#SistersInLaw Episode 214: Misprision
Release Date: December 14, 2024
Hosts: Joyce Vance, Jill Wine-Banks, Barbara McQuaid, Kimberly Atkins Stohr
Published by: Politicon

1. Holiday Preparations and Personal Stories

The episode kicks off with the hosts sharing their personal holiday preparations, setting a warm and relatable tone before delving into more serious topics.

• Jill Wine-Banks [00:10]: Kicks off the show by mentioning the holiday merch store before transitioning to the main discussions.

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [01:20]: Shares her experience of decorating with both artificial and live Christmas trees, highlighting the emotional boost from holiday decorations:

  "Putting on some Christmas music, putting up some lights and things around the house. Hanging mistletoe actually did lift my mood."

• Joyce Vance [02:17]: Describes her creative approach to tree decoration to keep her cats away:

  "Instead of a tree skirt, I couldn't find my tree skirt. So I got on Amazon this pink fuzzy cat tunnel... it's like a little tunnel around. I'll take a picture."

• Barbara McQuaid [03:47]: Recounts a family anecdote about losing a phone in the snow, emphasizing the shared experiences during the holiday season.

• Jill Wine-Banks [05:11]: Shares a heartfelt story about losing her engagement ring stone and its miraculous recovery, reinforcing the theme of holiday miracles.

2. Luigi Mangione Arrest and Extradition Processes

The hosts transition to discussing the high-profile case of Luigi Mangione, the alleged assassin of a United Healthcare CEO.

• Barbara McQuaid [10:07]: Introduces the case details:

  "Police arrested 26-year-old Luigi Mangione as a suspect in the assassination of an Insurance Co. CEO outside the Hilton hotel in midtown Manhattan."

• Jill Wine-Banks [10:52]: Explains the complexities of extradition within the U.S. legal system:

  "Extradition is actually in the Constitution. It is one of the parts of Article 4... The reason for extradition is to make sure that fugitives from the law in state one can't flee to another state and just escape."

• Joyce Vance [13:06]: Speculates on Mangione's motives for fighting extradition, suggesting he aims to use the courtroom as a platform:

  "My sense is that he is someone who has a platform and who has an agenda that he wants to push... an opportunity for expanding his platform and getting his views out in public."

3. Surveillance Cameras and Ghost Guns

The discussion pivots to the role of surveillance technology and the emergence of ghost guns in criminal activities.

• Barbara McQuaid [18:33]: Questions the effectiveness and ethical implications of surveillance cameras:

  "Surveillance cameras in this case is what allowed those McDonald's customer and employee to recognize him."

• Jill Wine-Banks [19:34]: Highlights the balance law enforcement must maintain when releasing suspect photos:

  "But in this case, I think the balance was used in the right way."

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [30:45]: Defines ghost guns and their impact on law enforcement:

  "A ghost gun is simply one that is assembled at home, usually from parts that have been bought online without a background check... It has become quite popular."

• Joyce Vance [32:40]: Emphasizes the challenges ghost guns pose for tracing and enforcement:

  "They are not traceable, because that frame that you've 3D printed has no tracing marks."

4. President Biden’s Clemency and Pardons

A significant portion of the episode delves into President Biden's controversial use of clemency and pardons, sparking debates on justice and fairness.

• Barbara McQuaid [38:15]: Criticizes the pardons granted to nonviolent but serious offenders, particularly those involved in white-collar crimes:

  "These are rich people crimes... They are people who are deserving of lengthy prison sentences."

• Joyce Vance [41:10]: Supports the initial steps of the clemency program, advocating for broader criminal justice reform:

  "I think as long as this is the first step and not the last step, it'll be a good thing."

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [43:28]: Discusses the need for case-by-case evaluation of clemency petitions:

  "Do a lot more of it. Right. But we are better off as a community when we don't lock people up in prison because the reality."

• Barbara McQuaid [50:29]: Argues that ending the death penalty should be achieved through legislation rather than executive pardons:

  "I think that we should require Congress to change."

5. DOJ Developments: FBI Director Resignation and Civil Rights Division Nominee

The hosts analyze recent changes within the Department of Justice, focusing on the FBI Director's resignation and the controversial nomination for the Civil Rights Division.

• Barbara McQuaid [53:49]: Expresses concerns over FBI Director Chris Wray’s resignation and its implications for DOJ norms:

  "I kind of feel like if somebody's going to bust a norm here, make Trump do it, don't make it easy for him."

