How Imani Ellis Turned a Living Room Meetup into a Cultural Empire

Summary

Podcast Summary: She's So Lucky Episode: How Imani Ellis Turned a Living Room Meetup into a Cultural Empire
Release Date: May 13, 2025
Host: Les Alfred
Guest: Imani Ellis

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Introduction

In this inspiring episode of She’s So Lucky, host Les Alfred welcomes Imani Ellis, a dynamic entrepreneur who transformed a simple living room meetup into the thriving cultural movement known as CultureCon. The conversation delves deep into Imani's journey, the principles that drove her success, and the lessons she learned along the way.

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The Birth of CultureCon

Imani shares the compelling origin story of CultureCon, highlighting the serendipitous moments that led to its creation.

Imani (00:30): "We have. But I actually feel like every episode, every conversation, everything happens when it needs to happen."

Imani (02:00): "I kind of thought, well, maybe if I invite some friends over and I give them a prompt, we can kind of build something."

Starting in her Harlem living room, Imani invited friends to collaborate, each bringing someone they could vouch for. This simple yet effective rule catalyzed the formation of a creative collective that rapidly scaled, evolving into CultureCon—a testament to the power of community and collaboration.

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Mastering the Art of Connection

Imani attributes her success to her innate ability to connect people, a skill honed through her background in public relations.

Imani (03:58): "I think that was kind of the catalyst of, like, my connecting was I could feel very deeply. And I would notice, oh, goodness, that personality with this personality."

Her sensitivity to energy allows her to read rooms and understand the unspoken needs of individuals, fostering meaningful connections that drive collective growth. This skill not only made her an effective publicist at NBC Universal but also instrumental in building CultureCon's robust network.

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Redefining Influence and Leadership

A significant portion of the discussion centers on what it means to be truly influential. Imani emphasizes that influence stems from trust, kindness, and genuine connection rather than sheer loudness.

Imani (07:50): "I really think that influence is built on trust... a track record of some sort that when you say something, people are like, oh, she's done it before, I believe she can do it again."

She contrasts traditional notions of influence, often associated with high visibility and social media presence, with her belief in subtle yet profound impact—being the "neck" that directs the "head," quietly guiding outcomes without seeking the spotlight.

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The Power of Mentorship and Continuous Learning

Imani underscores the importance of having a diverse tribe of mentors, offering varied perspectives that enrich personal and professional growth.

Imani (17:25): "I have a tribe of mentors, totally different mentors that come from different walks of life... perspective is all so contextual."

She advocates for lifelong learning, constantly seeking feedback, and viewing oneself as a "forever learner." This mindset has been pivotal in her continuous evolution, allowing her to adapt and thrive in dynamic environments.

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Navigating Stress, Burnout, and Seasonality

Addressing the inevitable challenges of leadership, Imani shares her strategies for managing anxiety and preventing burnout. She introduces the concept of "seasonality" in life, likening it to athletes who have distinct periods for rest and competition.

Imani (24:21): "It's a set period of time, and I say it will not always be this way. But it's hard right now. And once it's done being hard, it's gonna be fun again."

By recognizing and respecting these natural cycles, she maintains her mental and emotional well-being, ensuring sustained productivity and creativity.

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Balancing Personal Life and Leadership

The conversation shifts to the delicate balance between professional responsibilities and personal life. Imani discusses the complexities of dating as a successful woman and the importance of maintaining authenticity.

Imani (47:16): "You have to really... meet someone who they are and just say, is this aligned with who I am or not?"

She emphasizes the value of building genuine relationships without compartmentalizing her identity solely around her role as CEO. This holistic approach fosters deeper connections and personal fulfillment.

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Bridging Creativity and Business Acumen

Imani highlights the critical intersection between creativity and business, stressing the need for strategic thinking in scaling creative endeavors.

Imani (36:10): "We need to understand some of these unspoken rules in these careers... bridging the gap."

By integrating legal, managerial, and business strategies into creative projects, she ensures that CultureCon not only thrives artistically but also sustains its growth through sound business practices.

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Future Plans: Creative Residencies and Personal Growth

Looking ahead, Imani shares her innovative approach to personal and professional rejuvenation through creative residencies.

Imani (55:43): "The whole point was just to come back to the version of myself that was excited, that was inspired, that wanted to build things."

These residencies serve as intentional breaks designed to reset and inspire, preventing burnout and fostering continuous innovation. Inspired by James Baldwin's transformative experiences in Paris, Imani's residencies are structured to rejuvenate her creative energies and maintain her passion for CultureCon.

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Conclusion: Embracing Seasonality and Continuous Growth

In wrapping up, Imani reiterates the importance of embracing the natural rhythms of life and work. By allowing herself to navigate through different seasons with intention and self-awareness, she remains resilient and adaptable.

Imani (58:19): "When you're in the season of I'm in my conditioning season, you can't then compare yourself to someone who's in their sprinting season."

This holistic and balanced approach not only propels CultureCon forward but also ensures personal well-being and sustained success.

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Key Takeaways

• Community is Crucial: Building a supportive and collaborative community can exponentially scale your initiatives.
• Subtle Influence Over Loudness: True influence is anchored in trust, kindness, and meaningful connections.
• Diverse Mentorship: Engaging with mentors from varied backgrounds enriches your perspective and growth.
• Respecting Seasonality: Recognizing and honoring different life and work seasons prevents burnout and fosters sustainability.
• Authentic Balance: Maintaining authenticity in personal and professional life leads to deeper fulfillment and stronger relationships.
• Strategic Creativity: Bridging creativity with business acumen ensures the longevity and impact of creative projects.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Imani on Timing:
  "[00:30] Imani: We have. But I actually feel like every episode, every conversation, everything happens when it needs to happen."

• On Being a Connector:
  "[03:58] Imani: I think that was kind of the catalyst of, like, my connecting was I could feel very deeply."

• Redefining Influence:
  "[07:50] Imani: I really think that influence is built on trust..."

• Seasonality Concept:
  "[24:21] Imani: It's a set period of time, and I say it will not always be this way."

