← She's So Lucky
She's So Lucky
Becoming the CEO of Your Life & How Pop Culture Influences Your Creativity with Michele Y. Smith
00:58:25
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- [00:01]
A
The following podcast is a dear media production. So before we get into today's episode, I have some pretty exciting news. Balance Black Girl is actually nominated for a 2025 NAACP Image Award under the best Podcast for Lifestyle and self help category. Now, this is an incredible, incredible honor and I would appreciate your vot. We are with some amazing shows in the category that I'm honored to be nominated beside, and I would just really love to see you all turn up and turn out to support Balance Black Girl. So we will leave a link in the show notes or you can go to the NAACP Image Awards website and you can cast your vote there. Again, I would really appreciate your vote for Balance Black Girl under the best lifestyle and self help podcast category. Thank you so much for your support.
- [01:01]
B
One of the things that I love doing is getting into the minds of successful women, whether that is women, CEOs, business leaders, entrepreneurs, women who are at the top of their game and in their craft. And in today's episode, I'm really excited to do just that. So I'm sitting down with Michelle Smith, who is the CEO of the Museum of Pop Culture, also known as the Mopop, which is actually located in my hometown of Seattle, Washington. And I grew up going to this museum, and it has a really big place in my heart. And Michelle and I talk about so many incredible concepts that you need to hear, particularly if you are in your successful era. Michelle really gives us a masterclass on what it looks like to be an empathetic leader. We talk about the importance of wellness, of wellness in the workplace, how pop culture impacts the ways that we connect with one another. You know, we got to talk about Beyonce because this wouldn't be this podcast if we didn't. And we also talk a lot about the arts and investing in our local communities. So let's get into this conversation with Michelle. Michelle, welcome to the podcast. I am so excited to talk to you today.
- [02:10]
C
Thank you so much. I'm excited to be here.
- [02:12]
B
Yeah, I mean, we already kind of had like a mini. A mini podcast before we were rolling.
- [02:16]
C
We were like the pre Funk for the Real Funk.
- [02:18]
B
Exactly, exactly. But as a Seattle native, as someone who remembers when Mopop opened and who grew up going to the museum countless times, I'm really, really excited to chat with you.
- [02:28]
C
Well, thank you for allowing me to be here. I'm very, very grateful.
- [02:31]
B
Absolutely. So for people who may not be familiar, when I say Mopop, that's the Museum of Pop Culture, which is based in Seattle, where I'm from, which Michelle is The CEO of.
- [02:39]
C
Thank you.
- [02:40]
B
Yes. So I would love to talk a little bit more about your career journey, getting to that point, because you're one of very few black women leading a cultural institution of that magnitude, which is incredible.
- [02:51]
C
Yes. You know, my career has been a windy road. I started out really in Philadelphia working as a contract administrator, and then kind of moved into the, you know, travel and hospitality and then went into globalization. But really, all facets of my career have been around, you know, working with the public, being a community ally, and really working with organizations to set them up for, you know, selling their product or their revenue and having a social impact. And that's what really led me to the CEO of the Museum of Pop Culture. I landed in Seattle in 2017, and as you know, I started at the Woodland Park Zoo, which is a tried and true, you know, organization there, and led that for six years through the pandemic, and then this job opened for the CEO of the Museum of Pop Culture. And being from Philadelphia, you know, born in the 70s, kind of went through the 80s and 90s, really. Pop culture is in my DNA. I play the piano, I play the Suzuki violin and sing and love arts. So I'm in my perfect job, which I love.
- [04:05]
B
I actually, in a lot of ways, feel very jealous of Gen X, because I feel like as a generation, y'all got a front row seat to just the best in pop culture as it was happening.
- [04:17]
C
Yes. I mean, you know, right in the 70s, it was coming through the 60s of the civil rights, but I was very young and learning all of that from my family, but then moved into the 80s where it was Yo, MTV raps. And that kind of got really prevalent and then moved into the 90s, where the grunge era, rock and roll, R B. So I feel like I have, you know, a multitude of, you know, lifetime of incidents to be the CEO, but also understand the culture and what that actually has been happening with the countercultural movement to be the CEO.
- [04:52]
B
For sure. For sure. And throughout your career, you know, when you were earlier in your career, did you have your sights set on being a C suite leader? Was that something that you decided to work towards as you were progressing in your career?
- [05:05]
C
I never knew that I really wanted to be a CEO, but for me, you know, I was, you know, managing and going through all of these new roles and wanted to move higher. I was like, how do I move from a supervisor to a manager to a director to a vice president, and then, you know, finally getting in the C suite? It wasn't Like, I was looking to be a CEO. It just kind of. It was me trying to get through those stages, and then it turned into, okay, I think I'm ready for the C suite now.
