JW (1:28)

That's a really nice win for him.

John (1:29)

Medvedev, man, he's had a month winning in Dubai. Is he get to Indian Wells? Is he going to be able to play once he gets there? He played right back in. She is not someone who throws in the towel. She's not someone who retires from matches which would tend to make us concerned. One more point that I I want to make. I'm not going to overreact. Is going to win a slam the next two years.

Mike (1:49)

Whoa, whoa.

John (1:57)

AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built into. That's why it's no surprise that more than 85% of the Fortune 500 use the ServiceNow AI platform while other platforms duct tape tools together. ServiceNow seamlessly unifies people, data, workflows and AI connecting every corner of your business and with AI agents working together autonomously, anyone in any department can focus on the work that matters Most. Learn how ServiceNow puts AI to work for people@servicenow.com hey everyone. Welcome to Served Indian Wells recap show brought to you by ServiceNow producer Mike. Looks like he's on spring break. JW. It's just a beautiful little espresso table there is over his left shoulder, techie Sean setting up everything. I got stuck in wherever I'm at with weather because there are tornadoes in our city, or at least the threat of them. But we are pumped to talk some Indian Wells. And if I would have told you like four months ago that, oh, gosh, you know what, guys, we don't have to worry about Sinner in Sabalenka. They won Indian Wells. We would have been like, who's worried? What, what happened? Did something major happen? And you know, we'd be like, no. But Sinner goes through, does not lose a set, beating Daniil Medvedev. The resurgent Daniil Medvedev. Six and six in the final. Roll City some matches along the way. Had a tough one against Fonseca, which we'll break down a little bit more later in the show. Sabalenka delivers in an epic three setter. Seven, six in the third, eight six in the third set. Breaker. You guys, I'm obsessed with this her tiebreak thing that she has going. And I. And I think it's like, well, it. So she had to restart because she lost a couple at the end of last year. But just I don't think it's getting enough credit because a lot of the narrative around arena is one, she's going to be an all time great hall of Famer, best player in the world over the last two years, undisputed. I don't think you can find someone who, you know, can say that and not be laughed out of the room. And some of it has been, oh, you know, took a loss in Indian Wells last year to Andreva, lost to Coco, maybe she's favored in those matches. You know, takes a loss at Wimbledon to Anna Samova. You know, it's just, is she not winning the matches? She should win one. You create that shadow when you're favorite in every single match you ever play. That's because you've been really, really good and really, really clutch also along the way. Right? But I don't know how you can have the narrative that she lets you know, some matches go and not saying she hasn't, but let's like be at least a Little sober about this, this tiebreak record. So say she's not clutch and then make this tiebreak record real for me. Okay, 22 and three last year in tiebreakers. She lost a couple to break her streak at the end of last year and is now back up to five in a row. And I think her grand slam tiebreak record is still alive at like some dumb number, like 18 tiebreakers.

Mike (5:05)

18 or 19 or something.

John (5:07)

I mean, that's, that's just silly. Like, it's silly. And she's gotten to the point where we're taking for granted silly statistics. Not dissimilar to. You've heard, you've heard me harp on it on this show to Alcaraz Federal, sorry, Alcaraz Center. And you know, kind of they've created this insane expectation, you know, by the big three, Fed, Novak, Rafa, Serena, etc. But like JW, just talk to me a little bit about of, you know, when you're the favorite in every match, you're good, you're still going to lose sometimes. Does that make you not clutch?

JW (5:40)

I think we have enough data points as well. I was, I thought you were going, I'll go like 10 degrees. I think you're absolutely right. And there's actually a real consistency to her inconsistency even, which is she has great. Have you ever come across a player, male, female, this generation prior, who has this kind of bounce back ability? I mean, she'll take a bad loss in tournament n, and in tournament n plus one, she's winning the title. I mean, she's playing the same opponent that beat her to win a major, what, like five weeks ago, six weeks ago, loses the first set and then it's like, okay, I got to do what I got to do to win. Oh, we're going to a tiebreaker. Oh, I got to save off a championship point. Nope. Problem. That was Such a clutch 30 minutes to close out that match. And I think people see the scoreline and be like, hey, the number one seed won and she beat her new rival. What else is new? There was so much locked into that and her ability you talked about last year. And then what she do, she goes to the US Open and wins the title. We've talked about how she could theoretically have a lot more majors than she does, but it seems like every subsequent major after a bad loss, she comes back, no problem. And that tiebreak record, I mean, also look at the numbers we're talking about. This isn't like, hey, he won five in a row, which she has in, in 2026. There are enough data points now that this is just an extraordinary sort of insight and expression of clutch tennis. And she's number one for a reason. It hasn't always been smooth. She hasn't won every major since she's been number one. But the fact that that ranking hasn't moved in well over a year now tells you a lot as well. That was a serious title.

John (7:09)

There's something else about this tiebreak record also that it's kind of different than a lot of the streaks we've seen. Like I had one and it was the, the lead then for whatever time, but I would go to a tiebreaker with my plumber. Like I couldn't break serve all the time. So like I'm winning tiebreakers and getting credit for a streak against people 80 in the world, 150 in the world that I play first round. They're like gross tiebreakers that lead to like maybe a gross break in the second set. It's not as if she's getting to tiebreakers against people. Second, third, fourth round. These are all maximum pressure type tiebreakers, or at least the majority of them. Even to get to a tiebreaker against her on tour is different than someone kind of sliming out two tiebreakers in a second round because they have nothing else to go on.

JW (7:58)

Right?

John (7:58)

I mean the, the tiebreakers aren't all valued the same. Every, almost every single tiebreaker she plays is like the Robakin a third set breaker or is a second set breaker to close out a match in a major or, or some other pressure set. Like, I think more credit needs to be given to, to this streak.

