Stop Humbling Yourself: Owning Your Confidence with Alexis Barber

Summary

Podcast Title: She's So Lucky
Episode: Stop Humbling Yourself: Owning Your Confidence with Alexis Barber
Release Date: May 6, 2025
Host: Les Alfred
Guest: Alexis Barber

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Introduction

In this empowering episode of She’s So Lucky, host Les Alfred welcomes back Alexis Barber, a dynamic entrepreneur and influencer, who shares her transformative journey over the past few years. Alexis delves into her significant career pivots, the challenges she faced with burnout, and the societal pressures exerted on women in the content creation industry. This conversation is a masterclass in resilience, self-discovery, and owning one’s confidence.

Major Career Pivots

Transitioning from Corporate to Entrepreneurship

Alexis Barber recounts her early career days at Google, where she transitioned into YouTube Shorts—a role she describes as "the best job ever" due to its flexibility between New York and Los Angeles. Her entrepreneurial spirit led her to identify a gap in the market for robes that truly resonated with her, prompting the launch of her own brand, The Robes.

“I really loved it. I got to be between New York and LA, but I've always been an entrepreneur. Doing everything helped me see what I liked.”
— Alexis Barber, 01:36

Launching and Scaling The Robes

Despite the initial success, Alexis faced uncertainties about the future of her robe business while starting business school at Wharton in August 2023. Her influencer career also took off, resulting in book deals and high-profile collaborations, such as working with Selena Gomez’s Rare Beauty.

“After our podcast, all the things I'd been working on sort of came to fruition.”
— Alexis Barber, 03:30

Deciding to Pivot Again

By the summer of 2024, Alexis recognized the unsustainability of juggling multiple careers. She made the difficult decision to take a break from The Robes to focus on her education and personal well-being.

“I need to now pivot and decide what to do next because it's unsustainable to have four careers at once.”
— Alexis Barber, 04:00

Struggles with Burnout and Health

Recognizing Burnout

Alexis openly discusses her battle with burnout, exacerbated by her chronic illness, multiple sclerosis (MS). She describes burnout as losing joy and obsession with previously beloved activities, leading her to question her own productivity and worth.

“I was burnt out, like in the toughest mental spot I've been in for a long time.”
— Alexis Barber, 06:00

Seeking Help and Recovery

With guidance from a business consultant, Michelle Pelizon, Alexis restructured her workload by delegating tasks and eliminating non-essential activities. This strategic overhaul allowed her to regain clarity and prioritize her mental health.

“Michelle Pelizon put me on my burnout protocol. I had to delete, delegate, or defer every single task.”
— Alexis Barber, 27:06

Prioritizing Health

Alexis emphasizes the importance of listening to one’s body. Her MS symptoms served as a critical indicator to reassess her commitments and focus on what truly mattered, reinforcing that health must always come first.

“What really matters? And the health always comes first.”
— Alexis Barber, 36:37

Legitimacy in Content Creation

Facing Gender Bias

Alexis shares poignant stories illustrating the skepticism she faced as a female influencer. During a pitch competition at Wharton, male peers with pre-revenue startups were encouraged to "just be influencers," while her proven business achievements were downplayed.

“They didn’t ask the male influencers why not just be influencers. It’s not just that.”
— Alexis Barber, 11:34

Overcoming Doubts

This experience highlighted the deep-seated biases in the industry, particularly against women. However, observing successful influencers like Mr. Beast helped Alexis affirm the real financial potential of content creation, bolstering her confidence.

“The money in this is so real that I do not care what other people think of me.”
— Alexis Barber, 13:25

Societal Pressures and Relatability

The Pressure to Be Relatable

Alexis delves into the societal expectation for women, especially female influencers, to appear humble and relatable. She contrasts this with the often unchallenged success of male influencers, noting that similar criticisms seldom target them.

“People still question my legitimacy all the time. It’s a matter of being confident in your own career.”
— Alexis Barber, 13:47

Challenging the Narrative

She articulates the frustration of being told to "humble yourself," interpreting it as an attempt to diminish her accomplishments and keep her from advancing further. Alexis emphasizes that striving for authenticity should not equate to seeking external validation.

“Being likable… If I just focus on being likable, it goes to the data point. I would not be who I am.”
— Alexis Barber, 19:40

Embracing Authenticity and Rebranding

Journey to Authenticity

Alexis discusses her ongoing rebranding efforts, shifting away from content driven by external validation to one fueled by genuine passion and creativity. This transition includes her newly published journal, Too Smart for This, which serves as a tool for self-reflection.

“What I wanted people to experience with this journal is the recognition that it's actually all within you.”
— Alexis Barber, 39:17

Focus on Personal Fulfillment

By letting go of The Robes, Alexis found clarity and creativity, allowing her to cultivate meaningful relationships and align her career with her true interests. She now seeks to build a community of creative women and focus on strategy and brand consulting.

“I want to do strategy for you, execute and implement it with you... I just feel very clear on that being what I want to do.”
— Alexis Barber, 45:42

Future Plans and Conclusion

Expanding Her Influence

Looking ahead, Alexis plans to continue writing and sharing her insights through traditional publishing. She aims to provide valuable resources for women navigating the creator economy, emphasizing the importance of self-reflection and authenticity.

“There's not enough black women, young black women… I want to share the tools. It's my favorite thing.”
— Alexis Barber, 43:49

Final Thoughts

Alexis concludes her heartfelt narrative by embracing her authentic self and encouraging other women to do the same. She underscores that true success lies in being genuine and prioritizing one’s well-being over societal expectations.

“We’re gonna have one life. I’m gonna have fun with it. And I am having fun, fun with it.”
— Alexis Barber, 52:02

Key Takeaways

• Self-Reflection is Crucial: Journaling and self-reflection are powerful tools for personal growth and overcoming insecurities.

• Prioritize Health: Listening to one’s physical and mental health is essential for long-term success and happiness.

• Challenge Societal Norms: Women should confidently own their achievements without succumbing to the pressure to appear relatable or humble.

• Embrace Authenticity: Authenticity fosters genuine connections and sustainable success in the content creation industry.

• Continuous Growth: Pivoting and adapting are integral parts of an entrepreneurial journey, allowing for alignment with true passions and goals.

