Pilot Pt. 2

Summary

Sidebar: A Suits Watch Podcast – Episode Summary: Pilot Pt. 2

Hosts: Patrick J. Adams & Sarah Rafferty
Release Date: October 1, 2024

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Introduction

In the second installment of their inaugural episode titled "Pilot Pt. 2," Patrick J. Adams and Sarah Rafferty delve deep into the foundational moments of the hit TV show Suits. As both the actors portraying Mike Ross and Donna Paulsen, respectively, Patrick and Sarah offer a unique blend of on-set experiences, character insights, and behind-the-scenes anecdotes that enrich the listener's understanding of the show’s genesis.

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Episode Overview

[01:14 – 02:52]
Patrick begins by summarizing the pilot's second part, emphasizing the transition from the introductory scenes into the core legal drama that defines Suits. He outlines the main plot points, including Mike Ross’s integration into Pearson Hardman, his interactions with key characters like Lewis Litt, Donna Paulsen, Rachel Zane, and Jessica Pearson, and the pivotal pro bono case involving a single mother facing sexual harassment.

Notable Quote:
Patrick J. Adams: "First and foremost, the thing that powers your business is power. And when it comes to power, Ford Pro has options. Now scratch that. We've got every option. Diesel, gas, hybrid, all electric. Plus they're all connected, so you're always in the driver's seat. The power is yours." ([00:48])

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Character Introductions and Development

[02:17 – 10:08]

• Mike Ross (Patrick J. Adams): Patrick reflects on embodying Mike Ross, drawing parallels to Michael J. Fox’s iconic portrayals. He discusses the challenge of portraying a lawyer without formal legal training, emphasizing the authenticity brought by showing Mike’s genuine uncertainty and growth.

  Notable Quote:
  Patrick J. Adams: "I felt like I was doing this... Mike has no idea what he's doing." ([04:17])

• Donna Paulsen (Sarah Rafferty): Sarah shares her initial apprehensions about playing Donna, a character deeply intertwined with the show’s dynamics. She highlights the ease and chemistry she shares with Patrick, attributing it to their prior acquaintance.

  Notable Quote:
  Sarah Rafferty: "We had an easygoing thing when we went into that room. It was clear that she was going to get the part from the minute we did the chemistry read." ([10:54])

• Other Characters: The hosts discuss the introduction of Lewis Litt, Rachel Zane, and Jessica Pearson, providing insights into their first appearances and the relationships that begin to form.

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Key Scenes Discussed

1. Mike’s First Day at Pearson Hardman

[08:34 – 10:08]
The hosts dissect the iconic scene where Mike walks into the law firm, capturing his awe and nervousness. They discuss the meticulous set design, particularly the ever-changing firm sign, and Mike’s first interactions with members of the team.

2. Harvey's Office Conflict

[12:26 – 16:00]
A significant portion is dedicated to Harvey losing his promotional title and the ensuing confrontation with Jessica Pearson. Patrick lauds Gabriel Macht’s portrayal of Harvey, especially in scenes where Harvey showcases vulnerability beneath his authoritative facade.

Notable Quote:
Patrick J. Adams: "This sequence is just perfection. It's so funny... Harvey is realizing that he's lost his promotion." ([13:06])

3. Donna and Harvey’s Relationship Dynamics

[28:36 – 33:43]
The hosts explore the evolving relationship between Donna and Harvey, highlighting key moments that set the tone for their complex interactions. They emphasize Donna’s indispensable role and the subtle power dynamics at play.

4. Mike’s Struggles and Triumphs

[38:12 – 55:59]
Patrick and Sarah delve into Mike’s internal conflicts, including his anxiety over the drug test and his strategic maneuvers in handling the pro bono case. They highlight poignant scenes that showcase Mike’s ethical dilemmas and his partnership with Harvey.

Notable Quote:
Sarah Rafferty: "All that matters is they bury them in paperwork. And that we need to learn that Mike can move through paperwork really fast and efficiently." ([33:18])

5. Costume and Wardrobe Insights

[48:28 – 54:02]
A detailed discussion on how wardrobe choices reflect character development, particularly focusing on Donna’s transformation through her attire. Sarah explains how clothing acts as a tool for Donna’s empowerment, while Patrick shares his personal journey with suiting up as Mike.

Notable Quote:
Sarah Rafferty: "My favorite piece of this wardrobe is Mike's helmet." ([44:27])

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Behind-the-Scenes Insights

[04:10 – 44:56]

• Acting Challenges: Patrick discusses the difficulty of portraying a character like Mike without legal knowledge, and how he relied on instinct rather than extensive preparation.

  Notable Quote:
  Patrick J. Adams: "I don't know a thing about law. I'll speak for myself... you just can't." ([04:17])

• Directorial Choices: The hosts praise Kevin Bray’s direction, particularly the one-shot scenes that capture the essence of character interactions without interruption.

• Casting Stories: Sarah recounts her audition experience with Rachel Zane and the immediate chemistry that secured her role. Patrick shares anecdotes about co-stars from The Sopranos appearing in Suits, enhancing the show's rich casting tapestry.

  Notable Quote:
  Sarah Rafferty: "We could never do that again because of the time constraints of Suits. Every little second had to come out." ([13:39])

• Prop and Set Design: Insights into how the set deck team meticulously crafted authentic legal environments, using real books and thoughtfully designed office spaces to enhance realism.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

1. Patrick on Michael J. Fox Influence:
   "This is like every Michael J. Fox moment... he was such a foundational influence." ([06:11])

2. Sarah on Character Transformation:
   "I felt transformed. I felt like a different person." ([51:00])

3. Patrick on Costume Discrepancies:
   "I did some weird song. It was me singing... I change it because I have no idea how I'm gonna do this." ([39:29])

4. Donna’s Confidence Through Wardrobe:
   "It's a tool. As Donna's clothes got more and more elevated, it shifted the way she walked." ([49:39])

5. Mike’s Ethical Struggle:
   "Harvey wants to win, but Mike needs to do the right thing." ([55:59])

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Personal Experiences of Hosts

Throughout the episode, Patrick and Sarah intertwine their personal journeys with their characters:

• Patrick's Wardrobe Struggles: He candidly shares his discomfort with suiting up, likening it to donning his father's clothes and battling with self-confidence.

  Notable Quote:
  Patrick J. Adams: "I did not feel like I was relaying nervous actor vibe who doesn't know what he's doing." ([38:28])

• Sarah’s Transformation Through Costume: Sarah describes how dressing as Donna empowered her, allowing her to embody a more confident and competent persona.

  Notable Quote:
  Sarah Rafferty: "When I was putting those clothes on, it wasn't Sarah, it was Donna." ([51:50])

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Conclusion

Patrick and Sarah successfully navigate the intricacies of Suits Pilot Pt. 2, offering listeners a comprehensive breakdown that marries plot analysis with personal reflections. Their discussions not only highlight the show’s strengths in character development and storytelling but also provide an intimate look into the actors’ experiences portraying iconic roles. As they wrap up, they express excitement for future episodes, promising deeper dives, guest interviews, and more behind-the-scenes revelations.

Final Thoughts:
Patrick J. Adams: "We are so excited to continue to do this. We're going to have guests... I can’t wait to keep being in the room with you." ([57:33])

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Want to Engage?

Patrick and Sarah invite listeners to contribute their questions and thoughts:

• Email: sidebarpodcasteriousm.com
• Audio Clips: Send your recordings to be featured on the show.

Join Patrick and Sarah as they continue to explore Suits, offering fresh perspectives and insider knowledge that both fans and newcomers will find invaluable.

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This summary captures the essence of Pilot Pt. 2 of the Sidebar: A Suits Watch Podcast, highlighting key discussions, notable quotes, and the hosts' personal insights, while omitting advertisements and non-content segments per the podcast’s content guidelines.

