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[Annie Elise]

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[Angelique]

My whole closet is in flames. All of my clothes are. Everything is. Oh my gosh Just blazing. And I started screaming, oh, my God. Like, there's a fire. And I'm like. And at this point, like, everything went outside of my head of what just happened. Just like, I need to get this fire out. And I had my cell phone. It was just a flip phone. So I took it and I pressed send, send, send, send, send. Which ended up calling my best friend Skyler. He was the last person that ever called me. So when I call him, I'm just screaming, Call 911. My house is on fire, please. I'm trying to put it out. Boom. I hang up. I'm running back and forth with pots and pans. I threw a pot at Cassandra, and. But honestly, I don't even know what she was doing at this point. I think she was just standing there watching me. But I was running back and forth to the kitchen, filling pots of water up, throwing it on the fire. And at this point, my whole room is filled with smoke. It's hard to breathe. She can't breathe. She's coughing. I'm coughing. So I run to the garage. The garage is right next to my room. I open the garage door, and I grab. I go back inside my room, grab her by her collar, and I drag her outside. And smoke just starts rolling out of my house. So at this point, all you see is, like, black smoke just rolling out of the garage. And Skyler had gotten there first before the paramedics. Skyler lived, like, three minutes away from me, so he had gotten there first before the paramedics, before the firefighters, before anybody came. And right when she came out, right when we both came out, he pulled up with his mom and his little brother, and she just, like, took off running down the street barefoot. Nobody knows why.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

Nobody knows why.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

That's the markings.

[Annie Elise]

I'm an innocent person.

[Angelique]

That's what I'm saying. And he goes, what? And I go, just let her go? Yeah, just let her go. And he's like, what is. What's going on?

[Annie Elise]

Did she have the big diaper bag with her when she took off on foot?

[Angelique]

I'm gonna be honest. I have no idea. We've never been able to. I'll say, like, it's a very weird thing that she did, but we've never been able to understand, like, why, like, nobody found anything. The police, like, went and looked in the bushes that she. Nobody could find anything. So I don't know if she called somebody. So I don't. That part I don't know of. But, like, it was just a very weird thing. But it was a moment for me to talk to Skylar by myself. So, like, Skylar's mom runs back inside my house just to make sure the fire is out. And I pull Skylar aside, and he's like, what? I was like, just let her go. Just let her go. I don't know what's happening. And he's like, angelique, like, what is going on? And I'm like, can I tell you something without you, like, thinking different or judging me? And he's like, yeah. And I said, all right. I think she was trying to kill me. I think she was gonna stab me. I'm not exactly sure why. I think she set my house on fire. I think she's jealous of me. I don't know what's happening, Skyler, but that's literally how I'm telling him. I'm telling him so fast that his brain can't even comprehend what I'm saying. And he's looking at me like I'm crazy. And I'm like, yeah, I'm never gonna say this to anybody again. I'm never gonna tell anybody what I just said, because the way he's looking at me is like, I have 10 heads. And he goes. I go, you believe me, right? And he goes, I. I want to believe you. But, like, why would. Why would she. Like, this doesn't make any sense. Like, are you. Are you, like, are you sure this is what happened? Like, he was even questioning, like, what I was saying, and I was just like, maybe I'm. Maybe I'm overreacting. Maybe maybe this didn't happen. Maybe I'm delirious. Like, maybe there's something wrong with me. And I'm like, God. So at that point, I start having contractions, though. So now. Now, after I told him, Cassandra came back. So she did come back. And now the paramedics are there, the firefighters, the police are there. My parents pull up, and the fire restarted. So the cops, firefighters, are back in there trying to figure out what's happening. I hear them talking about, like, a battery that may have exploded. So in my head, I'm like, maybe she didn't start this fire. Like, maybe this is all just. Like, there's something. Like, they're gonna figure out. Like, the fire investigators in there, they're gonna figure out what happened.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I'm like, okay, let everyone do their job. Let me just go ahead and worry about myself, because at this point, I'm in, like, labor because I just. The smoke made us have contractions, and I say, us, because she started Having contractions. So her and I are both being treated by paramedics. And my mom comes over to me, and she's like, hey, like, how are you feeling? Like, how did this happen? And I'm like, I don't. I don't know. Just let them figure out what happened. And I go. And Cassandra's, like, crying. She's like, oh, my gosh. Like, she's in so much pain, and she's crying. And I go, mom, just go. Just go to her. Like, go to her. I have Skylar. So my mom goes over and starts, like, holding her hand, and the paramedics are getting information from her. And this is where my mom started to catch on to things, because everything she was telling the paramedics was different than what she told us. Like, her name was Cassandra Teruga, but she said her name was, like, Marie Tarruga or something. She was, like, giving different, like, names, different addresses, different age, different how many months. She was like, everything wasn't adding up to what she told us earlier that day. So my mom was like, weren't you, like, six, seven months pregnant? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm sorry. I didn't mean. I was five. I was. I'm six. I'm, like, seven. So, like, there were certain things that my mom was, like, sitting there, starting to, like, hear these.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And I'm sitting there just, like, trying to breathe. I have, like, an air, like, a mask on. And I told Skylar not to tell anybody, but of course, like, we're teenagers. He ends up telling his mom. His mom tells my parents. This is all happening while we're outside. Like, it's just like a. You know, everyone's whispering. And all of a sudden, my mom, my dad, and Skylar's mom all give me, like, a look, and I'm like, did you tell them? And he goes, angelique, I had to. Things are weird. Like, I'm feeling weird about this. Like, God forbid if this actually is real. And she tried to kill you. Like, somebody has to help us.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And I look at him, and I just do a big sigh of relief. Like, thank you. Like, I couldn't say it. So then I get up because I'm feeling better. She's still crying, and she's also talking on the phone with somebody, saying, yeah, Angelique, what hospital are you gonna go to? Can I go to the same hospital she goes to? And I'm like, don't. Don't let her go near me, please. And so I go back inside the house because my parents are like, what is happening? And I'm like, okay. So I do the same thing I did to Skyler. And I'm like, I think she was gonna kill me. She put me in my room. She put me in the middle of the kitchen. Then she put me in my room. Something told me she was gonna kill me. And I'm, like, trying to explain to them, and I can tell they just. Like, Skyler, they all want to understand and they all want to believe me, but I look like I'm hysterical at this point. And the paramedics go, okay, we're taking her to the hospital. We're just grabbing her belongings. So they start grabbing all my clothes. And I'm like, no, no, no, those are mine. I go, this is all hers. And I grab the bag and I give them the bag. And as I'm handing them the bag, I take it back, and I go, wait, there was a gift in here. And I put it on top of the counter so everybody could see. And I'm explaining. She said she had this gift. It shined on the ceiling. It said. She said it had Rylan's name on it. And I'm, like, talking, and I'm opening it, I put my hands in, and literally all I feel is metal. And when I pull my hand out, I have two large butcher knives in my hand, and I drop them on the counter. And I said, I told you she was going to kill me. I told you. And then I go into, like, this weird. I kept saying the same thing over and over and over. I told you she was gonna kill me. I told you she was gonna kill me. And I just kept saying that. It was, like, for like, an hour straight, I was, like, in this trance, and I couldn't stop, and I was just. I was staring at a wall, crying.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And at that point, they had already got her into the ambulance. So there, like, going, like, once. Medically wise, like, once you get into an ambulance, like, there's no. They're gonna take you to the hospital.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Yeah.

