Play the Man

Summary

Sidebar: A Suits Watch Podcast - Episode Summary: "Play the Man"

Introduction

In the December 3, 2024 episode of Sidebar: A Suits Watch Podcast, hosts Patrick J. Adams and Sarah Rafferty delve deep into Season 1, Episode 7 titled "Play the Man" from the hit TV series Suits. This episode is a pivotal moment in the series, featuring the first mock trial that brings the entire Pearson Hardman firm together. Patrick and Sarah share their personal experiences, behind-the-scenes stories, and insightful analysis, making it an engaging listen for both fans and newcomers to Suits.

Episode Overview

"Play the Man," written by Erica Lopez and directed by Tim Matheson, originally aired on August 4, 2011. The episode centers around Mike Ross facing off against Lewis's protégé, Kyle, in a mock trial setting. A significant guest from Harvey Specter's past, Dana Scott (played by Abigail Spencer), complicates the firm's merger negotiations. The episode also marks the return of Jenny, adding layers to Mike's personal and professional life.

Key Discussions and Insights

1. First Mock Trial and Its Impact

   Patrick emphasizes the importance of "Play the Man" as the first of four mock trial episodes, highlighting how it serves as a foundational episode that knits together the Pearson Hardman world. He notes, "the mock trial knits together the Pearson Hardman world. I think it's really fun to get to see everybody in the same room" (07:15).

2. Erica Lopez's Contribution

   The hosts commend Erica Lopez for her exceptional writing, particularly her portrayal of strong female characters. Patrick mentions, "I'm really loving how the device of the mock trial knits together the Pearson Hardman world," attributing this to Lopez's writing skills (07:50).

3. Character Development: Donna Paulsen

   Sarah and Patrick discuss Donna's evolution in this episode, noting how she gains a "surer footing in the ecosystem of Pearson Hardman" and showcases her wit and fearlessness. Patrick shares his admiration, stating, "Donna gets to really joyfully feel like she matters to the firm in a unique way" (07:15).

4. Abigail Spencer's Debut as Dana Scott

   The introduction of Dana Scott is a standout moment. Sarah praises Spencer's performance, describing her entrance as powerful and memorable: "It's just so clear from the first moment" (23:08). The episode also includes a voicemail from Spencer, where she shares her excitement about joining Suits and her experience on set.

5. Mock Trial Dynamics and Humor

   The hosts humorously critique minor continuity issues, such as Sarah's helmet disappearing, and discuss the authenticity of the mock trial scenes. Sarah remarks, "It feels like a very complex and difficult feat, and he [the director] did a really beautiful job" (24:08).

6. Emotional and Ethical Choices

   A significant portion of the discussion revolves around Mike's ethical dilemma during the mock trial. He chooses to lose the case to stay true to his morals, leading to a heartfelt moment between him and Jessica Pearson. Sarah highlights, "This is an episode about people and people changing, and what are they willing to change" (66:35).

7. Behind-the-Scenes Anecdotes

   Patrick and Sarah share personal stories from the set, including Patrick's past experiences working with director Tim Matheson and Sarah's memories of taking headshots for her episodes. These anecdotes provide listeners with a glimpse into the actors' off-screen lives and camaraderie.

Notable Quotes

• Patrick J. Adams: "I'm so excited to dig into Erica's first episode. It is our first episode written by a woman, and obviously she's writing with Aaron." (07:15)

• Sarah Rafferty: "It's a great question, and I think we talked a little bit about it. But what it's making me think now is that Donna is a champion for Mike in this part of him." (64:00)

• Abigail Spencer: "I watched the first episode of Suits and I was like, oh, my God, it's going to be Mad Men for lawyers." (26:44)

• Patrick J. Adams: "Mike wins the case by losing it. In many ways, he wins our hearts by losing the case." (58:29)

Conclusions and Reflections

Patrick and Sarah conclude the episode by reflecting on the profound impact "Play the Man" has on both the characters and the overarching narrative of Suits. They appreciate how the episode balances humor, emotional depth, and character development, making it a standout installment in the series. The hosts express their admiration for the collaborative efforts of the writers, directors, and cast, particularly highlighting Donna and Mike's evolving relationship.

Patrick remarks, "Can I please come work with you again? We love jobs," emphasizing his deep respect for Erica Lopez's writing (70:51). Meanwhile, Sarah shares her pride in being part of such a meaningful project, stating, "I'm just so proud of everyone and honored to be a part of it" (69:16).

Final Thoughts

"Play the Man" serves as a testament to Suits' ability to intertwine personal and professional lives seamlessly, offering viewers a rich blend of legal drama and character-driven storytelling. Patrick and Sarah's insightful analysis not only highlights the episode's strengths but also underscores the show's enduring appeal.

Notable Timestamps

• [07:15] - Discussing the importance of the mock trial and Erica Lopez's writing.
• [23:08] - Introduction of Dana Scott by Abigail Spencer.
• [64:00] - Donna's role as Mike's champion.
• [26:44] - Abigail Spencer's voicemail and experiences.
• [58:29] - Mike's ethical choice in the mock trial.
• [70:51] - Patrick's admiration for Erica Lopez.

Note: Timestamps refer to the podcast transcript's timing.

---

Timestamps Reference: <a id="timestamp-07:15"></a> 07:15 - Initial discussion on mock trial's significance and Erica Lopez's influence.

<a id="timestamp-23:08"></a> 23:08 - Sarah and Patrick discuss Abigail Spencer's impactful entrance as Dana Scott.

<a id="timestamp-26:44"></a> 26:44 - Playback of Abigail Spencer's voicemail highlighting her joining Suits.

<a id="timestamp-64:00"></a> 64:00 - Analysis of Donna's support for Mike and its implications.

<a id="timestamp-58:29"></a> 58:29 - Reflection on Mike's decision to lose the mock trial ethically.

<a id="timestamp-70:51"></a> 70:51 - Patrick expresses his desire to collaborate again with Erica Lopez.

<a id="timestamp-69:16"></a> 69:16 - Sarah shares her pride and honor in being part of Suits.

---

This comprehensive summary encapsulates the essence of the "Play the Man" episode as discussed in the podcast, providing listeners with a clear and engaging overview of the episode's key moments and thematic elements.

Transcript

[Narrator]

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[Patrick J. Adams]

This holiday season, share a new language with your loved ones. A lifetime membership to Rosetta Stone makes a meaningful present for friends and family. Patrick, did you know that my kids and my husband all can speak French? So now I'm trying to learn a little bit on Rosetta Stone.

[Sarah Rafferty]

When you learn French, where are you going to go first?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Listen, I'm going to go back to Paris, and the first thing I'm going to do with my kids, with my new facility in French is I'm going to take them to all the flea markets and then I'm going to order all the things on all the menus at all the restaurants perfectly.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Who would you gift a lifetime membership to?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'd gift it to you. I want you to come to Paris with me.

[Guest Speaker]