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [32:59]: Reviews the Supreme Court case on ghost guns and predicts continued regulation:

  "I don't think the Supreme Court is going to buy that. I think these will be regulated even if the Biden executive order is rescinded."

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [57:53]: Criticizes the nomination of Harmeet Dhillon for the Civil Rights Division, questioning her commitment to protecting voting rights:

  "She's putting in place someone whose whole claim to fame is doing the exact opposite right now."

• Jill Wine-Banks [60:43]: Addresses the DOJ Inspector General's report on January 6, debunking conspiracy theories and affirming no FBI involvement:

  "It absolutely says there was no FBI involvement in this event on January 6th."

6. Listener Questions and Panel Responses

The episode features a segment where the hosts answer listener-submitted questions, providing expert insights on pressing issues.

• Stephanie from Cleveland, Ohio:
  Question: "Is anyone legitimately investigating the election results? It seems that neither side trusts them. How can we fix that?"
  Response (Kimberly Atkins Stohr [64:22]):

  "Yes, the election results have been very, very well vetted... widespread voter fraud in a presidential election is very, very difficult to impossible... People spread disinformation about fraud."

• Fred:
  Question: "Would the speech and debate clause protect members of the January 6 committee and their staff from threats made by Donald Trump and Cash Patel?"
  Response (Barbara McQuaid [67:31]):

  "The speech or debate clause... means that anything a member of Congress does in their capacity as someone focusing on legislation or investigation is insulated... but it would not stop the FBI from initiating an investigation."

• Thalia:
  Question: "Would any of you ever consider running for office?"
  Responses:

  • Joyce Vance [69:25]: Reflects on the challenges and expresses openness to advisory roles or local positions.

    "I'm going to give a different answer than I would have given a year ago... I wouldn't rule out maybe serving on an advisory board or maybe running in my county."

  • Kimberly Atkins Stohr [71:26]: Decisively declines.

    "Nope. Nope. No Nope. Nopety Nope. Nope. Nope. Never. We'll never run for office."

  • Jill Wine-Banks [71:27]: Shares a past experience running for a delegate position and expresses willingness to serve in various capacities if circumstances change.

7. Closing Remarks

The hosts wrap up the episode by encouraging listener engagement and reiterating the importance of staying informed on DOJ developments.

• Joyce Vance [63:37]:

  "We are all lawyers by nature. We are DOJ watchers. But I suspect we will be doing an even more tightly focused DOJ watch for the next four years than we have up until now."

• Jill Wine-Banks [69:06]: Concludes by emphasizing the necessity of active participation in democracy:

  "It is important... for all of us to consider how we can best serve. Whether it's on your local library board to make sure that books aren't banned, your school board, or at a state or federal level."

Notable Quotes

• Jill Wine-Banks [05:11]:

  "It was a Christmas miracle."

• Joyce Vance [27:38]:

  "I have seen people have been referencing a David French article in the Times that suggests that there's a benefit to doing it this way."

• Barbara McQuaid [38:15]:

  "These are rich people crimes... They are people who are deserving of lengthy prison sentences."

• Kimberly Atkins Stohr [64:22]:

  "People spread disinformation about fraud."

Key Takeaways

• Extradition Complexity: Understanding the constitutional and legal frameworks governing extradition within the U.S. highlights the due process afforded to suspects like Luigi Mangione.

• Impact of Surveillance and Technology: While surveillance cameras aid in capturing suspects, issues like privacy concerns and the rise of ghost guns pose significant challenges for law enforcement.

• Clemency and Justice: President Biden's broad clemency grants spark debate on fairness and the prioritization of which offenders deserve leniency, particularly in white-collar crimes.

• DOJ Leadership and Civil Rights: Recent changes within the DOJ, including the FBI Director’s resignation and controversial nominations, signal potential shifts in the enforcement of civil rights and election protections.

• Public Trust in Elections: Misinformation undermines public trust in election integrity, necessitating robust communication and transparency from election officials and law enforcement.

• Active Civic Engagement: The importance of participating in democratic processes, whether through running for office or supporting protected institutions, is emphasized as vital for maintaining a fair and just society.

Conclusion

Episode 214 of #SistersInLaw provides a comprehensive exploration of critical legal and political issues, from high-profile criminal cases and technological implications to executive clemency and the evolving landscape of the Department of Justice. The hosts offer insightful analysis, grounded in their extensive legal expertise, encouraging listeners to remain engaged and informed in shaping the future of governance and justice in the United States.

Note: All timestamps correspond to the provided transcript. Advertisements, intros, and outros have been omitted to focus solely on the content discussions.