[Annie Elise]

And then if they're gonna have law enforcement, they'll send them there.

[Angelique]

Exactly.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So that ends up happening, and they take her. And at this point now, my street has been shut down as an attempted murder scene. So now nobody can get in and nobody can get out.

[Annie Elise]

Was there anything else in the bag besides the two butcher knives?

[Angelique]

There was disinfectant, there was scissors, and there was a newborn diaper. Wow.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

Yeah. It gives you chills.

[Annie Elise]

Like, I literally have the chills. I can't even imagine what was going through your Mind when you had that, it was discovering all of that.

[Angelique]

It was surreal. It really was. And even my mom, like, she'll sit there, and she was just, like, nobody's brains could understand, like, what was happening. And to be quite honest, even with all the evidence in front of me, I still didn't understand, like, why, like, I didn't put two and two together that she wanted to take my baby.

[Annie Elise]

You thought she just wanted to kill you?

[Angelique]

I just thought she wanted to kill me.

[Annie Elise]

So what was your mom's reaction as you were pulling the stuff out of the bag? Was she kind of like, what,

[Angelique]

the pair? I think. I don't think the cops were there when I pulled it out. It was the paramedics. My mom's crazy. She runs out with the butcher knives and the bag into, like, she runs outside because that's where everybody's at. And she goes, this was in her bag. And she's, like, holding two large butcher knives. And I'm like, so the cops are like, what are you doing?

[Annie Elise]

And she's like, no, put down the knife, lady.

[Angelique]

My mom's like, this was in my. In her bag. Like, so my mom is, like, screaming, and I was. I. I just stayed stuck in the house, like, staring at a wall. Yeah, I do remember they tried to call Josh, and Josh was at a friend's house, so he had. I think he was drinking, too, because when he had to get a ride, and I remember they wouldn't let him in. So it took two and a half hours for them to allow Josh to even come back, because everything was shut down. Nobody in, nobody out. And so finally they let him in. And by the time he got to me, I was still just staring at a wall. Like, I wasn't talking. I wasn't doing anything. I wasn't. Literally. The detectives tried to talk to me, and I was just silent. I wouldn't talk to anybody. And then finally when he came, I felt a sense of relief, and so I hugged him. And then I snapped out of it. It's like I snapped out of whatever funk I was in. And I was like, let me talk to the detective. And so I start talking to the detective. And what sucks about it is, like, remember, this is gonna be, like, where we talked about how this detective knew me from my younger childhood and has arrested me plenty of times to the point where she was questioning me?

[Annie Elise]

Yep.

[Angelique]

Are you sure that's what happened?

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

Are you positive? Do you think maybe the fire started because you were smoking weed in your room?

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my gosh.

[Angelique]

Are you. Are you. You don't smoke weed still? Because I do recall you. Me arresting you for smoking weed. Like, and the thing is, is I didn't even remember any of that until I got a hold of my interrogation tapes and I listened to the whole thing. I thought that they. My brain wanted to think that they were on my side, of course, but they were, like, making jokes. Like, I've listened to my own tape, and here I can hear myself. Like, I'm. I'm stuttering. I'm scared. I'm laughing because I'm giggling because I'm nervous. But they're making me feel so uncomfortable throughout the whole investigation where they're. Just. Because I'm being questioned, like I did something wrong. And I just remember, you know, the fire investigators were in there. They were able to find the teacup candles. They ran fingerprints. Her fingerprints were on both teacup candles, which they shouldn't have been if she didn't touch them. So she did use the teacup candles to light the fire in my room. And I don't. They do have some type of report that explains, like, how it happened. I don't exactly understand or know how it did something with the candle wax, something. When she lit it, I think she may have lit my computer and it exploded. I'm not really.

[Annie Elise]

Okay.

[Angelique]

Something created this boom. Because, remember, the first time I looked in the closet, there was nothing. There was, though. They said it was a slow fire, and whatever she did the second time amplified it. And so that's what caused for the fire, because it was maybe four or five minute in between that. So between that five minutes, the flames were everywhere. Everything in my closet was burned down. My mom's wedding dress that I wanted to wear when I got married. I lost everything in that closet, which for me was a lot, because that's, like. Of course that's where everything was.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah. So as the detectives and the fire investigators are all now working together, realizing, like, what really happened, she's transported to the hospital and what happens from there?

[Angelique]

So she was transported to the hospital, and from my understanding, she said she was pregnant. They ran a pregnancy test. She wasn't. And I think when they, like, confronted her about it, she ran. So, like, she left the hospital. Okay, so when the detective.

[Annie Elise]

So she was never pregnant.

[Angelique]

She was never pregnant.

[Annie Elise]

She just faked the whole.

[Angelique]

She faked the whole pregnancy.

[Annie Elise]

Okay, Was she wearing a fake belly

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

or anything like that?

[Angelique]

No, she. She was a very, very skinny girl. She was probably about, like, five, eight. So she was a little bit Taller. She had really large hips, and she had a really nice figure, to be quite honest. She had big hips and a big butt, but super, super tiny. So she would always, like, lean like this, and she would constantly go like that. So, like, a belly would kind of be there.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

But my mom told me, because I remember I asked too. You know, she doesn't look that pregnant, though. Like, she doesn't look six or seven months. I'm almost like, women carry differently. Like, there's some women that even don't even.

[Annie Elise]

You never see it.

[Angelique]

You never see it.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And I didn't show because I was, you know, coming off drugs. I didn't show till I was like, six months. Like, I didn't actually. I was trying to gain all that weight back, so it made sense. But. Yeah. No, everybody just thought that she was pregnant.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And because she told everybody for months that she was.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah. So she takes this test. She's not pregnant. She flees the hospital, and what happens then?

[Angelique]

The next day, I find out that she left the hospital and I was not okay with everything. I woke up feeling terrified because now it's like, somebody had to tell me that, like, this was a plan to take my baby. So, like, my mom ended up having to be the one to, like, kind of reel me in and make me understand. Like, Angelique, I don't think this was about killing you. I think this was about your bait. I think this was about Ryland. Like, I think she was going to take Ryland. And then it all started to, like. It was like a full circle where I was like, this happened. That happened. I was like, oh, my God. Like, I think you're right. Like, it made more sense. Like, the C section talk, all of that.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So then one thing about me is I'm a really good investigator. Really good. It's actually ridiculous. So I take things into my own hands because I don't think the cops are taking me seriously. So I end up finding information about her that other people didn't like that the cops didn't even find. Like, I found out that she was a runaway from years ago. And they said she was a danger to herself and to society. She was schizophrenic, manic depressant, bipolar, and at this time, it was called multi personality syndrome, but now it's called did Which I think because it was really hard to diagnose. Multiple type personality syndrome. It was. It was something along the lines, but it was in the news. I found, like, an article and, like, the fact that they didn't find any of this was crazy. I. And what makes this even wilder is that she. I found out. I found a picture of her where she was in a picture with somebody that I knew from middle school. So I had to remember. Where did I know this girl from middle school? How are I. I don't think she went to school with us, but she lived in Chandler. Like, where do I know her from? And it was from one of my ex boyfriends, Chris. He had dated her. So now I'm calling Chris Chris. What was that girl's name? This is her picture. Oh, that's Maddie. Okay. Where does Maddie live? She lives in Chandler. Okay, can I have her number? Can I have her Facebook? Like, he gives me her information, I call her and I just load it all on her. I know you don't know me, but something happened. There's a girl in the picture with you. Her name is Cassandra Cheruga. I think she tried to hurt me. Can you please help me? Like, how do you know this girl? And she was like, what happened? And I was like, she came to my house with butcher knives. Like, I'm kind of word vomiting.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And she goes, that's my cousin. And I'm like, your cousin? She goes, that is my cousin. And I'm like, okay, I'm so sorry. Like, I didn't. Like, now I feel like I stepped into a territory, like, where I'm talking to family and, like, that can't be good. But she was like, no. She's like, I believe you. And I was like, wait, what? She goes, I believe you. And I was like, why? She goes, because Cassandra is not, like, mentally, first off. She's not, like, a mentally stable person. She also has a lot of things in her life, like, that happen. Like, she kind of. She didn't really go into detail. She just said, like, I believe you. And she goes. I go, does she actually have a sister that lives out here? She goes, no, she does. She's like, but the sister is out of the country right now, so she has no idea what's going on. So the sister hasn't been there. Oh. Then I said, does she have a brother? Yeah, she has a brother, but he doesn't live here. What do you mean he doesn't live here? She got dropped off by her brother.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