JW (8:15)

I also think this has also emerged as a really tasty rivalry, isn't it? I mean it's, it's not totally the study in contrast that, that even Carlos and, and Sinner are. But these right now are the two best players, Rybakane and Sabalenka. Far and away they're both, you know, it's both sort of power tennis. They dictate the matches on their racket. But the real differences are temperamental differences, but they're also differences in their game. And, and all of a sudden I'm like, I feel like people are kind of missing the forest for. This is a nice rivalry that we've settled into on the women's side now. And yeah, I mean look at the scorelines of their last three matches in the last 120 days and you can't ask for much more. As a tennis fan, we said it

John (8:54)

on our Our recap show last year, Rybakan is going to make a run at number one this year. Right. And Sabalenka knows that and that's what it's building to. And these kind of rivalries are fantastic because they ebb and flow, you know. And now what's going to happen the rest of the year, people are going to write off ego. We did it last year. Then she goes and wins Wimbledon. Is she not going to be one of the top two or three favorites at the French Open? Other people will get in the mix as this year goes on. But to your point, it's hard to argue over a six month span with these two not being the two dominant forces in the game and kind of Robakina joining Sabalenka as this consistency mechanism that we're talking about now. The flip side is if you're a Bakana and you leave that match, you're going, okay. So closed out the year better than anyone. Last year I win Australia, I lose to Sabalenka, but when she's beaten me in kind of the recent history, it's when I've actually won four more points in this match in Indian Wells than Sabalenka. What? You can't leave this going. You're going, oh, I'm. As if you're in her camp, you're going, you're absolutely as good as her right now. Now you, we can debate that. We can go, you know, get into the statistic metric of it, but if I'm her coach, I'm going, yeah, you're there. You might even be better. Right now I'm, I'm pitching that narrative because she doesn't seem to mind it. She is definitely not scared of the tough matchups. Like she doesn't stress test about going in. She respects obviously the ability of, of the best players in the world. But there's no chance she doesn't view herself as, as that person right now even leaving with this loss against Sabalenka, Is that, is that nuts to say?

Mike (10:32)

Yeah.

JW (10:32)

And you know what else? Sometimes we talk about Robakina, we say it's Russia, it's Kazakhstan. She's not used to this heat and humidity. She can be a little bit vulnerable. She wins Australia and yesterday she gets to 76 in the third and it was like 97 degrees. I think she's got to be obviously not the result she wanted in the final. Even Sabalenka herself, I think said it was Russian roulette, which echoes your point. But yeah, if you're A Bakina and you're leaving that event, losing a third set tiebreaker on a 97 degree data, the number one player in the world. When you win more points, you can, you can live with that.

John (11:05)

Yeah, I mean, I mean, you can live with it. But listen, props to Sabalenka because she just figured out a way to win. I mean, she took the best punches, reversed it like to your point, jw, she knows the pressure sets. Like she loses to her again, we're going, oh, is this a matchup problem? Which maybe it is still, but it's a matchup problem both ways, right? Like there's no such thing. So it's a, it's a two way matchup problem. It's not like, you know, some of us who have had terrible matchups and it actually is a matchup problem. But props to Sabalenka. But also I think one of the things that is intriguing about this and you know, there's the dynamics on court, but like the juxtaposition of them off the court, it's like Sabalenka going in. I mean, I, Well, I'm here. Oh my gosh, I'm here for it. Because she just leans in fully. You know, congrats on the engagement. Wearing a veil while practicing, like there's not, there's not a lot of spotlights that she doesn't lean directly into. And that's great. Like, we need the next four days of TikTok before we get to Miami. Like, it's fantastic for the sport and Rybakina is almost allergic to actually having to say do or be seen more than she has to, which is, which, which is cool too. You know, there's nothing more swagger. Ish. And I can't relate to it at all than winning a big match and giving people nothing. It's like that's kind of. They're. They're both kind of badass and fun in their own ways.

JW (12:29)

I'm going to ruin your segue to the, to, to the men's final because it's not dissimilar. But one thing that's always interesting me, personality wise, I think some of it is just innate in who you are, but I think some of it is how you approach your career. And Sabalenka, she talked about it with you. I mean, she basically said, listen, I need some of these outlets. I need to offload stress. I need to keep it fun and interesting. And I think Rebakina's attitude is I don't want anything extra tennis I don't want anything that's going to distract me. I don't want anything. I don't need a controversy. I don't want any social media nonsense. It's both in service of winning, but it's two very different approaches to the job, which I think is really interesting.

John (13:05)

Yeah. And we've, we've talked about this before, so I won't belabor a point that we've, we've gotten to, but I remember growing up as a junior and everyone was like, okay, you have to stay calm. You can't say anything. You have to talk to yourself. You have to be. Do all these things. And I think, I, I don't know, like, I don't think you can play against your personality. Like, I don't think the way you act is completely different than the way you are. I think you channel that energy. And if you're fighting upstream, I don't know that it, it does that. So if you're a coach and you're looking at these two players, you're going, okay, let's actually have a view of our, of our player that we're coaching. And maybe they need to break something sometimes. But, like, how do we get back from that? To your point with Sabalenka, like, can you go nuts? Can you have a bad result? Can you lose the plot but then dial back in? And maybe that's where you need to spend kind of the coaching hours. So I think there's a lesson here where it's like, you can't turn McEnroe into Sampras, Mike.

Mike (13:59)

Yeah, well, and I think to that point, you know, Sabalenka, after the win, was in a press conference talking about how, you know, she was going to celebrate and she had this to say and what is our perfect delivery?

John (14:12)

Yes. Flying out tonight. So what does the celebration on the plane look like for you? Well, I guess a couple espresso martinis probably and five guys to go, basically. I mean, that's why I never in a good shape because it's five guys in preserve. Yeah, I guess that's it. Maybe a couple, couple drinks just to cheer ourselves and, and that's it because the schedule is really tight and we're on to the next one and I cannot relax too much because I'm a defending champion there. And also it's my Yamiel. I've been there playing there, so I want to do well there as well. So I'll try to stay loose, but focus. I guess it's again, going into the balancing Everything. So I'll try to balance it the best way possible. You know what? I don't, what I wouldn't want is to simultaneously be a little drunk and caffeinated in a flying metal tube for six hours. Hours.

JW (15:11)

You don't think, first of all, can we, can we just be clear to our international audience? Five guys is, Five guys is a hamburger joint. You don't think iconic hamburger joint Delta Flight 213 is going to have her? No, I don't think she's. I think her metal tube is not.

John (15:29)

I don't, I don't think there's a, I don't think there's a flight number. I think there's a tail number.

Mike (15:35)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. On her trip to Miami, especially when you're defending champ. But I just thought, I think it highlights your point that you just made. Right? Like she, she's enjoying herself, finding a way to enjoy herself, but then also is focused and determined to remain the greatest.

John (15:51)

One more, one more point that I want to make because it reminded me she mentioned Miami and it just kind of brought this memory back to me. We were in Miami last year during the tournament on a trip with some friends that were different and my son, our kids saw her and waited until after she ate and then they actually went up and apparently she didn't know there were our kids or whatever. So there wasn't any connectivity. But as friendly as she is and as light hearted as she is and listen, she's got a streak where she can break stuff too, but it was amazingly nice. Did it out and about. So I, this, this Persona, you know, where she's kind of welcoming to the attention and whatever it, Some people pursue it publicly and then are like, okay, get away. I don't, I don't want the parts of, of, of fame that my public Persona and me going after the spotlight brings. She's not that way. Which, which I'm like phenomenal with. I think it's great. She was so kind, so nice. Real quick, before we get to the, the break mic, I want to kind of analyze this center thing and just belabor the point that all the what IFs after the two or three years that we've seen from Sinner, when he loses to the, you know, most accomplished tennis player of all time and then loses a random match somewhere, it's like, oh, are we in crisis? Stop. Stop it. There's nothing wrong with Yannick Sinner. We said this last week. We'll say it this week comes back. But you will say more than Alcaraz who had a little momentum going, getting back into the winner's seat. Big deal for him, right?