I need it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Please gift it to me.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So start learning today with Rosetta Stone's lifetime membership holiday special. Visit rosettastone.com sidebar for unlimited access to 25 language courses for the rest of your life, available for a short [e-mail] Sidebar Wait, can I say something to you? Are we record? Are we going? I'm just ready to cut it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I am. Yeah. We can put it all together.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Can we edit? I don't know.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Are we rolling right now?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I just want to tell you something. There is a scene that comes up where there's a needle drop and there's some epic needle drops in the show. But this needle drop is cool. It totally made me think of bread. Are you familiar with any kind of soft rock, yacht rock classics? Bread? Like, baby, I don't know bread. Yes, you do.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Do I?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Baby, I'mma want you Baby, I'mma need you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Is that the song that this reminds you of?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Well, okay, so in the show, you and you and Jenny are gonna soft rock the shit out of each other. And there's a cool song, but it reminded me of bread. So anyway, the point is, last night I listened to the most popular Bread song. And then when I got in the car this morning, it was just on. So normally I would have turned it off, but I just let that play through and I soft rocked the hell out of myself over here.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So you are coming in with that.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I came in with some yacht rock.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yacht rock energy today.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, it's so. And you know, in fact, I'm going to talk with, like a silky smooth. Yeah, it really elevated my spirits. You know what? Because I've been on the struggle bus all week.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, me too.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Santos away.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And we're recording on a Sunday, which you've never done, but I'm kind of into it. I feel much more relaxed today.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's like, we can pop over to the farmer's market afterwards, which obviously we will. Yeah, we can soft rock ourselves over to the farmer's market.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Shall we dive in here? Hi, everyone. Welcome to Sidebar as Suits Watch podcast. My name is Patrick Adams and I'm Sarah Rafferty.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And we were on Suits, but we've never really watched Suits until now.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And this week we watched season one, episode six, seven Play the Man. But before we dive in. Hi.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Hi.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Hi.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Hey.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Hey.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We have so much to talk about with this episode.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's a big one.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But how are you doing? Before we do that, how's everything? Just a quick check in. Where are you at mentally and emotionally?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay. I'm okay. How are you?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I am good. I'm just, you know, I'm still shooting this show and I'm in Texas at the moment, and it's just, you know, it reminds me of what Suits was just so much back and forth, and you're with the family for a couple of days, and then you're gone and on a plane again. So I'm excited we're having such a good time on this thing, but I'm so excited to be home and here and able to just do this with you in the studio for a couple of months. So that's it. That's my story. What about you?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'm so excited. I can't wait to be in the studio with you more in the next couple of months, because I think it's.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Really important to just physically be present together.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Physically.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You just touch hands.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Touch listener.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We are. We are physically touched.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Get right up on that mic, sweaty balls. Anyway, let's talk about Listener.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Engineer told us before we started that Sarah's mic technique is far better than mine. He said it in a kind way, but he did point out that she's got the best in the business, I'm pretty sure, is how he put it. And I have some work to do. So this episode, you're going to hear a lot of this right up on it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I'm gonna go right into this.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And that brings us to the brief. Do you wanna dive in?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes, let's dive in. I'm so excited to talk about this episode.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Today we're breaking down season one, Episode seven, Play the Man. This episode was written by Erica Lopez and directed by Tim Matheson. Originally aired on Thursday, August 4, 2011.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So in our first of many Suits mock trials, Mike is pitted against Lewis's protege Kyle. And a visitor from Harvey's past complicates a merger negotiation between their respective clients. And Jenny is back.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Thank God. We have some quick facts from Kiki, our firm's best researcher. The shoot dates were June 14 to June 22. We were one day away from the series premiere. Erica Lopez worked on Suits for three seasons and wrote four episodes. She's gone on to great things. Most recently, she was the showrunner for the critically acclaimed Hulu Limited series We Were the Lucky Ones, which came out earlier this year. And since Suits, she's also written for the Morning Show, Julia and Bates Motel. So she's been a very busy lady, I guess. This is the first of four mock trial episodes, which I should know that. Cause I definitely shot them, but I don't remember making four, so I'm excited.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But you remember this one, right?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I do. And we'll get into it again. Like I learned I remembered more as we were doing it. Do you have any opening statements you want to talk about before we start excavating here?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes. So I'm very excited to dig into Erica's first episode. It is our first episode written by a woman, and obviously she's writing with Aaron. They're writing it together. But I am particularly taken in this episode by the leaps and the bounds that four female characters in particular take. So I love seeing women go toe to toe with their male counterparts. They are sparring with the verbal banter in a very, very satisfying way. And I'm not surprised that the lady character that she introduces in this episode goes on to become a central part of the fabric of the show.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yep.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So I am really loving how the device of the mock trial knits together the Pearson Hardman world. I think it's really fun to get to see everybody in the same room. And for me, on a personal note, this was the episode that gave Donna, like, a surer footing in the ecosystem of Pearson Hardman. And she gets to really joyfully feel like she matters to the firm in a unique way. And I know we talked about this when we talked about the scene where Donna messes with Lewis in bailout, but that scene was written after this episode was written.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, interesting.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So it's like this. You're saying maybe what happened in this.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Episode almost informed the writing of that scene, which got put back in in an earlier moment. That scene was written after Erica had developed this part of Donna and had expanded Donna's presence and her backstory and her wit and her fearlessness. And I distinctly remember when we were shooting this episode that at one point I grabbed Erica on set just outside of the library where we were shooting the mock trial, and I just thanked her. I just really felt like I owed her a lot for coming up with this part of Donna that is obsessed with acting and messing with people and going toe to toe with people and finding her kind of special.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Special sauce.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Unique sauce.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, 100%. You basically said everything I would say to begin with. I mean, obviously, as soon as it started, I went, oh, my God. Mock trial. It felt like there was pre mock trial and post mock trial. It felt like a really pivotal moment. And it was interesting to watch this episode and try and figure out why. And there are multiple reasons, and I think you just hit on a lot of them. Erica being a big one, I thought Tim Matheson did a fantastic job. We'll get more into some of the stuff he was doing in this episode that I hadn't seen a lot of yet. And I think we just learned so much about all the characters in this episode. So, yeah, huge one. I'm excited to dig in. As soon as it started, I was like, oh, yes, this one.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, it was like the perfect moment for it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Exactly.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Also, we both worked with Tim before. I worked with Tim as an actor. I played his wife on an episode of Without a Trace, and I feel like his character had framed my character for a murder.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Nice.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Or something.

[Sarah Rafferty]

How much longer before this was that? How?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Ooh, that's a great question. I don't know.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Tim Matheson, for those who don't know, a great accomplished actor as well as now a television director, maybe most famously known for his role in Animal House. That was like how I knew him best. But, yeah, he's done a ton.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I thought it was interesting that I was cast as his wife. I think we have like a 24 year age difference, something like that. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's so weird.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Drop that in there.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's so strange in this industry. Who would have thought? I worked with Tim. I did an episode of Cold Case with Tim. It was actually one of my first jobs. I was a guest star on an episode of Cold Case. He was directing it. He couldn't have been nicer. Also, fun fact, I took Tim Matheson's headshots. I remember I took his headshots. So Tim Math. I used to take headshots in my garage. That's how I survived because I Canadian and I wasn't allowed to have a normal job. So Tim Matheson was in my garage taking pictures. It was so wild.

[Patrick J. Adams]

He's very handsome.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But you know what? We'll do this in our Tim Matheson pod. You ready for that? Can we talk to Sirius about our Tim Matheson pod? Anyway, terrific guy and he directed a great episode. So let's get into it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We open on Mike zooming through Manhattan on his bike. And he nearly runs Rachel over. And we see that she's still angry at the revelation that Mike has a history of cheating on the Elm.

[Sarah Rafferty]

This helmet thing, I mean, we gotta put a nail in it right off the bat. I mean, this is the most egregious how there's all. First of all, I love the opening and the biking and through the city. Clearly me doing all my own stunts. Obviously, you know, this speaks to what Tim's doing in this episode, which is there's a lot of, like, quick, fast paced, close up, interstitial stuff. So the episode starts with some of the best bike coverage I think we've had. But again, because I'm actually in traffic, I'm wearing the godforsaken helmet, which I understand, safety first, but it looks kind of ridiculous. And you see me doing all this stuff and flying through, and then when I pull up to meet Rachel, helmet's just gone. Doesn't exist. It's not even, like connected to my bag. It's not on the thing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And why is it bothering you?

[Sarah Rafferty]

It bothers me because it makes no sense. You just saw me with a helmet and now I don't have a helmet. So this, to me was the most egregious version of this. And I got mad at myself because I was like, okay, your ego just officially made something not make sense in the episode. And it. And I don't know if it hit other people, but I mean, obviously I'm sensitive to the helmet.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What's the lesson here?

[Sarah Rafferty]

The lesson is like, just wear the helmet. It doesn't make sense. Like, continuity is important. Continuity is important.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait Guys, guys, in the booth, did I just wear the helmet? Helmet debate, like, we just led him to, but.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay. But as an actor, it looks so silly. But I guess Mike is supposed to be silly.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think you look good in the helmet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, that's sweet.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I look great in the helmet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You're lying to me.