Who was it that dropped her off? Right, because my brother saw a man in the truck. In the van.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, the van.

[Angelique]

The white van. Yeah. Yeah. So, like, all of these things where I was kind of trying to understand and not really knowing what was happening. Then I give all the information to the cops. I give them Marty's phone number, I give them the sister's address. I give them everything. And they're like, wow, how did you find all of this? And I'm like, I don't know. I.

[Annie Elise]

Like, I did a little research.

[Angelique]

Thank you. That's why I'm like, I don't know. A quick, you know, Google search. Yeah.

[Annie Elise]

Gosh. So then what happened? Was she ever arrested?

[Angelique]

No. After that, I actually got brought down to the police station, and they asked me if I would be willing to call her, because at this point, they said they don't. No one's explained to her that we found the butcher. She doesn't know any of this, so we're a step ahead of her. Now. They're starting to believe me. So now they're like, can you come down to the police station? And we put a wire on you, and we'll have you call and pretend like you have no idea what's going on. And we need you to get her to admit that she was in your room before the fire started. And I'm like, okay. And I'm like, do I. Like, do I have to? Like, this would really help our investigation. Like, she. I think she'll trust you. And I'm like, okay. So I get brought down to the station. They hook me up, and they have me call. So I call, and I'm like, hey, Cassandra. And she's like, hi. And I'm like, what happened the other night? Like, how are you feeling? I heard you went to the hospital. Like, are you okay? And she was like, oh, yeah, yeah, I'm fine. And I was like, okay. She's like, what about you? And I'm like, no, I'm good. I'm good. Like, you know, the contraction stopped. I said, you know, I was just more worried about you. And I was like, this whole thing is crazy. And they're like, yeah, they wrote down questions for me to, like, ask, which are all, like, in the police report, which I found. It's like, all these questions that they wanted me to ask. And so I had. I was supposed to narrow down her being in the room alone. So then I had to go into, like, this is crazy. Like, how did that fire start? I don't know how that fire started. Then I was like, they told me that you said we were smoking weed in my room. Like, that's a. Like, we weren't smoking weed. She goes, I would never say that. And I'm like, okay. And I'M like, well, you were in the room, though, right? Like, before the fire started. Like, you were physically there by yourself. And then she was like, yeah. And then all of a sudden, you hear, don't talk to them. Like, a man's voice. Get off the phone. And then click, oh, wow. And then that was it. That was the last time I ever talked to her. It was the last. But I was able to give them, like, they were able to at least get that to, I think, to kind of not put me. Because she said that we were smoking weed and that we ashed in, like, my closet or something, and I'm like, girl, I'm nine months pregnant.

[Annie Elise]

Like, what do you mean?

[Angelique]

So that's what she told them, and that's why they were questioning me about it. And so I just had to get them to, like, understand that it wasn't me. So after that, I end up going into labor. I find out I have preeclampsia, and I am in the hospital for, like, seven days. My room is shut. Like, basically, I'm put down as Jane Doe. Police are outside my room. Nobody can come in unless they have, like, a special code.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

So if they knew that there was

[Annie Elise]

such a danger and a risk there, why wasn't she arrested for anything?

[Angelique]

So they couldn't find her. After she left the hospital, nobody knew where she was at.

[Annie Elise]

Okay.

[Angelique]

So nobody could find out where she was. The sister was in different country. Different country. Nobody knew. And so. And I remember when I went into the hospital, I didn't talk to the cops at all. Like, there was a cop stationed outside of, like, my door. But, like, I never. I never talked to anybody, and I think it was just best that way. I ended up going through a really traumatic birth. Like, that ended with me, you know, I ended up, like, bleeding out and passed out in the bathroom in a puddle of my own blood.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my gosh.

[Angelique]

And I had to have, like, a blood transfusion. And Ryland, you know, when Ryland was, like, when I was giving birth to him, like, he was faced the opposite way, so his heart rate was dropped. Like, it was a very honestly traumatic birth. And they were trying really hard not to give me a C section because of what I went through. But, like, we both came out with infections. My water broke too early. Like, there was a lot. So, yeah, it was a lot on my body and on my myself. So by the time I gave birth, it was February 26th, so 10 days from the incident. I was released from the hospital about four or five days later. So I went home, and I just had nightmares, like, for days. Like, and I didn't leave my house. Like, I stayed literally on a couch for, like, days and days and days because I was scared. I was terrified. Now I have this baby that she wanted. Like, what's gonna happen? And then I think it was March 4th. I think it was March 4th or March 5th. In the middle of the night. It was, like, midnight. My mom came into my room, and she was waking me up, and I was like, what? She was like, it's Detective Turner. And I was like, okay. So I get on the phone, and she goes, we have her. And I'm like, what? So then I start to wake up, and I'm like, what do you mean? She's like, we have her. And I'm like, cassandra? And she's like, yes. And she's like, we have the confession. She confessed everything. Oh, she was gonna kill you. Perform a C section. The fire was never meant to be a part of this, but it played a role. So, like, when she couldn't kill you the first time because you turned around, she was hoping that the fire was gonna, like, overcome you with smoke and you would pass out, and then she'd be able to perform the C section and let the body burn with all of the evidence. Oh, my God. It was a very diabolical plan, specifically because the fire was never meant to be a part of it.

[Annie Elise]

She just was trying to improvise at that point.

[Angelique]

She was trying to improvise.

[Annie Elise]

What was it like hearing that and getting the validation, but also hearing the details of what she was planning.

[Angelique]

I slept for the first time that night.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

I slept for the first time that night without waking up. And it was a really. I felt like I wasn't crazy because I felt like everybody thought I was crazy. I'll be quite honest with you. My not so close friends, like, just acquaintances that were finding out, thought I was attention seeking, thought I was lying. I had family members that didn't even check on me, didn't care, Thought I was just exaggerating the whole thing. So there was a moment where I wondered, like, am I? And as time goes by, I was like, was it really that bad?

[Annie Elise]

Right?

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Because everything.

[Annie Elise]

You become a little bit desensitized to it, and you look back and you don't remember that feeling in the moment. And so it's easy to be like, was I overreacting? Maybe I was. Yeah. I totally understand what you mean.