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Notable Quotes:

• “I have to remind myself once in a while... I have to have confidence in my own career.”
  — Alexis Barber, 13:47

• “Being yourself is gonna be what matters most anyway.”
  — Alexis Barber, 51:37

• “The universe was like, girl, you better get in the lab.”
  — Alexis Barber, 39:29

This episode serves as a beacon for women striving to navigate the complexities of entrepreneurship and content creation. Alexis Barber's candid discussions offer invaluable insights into building confidence, overcoming burnout, and staying true to oneself amidst external pressures.

Transcript

[Host]

The following podcast is a Dear Media production. Alexis, welcome back to the show.

[Alexis Barber]

Thank you. Wait. I'm so excited to be back too.

[Co-Host]

I'm excited to have you back because I feel like the last time that you came on, I think it was maybe like, three years ago. I think it was 2022. Yeah, either 2021 or 2022, I think it was. And I think we're both living, like, entirely different lives than we were at that time.

[Alexis Barber]

Ain't that the truth?

[Co-Host]

I think we did, like, a zoom.

[Alexis Barber]

We did zoom. We did zoom last night because the.

[Co-Host]

Show was audio only. I was living in la. You were here in New York.

[Alexis Barber]

Oh, my God, what a time.

[Co-Host]

A lifetime ago.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah. That was crazy.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Alexis Barber]

I'm so shocked, because then I moved to LA for a little bit, too, after that, and then life changed, and then you moved to my house, and then now we're kind of neighbors.

[Co-Host]

People don't know that.

[Alexis Barber]

People don't know that.

[Co-Host]

You're semi responsible for me living in New York.

[Alexis Barber]

Don't you love that? Yeah, it was great. I mean, I wouldn't have wanted anyone else to live there, like, truly, so.

[Co-Host]

Well, I appreciate you lending me your apartment for a little while.

[Alexis Barber]

No, I'm glad we're all around.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

So I want to talk about some of your big pivots. Last time that you were here on the show, you were still working at Google. I think you were about to launch the ropes.

[Alexis Barber]

Yes, I was. I feel like it was, like, summertime. Yes.

[Co-Host]

Like going into the fall.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

Before you were about to launch the robes.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

Let's talk about some of the big pivots that you've made since then and how different life is for you just a few years later.

[Alexis Barber]

Oh, my gosh. So I guess 2022, Alexis was in her third year. I guess, like second or third year working. I had just started working at YouTube, leaving Google. It's the same company, so it's like the same thing. But I was going from marketing to working with YouTube shorts, which was the best job ever. I really loved it. I got to be between New York and la, but I've always been an entrepreneur. I was kind of doing everything, and I feel like that was really good for me in my early 20s of doing everything, so I could see what I liked. So then I had the idea to launch the robes when I was sick with COVID over December 2021, and I was just like, there's no robe that really speaks to me on the market. This thing could be completely redesigned. Like, let me just go for it. And so I did. We launched. I learned so much about running a product based business, about marketing, about really everything in the business world, which was so fun for me. We launched two products after that. And. And I also started business school in August of 2023 at Wharton. And so during that time, I was, like, very unsure about where the robes would go because we had launched a product and people loved it. But I was at school and I was like, I kind of want to enjoy school. What if I just, like, continue this? And then my influencer career kind of took off. I got the most deals I've ever gotten. I got a book deal, which was crazy. And the robes, we were picked up to work with Rare Beauty by Selena Gomez and we were featured on GMA3. So, like a. I guess after our podcast, all the things I'd been working on sort of came to fruition and I broke up with my partner of six years and moved to a new city. So I was like, you know what? What's going on here? And so I just sort of ran with all that. And my first year of business school, I just worked like a dog, to be honest. Kept up with the social life. Everything was going super intensely, but super well. And then in the summer of this past year, 2024, I was like, okay, I need to now pivot and decide what to do next, because it's unsustainable to have four careers at once. What do I really want to do? And so that's what the last year has really been for me, at least the last school year, while also trying to just be a lot more present, like, and enjoy my last year at school.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. And it's not like you had four, like, low pressure, easy careers. It was like multiple, demanding, complex careers happening all at once.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

You did recently share that you have kind of taken a break from the robe business.

[Alexis Barber]

Oh, my God. Yeah.

[Co-Host]

What brought you to that decision? How has that. How has it been? Has it been bittersweet to wind it.

[Host]

Down for a while?

[Alexis Barber]

Oh, my God. So I think this story will hopefully resonate with other female entrepreneurs and consumer entrepreneurs, particularly in the wake of the tariff situation. But I. The robe business was going really well, so it was making six figures. It was a profitable business. We worked with billion dollar brands, and I really enjoyed it. However, when I got into the Wharton startup accelerator, so only seven students get accepted to this accelerator, and I was the only student who came in that wasn't using AI and that was making revenue already. So I got there and these guys were kind of like, you know what, like there's something here, but like, let's dig into it. And when they soon like sort of saw that there is multiple revenue streams and sort of what are the revenue opportunities and what's taking the most time and leading to the most reward. So that's the biggest thing about Wharton that I got there. The reason I think I got into and went to Wharton is because it is a very quant heavy school and I am very insecure or I was very insecure about quant and math and data. And so when I looked at the amount of hours I was spending that would potentially result in me selling X amount of robes if I was spending that same amount of hours on content, the revenue opportunity is infinite compared to the amount of time you spent on selling a fixed product. And so as much as it was doing well and I sort of felt this identity tie to having a product based business. Cause I felt like that legitimized me more. It wasn't the smartest business decision. And I resisted that for the whole accelerator. Like I was like, I'm not gonna let these old white dudes tell me what to do. They don't know what a lifestyle brand is. All they want me to be is AI. But they were right. And I was like, at the end of the day, it was December. I was completely burnt out, like in the toughest mental spot I've been in for a long time. And completely like just sort of tied to this identity of being a product entrepreneur. And I didn't feel like just being a creator or an entrepreneur or a creator economy expert or anything else. I was, was enough. And that's really what the problem was. And so when I got to the bottom of that, I realized I love my products, I love doing this. But in the current economy with the impending tariffs after Trump was elected, that was sort of my final straw because the other option for me was going to be to raise because we had a clear product that worked. And it was obvious that like all I needed was a little bit more money and like ad spend to sort of turn it into the business that I would need it to be. But when we were looking at tariffs and we were looking at the content opportunity, it just didn't make sense to go that route and get investors. And so I was like, you know what, this is, this is tough, but I'm gonna accept that it's time for this to end and something new is coming about. And luckily my book was coming out in that Quarter. And so I got to sort of rest for the first time all my entire business school career. Like having weekends back kind of.