Transcript

[Sarah Rafferty]

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[Patrick J. Adams]

First and foremost, the thing that powers your business is power. And when it comes to power, Ford Pro has options. Now scratch that. We've got every option. Diesel, gas, hybrid, all electric. Plus they're all connected, so you're always in the driver's seat. The power is yours.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Visit fordpro.com today to learn more.

[Patrick J. Adams]

All right, let's get started. Hi there, my name is Sarah Rafferty.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I am Patrick J. Adams. J for jovial.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Let'S get serious. Hi, I'm Patrick J. Adams. I played Mike Ross on Suits.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I'm Sarah Rafferty and I play Donna Paulson on Suits. And you are listening to Sidebar a Suits Watch podcast.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sarah, I have two words for you today. Ooh, absolutely beautiful. Categorically stunning.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Stunning. That's what you are in that green really hot sweater.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Ladies and gentlemen, Sara Rafferty. How are you today?

[Sarah Rafferty]

We're going to do that every day, right?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Find a quote and we're going to compliment me. We're going to compliment you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, I don't care about the quotes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I do that every day.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Anyway, what are we doing?

[Patrick J. Adams]

What are we here to do today? Well, we are doing the second episode of what we are calling our Suits Watch podcast because this is actually the first time that you and are watching Suits in its entirety. And obviously today in this episode, we're gonna be discussing part two of the Suits pilot. We broke it into two pieces because it was an epic 81 minute journey.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And because the first part, the first 30 minutes felt like the perfect prologue.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sure.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It felt like it was a 30 minute scene that introduced us to the world that Mike is Leaving and the one he is diving into. And it was so beautifully done.

[Patrick J. Adams]

In this second part of the episode, I think we really lock into what the show is, which is a legal show. And we get into the case of the week. Especially as Aaron mentioned, this was really procedural in the first season. So we get to see our team diving into their first case. Should we just do it?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. Can you tell us what this part of the episode's about? Give us a little. Some. Some.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sure. Let's call it. We're calling the brief right now. Cause that's a creative legal pun. I'll give you the brief. We're still season one, episode one. This episode title is Pilot. It was initially aired on June 23, 2011. Directed by none other than Kevin Bray, written by Aaron Koresh. Our DP was Jim Deneau, who I think is an important mention, created the vibe of the show. In this part of the episode, Mike starts work at Pearson Hardman, where he meets Lewis Litt, a petulant yet sharp junior partner, Donna Paulson, Harvey's charming, quick witted secretary, and Rachel Zane, a talented, beautiful paralegal with a chip on her shoulder. And then of course, Jessica Pearson, the powerful, no nonsense senior partner who is also Harvey's mentor. Harvey pawns off to Mike a pro bono case to help a single mother in a sexual harassment suit. With the help of Rachel, Mike uncovers an essential witness who the opposition eventually bullies into silence. Harvey galvanizes a frustrated Mike and uncovers the witness tampering scheme from their opposition, winning the case for the single mother. Harvey and Mike are now a proven winning combination.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Dynamic duo.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Bromance, bromance, bromance. So before we dive in, you have any opening statements about this episode?

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, sir. No. You don't have anything to say?

[Patrick J. Adams]

You don't have anything to talk about?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Remember, I did not play a lawyer on the show. You know, people in the real world ask me if I learned anything about law.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I don't know a thing about law. I'll speak for myself. But I felt like I was doing this. I was just like, am I winning or losing this scene? Are we winning or losing? And I'm embarrassed to admit that I wish I was the kind of actor that was like rolling up my sleeves with every detail. But honestly, you just can't.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I have to tell you, I had a sneaky, mean feeling a little bit. No, it wasn't mean at all.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You can be mean.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But no, while I was on the show, I was secretly like. Like, thank God.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'M not a lawyer. And I thought when we got here that I was gonna be able to just have you explain all the law to me.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, no, no. We are gonna have to figure it out together. That's gonna be a part of the show, is figuring out what on earth is actually going on.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There was some bad karma, though, with my super happy, quietly to myself that I didn't have any law stuff, which was that the first job that I got after we finished doing suits was to play a transplant surgeon.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'm about to go off and play an FBI agent right now, and there's a lot of. It's just all jargon.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Wait, what's your outfit? Go.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's an 80s FBI agent.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, come on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'm a little nervous because men's hair in the 80s, unless you were, like, a rock star, was not cool.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Wait, who says this guy isn't also a rock star?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love your attitude.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Did you pitch that?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love your attitude. One thing that occurred to me watching this, that I just wanted to say from the beginning, was I didn't understand how much my performance as Mike Ross was basically just ripping off Michael J. Fox. I mean, I was a Michael J. Fox fan as a kid growing up in the 80s. We all were. But, like, the way that I'm bouncing around the firm and, like, always tripping into a scene and, like, dropping files and just, like, this fish out of water thing, it was not intentional, But I'm watching it and thinking, oh, my God, this is like every Michael J. Fox. I think specifically the movie I'm thinking of is the Secret of My Success is that the one where he, like, gets a job at someone's firm. He's literally working at, like, a firm, and he's having to make it up and pretend he knows what he's doing. I think I might have just ripped it off, all of that, because every scene I'm just, like, falling into running after someone, trying to figure out where I'm supposed to go.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Is there a better actor to be an homage to? I don't think so.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I think, again, like, it was. He was such a foundational for me as, you know, as a young kid in the 80s, he was one of the first people that made me realize, like, oh, you can be an actor. So it makes sense that, you know, not only would I try and emulate him in general, but that I would do it with this sort of first big giant role. And it fits perfectly. He's such a fish out of water. And I feel like Michael J. Fox excelled at that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I have one other thing to say, and maybe this is the place to bring it up. I have a theory.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Ooh.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I have a theory that Suits is a predecessor to another very popular show. Do you know what show I'm thinking of? Do you know what show I'm thinking of?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I have no idea of where you're going.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think that Suits walked so that Succession could run. I love Succession, as we all do. Obsession. An amazing show. Let me run you through the things that we have in common. Dagmar. She was in Succession. She was in Suits. Rob Yang. Do you know who Rob Yang was in our show?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Tell me more.

[Patrick J. Adams]

The doctor in this episode where he's giving Mike the drug test. Where else is Rob Yang?

[Sarah Rafferty]

That was a great scene. Gosh. He's in Succession.

[Patrick J. Adams]

He's the pilot of Succession. He's the guy who owns the tech company that Kendall Roy's trying to buy. Right from the beginning, we have Kevin Bray.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yep.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Who directed many episodes. Directed our pilot, and was the producing director of two seasons of our show. Directed countless episodes. You know, arguably responsible for the look and vibe of the whole thing. He also directed many episodes of Succession. And then just in general the. Of the show, it's in New York. We're dealing with New York power brokers, people moving and shaking at the highest levels of New York society. So I, you know, this is going to be a running theme for me, but I do believe that there is some connection between Suits and Succession.

[Sarah Rafferty]

They were sitting in a radically different place than we were at the Golden Globes, though.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, well, they, you know, they got to be the grown up. We're a bit of the PG version.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, listen, Gina and I were having a little bit of an illicit, quiet conversation about my sanctioned crush on. No, listen, everybody's married. Everybody's married.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Cousin Greg.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So this is. Well, no, I'm happy to start one on Cousin Greg. That's fine.

