← Sidebar with Katie Phang
Sidebar with Katie Phang
Trump Scrambles as France’s Epstein Investigation Closes in on Ghislaine Maxwell
00:29:29
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- [00:00]
A
With the news of the death of Daniel Syed, the longtime modeling scout and recruiter. As I say, for people like Jeffrey Epstein, Jean Luc Brunel and Gerald Marie and possibly others with this news, it just underscores the importance of how investigating the international component of these sex trafficking rings is the key to being able to find more perpetrators, find more enablers, find more groomers and recruiters and others that should be prosecuted. It's part of the pathway to be able to achieve justice and accountability. And we know that the Trump DOJ is not doing anything to advance that accountability and justice for the survivors and victims of Epstein, Ghislaine Maxwell and others. So now we turn our sights to other countries like France and England. England sitting there and saying, hey, extraditing the Tate brothers to come and face the 58, 59 charges of rape and trafficking and assault and child pornography or technically, child sexual abuse material that they're facing. You know what, it looks good and it sounds good to see that type of investigations being done, but the problem is Daniel Syed has now died. And, and the French authorities never spoke to him before he died. And he was a scout for Epstein, Brunel and Marie. And so we can't afford to wait. We can't afford not to continue to talk about the Epstein files and talk about the horrific crimes that were perpetrated by him and others. And there are people that are fighting across the sea, across the ocean. Excuse me, people like Homeira Sellier, the founder of Innocence in Danger in France. She was the reason why authorities and investigators in France back in 2019 started looking into Jeffrey Epstein, Ghislaine Maxwell and others. And so I wanted to make sure that people understood what Innocence and Danger is doing and why it is so important that somebody like Todd Blanche not become the permanent Attorney General, and why we need the Epstein files to be released in their entirety and unredacted. Take a listen. Joining me now, I do have the privilege of being able to speak with Omera Cellier, the founder of Innocence in Danger. Omera, I am still here in France and I am thrilled to be able to get into the details of some of the work that I am doing here, but it is so small compared to the amazing, amazing campaign of advocacy that you launched with Innocence and Danger and that you continue to. To try to strive for. I actually wanted to start our conversation today with the title of your latest substack post, and the title of it is the Enablers of Glamour Dismantling the Myth of. Of Modern Human Trafficking. What do you mean by that.
- [03:21]
B
Well, I mean that, you know, human trafficking is one of the missions of Innocence in Danger. It is one of the things we have been fighting against, rescuing victims, taking the bad guys to court and so on and so forth. But with what has been revealed lately through. When I say lately, I mean since the Epstein case, what we know about it, what is totally startling to me, and I think it should open other people's eyes, is that modeling is now to me, a market where they are modeling agencies who bring in models from all over the world, some minors, mostly minors. And they are promised a dream. As I say in the second paragraph of my article, it is what happens is a handshake is a dream that these girls have, and they are promised that they will get there. And then finally what we find out is that there is a massive, massive disillusion, abuse going on under the glamour of modeling and fashion shows and so on. And what I have to say, I'm very happy that we start with this topic, Katie, because what I am very surprised about is that Innocence in Danger has been very lonely in this case from day one. I don't understand. Not only where are the other NGOs who fight trafficking, who fight sexual abuse in the US in France and elsewhere, where are they? What's going on? I mean, were they all receiving money from these people so they can't do anything? This is a question mark. Do they not care? Then they have to close. They have to shut down their NGOs, and another very, very questionable point to me is that women like Oprah Winfrey, like Michelle Obama, like all these women who have been so loud about, you know, protecting women, I haven't heard any voices on this case. I don't know why. I mean, not in the us not in the rest of the world. This case has been left so alone, and I don't have the answer. It's a question that I have been asking myself from 2019 until today, in 2019, when I wrote to the prosecutor in France to say that I think an investigation should be opened on this man, whose name is Jeffrey Epstein. Because I had had a friend on the phone, friend, journalist, investigator, who told me that this man is in Paris. And I found out what he has done, what was known back then, only what was known back then. And I said, I don't believe that he will leave his activity behind when he is in Paris. I think he continues. I'm sure he does. And I think you should keep an eye. But you know, Katie, until Today, no other NGOs no other voices have joined ours and those of the survivors. And it is a question mark that is very unpleasant to have to ask myself along the road because everybody should be with us. Everybody. And also including modeling agencies, including fashion brands, Fashion brands. Cash money on the back of the models. They live of their labor, of their work. Shouldn't they be caring for their security, for their well being? Shouldn't they be fighting next to us today and homeyra?