- [05:34]
B
Yeah, yeah. So more of like a natural progression. Yeah. What were some of the experiences that you had that you felt really prepared you to step into this CEO role?
- [05:44]
C
You know, it really starts with my mother. You know, she's not alive right now anymore, but really, she instilled a lot of the resilience in me. She instilled that always be learning and learn every position. You know, as a single mom raising two kids in Philadelphia, she really, you know, taught me to have my voice, learn everything, be two times ahead of what you should be, just because she had to in her life. And so that kind of stuck with me throughout my personal journey. She passed away several years ago, but she was always a big proponent of my career. And so her and I would talk through different situations. And I think where I got the catalyst in my career was I had the opportunity to move out to San Francisco from Philadelphia. And as you know, if you don't leave home, you might stay there. I think you and I were just talking about that. So I was a proud Philadelphia girl and was, you know, offered a role to be in San Francisco. And my mom was like, what's the worst that could happen? You know, you can always come back to Philadelphia, but get out and explore the world. And so I did, and I actually never came back to Philadelphia.
- [06:58]
B
So you were in San Francisco for how long?
- [07:01]
C
I was in San Francisco for about three years. I had the opportunity to lead sfosw, United Airlines flight attendants during a very prevalent time of 9, 11. So that was a very interesting experience for me where I learned a lot of crisis communication, planning, a lot of leadership, things that were going on at the time. You know, we didn't know what was going on at the time with the terrorist attack. And, you know, I really learned my chops of being prepared and how to deal with empathy and all those different things that I wasn't even expecting to do, but learned that through there. So I was in San Francisco for about three years.
- [07:40]
B
Yeah, that sounds like a really. Just a challenging time to be in the aviation industry.
- [07:45]
C
For sure it was because, you know, I was the manager of 200 flight attendants at the time. And, you know, there were a lot of different feelings going on. Two of those planes were sfosw. Some of those were my flight attendants that passed away. And so just being able to talk to the parents when things happen, the ground stoppage, some of the things that were just going on in the world on a global scale, you know, was very challenging, but I learned a lot from that. And it's actually stuck with me as I moved into different careers in my roles, for sure.
- [08:19]
B
I mean, it sounds like. So some of the things that we talked about when we were offline was just your approaches to leadership now and how you lead your team. And it sounds like that experience really planted a lot of the seeds for the people first leadership that you carry out.
- [08:33]
C
Yeah, I mean, I'm a people first manager. Right. But I'm very transparent, and I'm, you know, there's no gray with me. I'm really upfront. I really want people to understand what's going on. I really want to center wellness and everything that we do. You know, coming through the pandemic, I think that gave me a huge roadmap to be a CEO, especially being the CFO of, you know, very, very popular zoo. 125 years in the making. But dealing with animals, so a lot of people don't understand is like, besides dealing with the employees, we had animals in our care. And so for me, there was a lot going on than just working with the employees, but also making sure that we kept these exotic animals that we had over 100 in our care at the same time. During a pandemic in Seattle, it sounds.
- [09:23]
B
Like a giant Rubik's Cube to solve, like a giant puzzle with so many pieces.
- [09:27]
C
Giant puzzle. You know, part of my role as the CFO was not just the numbers. It was the community experiences of our concerts in the summertime. It was a lot of our events. It was our food and beverage. And so, you know, the zoo in itself is a zoo, but there's so many different other enterprises within the organization that you had to deal with. And so dealing with that from the lens of an organization being closed, dealing with employees, restarting it, reopening it in several different ways in the middle of construction and different things. It really gave me really kind of that check mark of, okay, you have done all those things and you are ready to take over a new organization with a new vision and help them, you know, reset, restart, and move forward. So that's what's got me to the CEO of the Museum of Pop Culture.
- [10:23]
B
Yeah.
- [10:30]
A
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- [14:11]
B
Almost like CEO boot camp.
- [14:14]
C
It was, well, I think it was a boot camp for everyone. But for me, I look at it as my blueprint and roadmap to really moving quickly, making quick decisions, you know, really targeting how people are feeling, empathy, belonging. You know, most employees coming out of the pandemic were burnout. And I've talked to a lot of HR professionals that had done a lot of HR studies to see even in my own self, like, how do I get through this myself? Because I was burned out. I actually had 30 days in between roles and I had all this, you know, fun stuff. Planned to go to Paris. You know, they were like, take 30 days off before you start your new role as a CEO. And I didn't. I drove home from work and I was like, I'm feeling kind of funny. And it took a COVID test and it was like, no COVID test. I mean, no, you know, I wasn't positive. But the next day I woke up and for the next 30 days, I was sick. And I mean, the doctors didn't know what it was. I was, you know, throwing up. I just had all these weird things going on with my body. And when I found out it. It was stress, it was burnout. It was my body finally relaxing and saying, okay, you don't have to think about work for 30 days. And it was just like, who? And I didn't know how tense I was till I got to that point. And for me, I was like, I can't go into this new role without being healthy. And how am I going to do things differently as I step into this new role as a CEO? You know, that's stressful in itself. But my learnings that I took from that 30 days off really kind of shaped the way that I came into the organization.