JW (17:28)

John, he hasn't. I saw. I saw one thing saying he has not won a tournament going into Indian Wells in 20. 26 guys played two. It's March. It's March. It's march 13th. Yeah. I mean, honestly, I thought this was. This was about as good a tournament as he could have hoped for. I mean, he hadn't won this event before. Remember last year he wasn't eligible to play. He beat, you know, he beat kids, he beat veterans. He won handily. He won matches and breakers. He, you know, gutted it out in the final, didn't lose a set. I mean, this was. Not that he needs to make statements at this point in his career, but that was really a solid. That's a. That's a really nice win for him. And he's got to be thrilled going to Miami where, remember, I mean, he's kind of sort of the defending champion. Didn't play last year and he won it the previous year. So. Yeah, I mean, I think we need to all. It's. It's fun and it makes the world. Goes fast and it's social media catnip. But some of these. Some of these swag. We talk about sample size with Sabalenka. Sample size of. He's sitting. Lost two tournaments in a row is. Is silly. And now he's. Now he's won one tournament in a

Mike (18:32)

row, but two this year.

JW (18:34)

Yeah. You think he's going to be okay?

John (18:37)

Yeah. So one of the. One of the things that's interesting to me because we talk about Carlos and how his game can adapt to every surface and that. That's absolutely true. Right. But now we're looking at Sinner's body of work. Okay. And for, you know, a year and a half ago, it was like, oh, give him, like a fast hard court and he's the guy. Now, I don't know if that's changed. Like, does one match, you know, against Novak change that? I probably don't think so. But now look at. Let's look at where he's won, right. It was one point away from winning the French Open when he's never even won a Masters. 1000 on point, one point away.

JW (19:13)

Yeah, exactly.

John (19:14)

Wasn't comfortable, like, going into Wimbledon last year. Like, I don't know if grass is his best surface. As good as he moves on on a hard court. You know, maybe not the case on grass. I. I was wondering that.

JW (19:24)

Right.

John (19:25)

Wins there, has won World Tour Finals on a low bouncing kind of quick court that, that kind of the ball skids and as fast. Obviously it's one a million outdoor hardcourt events. Indian Wells is different. The way the ball travels is different. It can get up out of the zone. Like it's one of the few tournaments where if you're going against Yannick Sinder, you're going, oh, I might actually be able to access a hit point outside of his, his, his strike zone which you know, I, I say sarcastically goes from his ankles to the tip of his cap. But if you're like lining up places to play. Yannick Sinner, not saying that this is a good place, just saying, oh, I could maybe try to convince myself in one way shape or form that there is an option here that would make him more uncomfortable than other surfaces. If we talk about someone as being complete, we have to match on the other side with his victories in places that play a lot differently, not a lot from Indian Wells besides his ball just, you know, bouncing off the court itself. You would look at, oh, I'm flat. I get for a strike. I play through the court. Indian Wells isn't, isn't, isn't that place for, for those types of players. So for him winning in a bounce back win, because we just discussed what a, what a horrible year he's had so far. Listen, we have, we have to, we have to, we have to kind of call it all the same way. He's winning everywhere on every surface and problem solving in different ways. And Indian Wells, if anyone needed that reaffirmed, did that, does this matter? Maybe more than even winning in a Miami where we know that he can win on a fast, low bouncing court.

JW (21:03)

John, that's good. And, and the not not only is, is the surface in theory more to his liking, but also the conditions aren't as variable. Mike, you were saying before he's now won every. Is this right? He's, he's won every hardcore major. I mean he's won every hardcore Masters 1000, right?

Mike (21:16)

Yeah. Since 1990, since the Master 1000s were invented. He is now the, the youngest to complete the hard court set as they call it. So he's age 24, I think Fed did it at 30, Novak did it at 31. But that's winning Indian Wells, winning Miami, winning Canada, winning Cincinnati, winning Shanghai, winning Paris. All hard courts which you know, to the layman exactly what you were just talking about, Andy, you're like, oh, hardcore, they're all the same. But, but they're not. It's it's completely different. And I think that's such a fascinating point that you just made to give that stat itself, even like, deeper perspective.

John (21:48)

Yeah. But also, like, we get lazy sometimes. We're like, oh, it's hot in Indian Wells. It was 97. It's hot in Miami. It's so different. The air, the air is, the air is like desert air where the ball floats and you kind of have to adjust. You know, Miami is swampy and you kind of have to hit through it. So, like, the heat ain't the same. The air is all different. These are all these adjustments that you have to make. And he's proven time and time again. And I think, you know, Indian Wells victory just puts a little bow on this for, for Yannick Sinner. The other part about that stat that you just read, Mike, if I'm not mistaken, is that Medi, had he won that match, would have had the same stat. He would have been the youngest to, to have ever won all of those masters 1000s on, on a hard court. So that is cool. I want to get to even more stories from Indian Wells and not just the winners. Mickelson, Tien want to get to Fonseca injury recoveries from fees. Draper Novak out of Miami. Coco, should we be worried about the arm? All of that and more after the break. Thanks for watching. Served AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built on. With the ServiceNow AI platform, you' AI data and workflows all work together, connecting every corner of your business. To see how you can put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com AI agents Olivia loves a challenge. It's why she lifts heavy weights and likes complicated recipes. But for booking her trip to Paris, Olivia chose the easy way. With Expedia, she bundled her flight with a hotel to save more. Of course, she still climbed all 6, 174 steps to the top of the Eiffel Tower. You were made to take the easy route. We were made to easily package your trip. Expedia made to travel flight inclusive packages are atoll protected. The world moves fast.

JW (23:39)

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John (24:21)

All right, welcome back to serve. Brought to you by ServiceNow. Medvedev, man, he's had a month, JW. I mean, winning in Dubai and then planes, trains, automobiles. Is he going to get to Indian Wells? Is he going to be able to play once he gets there? He played, yeah.