[Patrick J. Adams]

This is all for our Succession pod. I realize we're going to do a completely different succession pod. It's going to run concurrently.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But wait, since you were asking me about my crush. My crush. It rhymes with McMaty.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Why don't we get into our show, though?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Suits, I m ready. Are we diving right in?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Let me walk us through it. First, we begin Mike's first day at Pearson Hardman. That epic shot. We talked a bit about it last time. It's one of our first great needle drops of the show. Airborne toxic event changing as Mike Ross comes out from the subway he's on his way into the lobby of Pearson Hardman that we see for the very first time. Well, no, no, no. It's not the first time. We've seen it with Harvey before.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, did we see the sign?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I don't know if we saw it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We just need to acknowledge how many times that sign is going to change in the years ahead.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's the first of many. But we get to see Mike walk into the lobby. He has a great. I actually love that interaction with the secretary. Again, just foundational. Mike has no idea where he's going or what he's supposed to do or what direction.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I think it's autobiographical a little bit. With Aaron, he talked about how everybody in the investment banking world was afraid of the executive assistance. I'm sure that there was always that vibe and that he experienced that.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And like I talked about, you know, I just kept embracing this whole process for myself as an actor and the way that I embraced the audition, which was like, you know what, just give me this job. I'll just do a good job. I will work as hard as I can. But then as soon as I got there, I got to just be afraid of everything. And I didn't have to pretend I was not afraid of everything. I got to, you know, show up to set every day and be like, don't pretend you're not nervous. I don't have to try and be cooler or more together or no. Because Mike has no idea what he's doing.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I had to try to be something that I was.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Cause you had. It was your world.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But I have to say, she waves you away. And I think she was a redhead, by the way, hat tip to her. She waves you away and then you go and you see the window. And your response to seeing the window.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Which is very real. I mean, when I first, before we started shooting, I remember getting up there, I did that same thing which was just walk up to that window and be like, oh my God, this view. I've never been to New York a lot, but I guess I haven't been to buildings with that view before. I guess I was quite top of the CN Tower. Yeah. But in New York it's different. You get to see like Central park and it's New York, you know, it's New York. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But I felt like there was a four year old boy that kind of tipped his body, his upper body towards the window and like Ferris Wheeler walked.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Over like, what is this? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's so endearing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Of course, this is the scene where we meet one of our most important main characters, Rachel Zane, comes up behind Mike and introduces herself. And we get to see the beginning of that relationship, which.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Before we dive into that scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

When did you meet M3gan? Oh.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So Megan and I had done a pilot before, a terrible, terrible pilot together. I won't even say the name of it, but you can IMDb it. There was a setting up of a romantic relationship in the pilot of that particular pilot too. And then we never saw each other again. The pilot failed. It was terrible, and went away. And so we had never seen each other nor spoken to each other again. And then I saw her at the call. But I was in there because I was the first to be cast for this show. So when I went in to do the chemistry reads with Rachel, she was right there and she said hi. And I went, oh, my God, so good to see you. And so I think our just knowing each other and getting to, like, calm down and not have those nerves of just getting to know one another really helped that chemistry read. And it was just clear that we had an easygoing thing when we went into that room. And it was pretty clear, if I remember correctly, that she was going to get the part from the minute we did the chemistry read. It was just so much easier than it was with anybody else.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Was the scene this scene?

[Patrick J. Adams]

It was this scene. And the next one where she walks Mike through the whole office.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yes. Yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's a bear of an audition scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's a big one. And she crushed it. She crushed it and she crushes it in the show. So here we meet them. One of my favorite lines in the show, maybe in the whole series, I love you. Whispered as she walks away.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That is a very popular meme, right? I love you.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, I love you. Yes. And in general, I just love that scene. I think it's a really strong beginning for her character. I just love her. What is her first line? I forget what she says. I just think it really, like, gives her some ownership of the space. So it's a good beginning of that relationship.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So this next scene, I know that this is absolutely a favorite of both of ours, and we've got to talk about it. Harvey walks back to the office to see his new title being scraped off of his office door. And we meet Teddy Kaluca playing the janitor.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Unbelievable.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We're going to go back and we're going to watch everything. And there's like 75 titles on his IMDb page.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Well, you can tell. Cause the man is a professional. It is such a good scene. Everything about it, the writing, which I looked at the script, and it is word for word that what was written there is no improvising. And Gabriel's really good in it, too. It's this, like, one scene where this very powerful Harvey Specter almost looks like a little boy.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's so great. And I think what it does is it also sets up kind of this. What I've been calling, like, these codes, these, like, suits codes, these things that we'll return to, these things that make suits. Suits. And it is Kevin Bray, our director. It was one of his oners where.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It'S just, yeah, yeah, we never.

[Sarah Rafferty]

One shot. And all that is happening because you get to stay on everybody's face the whole time. And you got both of them in frame, and then the stuff that's happening behind them. And then Donna pops in, and she's off. But they always win from there.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Obviously, Harvey is realizing that he's lost his promotion, so he goes back to Jessica's office, which begins with just a classic suitsism. It's in this whole sequence, which is. This sequence is, again, Kevin Bray, Aaron Korsh, brilliance. The him walking into Jessica's office. Jessica telling him that he's gotta pull it together. He comes in to fire Mike. Mike puts him in his place. He goes back to Jessica's office. Jessica says, you gotta take this pro bono if you want me to trust you. Don't you dare pawn it off on someone. Folder flies through the air into my hands. It's pawned off on me. And we're away at the races. That sequence, just so well directed and so tight from beginning to end.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay, so when Harvey first enters Jessica's office, she's. Did you notice this? She's working with this huge legal book.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So that's the thing, what we've all done on suits, which is like, what can I be doing? Because sometimes we're just sitting at a desk, and it's like, I've done this a few times. Maybe I could be up on my feet. Maybe I could be doing this and this. And we do have these, like, ornate legal books.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And sometimes Kevin Bray would say, grab that book behind you and, like, put it back. Or whatever. The.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It'd be great to know if it was a Kevin Bray or it was a Jeffrey.

[Sarah Rafferty]

The great thing is that it was a real book. I mean, I've gone to grab something, and it was like, a shoebox painted like a book.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But it always begs the question, is, like, what Is the head of the firm looking for in the giant leather bound book? I need to know. I need to know what?

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I do want to say, because we had such amazing set deck people and such amazing props people, so they put in such an effort to make our props as real as they could possibly be. Somebody who worked in one of those design departments was like, I'm so glad I got that big box of big law books so that somebody at some.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Point will open it. Sometimes you'll open that stuff, and it won't actually be a law book either. It'll be some other thing. You'll, like, go thumbing through it, and it's actually like gibberish.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I have to tell you a story. I'm just thinking of this just now. Is that when Donna finally gets an office, which I don't think is a terrible spoiler. I remember when they were designing my office, and when I finally went in there and kind of knocked around, I was actually so moved by everything that the props in the set deck department had decided would be, like, on my shelves in this space. And how thoughtful it was and sweet. I mean, I think there were books of sonnets.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. I feel like your office and Louis Litt's office. Louis had a lot of good Easter eggs in that office, too. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I did walk out with, like, one or two little things. Like, I still have the birds that were on her desk.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We'll inform the authorities on.

[Sarah Rafferty]

They were $5. They still have their price tag on them. We're fine.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Anyway, I just think this sequence, like I said, is just perfection. I think it's really funny. I think it's great to watch Mike outsmart Harvey to be like, okay, you're gonna fire me? That's not great. But also, if you do that, I'm gonna make your life miserable. And then Harvey kind of respect that and take that power move back to Jessica, and then he tries to pull the same thing with her, and she goes to the window and has that look like we're getting into the position where setting up that, like, these people can do some serious maneuvering, and it just makes each one of them respect each other more.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. So then is there a scene where you guys talk about suits?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh. He hands me the pro bono, and.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I say, don't say it. Can we play that?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Easy, Clarence Thomas. Just go meet the client. Hey, didn't I tell you to get some better suits? I spent $500. For how many suits? Five. What?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Exhibit A.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait a minute.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You are funny.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait, what is The. No, no. This is legitimately. My ego won't let it happen. What is the thing that I did that's funniest in that scene to you? Like, what do you think is funny?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay, which.

