← Served with Andy Roddick
Served with Andy Roddick
Martina Hingis on World No. 1 Pressure, Peyton Stearns’ Title & More | Love All w/ Kim Clijsters
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- [00:01]
Blair
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- [00:31]
Kim
This episode is brought to you by White Claw Surge. Nice choice hitting up this podcast. No surprises. You're all about diving into tastes everyone in the room can enjoy.
- [00:40]
Martina Hingis
Just like White Claw Surge.
- [00:42]
Kim
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- [00:56]
Martina Hingis
White Cloth Seltzer Works Chicago, Illinois Here we go.
- [01:07]
Kim
Hello everybody. Welcome back to a new episode of Love All. It is the start of March. There is no sign in New Jersey of the spring starting anytime soon. But I am very, very excited, Blair, to to speak with our next guest, none other than Martina Henges. Really, really excited that she decided to say yes and come on the show. So happy. Yeah, really looking forward to that.
- [01:34]
Blair
Yeah. So much fun to talk to Martina. I think we established in the fact that we were supposed to have her for a half an hour. We talked to her for almost an hour. We could have gone for several more hours. We're hoping that maybe there's a part B somewhere down the road. But I loved listening to you guys talk about your head to head and how each one of you thinks on the court. I was just sitting there. Had to remind my that I too was on the podcast because I was just sitting there enjoying story time. We had so much fun and if you can see my background here, if you're watching on YouTube, I am clearly not at home. You can see my lovely kitchenette behind me. I am in Indian Wells. I was in Las Vegas for the MGM slam. Congrats to 19 year old Joao Fonseca who can spend none of his $300,000 winnings in Las Vegas legally on on gambling or drinking. But we had a great time in Las Vegas. I'm in Indian Wells for a few days for an ATP project. But Kim, I'M excited to get to talk to you. Bright and early for me, we're going to do some Henley's headlines. We're going to get some confirmation, and as you mentioned, then we're going to go into our interview with Martina. All right, so let's start with some headlines, and obviously a tough one at first. The US And Israel have attacked Iran and fighting has spread throughout several Middle Eastern countries and cities, including Dubai, just as that tournament was wrapping up. As we speak right now, we know there are still players and staffers and journalists who are still stuck in that area because the airspace has been closed. And it's just a really difficult scene to watch from afar. There are a lot of questions, there's information that we don't know, a lot of uncertainties, but just a tough scene.
- [03:24]
Kim
Yeah, very. And I remember as a teenager flying to, you know, at the time when I was dating Leighton, flying to Australia and flying over Kuwait and some Middle Eastern countries where there was a war going on. It's, you know, it's scary thoughts. And so, you know, it also reminds me of a lot of the players from the Ukraine that are, you know, have been going through this for a couple of years and are, you know, playing week in, week out for their country and with everything that's going on. So it's a tough environment to be in and to just keep focused on what you're trying to do on court. But, yeah, it's an unfortunate situation and hope it doesn't have to last too much longer.
- [04:14]
Blair
Switching gears, Kim. We had heard rumors that Alicia Parks had hit with Serena Williams or was spending time on the court with her. We now have video proof. Serena does not look like a player who hasn't been out on the court practicing since 2023, as she said in one of her social media videos on a couple of weeks ago.
- [04:49]
Kim
Yeah, that, that was, I think, for the serve, right where she mentions her serve, which it is, I can speak with a little bit of experience there. The serve is the hardest shot. I feel like when you've been out of the game for a while to, to get the shoulder kind of loose and, and, and, and get that rhythm back. But really nice to see, you know, see them both playing together. I mean, whenever I watch Alicia Parks on the, on the tennis court, she just reminds me of Serena. She hits her forehand like Serena. She hits the back and she moves some of her reactions in between the points, like, very, very similar to Serena. So a great experience for her as well to be able on court with yeah. With Serena and a good kind of test, I think, in a sense. Right. For Serena to be able to play against a current player who's playing well and who. Yeah. Is out there competing against the best players today. So it's a kind of a nice little measurement for Serena, too.
- [05:50]
Blair
I am obsessed with the slow drip of Serena comeback media information, the misleading, the talk show, the social media videos, the. Are we joking? Are we not? I'm hooked. I'm on the edge of my seat. I have no idea what's going to happen, but all signs point to the fact that we're going to be seeing Serena back on a professional tennis court probably sooner rather than later. Agree?
- [06:14]
Kim
I agree. Yep.
- [06:15]
Blair
All right. A very important update, Kim from the grounds of Indian Wells. We're bringing you the hard news here. Arena Sanka has a new puppy, a King Charles cavalier named Ash. And I am told that it is in honor of Arthur Ash.
- [06:31]
Kim
Okay. Not Ash Barty.
- [06:33]
Martina Hingis
Not.
- [06:33]
Kim
Not Ash Barty.
- [06:34]
Blair
Although it's spelled A S H with no e. So I. Who knows, maybe we can give a. Not Barty as well. But so many dogs here on the grounds at Indian Wells. I mean, Mira Andreeva has a dog. Botapova has a dog. Colinskaya has a dog here. I mean, there are. There are puppies everywhere. Could you have imagined being on the road? I mean, not that I think Arena Sabalenka is getting up at 4am to go walk said puppy, but could you have imagined having a dog on tour with you?
- [07:04]
Kim
Not full time. I actually had an English bulldog that traveled with me to a couple of the European tournaments where I was able to, you know, to drive the car with. I can't take my English bulldog in a little carry on bag, which, you know, that was a little harder. But yeah, it's a really nice distraction, too, to be able to go home or go walk the dog or to the hotel room and just have, you know.
- [07:27]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [07:27]
Kim
A little bit of a distraction. Maybe her. The mother instinct or her mother. How do you say that in English? Like maybe she's craving, you know, like to take care of. Maternal instinct is starting to kick in a little bit, and that's a good first step for the two of them. And. Yeah. But just really very cute dog. I saw. It was very, very cute. So nice. I can't wait to play with the puppies. It's always been, you know, Venus and Serena travel with their dog. Martina Napratilova traveled with her dog. I mean, there were plenty of dogs around and it was just a really nice distraction from, you know, day to day life on tour.
- [08:06]
Blair
All right, next up, Coco has weighed in on the ball kids handling the towel debate. I love this topic, Kim, because everyone has an opinion, but this is what Coco had to say on social media. I saw a tournament where they put the towels in baskets and brought the baskets to the players. I feel like that would be a good option. Question mark. But I agree with not wanting bald kids to touch sweaty towels, lol. I wouldn't want to either. I always felt bad giving them my sweaty towels, lol. So. So Coco is. Is not in my camp or your camp either. I think we both agreed that we were fine with ball kids handling towels. I don't know.
- [08:44]
Kim
I mean, I feel like the bulk is the bulk. Kids have always been fine with handling. So sweaty towels. Maybe gloves are a middle, you know, a kind of a solution. But yeah, I have, you know, my son lost my phone last week and so I was a few days without a phone. I apparently didn't do an icloud backup for a very long time and I have not been able to get on my Instagram at all. It's not letting me get a code or whatever it is. So if there's any Instagram people that do like tennis and watch this, please maybe reach out or can I reach out to you? I don't know how, but yeah, I've been without Instagram for. For a little while, so. Haven't been. I'm glad you kept me updated with the latest tennis news and. But my house looks cleaner than ever, let me tell you that.
- [09:37]
Blair
Is that what happens when you don't have Instagram?
- [09:39]
Kim
I'm like organizing cabinets. I'm getting rid of a bunch of stuff. Stuff. It's like, okay, I have other things to do that are also very important.