JW (24:40)

I mean, if you want to psychoanalyze this, I wonder how much. And people now it's sort of become this joke and it took so long to get out of the country and tell us the story. This is serious business, though. I mean, this was not a joke. Two weeks ago when he was trying to get to Jeddah and looking at. Trying to get to Riyadh, Psychoanalyze with me. I wonder if part of this small part perhaps is house money. This is like a wild card. He gets there, he's playing, and suddenly he's had this travel adventure. Here he is. He didn't know if he'd make it. He's in the draw. Some pressure is off. But no, I mean, last year we talked about him and some of his struggles and a member of the camp, it was very cordial, but they sort of said, you don't understand his gut, this groin but problem. And it's affecting his serve. It's really affecting his game. When he gets this sort of groin healthy, he'll be back. Don't read too much into these defeats. And I think sometimes we do gloss over. We say, oh, it's a bad loss. And then you find out later, oh, he had trouble lifting his arm above his shoulder. So in the case of Medvedev, yeah, he had a very strong fall. Sort of had the Lerner teen problem in Australia. And now he's back and that win over Alcaraz, you want to. This is a little bit of a digression, but crazy stat. Players born in the 1980s, yourself included, accounted for 80 major titles. Players born in the 1990s accounted for two. And he's one of the. He's the one active one. Him and Dominic team. That's crazy, right? Anyway, point being, there's something generational here, but let's not forget this guy. You know, this guy not that long ago was winning hardcore majors and got to number one and got to the finals in Australia. And now he's. He's back. He mounted. I mean, that win against Carlos is probably about as good a win as he's had In, I'm thinking raw, I mean, years.

John (26:20)

And then it's as good a win as he's had since he beat Yannick sinner at Wimbledon 18 months ago. I contest that 21 months ago. But I'm just saying, like, this isn't a crazy result. He beat Alvin a couple years ago.

JW (26:36)

That's my larger point, which is, like, it's been a wild year. And, you know, a year ago, he's, he's struggling. He's had a groin injury. It's better. But my point is this is a class, class guy. I mean, this is a primo tennis player we're talking about. So great tournament for him again, it's been a hell of a march for him. But I think it's not unlike actually the real similarities between the men's and women's event here. But, you know, Jannik Sinner wins. Jannik Sinner back on the board. And a nice 7, 6, 7, 6 gutti final. I don't think anyone's going home disappointed if you're Medvedev and, you know, I mean, Sinner, Sinners back. But I think, I mean, tell me if I'm overstepping here, but did, did Medvedev not call you at some point last year for some, for some counsel? Do you want to go there?

John (27:22)

Yeah, that's fine. I mean, I asked him specifically, he said, yeah, whatever. He can talk about anything. He basically just called. I got a call after he had lost the US Open last year. And I think at that point, you know, I, I, I would guess, and this is all my guess, right? So this isn't, But I'm as the, the way that things shook out afterwards with splitting from Jill Savar, who, by the way, did an amazing job with Medvedev for a decade or more. So let that rest here before we get on to the changes. It felt like he was just kind of seeking outside advice, you know, from, from whoever. And so we talked. I remember sitting in the players lounge of the US Open. I was in a, a corner just sitting on the floor, and, and we were chatting on the phone, and he's like, well, what do you, what do you think? What do you see? And I said, listen, you're, you're very good at your patterns, but you've been playing the same patterns for, for, for a decade, right? And I said, easier said than done. I don't know what the solution is, but do you, you know, he was saying, like, I feel like guys are hitting bigger, you know, and I feel like I have the urge to try to hit it bigger, to, to do that. I'm like, I don't know that that's your, your skill set, right. Is there a way for you to be aggressive without just swinging harder? Right. And so I remember referencing, We've referenced the Stanware Rinka inside out backhand. You know, if you're playing defense in the forehand, you're back in the middle of the court. Guys are just going cross court on your backhand, which you have the best cross court back in, you know, one of the top five I've ever seen. But if it's predictable, these guys can hit the pitch. Is there a way where you shove it inside out? Is there a way where you just go nuts and munch one forehand just to keep people honest and basically just thinking through different ways where there can be aggression without being irresponsible in changing stroke production. And so, you know, who knows what lands? But I'm guessing I wasn't the only call that he made. Right. So credit to him for. Sometimes it's really hard when you've been successful doing one thing and playing a certain way for a long time. Finding that mix of adjustment at close to, you know, at 30 years old and implementing new things or going to a former Slam winner in Thomas Johansson and saying, okay, what do you think? What adjustments can we make? And I give him credit for at least curiosity. I don't know if one thing I said was of any value, but I do know that when you have, when you go and get some sort of feedback, if you hear the same thing from five, six, seven people that, you know have played and maybe you respect, there's. There. There's something there. Right? There's going to be something there. So credit to him for not being afraid to change things, not getting back. And I like that you made the point about injuries and we don't know what people are carrying. I don't know. You know, I know for a fact I talked to Zverev at the end of last year, too. He was a mess physically last year, like. And so it is. It does take a certain type of thing. You know, after Australia last year, you know, he said his year, I mean, he has. He said it's by my standards, it was very disappointing. Right. And also he didn't talk to. He didn't talk us through, you know, a back injury he was carrying all year, week to week. Some people need to get it out. It's like a pressure release valve. Some people will have a press release three days after they Lose, you know, even though they're not playing. And some people kind of choose not to talk about it, you know. So we. To your point, we don't really ever know what's going on. More so than House's money, though. Jw. With. With. With this Indian Wells run by Medi, I put a lot more stock in. I'm gonna claw my way back to some sort of form in the fall. I'm gonna win straight out of the gate in Australia. Obviously, the matchup between TN is not one that he likes, but then dominating in Dubai, I put a lot more stock in form like it feels like House's money. A lot more. If you beat everyone 2 and 3 in Dubai for a week, you, You. You know what I'm saying? So, like, credit to him for something's wrong. I need to figure it out. The majors are definitely not going the way that I want them to last year. I don't think he made it past the second round of a. A major, if I'm not mistaken. Let's figure it out. And I might need to wholesale change something that has already delivered me a Islam, the number one ranking, you know, and you said he made final like he made five finals, if I'm not mistaken, of majors outside of the one that he won. It's not like he just dipped in and dipped out like this consistent presence in, you know, the last 48 hour of majors for. For seven years. And oh, by the way, beat Novak Djokovic on a hardcore to win his only major title. So he knows how to play tennis. And it's not wholesale changes all the time. When things are going well, it's these little spots of like, can I bully someone to the forehand side? Can I switch directions? You're not going to beat Carlos Alcaraz to the convert to point backwards to the conversation that Mehdi and I had by being predictable. You're just not. There has to be something that's going to keep Carlos a little at bay, where you have to kind of cat and mouse them a little bit and then at least threaten the blowback. I saw him beat Carlos at the Open a couple years ago during a night session, which was a huge upset, you know, at least to the. The public, maybe more so than the locker room. But every forehand that came his way in the first, you know, however many sets, he was taking huge swings line, which is not what Carlos anticipates when you're. When you're playing Medvedev, but getting, you know, when to be aggressive when not but not, like, kind of overplaying. He's never going to have the forehand that has the RPMs of, like, a Casper Rude. So you can't do that. Like, people, like, be more aggressive. It's like, no, how are you more aggressive, Zverev? Are you just going to take pot shots on your forehand? No. You're going to, like, hit and come in or serve and volley? There's different ways to be aggressive, but they have to fit inside of the framework of your. Your stroke production to.