[Patrick J. Adams]

The part. Break it down for me, because I think you are a comic genius, and I want to learn from you. So you tell me what's funny about that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Goodness, no.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I need this reinforcement because I want to continue trying to be an actor in the world, and I need to know what works and what doesn't work. So I'm happy to hear that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Timing and look, you can't necessarily. Yes, there's techniques to get the timing right, and there are coaches who can help us with those things, but that's an instinct for timing and truthfulness. Hang on. Bunny is grounded in. I'm speaking.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, no, no. I appreciate this. I'm taking it. What I'm asking you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You are a dog who is looking away. I am making you look me in the eye.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You cannot keep looking away.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'm owning it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Here we are. I'm owning it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You can learn the technique of funny, but that's also the instinct. I am not the boss of funny. I don't know a lot, but I know that that made me laugh and that that is just sheer timing, and it's rooted in character work. It was perfect.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Here's what I think may be a good part of what we can get out of this is helping each other through the moments.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love you so much.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Wait, wait. Let's do it. I love you.

[Patrick J. Adams]

This show is sponsored by BetterHelp. Sarah, you know, we're going into the holidays, and there's no more important time to talk about gratitude.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Look, I was so grateful last week when I was struggling with being away. We were both away on set, and we had a nice phone call, and you helped me get reconnected with my gratitude.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. I think it's so important in my life to practice gratitude as much as possible, because sometimes life can get pretty heavy, and it's the quickest way out of that slump. That's why we're so happy that the show is sponsored by BetterHelp. You know, this month is all about gratitude. And, you know, what I want to say to you, Sarah, is thank you. It's been such a pleasure getting to do this with you. And I know we've talked a lot about mental health, but it's really helpful with us both away, shooting away from our families to have someone to talk to through it. So I want to say thank you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, thank you, Patrick. I'm so grateful for you too, as you know.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But there is one other person that we don't thank enough, and that is ourselves. Sometimes it's hard to remind ourselves that we're trying our best to make sense out of everything. And in this crazy world, well, that's just not that easy. So here's a reminder to all of you to send some thanks to the people in your life, including yourself. And if you're thinking of starting therapy, please give BetterHelp a try. It's entirely online, designed to be convenient, flexible, and suited to your schedule. Just fill out a brief questionnaire to get matched with a licensed therapist and switch therapists anytime for no additional charge.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Let the gratitude flow with BetterHelp. Visit betterhelp.comsidebarshow today to get 10% off your first month. That's BetterHelp H E L P.com Sidebarshow uncover one of history's greatest mysteries in Indiana Jones and the Great Circle, a first person single player adventure video game set between the events of Raiders of the Lost Ark and the Last Crusade. The year is 1937.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sinister forces are scouring the globe for.

[Sarah Rafferty]

The secret to an ancient power connected.

[Patrick J. Adams]

To the Great Circle. And only one person can stop them.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Indiana Jones Adventure calls Indiana Jones and.

[Patrick J. Adams]

The Great Circle releases on December 9th.

[Sarah Rafferty]

On Xbox Series X&S Game Pass and PC Pre Order Indiana Jones and the Great circle now. Rated T14. Copyright and trademark 2024 Lucasfilm Ltd. All rights reserved. We've all got a thing. For me, it's vintage furniture. And now talking about how I found.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It on ebay is like my whole personality.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Even at 2am when I can't get.

[Patrick J. Adams]

19Th century sofas off my mind, I'm.

[Sarah Rafferty]

On ebay for sure.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Scrolling my favorite seller's storefront, setting search.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Alerts, and building the watch list of my literal dreams.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I know antique lamps aren't everybody's thing.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But the best part about ebay is it doesn't matter what you're into. Fashion, car parts, trading cards. It's all there. So go find the thing that keeps.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You up at night.

[Sarah Rafferty]

EBay. Things people love.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Were we all good on mine?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yours isn't on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We're not recording any of my audio. All right, welcome back from the break. We are moving into Act 2 of Part 2. We pick up with Mike meeting his first client, Nancy the incredible Dagmar Dominczik, who was just amazing in this episode. How lucky were we to have her so incredible?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I remember being floored by her the first time I watched her.

[Patrick J. Adams]

She's amazing. She's so good. So Mike meets Nancy in the park. We learn about the case. We learn about what's happened to her and pulled on Mike's heartstrings. And he obviously wants to help and make sure that Charles Hunt is punished for what he's done. We cut to the hot dog stand. An important moment in suits history. The stand goes on to play an important role in the show. It's something, I think, that we talked about calling maybe standards and Practices, something that is introduced in an episode and goes on to sort of live through the fabric of the show, which a hot dog cart or a bagel cart or some sort of baked good cart or coffee cart does from time to time.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And Harvey says, I'm not about caring. I'm about winning.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Definitely laying some important suits pipe there.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's like a code.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yep. But you know what? Mike's gonna teach him to care. I think we'll see. Also, one of my favorite moments from the pilot, when Mike goes to reach for a lock on his bike. What are you doing? Don't touch that. As if the idea of touching a bicycle in New York City is so unfathomably disgusting. It's just great. And then that great moment that we found where Mike yanks on the lock. Anyway, so from there, we get upstairs into the building, we follow Harvey and Mike, and we meet for the first real time. We've met Donna, but this is a good. Yeah, we get some more time with Donna. Yeah, Donna's unfolding in this episode in a different way, like we talked about last time. And, you know, people were unsure. The creators were unsure to what degree Donna was gonna play a role in the show right from the beginning. And so for all the main characters in this pilot, she's probably more on the fringe, would you say? Is that fair?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Of course. Of course. Yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But in a weird way. And we can talk more about it, and maybe you'll hate it, because maybe I don't know how you actually feel about it emotionally, but I think it actually is, like, an amazing thing to set up Donna. It's like that scene we'll talk about where he says, like, I'm going to get fired because they're going to find out that you didn't really go to Harvard. And she goes, what? And you don't even see you. In a perfect world, we'd see you and follow your experience. But the setup that, like, you're just there. You are always there, and you Hear everything and, you know, everything. It actually kind of, like, does a service to the character moving forward. It's like a. It's a weird establishment and one that maybe. I'm not sure you're, like, totally happy with or would have been happy with in the moment. But I think it, like, creates a mystique around Donna.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There was plenty in the script to do all the backstory on. There were plenty of hints to be like, why is this an absolute in their relationship? Or an absolute in her character and figure that out and who they were to each other.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You're left wanting more with all the characters in this show, but with Donna specifically, you're really left wanting more. And I think that's a cool place to start a show with.

[Sarah Rafferty]

This whole scene that we are seeing was one that was supposed to be through an intercom, so she wasn't supposed to be there.

[Patrick J. Adams]

All the handing off of the card and the. He's handing the paperwork, and you're giving him things to sign and you're giving. You mean all this sequence?

[Sarah Rafferty]

No. So I wasn't supposed to be there. But I think Kevin and Gabriel decided that I would be there. And I was there that day. Right. Just even, like, letting us have some of the little buttons. They stayed in.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And one of them was. That was harsh. That was a little harsh. Which is a weird button.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I wanna get into that. Cause it's a very weird moment to me. I like it, but it's like, everybody has been so harsh on this show. And then he says this thing about the skinny tie, and it's like we've suddenly crossed a line. And I'm not sure about what line we crossed.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It was his tone for being like, you're a reflection of. And you gotta be this. And da, da, da, da.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, okay. Just being hard on him.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But I also think it was about saying to Harvey, kind of get over yourself. You know, that you see really immediately that she's a little bit like, oh, come on. Was that totally necessary? That was a little harsh.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Right, right, right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And what was great was Gabriel's response.