- [09:48]
Blair
Maybe I should try having my child lose my phone and lock me out of Instagram forever. No, but really fun to have Coco weigh in. Chris Eubanks also weighed in, by the way, and he agreed with, with both of us that, you know, it wasn't a big deal for ball kids to handle the towels until obviously it was for. For Covid reasons. And. And then we all started thinking about it, but for a time it was just sort of what ball kids did. And as a ball kid who did
- [10:15]
Martina Hingis
it, I didn't think it was that
- [10:17]
Blair
big of a deal. So anyway, I know again, like I said, people have strong feelings on that topic. I'm sure we'll revisit at some point. So that brings us, Kim, to My favorite new segment, it's Kim Formation, which. Just a quick summary.
- [10:34]
Kim
I'm glad you say it. I don't have to say it.
- [10:36]
Blair
Yes, I will say it. But also Andy, when he had listened to this segment last week, he texted to say that he has changed Kim's name in his phone to Kim Formation and sent us a screenshot of her contact now in his phone as Kim Formation.
- [10:58]
Kim
Listen, I've had nicknames, so one of Leighton's coaches back in the day was Roger Rasheed. He used to call me Kimbo. That was like, I guess an Australian way to go about things. And then I think Brad Gilbert was calling me Kim Kong for a while. So, so information is kind of like, I'm okay with that.
- [11:21]
Martina Hingis
Kim Kong.
- [11:22]
Kim
Kim Kong cannot.
- [11:23]
Blair
I, I saw Brad two nights ago at the, this MGM Slam thing. I, I, Next time I see him, I am bringing that up. That is him hysterical. If I. I need Andy to change your contact now to Kim Kong. That's the funniest thing I've ever heard.
- [11:41]
Martina Hingis
Oh, my gosh.
- [11:44]
Kim
Yep.
- [11:46]
Blair
Sorry.
- [11:47]
Kim
I want to say, hope he doesn't hear this, but he's going to hear it, you know, 100%.
- [11:52]
Blair
Okay, moving on to Kim Kong's confirmation, we're going to talk about the ATX Open, where Peyton Stearns Defeated Taylor Townsend 7 6, 7 5. A great final. Taylor playing in her first ever WTA final. Peyton Stearns getting the second title of her career in Austin, where she played college tennis, was an NCAA team and singles champion there. Great storylines in the final. But in terms of the tennis, Kim, what did you see?
- [12:21]
Kim
It was, it was good tennis. I think this matchup was, you know, it was a big moment for both players. Right. It was, you know, for Taylor, an important kind of first step. I don't think she'd ever made the final of a WTA event in singles. She's very successful in doubles. So for her to get there in singles is, was, was really exciting. And I think with, with Peyton Stearns, to me, you know, she added a little bit of extra pressure to herself by saying that, you know, it was about time that one of the Texas Longhorns was going to win the tournament. So. But, yeah, really exciting to see her win a title. I feel like with Peyton Stearns, she can show some incredible, great things, and then there's times where she can really miss some easy mistakes. And we saw that, especially in the first set where she went up a break, and it was just the level was going both ways. There was some really good things and Then some unforced errors, I think, on, you know, missing like an easier overhead, a drop volley that she missed as well, like on set points and on match points. And it just, it was, yeah, you could tend to feel that there was nerves and, you know, when you haven't been in that position for many times or ever, it's, you know, you don't know, a lot of times. How does my mind react to that added pressure? How does my body react when my mind is not, you know, not just focused on hitting the tennis ball? And there's other things that you're, that you're worried about. So, so. But I like her game. I like, you know, she's a very fit player. She, she can run a lot of balls down. But, yeah, just, you know, also likes to stay, you know, close to the baseline, play aggressive. But I think at times, I still think that there's a lot of room for growth. And I think the consistency, especially from Peyton Stearns, is something that can, can still improve. And, and, but that's, you know, winning events like this will definitely help with her confidence and will, you know, point out those kind of the strengths and the weaknesses. And it's really great to take that with you and move forward with it.
- [14:31]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [14:31]
Blair
I talked to Jimmy Arias about Peyton maybe a year ago, two years ago, and I know he spent some time working with her, and he said, he told her this is when she was maybe ranked 60, 70, something like that. And he said, you know, you should be so encouraged by the fact that you, you are already at this ranking and you don't know what you're doing out on the court. So essentially the same thing like you have, there's so much room to grow because she has that raw talent and raw power. Her, her, the live arm factor with Peyton Stearns, when you watch her is really evident.
- [15:03]
Kim
So, yeah, and then there's mistake, you know, then there's mistakes where you're like, wait, what was that like? Like, so, like out of nowhere sometimes and kind of. Yeah, very opposite of, you know, the player that we talk to later in the episode with Martina Hingis, who is very, you know, who has a solution for every ball that comes at her. And so, yeah, but a great win for Peyton. Nice to be able to do it in Austin. Yep.
- [15:31]
Blair
All right, and one more match that we want to talk about, slash player. In Merida, Christina Buksha defeated Magdalena Freck, star 614664. She also won the Devil's title. And she has a really fascinating story. She's coached by her father, who is not a tennis player. He was a former Moldovan Olympic biathlete and biathlon. I mean, gosh, you can't. You. I don't know that you can think of a sport that. That is more specific to what you're doing.
- [16:02]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [16:02]
Blair
Complex and. And, you know, not a lot of transferable skill, I wouldn't think, from biathlon to tennis, but they've made it work. It's a really neat story, right?
- [16:12]
Kim
And it's. A lot of times it's the mental side of it, right? That is what he's been able to transfer over. And I think that's something that. My dad was not a tennis coach at all. Like, he never interfered with what I did on court with my technique or my tactics. But it was the mental side that. That he, you know, tried to focus on and help out with and share his experience. And. Her father's name is Ion. Ion. You know, Moldova is a very, very small country. It's between, I think, Romania and the Ukraine, if I remember correctly. If my.
- [16:51]
Blair
That's pretty impressive.
- [16:52]
Kim
My European map skills. That's. Listen, that was drilled in us when, you know, going to school in Belgium. Like, we had to know all the. All the countries, but, um. So I've gotten to know them a little bit. A few years ago, you know, like, the dad would see me and. And we would talk a little bit. His English wasn't great, but he would. Yeah, just. We had a really nice connection, and. And I would go watch some of her matches a little bit. And she was always a player that, you know, was mentally very much always there. She. She hardly ever gets distracted, hardly plays bad matches. Like, it's not like her tennis stood out in the beginning when I saw her on tour, but was consistent, and she was. She worked her way, and there's not a lot of attention on her. She doesn't stand out as a. As a. As a personality a lot. But she's very committed, worked very hard, and it's her and her dad and that, you know, travel the world and go through it all. And she's been, you know, when you don't play your best tennis, she beat. She beat Paolini, right? And I think it was a semifinal. And when you don't play your best tennis, she's a very tough player to beat. And because she can make you doubt yourself, because she doesn't give you a lot of mistakes, she doesn't give you kind of momentum to work your way into a match. And she did that really well, she won her first WTA title on her dad's birthday, which was very special. But she's a good player. She has good results in doubles and is starting to feel more comfortable, more and more like she belongs on tour. And I feel like in the beginning, there was, like, the overwhelming factor. She was, a lot of times a little bit overwhelmed by the circus of traveling on tour and the craziness of it all. But I think winning matches like this and over time, you've seen her grow into a more confident player and just getting better and also fit strong, very strong mentally. I think what to me stands out the most is her mental mindset.
- [19:00]
Blair
All right, well, after the break, we are going to have our interview with Martina Hingis. I cannot wait. You guys will love it, so stick around. Welcome back to Love all, where we have a very special guest with us. She's a Hall of Famer who's captured 43 singles titles, including five Grand Slams. She also dominated on the devil's court, collecting 64 titles, including 13 doubles majors and an additional seven in mixed. She's been number one in both singles and doubles. We're so excited to have her. It is Martina Hingis.