[Co-Host]

The first time for like your adult life?

[Alexis Barber]

For my adult life, absolutely.

[Co-Host]

Before you went to business school, you were still doing basically full time content creation while being in corporate?

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah, my first day Google was the first day I like got like Instagram followers. Like I like I was working the whole time, which is crazy. Yeah. Yeah.

[Host]

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[Co-Host]

I want to talk more about the legitimacy being a content creator because this is something that I think about a lot. Yes, I think that there's a lot of pushback when it comes to content creation being seen as legitimate and even a lot of the conversation that we have around content creators because it is a female dominated industry. I think that if more men were successful at being influencers, people would not talk about influencers as negatively as they do.

[Alexis Barber]

I have two stories I will tell you about this that really encompass it. So first of all, at the end of my first year at Wharton, we had a pitch competition and I wasn't gonna participate in this pitch competition cause I was like I don't really care, I don't need investors. And then one of my professors really encouraged me to do it. So last minute I decided to sign up. And it turns out two other people doing that pitch competition are male influencers who are also in my class. One of which has 2 million followers and is a fitness creator and one of which has about 150k and is a travel creator. And both of them had startup that were pre revenue, just ideas and they were really excellent ideas for sure. And I show up, I have a billion dollar collaboration. I have, you know, Tartra, Perigee, Random House, I have time at Google. I have this revenue that I've already made from selling my product. And the first question I get from an investor is, why not just be an influencer? Like, why do this too? They didn't ask the male influencers that. And so it's not even just that. Like, I feel like they got the opportunity to be an influencer and that's just a distribution channel for them and they can be true businessmen. After that, I was already a true businesswoman. And it's still like, why don't you just shrink yourself a little bit and stick to selling stuff, other people's stuff on the Internet? And so I was like, whoa. Like, this is, this is some deep rooted stuff. And I mean, it took me a little bit to become proud of being just an influencer. And I think I went through that while I was at Google and then later YouTube, because I was working with our top creators at YouTube and seeing how people like Mr. Beast were organizing their businesses. And that's when I was like, you know what? The money in this is so real that I do not care what other people think of me. And so when I got to school and people would be a little bit weird about me being an influencer, I didn't really get it. I was like, well, I make more than you, so the audience gets it. So I mean, exactly.

[Co-Host]

My brand partners get it.

[Alexis Barber]

Exactly. So I was just like, I kind of learned to let that go. But it's not that I don't feel. I mean, people, people still question, you know, my legitimacy all the time. And when the money runs out, then what's really there, you know what I mean? So I think it's like a matter of being confident in your own career. And only this year has that happened. When I was forced to make a resume for the first time and I was like, you know what? I'm really that girl.

[Host]

Absolutely.

[Co-Host]

The credentials are there.

[Alexis Barber]

The credentials are there. I was like, I have to remind myself once in a while.

[Host]

For sure.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. I think about it a lot too. With the conversation around relatability and influencers, which is the latest thing that grinds my gears. Please again. Because I think that the pressure to be relatable is only put on successful women. Nobody looks at a successful man at the top of his game and tells him he needs to be more relatable. Yeah, we do that usually for women in this female dominated industry 100%.

[Alexis Barber]

And I think I've watched this play out many times because, I mean, I've been a consumer of content for a long time and like, I've been on the Internet for about four and a half years now. And so I've seen from the jump though my very first hate comments that I got in the beginning were about me needing to humble myself. And that was for me, like, really hard when you're a 21 or 22 year old. And yeah, I went to Northwestern, yeah, I worked at Google. But like, had I really accomplished anything, you know, that I truly wanted to do? I don't know, like, you know what I mean? Like, when you're building your own adult confidence for the first time, to hear that you should be smaller just because you are already exceptional is a really like, hard thing to grapple with. And I've noticed it time and time again, even when I'm at Wharton surrounded by, you know, the top 1% of earners and these people who come from elite backgrounds, for context, I come from like a very low income, like underprivileged background. And so to be successful and young and around them incites a lot of disdain. And I think doing it in this environment and being able to overcome that and feel a sense of pride in who I am and feel confident in an environment like that, which I didn't feel that way on day one, but I do now at the end of my time there. Now it feels like I can sort of conquer anybody on the Internet because I've done it in real life. And I think a lot of the people who've come become influencers, like during the pandemic, have to go through that. But I've recognized I am not relatable. I'm not trying to be relatable, and I have no interest in relating to you. I hope we get along, I hope we have fun. I hope that you guys can like, enjoy my content. But I don't make content to make you feel, I guess, better about, like necessarily like your exact situation, because no one's lived your exact situation and you have your exact situation and that's great for you. And I've like, really have always been inspired by the creators that I follow or entertained by them at least. And I've never tried to sort of make them more relatable to me. I've always tried to sort of grow and take from them what I the qualities that I enjoy. And so I do understand though, being triggered because that happens when you're insecure and when you're insecure and you don't self reflect, of course you're going to be triggered when somebody's doing well. And if you don't take a second and chill out on that, then you're not going to learn the lesson that the universe is begging you to learn from it.

[Host]

No, it's so true.

[Co-Host]

It's so true. And I think sometimes people conflate relatability with likability, because also sometimes people say, oh, this person is so relatable about somebody. And I'm like, there's no way that you relate to that person. You like them, you like their personality, you like what they put in the world. People will be like, rihanna's so relatable. I'm like, honey, that's a billionaire. Rihanna. You don't relate to Rihanna.

[Host]

You like Rihanna. Yeah, don't we all?

[Co-Host]

We all like her.

[Alexis Barber]

We love her.

[Co-Host]

You can't relate to her. You don't know her ever.