[Patrick J. Adams]

As Harvey, which he kind of takes it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He loved it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. Like he listens to you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, that he was like, okay, cool. I'm so glad I was harsh.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, that's how you took it. I read it a little bit like he. Yes. Like, I enjoyed it. But I'm also hearing you. If anyone else had called me out, I would just be like, nah, nevermind. But because you said it, it's actually gonna make me Think for a minute.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, okay. So that's interesting. That's what's so fun about things, is that everybody has a different interpretation. But I linked it back to when he said, do I look like a pimp in this suit?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I didn't have a response in the script, but I said, yeah, a little bit.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Right? Yeah, yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And his response was, same kind of thing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Psyched, nice. He was, all right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I look like a pimp.

[Patrick J. Adams]

All right. So from there, we go into a small room at a law firm, Lewis and Mike. And we get to watch Lewis fire an associate in front of Mike.

[Sarah Rafferty]

This was my favorite scene, Patrick, hands down.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think we're in agreement. I think this is just such magic, I think. Well, first of all, like, you know, we haven't really gotten into Rick Hoffman yet. I think Rick Hoffman might be one of my favorite actors in the world. And it's precisely for some of the things that he does in this scene. So many actors would want to luxuriate in the horrible dickishness of any given situation. And he can just go against an idea and he can play something so simply, and it makes it so much more scary and vile and terrifying and threatening. From the minute I remember shooting this scene and I remember sitting across from this guy and being like, I think he might be a genius. And I'm legitimately terrified of him.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay. Yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Terrified of his genius. Terrified. Like, I gotta keep up with this guy.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He is so joyful and so relaxed in how he oozes through it. And he reminded me of Alan Rickman. And I can't.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes, yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Pay. I cannot pay a higher compliment.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I can't.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, it's true.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It doesn't go above that. And I have to say that Rick is so relaxed and taking his time in this episode, in the whole episode, in the whole thing. He just kind of got his hands in his pockets and, you know, walks out like, oh, hey, Mike, come with me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So calm, and there's something simmering.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But it's so fun. And so we love him right away. And what was great about it being in this pilot was those first few seconds that you guys are sitting at the table looking at each other. I watched it several times. I didn't count how many seconds it was, but we could never do that again because of the time constraints of suits. Every little second had to come out. Every extra second had to come out of those transitions. But you sat there quietly. So can you take me back?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I mean, what you're seeing is Legitimately. What's happening? I'm like, how is this, man? But you were tickled, this performance. Well, I also loved the Gary Lipski. You'll see my favorite moment for me in the scene is that little wink. Just that little, like, I'm sorry, dude. I'm sorry, but okay. It was nice to meet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love that moment. All right, then we are at the firm's elevators, and we have Harvey and Jessica, and we get a first huge fashion moment of the show. Jessica dressed to impress. She's going out for the night, and Harvey is obviously impressed. I don't know the first thing about fashion, but I know she looks like a billion dollars.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I really wonder if that was the seed that was planted to make the show become the fashion show that it was. And look, the whole episode, I did notice the clothes and that they were different than what the clothes became.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Just so people know, when you shoot a pilot, too, like, you only have a limited amount of money, and, you know, you're not buying Tom Ford suits. You're having to make do with, you know, what you can to try and make sure that your show works before people are willing to spend that kind of money on things. So it's a different vibe.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

The next morning, we're at Donna's desk. Kidonna and Harvey. Donna once again anticipates and meets Harvey's needs. That's one of my favorite lines in the episode, is the you just completing a sentence. We were married. Oh, yeah. We were actually married seven years ago.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We've been married for the last seven years.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's great. Great. Genius. Again, you do so much with not a lot in this episode. You just build that relationship so much between the two of you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Thank you.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Was that all scripted? Like, that's all scripted. How much of that was?

[Sarah Rafferty]

That was all scripted. But I do think. I feel like I remember people asking us about in press, like, asking about the Donna Harvey relationship. And I do think that they saw that Gabriel and I are really comfortable with each other and had known each other for a long time and eventually sort of wrote more towards that. But I do think some of that was there in the pilot maybe, and that's what helped Donna to continue on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Again, feeding into the theme I think we kept discussing here, like, your comfortability with Gabriel, too, just makes scenes like that, where you're just playing off each other that much easier to find. You don't have a lot of time when you're shooting a pilot. You have, like, three takes tops to, like, get a Scene. And if you're two people that are, like, just getting to know each other, then it's just harder to find that kind of rhythm that's really funny and easy and, like, oh, we both know what the scene is. Let's go. And I think a place like this is a perfect example of how you guys just, like, fly off each other. It's instant. So from there, we're into Harvey's office. Harvey and Mike are discussing the sexual harassment case. We're walking down the hall. I think that's a walk and talk, if I remember right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That is a walk and talk.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But we've got a lot of these.

[Sarah Rafferty]

This walk and talk I really liked because it had my favorite line, which was not a line.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What's that? Oh, there we go.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Can we roll the audio, please?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, my bad. I keep forgetting you don't actually know anything.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Could we turn that into my ringtone, please?

[Patrick J. Adams]

You know what's funny? I think I might have this part because of that moment. I don't know why, but I'm remembering we had the interview scene in the audition, and we had this scene in the audition, I think. And I remember, like, one of the biggest laughs I got was that fake laugh. I remember. I think Aaron got such a kick out of it. So I don't know if I'm remembering that wrong, but I have a feeling it played a big part in me getting to play this role. So, yes, I appreciate that. Call out. I can recognize that. I think that's funny. That makes me laugh. I can find. It's hard to say, but I can find that funny. Mike rushes back to Rachel, another run up and says he needs help. He learns that Rachel has an office. He's jealous. And then we get this kind of great sequence between Rachel and Mike where they're studying together, trying to figure out, now this is where I need to track the legal stuff, right?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, I'm out. I'm on the floor.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, but it's important.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, I'm laying face.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, no, no, but it's important. It's important. It's important. We have a woman. She has been sexually harassed. She was told that if you don't sleep. No, no, no, no. Just please. Charles Hunt. It says, if you don't sleep with me, then you're gonna be fired. She says, I'm not gonna sleep with you. She is fired. Right now she needs help. They wanna subpoena all the records of the women have left in the hopes that they might find another woman who's gone through what? This woman's gone through a sort of corroborating witness or somebody else who's.

[Sarah Rafferty]

See, you are clarifying it for me. That's great.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay, so that's what's happening.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

There's gonna be a hearing the next day because they're gonna fight me on giving us these records. And so I rushed to Rachel to say, you gotta help me. I don't know what to do at this hearing in order to get these records correct. That's where we're at. I'm rushing up to Rachel now if we're gonna jump a little bit ahead.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That turned into you guys having edited.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But it's good for us to know contextually what's also happening in the case.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And this is your job.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What it all gets to. And I'm gonna jump ahead. But at the hearing, we obviously win because Mike and Harvey win. And then Mike finds a thousand boxes in his office. Right. Remember that moment where they're gonna drown you in paperwork? Classic suits moment.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay, so the hearing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Go to the hearing.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And that hearing I did. All I cared about. I'm gonna tell you. What I was told to focus on from my little brain was that judge and his bailiff. And the really interesting cry performance from the guy who played the judge.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sure.

[Sarah Rafferty]

About his bailiff. Like, I thought it was really funny and watched it a few times.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's so good.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I watched it so many times.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Literally, I had to watch this, like, 25 times. Cause I do what you do. I just wanna focus on the relationships. But I had to be like, what is happening in this case? Because sometimes you arrive at a moment where you go, huh? Wait a minute. And this is the moment I'm getting to when I get to the thousand boxes in which they're burying me in paperwork. That means that all those boxes are the subpoena documents referring to the women who have left the firm under potentially mysterious circumstances. Which means hundreds of thousands of women have left this firm under mysterious circumstances.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It can't be.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Well, what are those boxes? What matters? Like, my little brain says, all that matters is they bury them in paperwork. Like, that's the point. And that we need learn that Mike can move through paperwork really fast and efficiently.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And he likes cheese in his crust.