- [15:57]
B
So what are some of the things that you do differently now to avoid that level of burnout?
- [16:01]
C
I have a lot of boundaries. You know, one of the biggest things is my schedule. I get up early and for me, in order for me to work out, I have to work out in the morning. Most times in the evening, I have events or it's just not gonna work for me. I used to think, like, I have to find out, like, when is the day or what is the time that it's going to work for me to be consistent. And that's in the morning. So I have a whole schedule. And my team laughs at me, but they, they appreciate it. I get up at 4:30 in the morning and I start off with my water and lemon and, you know, apple cider vinegar. And then I get started on working out. I meditate, I get myself set for the day. And one of the things that I, you know, am working with my team is looking at your schedule on a Sunday to prepare you for the week. So you're not coming in so, you know, fast and hard. I do a lot of meal prep on Sundays. So, you know, some lunches, I'm out for lunch, but the majority I'm in the office. And so meal prepping has become my Sunday thing to prepare me for the week, especially if I'm back to back. I have a refrigerator in my office, I have a blender, we have kitchens. And so I set myself up for success, that I'm not grabbing the McDonald's or the takeout or all the cookies or sugar that's in the office, that I'm making smart choices and making sure, like I say, I start my day working out and move into the day that way.
- [17:34]
B
Yeah, yeah. And I could imagine in a role like yours as a CEO, you're making decisions all day. So having that preparation up front of either, you know, having your workout already done, planning your week, knowing what you're going to eat already because it's prepped, that just reduces the mental load of what you've already got going on because those things are already done and decided.
- [17:52]
C
Right. I think a lot of people, I call my, I say set yourself up for success, right. The days that I don't do that or, you know, I happen not to do it, I know that I'm frazzled, I forget something, I'm anxious, I'm agitated by the time I get to the office because I forgot those types of things. And so there is proof to Showing if you set yourself up for success, I call it the cheat code. Like do those types of things so that you are setting yourself up for success. And most times in the morning, you know, I get into the office around seven and between seven and nine, it's my own personal time. And one of the things that I'm teaching my executives is think about three things that you need to do for that day, like what are the priorities for the day, but what are your priorities personally? And that means what I found out is scheduling my dental appointments, scheduling, you know, those types of things that are still important to my well being. You know, I think in the year of the pandemic, I didn't go to the dentist and then I all of a sudden had an infection and all those different things. And so it's the priority of your own personal wellness. So every day I set a list. Three things priority that I want to do for work and three things priority that I want to do for myself. Which means like even scheduling massage, Right?
- [19:16]
B
That's so good. I have a similar method, I call it my daily deposits, where I think of, you know, myself as almost like a bank account and how can I make deposits so that I can feel my best. And I have a lot of similar things as to what you just described. But thinking of it that way is almost like paying yourself first energetically so that it sets the tone for everything else.
- [19:37]
C
It does. And it, it makes a difference. I love checking it off my list. It's actually, and it sits right on my computer, you know, where I'm like, check, check, check. And my team will come in, they're like, what is that? I'm like, all the things that I've gotten done for today and all the things that I've gotten done for myself personally. And you feel more accomplished and you know that you're working through that week and it just feels good.
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B
Yeah. And it's, it's a reminder that the things that you do for yourself as a person are just as important as the things that you do for everybody else.
- [20:07]
C
It is. And it helps you even show up to work better for yourself. Right. I want everybody to be well when they're coming into work. I don't want them to be burnt out. And one of the other things that I do is really work with my executive leadership team to say, you do not need to send me an email at 7:00 at night if you do. I probably won't answer it unless it's something extremely important, unless it's something that's really on fire at the zoo. I used to say, unless there's a jaguar at my door or something like that, but I mean, things can wait. And I think that people in the way that we work, in the fast economy of texting and all those different things, we have to take some time to settle back in, to slow down. My famous saying is grace sets the pace. Right. And giving yourself a little bit of grace. Right. And so making sure that they don't need to send an email. I time all my emails. So I sent out several emails this morning. I wrote them all yesterday, but they're on a timer to come out at 8 o'clock in the morning. So that sets my day up for success. But you don't really need to send an email at 9:00 at night. I'm not really going to look at it. And really, what is that really going to do for me? It's going to get me bubbling, thinking of thoughts now I'm not going to be able to sleep. So I really encourage my team that when they leave work, leave work and be home and be well and cook and be with your families or do what you need to do and come set yourself up success when you get back into the office.
