← Served with Andy Roddick
Served with Andy Roddick
Iga Swiatek talks Doping Case, Wimbledon Championship, & more | Served with Andy Roddick
01:07:29
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- [00:02]
Host
Support for the show comes from our friends at Infosys. Also proud partners of today's guest, IGA Witek. When enterprises turn to AI, they need more than tools. They need a partner who can scale innovation responsibly. That's where Infosys comes in. From modernizing systems to deploying enterprise grade AI, Infosys helps businesses lead with confidence. Beyond the boardroom, Infosys is transforming the sport of tennis as digital innovation partner for the ATB Tour, Australian Open and Roland Garros. Infosys uses AI and analytics to elevate fan experiences experiences and enhance player performance. Visit infosys.com to learn how they're helping businesses and tennis stay ahead of the game.
- [00:45]
Advertiser
Support for this show comes from Pure Leaf Iced Tea when you find yourself in the afternoon slump, you need the right thing to make you bounce back. You need Pure Leaf iced tea. It's real brewed tea made in a variety of bold flavors with just the right amount of naturally occurring caffeine. You're left feeling refreshing, refreshed and revitalized so you can be ready to take on what's next. The next time you need to hit the reset button, grab a Pure Leaf iced tea. Time for a tea break. Time for a Pure Leaf.
- [01:21]
Host
Hey everyone. Welcome to Served. I am pumped up today, fellas. IGA Swiatek is gonna join the show. I am excited for this interview. I'm a little nervous for this interview. All of the things serve brought to you this week by our friends at Infosys. It's gonna be fantastic. So what happened, just to give you kind of a lay of the land of the way stuff works sometimes is believe it or not, IGA's been pretty busy. You know, I can only assume that winning Wimbledon adds to the demands on your time. Supposed to do it Monday. Her team has been brilliant to work with. They said can you do it Thursday? And it's kind of been a moving target. So we were going to have it out last Monday for a Tuesday release. That was easy. Obviously the priority is her getting to Canada, getting training in the whole thing. So we're filming this Thursday of the practice week of Canada. You will be hearing it on Tuesday. And that's the way it works. The miracle of us having a studio in a garage with a bunch of knuckleheads is that we can adjust and we can be flexible. So we really appreciate IGA being willing to come on. But that also means I'm traveling Monday. And so on the back end of this episode, producer Mike and JW will run through all things DC Open. I'm sure there'll be some opinions on Venus Williams her match last week and at this point we don't know how the week finishes. So cool. I was glued to my TV screen. All you jackals that were in the comments disagreeing. My wild card take. Take that. Take that. Venus says I could still win matches out here. That was awesome. I am pumped for the English Viatic interview will be coming up right after this break. Again, Serve Brought to you by Infosys IGA on the other side, support for the show comes from our friends at Infosys. Also proud partners of today's guest, IGA Witek. When enterprises turn to AI, they need more than tools. They need a partner who can scale innovation responsibly. That's where Infosys comes in. From modernizing systems to deploying enterprise grade AI, Infosys helps businesses lead with confidence beyond the boardroom, Infosys is transforming the sport of tennis as digital innovation partner for the ATB Tour, Australian Open and Roland Garros. Infosys uses AI and analytics to elevate fan experiences and enhance player performance. Visit infosys.com to learn how they're helping businesses and tennis stay ahead of the game.
- [03:56]
Advertiser
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- [05:08]
Host
All right everyone, welcome back to serve. Brought to you by our friends at Infosys. We have the six time, the now six time Grand Slam champion, Wimbledon champion, 2025 IGA tech joining the show on served IGA you're already in Canada. Don't you ever get tired?
- [05:29]
Iga Swiatek
Well, first of all, thanks for having me. I do get tired, but I don't think it's time for me to stop. I want to use the momentum. I wasn't able to play these tournaments in Canada a couple of times already. So I'm feeling good, feeling healthy, and a lot of energy, maybe when I'm not jet lagged. So I'm ready to play.
- [05:53]
Host
Amazing. I guess you make everyone else look like lesser humans because of your ability to show up and really kind of put forth maximum effort every week. There's something that we need to address right off the top. Right. So I was lucky enough one day at Wimbledon to be sitting in the Royal Box. And I had the pleasure of watching you play that day. And everything was like, it was a match against Danielle and you were. It was just really like, I left that match and I said, listen, I know grass hasn't been her favorite surface throughout her career. So far. I go, she's in this thing to win it. Based on what I saw today, and everyone knows how that ended. The most important piece of this is in that interview, and I know you've talked about it a couple times. I just need some more information about this strawberries and pasta thing. Is this. Now is. I have questions. So one, congrats on winning Wimbledon and also making this food choice mainstream.
- [06:52]
Iga Swiatek
Yeah, it got kind of crazy. I don't know how that happened. I wasn't expecting that kind of reactions.
- [06:57]
Host
You know, because it's, it's, it's not. I mean, I had never heard of the combination. I was a little stunned and I tried to keep my face like I was supposed to be in the Royal Box.
- [07:05]
Iga Swiatek
You know, you're, you know, your life just started then if you just heard about it.
- [07:11]
Host
So there's a couple of questions like, is it that this could be stupid, but just tell me if it is. So the strawberries that you. They're actually on and in the pasta, or is it like strawberries and is it strawberries and pasta or strawberries and pasta?
- [07:28]
Iga Swiatek
If anyone watched the Wimbledon video, you know, when they tried it, like, that's not the proper way to make it, sorry, Wimbledon. But basically we've got to smash the strawberries so they're like all kind of juicy and then they mix perfectly with the pasta and the yogurt or the cream, you know. So the thing is like, yeah, should smash them as, as hard as possible.
- [07:49]
Host
Wait, wait, wait.
- [07:49]
Iga Swiatek
So that's the thing. So everything is Mixed, you know, so.
- [07:52]
Host
You just smash it together. Cold strawberries, warm pasta, and it's all.
- [07:56]
Iga Swiatek
No, no, no, no. You don't smash the pasta. Come on. That would be.
- [08:00]
Host
Because that would be crazy.
- [08:01]
Iga Swiatek
Yeah, that would be too much. You smash the strawberries and that's, that's the way to like, they're going to connect all the sensations. You know, this juicy, I don't know, strawberry jam.