- [19:37]
Kim
Incredible. Welcome, Martina.
- [19:39]
Martina Hingis
Hi, Kim.
- [19:40]
Kim
Hi. Very excited to get you on our Love Old podcast today.
- [19:44]
Martina Hingis
Well, thank you for having me. I've been watching you say, I've been
- [19:48]
Kim
watching you on the court. How are you doing?
- [19:53]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, pretty good. I'm right now actually doing a gig in Athens, so I'm staying at the hotel and a little bit kind of on the vacation trip playing as well. So looking forward to having a little bit of sunshine. Coming from cold Switzerland, a few days off.
- [20:12]
Kim
I'm very jealous. Blair and I, we've been, you know, over the last few couple of months, we've been stuck in snowstorms and cold weather, and so, yeah, seeing the tennis tour in Australia and now going to. To Indian Wells in Miami is. Is very nice.
- [20:28]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, I feel the same. So now. Now a little bit at the beach, so it's a bit chilly in the evenings, but, yeah, at least the sun's out and. And no clouds and no rain, no fog. Like, yeah, the same thing at home. It was really cold. And although I love skiing, so we went skiing quite a bit with my daughter, and that was perfect time. Like, every Swiss person almost has to. It's like a must. And I enjoyed that a lot. And, yeah, the weather up in the mountains, it actually was quite mild and really nice to do that, too, so I don't complain. Switzerland's good.
- [21:06]
Kim
When I stopped playing in 2012 and once I think after Jada was just before she was born, we went to Switzerland a few times to ski and we went to Lenzerheide one time. We went. Yeah. A couple of different places. Perfect.
- [21:23]
Martina Hingis
Like Alen Serheide I know frankly quite well because that's where I grew up skiing.
- [21:28]
Kim
Oh really?
- [21:28]
Martina Hingis
It's only half hour away from the place I grew up until I was 18 and that's actually the place that I used to go all the time, you know.
- [21:37]
Kim
So yeah, I think I love a little bit more just, you know, the spa and the. These days I didn't grow up skiing and so I don't know, I just. Yeah. God, don't have the. The freed. I don't feel the freedom or you know, I'm a little bit like fear. I have some fear play on the skis. So maybe I just need to practice more. That's might. Might help. Well, I'll go out with you.
- [22:04]
Martina Hingis
No, but I ski since I was three so that was always part of my in a way training as well. Which I did off court because yeah, it was great for later on realize how great for the legs and plus the altitude and it felt like it wasn't as painful as being in the gym and lifting weights.
- [22:25]
Kim
True, true. So I guess in your contracts it didn't say no skiing.
- [22:31]
Martina Hingis
No, my mom put it out on there.
- [22:34]
Kim
Good.
- [22:34]
Martina Hingis
She was smart on that way.
- [22:36]
Kim
Blair, that might be a fun. We do a love all episode on the slopes in Switzerland or something.
- [22:42]
Blair
Yes, please. Ski camp with Martina. I would be and sign me up, but Martina, you also mentioned your daughter Leah, who I think is seven years old. I know she does some of the cold weather sports as well. What is she like? Do you see yourself in her? What has it been like being a mom?
- [23:01]
Martina Hingis
No, definitely. I mean I tried to bring some of the things that I was taught as a young girl from my mom and I think it just gives you a lot of variety, especially being in Switzerland. Everything is very close by.
- [23:15]
Kim
So.
- [23:16]
Martina Hingis
So the only thing that I didn't do when I was a girl was climbing. So here in Switzerland there are a lot of indoor places as well, which is only like 10, 15 minutes away and they have this amazing indoor facilities that you can do climbing. Except that everything I did like trying to teach her like mountain bike, like riding a bike. I mean now it's not mountain bike
- [23:42]
Kim
yet, but in Switzerland it's probably a little more mountain biking than. Than here in New Jersey or anywhere yeah, not.
- [23:50]
Martina Hingis
Not the flat one, especially where I live. It's. It's only down or uphill, so. Yeah, but now with the E bikes, it works too. So you can do everything.
- [24:01]
Kim
Does she do any horseback riding already or.
- [24:04]
Martina Hingis
Yes, yes, of course.
- [24:05]
Kim
Since.
- [24:06]
Martina Hingis
In a way, since she was born in my belly. She had to be part of that. No, I mean, as soon as she could sit on the horse, I put her up in front of me and. No, she. We go like once a week, sometimes twice with my horse and. Yeah. Find a pony that we can take out and ride it. And. Yeah. After three years, finally, it's like trolling canter. And it's great fitness for me, you know, like, I have to run along next to her.
- [24:33]
Kim
Yeah, for sure. I remember a few years ago, Blair, I was in Belgium, and I get a message from Martina. Like, I forget even around it was like 20, 13, 12, 13, 14 maybe. I'm like. And my aunt used to have a sports store, and her name is. She was my dad's sister, Clyster's. And it said Clyster Sports. So I get a message from Martina, like, hey, is this your sports store? And I'm like, wait, are you in, like, my town? Like, close to. It was like, five minutes from my home. She's like, yeah, I'm over here buying a horse. And so we're coming. You were coming to check out a horse and. Very random, because I live in a very small, very cute area, but we are very known for horse breeding and horse osteopaths, chiropractors and things like that. So, yeah, it was a very, you know, a nice surprise to get a message on a random day from Martina that she was in my heck of the woods.
- [25:28]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. No, they had this world champion there, I believe. Yeah. Jos Lansing. Right. And he had this beautiful white horse and Kumano. And it was just a dream, I think I did some writing in that area, like, competitively, and I was like, okay, you know, you weren't far, far away, like, close by Antwerp. Right. And I was like, okay, I might try Kim, you know, and. Yeah, probably. I don't even know. I don't remember what I was buying in that sports store. But I. I tried. I think you were in the store.
- [26:00]
Kim
I think you drove by the sign and you didn't go in the store. But it was. Yeah, I know you were there for horses and. And it was just random, but it just shows your love for, you know, the, The. The sport. And nice to see that your daughter's
- [26:14]
Martina Hingis
doing that nice that we can connect. Like, there's always somewhere, right.
- [26:18]
Kim
Somebody and in any part of the world.
- [26:20]
Martina Hingis
Right. If you have the phone number, we can connect. Yeah.
- [26:25]
Kim
Well, Martina. Yeah. I feel like we can talk about so many things that have nothing to do with tennis as well. But we did want to talk to you about, you know, a big part of our season that's coming up is the Sunshine Double and Indian Wells Miami, and just kind of wanted to pick your brain, because I've always been fascinated with your brain because of how you play as a tennis player. How you. Yeah. How you approach, you know, even when we get to play the Legends doubles together, like, just how you approach the matches and, you know, when I get to play from the baseline and just see you do your thing at the net and really take over a point is always been very inspiring. And still to this day, like, when I get to play with you at Wimbledon, like, I feel very honored to be able to be on your side. And so to. Well, I just.
- [27:17]
Martina Hingis
That's why I was saying we should have played a few more together. I'm sure we would have been good.
- [27:22]
Kim
I think Wimbledon got some complaints from some other players that we were. We may have been too strong together, but, yeah, she ended up playing with Kara Black in 2025 and winning the title. So I texted her. I was like, listen, it's clear who is the weakest link. And, no, that's not right.
- [27:43]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, you held your own. Otherwise we wouldn't have won the other three before. So. No. But I love about you also, like, the competitive spirit. I think you can tell sometimes, like, the real difference when it's the momentum and you just click on and, you know, so that was really cool. I mean. Yeah, your power, that was also something that I. I had some, but I used it more from the power players. Like, I couldn't generate it on my own. And, like, you were forehand cross court sometimes. Like, when you guys played with Sonia, I was like, hey, you gotta slow down. Come on. I can't. I can't do anything about that. I can't help you.