• Creative Residencies:
  "[55:43] Imani: The whole point was just to come back to the version of myself that was excited, that was inspired, that wanted to build things."

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Resources and Links

For those inspired by Imani Ellis's journey and eager to connect with CultureCon, visit CultureCon's Official Website and follow their social media channels for updates on upcoming events and initiatives.

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This episode of She’s So Lucky offers a wealth of insights for women striving to create their own luck, emphasizing the power of community, authentic influence, and balanced living. Whether you're an entrepreneur, creative, or wellness expert, Imani Ellis's story provides valuable lessons on building something meaningful against all odds.

Transcript

[Imani]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Imani, welcome to the show.

[Les]

Les. Hi. Thanks for having me.

[Unknown]

I'm so excited because I know this episode has been something in the making for a little while.

[Les]

Yes, we've been trying.

[Unknown]

We have. But I actually feel like every episode, every conversation, everything happens when it needs to happen.

[Les]

I completely agree. Because the rebrand is here, and I feel kind of like, ooh, she's so lucky. Like, I don't know. This feels like very, very kismet.

[Unknown]

It does. And actually, when I think about it, because I know we had been talking about having you come on the show for a while, even with Balance Black Girl, and I think even if we would have done that when it was still Balanced Black Girl, we could have had a really great conversation. But I actually do really think that we. You're, like, the perfect guest for. She's so Lucky. And the new direction of the show.

[Les]

And congratulations, by the way. Like, building in public. Building something so special in public. Like, I'm. I'm. I'm a fan, so thank you for having me.

[Unknown]

I appreciate that so much. So, I don't know if you know this. I went to Culture Con, was it in 2023, like, right after I got to New York. I think I'd maybe been here for, like, a couple weeks.

[Les]

Okay.

[Unknown]

And that was one of my first New York experiences.

[Les]

Oh, my goodness.

[Unknown]

A taste of it. A lot of pressure. But it was actually really fun. Okay, great. I had a lot of fun. I also met so many listeners there. It was kind of my first experience going somewhere and having people come up to me and be like, oh, my.

[Les]

God, I love your podcast.

[Unknown]

Or I love this or I love that. But it was such a beautiful display of creative community, and I would love if you could walk us through the origin story of how it came to be.

[Les]

For sure. I mean, when I think back to the origin story of Culture Con, I was such a different person. And I really think that God is so gracious because I had no idea what it was going to take to do what he had said in my heart. But I was working as a publicist at NBC Universal, and the irony was I moved to New York. I knew no one. And I just kept thinking, like, where is my community? I knew where the day parties were, loved them. I knew, you know, where a lot of things were. But in terms of community and collaboration and, wait, how do we do this thing? I just couldn't find that. And so I kind of thought, well, maybe if I invite some friends over And I give them a prompt. We can kind of build something. And so the creative collective started in my living room in Harlem. The only rule was that every person had to bring one person that they could vouch for. It was my apartment. And that scaled so quickly. I was cooking for them, Les. I loved it. And culture con became the accumulation of all those little events in my apartment for so many more people. And so it's all about. I love that you said that, like, you meet people and you feel warm there. Because it's all about this, like, collective energy and collaboration. And I think it really kind of defies, like, all that isolation. Cause I think so much of the I'm alone or I'm the first to do this, or no one understands is what keeps us stuck. And then you talk to someone and you're like, oh, I just. Oh, that was me last year. And like that. And is sometimes I think the God nod or the momentum that can, like, really inspire you to keep going. And so it started kind of selfishly because I couldn't find something that I was looking for. And then turned out that a lot of us were feeling really isolated and alone. And so we just built something so much bigger.

[Unknown]

I mean, I think you are such a master connector. And you also having a background in PR is not surprising, because that is very similar to what that field does. Have you always been a natural connector? Was that a skill set that you cultivated over time?

[Les]

You know, I think it really starts with, I'm so sensitive to energy. Like, I can read a room. Like, I read a book. And I can usually read people. Like, I can read a book. And I thought we all could do this. So I can tell when someone's nervous. I mean, I get nervous. I can tell when someone is excited. And I can kind of notice that person in the corner of the room who really wants to join the conversation. But it's kind of like on the outlines. And so I would look over and say, oh, Sarah. I thought we all could feel that. And so I think that was kind of the. You know, that was the catalyst of, like, my connecting was I could feel very deeply. And I would notice, oh, goodness, that personality with this personality. That would be incredible. And so my sister's a chef. I think in the same way that she has, like, the ingredients, I can do that for personalities and people. And so in pr, it was great because I came from the South. I'm from Atlanta. Publicists are known to be a little aggressive and a little. A type personality. You gotta get it Done. I would say my approach to PR was a little bit more custom fit, depending on who I was talking to. So I wasn't always kind of the loudest in the room, but I was efficient and I think that's what helped me navigate pr. And I think it's the same thing that helps me navigate kind of building the room and building community.

[Imani]

I love what you just said about.

[Unknown]

Not being the loudest in the room. I can relate a lot to that. Even when you were describing that person who's maybe on the outskirts of the conversation and needs to be invited in. God bless people like you, because that's usually me. And whenever someone, like loops me in, I'm always very grateful for that. I do think that there can feel like a lot of pressure to need to be the loudest in the room, to either feel heard or to feel seen or to reach a certain level of success. How have you navigated being able to move so well even when you're doing so more quietly?

[Les]

Well, you definitely have to flex up sometimes, right? I think you can't always be like, oh, this is just who I always am. I used to really hold on tight to identity. So I used to start all the conversations with, I'm an introvert. I'm an introvert. And what I started to notice was I was kind of like backing myself into these labels and it was like, are you introverted or are you uncomfortable with this person? Or like, are you introverted or are you just, like, exhausted? I think a lot of my kind of becoming happened before I even got into corporate world. It happened doing ballet for 14 years. It happened doing track. And I'm someone who just loves to study. And I study people and I study again, energy. And I would look at different leaders and say, hmm, she's got this quiet confidence about her. I really want to emulate that. But she also knows how to put her foot down. You know, she's not going to let people walk all over her. And I was super fortunate when I got to NBCUniversal because I was the assistant to the EVP. I mean, she was the head honcho. And so I was cc'd on all of her emails. I planned all of her life and I learned so much from her. And I was able to see, wait a minute. It's actually more important to be influential than to be loud. And to be influential, you need to have people's trust. You need to have integrity. Be who you say you are. You need to do good work. You also do need to, though show your work, but that doesn't mean you have to be loud about it. And so once I realized that there was a cheat code that I didn't have to become someone else, oh, it was off to the races. It was off to the races from there.