- [08:14]
Host
I'll tell you this, if I would have known that beforehand, I would have been in like 2004, five and nine Wimbledon finals just smashing strawberries straight into. Straight into spaghetti or whatever else it is. Let's go back to this, this wonderful run that you just had at Wimbledon. I'm curious to hear what adjustments you made this year. I think I have my opinions of what I saw from you, but walk us through what the changes were. Obviously, I think the part that's undersold is you had a really good week in Bad Hamburg the week before to build a little bit of confidence. But what were the main adjustments that made the difference from, you know, maybe Wimbledon being your least favorite surface to you running through the draw? The second week was pretty flawless.
- [09:04]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I got to say, when I was preparing for this podcast, I was wondering how I'm going to answer all these questions because one, on one hand, like, I want to talk you everything, you know, because I also know you understand and you probably saw everything anyway. But on the other hand, like, I don't want to put it out there, so I'm going to try to balance it. Well, basically, you know, with Wim, I think I started serving better even at the beginning. Like after two months of practices, he kind of forced me to serve more, to undo the tee and on add to the backend side. I didn't like this, you know, directions before because I felt like it's the. Like, I can't slice it even a bit. I should play this surf flat, you know, And I felt like it's kind of too risky for me. I don't know. I'm not like you. I didn't surf from the best. I wasn't good at that.
- [09:59]
Host
Yeah, from the young age, I'll trade my serve for everything else that you do, no problem. Even that'd be great.
- [10:10]
Iga Swiatek
So basically, I think I needed someone to force me to do that, to gain a little bit of confidence and to actually see that I'm able to serve all directions with good speed and good precision. So I felt already in Australia that this is going better. Then I had some tournaments where I didn't feel it that well, but I guess in every process when you learn, you're going to have ups and downs and until you get to the point where it's going more naturally, so. So on Wimbledon, I think also with these balls that are kind of like, I don't know, I feel like they're like kind of sticking to the strings, that the contact point is a bit longer because they're heavier a bit. I felt like I could serve really well and I was really going for it. Like, honestly, when I looked at the stats after the tournament, I literally told my conditioning coach, was the speed check broken? Because I never served that fast. I was serving faster than all the big servers that we have on WTA Tour. So I was surprised. I don't know if I'm gonna be able to do that on next tournament, so I'll try because I loved it and I got so many free points and the girls couldn't really return. This serves as well as before, so, yeah, it was super convenient. So I think that was one of the keys. And I gotta say, for the first year, I wasn't trying to copy my clay court game with still trying to spin the ball on the forehand and, I don't know, move kind of similar. I just wasn't really. I just knew that I need to use my intuition a bit more. I, I think I played more flat from the beginning of the grass course season and you know, my spin wasn't really working before because, okay, the bounce was still higher than when you play flat, but the girls headed literally on the right height, you know, to attack. So. So I think I played more flat, more aggressive from the first shots and yeah, that way, like, you know how it is feeling this kind of change on the other side of the net, you get more tense. You feel like you need to rush it as well and make better decisions. So I think I put a lot of pressure with that on, on my opponents and, and every game I felt like I'm doing it a bit better because I also looked at the stats. For example, with the serve, I wasn't that brave at first rounds and you know, during the tournament I felt like I can do more and more. So. So I guess it was also a lot about the confidence and, and the momentum, I would say, but on every tournament it's like that.
- [13:10]
Host
Yeah, I mean, the, the stats Show Aussie Open 9 aces throughout the tournament, 0 in. In your match with Matty, 10 at Roland Garros 1 against Sabalenka Wimbledon 24 aces for the tournament and you weren't actually on the court that much, you know, so it's, it's a little more deceiving when you're playing long. Three setters.
- [13:29]
Iga Swiatek
Yeah, I'm, I'm really curious what's going to happen next if I'm going to be able to keep that kind of form because I, I, you know, first, first practice on grass, I felt like I can serve better and I felt like I can do more. So I think it was also a bit about the bulls.
- [13:44]
Host
Yeah, they, they're heavier. I mean they, they, they definitely like you, you describing as like sticking on your racket face a little bit longer. I think was, was the accurate way to describe it, but I totally go ahead.
- [13:57]
Iga Swiatek
Now we're going to switch to the lightest ball on the tour for women because we have different than the guys. So I'm curious if I'm going to be able to repeat that. I'll see.
- [14:07]
Host
Well, I hope you don't back off the aggression on your serve because I sitting right behind you. In the first couple of games against Danielle when I was sitting there and I'm looking and I'm going to 116, 118 and I'm, I've been a fan of yours for a long time now, but never had been like, oh, she's going to be a dominant server, you know, match in and match out. And if, if, if that stays and that's part of your game now, I wouldn't want to be, I wouldn't want to be on the other side of it. One thing I want to hear you talk about a little bit because I, I think a lot of the, kind of the. When people talk about your game, obviously the spin that you can create is, is as much as we've seen on the, on the women's side of the game for sure. Your footwork is something that whenever I'm talking to someone about who they should watch and how to do it, your footwork is maybe the best I've ever seen this side of Steffi.
- [15:03]
Iga Swiatek
Thanks.
- [15:03]
Host
But, but you're the backhand I thought at Wimbledon was, was dominant. You don't need a lot of time. You, your take back isn't this long extended. And talk about your ability to switch directions because you're one of the few players that can be slightly left of middle with a back end and still create angle across the court to where it sometimes crosses the sideline before it crosses the baseline. I feel like your backhand has been undersold for A long time. But to me that was the thing that kind of looked like it was keeping people on ice skates. Right. They were never able to get set because of your ability to switch directions on your backend.