JW (33:05)

To beat Alcaraz on. On that court. I mean, this is someone who's. Who's always diminishing himself. That's. That's. That's a big win. I forgot about that. You're right. I mean, he. He beat Alcaraz when Alcaraz was defending champion at the Open. But, no, I, I Can we all agree just the. The sport's in a better place when Medvedev is playing at this level.

John (33:22)

Listen, I didn't agree with him on the hindrance thing. I think he knew. Yeah, I think he knew that he fucked it up.

JW (33:28)

I don't think he agreed with him. Yeah, exactly. I don't think he agreed with him.

John (33:31)

Yeah, but, like, I don't know. Are we. Are we, like, more or less entertained? I don't. Listen, I'm not going to excuse bad behavior, but the thing that I like and the reason why. And they'll get on me. Like, you defend Medvedev. I'm like, no, he says he fucked up before any of us can say he fucked up. Like, he was at the net with Draper and Sean. Tell me. Tell me like, you got it. You said it. You said it well before we got on air, but he was basically like, I didn't like it. How'd that go? He goes. He goes, I don't feel great about it. Yeah, Draper was like, I don't feel great about what you did. And Mevin was like, I don't feel good about it either. Or some. Some version of that, you know?

JW (34:06)

I don't know.

John (34:06)

It's. It's better when he's in. Even when he messes up, he'll tell you he messed up most of the time. I'd say more than, you know, 99 of tour. But, I mean, he's back in there. You know, he was out. He was 20 after the Open last year.

JW (34:20)

Right?

John (34:20)

Back in.

JW (34:21)

Yeah.

John (34:21)

I don't know what his ranking is after Indian Wells.

JW (34:24)

He ain't defending much either, but. No, I think. Nice. Nice to have someone from the nice to have someone from the 90s making a run, holding down the decade. We love the 90s.

John (34:34)

Yeah. Along with most fashion trends. Something that I, that I kind of watch for like interesting stories inside of the tournament that don't necessarily end in like a semi or the final. And I know these recap shows that's, you know, largely dominated by the overall result. Mickelson beating Fritz, Tien beating Shelton, kind of that little American jockeying for position. That's always fun. These kids can play. Fonseca looked great. Obviously a lot of hype in that match against Center 6 and 6. I mean, that ball wasn't traveling subtly during that match, I'll tell you that much. But now everyone's like, I, Fonsega played great. It's like I feel like Fonseca is in the, in this place and where if he plays great, we're going to overreact and if he plays badly, we're going to overreact. Like there's is neutrality gone with Fonseca

JW (35:34)

now it's like American politics. You only can have a voice if you're on the extreme. There's no middle ground. Yeah, right. He's either winning double digit majors or he's the biggest overhyped flame out. No. Doesn't a lot of him, I mean, doesn't the eye test do a lot of damage and a lot of work for us here? You just watch him play, you just watch that pop, you just watch the forehand, you watch him go about his business and you say, you know what, I don't care what his one loss record is. I don't care about the match he shouldn't have won and did or the match he shouldn't have lost. And did you just see him and you remind yourself of his age and you just see promise here. He's so fun to watch already. There's such a, there's such a sort of measured approach. There's so many sort of tells that this is a real player. And I think we get caught up in reality, quirky results and not sort of just believe what you see, folks.

John (36:27)

Let's. I'm gonna, I'm gonna simplify Fonseca for us all very quickly. You ready? Everything that is hard to do, right. And that can't necessarily be taught. Like I can't create a certain amount of speed on my back end because of technical deficiencies and the fact that I'm just not very good with my left hand. Right. Like I can't do that. Everything Fonseca does really well, that jumps off the page, which is probably what results in you talking about the eye test, creating massive ball speed, being able to hit winners from all parts of the court, switching directions from either side with pace. Those things can't necessarily be taught to a 19 year old if there are limitations. Everything that is still a question mark, point production, where to stand on second serves, when to pull the trigger and when to lay back, those are things that can be learned, can and will be learned over time. That is why he is such an intriguing prospect. So comparing him to just someone else his age and saying, well, this person got further in this tournament doesn't tell the entire story because that person's ball speed, they could train it, do nothing but train that for two years and it wouldn't match Fonseca's. Now, if you only kind of put Fonseca in the realm of like, I need to learn how to win matches on a bad day, I need to learn about point production. Now, it doesn't mean that, you know he's going to be Andy Murray in that scenario in two years just because he thinks about it, but you're more likely to learn those things than have to learn the natural gifts that Fonseca has. And that's why he's an intriguing prospect. The upside and the things that are hard, he does extremely well. The things that are going to be generational weapons, he has those now. We have seen people that have those. And maybe it doesn't shake out at the bottom. I'm just saying the things that he needs to learn can be learned by repetition, by advice from coaches, by everything else. And that's why he's the person that everyone is looking at. Right. Lose in Australia, he stinks. This guy went further. It doesn't change the upside of what he does well and it doesn't change the upside of what can be learned. And, and when you think about those things together, if everything goes well, you have a guy that can win majors.

JW (38:46)

I hate even giving voice to the sort of the over hype chorus and the people who seem to relish in like throwing.

John (38:52)

Exactly.

JW (38:52)

I mean, it almost doesn't. It's not worthy of us to even dignify it. I do think this was a really nice tournament for that. You know, Arthur Feast back won a few nice matches. Jack Draper looked pretty. I mean, just go through the list of players and the prospects in Umboko and I mean, and Draven, the defending champion, perhaps is an exception, but I just, I thought this was also a pretty solid tournament. Overall with two, two very familiar winners, two very familiar finalists, but overall I think a really strong tournament for the kids.