[Unknown]

That's so good. Can we talk more about what it means to be influential? Because I think influence is now a word that's thrown out around a lot.

[Les]

Yes, absolutely.

[Unknown]

It's now a job. You know, when 15 years ago it kind of, it wasn't, you know, it's now like a career path. What does it mean to have influence from your perspective?

[Les]

I really think that influence is built on trust. And I think trust is built on so many different ingredients. But I think the most important ingredients are a track record of some sort that when you say something, people are like, oh, she's done it before, I believe she can do it again. And even if she doesn't do it again, I believe that, like she's going to win more than she loses. I think it's built on kindness. I think that that's a soft skill that we don't talk about enough is just like people want to be influenced, aligned with people that make them feel that more is possible. And then I think also influence is built on like connection, like people feeling seen. And so when I was in corporate, so much of kind of the influence that I was building was in one on one conversations, talking to the folks in tech, talking to the folks in marketing, not waiting till the fire drill came to be like, hey, can we like work together getting coffees? And so I know as a coordinator, there were times people were like, who is this girl? But what they weren't seeing was that I was building trust and integrity and connection and kindness with people behind the scenes. And so to your point, that word does get thrown around a lot. I think now it can see more vanity metrics. But I feel like people can be so influential and not even be on social media. Like you can move through this world and kind of, I love to say it's kind of like you're not the head, you're the neck. So you decide where the head's looking. To me, that's true influence. It doesn't have to be in kind of the front on the stage. It's kind of the director who's actually calling like the shots.

[Unknown]

I love that. I love that so much. And there's so many valuable lessons there that I feel like I could also relate to from my corporate experience of learning very early in my career and how far it will take you to make your leaders look good.

[Les]

Oh, yes.

[Unknown]

And to make them look, you know, prepared, proficient. Whether you're doing analysis for them, whether you're collecting data to help them be informed. Helping the people that you're either in community with or work with look good will take you so far.

[Les]

It'll take you so far. And another kind of just hack that I did was I was not afraid to identify the gap between where I was and where I wanted to go. So what I would do is as an assistant, I would look up and say, okay, the associate is the next level. And I would find an associate that I really admired. Unless I would say, hmm, she's got like executive presence. Like, she's not afraid to speak or hmm, she's not ashamed to, like, show when she's gotten a New York Times feature. Or, hmm, she's managing interns. And I would look at what was on my plate and I would say, okay, these are the things I need to work on. And I think that came from ballet. Like, I love feedback. And I think when you get over the fear and the cringe of like, this feedback doesn't have to be a personal kind of like, attack. It's actually a little bit more objective than that. It just changed my life. And so while I was at NBC Universal, I was promoted seven times. And I just say that because the formula was making my managers look really good. Like you just said, identifying the gaps. And I'll never forget, I went into one of my one on ones. My boss said, you kind of lack executive presence. Whoa. Like, I remember being like, wow. But then I knew what I needed to work on and I was able to like, optimize for it. So I've always been a long game kind of girl. I've always been a consistency is key kind of girl. And I never needed kind of that instant gratification. I think now as a CEO, I am able to kind of move faster. Like every decision has. Doesn't have to be a long game. But like, I believe that good things take time and I'm not afraid of that. Like, that doesn't scare me.

[Unknown]

Being able to take feedback is key. That's something that I still struggle with too. Just being like, sensitive.

[Imani]

I'm like, I am bad at this.

[Les]

Okay, I'm sensitive. Like, don't get me wrong, I'm sensitive, but I feel kind of like on the other side is really important information. And I understand some people's approach is like, I just don't want to know. But I think for me, I want to optimize. Like, I want to self actualize. I never want to be the emperor with no clothes on. That's like, there's nothing more for me to learn. So I think about it more as like a forever learner. And I think that goes back to like, I've just had a lot of coaches and so having coaches a part of that is okay. This was really, really great. But you're not perfect. So here's the part we're going to work on. And I think, I mean, even Oprah has coaches, you know what I mean? And it kind of grounds me that like, we're always learning versus we're always failing. Yeah, yeah, it's true.

[Imani]

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[Unknown]

What kind of coaches have you had that have helped you in your career thus far, and how did you find them?

[Les]

Oh, my goodness. So I actually just finished my first stint with life coaching. Game changing. I found my leak, actually, from her podcast.

[Imani]

My God.

[Les]

Like, game changing.

[Unknown]

The best possible coach you could have.

[Les]

The best possible coach. And she got me together in such a radical way that it changed my life. I didn't realize how many kind of set thoughts I had that were kind of like, narrating my life and narrating how I showed up and unqualifying myself. And she literally just held a mirror up to me and was like, hmm, is that true? And we did so much incredible work together. I can't wait to go back. But that was incredible. And then I have a tribe of mentors, totally different mentors that come from different walks of life. White men, black men, black women. Just so many different perspectives. I never want to have just one perspective because I really kind of feel like people are giving you the best they can with their perspective. But if you really want to kind of eat from the buffet and you really want to kind of live an abundant life, I think you need a ton of perspectives because perspective is all so contextual, right? So it's kind of like, this is what I would do if I were you. But you have to ask yourself, like, but is that what I want my life to look like? So I love my mentors. I love my life coaches. My parents are both pastors. They're always helping me with my spiritual journey. And then I would also say just kind of like my peers and just not being afraid to say, do you know someone who does this or have you done that? I think I got out of this. I won't even say perfection, but I got out of this. You have to kind of do it on your own mentality. I think that's it comes from kind of being in school, right, where you can't look at anyone else's test. But entrepreneurship is like, the exact opposite. Like, get as much help as you can. There is no. There's no prize for suffering. And I think once I realized I don't get a prize for, like, suffering and doing it on my own, I was like, wait, I'm getting as much help as I can get.