- [15:40]
Iga Swiatek
Well, you're probably right, but I wouldn't say it's something new because I always loved my backhand and you know, backend down the line is my favorite shot, basically. So it's not like we focused on it. I would say that was probably third or fourth on the list in terms of importance on grass, you know, so, and what we practiced, obviously you always have to practice, you know, everything. You can't go out on a match and not feel good, you know, on one shot you're probably, it's going to be used by your opponent, you know, so. But yeah, the back end, I mean, I always loved it. I always felt like I can do a lot from it, even if I don't spend that match as on the forehand. And yeah, I just went for it. I don't know, I mean, I was changing directions a lot. I don't know if more than on clay or hard because also like the moving on grass is much, much harder. So just making your opponent move in the first two shots was, was crucial. But on the other hand, you can't force it. Like you're just going to be late on grass if you force going down the line. So I really went with my intuition, you know, at the beginning, before we even started practicing in Mallorca. I heard even after around gyros, that he has this idea of me on how he wants me to play on grass. And then we sat and he was literally explaining to me when I should play cross and when I should play down the line. And I was like, wim, well, I know this, but I'll see what I can do, you know, because it's not like I stepped out on the grass and I, I step out on the grass and I feel like I have so many options, you know, years before I just needed to adjust to, to the opponent a little bit, see what she brings and maybe I can change down the line. Maybe I should stay cross. I'm not sure, you know, it wasn't really my decision making, wasn't really smooth, you know, so. So I was like, give me something else to focus on because that just doesn't really speak to me, you know, so he did. We focused more on the technique of beforehand and on the serve and, and yeah, but at the end, I think at the end it came back to actually yeah, making the right decisions and knowing when to switch down the line to not risk it too much. For example, the, the championship point, like, I wasn't sure if it's going to go in, you know, I was a bit late, but the vacant of the line went in and, and, yeah, I think I was making the right decision. That's it.
- [18:25]
Host
Yeah. I think that's an understatement to say that you are making the right decisions. So as someone who's kind of well studied in the game and not ever lacking thought behind something, at least from outside, you know, watching you and the way you digest things, it never comes across as. It's just something you haven't thought about. It seems like you, you, you're pacing in the way that you. You go about your business. Now that you're. You're at six slams, right?
- [18:54]
Iga Swiatek
You've.
- [18:54]
Host
You're 24 years old. I think some people forget that you're still only 24 years old, and you have six slams on three different surfaces, and you've passed people like Lindsey Davenport and Kim Kleisters and now Sharapova. Is it. Are you able to kind of grasp the fact that you're kind of creating a career that's not just successful, but, like, it's actually, you know, you're passing these, these names that are like icons. Is that something that you think about, are proud of, or you just don't want to think about it because you want the next Tuesday to be focused?
- [19:32]
Iga Swiatek
For sure. After that question, I can say that you think about it more than I do.
- [19:35]
Host
Yeah, I do.
- [19:38]
Iga Swiatek
So I don't think about it because, I don't know. I don't look at my life in that kind of broad perspective. I'm literally kind of. I, I kind of got it after I won even junior Wimbledon. That's okay. You win a tournament, but then you'll have another one to test yourself. And I gotta say, I forget quickly about the tournaments that I won. Sometimes I think I should even celebrate a bit more. But, you know, for some part of the seasons, it wasn't easy because everybody expected me to win. So I didn't feel. I felt more the relief, you know, instead of this excitement or. I don't know. But that's why this Wimbledon victory tastes much, much better, because it was so unexpected and it came kind of. And obviously I worked, and every year I wanted to develop, but it came a little bit out of nowhere, you know, because my best result was quarterfinal. And every year my opponents could find a solution. Playing against me, you know, so. So I kind of only think about these stats and these achievements when I get asked about it. But day by day, not really. It's. I try to remind myself if I feel like I need to celebrate a bit more and be proud of what I'm doing. But you don't have much time to do that, because, as I said, next week you have another challenge in tennis. It's not like you have only world championships, Olympics, and if you win that, you can kind of be happy for a month or two. You just have to get back into it straight away.
- [21:27]
Host
Are you saying that maybe the tennis schedule never stops and maybe it should sometimes?
- [21:32]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I've been saying that for a long, long time.
- [21:37]
Host
So you touched on something that I have written down as, like, a next thing that I'm curious to get your. Your take on. So for the last five years, you've mostly been number one, you know, for the majority of the weeks. And then you and arena trade off sometimes. But Wimbledon, you go in and you're seated lower than you've been seated in a Grand Slam since maybe you won the French Open the first time. Is there a different mentality where maybe, you know, losing at the French Open and not, you know, winning it to where, you know, you've been so successful that our expectation is like, oh, yeah, she. She's going to win the French Open. And then you get making the semis, and it's like, idiots like me never made the semis one time. And yet we can still. It's like, gosh, IGA didn't. IGA didn't win. Is there. Is there almost like a mental relief once you kind of reset post Roland Garros to where it's okay, now I'm the hunter and not, like, the hunted. I'm not seated number one. I'm not coming off of a Roland Garros victory was a certain part of that, maybe freeing mentally?
- [22:38]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I got to say, it was freeing in 2023. Not at first, but when I lost the number one to arena for. Yeah, for a couple of weeks, I. I was kind of devastated. But then it was freeing when I kind of worked through it and when I turned it around to something positive as, like, being motivated and, yeah, actually, like, convincing myself that now I'm gonna be able to, like, focus on, yeah, hunting instead of being hunted. But. But this year, I gotta say, and last year, because I lost number one in, like, in September or October, so it was a bit different because I just had many different stuff to work on and to focus on, you know, it started with my case and coming back after the case and all these mixed feelings that I had also, you know, playing well in Australia and then playing well in, in Doha and I lost in semis, but I felt like I'm playing good and I felt like, you know, I deserve to be. Maybe it was a bit not, Not a lot of humility, but I felt like I deserved to be number one and it was taken away from me. And having this kind of feelings didn't help me for next month because I, I was just. I just felt like the world is not fair. I know it's pretty childish and, you know, I'm, I'm a top 10 player, so I shouldn't be, you know, angry about things like that. I should be kind of grateful. But it took me a while to, to get over it and to focus on the future instead of the past. And I would say the reset didn't really come after Round Garros, it came after Rome. Also, you know, switching coaches was a big deal for me because I don't like changes. I, you know, my team is super important for me and any change, it's like kind of putting me off the balance a little bit. And with Wim, you know, it was tricky because I knew how experienced he is and I wanted to use his experience. And I was expecting at the beginning that he's going to tell me something that is going to be just Eureka kind of moment and it's going to change everything. But I realized that I probably learned too much over the past years to have that and now the changes are going to be much smaller and, and kind of I have to adjust my tennis delicately, not like I did, you know, when I started working with my previous coach before 2022. So. So, yeah, like, having these expectations and also I wanted to win something kind of for win because I, I knew that he's a great coach and I was winning before, so why aren't I winning now? Yeah, like every month I had a different challenge, I gotta say, and different thoughts in my head. And finally, yeah, when I lost in Rome pretty early and I for sure underperformed and my head wasn't in the match at all. Like, I couldn't focus. I, I had many, you know, thoughts about, I don't know, even. Yeah, it was kind of. I made my own problems. You know, I was able actually to reset after that and I, like, I knew that if I'm not going to do it now, it's going to last forever. And before Rank Garros, I came out on a practice court with a little bit different mindset and I, Yeah, and I practiced better. I, I played better than Run Garros. I had a little bit more of that fire in me that I had for last years. And. Yeah, and basically after round goers, I feel like I just continued that. So I wouldn't say losing around Garros was such a big deal for me because I knew I'm not playing good. And, and it's not like, not like you can dig out of your problems, you know, in one week. You're probably going to need a bit more time and a bit more consistency. So. So I think the, the Wimbledon victory was just. It didn't start on Wimbledon, it started probably after Rome.