[Patrick J. Adams]

He loves cheese in his crust.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And that Rachel is an equal dynamo.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And she understands research and she teaches sushi, but she can't take tests. And you know who can?

[Sarah Rafferty]

That guy.

[Patrick J. Adams]

That guy.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Where are we?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think we can jump back to Harvey and his investigator, Vanessa.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, Julianne. Emery.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Julianne Emery.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That was a great scene. You just want to lean in. Every time the camera's on her, she crushes it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I think it really establishes our Harvey's relationship with women. Powerful women that kind of don't want him, but also don't want to totally not want him. But she's fantastic in that scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I just want to say your eyebrows got jaunty in a way that I've never seen them jaunt before.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Really?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Look, I'm excited. Most importantly, we get through this case with the hearing, we get all the files, Our guys are on their way. Mike gets to experience his first big win in court, which we see. He's very excited. Mike and Harvey are on their way to the next stage of trying to make sure this pro bono comes out. In their way, they have a good godfather back and forth along the way. Yep, our guys are winning. How long are they going to win for?

[Sarah Rafferty]

How long can they be winning?

[Patrick J. Adams]

We'll find out after this break. Building a business may feel like a big jump, but on deck, small business.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Loans can help keep you afloat.

[Patrick J. Adams]

With lines of credit up to $100,000 and term loans up to 250,000, OnDeck lets you choose the loan that's right for your business. As a top rated online small business.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Lender, Ondeck's team of loan advisors can.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Help you find the right business loan to fit your needs. Visit ondeck.com for more information. Depending on certain loan attributes, your business.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Loan may be issued by Ondeck or Celtic Bank.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Ondeck does not lend in North Dakota.

[Sarah Rafferty]

All loans and amounts subject to lender approval.

[Patrick J. Adams]

First and foremost, the thing that powers your business is power. And when it comes to power, Ford Pro has options. Now, scratch that. We've got every option. Diesel, gas, hybrid, and all electric. Plus they're all connected, so you're always in the driver's seat. The power is yours.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Visit FordPro.com today to learn more.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay, welcome back. We are at a very important scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'm really excited to talk about.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I know you're excited about to talk about this scene. I'll tell you what it is. It's Mike walks into the suit shop, which callback to when you saw the business card before. I forgot to mention. Do you know what the name of the suit shop is?

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, I do not.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Deno Bray.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, there we go.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We saw it on the business card when Harvey or you handed me the suit business card. Jim Deneau, Kevin Bray, DP and director of the episode Easter Egg.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So I really wanna talk about this scene for two reasons. One is I'm very excited because my classmate from drama school, Mark Dold, plays Renee, the Taylor.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And was that just a coincidence or did you have something to do with him?

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, I did not have anything to do with him being there. He's just a fantastic actor.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And it was so fun to shoot that scene. He was so great. He was one of those people that just, like, knew it right off the bat. He got.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He was my first roommate in New York. Oh, no way. We were in School for three. There were only 16 people in our class. So we were all very, very close.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Conservatory program.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. You know what that means.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I know how close that is. He was fantastic. And I think the scene is hilarious. I think he's so good. What's his first line? Sorry, we don't sell skinny jeans at this location.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Perfect.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Perfect.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But let's talk about this scene. I think this might be a scene that hasn't aged well. Would you agree?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes. This was a thing for me too. Maybe the measuring of the ins. Well, the handing of a glass of booze and the inseam and the large joke. I was a little cringed by it. But again, we're always going to run into this show and I always have to. I'm always like, well, that doesn't feel like it ages well. But then I'm also like, this is a show about these kinds of people. There's something about seeing Mike in that world and him sort of like, kind of taken with it, but then he didn't go with it. That's like, kind of useful to see him, like, trying to like, can I be this kind of guy? No, it's not very comfortable for me. I want to get out of here. And he leaves the suit shop. There's something useful to that. But I felt. I did feel the same way you did that. As soon as we had this sort of inseam measuring moment and watching her walk away, I felt a little weird.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. I think we could have stayed on you watching her walk away rather than, like, followed.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, yeah. Of course. Another great needle drop. Heading into this was something we're calling the Greenback Boogie Award until we find a better name for it. Oxford comma by Vampire Weekend.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So Mike gets out of the suit shop. Cause it's not for him. And we get a few scenes with Mike's former best friend, Trevor. The takeaway. Mike is still holding onto the weed from the first half of the pilot. Maybe it's his backup plan. And also Trevor's girlfriend, Jenny, seems like she might be a little bit into Mike. Then Mike goes into research mode and learns that someone is missing. From the mountains of paperwork Charles Hunt sent over, Mike tracks down this person. It's Joanna Webster, played by the lovely Kristen Bush.

[Patrick J. Adams]

A fun fact about this scene. I think it was the first scene I shot of suits.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, really?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. I pulled up the one liner, which I can't believe I still have in my email from a legal mind. Pilot shoot. And my first day on set was this scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Wow.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And were you in Brooklyn? Were you in Queens?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Good question. I think we were in Manhattan. I think it was somewhere in Manhattan, but I don't remember. All a bit of a blur at that point. I was happy to watch it and not feel like it was the first scene that I shot. Do you know what I mean? When I realized that I was like. Was kind of, like, really looking for scared, nervous actor vibe. Like, oh, God, he doesn't know what he was doing. And I was happy to. I didn't feel like I was relaying nervous actor vibe who doesn't know what he's doing. Not in any moment. There's not much for Mike to do in this scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Well, and then it gets real fun because you get to go back to report to Harvey your success, Right?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Mike brags to Harvey about being a good lawyer. Right.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's one of those beautiful nighttime scenes that Aaron was talking about last time. The office. It's just so beautiful. And at night. It was always my favorite time to shoot scenes in there. Even when we moved onto a set. Yeah. And I'm coming into the episode, and this is funny. I did read the script. In the script, this scene is different. I do some weird song. It was me singing. And now I can realize why I changed it. Cause I was like, I have no idea how I'm gonna do this. It says Mike sings a little song. Testify. Testify. I got her to testify.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, wow. Okay.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And as an actor, I don't know how I would do that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Did you try it now? Let's try it now.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, Come on. No, no, no.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Testify.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Put that on our social media. We'll have me try and do it. I literally couldn't do it last night. I was with Troyan watching the episode.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I was like, testify, Testify.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. Testify. Testify. So that's why it changed. It also changed. Not just in that way, though. It changed in that I walk in in the script and I'm like, like, I did it. I got her to testify. And in this we do a fun. Like, I trick him at first.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We call that a mislead.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I throw him off track, and I make him believe that I failed. And then I actually dropped the bomb that I got her to testify by showing her that I cared for her. Cue the guns. Gun slinging. So we got the guns. But not only that. Mike is on his way out of the office when yet again, Jessica in another wicked. That power suit. She's wearing a power suit in this one. It's like the opposite of the dress. I don't know why. Again, I know nothing about fashion, so I'll just.

[Sarah Rafferty]

She looks amazing in everything.

[Patrick J. Adams]

In everything.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But what's interesting is that you're like, oh, I loved that suit. And I got it. Thank you.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Is it the worst? It's not a thing.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We went so far.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think it's just seeing her in a suit because I feel like Jessica wore dresses forever after this. I don't remember seeing.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So I remember. So this is a gray suit. So what's great about it is it's a three piece suit. So that echoes a little bit of what Harvey wears.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Am I wrong in that she also just doesn't wear a lot of suits in this show after this? Like, I don't remember her in suits. I remember her in dresses all the time.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay, so is that wrong? She never really wore pants again. She wore a lot of pants in this. But you don't see the pants here. What you see is the three piece suit of it on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I saw the pants before this shot.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. So she went into skirt suits a lot of the time and dresses. So she did have the blazer look a lot of the time.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think that's what I'm reacting to is a pants suit vibe, which I get was not where we wanted to maybe go forever with Jessica, But I just want to mark it as appreciated.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'm not telling you not to appreciate it because it looks amazing. I'm just saying this is a really interesting starting point. And to think about where we went with this woman is super fun.