[Alexis Barber]

Because you became a pop star at 17, so you get it. No, you don't. You don't know what that's like. I feel like, like, that is so true because you can like a lot of people on the Internet, but nobody's lived the life in the same way that you have. And also, the second you become a full time influencer, you are not relatable. There's no, like, waking up at 10am and journaling and going to Pilates and doing a podcast episode and doing all your admin. Like, nobody knows the influencer admin. Nobody knows what it's really like to sort of do this. So I feel like, of course you're not relatable. And if you're doing it on top of another job, even that's not relatable, you know, because, like, there's so many other things you could be doing. And so I find it just, it's sort of punishment for being outside of the norm as a woman. And I see this a lot with, like, I'm very curious on our generation of feminism because I feel like we've gotten all of these opportunities at once. And largely we are like, punishing women for going after them in a lot of ways. And a lot of times it's women doing that, which is really, like, disheartening for me. But I do believe, like, at the end of the day, women are mostly concerned about making sure we all get what we want. But when they see someone get what they want that they didn't allow themselves to have or didn't allow themselves to Want. That's when a lot of disdain comes up and the relatability conversation comes up because it's like, oh, you're not relatable, because I couldn't get that. But you're the one who put yourself in the box to say you couldn't. And that's what I have. All I've just seen throughout everybody.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. Yeah. Nobody has a fully 100% relatable experience. Even if I think about good friends that I've had, maybe that I went to high school with or that I went to college with, who I love dearly, who now live entirely, entirely different lives, I don't necessarily relate to them.

[Alexis Barber]

Even, but I want to see the content.

[Co-Host]

Right.

[Alexis Barber]

Like, I still love them and love.

[Co-Host]

What they're doing, but nobody is going to be 100% relatable to anybody. And it just bugs me that it is a piece of feedback that only women get. It really bugs me, for sure.

[Alexis Barber]

I mean, men will never get it. Men never.

[Co-Host]

They're too busy big bro. Ing each other to want one another. Relatable.

[Alexis Barber]

It's insane. If you ever have guy friends and I listen to them and I'm like, they just. If they see a guy doing better than them, they're like, yeah, respect, bro. Like, it's never a matter of, like, oh, he's. He's not cooler anymore because he's too big. It's like. It's just very frustrating. But I get it a lot. I mean, I get the social dynamics of Wharton playing out just because of every. It's like every day there's something new. I'm not likable and I'm not relatable, and I'm not having. I'm not interested in being like either of those things anymore because I'm much more interested in being happy and being myself.

[Co-Host]

It's a trap.

[Alexis Barber]

It's a trap. Oh, my God. Being likable, if I just focus on being likeable, it goes to the data point. Look at the data. What's the data that's going to make me likable? If I followed that, I would not be who I am. I would not be myself. I would not have my essence, which is really what makes me great. Anyway. It would all be gone. So it's like, why would I do that? Like, again, it's literally a trap to keep you small, you know?

[Co-Host]

Yeah. And I do get curious when women, and black women in particular, are told to humble themselves. I'm really curious what it is people who say that want them to do with that information, people who say that, what does that mean? What is it that you want that person to do? Do you want them to not show up? Do you want them to not have wins? Do you want them to not share wins? Do you want them to act like every single thing is, like, something that they don't deserve and to just act undeserving all the time? I get curious. What is it that people want?

[Alexis Barber]

It's that undeserving thing. For me, it's like the projection of the undeservingness. Then for a little bit, that bled into my own perception of what I deserved, because I was like, do I not deserve this? And when I. Do I not deserve? Or I guess, do I even. Am I even gonna allow myself to have this identity of being a smart, beautiful, funny, cool, interesting girl? Like, am I allowed to have everything that comes with that? And I remember on the first day of school or the first week of school, we had to go through this long simulation, and at the end of it, we had to give each other leadership feedback. And someone I had been very forthcoming the first day being like, I have this insecurity where I don't feel like people think I'm smart enough. And I feel, like, really insecure about that. And there was this dude who is, by all intents and purposes, a Wharton finance bro. And he looked at me at the end of that, and he was like, I don't know. What more proof you need? And I feel like we.

[Co-Host]

Oh, he ate that.

[Alexis Barber]

Right? He ate that. And I was, like, sitting there like, whoa, you're so right. Because I have all the proof I need. But it's because of these voices that are telling me I should be humbling myself or I should maybe, you know, show if I am gonna do well, then I need to be, you know, super grateful for it and say, like, oh, I didn't deserve this, or whatever. And so I really realized that it was those voices that were keeping me from looking at, like, the facts that were sitting in front of me. And that was, in turn, keeping me from executing on things I wanted to do, on taking the next step or trusting myself to go to the next level. And so whatever these people want me to do, it's impossible. So, like, all you can really do is sort of look at your own facts and your own perception of what's great. And, I mean, I. I go back to that all the time. It's like, what more. When I'm feeling insecure, it's like, what more proof do I need? Like, I can do it. So.

[Co-Host]

And all of those things can be true at once. You can have gratitude for something. So I think gratitude is important to have. You can have gratitude and still feel like you deserve something or recognize what was earned. And I also think a lot of people may think if they see particularly a confident woman who is like, hey, I'm in my worth, I know that I deserve this, that that automatically means that someone else doesn't. When the truth is like, for the most secure people, you're like, everybody deserves it. I want it for everybody.

[Alexis Barber]

Oh my God. That's what I think I realized when I was secure, is that everybody deserves this. Because I've never, I think I've never naturally felt competitive towards people because I. I don't know why, but the world will teach you to be competitive as a woman, you know. And so I realized through a series of like your own self reflection, you kind of realize if a girl's bothering you too much because you want what she has, you have to reflect. You don't know, you have to sit, self reflect. And if she's really bothering you, you gotta unfollow her. You gotta like, take yourself out of that because you know it's you at the end of the day. I've always known any competition or frustration I felt with someone else is a projection of me not believing I deserve it. Because everybody can have everything you want. You know what I mean? Especially. Cause no one actually all wants the same thing, right? Nobody has the same dreams. And I thought for a long time I'd be like, oh, well, everybody wants a million followers on Instagram. So like, I can't want it because there's only like, what, what two spots? And I'm like, there's only a few spots in the world that that's allowed. And it's like, then I got to like YouTube the first day and we were. There was a list of 2,000 people who had over 4 million followers on TikTok. And I hadn't heard of any of them. And I was like, oh, there's thousands of people in this world who are doing what I want to do. Not only that, but not everybody wants a million followers on Instagram either. And so like, you have to remind yourself that whatever you want, it's because it wants you back. It's not because it's like random or anything, but so we can all have what we want. I feel like the competition has never, never crossed my mind lately, really. Which I'm so grateful for. Cause I don't have time for that burden.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. And I feel like when you're so worried about what other people are doing, that's when you can't be in your lane on your secret sauce.