[Angelique]

So then the next day, it came out on the news nationwide, and that's when all the I'm sorrys came. That's when all the I'm so sorry I didn't believe you. I'm sorry that I wasn't there for you. I'm sorry that you went through this alone. Like, have you ever heard her confession? Unfortunately, the first time I ever heard it was on the ID channel, and they didn't tell me. So when it aired, that was my first time ever hearing her confession, and I. I vomited because I had never. Nobody had ever given me the opportunity to listen to it. My case was handled, was very. It was handled very incorrectly. I didn't get a lot of tools. I didn't get anything. So it was. I felt like when I heard it on the ID channel, though, it was very eerie. And it's also, like, the ID channel, you know, puts, like, a little bit of dramatic, like, music behind it and stuff. But I remember sitting there, watching the ID channel of, like, the episode, and then all of a sudden, it goes. They play actors in it and stuff. It was called Frenemies. And so, like, it was like, actors, actresses that are playing, like, me and Cassandra. And then all of a sudden, at the end, it says actual footage. And, like, it's her voice, and she's like, I was just gonna stab her just a couple of times. I wasn't trying to kill. But if that's what I had to do, then, yeah, I guess I was gonna have to. Wow. Oh, my God.

[Annie Elise]

So, but then the most frustrating part in all of this, she didn't end up getting charged with attempted murder, correct?

[Angelique]

That is correct.

[Annie Elise]

And can you explain why that happened? Despite a confession, the knives, the equipment, like, everything, fingerprints, everything, she was not charged with attempted murder.

[Angelique]

Also, one thing I did want to say was the only reason they caught her. So I did find out the only reason they caught her was because Marty called the sister when she came back into the country and said, you need to. I need to tell you what's been happening since you've been gone. And when her sister heard, she called 911 and said, come get my sister. She's here at the house.

[Annie Elise]

Good.

[Angelique]

So that the sister was the reason why I was able. Like, why we were able to even get her. Now during the whole legal process, it was. I don't remember talking to one person. It was like a whole year had went by, and I just dissociated the whole year because I was trying to learn to be a new mom. And what sucks about this is that, like, you're a mom, you know? Your first, you know, you have your first baby, you have all these, like, moments that you think, like, that things are gonna happen as a first mom. You're like, oh, I'm gonna give birth this way. This is what's gonna happen. You're gonna come home in this, we're gonna do this. You're gonna have, you know, you plan out, like, what this is all gonna look like. I didn't get that. I feel like, if anything, she took that away from me because I was in so much pain.

[Annie Elise]

She did.

[Angelique]

And I didn't know how to even parent at that point. Like, I was just happy that I had this miracle. But she took everything. She took my birth away from me. She took my son's first year for me, Like, I just associated throughout the whole thing. I don't remember his first steps. I don't remember what his first baby food was. I don't remember what his first word was, because I was just trying to survive. And so I do remember not talking to everybody I've talked to, talking to one person at all. And I remember asking my parents, like, had anyone ever called us? Like, I know I was in like a. Such. Such like a dissociation at that. At that point, like, did anything happen that I don't remember? And my parents said they don't remember anybody ever, like, trying to contact us until January.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

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[Annie Elise]

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[Angelique]

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[Angelique]

today to check your eligibility restrictions apply. It might have been the beginning of February of 2020 12, and a year had went by and they finally called and stated that they wanted to talk about a plea bargain. And I was like, wait, why? I was like, what?

[The RealReal Advertiser]

Why?

[Annie Elise]

Why would you do that? If she. You have her confession, you have this,

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

why do you need to do a plea bargain?

[Angelique]

Yeah, exactly. I was like, I don't get it. Like, why is this not a strong enough case? And they said, well, our biggest part of the case was the confession. And I was like, okay. And they were like, the cops didn't read her her Miranda rights at the time of her confession, so that has been thrown out.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my God.

[Angelique]

And as of right now, it's not illegal to carry two butcher knives in the state of Arizona. You can carry. I said, so I can walk down the street with knives and nobody will say? They said, technically, yes.

[Annie Elise]

So because the cops didn't do their job with reading her the Miranda rights, the confession is basically null and void. There's no other evidence that proves that there was attempted murder happening. There was, yeah, the fire incident. But you can't use her confession. She's probably not gonna reconfess, I would imagine. And so what were they able to charge her with?

[Angelique]

Arson? They scared me into a plea bargain, though, because they said, we can go to trial if that's what you want. They said.

[Annie Elise]

But they were able to show the confession.

[Angelique]

They said, there's a very high chance that she'll walk. They said, so what we're presenting to you is seven and a half years, technically eight and a half with her time served because she's been in there for a year, but we're gonna. They did give me the option. They said, we're gonna give you the option if you want to send her to prison or if you wanna send her to Ash, which is called the Arizona State Hospital. Okay. And so they gave me a few days to think about it and I came back with my decision and it was a really tough one. But at this point, I had been presented that she was mentally ill, that she had all these different, you know, things going on, and that, you know, I knew that one day she would get out. And I didn't want her to reoffend to anybody, so I wanted her to get the help that she needed. So when I came back, I said, I want to send her to Ash so that she can get the proper medication, get her life back, and when she gets released, she doesn't do this to anybody again. So that's where I sent her.

[Annie Elise]

I have to say, I am blown away by like the way you're able to rationalize things and think things through at such a young age. Honestly, it's like making me emotional thinking about it. No, because even how you had said when you had found out you were pregnant, that within 24 hours you decided you wanted to get clean and be on a good path and be there for your child, and then now having the compassion for somebody and their mental well being and being like, I'd rather her not reoffend in the future, whereas if it were me, even still today,

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

I'd probably throw her in prison.

[Annie Elise]

The hardest one you possibly could, put

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

her in Alcatraz, like, throw away the key.

[Annie Elise]

But to like, be that young and have such compassion, to be like, I don't want her to reoffend and I want her to get the help that she needs. That is so incredibly big of you. It really is. And you, if you're not, you should absolutely be proud of yourself for that. Because I don't think a lot of people would have made that choice.

[Angelique]

I found that out a lot on social media where people are like, you're not saying that I'm too nice. Because they didn't say that. They said the same thing that you said. Like the fact that you were that age and even going through a trauma, you rationalized like that type of, of way, and you don't want her to

[Annie Elise]

reoffend and hurt somebody else. You're not even thinking about your, yourself and your own vindication and the consequences for what she did to you. But you're thinking you're forward thinking being like, I don't want somebody else to go through this. And that is a huge, huge thing.

[Angelique]

Thank you. I really appreciate that. That's something that I really do. And it's really nice hearing, like, someone say that just because, like, when I go to a lot of places, like, I don't really talk about it too much. So thank you. I appreciate that.

[Annie Elise]

Of course.

[Angelique]

It was. It was. It was. I felt. I felt proud about that moment. I was able to go to court after, and, like, they gave me the opportunity to, like, talk on my own behalf. And I wrote this long letter, and I remember it took me forever to talk because I kept crying every single time I, you know, studied that letter. You know, when you're gonna go watch a perpetrator get, you know, sentenced, you're like, okay, let me just, you know, read this to everybody. My fit. My family, my mom, my dad, everybody. And I was like, yes, I got this. The minute I stepped in that courtroom, it was like, of course, like, all the emotions came out.