- [21:41]
B
Yeah, yeah. I love that form of leadership. So I would love to talk a bit about pop culture because it's, it's, you know, I would say it's part of your job. It's an important part of your job.
- [21:50]
C
2024 was the year of pop culture. There was lots of things going on. So where do you want to go?
- [21:57]
B
There was. Well, first, I would love to hear more about how pop culture has impacted you. Maybe I would love to start with some of the most impactful pop culture moments that resonate with you for 2024, anytime.
- [22:12]
C
Well, I talked to my team and I'm on TikTok. I think you and I were talking about TikTok and I'm like, TikTok is my job. And I, you know, I have my account, but I am not very active. I post things, but I like to see what is the conversation going on. I think the most prevalent moment that I can speak about right now that I'm in awe of is the Cowboy Carter performance at halftime. To me, it resonated with me in several ways. Number one, at the Museum of Pop Culture, we're storytellers and we're really talking about, you know, cultural heritage. We have one of the largest hip hop collections in the world. And fast forward to the Super Bowl Where Cowboy Quarter came out. She wasn't recognized by the CMAs. And then she came out and did this amazing performance. But the inclusion of what she had in the whole halftime show, the Beyonce Bowl, I mean, we never even thought that we'd say a Beyonce Bowl. It's not the Super Bowl.
- [23:11]
A
Right.
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C
It's the Beyonce Bowl. And to be able to see that happen to me was an iconic moment in 2024 where she included all the singers, men, male dancers, bringing back Ashley. It was just. I think what's so interesting to me is when I'm looking through TikTok is seeing all the people already know the dance, like the next day.
- [23:33]
B
Yes.
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C
And just everyone talking about the significance of it, her doing that in Houston and all those things. I think that was a iconic pop culture moment. How about you? How did you think about that?
- [23:46]
B
Oh, absolutely. And I mean, I think even now, you know, that was a little while ago Christmas. We're now a little ways removed out. This episode's going live in February. People are still talking about it. It's still creating all of this discourse, you know, with people agreeing, people disagreeing. It just the ability to drive that much conversation and also how much conversation that that performance opened up around black Southern culture and how it's often very misunderstood. And is it propaganda? Was the performance not like all of this conversation from one performance is. I don't think anyone else could. Could create that big of a cultural moment.
- [24:20]
C
No. And I think the other big one for me, and I'm not on any side, but I just like watching is the Kendrick Lamar and the Drake battle. Just looking at all the artistry between that. Between, you know, the diss tracks. What's going on? Kendrick dropping his album. Now we're waiting for the super bowl performance. I just listened to the entire, you know, new Kendrick Lamar album and then Dochi coming out. You know, it's all the things about female rappers are very prevalent for 2024, and they're coming out their shell. I feel like it's a female empowerment. Then you have Kendrick Lamar and Drake where they're going through their different things but talking about different ways. And Kendrick Lamar and himself is a Pulitzer Prize winner, so it's bringing all of that information into one. So 2024 was. Was hot with a lot of pop culture moments. I mean, I'm a big hip hop fan, so I pay attention to a lot of hip hop, you know, as being born and raised in Philadelphia. And I love the roots. So for me, just paying attention to that is just Something that I love to just do a deep dive on, for sure.
- [25:30]
B
And I even. I mean, like I mentioned, this episode is coming out in February, Black History Month. And when I think about pop culture, I think pop culture and black history as well as, like black culture specifically in the States, are so intertwined that there is no pop culture without the contributions of black people.
- [25:48]
C
No, not at all. I mean, and when you think about it with the Cowboy Carter, really, country music was started with black culture. You think about R and B and hip hop, you know, and the pop stars that are sampling different things that's coming from hip hop, from that genre, from the turntables. And it's kind of evolved. And that's why I think it's so great, you know, being experienced, being born in the 70s to the 80s and then the 90s and now 2024, you know, fast forward in the 70s, you know, hip hop was just coming alive. And what's so great for me, sitting as a CEO, is looking that we have one of the largest archives and that when the museum opened in 2000 as the experience Music Project, you know, Paul Allen was collecting all of that stuff before. And we were one of the first museums to even put hip hop as a genre in a museum. No one wanted to put hip hop as a genre. And so we were the ones that.
- [26:48]
B
Actually put it out there and really recognizing it as the art form that it is.
- [26:52]
C
It is, yeah.
- [26:52]
B
Yeah.
- [27:00]
A
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- [28:00]
B
A couple of weeks.