[Patrick J. Adams]

This is sponsored by helmets.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So the bullpen's empty. We find the whole firm preparing for Pearson Hardman's mock trial 2011. Donna explains to Mike what a big deal this is. Mike is assigned to go up against Lewis guy Kyle, played by Ben Hollingsworth, who we're meeting for the first time in this episode. Gosh, just look at these babies. We were babies. Yeah. We get to stand next to each other. I love. Probably just, you know, I loved it anyway, but now that we're doing this podcast together, every time our characters come together, I'm like, yeah, they're together. And, yeah, I just love it. And I love you in this scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It was great. Yeah. This scene looms large in my memory. I think I remember so many of those lines in this little teeny bit that we had. I must have just read those exchanges over and over again, because they were suddenly a big source of Donna's backstory and who she was and who she believed herself to be. And I think her. The opportunity for her to play an important role in the firm was the first thing that personally, and I'm really sorry to do this, but it lit her up. Somebody wants to get lit up.

[Sarah Rafferty]

She got lit up.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You can feel it. She is lit up.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. It's so fun to watch how excited she is to get to give a performance in the second.

[Patrick J. Adams]

She really believes she's getting dead.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's like, we are doing this. I finally get to put my skills to work. The confidence level couldn't be higher.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And when Donna says to Mike, it's your debutante ball, clearly, it's her debutante ball. Like, she is coming out. And I think it's hilarious that she resents that she played a traffic card.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, that's so funny.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, that, like, it was such a waste.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So beneath her, Beneath her talents, it's.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And it makes me so excited to see. It's just such a great setup to. I mean, a. The mock trial is a great idea and a great setup. I want to see how Mike's going to fare, but I'm most excited to see how Donna's going to perform, especially.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Because she says, oh, I don't play anything. I embody like, who says that?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Pretty sure I've heard you say that in your own.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, yeah. Like, in all my work. Totally.

[Sarah Rafferty]

What are you wearing in this scene, though? This. This. This outfit in particular seemed. I was curious how you felt about it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, I think wardrobe was playing with Donna's quirkiness. I think they were trying to see, who is she? Is she the quirky secretary? Is she elegant? Do we need to put a hat on it? We don't know yet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's funny because you're so beautiful and you're so striking, but you're in a show where the character actually, like, at this point, you're right. They don't know. Should she be beautiful? It's actually maybe gonna be problematic if she's too beautiful. And Harvey and her, like, what's happening? So now if we make you quirky, it's, like, easier. But it's so weird knowing you. And I guess also knowing where this character's gonna go and how beautifully you are dressed. When we actually figure it all out, sometimes I see these outfits and I'm like, what? Why are we trying to dress this down?

[Patrick J. Adams]

You know, what's. Well, thank you for the compliment embedded in there. Of course. Patrick, that's so nice. But I think it's so funny. Did I tell you this story that when I got this part, I said to my team, I was like, I'm excited to play the girl behind the desk. Cause I wanna get pregnant and.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, right, right, right.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I'm psyched that I can be quirky and I can be without the pressure of looking a certain way. Because they already have those two ladies.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

They had Gina Torres, and they had Meghan Markle. And I was like, okay, great. I can be, like, the weird, quirky.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You don't have to have the pressure of being the sex. Like, the sexy one.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I thought I could hide a pregnancy behind the desk. For sure. I thought that could happen. So there's something in the scene that I wanted to talk about with you, which is something that we talk about all the time, which is my boobs.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's my favorite topic of conversation. So let's. Let's dive in.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I had a memory when I saw that outfit. So that outfit is not fitting very well, wouldn't you say?

[Sarah Rafferty]

This feels like a trap.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's not a trap. This is a safe space. We've said that before.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I feel like it is emphasizing. Say it right. We're emphasizing. But isn't that a good thing or. No.

[Patrick J. Adams]

My chest.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Right? Yeah. My breast Isn't that emphasis? Oh, boy.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay. No. So this brought up just a fun memory on set. So I was away the last episode, right. I've come back, obviously. Probably before I left for that last episode, I had a fitting. I came back and I wear this quirky outfit.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I didn't fit in it on that day because super secret. I'm pregnant.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Right.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I remember Mark, the wardrobe guy was not happy. He was like, what? I was like, hey, Mark, I don't fit in this shirt anymore.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But you can't tell anybody you're pregnant.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Nope, not telling anybody. And he. I only heard this later that he like went to Jolie and was like, but she doesn't fit in her clothes. Like, she doesn't fit in her shirt. But he did something super brilliant right there in the moment.

[Sarah Rafferty]

How do you fix it?

[Patrick J. Adams]

He just cut the back of the shirt.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, really?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Because I'm wearing a vest. He just cut the back, left it open. We had to do this quickity quick pants because I had to get to set. So he cuts the back of the shirt and I go on and we kind of like tape it together. And you can see it doesn't. It doesn't interesting that well. But it was really funny because later when I got to tell Mark and I got to tell Jolie, that was like. They were like, oh. Oh. That makes. Wow.

[Narrator]

Uncover one of history's greatest mysteries in Indiana Jones and the Great Circle, a first person single player adventure video game set between the events of Raiders of the Lost Ark and the Last Crusade. The year is 1937. Sinister forces are scouring the globe for the secret to an ancient power connected to the Great Circle. Circle. And only one person can stop them. Indiana Jones Adventure calls Indiana Jones and the Great Circle releases on December 9th on Xbox Series X&S Game Pass and PC. Pre order. Indiana Jones and the Great circle now. Rated T14. Copyright and trademark 2024 Lucasfilm Ltd. All rights reserved.

[Guest Speaker]

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[Patrick J. Adams]

Hey Patrick, why is gift giving so enjoyable for you specifically?

[Guest Speaker]

Well, Sarah, I'm happy you asked. You know what?

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's great when you can get someone.

[Guest Speaker]

A gift that they wouldn't necessarily get for themselves. That little bit of luxury that they don't know that they're missing. And for quality gifts at an affordable price, there's Quince.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Do you know what I got from Quince, Sarah?

[Patrick J. Adams]

What did you get?

[Guest Speaker]

A Mongolian cashmere fisherman full zip sweater.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, I bet that looks so good on you. What color is it?

[Guest Speaker]

It's navy blue and it's incredible.

[Sarah Rafferty]

The problem is I don't get to.

[Guest Speaker]

Wear it much because Troian has stolen.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It from me and I can't have it back. I love that this thing is so comfortable and she wears it all over.

[Guest Speaker]

The house and I might need to.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Get another one so that I can wear one.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think I know what to get you for the holidays.

[Guest Speaker]

The thing about Quint is that it lets you treat your loved ones and yourself to everyday luxury at an affordable price. From 14 karat gold jewelry to Italian leather handbags, all Quint Items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. So this holiday season, gift luxury without the luxury price tag. Go to quince.com sidebar for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order that is quinc.com sidebar to get free shipping and 365 day returns.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Quince.com sidebar.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I just need some yacht rock to bring me back into this.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Act one. All right, here we go. We're heading into act one. Harvey gives Mike some advice about the mock trial. Tough scene for me to watch because why? Because I'm a Trekkie. There's a moment in this where he's talking about Star Trek and he is referring to a very important event in the lore of Star Trek, Kobayashi Maru, which is a moment if you'll give me. Allow me to digress. Captain Kirk changes the rules of a simulation in order to pass the test. He like goes in and like rewires it and Ends up passing because he cheats, essentially. It's called Kobayashi Maru. It's a big part of the lore of Captain Kirk, something I am very familiar with. And Gabriel, clearly, because he's cool, had no idea what it was. And you can hear him in how he says Kobayashi Maru. Can we pull that up? That's important. All I'm saying is try and create a situation where that's not even a possibility. Kobayashi Maru. How he said Kobayashi Maru.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's Kobayashi Maru.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay. I'm not saying it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You don't need to say it, but just as a Trekkie. And any Trekkie who is out there would probably hear that and realize he actually doesn't know what he's talking about.