John (39:20)

I'm glad you brought up Feast and Draper. If you're, if you're coming back from an injury, the last thing you want is to struggle early coming back from an injury. Right. Feast making the finals in the Middle East. Even if he got, you know, drilled by Carlos, big deal. Winning matches every time he gets out. Had a great win over FAA quarterfinals here. If you give that option to his team mid January, they're going. That is an absolute success. That is like great as far as what we need to build him up. And I think he's got the, the goods, the ball production, the ball speed to be a top five guy. I just, I do. And could be sooner than later if you're a Draper. Right. The mental gymnastics of having to defend the most points when you're kind of coming back still is hard. Unbelievable job of separating process from results. Right. Him getting back and making the quarters, beating Novak in like a big pressure filled match against someone who's not going to beat themselves. Like big wins for Feast for fees. Huge comeback for Draper. I don't care that he defended last year. This tournament was a massive success for him given the circumstances coming back from that injury. Both of them can be disruptors. They're two of the names that can get themselves in there and then listen, they don't have to be better and throw bonsai and they're, they don't have to be better than Alcaraz and Center all the time. Can these guys stress them out? Absolutely. With what they can do on a tennis court. Great to have them back. Novak pulls out of Miami. Not much of a surprise. Everyone loves the extended version of Indian Wells. Indian Wells should be grandfathered into any conversation because they didn't do it just because someone else did it. They proved concept, they proved a viable event in a viable place. Now if you're Novak in a silo and you've won 24 majors and you're looking to kind of pace yourself in, in a calendar and you lose in the round of 16 and you basically have two weeks before you play your next first round and your next tournaments in your, you know, one of your cities that you've lived in, guess what you're going to do? Bye. We'll see you in Monte Carlo.

JW (41:31)

We don't have to dwell on this, but just go further on that. Just, just game plan this out. I mean, I had someone, as soon as he lost a Draper, I had A former player text me like, there goes Miami. But what, I mean, what does tennis expect? This guy has, you know, whatever. I don't know, 11 year old and a 9 year old are on the other side of the ocean and he literally has, you know, what was he going to play? He's going to play Minecraft for 10 days. I mean, how do they expect him

John (41:56)

going to go to the Phoenix Challenger?

JW (41:58)

Yeah, I mean, yeah, right. Exactly. What do they think is going to happen?

John (42:01)

Here's what annoys me in this scenario. You ready? He was gone. Gone. Like, it would have been a miracle if he played Miami. But like, when Novak goes, hey, listen, I'm not chasing the number one ranking. I'm here for majors. I'm, I'm proving new success rates with longevity at, at this age. I will prioritize my family. I want to see my kids grow up. Everyone's, everyone goes, man, that's great. That's absolutely what you should do. And then a certain sect of, of people, he pulls out of Miami and be like, he's pulling out of Miami. No, those are the same thing. That's the exact same conversation. Doing all of the things that he has talked about for the last 18 months is this decision, like it's this exact decision. Sitting around and going to Miami and training and playing practice sets and doing the whole thing. No, your next tournament's in Monte Carlo. Guess who's going to be in Monte Carlo. I'll bet, I'll bet you a dollar. His family. This, that those are the exact same conversations. If you understand the macro conversation of something, you can't be upset about the micro decisions that lead to that macro view. It's dumb, makes no sense. He's gone. He's not going to spend two weeks training. Gone. He doesn't need to win Miami. He's Novak. Who gives a shit? Sorry, James. Probably, probably not a great segue to say that James is going to be. James Blake, Detroit director in Miami is, is going to come on for the Q and A segment. So send in those questions. Mike, where can they send them?

Mike (43:28)

Go to servepodcast.com and you can find a link there and send all your questions or just DM them to us, however you want to send them. We'll take them.

JW (43:36)

Go hard too. None of this like, what's it like running a tournament? I mean, we want to make this guy twist. We want to make him squirm, we want to make him embarrassed. I mean, really unload on James Blair. The chamber here, folks.

John (43:47)

If I could lob In a couple. I got some. I got some questions about a couple nights out in the early 2000s. Anyways, one thing I just want to touch on the. The women's draw. A couple of you mentioned the youngsters, and I want to make sure we get to them before we close out here. It never good to see Coco. She is not someone who. Who throws in the towel. She's not someone who retires from matches. She is not someone who, even with struggles with shots, she kind of leans into the stress. She shows up the next week. She's, you know, maybe one of the most professional people I've ever seen her age, which makes. Which would tend to make us maybe accurately concerned about this. This. This arm situation. Hopefully it's nothing.

JW (44:32)

Yeah, I mean, this is one. One of either. I mean, I think ultimately this is a benefit of tennis.

John (44:37)

We don't know a lot.

JW (44:37)

If this is the NFL, you get a much more detailed injury report. I mean, we don't. Arm. Arm injury could mean a lot of things. You know, we've seen players in absolute agony and then they give it a day and they still look good when they enter the doubles draw. So who knows? But, yeah, I mean, this is. This is basically a home game for Coco. And let's not forget she is the defending champion of the next major. But to your point, this is not someone who is. Is quick to pull the ripcord. So you hope she's okay.

Mike (45:04)

Well, after the match, in her press conference, she said that it, quote, it felt like a firework was going off inside my arm, and they may be potentially nerve issues and. Andy, have you. Did you ever deal with any nerve issues?

John (45:17)

Yeah, it's not like it's. Well, there's. There's a. Think of like a back injury. It could be pinching a nerve, and then you get adjusted and lets itself out. That can relieve pretty quickly once you get there. As far as an arm, I don't know that you want anything nervy in an arm. It look, it looked like forearm, which is probably better than like elbow shoulder situation that tends to lend it. And this is. Listen, I'm not. I'm not a doctor. I'm just telling you because I've probably felt these things. This feels more muscular and. Which is. You'd rather have muscular than like structural. So hopefully that's. That's the case with Coco. But it. Not all people retiring from matches are the same. And when you see Coco do it, you kind of go, oh, okay. I hope this isn't. I hope this isn't the second time

Mike (46:02)

she's ever done it.

John (46:03)

Yeah, and listen, she.

JW (46:05)

She's.

John (46:05)

She's not one to. To throw in the towel and walk off if she can compete. She is an uber competitor. So we hope that Coco gets better. We hope that she's in Miami. More importantly, we hope that she's healthy for the rest of the season. If I'm her team and she's not feeling great going into Miami, she's not one to lay off the calendar. She plays a pretty heavy schedule all the time. It's a tough, tough tightrope walk, shot clocks, big shots, upsets, aces. TGL playoffs are here. First, Atlanta Drive starts their repeat run against Los Angeles Golf Club. Then Rory's Boston Common golf and Tigers Jupiter Links face off in their playoff debuts. Who will advance? Keep up its playoffs. Tune in Tuesday, March 17 at 6:30pm and 9pm only on ESPN and the ESPN app. So good, so good, so good. Spring styles are at Nordstrom Rack stores now and they're up to 60% off. Stock up and save on Rag and Bone, Madewell, Vince, All Saints and more of your favorites.

JW (47:01)

How did I not know rack has Adidas?

John (47:03)

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JW (47:57)

No, no. Fierce disagreement, but what you're basing that on what?

John (48:01)

She plays well every week.

JW (48:02)

That's pretty.