[Patrick J. Adams]

She's wearing the pants.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Of course. She's wearing a three piece suit.

[Patrick J. Adams]

She's literally.

[Sarah Rafferty]

She's wearing a waistcoat.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. Is that what you call that? A Westcot?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yes. And so is Harvey in the same scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So Mike takes the briefcase of weed to work to hide it. And that happens to be the same day that Louis Litt surprises him with a drug test. Our firm's best researcher, Kristen's let us in on the information that weed does typically stay in your system for 90 days. So Mike is. Mike's worried. I'm guessing Mike, like, probably knows that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Mike needs somebody else's urine.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Anyway, we start getting the sense that Mike is distracted in dropping the ball, which culminates at the deposition of Joanna Webinar. I think this is a good place to call out another great performance in the episode, which is Matt Servito, who I'm a huge Sopranos fan. So when I was sitting in the room with this guy, this was one of those moments in the pilot where.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I was like, pinch me.

[Patrick J. Adams]

That's where he's in the Sopranos. I'm in a scene with somebody from the Sopranos. What kind of role did he play in the Sopranos? He was an FBI agent. He was an agent. He was coming after Tony Soprano. He had a bunch of great scenes with Tony.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So the last time I watched the Sopranos, I watched it all on borrowed vhs. So I think it's time for me to return.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So we're gonna have a succession pod and a Sopranos pod. So the deposition goes poorly and Joanna no longer wants to help Mike and Harvey. Harvey blames Mike for not being prepared.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Didn't he say, fix it?

[Patrick J. Adams]

You go fix it? I think a good time to talk about the bike, too. God, this breaks my heart. If I have a heartbreaker from this episode, it's this one shot of me on the bike with that helmet. I can't tell you how much I did not want to wear that helmet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And the studio said you had to wear it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We had to. That's what I heard. There was no. And we were. I was like, let's just do it. Like, let's ask, you know, full suits. Like, ask forgiveness, not permission. Let's go. Let's just shoot it. And they could use it. And they were like, they will shut our production down if you ride this bike without your helmet. Like, it was full on and you can't make the helmet look cool or. I couldn't. A better actor might be able to. I could not. I just. As soon as you put it on me, I am like a 12 year old boy. But at the time, I just wanted him to be a cool, helmetless guy.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I think you can be cool in a helmet.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Look, I get it too. I didn't. I don't want to glorify that thing. I don't want other people not wearing their helmets.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But we should all smoke cigarettes, though.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, is that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Are we going back to that?

[Patrick J. Adams]

That's good. Now Suits Rewatch podcast brought to you by Philip Morris. Smoke them if you got them. Okay, we're heading back on track.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Listen, kids, wear your helmets. You can have cool helmets. There are cool helmets. So Mike is on the bike, and I just want to say we get my favorite needle drop of the episode. It is by the veils, and it's called Graylon Park. And I want to shout out to wardrobe, my favorite piece of this wardrobe is Mike's helmet.

[Patrick J. Adams]

How dare you?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I love that helmet, by the way. Sidebar. Erin Korsh. Remember the helmet? He was like, oh, my God. Mike and the helmet. It wasn't just Patrick and the helmet.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Kevin Bray.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We all hated the helmet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Well, it's seared into Aaron Korsh's memory, as it is yours.

[Patrick J. Adams]

There's a couple of things that are seared into Aaron's memory, but yes, that's the sort of thing that Aaron could not care less about. Right. That's the sort of thing that keep Kevin Bray up at night. And Aaron Korsh would be like, stop asking me questions about the helmet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

That's a perfect example of that. We pick up, and Mike is trying to figure out what to do. He's had a talking to. He's sitting with his weeds, and he's having to take it all in. And we get to see this scene between Harvey and Lewis in the bathroom where Harvey comes to give him a hard time and explain to him that he's got to stay away from his boy. And Lewis reveals that Gary Lipski was a plant. And this gives Harvey the idea that Joanna Webster was, in fact, a plant.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So then we're in the scene. We have a bathroom scene with Lewis and Harvey. And I just want to say that does establish that co that a lot of things happen in the bathrooms on our show and shout out to Rick's choice of Lewis's quiet confidence and ease. So beautiful. In that scene, it's just a chef's kiss.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Great. There's not a single scene where Lewis doesn't just crush it here. But you're right. Bathrooms play a major role and where people are. There's not a lot to work with in an office. And I think we learned that that as we shot so often in an office, you're like, oh, you kind of run out of places, and you have to figure out where certain things happen and how to stage things, because you have the same scene in the same six sets a thousand times.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. So I think Ally McBeal got there first. They started using their bathroom with more frequency. A lot of frequency. Well, before we did but shout out Ali McBeal.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And then we are at Joanna Webster's door, and Harvey is just giving it to. He's caught her in the act. And he says something like, I could pull out all this proof I don't have.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'm the guy you tell.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'm the guy you tell. Great line.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Was Great line. Charming. And you understand why people might tell Harvey Spector things.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I think, because that was day one for me, was the same day they were shooting this. When I got to set, he was shooting this. This might be his first scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, okay.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think I remember getting to set and knowing they were shooting this, and it was inside, so I couldn't really watch, but I knew it was happening. Little BTS information.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So then Mike finally confronts Trevor. He returns the briefcase full of weed, and in a moment of triumph, he takes all of Trevor's nice, expensive suits. And what I love about this, Patrick, I think my favorite thing is that look. We think that Mike is just taking all these fancy, expensive suits, but then on his way out the door, he has his final, like, ta da. Or he, like, you know, twists the knife a little bit where he opens the briefcase and he reveals the weed to Jenny.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. And it's nice to finally, the briefcase is tracked so much for him as this big metaphor of, you know, maybe there's just still a world for me where I could not do this. So there's something very powerful about seeing him open that and take out the suits. And then we cut to this great scene where he comes in, you know, and as somebody who didn't really, even at the time understand the difference in fashion, when I came in wearing the suit, I was like, why is this suit so different?

[Sarah Rafferty]

So you don't.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You have to understand. I am like. I am like, it is such a blind spot for me, fashion. And it's. You know, I think I'm really coming into my own now that I'm a father, because I think I've always just been a dad in, like, dad core. Like, I just want to wear shorts and shoes that don't look right with my shorts. Like, I don't know how to dress. And I'm trying to learn. And maybe through this pod, I can be. I can be taught. But at the time, like, I literally would be like, sure, this suits, this. Like, they're all. Aren't all suits the same? Like, what are you talking about? So Mike's naivete is the exact same as my own. Naivete on it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

When you were doing plays and you had your costume fitting, that wasn't like a transformational piece of doing a play.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I can be into it, like, I can be excited as a way of it, like, expressing a part of the character. But this show is about, like, fashion.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I just said that to a guy who was naked on Broadway.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So, yeah, the last time I did Broadway, it was lack of clothes. But, like, I just don't understand what's cool. I'm learning more and I obviously learned a lot more from the show. But it's funny to watch this now and think when I came in, in this suit, I didn't understand. Like, to me it didn't seem like it was that big a difference from the suit I was wearing with the rest of it. And then when I watch this now, I do see it through my eyes now that this is a significantly nicer suit and that Mike looks totally different.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So I have a totally different relationship to costume than you do. I think what can be interesting about the clothes on suits is that, like, my experience of them were that they were a tool. So as Donna's clothes got more and more elevated, it shifted the way I think she walked. It's shifted her position in the world. It shifted the way she moved in the world. So I think that's just a really different way to come at what the clothes are.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So for me, when you put on, I wanna don't. That was like your favorite thing from suits. Did you feel like, stronger, sexier, better?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. By the end, I was participating in choosing which dress in which scene based on what was happening. So I think this is a flowier scene. I think this is a guarded, like, armored scene. I think this needs this kind of shoe. I think this kind of cut. A full skirted moment. A not full skirted moment. That was the way. That was one of the paths out of my serranus.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sure.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Into being Donna, because who she is, like, she was incredibly vain and competent. And I thought originally that some of those places where Donna is incredibly confident, for example, about her appearance, my first response was, oh, she's being self deprecating. And it was Aaron or the director had to be like, no, no, no, she's saying this thing. And I was like, yeah, like, in.