- [27:08]
Host
Yeah, I mean, I think people who haven't been in it don't realize that there's constantly a process towards things and it doesn't just happen like magic. Um, you mentioned, you mentioned your case and last year and I remember hearing about it and then the, the, the more that I was privy to the facts of the situation and you know, luckily I have a microphone and I can try to explain my understanding of things and it's basically like, listen, she's jet lag. She took melatonin. I, I took four melatonin before the show today. Like, honestly, like, it's.
- [27:44]
Iga Swiatek
But why aren't you sleeping now?
- [27:46]
Host
I. Cause I just. It's, it's this, it's this Mel. Melatonin coffee trade off that I got going. Completely unhealthy. But I think it needs to be said in front of you. And then I'll also tell you, the only time that I think I've ever really disagreed with something that you've said wholly is your case. This whole thing, everyone who has looked at it, who is an expert, has said there's no intent, there was no wrongdoing. The contamination has been proven over and over and over again. One, as a former player, I can't imagine knowing that I had done nothing wrong and then having a notice come through, an email, a phone call, whatever it might be is just. I can't imagine much worse now.
- [28:32]
Iga Swiatek
Dealing pretty terrible.
- [28:34]
Producer Mike
Yeah.
- [28:34]
Host
I mean, what was your, what was your first reaction and where did you first hear about it?
- [28:38]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I was in a photo shoot with my sponsor in Warsaw and I was in the middle of it. We were just kind of changing locations. So I went on my email and I saw that I got an email from this portal, you know, and I thought, it's Just a reminder to do my whereabouts or something. But yeah, it said that. Well, I didn't even read it because I started crying. And my. My agents that were there, like with my. For my shoot, they literally thought that someone died, you know, So I gave my manager the phone and she read everything. They were also pretty confused because obviously no one knows what to do in a situation like that. But I called Maciek, the physio and conditioning coach. He already knew from my other agent. I called Daria and basically we met. Yeah, during the shoot, I had no idea, like, if I should even continue doing this shoot because my face was all red. I was crying for probably like 40 minutes. But, you know, on the other hand, I knew that I can't really probably tell them about it. So I just continued for next three hours. And I gotta say, these were the best scenes that I shot, so I must be a good actress. And yeah, we met in the evening with the whole team, with my doctor, and we had a first call with a lawyer. I hired him on the phone, basically. And yeah, it was all pretty confusing. And honestly, I was a total mess on this meeting. I was basically joking because it didn't. I was like sarcastic and everything because I just had to do something to keep it together. You know how it is sometimes. And then when everybody came out, I was just crying for. For two weeks. So I couldn't. I couldn't practice, I couldn't step out on the court because I felt like tennis did it to this, did this to me, and that I'm in this place because of tennis. I, you know, I would. Because I felt like I'm losing my integrity. Like, I felt like no one is going to believe me, that I didn't do anything wrong. And I felt that the whole world is going to kind of turn their backs on me and that I'm finished, you know, and every accomplishment that I had is going to suddenly disappear. Sorry, I'm going to start crying now.
- [31:24]
Host
No, don't do that.
- [31:26]
Iga Swiatek
So why are we talking about this? So. So, yeah, I was a mess. My team helped me a lot with making the process kind of logical. They told me basically, and the lawyer what I needed to do. We started testing all my supplements and medicines that I take and just doing the research. But for most of the days, I just tried to kind of block it out. And I was meeting with my friends who didn't have a clue what's going on. Well, they saw I'm not injured and I'm not playing. So one of them Kind of guessed that I might be in some troubles, you know, so at some point I, I told them, which also wasn't easy because I, everybody was saying that I shouldn't tell anybody because, yeah, I know that there was also some priority fuss about players not being clear about what's going on with their fans and social media and everything. But truth to be told, if anyone would say straight away about this kind of case without any explanation, without any data, without any proof that you did nothing wrong, we would all be finished. Everybody would just hate us. So regardless what even other athletes say, because I spoke to them and most of them were kind of rational, but some of them were angry that, you know, you're not disclosing all this information straight away. I feel like, honestly, if I would have to tell everybody without being able to defend myself, I don't know what would happen to me, but I would be in a really, really, really bad place, you know, so. Yeah, well, my team was really helpful. It was amazing how everybody just got together to help me and everybody, they kept me going. And for sure, Daria, knowing me so well, being my psychologist, also helped me at that point and months later when I was already on the court, but I had so many different thoughts about this whole process. You know, she helped me to, to find some logic in it, even though it was super hard, and to be grateful about being able to play again rather than focusing on this bad thing that happened to me.
- [34:06]
Host
Yeah, well, I'll say anyone who's actually in, most of the people who want their reactions valued, don't actually go through the process of reading through the case file and the sequence of events and which, which, which sucks because it, like, like you're saying, it puts you in a no win situation, even if innocence is proven, which it has been in your case. One of the times that I really, I felt like a lot of sympathy for you the entire time, but especially when I remember it was post Indian Wells before Miami and you posted something very long and it broke my heart that you felt like you had to explain the fact that it had been mentally taxing. Right. And at this point, I remember, I remember I went, we did a show with with Kim Kleisters that day and we talked about it. I'm like, they're just looking for something. Yeah, I mean, just, it's, it's like you don't owe anyone that thing, especially if you're innocent. I know that's impossible, but that I really felt sympathy for you. The fact that you felt like you had to post something before Miami.