John (48:03)

She plays. She plays. She's going to be in position. So we talk about Stabilenka. She lost in, you know, grandson. She's in position every single tournament. Now, Umboka is obviously not there yet. But if you take this breakout last year, some injuries kind of maybe limped ish to the finish line or at least was spottier out of the gates. This year, like final quarter major, you know, she's making the quarters or better in every single event. She gets through tough three set matches all the time. She starts flipping those and you know, turns her three set wins into four and fours, which she will. You know, she's only been on the main tour for like eight months. Okay.

JW (48:39)

She didn't have a top, she didn't have a top hundred ranking this time last year.

John (48:41)

That's what I'm saying. Like, but she, she plays well every single week. Like losing to Sabalenka. Yeah, it doesn't bother me at all. But she's just building, she's physically strong. Right. She can kind of withhold the stress test of, of big tennis. So I, I'm just more and more impressed with her, the way she goes about it. She doesn't have to play great to win matches she's really good at. Like, I might not play well first, second, third round, but I'm still here in the quarters. Those are big things for a young player. So I wanted to say that out loud and maybe give me till like the end of 2028, but I think she, I think she wins a major. Conversely, someone we would have been saying this about a year ago, who I'm still a big fan of, I'm not going to overreact. Even if she may have overreacted to the crowd this week, which was, which was Mira Andreva. You could kind of feel the stress of maybe having to defend.

JW (49:34)

You can hear the stress.

Mike (49:35)

Yeah.

John (49:36)

I mean, what do you, what, what's your take on where she's at right now? And one, am I crazy with the imboca thing? And, and two, what do we make of Andreeva right now?

JW (49:44)

I don't think, I mean, picking anyone to win a major is, is bold, but. No, I think you're right. And Boko is a real revelation. And you're right too. I mean, there's just, there's defense. She's a good athlete, she's a good mover. There seems to be a real calm around. I spent a little time with him in Australia. There's a real sort of nice vibe around the camp. Not too stressful. I don't know what to make of Andreeva. I mean, look, careers are not linear, lives are not linear. But yeah, the last, it's when she loses lately, it's come with A lot of drama, which I'm not sure too many people saw coming. And yeah, I mean, I think you had a key phrase which is. I think she's defending a lot. That was a lot. That was a big pressure event. So it wasn't just a defeat. But she knows what happens to rankings when you win big events and then you don't do it the, the subsequent year. I'm not sure about the, sure about the profanity we, we give grace to teenagers, but I don't. That's like this has become like a thing. It's not a one off.

John (50:41)

I'll tell you something, I don't like profanity. I don't like profanity.

JW (50:46)

Enough of this fucking profanity.

John (50:47)

I won't stand for that.

Mike (50:49)

The woman, the woman reacting to her yelling, fuck you all.

JW (50:52)

The pearl clutcher.

John (50:53)

The pearl clutcher is still.

Mike (50:55)

It's going to be one of my favorite of the year. That, that and the grandma knitting during one of the matches is, is probably some of the best. Stu.

John (51:02)

Here, here's, here's. I got, I got something for you on Andreva, right? When your game is based around power and you can hit yourself out of frustration, it's a little bit different, right? Than when your game is based around decision making, tennis IQ and clarity of intent, right. In order for Andreva's game to work, I think she has to have a certain amount of chess master in her game, right? What she did so beautifully last year for that run of like four to five weeks from Middle east through Indian Wells was mixing up paces, switching directions, playing it short, playing it back, defending against Sabalenka's pace by you deflating the ball. All of those little decisions you have to be clear on. I think if things are jumbled up here, I think specifically with her style of game. And listen, I'm the last person that ever cares about someone hitting a ball out of a stadium. But similar to what we talked about with Sabalenka, Sabalenka can break a racket and I have no doubts four minutes later she's going to be engaged. I don't have that same confidence right now within Drava, so I don't mind her getting upset, right? Her personality is not going to be this wallflower, quiet, Rabbakina type thing. It's not going to be that. So that's a dumb expectation for anyone to have. The focus is get it out, get back to work. You got to find a way to deflate your emotions when they get the best of you and they will. She's fiery. That's going to be a benefit for her at some point in her career and we're going to give credit to it two years from now, while not remembering what happened in Indian Wells this year with her game specifically. There has to be clarity of operation to make the decisions to make her the most effective version of herself, in my opinion. Mike, I don't know that we have time to kind of go to this rabbit hole because I could spend 40 minutes on it and I want to do it responsibly and not rushed at the end of a recap episode. But can you just talk about the moving parts of Italy buying a grass court event, the ATP starting buybacks through the Saudi investment fund and kind of where that's at or at least just give the headline real quick.

Mike (53:11)

Well, yeah, the Athletic dropped an article last week kind of breaking all this down. So if you wanted in a lot of detail, go over to the Athletic and find an article about this. But essentially the report is that Saudi Arabia, through the PIF investment fund, Surge, which is basically a giant sports investment fund that they use to acquire properties, is aiding the ATP and cleaning up the calendar. I guess last year or end of last year or recently, the ATP has initially used its own cash to buy back four ATP 250s, which would include Hong Kong which is in January, Shandong which is September, Moscow, which I think has been long retired since the war in Ukraine started. That was October, and then Mets which is November. And now Surge is backing the move to negotiate buyouts of Argentina which is in Argentina Open which is a 250 in February and Acapulco which is a 500, which obviously was in the news for a lot of the wrong reasons. So that would clear the way for their 1000 which starts in 2028. The goal is to have these done by 2028 so they can clear the calendar for their own new week long ATP only Masters 1000 which starts in Saudi Arabia. And then the goal of the Italian federation was they recently bought the Brussels ATP 250 license, which I believe that one was also in October and they're going to move it to Milan and they're going to flip it to a grass court event the week after Roland Garros. And they bought that for some $24 million, which then also includes a 10% fee to the ATP. So the ATP gets a cool $2.4 billion for just saying, yeah, that looks good for a 250.

John (54:51)

Yeah, well.

Mike (54:52)

And with the goal of maybe they're going to move it to a 500, but then that'll also be in Milan. That'll be in Milan by 2028. So that, that basically leaves.

John (55:01)

All right, you know, so I've, I have a couple of quick thoughts and we won't go too far into it. Is there precedent for a 500 after a major? I don't think there is. So for that to happen we just have to like rip up.

Mike (55:15)

You're talking about the Milan?

JW (55:16)

Yeah, I mean the very, you mean the very next week after a major?