[Alexis Barber]

You can't. And I even realized this with being distracted. Like, generally you cannot focus on yourself and have a happy life and have an intentional life if you are focused on what the random boy on hinge is doing, what your friend is doing, what your like sister is doing. Like any, any of those big distractions, whether it's like disdain or not. You can't focus if you're like too worried about what other people are doing.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Alexis Barber]

Ugh. I hate that I have to learn that lesson every 20 minutes.

[Co-Host]

Don't we all?

[Alexis Barber]

Don't we all? It's crazy. Yeah.

[Host]

So I've been a Nuuly subscriber for years now, and not to be dramatic, but every month when my Nuuly box shows up, it kind of feels like Christmas. Just something about opening it up and seeing the pieces I picked out. Styles that maybe don't need a permanent spot in my closet but that I'm excited to wear for the month. That just makes my day. If you're not familiar, Nuuly is a subscription clothing rental service. For $98 a month you can rent six items from their closet of literally thousands of pieces. Everything from vintage finds and premium denim to fun statement looks and everyday favorites. And they've got amazing brands like Free People Ago, a Goldie Farm Rio and more. And they make it so easy. Free shipping and returns, no laundry. Bless. And if you fall in love with something, you can buy it at a discount. For me, Nuuly has been an incredible addition as I've been on my style journey because I get to play with different pieces, try new trends, silhouettes or colors that I wouldn't normally go for, and then I can send them back guilt free. It helps me stay excited about getting dressed without constantly buying more stuff or dealing with closet overload. It's also way more sustainable than constantly buying new clothes. No plastic packaging, they use eco friendly laundry practices and they repair pieces instead of tossing them. Plus the sizing is inclusive. They have everything up to 5x petite sizes and maternity. Nuuly is a great value at $98 a month for any six styles. But right now you can get $28 off your first month of Nuuly when you sign up with the code balanced less. Just go to n U-U-L-Y.com that's a Nuuly with two U's and enter the code balance less and sign up to get 28 off your first month. That's N U-U-L-Y.com nuuly with two U's with code balanced less newly subscription clothing rental. Change your clothes.

[Co-Host]

I want to go back to talking about burnout because you did mention having experienced some burnout before you decided to, like, sunset the road business. For now. How did you know that you were burned out? Were there any kind of specific things that you were feeling, where you were, maybe like, okay, this is like next level burnout as opposed to maybe like, like normal levels of overwhelm that we probably operate at?

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

And what has helped you start healing from that?

[Alexis Barber]

Great, great question. I feel like burnout is really hard to admit to yourself when you're really going through it, because oftentimes it's losing an a true happiness and obsession with something that you once were really connected to. So it's hard to admit to yourself because you're calling yourself lazy or inconsistent for a while because you're not showing up the way you did once for that you really cared about. And so that was hard for me to recognize because for the first semester of my second year, so the time when I was in the Wharton startup accelerator and, you know, in my second year of business school and everything's getting a lot of opportunities and stuff. The problem was I had too many opportunities, which was great, but that did not. I did not feel happy for months. I didn't feel called to do it. It was a chore every day. Editing everything was a chore every day. I did not want to do anything that I was doing. I was not creatively inspired whatsoever. And it's not because I didn't love those things. It was simply because my nervous system wasn't okay. And so I didn't realize I was burnt out. I really just thought I was lazy and had no structure until I got a business consultant. Michelle Pelizon.

[Co-Host]

We love Michelle. We love Michelle at holisticism. I think you put me onto holisticism.

[Alexis Barber]

I think so. Back in the day, girl. I'm a holisticism Stan. She runs my life mentally. And I talked to her and she was. I was like, yeah, I need, like, a new structure for my business. And she was like, everything you're telling me you don't sound well. And I'm put you on my burnout protocol. So I wasn't allowed to consume nonfiction stuff for a while, which was so good for me because I was really deep in my self help podcast, Andrew Huberman Bag. And so I couldn't do that for a little bit. And I had to delete and delegate or defer every single task that was in my business. So she made me write everything out that I did on a daily or weekly basis for my business, for school, for. For content. And I had to delete, delegate, or defer all of it. And so what I learned is that I don't ask for help enough. Why am I doing customer service? Like, why was I doing that when, like, we were processing all these orders every day and like, But I felt very connected to, like, wanting to make sure the customer experience was perfect. So, like, I was deep in doing that or why. Why am I shouldn't be involved in, like, I don't have to be involved in like podcast editing, you know what I mean? And so there's like tons of things that, like, I needed to let go of from a perfectionist standpoint. There was also a ton of things that didn't really matter, like going back to that data point, what's really driving value in the business. It's not a lot of these other things that I'm spending time on, you know, and it could be these other things. So getting clear and just writing everything out was really helpful. And also, again, taking away that nonfiction or consuming, like, way too much content, it's bad for you because you're trying to. And I mean, I'm getting excellent business education every day from my literal business education that I'm going to. I don't need to listen to 12 podcasts and books on top of that. I was overwhelmed. So I recognized it because somebody told me to answer your question because they were like, ma'am, you're not well. But what I want you to think about is if this is something that genuinely, like, excited your soul at one point and now you can't pick yourself up to even look at it, there's something there that you have to explore. And a lot of times it is burnout because. Because I've always known I meant to be a content creator. I love content. Like, I have a unique skill set for this. It doesn't mean I don't want to do it. It just meant that the systems, I didn't have enough help and I didn't have enough time to do it the way that was most, you know, uniquely beautiful for myself.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, that totally makes sense. And for even getting help, that outsider's perspective can be so helpful because when you're so deep in it, sometimes you Just can't even see which direction to go. You can't. It's like so hard to see what's broken when you're always in it.