[Annie Elise]

Did you see her?

[Angelique]

I did see her. I read her what I stated. And at the very end, I stated, you know, that I forgave her because I don't want to have hatred in my heart. I don't want to live my life hating somebody for somebody that was mentally ill or somebody that made a mistake. And, you know, I said, like, you know, I don't like you. I don't like you. Every bone in my body tells me to hate you. And I said, but I refuse to allow myself to have hatred. And I said, I hope that you take what I'm doing to you by sending you to Ash. I hope you remember in the back of your mind when you're released that I did that, that I showed compassion and love and understanding and forgiveness, because you're not gonna see that from a lot of people. So, like, take that and please, like, do better. And I remember the judge looking at her and telling her, like, cassandra, this is now your opportunity to talk. Do you have anything that you wanna say to this young woman? And she. She stood up, looked at me, looked at the judge and said, no, you, Honor, and sat back down.

[Annie Elise]

You're like, I take it all back.

[Angelique]

Send her to Max.

[Annie Elise]

That's what I would have done. Like, fuck that. Let's take that all back and send

[Angelique]

her to the chair. I literally was. I remember, like, my brain was like, are you for real? Yes. The judge even said, again, Cassandra, I'm gonna repeat this one more time. This is your last Time you will ever see this woman. Do you have anything that you want to say? No.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

It was. And the way that she did it, dude, it was so. It was the most eerie moment, I think even more than her confession. It was the. It was the smirk.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

It was the no remorse. No remorse. And that made me feel like. Shh. That made me feel like shit, because I was just like.

[Annie Elise]

I just poured my heart out.

[Angelique]

I just poured my heart out to you. I can't believe that. Oh, my God. So I remember walking out of there, I was just like, I am so happy this is over. But, like, this is crazy. And I remember giving. My, like, giving. I remember being outside. The news reporters were out there. It was, like, lights flashing everywhere, and they were like, what did you say? What did you do? Blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, here you go. Here's the letter. Analyze it. Take video.

[Annie Elise]

Do what you want to do.

[Angelique]

Do what you want to do with it. This is what I said. I'm done. We're done. I'm happy this is over. I'm gonna go be a mom to my son, and hopefully she gets better. And, like, that was the. That was, like, the end of it. I mean, for the most part.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

Until I went back home, because Florence is, like, a good hour away from us, so that's, like, where all this was done. I live in Maricopa, and so when I got back home, like, news reporters were outside of my house. Like, everybody wanted to have an interview with me, of course. And I just stayed isolated for, like, after, like, two weeks. It kind of just, like, slowed. Everybody kind of left me alone.

[Annie Elise]

So she went to Ash for, what was it, seven and a half more years?

[Angelique]

Yes. So her date of release, she went February, something. I don't remember what it was, but her release was August, like, first or something, which equaled, like, seven and a half years from that sentence. So technically. Technically eight and a half, though, because she served the one year.

[Annie Elise]

And what year was that?

[Angelique]

2011 is when it happened.

[Annie Elise]

So she. She's out.

[Angelique]

She's out.

[Annie Elise]

She's been out.

[Angelique]

She's been out.

[Annie Elise]

Have you had. Had you know anything about where she's at, what she's doing?

[Angelique]

I went to her release.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, okay. And what was that?

[Angelique]

Like, that was very interesting. I wasn't gonna go. I was in 2019. I had, like, forgotten that, like, she was gonna be released. I became a surrogate, so.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my gosh.

[Angelique]

Yes.

[Annie Elise]

That's incredible.

[Angelique]

Thank you. Thank you. I really wanted to find some sense of like, purpose of, like, me allowing somebody, like, to have it felt very therapeutic. I had originally done it because one of my best friends couldn't have a baby. And I watched her have miscarriage after miscarriage, and it broke my heart. So we always joked around that, like, after I was done having kids, I'd be her surrogate. She ended up having a baby. It was the man. It wasn't her. After I was done having my own kids, I was like, I still want to do this. Like, I feel like this would be such a great purpose in life, like, to be able to give somebody something that they can't have. Because, remember, I'm under the terms that Cassandra can't have. Like, she had. They tried giving me this story that she had, like, hysterical pregnancies and she couldn't have babies. This is why her brain, you know, she thought I was carrying her child. Like, they had painted this whole picture that, like, she was a woman who just couldn't have a baby and just lingered onto me and thought I was carrying hers. So I was like, you know, there's women out here that can't have their own children. Like, if I could have a baby for somebody with their DNA and give it to them, like, I don't know, like, it feels like a sense of healing. And so I did it, and I ended up being pregnant, and so I wasn't gonna. I was pregnant with a surrogacy baby.

[Annie Elise]

I mean, you were pregnant at her release? Yeah.

[Angelique]

Yes.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my gosh.

[Angelique]

Yes. And I didn't. I didn't. I didn't anticipate that happening because we had failed to, like, a transfer prior. So I should have, like, probably had given birth at that time, but instead, I was going through the pregnancy, and so I told myself I wasn't going to go.

[Annie Elise]

I literally.

[Angelique]

They called me. Do you want to come? No, I don't want to go. I'll. I'll listen. But then three days before, I had decided that, like, no, that's not who I am. Like, that's not who I am. I'm going to go there. This is going to be a sense of empowerment. This is me taking my story back. This is me taking everything back. And, like. Like, owner. I don't know, I felt, like, a certain way, like, I had to be there. So three days prior, I called them, and I was. I don't know who I called, but I was like, I'm going. I'm gonna bring my dad and my. My husband, and, like, we're all gonna go. And so we went. We went to Ash. It looked like a prison. It was kind of scary. There was a. There's. It was kind of scary in there, I'm gonna be quite honest, because there's a lot of. There's a lot of mental. Mental. I don't want to say mentally insane. Well, yeah, it would be mentally unstable.

[Annie Elise]

Unstable, absolutely. That is a scary situation to be in.

[Angelique]

It is because, like, I was walking by and, like, they were outside, and, like, I could tell they were having, like, some type of, like, recess area, and it was just. It was scary. So when I got in there, it was just like a prison, though. Like, you go in there, you, you know, they take your bags, you get. You know, they check you and everything. And then you sit in this little courtroom, and you can hear everybody's case because there's a bunch of people that have these cases that day. So then Cassandra, this lady who's been, like, helping me and prepping me through everything, comes and sits next to. To me. I don't remember her name, but she was there during the trial. So she had known me. And, like, she's a part of it. She was a part of it. So she came there and she was like, you know, do you. Do you want to speak? Like, you don't have to. You can. You don't. Like, you can just watch, like, whatever you want. And I was like, no, I. I came here. I want to speak, and I don't know what I'm going to say. I went there with nothing. Like, no paper. Just went there to pour my heart out and to. Essentially, I wanted. In Ash, the way that it works is, like, if they believe she's still mentally unstable, they can keep her. And I don't believe that she was mentally stable. Every six months in Ash, they do a reporting where they do, like, they bring her upon the board, and she's supposed to be presented with what medication she has. If it's working, what's not working, I stay on top of all of those. So every six months, I get all that stuff, and not once has it ever lasted longer than, like, 15 seconds.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

Because she's mentally not stable. Oh, my God. So the goal was that if she was. If they ever did deem that she was mentally stable within her sentencing, she would spend the rest of it in prison. That was our plea agreement. So every time six months came, she would go upon the board, they'd say, she's mentally unstable. None of the medication's working. Let's try something different. So that kept happening Kept happening. And then magically, like, two months before her release, she's magically better. And I was like, no, she is not better. You can't. Like, that is some bullshit. Like, I'm not gonna. You're not gonna tell me that she's better. She's not. Like, just three months ago, you guys deem.