[Guest Speaker]

Yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Okay, let's move on in. To discuss the merger. Harvey learns that he will be negotiating with his former law school rival, Dana Scott, played by Abigail Spencer. We have. I mean, I don't know that you can get a better entrance than this as a character.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, this woman knows how to make an entrance and how to own a scene.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And it's just. She just looks like a trillion dollars. It's so clear from the first moment. And I love how it pans off Harvey's face to her. And you see what this means to him. Yeah, like he knows that this is arriving. Exact. Exactly. I thought it was a brilliant, brilliant moment.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It felt like a timeless entrance too. Like, when I look back on it, it seems like an old timey movie. It seems like Audrey Hepburn is coming down the stairs.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Sometimes I don't love on shows the, like the sort of melee gaze, like up the legs and all that, but for some reason in this, it's like perfect. It didn't feel just sexualizing. It felt powerful. Does that make sense?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love that you drew the difference between those things.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. Sometimes it feels like it's just like.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Panning up the legs. Is that male gaze thing. We could look for that more because here it's done really, really well here.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's perfect. It's perfect. An early contender for me for the Gina Torres moment of the week. I don't know that you can beat it. And if we do beat it, it's probably another Abigail Spencer.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Spencer does exactly, exactly. Okay. So I took this opportunity, of course, to reach out to Abigail Spencer because obviously we're eager to get her because we're obsess on the podcast sometime soon to talk about Scotty. And she's amazing, so we're so lucky. She sent us a voicemail. Here it is.

[Abigail Spencer]

Oh, ho. Sarah. Rafferty, Patrick J. Adams. Do I have any memories of the first time Suits came across my desk? Sure do. Also, you know, sidebar on a sidebar. Thank you so much for having me. I had the great fortune of just being on Mad Men, honestly. I had just been on Mad Men, and really the first time, a lot of people seen my work, and Aaron Korsh happened to be one of them. He reached out through Bonnie Zane, the illustrious Suits casting director. And to her credit, I actually had an offer for another show. And it was a show that had already been on the air for years, and it was going to be recurring, like, multiple episodes. And the Suits offer was for one episode. And Bonnie, she was like, I know you have this other offer. I think you should just watch the pilot. I'm just going to slip you the first episode of Suits. So I watched the first episode of Suits and I was like, oh, my God, it's going to be Mad Men for, like, Mad Men for Lawyers. That's what I said out loud. Mad Men for Lawyers. And I just was like, I think. I think it's worth taking a little bit of a quote, unquote risk. The role was amazing. You guys were all amazing. I loved it. I loved working with Gabriel. I mean, what a scene partner. Like, you know, whenever I'd come on set, like, hey, favorite scene partner. And then all of you guys, I mean, I don't know if you remember, Sarah, but, like, I had seen something. Maybe it was after Play the Man. When I came back for season two, you and I had dinner, and I was like, girl, you are amazing on this show. And, you know, I just really got to revel in everyone's great work. And my son, who's now 16, wanted. I mean, my son was 2 when I started. He's 16 now.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What?

[Abigail Spencer]

And he has this summer, wanted to start watching Suits. So we are. We're in season four. And so I recently got to watch this episode and am also kind of rediscovering Suits along with the rest of the world. And it's so good. And Scotty's so great, and that was such a great introduction. So it's pretty fresh. So it's like, so present for me when it happened, but also present for me right now because I just got to revisit it. Thanks, thanks, thanks, thanks. So excited for you guys. I can't wait to be with you in person and do more. Lots of love, you guys. I hope you're having fun. Bye.

[Sarah Rafferty]

She's the best.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So cool. So cool. Thank you so much, Abby. We can't wait to talk to you more.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I don't know if this is also the appropriate time, because I don't know that I've ever told Abigail Spencer this, but I think, like most men in America coming off of Mad Men, I had an enormous crush on her. She played an iconic role on Mad Men, a teacher who interacts with John Ham's Don Draper. And she was just radiant and amazing and did such a good job. So I remember when she. I found out she was coming to the show, I got very squirrely. I was like, what? Oh, my God, What?

[Patrick J. Adams]

And is Abigail Smith Interacts in quotes. Interacts.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's my new word for coitus.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, nice.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Interacts.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I can support that. So then Harvey and Scotty begin to discuss their client's merger, and we quickly discover their history is far more interesting than just former law school rivals. Hats off to Abigail for jumping right into Gabriel's arms for that scene. I mean, this is before we had intimacy coordinators where all these things were planned. I mean, I'm sure they rehearsed it and planned it, but, like, I personally would need, like, a professional athlete to jump into their arms. I'm sure that Gabriel could catch me if I did that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But you don't think I could catch you?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think we should. Can we just give it a quick. A little quick one, too? No, I don't. I think I. I'm going to catch.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You when we're done here. We're doing it, and we're gonna get a video.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Well, like I was saying, like, I'm too tall for the ride. Like, I don't know if I can get do that. Like, I feel. I'm afraid I would take somebody down.

[Sarah Rafferty]

She did it great. The scene's great. It's fun to watch. You're like, oh, God, I already love these two together.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes, he has met his match.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So in Act 2, the mock trial begins, and Mike is blindsided by Kyle. So Mike requests ample time to prepare his case since Kyle caught him off guard. Jessica gives him five minutes. Rachel checks on a very rattled mic.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I also wanted to punch Kyle in the face in this scene, and a couple more times, I want to punch him in the face.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He's very good at playing a punchable character in this scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

He's very good.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's. You know, he's. We've seen, like, an evolution of these guys who are coming up against Mike, and I think Kyle does a great job of being the, like, ultimate douche. Douche.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And well done. Well done, sir.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Ben Hollingsworth. Oh, I just thought it was funny when you're watching all of this mock trial, you see all these older lawyers sitting around and watching, like, attentively, like, this mock trial.

[Patrick J. Adams]

How do they have time?

[Sarah Rafferty]

And it's like, what? What? Aren't you all professional lawyers?

[Patrick J. Adams]

What about your clients?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Even Jessica? It's like, are you. Don't you have something better to do than running the mock trial for? And it's not just like you're just seeing mine and Kyle's, but at the beginning, Louis is handing out a bunch of them. So you're just seeing one. There's like 10 of these that are happening throughout the day. So apparently Pearson Hartman just doesn't have any cases to be working on for two weeks. I don't know.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Thank God they're there, because watching them listen is one of the most satisfying parts of this episode. We'll get into that more later. So Harvey returns to the office after his meeting, and Donna teases him about Scotty.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, God, I love you so much. You're so. This is what we're talking about. You're so in the pocket by this episode. You're like, it's. It's so wild to watch. It's like, oh, we found it. We found the gear. It's just like, perfect. And it's perfect. One of the details I love is there's not an ounce of jealousy. I think the temptation to play a moment like we talked about in that with Bonnie Zane, a moment of I'm also a little sad or I also have a thing for. You didn't play a single moment of it. You are just like a frat brother. You are just high fiving him. It's so good and leaves so much more to happen. Rather than trying to put the. The breadcrumbs to something else that might. You don't need to. You're like, we have plenty of time. It's really fun.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Exactly. I love this scene so much. And, you know, I do really want to thank Erica and Aaron for this. And in some ways, it's like I imagine them writing this together, like in some fantasy version of it where they're beautifully lit somewhere on opposite sides of a desk, like playing each part, you know, candle lit. Yeah. But I think it establishes a bunch of things in a really short amount of space. When you look at it on the page, it's, you know, a few eighths of a page, I think.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's not that much. So one, you find out Donna knows everything, which is obviously something that we lean into through the whole series. So she knows everything, including that they just had sex. Right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Interacted.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, they just interacted. Thank you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Interactive.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Thank you. That there's no boss employee vibe here at all. No, she's his equal. Yeah. She can take the piss. Like Harvey, Donna enjoys going toe to toe, and I love that she wins this round, I think, with several zingers, not just one. Like, she gets the. Did you come out on top? Your fly's unzipped. It was earlier today. And the. Ooh, is that what Scotty said? Like, they literally let her win time after time. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There's no doubt she's winning. And that's such an Aaron Korsh. Like, when you're hanging out with Aaron Korsh, that's how he works. Like, you know, one person gets somebody, and then you gotta get the one. And it's like, how far can you go? So it's fun to read these scenes because you can just see him writing it, and he, like, he will take it as far as a character can go before it's like, that's the end of the scene.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But he made it that the secretary won.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, yeah. For sure.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Like, our hero loses.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