[Alexis Barber]

Exactly. And I think for people who are operating businesses that are, you know, operationally heavy, for me it was like, I'm looking at numbers, I'm looking at Shopify, I'm looking at our conversion rate. And it's like, I'm not the best at that. Like, that shouldn't be where my energy is. It should have been somewhere else. And I was too afraid to sort of hire for that early on because I wanted like excess control over my business and which in turn, you know, burnt me out. But I mean, I do believe that all of that sort of happened for a reason. Because I have learned so much about business. Like, I could create a business plan for a product based business. I could take two collective to a million tomorrow if I wanted to. Because I know so much about it and I feel so confident in that experience that I did it. I made every mistake I made, especially down to the burnout, because I needed to learn that for the next thing. Because love the robe business and I love product so much. There's certainly product in my future. It doesn't have to be right now though. I'm so okay with that. But also in the future, I'm still so passionate about it and I get to have all this knowledge and skillset related to it too. So your mistakes. Yes. They suck, girl. In the moment. Cause you're like looking at a PO. It's like 10K and you're like, oh my God, I can't do this. But I am really grateful that I've learned from so much of it. Yeah.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. And it's such a good reminder that you don't have to do everything right now.

[Alexis Barber]

No. And I really, you know, Les, you know how that's how, you know that's how I was?

[Host]

Yes.

[Alexis Barber]

Like back in the day, I was like, I have to do everything yesterday.

[Co-Host]

Yes, yes.

[Alexis Barber]

And that's because I'm an Aries rising.

[Host]

You're in triple fire, aren't you?

[Alexis Barber]

Triple fire? Yeah. SAG stellium. I'm getting. Okay. Why am I getting my Saturn return at 26? Apparently Saturn's coming into Aries this summer.

[Co-Host]

Oh, it is?

[Host]

Yeah. You'll get it over with.

[Alexis Barber]

I'm not excited about it. I was like, I'm gonna graduate school. I'm finally gonna have some freedom and now I'm gonna have to learn some lessons.

[Co-Host]

Yeah, you'll be Fine though.

[Host]

You'll be fine.

[D]

Yeah.

[Alexis Barber]

So I feel like, like I've always been, like, I have to do it all right now. Something that's really helped me with that is letting go, which is hard, which is so hard. But when I let go of the robes, having like this past semester, I've just felt so much clearer. I felt more creative like you were talking about with your rebrand. I felt more like able to enjoy my relationships, which is something that I was, I think a lot of people say, oh, I want to be an entrepreneur so I can have flexibility, freedom and, and be with the people that I love the most.

[Co-Host]

I have something to tell you.

[Alexis Barber]

Exactly.

[Host]

Bad news for you.

[Alexis Barber]

Bad news for you. Unfortunately, that doesn't take place. And so I was not there for the people I loved. I was sacrificed. I was using my business so that I wasn't using it necessarily, but like it was a great excuse to not show up for people. And it was a great excuse, you know, to not show up for myself. When people would ask me, what do you really care about? I'm like, my friends, my relationships, like traveling, my family. Like one day I wanna be a mom and have a ton of kids. Like these things that I was saying to people weren't adding up with where my hours were. And so that was humiliating. But you learn it, you learn it. And then it's like once you let go of the things and you start to see what really matters, then you can start to craft a career around what really matters instead of, you know, doing it all at once. But I'm happy I did it all at once. Cause I like learned, but. But not for my mental health and my cortisol levels.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Alexis Barber]

You know, for sure.

[Co-Host]

And it takes a toll on your health. And I also know something that you've talked about and been really open about in your content is like having Ms.

[Alexis Barber]

Yes.

[Co-Host]

And also like doing all of this while living with a chronic illness. And I'm sure burnout doesn't help that at all.

[Alexis Barber]

Ms. Is a stress related disease. Yeah, by all means. And so I, I think I got it when I was one of the most. I was got it when I was 15 and that was when of the most stressful years of my life because I had skipped a grade. I was applying to colleges, I was like doing the sat, all of that. And like that year is when my first symptoms arose. So I've kept my Ms. Pretty much under control. But in the summer of last year, I don't think I've really talked about this publicly. But I was signed up to run this leadership program at Wharton, where for three weeks, you're basically a TA for the class and you are bringing in the new class of Wharton. And so for three weeks, it would be a pretty intense time. And I was really excited about it because my leadership fellows who I had interacted with had been really instrumental to my experience. So I had done all the training and everything like that. And some of my Ms. Symptoms started to crawl back up in summer of last year. So the question. And that's around when I was working with Michelle and like, the burnout was really prevalent. And I got into this accelerator and I was like, I don't know what to do here. And the thing is, your health will always tell you what you have to do. And the first thing I had to give up and prioritize was this program. And that was very hard for me because I had to prioritize because of my health, because I hadn't been prioritizing my health in the past. And it reminded me, of course, what's important and everything like that. But I don't want to discount how frustrating it is. It's so frustrating to live with an illness. It's so frustrating to not have the same free will everybody else has and to, you know, have to think about it. And I think that's why I hated it so much from my childhood. But at the same time, it's real. And I'm very grateful that I have a meter like that on my health that will tell me, you know, you know what? It's too much right now. And if I hadn't had that, then I wouldn't get to a point where I'm able to prioritize better. And so. So that's been the greatest lesson of the past few years, is like, what really matters? And the health always comes first.

[Co-Host]

Absolutely.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Co-Host]

So important.

[Alexis Barber]

Truly.

[Co-Host]

Yeah.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah. I'm very lucky to be in a great place with my ms, though. But it's taken a while.

[Co-Host]

That's like the best news.

[Alexis Barber]

Thank you. Yeah. We're living.

[Co-Host]

Yes.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Host]

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[D]

Hi, I'm Lisa Rinna.

[E]

And I'm Harry Hamlin.

[D]

You may know me from Days of Our Lives, Melrose Place, Real Housewives of Bear, Beverly Hills.

[E]

Yeah, I've been around for a while. Clash of the Titans, Louisiana Law.

[D]

That's right. But there's a lot more to us than what you've seen on screen. Let me tell you.