[Unknown]

It's a lesson. I'm trying to Learn in real time. Yeah, it's a hard one.

[Les]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

Yeah. I think from. At least in my experience, it's not even necessarily like, not wanting to ask for help, but I think being put in a position of being the first in many instances, whether it was I was like the first in my family to go to college, and I realized the amount of trauma that I had stemming from that that I still carry, or the first entrepreneur or the first person to leave, you know, the hometown or whatever. And I think often when you are the first to do something, everyone is looking to you to figure what's next. But then it's like, well, who do I look to?

[Les]

Oh, yeah, that's so true. And I think for a long time I was looking back to my team or back to my employees, and I realized this is not a great dynamic. I'm going to actually have to find other help because I do think there's a lot of pressure with being the first, but I think there's also a lot of pressure that we put on ourselves. And so it's kind of like, I know what it feels like to be anxiety ridden, to worry about everything, to have the panic attacks. What would it look like to just pause and spiral into control instead of spiraling out of control? And that's been my mantra is. Even on the way here, I was like, we got a lot to do. And I just was like, let's breathe. My sister always says, I always say we have a lot to do. And she would say, and you've got the time to do it.

[Unknown]

I love that.

[Les]

And that. Yeah, that really, really grounds me.

[Imani]

Yeah. That's so affirming. Yeah. How have you navigated those seasons where.

[Unknown]

Maybe you're experiencing burnout or the anxiety is really high? What helps you start spiraling into control?

[Les]

I think because I've done the opposite for so long. My relationship with fear was fear always won, but yet I was courageous. So, like, I guess fear didn't win in the end, but it dragged me. It really did. Because I wasn't able to see an example of what it would look like on the other side. I didn't have the experience yet. And so it would all feel so fatal, Especially when you're building something in public. It's not just culture, con. There's people. People, you know. And I think for me, I thought, what if this fails? I will fail. Or, what if this doesn't succeed? We won't succeed. And those kind of thoughts, attaching yourself to something that personally is never going to set you up for success. And so I finally got to a place where I said, we've got to try it a different way. Because if CultureCon is going to continue to scale, we started with a hundred people. We had 10,000 people last year. If that's only gonna continue to grow, you've gotta grow. And I think a lot of my anxiety was steeped in a younger, less prepared version of myself. And so what I do to cope now is one, I remember that this is kind of the equation, right, that something scary happens and you want to go into fight or flight. For me, it's interesting. I. When I'm anxious, it makes me work. I work my way out of it. And so that's, I think, how I first combat it is. I put it on a piece of paper and I say, what really is under this anxiety? Is it that you don't have the sponsorships? Is it that you need more talent? Is it that your team is a little off in morale? Like, what is it? And once I understand the thing I work towards the thing I think that's really helped me because sometimes when you're just like, I'm stressed that it's really hard to diagnose what we're fixing. And so I now say, you know what? I'm not feeling really great about where we are positioning wise. And that allows me to kind of bring in the team that needs to help with that or bring in the mentors that need to help with that. The other thing I do is I've really become so much better at my capacity. There used to be, I never say no, I don't have capacity. I do everything like the limit does not exist Now I can feel in my body when it's like, oh, sis, we're done for the day. So even if we're waking up early tomorrow, or even if we're working on the weekend, you've got nothing more to give today. And that allows me to not go into we're spiraling mode. And then sometimes the truth of it, Les, is you're gonna spiral because it's a part of, I think, the conditioning. And so one of the things that I try to be really honest about is just the seasonality of my life. And so I just came from like a month in Atlanta with the best nervous system and cooking short ribs. But I know that now we're in selling season. And so I don't lie to myself. I don't say we're still in relaxed season. I say we're in work season. That also helps me because then when it's hard, I'm not wasting a lot of time crying because it's hard.

[Unknown]

Like, it's finite. Like, you know, it's a set period of time.

[Les]

It's a set period of time, and I say it will not always be this way. But it's hard right now. And once it's done being hard, it's gonna be fun again.

[Unknown]

That point that you made about identifying what it is, that is either causing the stress, pinpointing it, I think is so important because that's when you can go from, like, spiral mode, the bad spiral mode, to problem solving mode.

[Les]

Yes.

[Unknown]

And learning how to get into problem solving mode is so helpful. And it's just such a good reframe for those moments when everything feels like chaos.

[Les]

Oh, absolutely. Because otherwise, your resources, your time, your energy, it's just, like, splattered at the wall. But, like, that problem solving mode of kind of like. Like, this is what we need to fix. And that's why you also have to know your zone of genius. My operations lead is so good at, like, extracting and then the next steps. And if you don't have an operations lead, you know, because before I didn't have her. It's finding that within yourself, which is like, okay, in the morning, I can optimize on problem solving and then just getting in there.

[Imani]

Yeah, yeah. What is your zone of genius, and.

[Unknown]

How did you find it?

[Les]

Ooh, you know what I asked myself? What parts of the role give me the most energy? I think so much of what we want to do, our body knows we want to do it. I find that when I'm procrastinating, when I'm putting things off, it's. Because I don't want to do it doesn't mean I don't have to do it, but I don't want to do it. So my zone of genius is definitely building teams, curating rooms, like experiential design. In terms of. This is what I want it to feel like. I would say empathetic leadership and just an eye for creative. I really trust my eye. The things that I could take or leave the P and L. I know the P and L. I know how we're doing. I know our profits. Is that what gets me going in the morning? No. You know, staffing and hiring and onboarding. I don't. You know, I. I heard in one of the podcasts that you were like, I could eat the same thing every day for a month. I am not that girl, like, ever. Like, I. And so when it becomes a little bit like, oh, we're onboarding again. That's not. That's not my zone of genius. Now, once you're onboarded and it's time to play and build things, I'm your girl.

[Unknown]

That totally makes sense.