- [28:01]
A
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- [30:22]
B
In some ways it almost feels like pop culture is modern art. You know, there's so many. I now living in New York, I frequented a lot of museums that have a lot of like classic artwork and when I think about what will be considered classic artwork of the time that we're in, it almost feels like pop culture and the conversations that we have around pop culture are the new modern art.
- [30:46]
C
I think they've always been that way, but no one has been talking about it. I recently did an article last year titled Mass of the power of pop Culture. I was interviewed on our gateway at the museum talking about that. You know, pop culture has always been a global language, and it has done a social impact. It just is that no one has been talking about it till now. It's been there, it's been part of that art. And, you know, fine art are almost of the same. It's just a different way of talking about it and genre of how you're. You're looking at it. But there's, you know, we have Keith Haring right now in our museum, and that's talking about graffiti art, and that was back in the 80s, so it's always been there, but no one has really elevated the conversation to talk about it.
- [31:36]
B
What do you think has been, I guess, kind of an equalizer in terms of getting people to talk about these different art forms? Do you think it's social media? Is it, you know, what do you think has been the difference in how we talk about pop culture now?
- [31:50]
C
I think it's social media. I think it's also, you know, museums that have started to change the way that they're putting out exhibits and having visitors come visit and really kind of working with artists and creators and telling their stories. Storytelling is big. It's. Storytelling is real, and people, they're more authentic than just looking at a picture on a wall and having a caption under it, but really having these opening parties and having these artists and creators there giving the story behind why they made this photo or this picture or this event and telling those stories, you know, making sure it's more accessible online on a global scale and talking about it. So I think that's, you know, digital accessibility has really helped share those stories and change the game in that. In that way.
- [32:39]
B
Yeah. It almost feels like we have a direct channel to artists in ways that we didn't previously.
- [32:44]
C
And I think artists are starting to feel more comfortable coming out of their shell and telling the stories, noticing that everyone wants to hear that, you know, it's not just about the record, but it's like behind the scenes, how you made the record. What was the reasoning behind that? You know, what did that song really mean to you? What were you really going through? And you see a lot of artists really starting to talk about that and why they made that record and where they were at that time. And then for Me, what I've seen on TikTok is people talking about the words of the lyrics and really the references of what it does, especially with. Most recently when I said. When we were talking about the Kendrick Lamar and the Diss tracks and different things like that, there's a lot of commentary on TikTok talking about what this really means and what was he saying and how that really affect, you know, the genre or what was going on at that time, especially when he's bringing in the mariachis on the album and all those different things that are really cultural relevance, you know, the indigenous groups that they're including, it's really giving them the shine that they haven't been doing for cultural history of stories that haven't been told.
- [33:56]
B
Absolutely. Absolutely. And even in performance, I mean, if we were to go back to the Cowboy Carter example, and I think something that, particularly in the past decade or so of her career, Beyonce has done really beautifully in her performances, is there's so many layers. There's so many meanings behind things as opposed to. I mean, I don't know, I'm thinking about, you know, big performances. When I was growing up in, like, the late 90s, early 2000s, it was like a singer on stage with a headset and some dancers and.
- [34:25]
C
Great.
- [34:25]
B
But that was kind of it versus now. It's like a whole performance is a story and there's layered meaning.
- [34:30]
C
Oh, yes. I was, you know, again, getting in the weeds like I shouldn't be, but, you know, I just get so caught up. Was talking about the origins of the White horses and what they met and the cars and, you know, all those different things. And it is. It is a story of the performance and being able to perform it in Texas, where, you know, where she originated from in her family. It's just, you know, to me, it's.
- [34:55]
B
Exciting to see she knows how to just do the act.
- [34:58]
C
Dropping the ax. There's so many things behind it. I saw one person say that they're thinking, like, she's going to rock now. Who knows?
- [35:06]
B
That's a popular theory that Act 3 is gonna be a rock alb album.
- [35:09]
C
Yeah. So I can't wait to see what. What happens. But she's been very intentional. Right. And I think that's what people are starting to understand. It's like she's had this planned out. She's very intentional. She's very thoughtful, and she's very inclusive. And so I'm excited to see what happens.
- [35:26]
B
Yeah. And I also love taking bits of that and thinking like, okay, how can I apply that to my life? Or how can I apply that to my work? Even when I'm thinking about recording this podcast and I'm thinking about what goes into an episode, how can I prepare? And I'm thinking, like, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna get in front of a mic and just wing it. Would Beyonce get on a stage without. Without preparation, without rehearsal? Absolutely not. So I'm gonna prepare, and I'm gonna rehearse. And no, this is not the Beyonce bowl or, like, Coachella, but I'm gonna do my version of that. And there's so much that we can learn from the artists of our time.