- [07:48]
A
This is why I think this conversation is the beginning of many. Because I think it's important for people to understand that the mo. The modus operandi of these crimes, of these international trafficking rings, you know, a lot of them are premised on this idea of promises of futures given to girls that are often, if not almost all the time underage, from foreign countries that are given visas and places to live. That's what Jeffrey Epstein did. Jeffrey Epstein did it with Jean Luc Brunel, Gerald Marie, John Casablancas, I mean, you name it. These are all big names running big modeling agencies and these huge modeling houses across the world. And yet it is now coming out even more now, to your point that they all operate in the same fashion, right? No pun intended. They all operate in the same way. Why was it so important when you found it Innocence and Danger to come forward for this? Because I agree. We have seen now evidence that Epstein was doing his recruiting with, with the help of Jean Luc Brunel and Daniel Saene here in Paris and here all over Europe to be able to bring these young girls and then to put them on planes and take them to the Virgin Islands and take them to the United States and then putting them up in apartments and controlling their money and they have no way to pay the rent and they have nowhere to go.
- [09:10]
B
I mean, the mission of Innocence in Danger is to protect and to advocate for victims of sexual abuse. It was all natural for me to come in and to act upon this case as soon as I understood what kind of man Jeffrey Epstein could be. And it was very. I mean, it was not an effort. I didn't have to think twice. I simply thought that this man is coming to Paris. He has a flat in Paris. He has chosen to be in Paris for some reason because it's obvious that France is the only country outside the US where he had a house, he had purchased an apartment. And I was sure that this is because he had friends who were enablers. That's what I'm talking about. Who would book the girls, men who would traffic the girls, who would give them visas, who would Put them in planes. Then who would take those passports and the visas to force them to do what they wanted them to do and prey upon them? It is what we do. This is what we do. And of course, I can tell you, Katie, that compared to what I knew in 2019, what I thought I knew in 2019, which was revealed back then, what I learned since then, it's an ocean of documents, as you know, and proofs of what has happened. This exhibition, which was in New York, I believe. And when you see these rooms with all these documents on the wall, they are all proofs. I am quite stunned that also in the US There has been a very. I can say the investigation, if there has been any, has been. Has neglected everything. And what we should. What I wrote. I wrote a piece a couple of months ago to. But back then it was Pam Bundy who was speaking about. Speaking to say nothing about all these
- [11:30]
A
things, but not like Todd Blanche is doing more right now.
- [11:34]
B
Todd Blanch? Yeah, Todd Blanche is also doing nothing. And I want to tell these people this is an international transnational criminal case. You cannot sit on documents and refuse to investigate and indict people who have for three, four decades trafficked minors, enslaved them, raped them. And today, because this one or that one is protecting. I don't know who. I mean, we know, we know what kind of people they are protecting, but this is not okay. Then they should go and do something else. They should not be at the position of responsibility and talking in the name of justice, because there has been no justice here. And you have.
- [12:27]
A
Oh, go ahead. I'm sorry.
- [12:28]
B
I mean, this is not only American. This is not an American case. This is an international case. There are victims from all over the world as we speak. Now, I heard that they are 10, 11, maybe 12 investigations, small ones in this or that country. They are starting, but nobody should be stopping these people do to do their work.
- [12:56]
A
And you yourself have also called for the French Senate to launch a parliamentary inquiry, which I think is brilliant. I just wanted to read off a couple of the questions that you believe need to be answered, because I think they're important. For example, Homera, you say, why was Jeffrey Epstein's Paris apartment not searched until September 23, 2019? What materials were seized? How were they classified? What cross checks were carried out with foreign authorities and parallel French proceedings? What investigative lines involving third parties were open at the time of Jean Luc Brunel's death? And it goes on and on. Why has not one single client name been made public after more than 1500 days of detention in the sex trafficking case of Ghislaine Maxwell, who, who is a French citizen. And you know, because we've spoken, how much my focus is on having Galen Maxwell extradited to France to face justice here. Yes, but your questions, I don't mean to use this adjective in a derogatory way. Your questions are so fundamentally basic, they are so decently clear. Why are there no answers, even from French authorities, about what happens?