- [28:24]
Kim
Well, that's a. That's an interesting kind of thing that you mentioned there, because one of the things that I had written down and that Blair and I talked about was, you know, how. How do you. Like, when you look at the game now, like, how do you feel like somebody with your type of tennis, right, who was so, so smart on the court, you know, feel like, you know, was almost two, three steps ahead of. Of. Of their opponents? Like, how would you approach playing players today? Like a Sabalenka Rybakina? Like, how. Like, what kind of mindset would you go into when you would play a player like that? I think, you know, in our time, we had, you know, Venus and Serena, Lindsay Davenport. So just. I'm just curious about, like, how that approach was for you.
- [29:08]
Martina Hingis
Well, exactly. I mean, this. When people ask me about the power and the difference today, I say, hey, we've had all these players you just mentioned, the Williams sisters, the Davenport, the Sellers, the Capriati, the. You know, so it was already like the power game on at that time. What change, I think, is the. The material, the strings, on the other hand, they make the court slower and the ball slower, but the power was already there and the athleticism between us. And also you, when you came, I mean, you were very athletic. I mean, come on, you made the splits on the court and you like running from corner to corner. So it was already out there. I think it's just now there's more players who can kind of be like, in danger to put you into dangers where maybe back then it was like the top 10 was a difference than the top 20 to 30 players. And on the other hand, it was the rest. But, yeah, and now I think anyone on a given day can kind of bite you, come and beat you in the first, second round. Yeah, I think. I wish I had a chance. You know, honestly, if I would want to play as a Balenca, I would try to get into her head. I think that's my thing.
- [30:31]
Blair
Wait, wait, Martina, how would you have done that?
- [30:35]
Martina Hingis
I don't know, really, to, like, get as many balls back as possible. We've seen that in the past, like on. Jabor was able to do that in Wimbledon, right. And some other players who were able to turn around matches. Mokova at the French Open in the. In the semifinals. So I think you shouldn't give up until the last point is played, definitely against a player like that and, you know, try to take that momentum and really, like, every ball, I mean, that was the same kind of thing when I had to play Venus or Serena. Every ball on the other side was a good ball, no matter how you played it, like with a slice or a spin or fast and slow ball using the angles and all of that. So just try to make her really, like, give her a different ball every single shot and try to make. I mean, of course her surf is big, her bombs of the returns, but anything to just try to make her move and let her See a different ball every time.
- [31:37]
Kim
And that's the thing. Like, seeing a different ball every time, like, that's so much easier said than done because there's not many players who could do that, especially, I feel like, right now. But you were, you know, definitely, I think, one of the. The front runners, or it stood out that that was a type of 10 type of tennis that could. Could make them mentally break down. Right. Like, that's how you can. It's retrieving a lot of balls, but then at the same time doing something with it that is so unexpected. And, you know, you. You could do that. You could hit the slides, you could hit the. Change the patterns when you don't expect it and kind of throw them off their rhythm a little bit. And that was so fun. I mean. Yeah. For years I remember, you know, being younger and. And just, you know, seeing.
- [32:19]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, thank you.
- [32:20]
Kim
Yeah, it was, you know, it's true. Like, it's. It's, you know, you. You inspired a lot of people to play like that. Like, I think in our generation, when we were younger, we. We were taught to. To construct the points really well. Right. Make the right decisions, play. Use the angles of the court. And then. And then, yeah, over time, like, the power game kind of took over and. But I still, you know, still at times miss, you know, seeing that type of tennis like you, Justine Hennon, like Ash, Barty Angeber, you know, Moresmo. And like, it was. Yeah, it was so fun to see those contrasts. So. Yeah. Interesting.
- [32:56]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, but even you had defense, you know, like, something like you. You don't become a number one without knowing, like, how to defend yourself. So you had the power.
- [33:06]
Kim
Yeah.
- [33:06]
Martina Hingis
Ball. But I think in the beginning stages, everybody, like, teaches you, okay, you have to hit the ball fast and. And into the corners. But on the other hand, yeah, you have to learn how to defend yourself. And I think that's a little bit missing in today's game that, you know, they have a plan A, but no B or C. So when the plan A doesn't work out, they don't have something to back up.
- [33:29]
Kim
So the unforced error starts to build up.
- [33:32]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, exactly. So something like that, you know, playing maybe Rybakina or Sabalenka, it's already more difficult with a player like. Yes. I mean, if she's on, then just to break her rhythm, it's definitely more difficult. But I think from there, there is. Most of the players, they have somewhere a weaker spot, like we all did. But at the end of the day, you have to try to get into their head and like make them
- [34:03]
Kim
make
- [34:04]
Martina Hingis
those errors, make those extra balls and to make it work and try to implement your game into their. On to the other side. Yes, but like I said, yeah, it's definitely difficult if someone is hitting like. Yeah, like Zabalenka or Anisimova, those flat straight back ends down the line, cross court and 140km an hour that you try to redirect. But like I said, with today's material, I think with the serve and return, if you choose the right things and try to analyze where they're better serve and returns and how to play that, um, yeah, there is a hope for little players and smart players. I think it's more of the coaches, they don't teach that and I think that's the biggest mistake. And in general in tennis that they don't teach you or like they don't take extra time like my mom did or maybe with your coaches that you have to play our court game already with my daughter, I'm trying to, you know, she knows how to volley. She knows how to have a good overhead, like off the ground, from the ground, like top spin volleys. If she puts it in, that's another story. Don't. I mean, you know, they'll fall in
- [35:24]
Kim
one day
- [35:27]
Martina Hingis
knowing like to play all court game. I think, you know, like hitting a couple ground strokes, making a step forward, hitting a top spin volley, hitting an overhead off the ground coming in. I think this is like everything that it takes time and it's not very efficient at times because they're hitting it all over the place. But eventually they at least know and they learn how to play those balls.
- [35:51]
Kim
And especially for kids, I feel like it's, you know, they have to be able to stay focused to do it long enough. Right. Because there's a lot of failure in the beginning. But yeah, I think we were all brought up in a system where, you know, the overall becoming an overall tennis player. Right. Was very important for, you know, my coaches growing up and, and with your mom as well. So it was always, yeah, a lot of fun to see.
- [36:19]
Martina Hingis
I think it was definitely like my mom always had this vision that you were able to react to every ball, like if you could be able to play every ball. But also like, for example, with me, I mean I used to prefer hitting overheads because I was a smaller player and I had a pretty decent overhead.
- [36:39]
Kim
Instead of the drive volley or what.
- [36:41]
Martina Hingis
Yes, exactly. Instead of the drive volley where Belinda benches, you know, she had this year kind of same education or similar or even more like the knowledge that my mom had over the years where she learned she used to prefer the drive volley, you know, the top spin where because she was a 10cm taller and had more power behind it. So yeah, I mean every player chooses at the end of the day what they prefer, what shot they think they have a better percentage to make a point or a good preparation. Yeah.
- [37:17]
Blair
One thing, Martina, that Kim and I had talked about is your anticipation. So in addition to all these other tools, you seem to almost sense what was happening next. And I'm wondering, is that something that you can learn or do you think that you were born with that?
- [37:31]
Martina Hingis
Well, I like to say that in a way I was born with it to be smart on the court and like seeing it faster. But on the other hand, I play so many matches and points when I was a kid and played with older girls or even amateurs that I always had. My mom always prepared me for the match and I had a strategy and a plan. And I think when you learn that as a kid, you know, to see where the ball is coming, where the other opponent, when it's slower, where they're standing, what the basics are, it's much easier later to know what to do in the full court. So we played a lot of matches on the half court size, so you should not, I mean, make mistakes. That was like a no go. If you get to the ball, you don't miss a ball because once you get there, there is no reason to miss it. And I think today like many play a lot of like private lessons and, and you have a full court, then you don't get that chance to, to put everything back all the time. And I think this is like something that teaches you to not panic when the ball comes back, like over to 20, 30 to 50 times. Where you see sometimes in men's game that the rallies get really long and mentally that you're prepared, okay, the ball keeps coming back and you have to hit an extra ball to win the point.