[Annie Elise]

Or she was faking being unwell the whole time so that she wouldn't have to spend the remainder of her sentence in prison.

[Angelique]

Exactly.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

That's what I was. Very manipulative. So I went there with like, no, I'm not here to cry. I'm here to fight, because I'm not gonna. I'll be damned if she's gonna not hear what I have to say, and I'm not gonna be. And I'll be damned if I'm not gonna fight for mine and my son's safety.

[Annie Elise]

Yep.

[Angelique]

So I went there, and I was. I was pissed. So I went upon. I was mad. And then I looked at her, and I felt like a gummy bear. I was like, no, no. So I had to, like, take a second turn around. I was like, can I please not look at the. Like, look at my perpetrator. Can I please turn around? So, like, I turned around and talked. And then when in the middle of me talking, I don't remember exactly what I said, but I was very passionate. Very passionate. When I felt comfortable enough, then I turned around and I said, I'm not scared of you. And I want you to realize that I am not scared of you, but I have a son that I need to protect. And, like, what you did is not okay. And you sitting there thinking that you're better when you're not is not okay. Like, you know, you may have everybody else fooled, but you don't have me fooled. And I looked at the. You know, the people, like, the panel of. I don't know what they're called, because it wouldn't. There was, like, five or six of them.

[Annie Elise]

The people who are responsible for the decision.

[Angelique]

Yes. And I remember looking at them, and I said, like, I looked at the woman, and I said, could you imagine being pregnant and almost having your baby cut out of you? Like, could you imagine this? I said, but the thing is, is that she's not in there for that. She's in there for arson. But it did matter. Like, that mattered.

[Annie Elise]

It's context.

[Angelique]

It's about it. And so I do remember when they were about to make their decision, the lady. Like, they all started, like, making their decisions, and the lady Stood up and she goes, did you guys all not hear what this young woman has said? Did you guys not see how much courage she had to stand in front of us and say this? I don't agree. I'm calling a recess. We need to go to the back and talk. Oh, my gosh, it was so crazy. The lady that I was with goes, I have worked here for so long and I've never seen that happen before. This has never happened. She goes, they've never went to the back to go talk or, you know, whatever. And so they did like a 30 minute recess. And I remember going into the bathroom and I was like about to vomit and I. I had a full on panic attack. Like I couldn't breathe. I was literally like, like holding onto the sink and I remember screaming on the top of my lungs because it just. Everything hurt. Everything hurt inside of me. And I was pregnant. I was pregnant too. So it was just like a whole surreal moment. And when I went back in, she was outvoted and she still fought for me, though. So they were, they released her with nothing. Just go out, live your life.

[Annie Elise]

Figure out your life.

[Angelique]

Yeah, figure out your life. No, nothing. Like, nobody's gonna check on you. Nobody's gonna make sure you're taking your medication. But the lady, whoever it was that lady was, she was able to get them to at least allow, like, for them for somebody to check on her. She had like, now she had stipulations when she got out like that she had to go to some type of counseling and they had to make sure she was taking her medication, which was only gonna go on for a year. But it was better than nothing. She had fought as hard as she could have fought for me, and that meant a lot.

[Annie Elise]

So Cassandra's out right now and you don't know what she's doing or where she's at. Have you followed along closely to try to like, keep tabs on her?

[Angelique]

People have told me things about her. So she lives like an hour away from me.

[Annie Elise]

That's way too close for comfort.

[Angelique]

Way too close for comfort. She lives very, very close to like my brother in law. Like not even like six or seven minutes minutes away from oh my gosh. And I know where she works. Like, I know all these certain things about her, but I just don't, like, I don't poke the bear. I don't tell people where she is. I don't. I just feel like, because, like, when I started to become more public on like, you know, TikTok and Instagram and Telling my story and explaining things. It got kind of scary because I don't want her to try to come back after me. Yeah.

[Annie Elise]

Let me just stay in my bubble. You stay away from me. I'm living my life.

[Angelique]

Exactly. And I never say anything bad. And I always say that like I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna say anything bad. All I'm gonna do is tell you guys the truth about what happened because this is not her story. This is mine. And I am allowed to take control of my own story and tell it how I. How it did happen. Not even how I think it happened. It happened like this.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And so, you know, I don't want. She could be mad about it, but, you know, she hasn't came up to me. I've. She's had like family members have.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

And her family members have come to

[Angelique]

you, her husband's family members, because they didn't. She got married. And that's a whole other dynamic. Like I heard that she got married, she had a baby, the baby got taken away by CPS and the family all found me because she had not told her husband or any of their family that she was in ash for what she was in there for. Oh. So things started when I started becoming more public. They were like, is this true? And I'm like, it's true. And I said, they're like, can you talk to her husband? I said, absolutely not.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah, no way.

[Angelique]

I will not do that. I said, if her husband wants to watch my stuff, which I'm sure she has watched, he is more than welcome to.

[Annie Elise]

He can get the story.

[Angelique]

Exactly. But I will not talk and I will not tell him anything because I will not be the reason why anything happens in her life. This is her consequences of what she did. And I don't want to be involved

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[Annie Elise]

Did you ever find out who she was on the phone with that day? Calling back and forth.

[Angelique]

So right after sentencing, I don't know if you ever followed in 2020. Do you remember when, like, Save our Children's came out?

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So hashtag Save our Children's came out Right before that happened. I had gone to the release, and then I decided, you know what? I don't know anything about my case. I know nothing about it. I never wanted to. I do remember, though, I did an article within Maricopa, which is just like, my local, like. Like, newspaper. And I remember, like, I was telling, like, we just did, like, a brief article when the ID channel was coming out, and he had grabbed the police report and some of the interrogation tapes, and he had told me, and he gave it to me, the police report, and said, when you're ready one day, you should read this. He says, because I think you were lied to. He says, I don't think you know your story the way that you think you know it. And I was like, excuse me. Like, I was insulted. Like, what do you mean, I don't know my story? He's like, I wrote this how you wanted. He said, but I want you to know, like, there's stuff in here that you don't know about. And you wanna know what I did with it? I shredded it. Oh, my gosh. I didn't wanna know.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

But that always stayed with me. So when she got released, it brought all those wounds back up. And I was like, you know what? I'm ready. Like, I feel like I'm in. I. I just watched her get released. Like, I feel like I'm in a point in, like, time my life where I can do this.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I went down to the police station, I grabbed everything. I said I want everything on my case. I want the police report, I want the interrogation tapes. I want anything you can give me to get me to understand. So they released everything to me, and I went down. It was her confession. Interrogation tape is, like, three hours. And I didn't have a CD player in my house, so I had to put it in my car. So I drove around my town for three hours.

[Annie Elise]

Oh, my God.