[Imani]

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[Unknown]

Zone of Genius has been something that's been top of mind for me a lot because I'm working with an executive coach right now. Kind of to your point or to what we were talking about earlier? Who. She's been really great. One of the things that we've been working on is identifying my zone of genius, which is largely centered around storytelling and facilitating conversation, of course, kind of the short summary. And I had this misconception around zone of genius that it. It was something that had to be easy, because in my mind, I'm like.

[Imani]

Oh, my God, nothing is easy, really.

[Unknown]

Or nothing. I don't feel like anything really comes easily to me. I feel like I've had to cultivate, like, every skill and nugget and whatever, and she really helped me work through that. That it's not that something is just easier, takes no effort, but that it's just more so, like, where your energy is aligned towards and where you're able to really expand and bloom. And when I let go of that idea of, like, oh, it has to be this supernatural talent that I don't put any effort towards, and it's just effortless and easy. When I thought that, I thought, well, I don't have a zone of genius because, like, nothing feels easy. And then when I let go of that and realized that's not necessarily what it's like for everybody, it was really helpful for me to pinpoint.

[Les]

I really love that, because I do think that.

[Unknown]

Right.

[Les]

Sometimes we think easy means no effort, and I think. I love that. I do think it's more about energy, alignment, and just what you're really, really good at. And maybe what. That's so interesting that you say that nothing comes. Did you say easy or natural?

[Unknown]

Both. I think. I kind of used it interchangeably. Yeah.

[Les]

Because I feel like before we started going, I was just saying how easy it is to talk to you. So when you talk about storytelling and facilitating conversations, that seems like such a natural extension. I feel like you have a very. Let's sit and talk. It's a gift. It's a gift. And sometimes I think because things are gifts, it's like, almost like in the same way that you can't see your nose.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Les]

You know what I mean? It's right there. Yeah.

[Unknown]

Yeah. It's interesting. I think of it as something that I've had to cultivate so much over time, just because when I was younger, I was so quiet, I did not talk at all. And I used to have a lot of social anxiety. So even having conversations for me when I was younger was really hard. And so I had to do a lot of work to get over that and build the skill of conversation and storytelling.

[Les]

Got you. Okay.

[Unknown]

It wasn't something that I've just always been able to do. And. Yeah, so I think that's.

[Les]

That makes sense. Okay. In terms of. Yeah. Just like, growing that muscle. Growing that muscle. Yeah. I mean, I think another thing that I've really been thinking about lately is just to not allow yourself to be too attached to anything. You know what I mean? Like, I think when I was younger, I was very outgoing, and I still am. Like, I'm not shy, but I'm definitely more of an observer now. Like, I really. I'll go to a dinner. So I'll go to a dinner, and I will just listen to people talk. I just. That wasn't my personality when I was in high school. I was so rambunctious, so loud, always having parties. And so I'm just allowing myself. I'm in this state of just flow. And I think back to, like, oh, my goodness. So much of who I am today is who I dreamt to be. But I had to kind of pause and reflect on that because I am a very kind of like, I'm an optimization girl. So I'm a very, like, zone of genius efficiency. All the books that I read are like the Harvard Business Review, like, I gotta chill. And I think that's right.

[Unknown]

I need to get you some fiction, girl, please.

[Les]

I haven't read a fiction book. Book in, like, three years.

[Unknown]

I've read a lot of Rex on Rex for you if you ever want.

[Les]

I read so many books right now I'm reading Rest is Resistance, but I do not read fiction. So please put me on. I need more. More of that in my life, I think.

[Unknown]

And I actually think that it's so good for creativity because I was very similar where for a very long time it was all either like, personal development business and all those things are great and still do those things. But then also when I started incorporating a little bit of the fiction and letting myself get lost in a story, then I felt like I became a better storyteller. And it helped. It actually did help just as much in other ways, kind of to that same vein. I would love to talk more about creativity because so much of the work that you do is really about supporting and uplifting creatives. And I would love to talk about why it's so important to you to provide support to creative people.

[Les]

The catalyst of me noticing was actually I went to a conference for creativity. I'VE always been creative. I've always loved so many different kind of like outlets and vehicles for creativity, from musicals to painting to singing to dancing. And I went to a creative conference when I first got to New York and I was so excited. I got there early and I was sitting in the audience and. And no one on the stage looked like me. This was in 2017. And it made me so angry. And I didn't even stop between like, it's so crazy when I think back, I didn't stop between like, oh, go find another conference. I was so angry that I was like, why don't we have these spaces? This is insane. And that anger was such a great catalyst for we deserve, we should have. Also I had a ton of visibility in a corporation of resources and education and just so much that I never would have known if I wasn't kind of right there in front of it. And it made me think about, you know, is this going to be the future of creativity if we never kind of open the door and shut a light of all the different voices that are being, you know, not included in these conversations? Because these conversations are so one sided. And so I'd be in these rooms as the only. And I'm like, all of this resource and this is the best that we have. And again, I say this very humbly, but what I meant was that it could be so much better than this. And so it felt very personal to me. And that anger actually was able to evolve into something more special, which I think was advocacy. And it was just like, we need to understand some of these unspoken rules in these careers. We need to understand that you can't just kind of like show up, do your work, go back home. You're never going to really get as much as you can from this. And I think we also need to understand that. What I was seeing was there was a huge gap between creativity and business acumen. So and so many ideas, but then no kind of like strategy on scaling it, protecting it. And that made me feel like we had to do something to kind of bridge the gap. And so CultureCon was the answer of bringing in lawyers and talking about ip, bringing in managers, and also recognizing that accessibility is a thing. Right. So bringing in resources that were free. You know, a lot of the resources that we talk about don't cost any money. Right. I think that was a surprise to our community because sometimes you hear a lawyer, you're like, oh, I don't have a budget for a lawyer. Or you know, cpa. I don't Have a budget for a cpa. And so it just was kind of just visibility of it can look different for you. You just have to be curious enough about it. And community is what's gonna set you free. Because if you don't know the answer, that's fine. I don't know a lot of things, but community and just being brave enough to say, I don't know, I need help, it can change your life. And so the origin of just kind of how this started was a very, I think, big mix between. It's possible for us. We deserve this. And if we can really wrap our minds around left brain, right brain, we're going to be unstoppable. Just like as a community.