- [35:59]
C
Oh, yeah. I think, you know, practice makes perfect. And really doing your research, you know, that's the same for me. I'm, like, researching you while you're researching me. We're thinking of things that we're going to talk about. I want to talk about what's relevant and current on. On the minds of viewers that are listening to this podcast. Preparation is key, and it sets you up for success. So I think, you know, there's are a lot of lessons that we can learn from that.
- [36:24]
A
Yeah.
- [36:25]
B
Knowing our history, something I definitely want to be better about, for sure. That's. That's a big one.
- [36:30]
C
And I think that's why I'm on TikTok, because I like to hear what everyone's talking about, and then I do my own research, and then I start to go on these deep dives, and then I'm like, I didn't even know all these great, fun facts that I can talk about or when I'm, you know, working with my team and different things like that. So it really gets me on a learning journey for myself. I'm a continuous learner. I love to learn, so that helps me just do more deep dives and learning for myself. Knowing my own cultural history.
- [37:01]
B
Yeah, absolutely. I love that you're, like, a lifelong learner. What are some of your favorite mediums or places to learn from?
- [37:09]
C
Well, I love reading, you know, all about the news stories in the New York Times. I look at the cut to see what's going on in pop culture. But documentaries are my new thing. I like to watch a lot of documentaries on the plane, so just looking at different documentaries and understanding about different things. I love food. I love culture. I love art. I know there's a new Bob Dylan documentary coming out, so I'm looking to. Look forward to look at that. I was looking at the Ziggy Marley one that came out So I love learning in that way just from that lens and understanding what they were actually going through.
- [37:47]
B
Definitely, definitely that's something that I want to be better about. I was actually thinking about it recently because I grew up really loving pop culture and being very, you know, engaged when it comes to television, film series, things of that nature. And then as I've gotten a little older, I veered away from it and I've focused more on reading and I love to read a lot of fiction, but I have also felt myself kind of missing out on major cultural pieces because I'm not as tapped into some of these things. And there are just some things that I just, just personally don't enjoy, like reality tv. For me there, it just like doesn't click in my brain, it doesn't hold my attention, but something like a documentary will. And so I'm wanting to be better about engaging in those things so that I can be more connected to broader cultural conversation.
- [38:40]
A
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- [42:03]
C
So one of my biggest things that I've loved that Netflix is doing is they're starting to do more short, you know, stories. They just did one on food on the Blue Zone in different cultures and longevity and wellness. Yeah, and for me, that was, I was, you know, tuned in and I was like, like now I'm meeting like the Blue Zone for me and myself and different things like that. So Netflix has done a really good job of putting some of these short documentaries that are easy for you to go through, like six series on things like that or what McDonald's food does to you or things like that. But I find myself looking at those types of documentaries and I read a lot. I read about three books a month. It's just, I love doing that. And I think you and I were talking about one of the biggest things that I do right now is listen to the audible. So I'm, I love to cook. So I'm now cooking and listening to audibles and learning through that. And I've. I realized that I can take that in quicker than sitting down and reading a book. And I can get through 10 chapters while doing chores around the house. And so that's my new way of learning right now is listening to the audible loud while I'm doing chores in my house, folding laundry, cooking, all those different things.
- [43:15]
B
Any recent books that you've listened to that you love and recommend?
- [43:18]
C
Well, we were just talking about Mel Robbins and let them and that is actually my motto for the year is a good one. Right. And as we were talking in the pre before we came in here, we were talking about you like what's your motto for 2025? And I'm stealing this from whoever was on TikTok talking about this. So please, I said if it doesn't, you know, let me grow, let me flow or Glow in 2025, it's a no. And it all goes around boundaries and being unapologetic where you don't need to explain yourself. A no is a no. And I think that you and I were talking about how we have set ourselves up to be conditioned to say it's a no. But let me explain why you don't really need to validate yourself and you should feel empowered to be able to say it's a no because it doesn't fit into my schedule. And I hope you understand that.
- [44:11]
B
Yep, absolutely. And kind of fighting that urge, especially as women to over explain, over, you know, apologize. Of course, apologize if you did something caused harm. But like saying no isn't necessarily causing harm. Setting a boundary isn't necessarily causing harm. So we don't necessarily have to apologize for that.
- [44:30]
C
Nor is self care.
- [44:31]
B
Right.