- [14:12]
B
I know, I, I, I, the senator I met a couple of months ago who accepted to carry this plea of mine into the Senate, he himself, he didn't have any answer to all these questions because before I go, I sent to his office a number of, you know what I think, and my questions are very legitimate. And how can somebody die and the apartment be searched, raided only five weeks later? Why? What happened during those five weeks? And where is the material which was seized? Why is nobody indicted? Why? There are, I mean, we have, there were some names here and there, but those people are as free as you and I, and it's not okay. They should at least be heard. And when I say be heard, I mean they should be asked questions in a very direct way. Not like even I saw a few of the interrogations in the U.S. i mean, my God, they were so weak. America can do better. Every country can do better. What's wrong? What's wrong with these people? Why are they doing what they are doing? They are put in these positions because the American citizens entrusted them, just like those in France. And they have to serve the people. Todd Blanche thinks he has to serve Donald Trump. He has to serve American people. Yes. And I don't even understand that he's kept in this position because he's not doing the job.
- [16:00]
A
I share your frustration about that, and unfortunately, I'm fighting against him getting confirmed as the Attorney General. But I will say this. You know, I think what people need to understand is that, and that this is not just a Jeffrey Epstein, Jean Luc Brunel, Galen Maxwell, Daniel Sed problem. This is also a Gerald Marie, John Casablancas problem, that these worlds of these predators collided and were linked and connected in many ways. And part of it is, is establishing those connections because again, they all had the same way that they preyed on these young children, the way that they brought them in to this industry. And that's why I was really pleased to go to court last week with Matthias, the young lawyer who is working so hard to represent some new victims that have come forward to be able to get justice for their Abuse and the crimes that they suffered from because of Gerald Marie as well.
- [17:09]
B
Yes, I mean, these people, these men were all together. We have the name of Gerald Marie here for the case, this specific case which was filed a couple of days ago, thanks to Matthias. But let me be clear. I think we agree on that. Gerald Marie and Jean Luc Bouronal and Daniel Siat, Jeffrey Epstein and Giancasablancas, they were all part of the same group. They were all together. One was doing this, one was doing that. They were passing the girls from here. They were traffickers, they were sex traffickers. And they acted in plain sight for three decades. And I find it very unfair that the models who spoke as early as 1988 and then again in 1996, then again in 2000, then again in 2001, they said everything, they explained everything, There was no investigation whatsoever about all the facts that they spoke about. And today they want to tell them that there is status of limitation. Yeah, it's actually the status of limitation. I hope we will have a good judge who will understand that not all of them, not all of the survivors are time barred, first of all. And if we have only one who is not time barred, she can open the door to all the others. Thanks to legislation which passed in 2023 called sliding statues of limitation. Which is, which is a. Yeah, it's a good article of law. I'm happy it's there. I'm happy we can lean on that. I'm just praying to. Praying to the universe or whatever. So we have a judge who really wants to dig the truth and do the work. I really hope so. He will be remembered for, for the legacy he will leave on this case. Because I think, as I told you, I started Innocence in danger in 1999. I have been working on many criminal cases before. This is what we do, but this one is very important because of the impunity and because impunity of institutions, impunity of those men. And because sadly, I see how far up it goes in every country. And this is, this is, you know, it's very troubling because those people who are kind of covering up or having other people cover up for them, they are those who are telling people, citizens, what is good, what is not good, what to do, what not to do. And they are covering crimes. How can they feel comfortable with it?
- [20:30]
A
Yeah, I wanted to just briefly interrupt because I tried to explain here on an episode that I did on the channel last week about the juge d' instruction, like this, this role that is so unique to French judicial system because we do not have that in the United States. Humera, maybe you can just give a little bit more detail because when you speak of a judge, you are speaking of this juge destruction, the investigating judge, the instruction judge, which I think is so important, I call them in English, the investigating judge. But this role is so unique because the investigating judge is given powers to be able to subpoena and interview and, and to. And to explore how far out the tentacles and the web of the trafficking and the people that are involved go versus just staying in the narrow lane of only looking at Gerald Marie only. I mean, this investigating judge can look all the way to people like Ghislaine Maxwell, right?