He has to walk away.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. Of course you win.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love that, and I'm so grateful for it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So then Mike's waiting in Harvey's office ready to let him know exactly what he thinks of Harvey's advice. But Harvey shuts him down with some major wisdom bombs. I feel like there's a lot of memeable Harvey moments in this scene. Mock trial is about figuring out what kind of lawyer you want to be. And there are only two types. Winners and losers. I see the meme already. Winners don't make excuses when the other side plays the game. I feel like we're getting a Harvey TED Talk here.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Does Star Trek give you those TED Talks? It drops wisdom and philosophy, too. Right?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Star Trek.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

From your. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

When we're done watching this show, can we just watch all of Star the Next Generation and do a watch of that?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I would love that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Whoa, whoa. I just got. I just got tingly excited.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's fun. Cause maybe by then I'll be on the other side of menopause, and I'll just be stoned all the time.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And then can we bring on the. Like, do you think. Wait a minute.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Kristen's face is like, people come.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Will Patrick Stewart come? Will they come and talk to us? Could we do this?

[Patrick J. Adams]

I just want him to do the sonnets. But anyway, what I was gonna say was it's not the TED talk line that I loved the most. It was the opener when he says, take the drama down. Juliet.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, great.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Loved it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Nailed.

[Narrator]

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[Commercial Voiceover]

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[Sarah Rafferty]

All right, we're back. Let's get into act three. Mike approaches Donna's desk where she offers to play his client in the mock trial by giving her best Lena Lunders.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love how she's not necessarily offering. She's just assuming that she's cast.

[Sarah Rafferty]

God, it's so good. The scene is so good. This is one scene where you're so good that I am mad at my own performance a little bit.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You're insane.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, no, it's fine. I don't want to get too far down a thing where I'm too hard on myself. But you're so good that I think actually what's happening in the scene is I am genuinely overwhelmed by how funny and good you're being in this scene that I'm not fully connected and able to go with it. That's what I'm witnessing when I watch it. I don't want to get into a whole thing about me being hard on myself. It's fine. It's not a big deal. But this is one scene where I'm watching and I'm like, oh, I wish I could play this again. Like, I would do a couple of other things differently in this scene, but I think I am genuinely astonished by the performance you're giving.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Okay, my chin. My jaw is in my lap. I can't believe you're saying that. I don't think you remember that you Were improving. Like you added. Yeah. And it cuts to the bone.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I added that.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. I remember you coming up with that on the spot. You were improving. You were feeding into it. You were totally, totally playing totally there. And you were just supposed to be really freaked out by Donna's weirdness. And it's the perfect counterpoint to what she's doing. And then you have that beautiful turn when you say, I love you. Right. It all led to the satisfyingness of that moment. I do remember on set that day, we were laughing about the Demi Moore single tier.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Is there a particular film you're thinking of? A Demi Moore single tier? Ghost. Oh, right. Epic.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. So good.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And so I remember we were joking around and Erica was there, and I was like, oh, what if I said left eye or right? And they were like, yeah, keep it. And what I remember now, since we're doing this, all in order, is that I didn't necessarily ask for permission. Like, I had the last episodes. I was like, oh, I have an idea. How about this? This? And I was finding my feelings of belonging.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I think you're more relaxed. You're. Well, you're taking risks without feeling like you have to apologize for it. Like, all that stuff we've been talking about where you're, like, unsure if you can take up space and how much time and what can I ask for? That sort of slipping away? Is that what you mean?

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's slipping away? And I think basically I was like, wait. They have trusted me with this material. Like, it was delivered to me on the page. And so I had that element of, like, oh, they want me to play, like, that invitation. I had worked with Tim as an actor, and then I had you. And as the listener sees, you say incredibly nice things like this to me. Right. And so I felt. I think I felt really safe. I mean, it is kind of a case of life imitating art. Is that Donna is finding her spot in the fabric of the firm, and Sarah's kind of like, oh, I think I feel a little bit a part of this, too.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And how much. I mean, it's a lot to do with Erica again. Like, I think she got it. Like, in the writing, she got it. She opened up a door again, always. Erica and Erin. Erin's a huge part of it and encouraging it. But there's some part of Erica's voice that just really opens this all up.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I think for me, maybe that was a subconscious piece that I needed that permission from another female voice. Maybe I just needed that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Right.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I don't know, like, that's a special sauce that I can't really put my finger on, but it's definitely happening in this episode so often.

[Sarah Rafferty]

As advice on how to win the mock trial, Mike visits Jenny. He asks for help, and in the process, confesses his big secret.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So it's. Did you see your face? Do you see Mike's face when he sees Jenny?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Ugh. It's so good to see her. She's the best. And that is my face when I see Vanessa Rae, because she is the greatest, and she was so fun to work with, and it was so nice to have her back. I will say, though, this might be. Do we have a name for, like, the part of the episode that's, like, the part we're not the most fond of? Do we have, like, a category for that yet? Oh, I don't think we do.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So what's something that you dislike?

[Sarah Rafferty]

This scene, I think, look, it's a part of it. We can't have a whole scene where you see her learning about Mike's secret. But it feels like we. It's such. Mike hasn't told anybody the secret. Like, it's such a profound secret of the show that nobody knows. And then off screen, he just tells Jenny, and her reaction is just like, oh, that's crazy cool. Like, it's not. We have to get through it because the more important scene is what's coming up. And I love the next scene with us working on the trial together, but it just feels like it takes the air out of this secret that Mike.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Has that's so interesting. And you're yucking my yum a little bit, but I'm gonna show up anyway.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I love, love, love, love, love the next scene between the two of them. I think it's great, and I think it is the more important scene, and there are gonna be other characters where it's a big deal that they learn the secret. So I understand why. It's just. I feel this. Like, this. Like, oh, that's too easy. That happens too easily for somebody who's been hiding this the whole time. And the reaction from her character from Jenny is a little too, like, oh, that's all good. Like, we have to get into.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Now that you're saying that, I realize that I wasn't thinking that it was the whole kit and caboodle, which it would have had to have been. Right. Because she's gonna show up at Pearson Hardman and she. That you're not a lawyer.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. In order to get her character to where it needs to Be for this episode, which is great. It's so perfect. He needs to tell her.

[Patrick J. Adams]

That's so interesting that you brought that up, because it didn't bump me at all, because I was just all in because of the simple moment where she says, you trust me.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. So then we go right into the next scene, which I love. I love this scene. Great song. Do you want to tell us what the needle drop is in this song?

[Patrick J. Adams]

So it's Cafe Roma by Giacomo Bondi. Is that right? Giacomo. What? Howie?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Giacomo.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Is that why you said. Do you want to say it?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yep.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Whatever. It's Cafe Roma, and this is what brought me to bread. Can we play the first just, like, bar of this? Thank you for trying to get me to say do the hard stuff. Wait. Wait for it. Wait for it. Oh, strumming the guitar. Oh, my God. Strum the guitar. People listen to that. Look at that. This is a great, sweet, lovely smooch. You guys are fumbling with clothes like real humans, being super authentic. And then you pick her up. What the hell? I'm tired. Everybody's getting picked up. I am from big people. I don't think I ever really did this. I mean, I'm doing it at this.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I mean, we'll do it. I'll just pick you up, and we won't fall into bed together, but I'm gonna pick you up at the end of this.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I just had a panic attack when I was on Chicago Med recently. Oh, my God. Dom. Dom Reigns who I was playing opposite. Such a great guy. Very tall and handsome and built like all of our suits heroes, too. And I had to play a scene where he had to lift me up off the floor and I had to be dead weight, and I had a panic attack for, like, three days beforehand. He did it, like, 10 times like it was nothing. But, you know, it was like my stuff. It was like I'm triggered by the fact that all these girls are getting picked up. I would not do that.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There's a lot of picking up. I love this scene. I love that song everywhere. From now on, whenever I kiss my wife, I'm gonna have guitars playing that song.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What's really interesting about it is that this scene is cut, but also with the Scotty Harvey scene where they are smooching two, and it's just very different. So there's a real counterpoint in the slickness. Sorry, you might regret that word. For the Scottie and Harvey piece. And then the wholesomeness of this. As I said, like, you guys are gonna soft rock the shit out of each other any minute. And it's gonna happen off the.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Especially when she's just pointed out, like, you're charming, you're trustworthy. Don't try and be this other thing. Don't try and be Harvey, essentially.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I'm like, okay, I'll be me. And then I'm me. And then I have my own version of what Harvey's having in a penthouse.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So while Mike is with Jenny, Scotty arrives at Harvey's apartment in an elevator. In an elevator?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. Where's this elevator come from? We never see it again.