[Unknown]

Absolutely. I think that intersection between creativity and business acumen is so, so important. And I think sometimes people will be in a rush to maybe leave. Maybe it's a corporate situation to pursue their creative passions or something, to feel like it has to be one or the other. There's also so much to be gained from being in those environments that you.

[Imani]

Can also apply to your creativity.

[Unknown]

That's really important. I think you're a great testament to that. I know I applied a lot of what I learned in corporate environments to the business side of things. You need that balance, no pun intended. Whether it's you doing it yourself or having community that you can call on to help help with those elements as well.

[Les]

And it's such a mind shift. Like when you're in corporate. I would encourage anyone who's in corporate to reframe it from I'm working for the man to I'm in business school that I get paid for. Yep. So, like, I gotta leave here with something. What am I gonna learn? Whether it's for my next job or my own job. Like, to your point, so much of that application I learned from NBC Universal how to manage people, how to deal with crisis. You know, it. It all was so transferable. And so whenever I'm talking to, you know, younger, you know, people who are just getting started, and they're like, ugh, I hate my job. I'm like, but what from that? Can you extract, like, be a little selfish? And the other thing I used to think about was I would think about my job as my client. Sometimes, like, I would go into work and I would be like, this is my client. And same job, same title. But the mindset is different. And it just. It gives you a little bit more control of your destiny. It's a little less passive. It's a little more. If this was my company, and this was my client. I would probably double check that press release. Right. And I think that ownership is. Yeah, it was a game changer for me, for sure.

[Unknown]

When I was in corporate, I used to think of my corporate job as a revenue stream, and that helped me not. Not, like, tie my identity to it as much. It's like, this is a revenue stream. I'm learning how marketing works within this big company and how to manage a.

[Imani]

Team and what processes look like.

[Unknown]

And then in my business, my other revenue stream, I can apply some of what I learned, and it's all, you know, none of it was, like, the totality of my identity.

[Les]

Oh, that's so good. I. I had to unlearn that because absolutely being a publicist was the totality of my identity for so long. And that, you know, then I went from that to being a CEO. And when you're jumping from identities like that, it's. It's just not sustainable. It's not sustainable because nothing is so permanent. And so I did so much work in the last three years because there was a time people would say, culture con, and I'd say, oh, because I was thinking they were talking to me. And it's like, there's so much more freedom again in that seasonality. And being like, this is one of the things that I do. I love going to estate sales. I love being a daughter. I love being a sister. But I think this is the first time in my life that I actually mean that versus it being, like, a really great thing that, like, sounds really good because it was working like I was getting rewarded for this kind of, like, obsession. And I think what I realized is there was a season where you needed to be very obsessed. We can now pull back a little on that. Now it's built, now we're optimizing. And so it's just a different version of who I need to be and how I can take some of that energy, a lot of that energy, and poured into who I am, you know, becoming.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Les]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

I love that so much.

[Imani]

So now that you are in a.

[Unknown]

Space of being able to pour more energy into yourself and into other areas of your life, where do you like to pour? What fills you up?

[Les]

Oh, my goodness. That's such a great question. I think it's. I am in this really exciting chapter of dating and getting to know myself, and I used to feel guilty for taking time or guilty for taking this dinner, and now it's like, so what was all this work for? To just keep working? No, we're going to stop. We're going to enjoy it. We're going to get to know what we like, what we don't like. And I think a lot of that is just learning to trust myself. And so as a child, I trusted myself freely. And I think somewhere along the way, it was like, not like that. Oh, you're too quiet, you're too loud. And now I'm in this season where it's very much like, imani, what do we want to do? Like, I don't have any dependence. You know, I don't have children. I don't have a partner. And so at this time, I'm really able to say, what are we going to do? And I have had that freedom for a while, but I wasn't utilizing it. So it's almost kind of like I heard this story, which is like, when a baby elephant is young, they will tie. Have you heard this?

[Unknown]

No.

[Les]

They will tie its leg to a really, really kind of like, small, little, like, stick in the ground. And because it's small, it can't pull away. But as that elephant gets larger, same stick, and they can tie the elephant, and the elephant doesn't realize that within a second, they could break the twig and run free. And so if for so long you're telling yourself you can't rest, that means you're lazy. You can't go out to eat by yourself. What will people think? You can't travel alone. It's too hard. You just really start to. That becomes, like, the headline of your life. And so now I'm in this chapter of just questioning all the headlines of my life. And it's really fun. And I'm dating, and that's really fun. And I'm recognizing that so much of what makes you a really great CEO isn't always transferable, but a lot of it is, and that's been really fun. And so I think for me, it's just a season of play until CultureCon comes in October.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Les]

And then it's.

[Unknown]

Then it's, you know, the season for that.

[Les]

It's the season for that.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Les]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

But I love what you said about being in a space where you do have more space in your life. Let's say, you know, you don't have children. Dependence. In this moment, it can be so tempting for us to fill that space with more work.

[Imani]

Almost expected.

[Unknown]

But to take a step back from that, be like, actually, I'm gonna use quite a bit of this space for myself and for exploring where I am.

[Imani]

Now and who I Am now is.

[Unknown]

A really beautiful thing.

[Les]

Yeah. You know, I, I, I love that because one is, I think, a little bit more measurable. Right. So work is so measurable. Right. The accolades and the building and the announcing, and I think that's why it feels so great, is it's, it's very visible. One of the reasons I loved PR was there was a set goal and then an outcome. Right. And I could always look back and say, wow, look at all this press we got for the show. It's a little harder to gauge self actualization. It's a little harder to gauge self trust. It's a little harder to gauge, like, how am I with all my friendships? But I love that challenge. And I think as I start looking at my life, I've just been giving myself little assignments, little side quests, and it allows me to be accountable to myself instead of having these abstract goals of I'm gonna see my friends more. It's like I'm gonna do two friend dates a week. And it's still something that's measurable, but, like, in a different direction.

[Imani]

For sure.

[Unknown]

Yeah. Because it's like, quantity and quality.

[Les]

Absolutely.