- [35:06]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I wanted to explain a bit because people, I came back on the court and people did forgot that I had this kind of problem and they just thought that it's going to be back to normal, you know, back to winning everything. And honestly I thought it as well at some point because I had this, I don't know, perfect Instagram kind of vision that, you know, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger and this kind of blah, blah, blah. And yeah, it works sometimes, but. But on the other hand, I was also expecting that it's going to make me stronger and expecting that, okay, now I'm going to be back on door with this, I don't know, maybe rage and I'm going to be strong and I'm going to prove everyone well. I didn't feel that way, you know, I felt like the world was kind of attacking me and destroying my life. So it was a bit different. And I think I needed to explain that to the fans. And honestly, everybody listened and understood. It's hard for me to like go on a press conference and explain this kind of stuff because mainly I feel like I should be able to deal with it myself. Myself. So writing a post like that, I think it's a bit easier. And yeah, I felt like it's a good idea. And then it was a bit easier also to talk about it on media, for example, before Miami and everybody understood, they forgot about it, on the other hand, when the clay court season started. But yeah, but as I said, I really just tried to focus on myself and I knew what problems I need to solve, what changes I have to overcome. And at some point I did that and I'm happy with my wisdom trophy now I don't care about.
- [36:54]
Host
Yeah, I'm about to say, I think a wibble of title makes everything feel a little bit better. Let's talk about. You mentioned Wimfosset and I want to get back to that because we also talked about the show. It's that, that thing where you've established such dominance, especially on, on, on clay throughout your career. Whereas, like, if you don't win every tournament, people are going, what's wrong? It's like you've made two semis of slams in one one this year and people are going, oh, no, you know, it's not. It's like, it's so absurd. But especially when people were kind of maybe starting to question the partnership with you. And Wimfa said, I'm going, you morons. Like, you're here, you know, in the comments section of some thing your coach has worked with. Osaka, Kerber, Azarenka, Kim, Kvitova, Halep, all of one, two plus majors. And by the way, it actually takes guts to take a job with someone of your pedigree because there's a lot more downside than upside for wimfacet in that job. Right. Walking onto someone's bag who's already won five majors.
- [37:57]
Iga Swiatek
Walk us through three almost perfect seasons.
- [38:01]
Host
Yeah, so talk.
- [38:02]
Iga Swiatek
The expectations are super high.
- [38:04]
Host
Yeah. But talk about how I don't think people actually understand how hard that is because one for you, bringing someone new into the fold, which you had mentioned quickly before, but also for whim, right. There's not like you go out and you win the French Open and people go, well, yeah, like winning Wimbledon is almost the perfect solution because there's such a value add. And that was kind of like there was space on your resume for. For Wimbledon title. But talk through that relationship, especially in this year where everything hasn't really gone totally according to script.
- [38:36]
Iga Swiatek
Well, also a reminder like when started working with me, when he didn't know when I'm going to be back on court. So.
- [38:42]
Host
Yeah, yeah.
- [38:43]
Iga Swiatek
So that also says something, you know. Well, as I said before, I also had high expectations, which probably didn't help me at the beginning because I would say the preseason was amazing. William showed me a different way to play my forehand and we were basically just focusing on that and on my serve. And I felt really great in Australia. I felt really confident and I felt like everything that we worked on during preseason was clicking. But then, yeah, then I started to have all these thoughts that I told you about. And I also, I wanted to win something for him, which was pretty stupid because you should win for yourself. But yeah, I felt like I should do more. I felt like the previous. I was constantly comparing myself to my previous seasons and that can't be helpful if I won almost everything before. So I had a bit of a trouble with that then. Also, I don't like changes. I felt like my results aren't as good. Sometimes it wasn't really anybody's fault. Sometimes I just had a worst day. Even though my process was going slightly up, I had one worse day. I lost. And suddenly you feel like you're not working Well. I also had some doubts that I had to go through. And. And Wim was great. I taught them. I told him even about them. And he. He probably is like the most patient person and understanding coach that I ever talked to, you know, and he really Waited a bit for me to get it together and, and when I did, I, I was actually able to like, I don't know, trust him more and dig into the work with him a bit more instead of constantly thinking about how I played, you know, last seasons and thinking that, well, it worked last year, so why should I even learn something new if I, if I was winning a lot and I felt great, you know, but tennis doesn't work that way. It's constantly developing and you also need something to surprise your opponents with. You can't play the same way. You can't play the same way all the time. So. So I was finally ready after many months, probably way too long for an athlete like that to change something and to learn something new. And, and yeah, we waited and we were still working on stuff, but, but I gotta say, I, it was my fault. I little bit lacked of them the belief, I would say, and commitment, as he likes to call it. And yeah, when we finally, when I finally let go of the past and I started only thinking about the future, I was able to practice much, much better. And the quality of my game also was much, much better. So again, it was another proof that in tennis you kind of have to. Makes this, this tennis part, the physical part, obviously, which I didn't talk about and the mentality and all the things that you have in your head, you know, so, so yeah, Wim is, Wim is great and he, he's a great coach. He, he knows a lot his amazing experience and he uses it, you know, to explain me stuff and to convince me sometimes. So, yeah, and first, like, that's also main thing for me when I hire a coach. He's a great person. You know, we have to spend so much time together and it's just, life is much easier when you like your coach and when you know that you can rely on him and trust him. So, so yeah, when is for sure one of these people.
- [42:58]
Host
And I really appreciate that I was getting frustrated. I'm glad you, you kind of explained the dynamics of what all goes into a good relationship player and coach, because I'm going to be hearing people talking, I'm going, okay, this guy's track record, ega's track record. And we're trying to tell them that they don't understand what they're doing. Like, give me a break. Get out of here, morons.
- [43:17]
Iga Swiatek
Yeah, I mean, people should give a little bit more trust and also a little bit more time also sometimes for things to click, you know, it's like we're Robots, you know, and we're just going to repeat what we did before. And also I'm stubborn, you know, like, there's a reason it took me a few months to try new things out. You know, I wish I wasn't that stubborn. I think it's a good thing and it's a bad thing. So it's hard to get rid of it if it's also bringing you some positives. But I'm super stubborn. And most of problems that. I mean, problems, like most of challenges that occurred was basically me being stubborn or us, like, not understanding each other, because that's the first time I have a coach that doesn't speak Polish, you know, so. But these are things you solve pretty quickly. Yeah. Especially when Daria and Maciek were always there to kind of help us understand each other.