- [44:31]
C
Nor is saying that you are taking this time for self care. That means that you need a break. Right. Whether it's just sitting at home, whether it's just, you know, having a cup of tea and you need to walk around the corner. And I think, you know, one of the things that I talk about to my team and you know, where I'd love to get is where I'm exploring with my chief people officer is more wellness and belonging in the workplace. I'm currently going through menopause right now. There is no type of menopausal leave. There's nothing for women that are going through menopause. I mean, there's times where it is a very hard thing to go through with the hot lights and the hot sweats and you're standing up there and people don't understand what you're actually going through, where you're standing up there and going through all these hormonal changes in your body and what that does for you. And so for me, it's working towards a better way for our insurance carriers and our brokers to come up with more wellness in the workplace that goes along with your insurance. We most recently got a credit from our insurance to our organization and we're like sitting down, like, how are we going to use this for the organization? And we set up like meditative sessions. We also did some employee wellness, you know, back and neck, you know, massages, things like that. But I think for me, I would love to add more wellness into the workplace. And that's a big, big goal for me and my executive team and serving our employees to make sure that continues to be front and center.
- [46:10]
B
And when you survey your employees and ask for their feedback, what types of things do they ask for?
- [46:16]
C
Mental health days. You know, I know that Microsoft and a lot of the bigger employee employers out there have a lot of mental health days. Not sick days, they're mental health days where you just need a mental health day, you might need a break, more time off, you know, looking at our employee and our vacation policies, different things like that, more things to help them further along instead of just eap, you know, different types of therapy modalities, employee resource groups for belonging. So we're just starting and re kicking that off. So you know, I like to hear and create programs with my employees, not me creating the programs for them. So we're really continuously looking at that so that we can understand what our culture needs and provide that for them. Knowing that Rome was not built in a day. But I talk about the crawl, the walk, the run. We're in the crawl. So we're learning and unlearning together so that we can come up with something that works best for our culture.
- [47:18]
B
Yeah, yeah. And that sounds just like a more effective way to do it, actually meeting the needs that the team has.
- [47:25]
C
I promise myself, you know, growing up through the ranks to be a CEO, that if I ever became CEO, I would right the wrongs and really kind of change the things that bothered me when I was an employee and I was listening to other CEOs or decisions being made. And so I'm very inclusive and I want to co create those programs because it's going to make a lasting impact. If no one's, you know, participating, it's because you probably created it on your own. And the movement really kind of Starts with us working together to understand what is going to be the most impactful program. And if it fails, how do we, you know, restart it and do something that's going to work for all of us? My employees are my biggest asset, you know, and if they're not, well, why would I want them to be unwell, showing up to work? And so, you know, it's a long road ahead. Again, I'm not perfect, my organization's not perfect. But we are intentional and that is like one of our top priorities that we're thinking about as we move forward.
- [48:29]
B
Yeah, yeah. And I would imagine it takes a lot of deconditioning for a lot of people too, for the ways that we've come up being conditioned to work. And maybe it's a little bit different for Gen Z, who's newer in the workplace. And I think that generationally, they are in a workplace that is maybe a little bit more flexible than Millennials and Gen X and beforehand came up with. But for a lot of us, it is a lot of deconditioning and unlearning.
- [48:53]
C
Yeah, I mean, you know, my, my staff is multi generational. I've had people that have worked at the organization since it started, and I, I love it because I'm learning from, you know, different ways of working. And for me, I love to hear that type of feedback because it helps us be better. You can't stay stuck. I don't want to be the blockbuster of the world. I want to be, you know, present, functional in how we need to operate in today's society because it's changed. And if we don't change, it's, you know, people get frustrated, they leave. And I want people to come to work. I have a lot of passionate people, but how do I keep them there and how do I really go with the global environment of what's the pressures of the world? And that's compensation, it's wellness, it's insurance. It's all those different things because they're passionate about pop culture, but there's other things outside when they go home that they have to deal with. And so you have to think about that holistically. And I think CEOs really need to think about that. In 2025, people are still recovering from the pandemic. It's in the stats, it's in the fmla. You and I talked about this earlier. The anxiety is still high. No one thought that they were going to be put in a box for as long as they did. And so, you know, people really need that grace to set the pace. But they also need employers to step up and help and, you know, really work with their insurance providers to come up with wellness longevity. It's the key to the success, I think.
- [50:34]
B
Yeah, 100%. And in addition to having a multi generational workforce, you also have a multi generational community that you serve. I mean, people of all ages and generations are coming into the museum. What are some ways that you and your team really engage with the different generations who come through?
- [50:52]
C
We have a youth advisory board that we work with and they start with us for a whole year. So we're always working with them to create different things. So for our exhibits from their lens and what they're thinking and how it really has affected them, we have a teacher advisory board that we're working with. We have community advisors and other community groups. When we're starting to create programs again, we're co creating it with them to understand, you know, what I've heard is that if they don't see themselves in the museum, why would they visit? And so we want to be a community ally. And so we're serving the community and doing surveys and talking to our members to see what do you want to see, what didn't you like or come test this out as we do different things. So it's a process to do that, but it's really inclusive to how we work and how we move through our strategic and operational plan for the organization.