- [38:58]
Kim
I want to talk to you for two days. My brain, I have so many questions going through my head.
- [39:05]
Martina Hingis
My point, I kind of did an answer to that question. So if you learn how to win a point on a half court size, so you play a full court size, so there is much more space. So you have to be smart about like hitting a shorter ball, like kind of drop shot low right.
- [39:22]
Kim
You have to play with what you. With the size that you have.
- [39:25]
Martina Hingis
Exactly.
- [39:26]
Kim
Did you play a lot of two against ones when you Were playing on the full court. Did you do a lot also?
- [39:32]
Martina Hingis
Yes, a lot. Two on one. So when I played some girls who are four or five years older, actually they had to play my half size and I had the singles court and they had half court with the double scored.
- [39:44]
Kim
And dictate.
- [39:45]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, yeah. I had to kind of not and dictate and make the point where later it changed where I had to play full court, like half a chord and they had full court and things like that, that you learn where to position yourself on the court. And I think that's really important.
- [40:02]
Kim
And was this your mom who came up with these exercises or was she. Who did she listen or follow? Like, how was she inspired by knowing what to do? Because I feel like that was a very similar kind of. Those are similar patterns that I learned growing up is, you know, we would put like a long strip and this was the court, three quarters of the court that I was able to use to try and win a tie break or, you know. Yeah, things like that.
- [40:28]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. I think that's why we are really strong with tiebreakers, because we play so many and it's not like us. Yeah, it's like, oh my God, we're not scared to play a tiebreaker because every point counts.
- [40:39]
Kim
It's like time to step up.
- [40:41]
Martina Hingis
Exactly. I think it was mainly because we were also like 40 kids on five tennis courts. So you have to make up some of the exercises because there is no space. I mean, 40, you don't have what normally five courts, 10 people? No, you had 40 people on five courts. So you have to really be smart about, like how to use the space or like three on two or three against three and all these different kind of things. And we end up playing lots of doubles as well. And yeah, all these different things.
- [41:18]
Kim
You're saying that it's really not that important for kids to just do one on one tennis sessions. That's all the questions I got from the parents, like in the academy was like, they need private lessons every day. I'm like, no. Like, I had maybe two private lessons and then everything else was in a group. And like you said, like, you would play against guys that were better than you. But I was playing girls that I was supposed to beat. And it's that mental side. But now I feel like a lot of girls, they get so protected from losing to a worse player in practice and not wanting to practice with, you know, player that they're supposed to beat or be better than. And with us, it was just we had to Figure it out, right? Like, whoever we played, like, if we played guys that had a good serve, we had to figure it out. And there was no, no adjustments, which I think is what made us tough.
- [42:04]
Martina Hingis
No, I mean, you have to welcome the challenge. And you. We were always challenged every day. You know, you go on court and I had a friend who was five years older than me, and I really wanted to always play with her against the, the boys or the other girls who were older. And if I had kind of made mistakes, she. I would never be allowed to play with her. She would just like, send me to. Okay, little one, go to the next court.
- [42:30]
Kim
You know, consequences if you made mistakes, like, if you were drilling to not like, was there like push ups or what, what, like, what did you have to do?
- [42:38]
Martina Hingis
Like, no, I would not be able to play on that court anymore, but I wanted to, and that was my kind of pride. And, you know, like chord five was the worst chord, the beginners or the youngest ones. And you wanted to work yourself up to the second or first court. And yeah, that was the only opportunity when somebody was missing. So I kind of, I was always there. My mom, she was teaching like the third group and then to be able to play with the first group, kids who were, like I said, older, that was a privilege. And I was like, really happy and lucky to be able to be part of that, you know. So, no, no, I think we were just kind of educating ourselves, you know, like it was normal. We had our pride and image and we wanted to be just good and play well and not like this protection like you said earlier. I think it's just like avoiding the big stadiums. At the end of the day, it's harming the kids, in my opinion, that it's preparing you already on little stage where nobody's watching yet. Instead of playing like 5,000, 10,000 at the end the US Open, there's 20,000 people watching you. And if you already break down on a small court like this with no pressure, literally, how do you want to become a U.S. open champion?
- [44:02]
Blair
You know, Martina, you. You have seemingly had such a great relationship with your mom. We've certainly seen many parent child coaches, though, over the years that, that have been tough because it's tough to be a coach and a parent. So what worked well for you and your mom?
- [44:18]
Martina Hingis
I think, I mean, like I said, this was like being disciplined. That was definitely something. Like, she really was very kind of tough on and the right technique. She was really about like precision and playing well and playing smart. And if I I mean, I had matches where I kind of one in three sets, didn't play my greatest, and I end up winning. And she's like, well, let's go hit some balls, because you didn't do this and this and this. And on the other hand, you know, I could have lost one and one and played my best tennis, and I just was physically not up to date with the bigger players. And she said, hey, you did everything you could and you played the best. That in this given moment, you're. You're learning when you're physically stronger and when you will get your chance when you're older. So she was very fair, I have to say.
- [45:19]
Kim
She.
- [45:19]
Martina Hingis
And we trained together, and we did most of the things together on and off the court, so I could never complain. Hey, you know, like, maybe some of the girls sometimes feel like, okay, you know, I'm working my.
- [45:34]
Kim
You can say it.
- [45:34]
Martina Hingis
It's okay here. And you're just kind of dictating what I'm supposed to do. Run this, do that, you know, like. But she was always there. And on the other hand, I also felt very protected by her.
- [45:49]
Kim
The amount of times that I've been able to just kind of interact with her. I love the part that she's so straightforward. Like, it's, It's. She makes it simple. Like when, When. When it's. Whether it's about a tennis match or, you know, whatever we're playing, like, even or in practice, like, when she's there, it's just like, there's no B.S. like, she just says it and it's like, all right, we'll do that. Like, yeah, understood, right? Like, it's. It's such a straightforward way of communicating. And I told Blair yesterday, I said, that was a really funny moment. And I think it was in 2024, after, I think we maybe just won our semi finals or something. And. And we were waiting at Transportation and there was a double rainbow. Do you remember that moment that we were outside and we were taking pictures and we were, like, looking at the double rainbow, and it was such a pretty kind of view over the, like, the Wimbledon courts and your mom. And, you know, I couldn't understand it at the time, what she was saying, but it sounded like, let's go. Like, stop this crap. And I was like, what did she just say to you? And she's like. She's like, martina, have you never seen a fucking rainbow before? Get in the car. So I was like, that's Melanie, you know, like, she's just so, like, it's a rainbow. Let's go. Like, we gotta go home. I've been at these courts all day. I need to get to the, to the house.
- [47:05]
Martina Hingis
Exactly. No, that's, that's true. It's about routine, right? It's like you get your. Yeah. Get, get to bed on time and yeah. If there was something we never had issues about tennis, if it was something that was like sleeping times or phone times or anything else, we never had had disagreements about the professionalism. Yeah. On the court, your little one grew three inches overnight. Adorable. Also expensive. Sell their pint sized pieces on Depop and list them in minutes with no selling fees because somewhere a dad refuses to pay full price for the clothes his kids will outgrow tomorrow. And he's ready to buy your son's entire wardrobe right now. Consider your future growth. Bird budget secured. Start selling on Depop where taste recognizes taste. Payment processing fees and boosting fees still apply. See website for details.