[Patrick J. Adams]

A funny way, go like, oh, I'm not that thing. You know what I mean? Like, I'll be self deprecating. I won't actually feel.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Are you gonna charge me for the therapy?

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, because what I'm saying is you've said that you could put on certain clothes and you'd feel that cool and that strong and that sexy if it was done the way that you want it. But, no, of course. Did you personally, Sarah, feel also sexier, more confident? On.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I felt transformed. I felt like a different person.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I never felt that way. That's what I'm getting at. I could put on a $4,000 suit that was the most beautiful suit in the whole world. And I'll still feel like I'm 10 years old and I'm dressing up in my father's clothes. That's my point. Like, that I learned how to get over my own self, to realize that I'm insane. And that what was being communicated on screen was different than my experience. But in my head, it did not make me feel any more attractive or cooler looking or sexy or confident. That's my point. I have had to, over the course of my own life, just, like, get over that. There's going to be this hump of my brain that's never going to feel that way. But I can understand that it will be expressed differently.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So all I would add to that is, when I was putting those clothes on, it wasn't Sarah, it was Donna.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sure.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Right. It was not about whether Sarah felt cool and beautiful. It was about whether Donna did. And it was about, who's the person who buys this stuff for herself? It was a path. And I think Jolie and Joanna later really, really helped me lean into. Hey, can I use this to help me in this scene? What do you think?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think we're talking in a way about two different things. Cause I totally see it that way, too. 100%. Like, oh, Mike's gotta be really dialed in. And let's tailor it this way. He's really strong in this scene. He's the guy who's winning. And therefore, I can use the wardrobe to express that and feel that there was just always also a thing I had to get over, which was, oh, I'm never gonna feel confident in anything I wear.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Especially in the early years of suits. Like, a lot of body dysmorphia, for sure. A lot of, like, just feeling like a fraud. Especially when you're sitting across from this guy, Gabriel Mockt, looking the way that he looks.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You're preaching to the choir.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You know, he shows up in his, you know, sweatpants, and he looks the way that he looks. Anyway, we've got them in this room together. The bromance is alive and well, and Mike is in it to win it. He's not Going anywhere. And you can see the brothers have united, and they're on their way to court.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So this is the scene where you come in and you show that you're committed.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And this is one of the scenes that was one of my favorites because it's a very tender conversation about what is happening there and the bond that is now solidified between the two of them, for sure. But one of my favorite suits codes, I'll say that is defined here, is that Harvey hands you a brief and you read it in exactly four wonders.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think we both made this. This note. This exact same.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It was four. I counted it was four. One, 1,002, 1,300.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Where somebody consumes a document instantly and not only consumes the information, but processes the repercussions. And that is like, is this for real? Let's go. And the whole game plan, it makes sense. It's a great. Those are viral on TikTok.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Are they?

[Sarah Rafferty]

A lot of TikToks about this.

[Patrick J. Adams]

People love it. Really awesome. Thank you. And that's from our firm's best researcher, Chris. It's interesting that TikTok doesn't serve me up more of myself. What's that about? Oh, God.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Thank God.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, I'm really happy about it. But, like, you would think that the algorithm would be like, we found him. Let's just launch it at him. I have a similar question.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Sidebar about Netflix. No, no.

[Patrick J. Adams]

When you watch Netflix on. Is the suits on your Netflix like, your face? Cause I think that poster changes to what's on yours.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Sometimes it's the group, and sometimes it's me.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sometimes it is you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And I don't know if I'm prepared.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It knows. It doesn't know that it's you, but, like, it knows enough that it's probably you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, I think it knows that somebody in my house or me has watched the other Netflix show that I'm on on all the episodes of it. Right. So they go, oh, here is.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What about me, though? Cause I'm not on any other Netflix shows. And it knows it's me. Every time I pull it up, I go, look at me. I'm the poster of suits. That's cool. Why would they. Oh, they didn't just pick me. That's just my house.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But are you ready for all the things that are for you, for your algorithm on Netflix to offer up for you everything that's like suits? Because the thing that you're gonna be.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Watching is because we are watching. Yeah. My algorithm is already like, what are you doing? So let's get back into it. We get the first shot. I remember shooting this B roll stuff in New York, which was great of the courthouse. And both Harvey and Mike are presenting Charles Hunt with everything that they found. They realize Joanna Webster was a fraud. And we get to do that classic thing in suits, which will happen time and time again, where Mike and Harvey just have folders in their hands and deliver the hard truth to our bad guy. I think this is a really fun scene. I love the moment in this scene when they walk away and Mike melts for a second. Like, you see the. Like, he's been trying to keep it cool for so long. And then as soon as they leave, he has to shake it out because he's never felt that cool in his entire life. I thought that was pretty.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I don't remember doing it. It's one of those things where I was like, oh, God, I should be nicer to myself. That was a good idea.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

They've managed to do that very hard thing, which the show wants to do, which is Harvey wants to win, but Mike needs to do the right thing. And right from our pilot, we have accomplished both those goals. And Batman and Robin are leaving the courthouse together at last riffing on what the better Batman is, which obviously is no contest.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Keaton.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's Michael Keaton.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Michael Keaton's not in the script, though. Did you notice that?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Did we improvise that?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. I mean, I don't know if it was improvised.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We did. No. My God. Now that you. Thank you so much for bringing that up. We did improvise that. I remember that. I remember in the moment, we both went, well, Michael Keaton's the best. And then I think Aaron was like, oh, my God. Hey, Michael Keaton. Great. I have a. You can tell I have a very specific Eric Horsham impression that might come up from time to time. Guys, that is the whole pilot. I want to say that that was really fun.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So I have a question. I have a really burning question. How many goddamns did we get?

[Patrick J. Adams]

We had four in the first part. I'm going to go six, Nine total.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There are seven total in the entire episode. So only three more this time.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Look, this is the first of many episodes. We are so excited to continue to do this. We're going to have guests. Come on. We're going to be talking to people both in front of and behind the camera who helped make the show what it was. We're so excited to continue to do this. And we also want to hear from you. So if you have any questions, thoughts or ideas of other things you'd like to hear from us on the pod, please send your emails to sidebarpodcasteriousm.com and if you want to record an audio clip of the question, go for it and we can play it on the show. We're really open to any ideas, things you guys want to hear more of or less of. Please let us know. And I can't wait to keep being in the room with you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Me too.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Thank you friend. I'll see you next time. Thank you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Sidebar is produced by Sara Rafferty, Patrick J. Adams and SiriusXM Media. Our senior producer is Kimmy Gregory, our producer and researcher is Christian Schrader, our sound engineer is Alex Gonzalez and our audio mix is by Eduardo Perez. Our music is by Brendan Burns and our executive producers are Cody Fisher and Colin Anderson. Did you know when you shave, one third of what you remove is skin. So if you shave it dove it with new Dove Advance Care antiperspirant Dry Spray. New Proceramide technology helps repair skin's natural barrier after shaving. For soft, smooth underarm the ultimate post shave care with 72 hours sweat and odor protection. Try new Dove Advance Care Antiperspirant Dry Spray from the number one dermatologist recommended brand for everyday underarm care. Learn more and find where to [e-mail].

[Patrick J. Adams]

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[Sarah Rafferty]

Visit fordpro.com today to learn more.