John (55:19)

Yeah. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't, I mean there was queens for a while. Can you fit another 500 in there with Holland Queens? They ain't losing their designations or they shouldn't lose their designations. It's 500. So I'm all for it. Here, here, here's. And people are going to be polarized by this issue, right? Do we want to take this money and okay, here's what's going to. Here's the choice of the ATP and we, you've heard us, we give our honest opinions on everything. You either take this money because the biggest issue you have is the schedule. Right. And I've long been saying take the two 50s back, you can shuffle those around. Those would be the easiest thing to move to fix the calendar. End World Tour Finals earlier. Now, if you don't take this money, there is a threat of live tennis. I don't think anyone agrees that that's a great way to go. So if you, if that money's going somewhere, should it go to you? Should we be focusing on the ATV250s and does that give us the biggest chance to actually get a calendar that is shorter? Now, all of these other financial things and where the money goes and all that stuff, I want clarity on that. I don't think we're going to get that in the next year. Right. But if there's a chance to move these things and to shorten the calendar and if that's the end result, I can rationalize these moves. Jw, what do you think?

JW (56:38)

Yeah, we should do a deeper dive on this another time. I think long, I think short answer. You're right. I mean, I think what everybody wants to avoid is a live situation. I'm a little skeptical of all of cloaking this and oh, it's all about the calendar and it's all about making this better for the player. I mean there's still, even with these buybacks, they're going to be more than 60 events. I think Formula One looms large here. This has always been a model. Why can't we have a select number of events where the best players are going to be there? The best and you know, the Formula One season is, whatever it is, 22 races. I think, ironically enough, I think it's 22 now that two races in the Middle east were dropped because of the situation there. But look, I mean, Saudi Arabia is going to get their event in 2028. It's going to be a 56 draw. It's going to be one week only. It's as of now, men only. And just because someone offers you a buyback doesn't mean you have to take it. So I am a little bit confused. I mean, great, if Acapulco says now we're all good or, you know, we love our South American, you know, we can't compete with you financially, but we sure have a lot of flavor here. We certainly have more homegrown players than Saudi Arabia. But I don't know, we should.

John (57:45)

We should.

Mike (57:45)

It doesn't mean they go away, by the way. It doesn't mean they go away.

JW (57:48)

Yeah, right. They can come back in the calendar. Right.

Mike (57:51)

That's, that's the biggest thing. It's not like they're buying them and killing them. Right. It's.

John (57:54)

They're.

Mike (57:54)

Some of these, they're just going to move.

John (57:55)

It doesn't mean they're not.

Mike (57:57)

It doesn't mean they're not. I'm just saying it doesn't mean they are. And that depends, I guess on the negotiation and remaining, whatever it is. And to your point, John, about the WTA is kind of left out of this, but they're not. I mean they're basically in the Middle east all of February already.

JW (58:12)

I just think it's important that we have another acronym. You said surge. S, U, R J. That's the Saudi.

Mike (58:18)

Yeah.

JW (58:18)

It's good because tennis doesn't have enough acronyms. Glad we can. Glad we can add a tenth. Glad we can add a tenth event.

John (58:25)

Good.

JW (58:26)

Anyway, it's interesting. It's some point. You know, it's, it's. This is really important as a sport and we could probably do a solo episode on this alone.

John (58:34)

We will. I think that's where we're going to net. Net out on this news will be incoming. I was. Listen, you're going to be a lot of two 50s that are selling. If 25 million plus is the, is the thing, a lot of them don't make money, frankly speaking on a week to week basis on their Own. So listen, if you were doing a multiple of revenue, it would not be $25 million, I can guarantee you that. So. So listen, if they're taking care of these, these two 50s that are largely dying because of mandatory events and all that stuff, then, you know, maybe there's a lane here. And I am hopeful for it. I hope it's the best case version of what this could potentially be. And, and then I could probably rationalize an explanation that may be imperfect but rational, you know, so hopefully that's. That's where it's going to go. James Blake, I think, is going to take over Q and Andy, uh, this week. So send in your questions for turnover director James Blake. And we have more news. A big one. We got a big one coming. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Alex Yala. The phenomenon is going to come on serve.

JW (59:39)

We are going to shoot.

John (59:40)

We are going to shoot that this week and that will be out next Tuesday. So a bit of a delay on when that is released. But I mean, jw, you've spent some time with, with Yala and just observing this phenomenon, like, is there any precedent for this with someone who kind of. We didn't know largely the tennis community a year ago, before her run in Miami, and now it's Must see TV and drawing maybe the biggest crowds, you know, of anyone outside of, you know, Alcaraz, Sinner and the like.

JW (60:10)

I, I love. I mean, let's be clear why. I mean, I. And she's very upfront about this.

John (60:14)

She's.

JW (60:14)

She's a top 30 player. I mean, this. And she had a great week last week. I mean, this is a. This is a formidable player. But let's be honest, this is because she represents the Philippines, which is a country with more than 100 million people, but doesn't have a lot of history in tennis. And she's really leaned into it. And I mean, there's some players who sort of like hype for the wrong reasons. And there are other players who probably should lean into hype a little more. Here's a player who just gets it. And I don't think she's, you know, there are no delusions here. I mean, I think she knows that there's still a couple. Everything's trending in the right direction. She still has a couple levels to get to, but she has really embraced the fact that she is representing. Representing so many fans. And when she plays, I mean, we saw this at the Open. We saw this in Australia. It was apparently the case in Indian Wells. There is such a loyal fan base from this demographic that honestly tennis hasn't had much representation of in the past. It's really lovely to see and it's lovely how she has shouldered that so gracefully and so happy. She's cool, she's 20. But I think this is a set of pressures that I'm not sure any other player on tour, I mean you could go back and I know Sanya Mirza in India or maybe, but it's really an extraordinary set of circumstances and the way that she has welcomed this and embraced it and will sign every autograph and pose with every flag, it's really, it's lovely to see it. It's also a reminder of tennis's potential as this global sport.

John (61:38)

I'm so excited. I get the most nervous for interviews where if someone comes on and I have a 20 year history with them, I know that there's going to be this thing. I'm just really excited to learn more from her. I know as much as you all do. I've watched, watched her, I've read the articles, I've seen her speak in press. I'm amazed. Like whether it's her, whether it's Mboco, whether it's so many of these young players, I'm always just blown away by their maturity and they're like understanding of, of kind of their orbit, you know, maybe more so than, than us dummies in the past and you know, what kind of where we were. But I'm super excited. I'm glad to hear that your experiences with her have been amazing and I know that our served audience will love hearing from her as well. So tune in for the Yala. I always have to find myself like you remember when, you remember when Ja Rule used to go holla, holla. Sorry. Anyways, this, this been, this has been served. Brought to you by ServiceNow Yala Mania. Next week, send in your questions for James Blake. He will not outrate Yalla, I guarantee you. Thanks for watching. Thanks. Thanks for watching, sir. AI is only as powerful as the platform it's built on. With the ServiceNow AI platform, your AI data and workflows all work together, connecting every corner of your business. To see how you can put AI to work for people, visit servicenow.com AI agents.