[Angelique]

Listening to her talk about what she. How, like, just, like, obviously they ask, you know, certain questions, but she, like, bullshitted through the whole thing for a very long time. And so after, like, when it gets down to, like, the last, like, 45 minutes or like an hour, she fake. They're pissed. Like, the detective then fire investigator, they're like, listen, we don't give a fuck what happens to you. Like, you want to keep playing games you don't want to say what's going on? Like, that's fine. Like, we're just going to book you right now. You can deal with, like, everybody else later. And then she decides to start talking. So when they start getting her to talk, she starts talking about, you know, how she is a part of a gang and how she was involved with the gang leader. His name was. I forgot his name. It's in the police report. I think it might be Edward. Edwin was never her husband. All of that was a lie. It was a guy that she used to like in high school, but he was never real. But who was the people that she was talking to all the time? She was talking to this guy, the gang leader. They asked, how did you meet Angelique? Like, how did you guys. How did you come about with Angelique being the person that you wanted to choose to do this for, like, to kill her? And she goes, well, Hannah. She goes, well, what do you mean? She was like, Hannah introduced us. And I told him, I met this girl. She's a pregnant person out here. And. And he said that she would be perfect, that, you know, for me to become friends with her, and when the time was right, we would execute our plan. And the way she talks about it, though, in this confession is like, we normally. Like, she talks about, like, they've done this before. She talks about how much money she would get for it. She talks about how there was a buyer waiting across the border in Mexico for them.

[Annie Elise]

This wasn't about her trying to steal your child for herself because she was going through something mentally and thought either your baby was her hers, or she was so devastated that she couldn't have her own child. It was strictly a transaction.

[Angelique]

It was a transaction. She was gonna get paid, and she was gonna stay in Mexico and not come back.

[Annie Elise]

Wow.

[Angelique]

And the thought when I heard that, like, I have a recording on my phone of it. And I remember, like, when I'm recording, I'm recording it for my best friend. Because, like, when I. Like, in certain parts, I would record certain things. She's like, do you want me to sit with you? And I'm like, no, I need to do this by myself. Like, let me be by myself, but I'll record things for you. And I'm sitting there and I'm listening to it, and you can see, like. You see, like, my CD player, like, my car. And you see my hands start to shake, and you see me start. You hear me start to cry. Because, like, it's so. It's so just like, nonchalant. Like I was nothing. All I was was a transaction. All I was, you know, you were the carrier. I was the carrier. And she just kind of just goes into detail. Like, she goes into just straight detail about everything, just how. How they were going to do it. The fire. Well, what happened. The fire, that was never even a part of. Of the plan like she. That just happened. But it makes sense because it all aligns in together. You know, you got to think when she wanted me to leave, to go to the park, so supposedly he was in the van waiting at the park for me. They were hoping that they could take me back to the house and do it there. The goal was not to have the C section performed in my house, but she had to keep improvising because I wasn't giving up. I wasn't leaving the house. When I turned around, when she said three, that phone rang immediately. He was watching. When she said, hey, come get us, without even hesitation of who this is. That was him. Yeah. It was a plan.

[Annie Elise]

They had orchestrated it together. So now, looking back at everything in hindsight, Your son is 15 now.

[Angelique]

He's 15.

[Annie Elise]

And you have three children, correct?

[Angelique]

Yes.

[Annie Elise]

How old are they?

[Angelique]

So Rylan's 15, Maddox is 10, and Scarlet's 8.

[Annie Elise]

Okay, and how does he know anything about your story?

[Angelique]

Yes. So Ryland. Ryland's gone on a lot of interviews with me as a baby. So, like, we did, like, the Dr. Phil show, and then we did the ID channel. So he was a part of both of those things, but he was a baby. When I went to the release, he would have been eight and a half. So he was eight and a half when she was released. And I sat down that day when I came back home from the release, and I told him everything. And I said, I'm not telling you this to scare you. I'm telling you this because I want you to be protected, and I want you to not be naive. And I want you to understand that there was a bad woman out here who wanted to take you. I'm not sure why she wanted to take you, but there was a reason. I showed him her picture. I went to the school, printed out the picture. I took time off of work for about three months because I changed our routines. I wanted to make sure that I didn't have a routine that she could follow. You know, Dr. Phil told me that I didn't have to worry about her ever coming back after me because she wanted a newborn.

[Annie Elise]

Because he knows.

[Angelique]

Yeah. Cause he knows. Yeah.

[Annie Elise]

Cause he knows.

[Angelique]

So I was like, that's what he always told me. And that's what people always told me. Like, why are you scared? He wanted. She wanted a newborn.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Retaliation, anything.

[Annie Elise]

It could be just to ruin your life because she thinks you ruined hers. Now, there could be a million reasons.

[Angelique]

It's not, you know, people call me naive. Like, it's like an insult. I'm not insulted that I'm naive, but you're not going to see me be naive about the same. The same situation twice.

[Annie Elise]

Right.

[Angelique]

Like, we're allowed to grow. That's what, as humans, we're meant to grow. We're meant to learn, you know, go through hardship and learn from that and grow from it. And so this is me growing from that. And if I'm scared, I'm scared.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I just wanted to change everything about our lives. Like, I mean, we didn't move or anything, but like. Like, we. You know, I did leave Maricopa for about six or seven years, and then I ended up back in Maricopa. So it was just changing everything, being more visual, being more, you know, like, realizing our surroundings. And for about a year or so, it felt really good and we weren't bothered. And so I do feel like now I feel a lot better, but I'm still the same way.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

I still don't keep my eyes off of things, especially with me being public. You know, I don't want. I feel like my story is very unique. Fetal abduction is something that doesn't happen often, but we learn from other people's mistakes, and we learn from things that they've gone through. And so I'm not going to stop talking about the situation.

[Annie Elise]

It's your story, it's yours to tell. You shouldn't ever feel like you need to stop talking about it.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

And how has that journey been like for you?

[Annie Elise]

Because you have gone on Dr. Phil, you've done interviews, you have a very big presence and growing presence on TikTok and social media where you're sharing your story. Do you feel like that has. Has been empowering for you and that it's been received well? And how has that entire situation been for you?

[Angelique]

At first on TikTok, it was very scary. People started to recognize me from the Dr. Phil show, and that's kind of how that transpired. And that's when I decided to take my story back and kind of give an explanation and kind of break everything down for people, because the Dr. Phil show did not show that. So now it feels empowering because I feel like I'm finally being able to take my story back from what other people have said about me. The Dr. Phil show, I feel like, made me feel. Made me feel like I was stupid. The ID Channel wasn't. It wasn't bad, but it didn't give the facts. It didn't. It gave lies to, like, unfortunately, like, when you do documentaries and things like that, people. I think people need to realize that sometimes it's not the truth. Sometimes there's things that aren't truthful in it. And so this was my first time to actually say it from my own mouth. Now I got a lot of backlash. For a lot of times, people kept telling me to, like, stop feeling sorry for myself and.

[Annie Elise]

Are you out of your mind?

[Angelique]

What? It's. It's. It's the Internet. It's crazy.

[Annie Elise]

Trust me. Yeah.