[Unknown]

You also mentioned dating, which is, like, a fun thing. Yes. And kind of navigating, like, when to be the CEO versus not. Can we talk more about what that has been like? And also just dating as a successful woman, I think sometimes can have different. Different stigmas or preconceived challenges. So I'm just curious how that's been for you.

[Les]

Yeah. You know, I think for me, it's so interesting because I believe we're so many things. I think sometimes it's other people who decide that we're the one thing. But I've always been so many things, and so I am someone who is a nurturer and a collaborator, but I can flex into leadership. And I think one of the biggest obstacles when you're kind of dating and you are building something publicly is sometimes you're spending a lot of time trying to explain away that that's not all of who you are. I'm in a chapter now where, like, I kind of have a lot of indicators of, oh, this probably isn't gonna work. Like, if we're on a first date and you're already like, yeah, boss lady, or da, da, da. I just can't.

[Unknown]

I just had a physical reaction to that.

[Les]

I just. I just can't. But I will say I am optim because I really do believe that there are so many examples of what partnership can look like. My parents have been married for 45 years. They both met, they were both pastors. They were both at the same level. And so I've seen what, like, give and take can look like. And I think for me, my kind of biggest journey now is really not betraying myself or trying to see, like, fixer uppers. Because, Les, I'm a girl who can see potential. I'm a girl who's like, oh, it could be so much better if we just. And that's, I think, been. The biggest lesson is you've got to meet someone who they are and just say, is this aligned with who I am not? Could it be better? And that, I think, is the part of the CEO that I have to take off my CEO hat, because no one is asking you to change them. And I think sometimes I can really see a lot of potential in things. And now I'm in this chapter where I'm like, you know what? I don't want to put energy in potential. I really want to put energy in co collaboration. And so that, for me, is so exciting because it's like, that's an opportunity, I think, to not flex, you know, a muscle that feels so second nature to me and to allow myself just to be and to be happy. And I think the other piece, right, is to show up as yourself, your silly, weird, you know, driven, calm, passive self, and to still be seen in, you know, the highest regard. That is so exciting for me. So I think it's something that I. Yeah, I'm excited about it. I don't have this kind of like, it's never gonna happen. Like, I know it will. And I think for me, it's like, in the in between time, there's so much life to live.

[Unknown]

Absolutely, 100%. Oh, the Fixer upper part is so real. And I do think in a lot of ways, as women, we're socialized to move that way. And it's not to our benefit.

[Les]

It's not. It's an uphill battle. And it's kind of like by the time you've reached your 30s, you're not really gonna change someone. People can evolve on their own and if they want to, but you've got to really, I think, acknowledge the role that you play in your own suffering. Because if someone says, I'm a dalmatian, and you're like, but you're not, you're the best little husky you ever could be. You know, there's a part where it comes to, you know, what it. You're telling me who you are. If I Choose to not see that I've got to take accountability of kind of the role that I play in that dynamic, which is the lesson that probably will take me the longest to learn.

[Unknown]

Relatable. I've been there many times. Yeah, I know that very well. Yeah, it's tricky.

[Imani]

It's tricky, too, because it's like you want to see the best in people.

[Unknown]

And you want to believe in the best in people, and it's. Yeah, it's hard sometimes when that doesn't line up.

[Les]

Yeah. Especially because the best is so subjective. Right. Which is why you should go where the light is. Because you wanting something for someone else is just, again, not the best use of your energy. And I think, you know, two things can be true. I think that you can have conversations and you can be open to what it would look like together, but you also kind of. Of need to kind of have a powwow with yourself and just say, is this where our energy should go? Because, yeah, it can be diminishing returns if you never stop to kind of like, course correct and ask yourself, oh, my gosh, I'm. I'm being such a CEO. Course correct. But it can be diminishing returns if you're. If you're just not able to ask yourself, you know what? Because I have to flex this muscle so much in my day to day, do I want to flex this muscle so much in my, you know, night to night? My. Probably not. You know what I mean? And so that's kind of been something that I'm so excited to explore, is building a strong foundation of, like, friendship and compatibility and chemistry versus kind of forcing myself to go into these kind of, like, archaic gender roles of, like, what it does and, like, doesn't look like.

[Imani]

Totally.

[Les]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

And how has it been for you, as somebody who is also building something so publicly to navigate that space? Because I know for me, I tend to compartmentalize a lot, and I have gotten into a really bad habit, especially in dating, where I say nothing about the work that I do and, like, don't let people into that part of my life at all, which is also not helpful.

[Imani]

Yeah, it's such a weird thing.

[Les]

I've experimented with it all. I've done the. Oh, yeah, I like, work in marketing. You know, just.

[Unknown]

That's my go to.

[Les]

Is that your. The blanket. I work in marketing.

[Imani]

Cause it's not. Not true.

[Les]

It's not not true. But I am no longer making it, like, the fine print. I'm normalizing it because it's normal.

[Imani]

Yeah.

[Les]

So Yeah, I run a conference. I have a community. Da, da da, da da. We have employees. Da, da, da da. I don't pause before it. I just say it. And here's the other thing I think is, like, they're going to find out anyways.

[Unknown]

True.

[Les]

So your time is so valuable. When I was, you know, 19, I mean, I could afford to just kind of, like, get to the eighth date before I said what my job was. But now I think for me, it's like, are you able to have the capacity to see that that's not all that who I am? Because we need to know that sooner than later. And I think I have done the. Let's kind of, like, bloom later. It doesn't really work out. It doesn't really work out. You've got to just be who you are. And I saw this beautiful quote, I think a lama day from Topicals. Love her.

[Imani]

Love her.

[Unknown]

She said, I'd love to have her on the show.

[Les]

She said, the right people say yes and the wrong people say no. So there's no, like, let me get this text message. Absolutely perfect. The right people say yes and the wrong people say no. And that has just set me free.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Imani]

Yeah, that's so true.

[Unknown]

I've also heard a lot, like, you can't say the wrong thing to the right person.

[Les]

Oh, that's good.

[Unknown]

Which is a kind of.

[Imani]

Yeah.