- [44:21]
Host
Yeah. I always have this theory that sometimes when you get to a certain level of success as a person, and obviously yours has been outsized, that I think our biggest strengths can also sometimes be our biggest weaknesses. Right. In that offset figuring out how to, like, turn on the superpower of. Of. Of commitment and being stubborn, and that's probably, you know, what largely got you to where you are, but then being able to adjust off of it, I think that's brilliant. Self awareness. Okay. All the questions I've asked are for the tennis world and to get into your mind. I need one for me. I need to know about your footwork. Did it look the way that it looks now when you were like, 8 years old? I can't get over it because it's not like, you know, the person who watches a tennis match every two or three months knows the forehand, knows all the stuff. But I want an isolation shot, like, on your footwork. Is it something that has come naturally to you? Are there certain drills don't tell us all the secrets. But is it something that was always easy for you and it just got better, or was it something that you worked on from, like, a very young age?
- [45:23]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I wouldn't say I worked on it from a very young age because it's not like we had. It's not like I was in the system where I had the best coaches already from a young age. You know, my dad was basically just trying to figure things out. So, like the property conditioning coach, the first conditioning coach, and the proper conditioning, like, practices. I started when I was like 14 or 15, so I would say pretty late. Also, I didn't really have time for that because school was, you know, as important as tennis, you know, If I would be bad at school, I wouldn't probably play. So. So basically, yeah, I think I had it somewhere in me from the beginning because people, like parents or my dad even, like, they saw that I probably moved a bit better than other kids, I guess. But it's not like I felt it, you know, I just did. I just lived the way I live and that's it. And played the way I played. And then. Well, would you say I was a good mover in 2019? I mean, when I came on tour?
- [46:39]
Host
I mean, so it's. The movement piece is one part, but the part that is, like, otherworldly to me is when you're in. Working in the middle of the court and the quick steps in between shots. And like, I see players that are way, way less accomplished being lazy in a warmup. And literally from the word go, your feet are moving. You don't take a play off, even though you know, your, your footwork is some of the best that I've ever seen.
- [47:02]
Iga Swiatek
Well, I remember working on these little steps when I was a kid with one of, with my first coach, basically, who also had this idea that I should serve, kick, serve and play topspin from my forehand. So he had some good ideas and. Yeah, but I think. I don't know. I can't really tell you. You would have to talk to someone who knows some stuff about it, because I just do that. I just do what Matic basically tells me to do our practices, and I don't overthink it. Also, I don't understand it. Like, basically there are people who study these things for six years, you know, at university. So how can I do it better? You know, I just. I don't know. I don't know. But I was always a fast kind of person, you know, everything I do, I do kind of fast, you know. I don't know if that helps to answer that question.
- [48:00]
Host
Well, it's, it's. Listen, what it is, is it's brilliant. I know you're getting ready for the, the tournament up there in Canada. You've been super generous with your time. I've always admired you.
- [48:12]
Iga Swiatek
As scheduled twice. So we already, we already.
- [48:15]
Host
We already. We already explained all that. You know, we already explained all that. Everyone's happy to hear from you. Everyone's very excited that you came on. I appreciate your honesty. You know, we rarely have to wonder what you think for too long.
- [48:30]
Iga Swiatek
You said it's going to be fun, and then you talked about my case for 15 minutes, to be fair to.
- [48:35]
Producer Mike
Just, just, just so we're just, so.
- [48:37]
Host
We'Re clear, you talked about your case first and I asked a question, so that's that you were, you were, you, you were completely honest. But I also think, I also think, like, I think what people have to understand is like, when you're in a.
- [48:49]
JW
When you're in a topic, when you're.
- [48:51]
Host
In a press conference, you can't actually, you don't have the ability to explain something, the details of something and the emotion of something. One of the things that I like about doing this job is that there's actually space to get into the nuance of life as a tennis player, as you know. And I don't know that we've heard that long form. So I for one, am thankful that you, you shared it with us, even though I'm sure it's the last thing you want to talk about at this point in your life, especially coming off of Wimbledon, but because of, especially because of everything that's happened to you in the last year. I know I speak for a lot of tennis fans. We're thrilled for your successes at Wimbledon. We enjoy the way you play. I respect your professionalism, the way that you go about your craft and trying to get better and better and better, even in the face of marching through history. So, iga, thank you so much for coming on.
- [49:40]
Producer Mike
Served.
- [49:41]
Host
Good luck in Canada, good luck in Cincy, and we'll see at the US Open.
- [49:44]
Iga Swiatek
Thanks a lot. See you around again.
- [49:46]
Host
Serve. Brought to you by Infosys. We'll be right back. Support for the show comes from our friends at Infosys, also proud partners of today's guest, IGA Witek. When enterprises turn to AI, they need more than tools. They need a partner who can scale innovation responsibly. That's where Infosys comes in. From modernizing systems to deploying enterprise grade AI, Infosys helps businesses lead with confidence. Beyond the boardroom, Infosys is transforming the sport of tennis. As digital innovation partner for the ATB Tour, Australian Open and Roland Garros. Infosys uses AI and analytics to elevate fan experiences and and enhance player performance. Visit infosys.com to learn how they're helping businesses and tennis stay ahead of the game.
- [50:38]
Iga Swiatek
Fox Creative.
- [50:41]
Hiro
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Pickle
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Hiro
Honestly, Pickle, I haven't been feeling like myself lately. I've just been so sluggish and I've. Well, I've gotten a little chonky.
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Pickle
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Hiro
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Pickle
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Hiro
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Pickle
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- [51:34]
Hiro
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Pickle
Thank you. Thank you.
- [51:38]
Hiro
Alright, let's take a break. As always, don't forget to rate, review and knock something off the shelf.
- [51:44]
Iga Swiatek
Today.
- [51:46]
Hiro
You can help keep your furry friends healthy and thriving with Einz Healthy weight Cat Food now available online and at your local retailer. Learn more@iams.com.
- [51:57]
Producer Mike
Jon welcome into the show. Andy is currently up in Toronto. What did you make up of this incredible IGA interview?
- [52:04]
JW
Great conversation and I think it bears in mind this is a superb superior tennis player. But IGA plays it pretty close to the vest. That was really a revealing conversation from a player who you know isn't necessarily the most extroverted. I think there was some game recognized as game and I think the fact that Andy was the one asking those questions probably went a long way. I was interested in a few things. One of them was sort of the tick tock of what happens when you have one of these adverse doping findings and you see the difficult position a player is in and she couldn't immediately run to defend herself because that would have violated the process. At the same time you could imagine the strain and the stress that you have this knowledge and you're pulling out of events and you can't really say what for. I thought her remarks about coaching and sort of the Vinfassette relationship and how that took a bit of time were interesting. And again, I mean go back and read for example, some of her press conferences during Wimbledon. Again, this great triumph of her career, this one of the happiest two weeks that she's had all year. And it's pretty subdued and it's pretty close to the vest and I think that Andy raised a good point. When you can actually have an exchange and have some nuance and not just have question, answer, question answer, absent of context, I think that makes a big difference. That was a really spirited Conversation with someone who doesn't always engage in spirited conversations. I enjoyed that.