[Patrick J. Adams]

No, because we build the set and obviously that's not in the budget.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We have a fan question here about this apartment from Kathy. She asks, is that the same apartment that Harvey lives in in later seasons? Scotty comes in through an elevator in the main room. And Harvey's bedroom looks different. Yeah. This is actually. We found out this is the same location as the last episode. It's in the soho Hotel. Because we have not built Harvey's apartment on our stages yet. I'm not sure when that happened. I'm sure Kiki's gonna figure it out. Cause she's a superstar. But we don't have it yet. So we keep trying to find, you know, what it is in Toronto in real locations. And so they used this elevator.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I love that they used it because Scotty makes another entrance. Totally big old entrance.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. And it's also funny in shows, you think people are going to. Obviously people catch it, they see it, they go, wait, this doesn't look quite the same. But then you let it go, you know, like, do we though? Well, I think people let it go like nobody. It's not. It wasn't a huge issue that we never saw this elevator again. Right, right. Like you. You look at it in this episode, you accept it, and then you move on. And then when his apartment's built, do you really go, wait a minute, what's going on here? No, you just think you're looking at the apartment from a different angle.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Can we chat about. I don't know if Gabriel's going to be somewhere mad at me for this, but I got to point it out. Harvey's got a very sort of coquettish pillow hugging thing going on on the bed in this scene where he's putting it all together. It's such an interesting take. I don't know why you'd think he'd kind of be reclined, but instead he's on his stomach, like holding a pillow. It's Very different, and I love it. But I definitely. I was like, huh, Harvey.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Interesting.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You know What I mean? Is that sort of a.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Like, I feel like they planned it in the blocking so that when she comes back with the water, they're sort of laying facing each other, and they can have a kiss, and then he can get the idea because it's a aha moment. The kiss is the aha moment that she. She's potentially winning this legal thing. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That he's on to her. Like, wait a minute. This is. Something's going on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sidebar. This is unplanned.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We should have a. Can we have a sound effect for Sidebar. It's like a siren or something. Sidebar.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What is this vibe? Is this, like, heart to heart? Like, what were the shows? What was the Kathleen Turner movie with Michael Douglas? Like, the.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Romancing the Stone.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Romancing the Stone. Yes, it was Romancing the Stone.

[Sarah Rafferty]

What was the other one? Romancing the Stone and Jewel of the Nile.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But it comes out of, like, 1940s, 1950s meetings. Like, hey, Bub. You know, that kind of. Kind of a noirish post comedy, like his Girl Friday. Like those women who take charge and speak really fast.

[Sarah Rafferty]

SEM fatales. But, like, whatever the evolution of that is.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. There's a lot of it. It's evoking a lot of that. They're dynamic.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. You can't. You know. Can I trust this person? I mean, she's already displayed the fact that she can kind of outpace Harvey, and you can't trust Harvey. Like, you never know what he's doing. So, you know, right away, like, while I love these two together, I definitely don't think I can trust this woman. Like, she's. There's just something up her sleeve, and it's fun to watch him realize it. And, you know, they're playing a chess game, and they love it. Of course they love it. They, like, get off on it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's sexy. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But it's also not sustainable.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah. And that's why when Abigail peppers in these really subtle, nuanced, vulnerable moments.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It's such a grounded performance.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's beautiful, though, because you're like, is that resistance? Yeah, it's like, not. Not is. It's like, is she really feel that way, or is she trying to make Harvey feel bad so that he doesn't smell that she's onto something else? You know, it's perfect, Harvey. It's like the flip side of the coin. It's like, are you really feeling that, or is this just another Game again. Are you playing the man?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh. What did you just do?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Whoa.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, my God. And Mike's being ripped out of the counter and thrown on the carpeted floor.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Anyway, love them together. And it's a great scene based on her performance. Harvey surmises that Scotty's hiding something. She's beaten him at the merger, and he needs to know how. So he calls Mike into the office. I love seeing our guys in the office after hours, just trying to figure it out in T shirts and just cracking the case. Do you know what I mean?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Dressed casually is always.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He's got a great line in this scene. This is Haley's comet. Take a good look, because it'll never happen again.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, that's gonna go on the list of top lines from this episode for sure. Okay. We are back at Pearson Hardman for the conclusion of the mock trial. Lewis and Harvey place bets on the winner. Jenny and Rachel meet each other for the first time, and Harvey gives Mike a pep talk about playing the man.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I felt very nervous seeing these two women together in the same space.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yep. And the episode is doing its job.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah. I felt very like, whoa. Oh, no, no, no. But not like, what? There's no secrets. Like, there's no secrets here. But still, like, clearly there's conflict.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

The mock trial begins. Donna takes the stand as Mike's client, Lena Lunders. I. This might be the first time I literally laughed out loud. Well, I've laughed, but I'm a quiet laugher. I'm a quiet laugher. I like to laugh privately. This made me almost spit the drink out of my mouth when it cut to you crying. And just the silence. It's so expertly edited as well.

[Patrick J. Adams]

It really is.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It just holds on that face. So close. So good. Yes. Yes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Can I ask Sarah a question about the meta. Ness of acting and acting like you're acting to cry? Like, what is that process?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Like, does that make sense?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, my God. That's such a funny question. Okay, so I think I had plenty of experience, like, on the Practice, talking about being roofied and crying about it or playing the bad guys. You know, I had red hair. I don't know if you guys know this. I have red hair. But living your life as a redhead, as an actress, I think in the beginning, all my parts were like, the bad girl or the mysterious girl or did she do the crime or is she the victim of the crime? There was that. So I think what's super fun about this is that it's Donna getting her chance to be on sbu, it's Donna getting her chance to be on the Practice or, you know, be the victim here. And Donna really knows her audience. Like, when she leans into the piece about being like. But as a woman in power, people label you. Right.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And she's crying right now.

[Patrick J. Adams]

She's playing it for Jessica. Right. She knows who's there.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, but even Jessica. Everybody. Everybody at the scene is just like. It's just like, what is happening.

[Patrick J. Adams]

So that's the brilliance of this scene. That's why this scene works, is because the way the camera goes to every single other character and you specifically have their point of view of watching Donna overact the shit out of this part. That's why it plays. You know, it's like. It's like. You know, when you say, like, oh, I've gotta play, you know, the king walking on stage, well, the fact that I'm wearing a robe and a crown really helps. But also the way the crowd reacts really helps, like how everybody behaves in that thing. So the comedy is really in the hands of the people listening, to be honest.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, my God. Well, yes. Okay, so not only does this scene clearly win the Sara Rafferty should have won an Emmy Award of the Week, but that moment that I think we both found, which is just like. And Rick has got a tough job in this episode, which is sometimes you have episodes where you just don't have a lot to do. And then you have an episode like this where not only do you have a lot, not a lot to do, and you get to stay home and just sort of take a break, but you have to be there, and you have to be sitting and just watching a mock trial, and you don't get to do anything. Those are hard days. It's hard. I mean, look, there's harder days in the world, but it's rough to sit there for 12 hours and not really have much to do. And sometimes you miss that moment when the camera is on you for the two seconds of the day, and it kind of just. You're not paying attention, or you're just sort of tired and miked out. This is a. This is. You know, it's a very subtle, small moment, but earns the. My. Rick Hoffman should have won an Emmy Award for this episode. It's just a subtle rack focus from your enormous, beautiful, emotional performance to Rick's stunned face. And I can't tell if it's just stunned or if it's a little impressive. I have a lot of. How is she doing this? Like, I'm sort of in awe.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I swear to God, if I had been more hydrated, I would have pissed myself watching that. I went back so many times, I took a screen grab of it. I'm gonna put it on my phone so I can see it all the time. It's like you can hear his interior monologue. His interior monologue is on the outside. He's like, what the are you doing?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I have been on the other side of that face from Rick Hoffman many times in my life. And it's like, my favorite place to be when you earn that. Like, what is going on with you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