- [48:04]
Blair
Martina, the piece that you said about feeling protected I think is so important given that you won your five single slams before you turned 19. You were growing up in front of the world on these massive stages. I can't imagine it having having my life written about in those formative years. How, how tough was that for you? Do you, do you look back fondly on those years? Was it difficult?
- [48:32]
Martina Hingis
No. I mean, I think it was the best time that I had actually. Especially when you are young and you have nothing to lose. I didn't feel the pressure at that time because every time I stepped on court I felt like, hey, if I don't win Today, I have 10 years to go. Which it wasn't like that anymore. But at that time, this definitely what I felt like as a 14, 15 year old going on tour and, and playing those tournaments, playing those matches against mostly, you know, the top 10 players who were older than me. And I really felt like I have nothing to lose later. Maybe at 16 and you know, in 97, 98, then I had felt a little bit more. I have to prove myself. I have to back up those tournaments that I've won. You have to defend those titles and everybody's expecting you to win week after week after week. And every time you lose as a number one, it's like a loss. But before that there was no, no fear. And I love traveling, I love playing. I enjoyed much more playing those tournaments and having, being at home and practicing. To be honest, you know, that was the tougher part. But that was also part of my mom's vision that she always wanted the practice to be kind of tougher than what do you expect on the core later on? Was it with you as well? Like, when you trained, was the. The practice harder?
- [49:58]
Kim
Yeah, I couldn't wait to go to tournaments. Like, I was so hungry to, like, compete. Like, yeah, I enjoyed practicing, but not too. Not too long of moments, you know, like, if I was home for two, three weeks, like, I was like, all right, I need to play my matches, and I want to, you know, see if it's. If it's working out on the match court, what we're working on. But it's true what you say. It's like, I. You know, when you're so young and you were a few years younger than I was when I came on tour, but people ask me now, like, don't you feel like you missed out on your childhood and, like, like, you. You wanted to just be a normal teenager? I'm like, no. Like, I feel so privileged, right, that. That I've been able to do what I've wanted to do. And I wanted to play tennis and I wanted to travel the world. And so, yeah, I think it's maybe just to the outside world, it at times looks like it's, you know, it is demanding and it is intense, but it's also what, you know, we love to do and what we dreamed of doing. And so it's. It's. It's fun. I don't know, at this, you know, at this time now with social media and with all that stuff, if that would have changed maybe our mindset a little bit. I don't know. I think we've all had, you know, pretty good people around us who will protect you from even that kind of, you know, those kind of things. So, yeah, it's. I definitely didn't feel like I missed out on childhood things or, you know, I still had time to go if I wanted to go to a party, did that if I felt like it, or had a boyfriend or whatever like, that was. It's not like you're in this complete bubble.
- [51:27]
Blair
So did your mom have any issues with that? Martina, if you had. So. So say you wanted to go out, or you, you know, the boys or whatever. Did she stay. Stay away from that, or did she have input on that as well?
- [51:40]
Martina Hingis
If I was back on time, yeah, that was. Well, we mostly had connecting rooms, so it was hard to kind of sneak in, Sneak out. But no, I mean, yes, of course. Yeah, we had our issues. But on the other hand, I wasn't be. Later looking back at it. I Wasn't able to bring those results if I came back at 3am in the morning, so that it's impossible. So. And then the only times if I was saying, okay, if I finish the tournament or like semifinals or finals or. And I'm winning and she's like, ah, now you can go out. I'm like, yeah, but there's nobody there.
- [52:26]
Kim
Yeah, they've all gone home.
- [52:29]
Martina Hingis
Thank you very much.
- [52:31]
Blair
Yeah, Sunday night love is dead.
- [52:34]
Kim
So she was trying to find the balance too, right?
- [52:38]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. I think as a mom, she wished I could do that and be helpful. But on the other hand, yeah, there is nothing going on at those times. And then you. You pack up, you travel. But we had our dinners, we kind of, you know, had a cheer, had a toast. But yeah, I mean, later on, I think I made up for those parties at some point when I.
- [53:00]
Kim
We all have. We all have.
- [53:03]
Martina Hingis
So, like you said, I think it's the way you look at things. And again, like, I feel I was really privileged having my family with me and travel and have my team, that I didn't miss being home. And sometimes I did go out and had my free time and what I kind of missed was more like the horses. You know, I had my horse at home and, and going there, but even that, I was actually like horse riding in Sydney or in Perth or Melbourne, I went out and in Californ, every time I went to a place, my first thing was, back in the day was the Yellow Pages. I. I looked for stables. So it's funny.
- [53:47]
Kim
All right, let's talk Indian Wells for a second because that's, you know, where they're playing the, the qualifications this week, what you've had, you know, great successes there. Like, what stood out for you when you went to Indian Wells? Like, you know, I know I. Back in the day, I don't know how it is exactly now if it's still a lot slower than Miami was. But did you enjoy playing there? Did you like the environment? Did you like the tournament? You won twice. How. Yeah, how did you take on that approach?
- [54:18]
Martina Hingis
I really liked playing both of these tournaments, like Indian Wells in Miami. It was like this, really, coming from Australia actually now, like being in Switzerland for so long, like now the seven, eight years, I never realized that we travel behind the sun all the time. 10 out of the 10 miles of the year. Yeah, that was the opposite. It's like seven months stuck in the cold, you know.
- [54:42]
Kim
So we definitely don't have the tennis tan lines anymore now.
- [54:48]
Martina Hingis
No. So I was like, wow, this I never realized that we actually are kind of lucky to be in the sun all the time and travel to beautiful places, you know, Palm Springs, the palm trees. We always went to this palm canyon that I, you know, like up hiking on a day off and when we prepared and the drive from LA to Palm Springs or like, yeah, Indian Wales was always kind of cool to see the different places and environments and, you know, being in the desert, coming from the, you know, green scenery in Switzerland and. And the mountains and then you end up in the desert where they're able to, you know, put these beautiful chords and especially now, I mean, I even remember the old stadium, which was kind of nice and cozy at the Hyatt, which I loved. Oh, yeah, you have this.
- [55:41]
Kim
You know, I've only practiced there. I never. Yeah, never played there.
- [55:46]
Martina Hingis
So now what they were able to put there and build those new chords and, you know, the infrastructure is amazing. So I'm kind of jealous now. Like, I play doubles there still now, but it's really beautiful.
- [56:01]
Kim
And when was the. When was the last time you were there?
- [56:04]
Martina Hingis
I believe. Yeah, 2017. 17 was still. It was already the way. But at first it was just like some palm trees, the courts, and now everything is much more built around it.
- [56:18]
Kim
So do you have a favorite moment or a favorite match that stands out to you from any of your. Your wins there or.
- [56:26]
Martina Hingis
I. Yeah, the wins, are they all a blur? Honestly, if you ask me, I don't even know like, who I beat in the final. So I. I think one year I might have beaten Lindsey Davenport, but it's more the losses that stand down, which is horrible. You know, the ones that I was supposed to win and I did it. I don. Know how it's for you that. That if you win and you're there, it's kind of normal because it's like you're all always in this kind of go mode. And especially in 97, my first time that I won there, I. I mean, I had this winning streak, so everything was supposed to be that way. But the ones that I lost, it was stand out almost more because I was up, you know, set in 4:1 and end up losing or, you know, so that was more devastating.
- [57:22]
Kim
You know, I'm like, I'm like happy to hear it almost, because when I talk to like Andy or I hear like Andy and Andre Agassi, like, talk about tennis, they remember like points of like the semi final, third set, four three. I'm like, wait, what? How is this possible that they know this, like, you know, literally in like a normal conversation, sitting around. And so I'm kind of happy to hear that there. Didn't you know that maybe it's more like of a female thing that we don't remember each point or each match as much.
- [57:51]
Blair
Do you guys remember your record against each other?
- [57:54]
Martina Hingis
Well, now Kim is winning. It was the early stages that I was able to beat her when she came on tour, but later he kind of, kind of swapped.