[Unknown]

Similar idea. Play on words. I've also had a lot of instances where my community. Love them. Love y' all. Blow up my spot.

[Les]

Oh, do they?

[Unknown]

Out publicly.

[Les]

Well, I would blow up your spot, too. I would be so excited. Like, I mean, we are rooting for you. We're rooting for us. Yes.

[Unknown]

Thank you.

[Imani]

Thank you.

[Unknown]

I think I've. I've, like, I'm starting to kind of, you know, move into a better. A better season of it, but, yeah, I've had my spot blown up a couple times.

[Les]

We were together and people were freaking out. Where were we? They were like Balance Black girl. I mean, it was incredible.

[Imani]

Was it at Afrotech in Houston?

[Les]

Yeah, in Houston. It's a thing.

[Unknown]

Which is so nice.

[Les]

Yes.

[Unknown]

But, yeah. So I couldn't. I couldn't keep lying and saying I worked in marketing anymore, because I didn't go far.

[Les]

Yeah, no, no, we are. It's the season of Audacity. Yes. With the way that everything's moving. Like I said, we've tried it the other way. Mm. Let's try it this way. A braver way.

[Unknown]

Yeah.

[Imani]

And embodying all of who we are.

[Unknown]

And showing up as that. Yeah.

[Imani]

So, Imani, is there anything that you're.

[Unknown]

Really looking forward to either coming up.

[Imani]

In the rest of 2025 or just as you step into your next season?

[Unknown]

What does that look like?

[Les]

Ooh, I'm planning my next creative residency, love.

[Unknown]

Let's talk more about. About creative residency.

[Les]

Yes. For people who don't know, right after I left corporate for 10 years. Loved it. But I was so burnt out. I literally, I think, took off two weeks and then stepped into full time as CEO of CultureCon. And we were off to the races. And I felt like there was so much to do and so much to prove. We did three CultureCons in a year. It was wild. It was wild. We did Atlanta, New York and la. Great. All sold out. And, you know, we finished Atlanta, we finished la. And my body was like, we're good, right? And I had to tell her, oh, sweetie, we actually have our biggest one yet in the fall. And she was like, respectfully, no, no, I'm good. And I knew that I had to kind of change the pace. And so I built a curriculum called creative residency, where I took a 30 day sabbatical, a reset. And it had three different parts. And the whole point was just to come back to the version of myself that was excited, that was inspired, that wanted to build things. And it was really kind of like a scientific experiment, but it worked. And it was inspired by James Baldwin. So when he was feeling so overwhelmed in the 60s, he went off to Paris and then went to the south of France. And so I followed his footsteps and it was just. Yeah, just a life changing experience. And so now creative residencies have become a part of just my routine. And I'm experimenting. Sometimes I go actually before CultureCon to really kind of just get ready. Sometimes I go after CultureCon. Usually I do one a year. I think this year I'm gonna do two. So I'm just planning kind of like my next creative residency. And just like the goal is not to really produce out of creative residency. It's actually just to reset. And I feel like even that is just a reframing of we're not doing this to do more work. We're actually doing this to kind of come back to the person who's, you know, calm and grounded and excited about all that's to come.

[Unknown]

Yeah, I think it's so important for creatives to focus on that recharge time because we can be in production mode all of the time. And I know that's something that I really struggle with. Just the nature of this work is, like, every week there has to be an episode. And finding time to, like, not be producing is really hard. But that ability to just live and unplug and recharge so that you have a creative well to draw from later is, like, cannot overstate the importance.

[Les]

You can't. And again, it's all about pacing. I mean, if you think about the seasons, if you think about athletes, right? Athletes have down season where they're just eating pizza, then they go into conditioning, where they're are revving up, then they're going into, you know, we're getting ready to compete. Then there's the competition, right? So it's seasonality. And I think that's the word that just rings so true is allow yourself to have seasons. Allow yourself to be more than one thing. And when you're in the season of I'm in my conditioning season, you can't then compare yourself to someone who's in their sprinting season. You can applaud the sprinter and say, my sprinting season is coming. We're conditioning right now. So I actually don't even feel anything. Cause I'm running my own race. And so many of these things are cliche. But when you really embody, this is not the season for that, you will set yourself free. And so people will say, imani, I know CultureCon, Culture Con. Culture con. But if it's January, I'm not really on CultureCon season right now. And, like, that has been, like, what'll sustain me.

[Imani]

Absolutely. Okay.

[Unknown]

We need, like, an Imani calendar of.

[Imani]

The season so that we can, like.

[Unknown]

Create our own and emulate.

[Les]

Yeah. You know what? I'm gonna work on that.

[Unknown]

How to do this idea for something.

[Imani]

To put out into the world.

[Unknown]

Imani, thank you so much for joining me.

[Les]

Thank you for having me.

[Unknown]

Like I said when I started, I'm like, every conversation happens exactly when it needs to, exactly how it needs to. And I feel like that is what we really had today.

[Imani]

Can you let the people know where.

[Unknown]

They can find you, where they can.

[Imani]

Support you if they want to come to CultureCon this year? Where they need to go, oh, my.

[Les]

Gosh, on all the channels. We're on CultureCon. And then I met Imani. Imani me on social channels. So, yeah. Say hi, friends.

[Imani]

We'll have all your information linked in the show notes. Thanks for being here.

[Les]

Thanks for having me.

[Imani]

Thank you for tuning in to this week's episode of she's so Lucky. If you're ready to create your own luck, hit that subscribe button wherever you get your podcasts or on YouTube so you don't miss an episode and head to the show. Notes for resources, links and discount codes Codes and if you are really feeling lucky we would appreciate your rating and your review. It really helps us be able to improve the show to get great guests and to understand what you want to hear more of. Thank you for tuning in and I'll see you next week.

[Les]

Join us on May 17th in Los.

[Unknown]

Angeles for the Dear Media Edit, a Live Wellness Experience.

[Les]

A day of curated conversations and immersive.

[Unknown]

Experiences with your favorite Dear Media hosts and leading voices in health and wellness. Explore what it means to truly feel good inside and out. Tickets are on sale [e-mail] events.

[Les]

Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.