When you've pushed it so far that even Rick is like, I don't know how to follow you.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Also mixed with, like, something smells really bad too. Like, it's just, like, the funniest face. And also, Gina has that moment too, because when Lena Lunders is having this, like, feminist moment about how hard it is to be a woman that tees up. Like, Kyle's response. Gina has a little bit of a moment where she's nodding her head no. A little bit. It's like, as if she's watching a soap opera and being swept away by the soap opera for a few moments.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Interesting. Let's pull that up. That was not my read. My read was that Jessica's like, are you okay? But I'd love to see.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think. I think Gina is playing many, many things.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Well, of course she's not just playing one thing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah, fine. Okay, here we rock to wreck. But as a woman in power, people look at your success and label you. There. See? And they label you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You're right. No, there's so much going on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

People look at your success and they label you.

[Sarah Rafferty]

What's so funny is, like, your character is also just, like, in his most beautiful way, making this all about her. It has nothing to. This is, like, whole case going on.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think that's what.

[Sarah Rafferty]

There's nothing else matters.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Full immersion.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Full immersion.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Which is so good, I think that, like, Donna has not learned at all that acting is not all about you. It's about the other person.

[Sarah Rafferty]

But it helps. It's what he needs. He does the job. Brilliant. Love this scene. And then Jenny's next on the witness stand, followed by Rachel, who gets close to breaking. So I love this moment where Mike calms Jenny down. He kind of reciprocates what she did in the apartment. Yeah, I thought that was really sweet. And Jessica clocking it. It warmed my heart to have, like, Jessica see him do a nice thing.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And she Takes a note. Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And she's like, oh. Cause you'd think maybe she'd. She'd judge him for doing something nice. It's like, we don't know. We can't figure out where Mike Ross stands with Jessica Pearson. So it was nice to see her impressed by something.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And it will always be a push pull between the two of them, you know, moving forward, too.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Totally. Of course, I think the rest of this scene might be my scene of the episode. Just. It's the one again, the one I remember the most now that I'm watching it. And it feels really important to a lot of the characters, you know, specifically Mike and Ray. It just feels important to the show and to what happens here and to the decision that Mike makes. I love this scene. I thought it shot beautifully explained what.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Happens in this scene exactly. Like what Mike's choices are.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So there is an examination. He's put Rachel on the stand, and in order to get what he wants, he remembers Harvey's wise words, which is play the woman. And he remembers that Rachel feels like a fraud and feels like she's watched all these people succeed where she should have succeeded. And he pushes and pushes and pushes and pushes and breaks her. And then he has an opportunity to break her further. Once he's cracked it, he's like, okay, now's the time. And he offers up a settlement before he has to do it again. Kyle, being very Kyle, like, says, no, I want to see you break her. And Mike chooses not to, and he loses the mock trial. Just a beautiful setup. It's just, like, a really genius idea. It's executed beautifully. I think Megan's performance is gorgeous, and I think it was really fun. I don't know if we've had a courtroom scene in this show yet. I don't know if we've had your classic leading the witness. I object to all the stuff going on. We haven't seen that yet. And so it's kind of fun that on this law show, the first time you're seeing it is in this mock trial.

[Patrick J. Adams]

But I also love that much. Mike wins the case by losing it. In many ways, he wins our hearts by losing the case.

[Sarah Rafferty]

He wins you but loses the case. Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wins the audience but loses the case. I think we're also at a point in the season where everybody's locked into their characters so much. So the way that people are listening in this scene. And again, when we pan to them, it's very, very interesting, and the points of view are very clear. So when that moment Happens. Lewis is kind of surprised and marking it. It's like, very foreign to him.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Somebody doing something.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Like sacrificing their own position in life to.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And then Jenny's worried about Mike a little bit. At least that's what my interpretation of it is. Rachel is hurt and angry, as she should be. Donna's proud that he relented, is impressed with his authenticity and. And that he's human and that he's kind.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And I think that if I'm gonna speak from Donna's point of view, she really loves seeing that, because that's something that Harvey struggles with, that Donna takes nine seasons to kind of coax him out of. And Mike has arrived with it. Jessica, I think, seems to privately appreciate his heart and empathy. But then she has to have a verbal response to him later as the mentor and boss that's on the party line. That's what I said, and it was cold.

[Sarah Rafferty]

What did she say? What did. She looks right at him and says, naive and soft. That's what I say to myself every morning in the mirror. You. Soft and naive. It's so cruel. It cuts right to the bone, like.

[Patrick J. Adams]

A hard mentor might have. Right. I don't think it's true to who she wants to be as a human, but I think she's being the tough mentor.

[Sarah Rafferty]

All what you just described, all the different people's perspectives in the scene, all. Everybody having a bit of a different read on it. That's really hard to communicate. So, like, hats off to Erica for writing it and Aaron for writing it, but Tim for directing it. That's hard to, like, get all those different points of view and understand them. It's a complex and difficult feat, and he did a really beautiful job.

[Patrick J. Adams]

My question is, are those points of view, though, like, written out explicitly, or is everybody just very clear on who their character is?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, I think it's probably intended, but, no, I think it's a good point. People are playing it, too. People are bringing it, and then you're on set, and that means the DP seeing it, and they're like, oh, that's a good moment. That's a good moment. Make sure to get that. And then the editors in the editing room and seeing it, and they're grabbing. It's great. So everybody doing their part. But it does lead to a very kind of interesting and complex scene. So, anyway, that's, I think, my favorite scene of the episode.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Can we just see if there's a meme of that face of Rick, just so I can have access to it. I don't mean right now. This is a sidebar. Can you edit this out?

[Sarah Rafferty]

You know, you can just make your own memes.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What?

[Sarah Rafferty]

So if you want a meme, you just go ahead and make it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What are you talking about?

[Sarah Rafferty]

You just take the screengrab and you put words on it. It's a meme.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, but I want it to move. I want it to ride.

[Sarah Rafferty]

That's a gif. And you can also make your own.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Gif with your technical terms.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'll make you a GIF of that face. We're into Act 5 back in Harvey's office. Harvey expresses his disappointment at Mike's loss, but Mike is sure he did the right thing. I'm proud of Mike for standing up for himself here. I think it would be easy just to say, I'm sorry. I screwed up. But I think he's in the process of kind of realizing that he's not going to be Harvey and that he might not want to be, but we.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Had a private moment in the previous scene of Harvey. No, he was there. He had popped in and he looked away. Did you read into what his face was?

[Sarah Rafferty]

It seemed to me he was disappointed.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think he was two things.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Oh, okay. See, I'm trying to simplify, but you're right. Life is complex.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Things can be two things.

[Sarah Rafferty]

All I was paying attention to was how you could tell all the other actors had to be there for the whole scene, and Harvey only had to be there for one shot.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And, yeah, it was not linked to anybody else. No one else was in a shot. You are good.

[Sarah Rafferty]

You figured out how to be. There's tricks. You've done this long enough. And there's tricks to be like, I'm going to be standing over here in this corner so you can shoot me out. It's like if you're working with a child on set. I just learned this because children have only a certain amount of time they can be on set before they have to go home or go to school or whatever. So if you're in a scene with kids and you really want to go home early, you just go and stand as close to the kid as possible and put your hand on their shoulder in the scene. Because as soon as they get cut, you're inevitably getting cut.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait, that's brilliant.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Genius.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait a second. Did you just figure that out on your own or did somebody.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Somebody taught it to me on this show.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wait, you just taught it to me. And I am on a show with a lot of kids.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, just get as close as you can to the kid who's pumpkin ing early as possible. Pumpkining is the word for you turn into a pumpkin, and the kid's gotta.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Go, oh, my God.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, it's pretty good.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Wow. I'm gonna. Next season on Walter Boys. I'm gonna be like, I am sitting right next. He's on my lap.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, exactly.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We're going to play this with him on my lap. Yeah, that's perfect.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We have a fan question from Gabby.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, yes, it's Gabby who runs the Suits Nostalgia account and the Sarah Rafferty Styles account. And I got to meet her happily in Chicago recently. Can't we, dear?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Let's hear what Gabby has to say.