[E]

We've been together for over 30 years.

[D]

We have some crazy stories to tell and on this podcast, we're gonna own it, baby.

[E]

We'll talk about everything from love to sex to pop culture to juicy behind the scenes stories we've never told before. You can listen to new episodes of our podcast, let's Not Talk about the Husband every Friday.

[D]

Follow the show wherever you get your podcast so you don't miss a thing.

[Co-Host]

Also, want to talk about the book?

[Alexis Barber]

Oh my God.

[Co-Host]

Because you just came out with a published journal, which is really exciting. Can you walk us through the process of what made you decide to go the traditional publishing route and then tell us more about the journal?

[Alexis Barber]

Oh my God, guys, here's the thing about my early 20s again. I was just doing it all, you know, so. Okay, I'm going to take you on a tangent. So. So when I was in college I was similar where I was like, I don't know what I really want to do. So I'm going to try everything. And after I got in the Google internship, you could apply for deferred enrollment MBA programs where you would apply as A senior in college, if you got in, you would have three to five years to do whatever your career you were going to do and then get an mba. And so I built in a sort of like risk taking ability into my early 20s by applying to and getting into Wharton because I knew between three and five years later, like I could just go to Wharton. And even if I completely failed in my early career, I could go and I could, you know, change my, the course of my career if I wanted to. Will I change the course of my career? I don't know. We'll find out in the next three weeks. But basically I said yes to a lot. I pivoted a lot in the beginning. And so I was never on my list though to write a journal or to write. I started my podcast Too Smart for this and one of my listeners was a book agent and she mentioned, she heard me mention something about maybe creating a journal, but I looked into the margins and self doing. It wasn't really like, didn't really make sense for me. So I went with the robes instead. And she was like, well, I'm a publisher, maybe we could do this together. And it was a very laissez faire thing for me where I was like, you know what? Sure girl, you know what? Hell yeah, I'll send you a book proposal. And it turned out to really resonate especially. And I think, I think the reason the Too Smart for this Journal really resonates with people is because you know deep down that you are better than your circumstances a lot of the time. And it can be very difficult to pinpoint what exactly the quote is or the book is or the lifestyle changes that you need to change to get your external reality to reflect how you see yourself. And until you open that door, most of the time you're still going to be upset and looking for it outside of yourself. And what I really wanted people to experience with this journal is the recognition that it's actually all within you. And if you sit down and talk about it with yourself and if you self reflect, then you're not losing the millions of dollars that you could be making if you actually believed in yourself and you're not losing that valuable time with your friends that is actually more important to you than and whatever else you're focusing on. And so I felt like since it was so necessary for especially like the women in the publishing world who are probably feeling a similar way, it just sort of made total sense. And I'm really happy with how it all aligned in a very serendipitous way. The traditional publishing route happened to be more helpful for me than the self publishing route because it wasn't my main career. It was more so something that was supplementing the audience that I already have.

[Host]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which makes total sense.

[Alexis Barber]

It was great.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

And you've also talked a lot about journaling and how journaling has been a really helpful tool. And so it's great that you're able.

[Alexis Barber]

To share that with other people, truly, because people. Okay, I get to Wharton. You know, I'm around a lot of people who are a little older than me. The average class age is 28 and I'm 26. And you can tell who's never journaled or had a self reflective moment in their life because it comes out in their insecurities. When you are someone who has self reflected and journaled, or not even just journaled, but sat with themselves, which is sort of what the goal of journaling is. You can clock it in other people when they are moving from an insecure place. It doesn't mean that you have to forgive them for everything they do or have empathy, complete empathy for them, but it does mean that you can see why they're acting the way they are and wish healing for them. You know what I mean? And so I feel like that's why journaling being the most accessible and probably the most helpful thing for me is why I really wanted to like to bring this to people. And someone asked me at my first book signing, they were like, can men use this? Like, is it just for women? Or whatever? And I was like, get men. Stick to the first section. The like childhood. Why am I here? Cause I'm like, y'all never think about that. Start there, start there. You know what I mean? Cause a lot of women get to the dreaming phase. But what I think is unique about the journal is more like the handbook for handling your own life and. But the men, you guys need to start in the beginning. Yeah, yeah.

[Co-Host]

But we love sharing the tools.

[Host]

They need the tools.

[Alexis Barber]

I love sharing the tools. It's my favorite thing.

[Host]

Absolutely.

[Co-Host]

Do you see more writing and more books in your future?

[Alexis Barber]

Truly? Yes. You talk about rebranding, you just successfully rebranded. So beautiful. I'm in the middle of a rebrand currently because I recognized I talked a lot in my sort of past content about, you know, doing things for external validation and working at Google, realizing like I didn't like that so much. So becoming an influencer. But then I realized like a lot of the things I was doing as an influencer I don't like doing that. I don't enjoy that either. And you can make great money from things. It doesn't mean that that has to be your passion. And so I sort of got to this place in the last year where it's like, what do I enjoy doing? What brings me creative fulfillment? What do I want to do? And that has taken a really long time for me to answer that question, especially because there's a lot of external noise and expectations for what you should or shouldn't be doing. And I found that even though it was never in my intention to be a writer in this traditional publishing way, when I was little, the first thing I said I wanted to be when I grew up was an author. That's what I wanted to be as a child. It sort of recircled and found me again. And so writing, I think the universe was like, girl, you better get in the lab. So, absolutely, I'm sort of transitioning, I think my whole career to be more focused on subset and more focused on brand consulting and on creator economy insights and consumer insights. So that's what I'm in the middle of, transitioning my podcast, slash substack to Smart for this into. And that actually brings me joy. And I don't care that I don't have a single idea how I'm going to make exactly the money from it or the data or whatever. I just feel very clear on that being what I want to do.

[Co-Host]

I love that so much. I think that one that's very needed as somebody who is in the industry, who likes learning about business, who wants those insights. It's very needed.