- [58:05]
Blair
Kim has the five, four head to head. But I think, Martina, did you get her in the Dallas exhibition? Did we even up the, Even up the head?
- [58:12]
Kim
She did.
- [58:15]
Martina Hingis
Huge win. Yeah. You were like, match point down and was able to turn it around. What?
- [58:21]
Kim
I mean, I got like, nervous again. I was like, wait, what is happening to my body? Like, this is an exhibition. Why am I feeling nervous? But it's fun. It's, like, nice. I think when you're on tour, you don't realize, like, how many fun opportunity opportunities there are after, you know, being a professional player that are still, you know, a part of the tennis world, whether it's playing legends at Wimbledon or doing a, an event at. In Dallas. Like, it's. There's so many fun things that we can still be a part of. And, you know, I don't know if you're going to.
- [58:51]
Martina Hingis
Well, yeah, you got me in Dallas and you got me. I got you in that and you got me in Luxembourg. So it's. Again, it would be six, five.
- [58:58]
Kim
Yes. Yeah, true.
- [59:00]
Blair
Martina. Before we move on from talking about Indian Wells, we did want to mention the defending champ, Mira Andreeva, because I know that, that she, that she called you. I, I'm sure one of many players who, who was saying, please, please coach me. But I'm, I'm curious, have you had a long line do. Are people calling you regularly? Have you considered maybe at some point coaching on tour?
- [59:23]
Martina Hingis
Not recently. I mean, that was, yeah, before she teamed up with Conchita. But I think people more or less know that it's impossible right now with Leah. I mean, like I said, you're right. She just turned seven last year and she's going to school. And yeah, for me, it's impossible to travel 15, 20 weeks a year. So the only thing that would kind of work out if they would come here to like to visit me in Switzerland a day here or two. But yeah, I think somebody that really needs more being as a consultant, but like to travel year round or even half of it, it's impossible. So. Yeah. Did you ever consider coaching, like, I mean, next to like, you had Meritants, right before.
- [60:18]
Kim
Yeah, because she trained in my academy that I had in Belgium. So it's easier in kind of an environment like that where, you know, she had her coach and. But if I, you know, I would hit with her sometimes and just be on court and be available to just talk, like. Like a mentor, basically. But I've had a few players. I also, you know, the consideration of traveling 20, 25 weeks a year is just. It's impossible. And I also think we've done it for so long, and to go through it again and now that you have a family just makes it. Yeah, just the priorities shift a little bit. But I do love talking tennis, and I'm sure maybe after players hear us talk about tennis, you might get a few more calls and want people to come to Switzerland, because I just. Just. Yeah, I always, always admired your. Your tennis brain. I mean, I think you're, you know, we have to kind of round it up, right? It's. You're supposed to be on court for a lesson soon.
- [61:11]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, well, I kind of. I think they shifted it, like, from 5:30 to 6. So I should be good. No, but we could talk forever.
- [61:23]
Kim
Like, I know there's so many things
- [61:25]
Martina Hingis
I want to know, like, how much did you implement your, like, from your father, like, soccer training into your, like, game? And also, like, I think that we kind of grew up in a healthy environment with our kind of athletic parents that, you know, they always supported us, like, to do other things, and. And I think that's the key to success at the end of the day, to. Yeah. I mean, you would never be able to put me in a gym, like, 24, seven, you know, like, neck. Just to play tennis and not be outside and enjoy yourself. I mean, if you give me a ball, it doesn't matter what it is. Like basketball. I mean, now if you're, you know, basically. Yeah. But everything we did, it was, like, with a passion. And I think everything you do today, like, as long as it has a ball in the racket or ball involved, I mean, I'm willing to run, but if I have to do, like, 10 sprints in a row, you kill my mind, you know?
- [62:25]
Kim
I know. Yeah, same. Like, long distances is obviously not with my Achilles. I, you know, I'm dying to do. If I could jog, that would sound like a lot of fun. But growing up, it was, you know, soccer with my cousins. Like, that's what we did. And we played games. Like, we played, you know, matches. And it was just for fun. Like, in my Parents, my. My grandparents backyard. I also feel like in the federation growing up, we did a lot of other sports. We would do hockey, we would do soccer, we would go mountain biking, we would play squash, we would like we did so many other things for fitness. Like that was our endurance training or just to keep the mind off to do something different, which is something that throughout my career I always wanted to have that variety. And we found a lot of other things to do all around the world. Whether it was. Whether it was going rowing, I had to do an endurance training. We would try to find a place to go rowing and not just on a row or in the gym, like literally on the water and just to cool.
- [63:25]
Martina Hingis
That's the first time I hear that.
- [63:26]
Kim
Yeah. Just to change things up a little bit. Right. Like you just. It's because otherwise it can become so one sided. Like it's always the same thing. And I definitely needed like a lot of that, like a lot of variety. And I loved all sports. Obviously soccer with my dad was I feel like kind of my first passion that I saw him as in, as a coach, as a soccer player, as a coach. So. And then my mom is a gymnast. So like that's kind of how. How I was brought up and, and just a large interest for all kinds of sports and. And to, to see it and to learn it and absorb it I think just helped me also on court to be, you know, have better court awareness. Better awareness about my own body when I was moving and unknowingly. I think you just learn.
- [64:13]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. To be versatile and to be able to adjust to different situations. Like also like I felt like every time like skiing or horseback riding was far more dangerous than just playing some tennis, you know, because you had to always like be careful about not. Yeah. Hitting the slopes. Like it's icy, it's different surfaces, so you had to adjust and it's foggy or it rains or you know, when we ran in the mountains, it's like you have not just like a straight treadmill which just. Just keeps pushing faster and faster. You had the trees and you could step on. How do you call them?
- [64:56]
Kim
Yeah, the roots. The roots.
- [64:57]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. So. And twist your ankle and all these things and actually like one thing. Yeah. I didn't say about Indian Wells that we always brought like some inline skates to Indian Wells and like Australia. So we would just always go out from the hotel and go on the streets in Indian Wells.
- [65:17]
Kim
You with your mom?
- [65:18]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [65:19]
Kim
So fun.
- [65:20]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [65:20]
Kim
So parents are probably like, okay, you have to wear like, all the protection. Don't go out on skates. Like, you can't risk, like, getting injured. And that's, that's really nice to hear.
- [65:29]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. No, it's like in Australia especially, there were all these rivers that you could, from the hotel, like, great infrastructure. Like Perth, I believe it was the Swan River. Then you had the Melbourne, you had Yara River. So we went like half hour one way and half hour back, which was, yeah, always kind of fun part.
- [65:52]
Kim
Good for the butt.
- [65:54]
Martina Hingis
Yeah.
- [65:57]
Kim
Claire, do you have a question?
- [65:59]
Blair
Well, I just wanted to mention the fact that only six women since the beginning of the WTA rankings have been ranked number one in singles and doubles at the same time. And I am currently speaking to one third of them, to two of the six. And I just wanted to point that out because I think that that is, is such an achievement. It is so difficult to do. I don't know that we'll see that again. Do you guys think we will in, in women's tennis?
- [66:30]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. I mean, like, with Irina, she was number one in doubles before she was, was number one in singles, so she definitely had the capability of doing that. On the other hand, doing both at the same time, I think it's probably a little bit harder with, Yeah, I think occasionally to play doubles possible, like at tournaments and winning, maybe both or. But I think today they would just like, end up in the semifinals and say, hey, I have to focus on my singles, semis or finals and win the tournament. So probably not. Yeah, it would be nice to see, like, more singles playing the doubles, but probably impossible. What do you think, Kim?