[Patrick J. Adams]

After the mock trial. Harvey is obviously disappointed in Mike, but Donna seems to have a different reaction. Almost as if she's happy or proud he gave up the win. Why do you think this was Donna's response? And how do you think this impacted Mike and Donna's friendship moving forward?

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's a great question, and I think we talked a little bit about it. But what it's making me think now is that Donna is a champion for Mike in this part of him. Nobody else at the firm is super supportive of Mike's open heart in these situations. You can tell everybody's trying to harden him up and have him not be that soft. They want him to be more Harvey like. And Donna is the only person and who is fighting for that part of Mike.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Donna and Mike are also from outside of this world.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And she wants to preserve that in him. Because I personally. I'm Mommy in this scenario. I personally want Mike to still be able to be who he is. So I think when Donna sees him making these choices from his heart, she feels it too. Right. It's like a thing that they have in common, that they lead with their.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Hearts, similar to our. To our love together.

[Patrick J. Adams]

To our little touching.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Touching. You know, just keeping each other soft.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Keeping each other soft, real and tender. But it's a. It's a great question. Thanks for noticing that, Gabby. I think it's also something that I already touched on this episode, which is that, you know, she's got a long road, Donna, in terms of helping Harvey to become a little bit more in touch with his heart and his integrity and who he truly is, whereas Mike is coming in with it, and she just doesn't want him to lose it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Right. I think that's true.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Thank you for that question. Love it.

[Sarah Rafferty]

So Harvey got the hotel merger back on track. Unfortunately, at Scotty's Expense. There at the Harvard Club, Harvey meets Scotty, and she reveals that she's getting engaged. Just a beautiful scene. It's so. This whole relationship, the whole setup is such a huge win of this episode. You know, not only is it this amazing mock trial that I think does so much, but I just think this relationship is so interesting and so complex. And, you know, it reveals this part of Harvey that we haven't seen before. The way he hugs her as she's walking out. Beautiful. It's just like. It's all so heartbreaking in that, you know, this is an episode about people and people changing, and what are they willing to change. And you're in this scene, and you get faced with this. We can't change. You know that. We're not gonna change this part of ourselves. Not now, not today. Like, we. We're accepting who we are, and that this is how it is, and we are these people, and we will always be these people.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And it leaves us with an ache.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You know, and I think Abigail, she leaves us really feeling for her and really needing more of her. I mean, it's without a doubt gonna.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Become so good in this episode. Meanwhile, the associates are out celebrating. Rachel thanks Mike for how he handled the trial. And she confesses that she was so hard on him this week because she expects more from him than most people.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Oh, really? Wait.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And he says, why? And what does she say?

[Abigail Spencer]

You're a smart guy. You can figure it out.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I got chills in that part. That was great. Perfectly delivered by Megan. Just a great performance. And it was like in an episode where we finally felt for Mike and Jenny, and we were like, they're pretty damn cute together. That's pretty great. It's a very strong way to end the episode. Cause you're like, oh, damn, that's a pretty powerful relationship.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I'm struggling.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, it's tough. I know we don't want to do teams.

[Patrick J. Adams]

We don't do teams.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We don't do teams here. But it's hard because life is hard. And there's two roads that are opening up for our young guy Mike. And it's tough. This, again, perfect setup. This whole show is about which way, what kind of person you want to be, what life do you want? Who are you going to be? And here's Mike's version of what Harvey just had in the Harvard Club. Which life do you want? This life or this life? Who would you want to share that life with? And they both seem to represent different paths.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Look at what this episode did. Like, from the macro right down to the micro. So you're talking about how expertly delivered that last line is and how well written it is. And we have a million specific lines that we could put on the list of favorite lines. But then what? It knit together overall, that theme in an episode that actually at times made us legitimately laugh out loud. Like you. I really laughed out during it. But also am leaving with this ache. Cause Scotty's going back to London and they're gonna keep missing each other and they can't get out of their own way.

[Sarah Rafferty]

It's what we've been talking about, though. Like, what episode is this?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Seven. Lucky seven.

[Sarah Rafferty]

We're in episode seven of the first season of a show, and it's just going like, I get it Again, we've talked about it before. I was worried to start doing this. I was worried that every week I'd be like, oh, God, I gotta watch another. This is hard. And I'd have to do all this sort of putting armor on and getting over my own ins. And like, I watch this and I'm like, this is really good.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Yeah.

[Sarah Rafferty]

And I hate to sound surprised, but I kind of. I'm just so proud of everyone and honored to be a part of it.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I asked. I texted Aaron last night about this. He said Erica was such an incredibly special writer. I think Play the Man stepped up season one to another level.

[Sarah Rafferty]

No, definitely agreed.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I think there was a really special magic in having the mock trial bring the whole Firm together. Just knit it all together so that we can see it as one organism and not just a typical A, B, C storyline. The storylines aren't that disparate in this one. We're not spending a lot of time on a case in that way outside of the Firm. And that brought an intimacy to it like a family reunion would. Or like a wedding episode or a Christmas episode, a holiday episode where everybody's together. I think that was really special. I'm also a little bit Team Jenny right now.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Ooh, controversial.

[Patrick J. Adams]

I said it. But just for now. It's just for the moment. I'm gonna be fickle and go back and forth on that. I love that our two heroes, Mike and Harvey, were terrific in this episode. Just so great. But really, I really, really especially loved how often they were going toe to toe with a female counterpart who really had a chance to shine and be of equal status. Right. And have equal screen time, have equal line counts. Probably if I looked at it closely, the banter is just unbelievable. And Erica, if you're listening, you know I've been saying this for over a decade. Can I please come work with you again?

[Sarah Rafferty]

Yeah, give us jobs. We love jobs. All right, well, that's it. Before we close out, let's get a guess on the goddamn count for the week.

[Patrick J. Adams]

What are you going one?

[Sarah Rafferty]

I'm going to go zero on this.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Patrick's on a bit of his two. Stop it. Yes.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Zero. I was just feel. I feel like Erica. I can imagine Erica kind of sneakily being like we're not going to do any. I don't know. Yeah, that feels right. So what is that? What are we up to? Total?

[Patrick J. Adams]

Well, still 18.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I didn't remember last week. I'm living hour now.

[Patrick J. Adams]

You're just running.

[Sarah Rafferty]

I live life a quarter mile at a time. Okay, well, that's case closed on Play the Man. Thank you all so much for coming back and please join us next week for a new episode. Make sure to rate, review and subscribe.

[Guest Speaker]

It is such a great and important.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Way for you to support the show.

[Patrick J. Adams]

And as always, we want to hear from all of you. If you have questions, thoughts or ideas, please send your emails to sidebarpodcasteriousm.com and if you want to record an audio clip of the question, go for it. We would love to play it on the show.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Have a great week, everybody. Thank you so much and see you next time.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Thank you. Let's touch one more time with honesty.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Touch you. It's too much bread.

[Commercial Voiceover]

And cue the bread.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Cue the bread.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Sidebar is produced by Sarah Rafferty, Patrick J. Adams and SiriusXM Media.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Our senior producer is Kimmy Gregory and.

[Guest Speaker]

Our producer and researcher is Kristen Schrader.

[Patrick J. Adams]

Our sound engineer is Alex Gonzalez and our music is by Brendan Burns.

[Sarah Rafferty]

Our executive producers are Cody Fisher and Colin Anderson. Netcredit is here to say yes to.

[Narrator]

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[Sarah Rafferty]

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[Commercial Voiceover]

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