- [21:31]
B
Exactly. In France, when you file as a civil party in a criminal case, the hope is to have an investigating judge, as you call it, who is nominated. He has the power, first of all, he's independent, he's normally independent, which is a lot, which is very important. And he has the authority to do everything you can imagine. Search warrants, indictments, digging information and going after those who need to be indicted. So if we have the nomination of an investigating judge soon, which I hope we do, remember August is not. Is closed. Justice doesn't work here. But I'm hoping maybe in September, in the fall. In the fall, exactly. I would be very happy to know his name and to make it obvious for him to know that not only innocence in danger, but I mean, although as I said earlier, we are the only voices now speaking about this case for the time being. I am hoping with what is coming that we will be totally at his disposal, his or her disposal, to help with survivors with what we think is interesting to be digged in. And in my opinion, Ghislaine Maxwell should be indicted in France because she's so protected in the us I mean she will never do anything in the us. She has traffic, she's imprisoned for trafficking. But to whom? To people in another planet, I mean to other entities, to Avnis.
- [23:37]
A
That's the absurdity that it's only been at least in the Epstein case, it's only been Epstein and Maxwell, it's been nobody else. And yet we have 3 million plus documents only that have been released that show other perpetrators. Which gets me to my last question, Omara, which is this. How important in your opinion, having found an innocence in danger, having been in this French system and understanding it, how important is it for authorities in France to have access to the unredacted Epstein files, to be able to help them in Their investigation of how it hurt people in France as well, well, it
- [24:12]
B
is absolutely capital because, because this is what an investigation looks like. I mean, they cannot, you cannot work upon papers where the, you know, the only the name of the survivors are, are, are, are seen and the rest is redacted. So you see, this is also something that investigating judge can do. He can demand unredacted information from the US authorities. And if they did not give it, which I heard in one episode in the Jean Luc Brunel case happened, then I think the world should know. I heard. The problem is. I'm happy to speak about it, Katie, because it's important, but I have not been able to double check anything. But it was said that when Jean Luc Brunel was being investigated, because don't forget, Jean Luc Brunel came to the US and stayed in Florida for six, seven months. I personally think that he was there to clean up, you know, to remove what was to be removed. But he couldn't remove everything because some of those documents were documents to blackmail other people. So I think, you know, not everything was destroyed. Anyhow, there is a rumor it was actually in France. It was written in an article in the magazine Society. It is said somewhere that Jean Luc Brunel had containers with information inside and French authorities, while they were investigating Jean Luc Brunel had demanded from the American authorities to have access to that information about that and that the American justice system never got back to them. Okay, Brunel is dead now, nevertheless, I mean, you know, if this is true and Society is a very serious magazine, I cannot imagine they wrote something which was not verified. But I mean, this should not happen again. This cannot happen again because this time the world, the whole world will know.
- [26:41]
A
Well, yes, and, and, and Jean Luc, Jean Luc Brunel and Jeffrey Epstein, for those that are listening and needed the reminder, they, they created a modeling agency together that was in Florida, in Miami beach, funded with Epstein's dirty money. And Brunel was working with Epstein as well as the kind of top recruiter Daniel Said, who now has been identified by a Swedish woman because of the release of the Epstein files as being one of her rapists who then took her to Jean Luc Brunel and Gerald Maria and all these others. So I mean, the more information that gets out Homeyra, I believe the more victims and survivors will step forward, the more that they will identify perpetrators and they will say this, but we need more of the information out so that they can do so.
- [27:32]
B
Exactly, exactly. I am sure that there will be other survivors joining those who are here already who have come forward. And I want to thank them because it's not easy to be the first ones. It's not easy to remember all those terrible stories again and again. But I am. Yeah, I'm sure more will come forward, especially once we can use this lighting. Status of limitation. Yes, that would be a great page turned. Amazing. Not only in France, everywhere. Yeah. Yes.
- [28:11]
A
Yeselier, thank you so much. This is the first of many conversations for us to have as my investigative work continues and your amazing advocacy and work continues. I am grateful for you taking the time to be with me today to be able to have this conversation, because I think it's important to explain, expose it all so that people understand how it worked, how the machine worked, how it. How it was able to do what it did. Because if we do that, as you advocate for it, innocence and danger, when we expose it, we can also protect what happens today and in the future, not just what happened to people in the past.
- [28:52]
B
Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. But, Katie, thank you for giving me the opportunity to explain a little bit what we're doing. And I hope we will have other conversations anytime. Anytime.
- [29:07]
A
Thank you. Merci puku for your time.
- [29:10]
B
Merci. Merci a toi. Merci.
- [29:12]
A
Katie Fang here. We launched the Katie Fang News Channel in partnership with the Midas Touch Network, so we could bring you the latest in legal and political news. Straight, no chaser. So if you're a fellow truth teller, hit that subscribe button and share the word about this channel so we can build a high information America together.