[Angelique]

So I stopped talking about it for a little bit. Like, I never went on podcasts. I never did anything else. And then in 2023, I had. I think I went on my first true crime podcast, which was like, the Murder Diaries. And that was my first time ever, like, doing something with, like, true crime. And then I started to get more involved into true crime, just, like, listening to other people's stories. And I started to realize I wasn't alone.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

I started to realize my biggest thing that I always state is that trauma is trauma, no matter how big or how small. Like, there's no reason to compare, like, my story with somebody else. Like, we all go through the same thing. We all go through ptsd. We all can relate. We all dissociate. Like, it just felt like I finally stepped into this world where I wasn't alone. And I still wasn't ready to, like, venture off and talk to, like, these other people, but I felt. I felt good. So then I started to learn to do things like, and talk to other, like, talk to, you know, do podcasts. And then I decided for the. Then I decided, you know what? I know it's been a couple of years and people criticized me and said I was stupid, but I'm gonna tell my story with confidence.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And that's when I did my full, Like, I have a story time button on my TikTok. It's very long. It's like 10 minutes. Like, it's like seven 10 minute videos. But it's basically what you and I talked about. Like, I break everything down. And it felt so empowering. It felt so good. It felt good to finally, like, be able to talk about, like, everything. And the biggest part was the confidence that it took like, so I feel. I feel amazing about it, and I feel like I'm helping other people. I have. You know, sometimes I feel like maybe I shouldn't talk about it because people are like, okay, it happened to you. Get over it.

[Annie Elise]

No.

[Angelique]

Like, it's been years. You don't know how many times I hear that. And sometimes it gets in my head where I'm like, maybe I should stop talking about it.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Yeah, you go through something similar to

[Annie Elise]

this, and then you tell me when you want to stop talking about it. Give me a break.

[Angelique]

Well, and I think people need to realize that. Like, I didn't start talking about it until 2020, and that's almost 10 years after my trauma. Like, and if you talk to a lot of survivors, a lot of them do the same thing. They don't talk for a while because they can't. It takes a while to go through therapy to understand what happened to you, to break everything down and then also wanting to talk. You don't usually find survivors that go through the trauma and they're like, okay, let's go. Yeah, like, let's go ahead and talk about it. Just, like, how I am right now. They don't do that. So I am just really happy like, that I was able just to fully, like, take my story back and talk about it. I met some friends, like Tara. I've met Tara. She really helped me with building my confidence and talking to podcast, and I recently just did a documentary for the Dr. Phil and all these things. Like, I always feel like Tara's like my big sister. She guides me and helps me, and it's just. It's just really nice.

[Annie Elise]

What do you hope that people take away when they hear your story?

[Angelique]

I hope they take away the intuition part. I hope that they understand that. Because as young, not even just young women, like, as just young people in life, like, we tend to want to run away from whatever that voice inside of our head is telling us, or we don't understand what it is, because I didn't understand. I'm very thankful that I listened. But what I want other people to realize is that I between. It only took, like, maybe half a second that I could have died and this could have, you know, happened to me. So I always want people to take away the intuition and just trusting yourself and learning to be more intuitive with yourself. But I also want other people and young. I want young women to understand what this crime is, because, unfortunately, when it happened to me, it wasn't very common. And ever since 2011, there's more cases that have happened. You know, you have Michelle, you have Marlene. Is it Marlene Reagan? All of them, like, you know, they're different. Our stories are different, but they're also very. It's very alike. And, you know, it's just that I don't want to see this happen. It literally breaks my heart when I see this happening, because it's just, like, I feel like these women could have been saved. And we're not talking about this crime that much because it's not common.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And, you know, like, when you have, like, sexual abuse or you have, like, you know, domestic violence, like, you have this whole circle of people that unfortunately, it's so sad that it's happened to so many people. But there's this larger circle. There's not that with fetal abduction.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

And I don't want there to be.

[Annie Elise]

Right.

[Angelique]

Please don't join this club.

[Annie Elise]

Yeah.

[Angelique]

I don't want you to be a part of this club. But please, like, take away from the fact of making friends when you're pregnant, being aware when you're pregnant. Because honestly, like, I think there was some type of study done that said, like, the number one cause of death in the US to pregnant women was murder or was, like, something along the lines of that. And it wasn't just about fetal abduction. It was about, like, husbands that murder their pregnant wives. All of that. Like, we're in such a vulnerable state at that moment, and we're a target. So I just want women to understand that. Yeah.

[Annie Elise]

Well, thank you so much for being here and for sharing your story, truly. I know that it was longer than we initially had planned. No, no, please. I'm grateful.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

Thank you so much, much for sharing all of that.

[Annie Elise]

I know that everybody listening to has been. Is fascinated and loves hearing your story, too. So I appreciate it.

[Angelique]

Thank you. Thank you for having me. It's been great.

[Annie Elise]

Thank you. So I'm going to put all of your socials, everything in the episode description and the show notes so people can follow along with your story, your journey. They can go watch your story time. But thank you so much for being here.

[Angelique]

Yes. Thank you, Annie.

[Annie Elise]

Angelique's story is one that is both terrifying and also incredibly powerful. It's a reminder for all of us that sometimes danger can come from the people that we trust the most. And again, another reminder that our instincts are there for a reason. I've said this before, and I know it maybe sounds lame or cliche, but your intuition and your gut, it's there as your first line of defense. It's there to protect you. It's there to tell you when something's wrong. So when you listen to that gut feeling, it quite literally can save your life. Her story is also an incredible story about survival. I mean, Angelique lived through something that very few people could even imagine, no less survive and get through. And today, she's using her voice to raise awareness about fetal abduction cases and help others who, God forbid, are in that situation recognize the warning signs. Far too often are we hearing about cases where there's Facebook market exchanges or sales and people befriending them. And that's the plan all along. So by raising awareness this, hopefully it will help curb future fetal abduction cases in the future. Now, really quickly, before we wrap this episode up, I do want to just say this. There is a lot more that is tied into this case. I'm talking video clips, clips of Angelique hearing the confession for the first time. Videos, documents, court filings. So much. I was going to put it throughout this episode, but I really did not want to break up the interview. I felt like I wanted Angelique to be able to share her story uninterrupted. I wanted it to be a clear experience for all of you. So what we've done is something that we've never done before. But depending on how you like it, we may do this for many cases or all cases in the future. But I went ahead and put our entire Angelique case folder over on Patreon, where that way you can see all of the research, all the court filings, all of the videos, the clips, clips that she shared with us firsthand that we didn't put into this episode. The again, the confession, things like that, where it just gives you a little bit more of a deeper look and deeper understanding of this case. Completely optional, of course, but it's for those of you who want to take it a little bit further, a little bit more behind the scenes, behind the research, into the case folder itself, how we gather all of our research and of course, some of those video clips and the material that is tied to this case. So it just helps paint a fuller picture for those of you who are, you know, true crime enthusiasts like myself that want to know every single detail involved in a case.

[Podcast Sponsor/Host]

So all of that is the whole

[Annie Elise]

case folder is over on patreon right now. Patreon.com Annie Elise, you can get access. And once you're over there, please let me know if you want us to start doing that for the majority of our cases. As you know, we collect so much information as we're building an episode between the FOIA requests, the outreach, the interviews, court filings, whatever it may be that we have these massive case folders that we could easily share with you. For those of you who want to sleuth a little bit and want to look into it yourselves and want to see some of this stuff firsthand and it's just again, a little bit of a way to go beyond the episode. So go ahead, take a look. It's up now. And let me know if you want us to start doing that for other cases. But anyway, that back to what I was saying regarding Angelique. So I just want to thank Angelique again for sharing her story with us and thank all of you guys for listening. And if you want to learn more about Angelique, her story, the great work that she's doing, I will include all of her information in the show notes below. But thank you so much for listening. Until the next one, be nice, don't kill people, stay off of Facebook marketplace and just be careful with who you trust. Alright, bye.

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