- [53:27]
Producer Mike
Yeah, yeah, I completely agree. And just hearing about finding out about the negative result while in a photo shoot, you know, having a great day and a great time and then having to compartmentalize that and exist in this space because there's so much repercussion if she's to let on, you know, that this has happened. You know, the fact that she was able to have a team around her to support her, I think was incredible. But it was truly eye opening and it was great to hear this side of her, to be honest. John, let's get to the DC Open that just wrapped up over the weekend. First, on Saturday we had Layla Fernandez capture the title. She showed some serious moxie through her run to the win. Let's talk about her performance and some of the greats that she made her way through to capture that title.
- [54:11]
JW
Yeah, what a week for Layla Fernandez. And I think we forget how young she is as well. This was a player who came within two sets of winning a major four years ago. And we forget, wait, she was a teenager when that happened. The other thing I have to say about DC, I was there actually for non tennis for 60 minutes reasons. It was so oppressively hot. Remember those days we had at Wimbledon last month and people sort of. There were fans that unfortunately had some health issues in the stands. This in D.C. was just next level heat and humidity. So apart from beating that murderous row of players for both men's and women's side, bear in mind, this heat and humidity was absolutely brutal. And I think that ought to be a factor in our analysis. But no, I think Layla Fernandez, she had this really, really tough semifinal battle, 76 in the third against Rybakina. Great contrast in styles. Fernandez certainly on the diminutive side of the WT against the ace leader of the tournament. And it just came down to a few points deep in that third set. And Fernandez battles as she does, and then to come back the very next day and win a final so handily, that says a lot. All of a sudden she goes to Canada. She's going to be, she'll be back in the top 25. She goes to Canada. Of course, that is the closest thing she will get to a home slam. Then she comes to the US Open where she has these great memories. This is a player who, she's got a lot of commercial endorsements and I think that that in some ways has been great for her. Upside. I think in some ways that may have been a Bit of an added source of pressure, but no, Here she is 22 years old and we forget, I think how young she is. We forget how many looks she can give. There's a lot of variety to that game. Obviously being left handed helps. Suddenly you say wait a second. This is a player with some real upside and that was a great week for her in D.C. on the men's.
- [56:02]
Producer Mike
Final we saw Alex deeming your pull off a stunning win over Davidovich Fikina after saving multiple to claim his 10th career title. JW, what do you make of that three hour plus battle, especially in the heat?
- [56:15]
JW
Tennis is a cruel sport. You're Davidovit Fakina, you beat Taylor Fritz and Ben Shelton. You're a point away from winning your first title. You too are going to have a career high ranking after this likely. And then you just can't quite seal it. And a tournament that in so many ways should fire you with so much confidence and optimism ends up with you crying. It's rough out there. No, David Fakina is a very fine player. It's really surprising he has not won a tournament. You'll remember at Del Rey he also, you know, another, another American hard court event just a few months ago he also I believe had match points and lost a three set final. That was to Katzmanovich. To have that happen to him again, I mean Alex Diminore is absolutely the wrong player you want on the other side of the net if you have trouble closing. And some of this, let's give our credit to Diminor who wins still another title shows why he's this top 10 stalwol, just a solid pros pro. I mean I don't know if you saw that one match point that he saved was just one of the points of the year. And then I don't know if you caught this too. The gesture of sportsmanship afterwards, that was awesome. Yeah. And so I think Dibenor gets it and I think also remember that Diminor is Australian but has all of these ties to Spain, trains there, speak Spanish, family there and I think that that may have impacted that as well. He's known dividend Fokina for a long time. But yeah, I mean you win a title and you're thrilled, but you also, you don't exist in a vacuum. And Alex Diminore of all people, he knows the sting that's coming on the other side of the net and then to see your opponent in the final basically dissolve into tears is a jarring sight. So bit of a bittersweet day credit to Diminour. But you really hope Davidovich Fokina, one of the good guys out there, can break through and win that first title.
- [58:06]
Producer Mike
Let's shift gears off court. Naomi Osaka has parted ways with her head coach, Patrick Mouraglu. John, what more do you know about this split?
- [58:13]
JW
I don't think this was a huge surprise. This has been a relationship of less than a year. Naomi Osaka has won a fair amount of matches, but not at the biggest and best events. She just took a loss at Emma raducanno in Washington, D.C. her coach, Patrick Marutaglu, wasn't there. I think some of this is about results, some of this is about logistics, that Patrick's got his hand in a million pots and he's promoting a book and he's doing the Tennis Showdown, and Naomi's based in Miami and Patrick's an ocean away in Nice. I also think, I'm not sure what sort of Patrick is a guy that pumps a player up with confidence. I think he's much better known for that than any sort of tactical expertise. And if a player doesn't necessarily have confidence, as Naomi doesn't appear to have much of right now, I'm not sure what the relationship is all about. Heard something interesting. I've heard it's Monday, so who knows? This will either be out there or disproven. But my moles tell me that she will be working at least in Canada. Cincinnati in the U.S. open with Thomas Wichterowski, longtime coach of IGA Swantek, our guest. Keep in mind, too, that, yeah, it's an interesting match and I don't know what the overlap is there. Thomas worked with Agnieska Radwanska, who was, I think, the first client of Naomi's agent, Stu do good. So I think there's some familiarity, at least through the agent. But Thomas Wicktorowski getting the call from Poland and I think at least through North American hardcourts. I'm told he will be the aide de camp. Interesting. Interesting move there.
- [59:46]
Hiro
Yeah.
- [59:46]
Producer Mike
John, you know, when I look at these stats, I was reading the Athletic article about it and says six of Usaga's last seven matches had come in three sets with all the deciders ending 6, 4 against her or in tie breaks. So maybe it is heading into a tournament she knows well in a surface she knows well. Maybe trying to find something to give her that little edge.