[Alexis Barber]

So needed. There's not enough. And there's. I was like, there's not enough black women. There's not enough young black women. There's not enough people who have seen. I've seen every side of the creator and sort of consumer economy, from being a scout at a VC firm, to being an MBA student, to running a business, to being a creator, to working in marketing at a platform like, I did not sort of take seriously my experience across those industries. And I also didn't recognize I'm a nerd. I don't want to just be, you know, posting my little outfit of the day every single day, which I do and I do enjoy because I do love to serve a look. But that, to me, cannot. That's not gonna fulfill me long term. It could fulfill somebody else, and I would never judge them for that. But. But I am a nerd. I want to do strategy for You, I want to execute and implement it with you. And I want to have a community of really incredible creative women that I'm around all the time. And I want to build things and see them come to fruition and change my mind and travel and do all these things. And just because I was doing well in X amount of careers before me doesn't mean that I can't still make that happen for myself just because I was good at this. So I should stick with it. Girl, everything's always evolving, so I'm just going to do that.

[Host]

It's true, it's true.

[Co-Host]

I mean it's. We can always pivot, we can always do something else. I also think with where we are right now as a society and when it comes to business, there's a lot of really good opportunity there because I do think unfortunately with the tariffs and with everything that's happening, it will likely disproportionately impact women owned and also black woman owned product businesses.

[Alexis Barber]

I mean like I said, that's sort of why I didn't raise because I was like, I mean that's that I had a perfect pitch deck revenue business like that could be my career right now and having to let go of that identity is tough but it is strictly because of economic policy that I'm not there. You know what I mean? So this is my response to that and I'm so lucky that it's a good one. But I mean I don't want anyone to feel bad for the terrible people running this country being the reason that your business has to shut down. No.

[Co-Host]

And I think so many people are gonna pivot and probably move into the digital space and continue focusing digital platforms while all of this hopefully gets ironed out and let us pray, isn't forever and then we will get to a point where it is practical and affordable to develop and create products again. But I think that as time shift we as innovators shift and I think we're going to see more and more people kind of switching to more digital platforms 100%.

[Alexis Barber]

We absolutely are. And it's already changing too. Because something I noticed when I was start like building shorts out at YouTube is it was more sort of basic content even then. Now I think people are tired. I mean we saw the NYC influencer discourse and everything. Like people are tired of just the consumerism of it all. I think people are more interested in people with a point of view with an intellectual strike or something like that. And that's something that, I mean that's what I care about as a consumer. And that's what I want to provide as a creator as well. And I think I didn't realize my own point of view of view was so important. Other people are going to recognize that their point of view is so important too, because it's not, you know, just one thing you can really do so much with the way the digital economy has been scaling.

[Co-Host]

Yeah. And I think it's also changed a lot from earlier days in content. I mean, I've been creating content for 10 years.

[Alexis Barber]

So long.

[Co-Host]

And 10 years ago it was like you kind of had to have a shtick. You had to have a very specific niche. You would have a handle or a blog with like a cutesy name. There wasn't really a personal brand because you were hiding behind whatever it is you did. Were you a makeup, makeup girl? Were you a fashion girl? Were you a wellness post? The smoothie bowl girl? And it was very siloed versus now the ways that people engage with creators and want to see creators. They want to know who you are. They don't want a cutesy handle. They want to know what your name is. They want to know what you're about. They want to know what your opinion is on things. And I think having the personal brand piece.

[Alexis Barber]

Yes.

[Co-Host]

Is more important than it's ever been.

[Alexis Barber]

100 and I'll be the first to say I haven't been good at that because I feel that. I feel people tell me when they meet me in real life that my personality is way better than what there is online, which I would prefer for it to be that way than the other way around. But I do think that I got so scared of showing my personality because a lot of times as black women, self deprecation and sharing your insecurities can be used against you. And I found operating in, you know, these very elite and mostly white spaces that that happens a lot, particularly when you threaten the people who are in the room. And so I've sort of shrunk myself online for a lot of it because I've been like, I don't want this to sort of, you know, I don't want people to think I'm not cool or I don't want people to sort of cringe or whatever. And I, I guess, like, I sort of lost that after a while. I was like, I mean, in the past couple of months, honestly, I've just been like, why would I care? I think it was part of turning 25 and then 26. It's like, why would I care about that because being yourself is gonna be what matters most anyway. And most people who judge you for doing anything would never take a risk on themselves anyway. But with all that said, I don't feel like my personality came through as much because self deprecation as a black woman is a dangerous game to play. And I felt like I had to do that in order to be humble enough for people to still like me instead of embracing, you know what? I'm a great person. I'm really smart, I'm really fun. And I'm going to share that with you from a place of genuinely wanting to share and love myself instead of from a place of, oh, I just want to be palatable so that I can get enough views, that I can get enough brand deals, that I can stay in this game. Because that will work for a little bit, and it did for me. But what's going. What the next phase of this is? Can I just share myself authentically? That'll still work too, as long as I believe in myself. Authentic.

[Host]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

And I think the more of us that share authentically are bold, own what we're doing, own who we are, People are gonna have no choice but to accept it and get with the program.

[Alexis Barber]

Get with the program.

[Co-Host]

If we all show up that way, they're gonna have to get with it.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Co-Host]

And I think it just. It's a win, win for everybody.

[Alexis Barber]

Totally. And I'm so glad I'm strong enough to do it now. Cause I wasn't when I was 21 starting on Instagram, but now I'm like, you know what, girl? I'm good.

[Co-Host]

You got one life.

[Alexis Barber]

We're gonna have one life. I'm gonna have fun with it. And I am having fun, fun with it.

[Co-Host]

Good.

[Alexis Barber]

Yeah.

[Host]

I'm so happy to hear that. Thank you, Alexis, thank you so much for coming back on the show.

[Alexis Barber]

I had so much fun. Thank you for having me.

[Host]

Let the people know where they can.

[Co-Host]

Find you and how they can keep in touch everywhere.

[Alexis Barber]

Alexis Barber. My substack and podcast is Too Smart for this. You can find the Too Smart for this journal everywhere available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble. Check your local places. Everybody needs it. Get it for your friend, your brother, your sister, your aunt, your uncle, everybody. I'm like, it's so fun. And you can DM me with anything because I love to chat.

[Host]

Amazing. And we'll make sure all of your information is linked in the show notes.

[Alexis Barber]

Yay. Thank you so much.

[Host]

Thank you.

[Co-Host]

Please note that this episode may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products and services. Individuals on the show may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to in this episode.