- [67:15]
Kim
Well, listen, I, and we've mentioned this on the doubles court, when we were playing Legends, we were like, why do we never play together, like, on tour? Like, I feel like we, you know, a lot of times, like, we match up really well and I think that's a little bit of a. Yeah, like, I, I remember, like, thinking like that, like, we, we read, read off each other so well. But to go back to your question, Sorry, that was, I just wanted to.
- [67:40]
Blair
No, you could go.
- [67:41]
Kim
Keep going, keep going. But I, I, it was more fun. Yeah, yeah, it's, I think, I never thought about it. Like, I love playing doubles, I love playing mixed doubles. Like, it was also fun for me right out of, like, whereas the singles, it was, you know. Yeah, there's a little bit more pressure on it and you can't really laugh or talk to somebody when you're not playing well. Like, it was nice. Like, I played with Icuyama and just to Be able to have, like, the support and when things weren't going your way or if you just lost a singles match, you could still go out there and kind of, you know, end the day on a positive note if you won at least another match in doubles. So I've always loved the combination, but I did notice, you know, at a certain stage, and I think it's the same with, like, a Saba Lanka and that before they had all the roofs on center court and all those things, like, it was. There was a lot of, like, waiting around and. And where I felt like it started to take away a little bit from my chances in singles, quarterfinals, semifinals, where, you know, I could have, you know, been in the hotel room and already been finished with my. With my recovery, and I still had to play a doubles match or something. And that's when I started to kind of, over time, make the decision to, yeah, to play less doubles. But I always played doubles or added some mixed doubles just because I wanted to. I thought it was also important for my development in my singles to. To be able to, you know, feel more comfortable at the net and practice a little bit more on my serves or my, My return game and. But, yeah, it's. It's. I mean, I'm not going to say it's never going to be done. I do think, you know, there will be another player who can do it, but it's. It's. It's intense and it's. It's a lot.
- [69:22]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, no, I definitely agree because it's like, many times I think if I had maybe, you know, one or two of those Grand Slams, if I had not played the full amount of doubles, like I said, but we were so successful.
- [69:36]
Kim
So you don't want to drop it,
- [69:38]
Martina Hingis
to say, hey, you know, I'm sorry, you know, to pull out when it helped you up until a certain stage to get some more matches in, to play practice, serve and volley and play those volleys. And again, like, having the court sense and feel the ground and the ball in the beginning of the tournament, it helps you where at the end of the tournament, it just kind of stands in your way and you get physically, like I said, it's, like, intense and it's more draining. And the extra waiting time, like, if I look at. Back at the 97, you know, like my French Open finals, I was dead. You know, I'm like, sometimes, like, thinking, like, why was I, you know, just like, after, of course, I had the injury and coming back on clay, but I'm realizing I also play Friday night, like, three set or double semifinals, got to the finals and played the semifinals and played about, you know, so that kind of. You don't think about that. But looking back, it was like. Like, semifinals was like, six, four in the third. Next day, you go on court instead of having maybe a slower day, you know, you again have to go warm up for the doubles and be focused, play your match, and you're like, okay. Day by day, there was, like, no more energy left, where you don't want to tell your partner, because at that time with, like, Arancha Sanchez Vicari, I played with, and it was like, you know, you helped me up until that moment to. To have a successful tournament, I would never, you know, be disrespectful and say, hey, I'm sorry. I want to focus on myself, you know, so you could not say no, you know, So I think maybe in that time, it helped me to get to the finals and have a successful singles tournament. But on the other hand, if I had played a little bit less doubles at the big events, maybe there would be a different outcome.
- [71:30]
Kim
Yeah, maybe. We'll never know.
- [71:32]
Martina Hingis
We'll never know.
- [71:34]
Kim
One more question. Martina, as a young girl, and I think I was, like, 14 when it happened. No, a little bit older. 15, 16. Your match against Steffi, when you made that underarm serve, you're, like, one of the first women to do it right. Like, now it's become, like, almost, like, part of the game a lot of times. And how do you, like, forget about, like, the moment? But what in your head, like, that's what I'm so curious about, that you had had the. The guts to. To do that at that time, I was just like, it was so amazing, like, that you. That you were able to do that. And so, yeah. What, like, in your brain, what can you just. Do you remember that moment? Do you have any. Like, this is a tactical thing or. Or, like, was it more like, f this, I'm gonna whatever, you know, throw you off? And. And.
- [72:26]
Martina Hingis
And, like, yeah, it was especially. That one was a little bit more out of. Of hopelessness, you know, but, you know, being match point down. But on the other hand, like, usually I did it maybe in the last game of the match. Sometimes I did throw that one in, and no one realized. And sometimes, like, there was even times where people pick up the ball and say, hey, you have to. So that's when you say, like, it wasn't common to do it, like, sometimes, like. But my. I'm like, Michael Chang has done it.
- [72:57]
Kim
He did it on the outside.
- [72:59]
Martina Hingis
So I was just a little bit after that. So it was out there. And as a girl growing up, I did that sometimes like in our, you know, like national tournaments or the league matches on the match point, but. And then the people pick up the ball. It's like, what are you doing? You like serve normal.
- [73:17]
Kim
That was a serve. Like my point. But see, for me it was even if we would practice, like we would sometimes practice it on the practice courts and it's hard to hit. Like I don't have the touch. Like I didn't have the touch like you. You did. And, and even if I would try to like hit the, you know, the underarm serve, like I would miss it a lot. So I would, you know, to, to say like, this is what I'm falling back on if I feel like my opponent is maybe returning too, too good or I'm really just not feeling my second serve at all was also not.
- [73:47]
Martina Hingis
Yeah, but you had a good serve, so you didn't have to kind of, kind of sneak through with it.
- [73:52]
Kim
Luckily, I just didn't feel like people make it look like it's an easy shot, but it's not an easy shot to hit.
- [73:58]
Martina Hingis
Yeah. You see where, how Nick, for example, like they practice it sometimes, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's part of their training. No, I, I never really trained that. Like sometimes like, because I, I was hitting quite a few drop shots maybe in my matches. So a little bit I had that forehand slice in there. But yeah, I, Yeah, probably today I would use it even more than back in the day.
- [74:26]
Kim
Sure. Right. Talk about breaking somebody mentally. There you go. Like that. Be part of that tactic. It's been really nice to see you.
- [74:36]
Martina Hingis
It was really fun to see you now and talk to you and like. Yeah, when we even played like the, the legends like you were running, I was running all over the place. We kind of were on the court, but that was. Sometimes I felt like we connected and click, you know, it's like a brain of a, you know, like the true champion that you don't need words sometimes you just know what to do. And that was really cool playing with you. Thanks.
- [75:04]
Kim
A lot of times we were talking about like non tennis related things, right? We're just like catching up on life and kids and all that stuff. So. Yeah. Nice that we got to do that here again today. So really good to see you. Enjoy Athens. Thank you. Jealous of the gray skies, but anyway, have the best time. Enjoy.
- [75:24]
Martina Hingis
Thank you. Take care, guys.
- [75:26]
Kim
Bye, Martina. Thank you. Bye.
- [75:29]
Blair
What an incredible conversation to start our day. Kim. So much fun talking to Martina. Cannot wait to do it again. But for now that will do it for us. Make sure to follow us on all of our socials, oveallpodcast like and subscribe over on YouTube. And for Kim and our entire team behind the scenes, we will see you next Wednesday with a new episode.
- [75:51]
Kim
Thanks guys.
- [76:03]
Blair
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- [76:31]
Kim
Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body
- [76:34]
Martina Hingis
relax and let go of whatever you're carrying.
- [76:37]
Blair
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- [76:45]
Kim
Oh my gosh.
- [76:46]
Martina Hingis
They're so fast.
- [76:46]
Blair
And breathe. Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order.
- [76:53]
Kim
Oh, sorry. Namaste.
- [76:55]
Blair
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- [76:59]
Martina Hingis
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