- [60:07]
JW
Yeah. And I mean, sometimes she's really close and you watch the level and you watch how deep she gets into these matches and you say, okay, then she's not that far off from the player who won four majors. She's having a hard time, though, pulling those matches out. And I mean, this is the issue when you've had the success that she has had. I mean, it's been a very strange career, sort of in terms of rhythm, and she's sort of won back to Mac majors twice. But then we'll go years without getting to the second week of a major. When you've won four majors and you had the success she has, you're not in this to get to the third and fourth round. So I think she's looking to get back to the level where she once was, and I think she's encroaching on age 28. I suspect the last year has been pretty frustrating.
- [60:50]
Producer Mike
Another coaching change. Stefano Sisypas has returned to his family tutelage. Can you tell us about that split?
- [60:59]
JW
Bernie Vovic is going to have a very we're not quite at 30 for 30 level, but he could do quite a short about 20, 25 in his coaching misadventures. Remember, he was part of the Elena Rabakina team and all that came with it in Australia. Sort of left that situation, sort of fairly unceremoniously hooks up with sits AAs. That has a curious dynamic as well, I think. After those remarks, do you remember the remarks that Goran made at Wimbledon after Tsitsipas lost? And essentially whether this was to motivate or whether this was just one of the great tennis truth tellers telling his truth, it did sort of strain. It's a strain, the imagination, that that relationship would continue. We've talked before on the podcast and maybe Andy and I, maybe we'll even do a deeper dive about this whole parent coaching, their kid dynamic and where family loyalties cut off and optimizing professional capabilities begin. It seemed like a really fraught situation. Now Goran Ivanicevic for his third job of the year. We're not even out of July. It looks like he's going to be working with Jasmine Paolini, at least on these North American hardcore events. Goran Ivanicevich, again, I don't think we're going to quite a 30 for 30 level, but he will have an interesting college essay, if nothing else, about the 2025 coaching arrangements he's had.
- [62:24]
Producer Mike
Tsitsipas called it a quote, brief but intense experience and a truly valuable chapter in my journey. So intense was probably the best way to describe it based on all the commentary in the public. Last thing, John, I know we didn't go over this, but I wanted to get your commentary on it. We talked about it on the Friday five setter, but the Wimbledon win in the courts, about expansion. I wanted to get your take on what you think that means not only for Wimbledon as a whole. By tripling its right, it's almost tripling its footprint. But for tennis as a whole and for all the other Slams, man, we.
- [63:00]
JW
Could do like half. I mean, I'm kind of sort of fascinated by this whole topic. And for a while one of my takes on Wimbledon was how much money they passed up and they didn't get into the naming rights game and they didn't have so many sponsors and you don't see the back walls plastered. And all of a sudden this looks like a pretty savvy move from a business perspective. I mean this event is going to absolutely change. There's going to be this 8,000 seat stadium, there are going to be more than three dozen courts and it's going to take a while. This isn't going to happen tomorrow. I mean I think they're talking early 2000s. And one thing about wimble and you noticed it Mike when you were there, great event, nobody walks away disappointed. One of these bucket list experiences. But it's pretty crowded and if there's a way to allow more people to experience Wimbledon, you know, people are spending the night camping out in a field in order to experience this. If this creates more opportunities for people to enjoy Wimbledon. I mean obviously the bigger picture for tennis is this fits into some of this is the arms race among the four majors. And I think Wimbledon is going to lurch significantly ahead now. I mean just in terms of square footage, but also just amenities now. And the hospitality picture will change and the fact that the qualifying rounds will be on site will turn this into a three week event the way the US Open is. And also I think this is just another indication that the four majors are really the coins of the realm for tennis. And I would not want to own one of the tour events the week before Wimbledon when Wimbledon inevitably goes to three weeks and we're going to have fans and qualifying and it's going to be a three week tournament basically. And I mean I think you have reserve a sliver of sympathy for the neighbors who are very unhappy about this and they're going to have dump trucks outside their house for the next five years. But I think sort of big picture, it's good for Wimbledon, it's good for the common fan, not just for balance sheets. But I think the Average fan will now have a lot more experience. Opportunity to experience Wimbledon. I think it's kind of inevitable. And the trick that Wimbledon seems to master so well, that the needle thread is keeping tradition, keeping everything that's special, but also growing with the times. And we'll see. They've been very. To this point. They've done that delicate dance really, really skillfully. Let's see if they can continue now that their square footage is going to expand so dramatically.
- [65:28]
Producer Mike
Yeah. Biggest thing for me is they're probably going to have to build a bigger Tube station at South Fields, because that thing was, like, ridiculously.
- [65:37]
Iga Swiatek
Well.
- [65:37]
Producer Mike
That's it. John, you got anything else? Any other news from around that we need to hit on, or are we good to go?
- [65:43]
JW
We're going to do winners and errors as a feature if I have to twist Andy's arm. But no, we had good Venus Williams discussion after talking about the merits of her wildcard. I think that was validated. And we now make the pivot to two big events and then the US Open. So here we go.
- [66:03]
Producer Mike
Yeah. And just so, programming note, you know, the Canadian Open is going to kind of. It ends on a Thursday now, so that that episode's going to come out right before the end of the Canadian Open. So we're going to do a special re release of the Bryan Brothers interview that Sean and the team are working on right now. We'll still do a new introduction. Really excited for you guys to revisit that. We never really actually put it out as a full release back when we did the episode originally. And we're also going to have Maria Sharapova on in the coming weeks. Very excited about that. And we're putting together final plans for our Fan Week draw special. We'll give you guys more details. I know in the comments. People have been asking a lot about that. John, we got a lot going on in the next, like, six weeks.
- [66:47]
JW
Beats the alternative.
- [66:48]
Producer Mike
Yeah, I agree. I agree. Well, thanks, everybody for checking us out and be sure to subscribe. Like, check out our merch in the store. Grab a hat just like mine or Sean's. Sean's gonna be on screen. There you are, Sean. All right, guys, that'll do it. For served. Brought to you by our friends at Infosys. We will see you guys next week.
- [67:15]
Jon
Thanks to Smartsheet for their support. No matter the challenge your team is trying to solve, no matter the innovation you're working to achieve, every team needs tools to help their workflow. Smartsheet is the innovative work management platform that allows teams to remove distractions, collaborate across projects, and efficiently solve whatever challenges come their way. Real innovative work needs a place to flourish, and Smartsheet is that place. Smartsheet Work with flow. Learn more@smartsheet.com Vox.