- [51:45]
B
Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. And it sounds really comprehensive. And yeah, I mean, a community is going to want to be a part of a place that. That represents them and they're going to feel more touched and engaged. So I would also just love to talk a little bit about the importance of investing in our local museums before we wrap. Something that I've been thinking a lot about and I've talked about a lot on the podcast is just the importance of having hobbies and being engaged in our communities. Being engaged in culture. Going to museums is something that I have become a lot more interested in and prioritized more in my own life. And a lot of museums run on a membership model. And I would love to talk about why that is and also why it's important to become members of our local museums.
- [52:30]
C
I'm like, if my membership person was here today, she'd kiss you. Because, you know, that is our number one goal is our membership. And why is it important is because it's that cross generational when we talk about generational wealth. Right. You know, the culture of philanthropy is real. And you just can't depend on big funders to just fund your museum as a 503C1. The membership, even for a dollar, if you're spending money in my museum, goes towards my operating funds. It helps me expand those programs, the educational programs that are amazing. But we have a short budget. You know, we're a non profit. And so for us, you know, having attendance, buying membership shows the commitment for loyal, you know, guests. And it's great. We just restarted our membership program. We went out and surveyed, we said, hey, what are we doing wrong? What could we do better? We called it the Renaissance and we relaunched it. We were all things Beyonce. So we talk pop culture and we do everything around pop culture. So we said, we're going to do the Renaissance and we launched our membership program. But what we did is we also went to the apartment buildings and we said, hey, can we get in the apartments? Can we get more locals coming to our museum? We have a lounging cafe and so we have a bookstore. We want people to linger. We want to be a cultural hub. And so once you're a member, you're getting the inside tip for all these different things that are going on. We're communicating with, you know, we're doing all different types of meet and greets for book signings and different things that are going on. You know, once we redo our cafe and lounge in June, we're going to have, you know, after you can get into the museum after hours and listen to music and look at art and different things. And so it's. We really want it to be a community hub, but what we found is, you know, for people that look like me and for the community that we serve, generational wealth is, is big and that you can be a philanthropist by just supporting my museum and then as you get move up in your career, you can then put your legacy within the museum. And I think it centers around generational wealth and that you don't have to be a billionaire if you're buying a membership for $79. You're already supporting me and we want you to be a loyal fan. And I care about what you think and what you're doing. And as you grow up and you have kids, I want you to bring them back to the museum and learn that way. It's always that continuous process, learning and education for yourself. So why memberships? It really helps drive the culture of the community that you're in, but it also helps us grow and expand our educational programs that may help your kids in the future.
- [55:24]
B
Definitely. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for joining me, Michelle. This was like a masterclass in leadership, pop culture, community engagement. Before we go, I would love to hear what you're excited about this year with the 25th anniversary of the museum. Is there anything else that our listeners, if they're in Seattle or visiting Seattle, should be looking out for?
- [55:43]
C
You know, this past 2024, we launched our first gala under my vision called the Icons of Pop Culture. So I'm excited about several things this year I'm excited about. It is our 25th anniversary for the museum, but it's also our 25th anniversary for our Soundoff Youth Artist Showcase. It's a 21 and under showcase where we mentor kids in the music industry and they do their showcases. So there's three of those coming up on February 8th, 15th and the 22nd, so that if you're looking on our website, you'll see that I'm also excited for the reconstruction of our Culture Kitchen where we're going to have a glow up and we're going to be able to do more exciting, extended programs for the community. The designation, of course, is another one. But we also have our second year Icons of Pop Culture, where we're talking about the culture of philanthropy. And I'm really proud of my employees. You know why? Because they have allowed me to reset and reimagine and we're focused on our strategic and operational plan. And what's so great for me to see is how things have changed and what we have accomplished together and how everything's moving in the right direction. At the same time, it's exciting to see the power of pop culture come alive.
- [56:59]
B
Absolutely. Well, we'll make sure that we link to the museum and upcoming events in our show notes so that people can check it out.
- [57:06]
C
Well, thank you so much.
- [57:07]
B
Thank you for joining me. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Balanced Black Girl. I hope that you enjoyed this conversation with Michelle. I hope it inspired you in your own leadership journey and also maybe inspired you to check out your local museum. All of the information that we mentioned today is in the show notes. You can also check out the show notes for all of our discount codes and links from our sponsors. And if you have not yet subscribed to Balance Black Girl, please make sure you do so. You can subscribe on YouTube, on Apple, on Spotify. That way you will never miss an episode. And if you enjoyed this episode, I would greatly appreciate. Appreciate. Your five star review is what really helps the show. It's what helps us reach new listeners and getting amazing guests. And I just really appreciate hearing from you. Thank you again, and I will see you next week. Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.