Slate Money — "Money on the Mind: To Have Kids or Not to Have Kids"

Date: October 30, 2025
Host: Felix Salmon (Slate Money)
Guest: Anna Sale (Death, Sex & Money)

Episode Overview

This special crossover episode brings together Felix Salmon of Slate Money and Anna Sale of Death, Sex & Money—two Slate podcasts with “Money” in the title—for a candid discussion about one of the most emotionally and financially charged decisions: whether or not to have children. They weave together personal experience, financial reality, and cultural observations to examine the costs (monetary and otherwise) of raising children, the societal narrative around having kids, and what it means for future generations.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Intersecting Worlds: Money, Feelings, and Family

• Felix highlights that Slate Money rarely discusses personal finance or emotions, whereas Anna’s show thrives on them:

  "We don't really have feelings on Slate Money. We are rational robots. And now I'm entering this Jacuzzi with you full of emotions and floaty bits."
  — Felix Salmon (01:00)

• Anna appreciates how Slate Money helps frame her “floaty feelings” in an economic context:

  "...you help me kind of hook it on scaffolding to help me understand where I am and how I’m situated to other people in the economy."
  — Anna Sale (02:15)

2. Are Kids a Luxury? The Real Cost of Parenthood

• Felix raises the common portrayal of children as an “expensive luxury,” noting public concern over affordability and declining birth rates (02:50).

• Anna responds with personal anecdotes—her jewelry as metaphor for delayed spending due to child-rearing expenses (04:20):

  "We were married for a long time before it felt like we could do something that was, like, special special...I just want...when I thought about, like, how is my life shaped by the fact that I'm raising two kids?..."
  — Anna Sale (06:17)

• On trying to budget for a baby:

  "I did try to, like, spreadsheet out what a baby was gonna cost...that didn’t really give me an accurate number."
  — Anna Sale (07:26)

• On financial anxiety and hidden costs:

  "It was really, really scary and overwhelming to have so many cost, new costs coming at me at once."
  — Anna Sale (09:41)

3. Choices — How Money Shapes Family Size

• Anna is open that money limited her family’s size:

  "We actually said over and over again when we would daydream about a third kid, well, we couldn't. One of us would have to quit our jobs. And that's because of the cost of childcare."
  — Anna Sale (12:41)

• Felix notes the Manhattan “three-kid flex”:

  "As someone who lives in Manhattan, I have long believed that the biggest flex you can do in Manhattan is to have three kids."
  — Felix Salmon (10:43)

• Anna’s candid admission:

  "If money was no object, you would have like four kids by now...Yes. Yeah."
  — Anna Sale (11:28)

• The astronomical cost of childcare (Bay Area example):

  "Childcare where I live to send my kid to preschool cost over $2,000 a month. $2,500 a month."
  — Anna Sale (13:44)

4. Children as Assets or Liabilities? Multi-Generational Realities

• Felix probes the idea that, later in life, kids become a kind of “pension plan” (15:00–16:31).

• Anna agrees, watching friends care for elderly parents, and highlights the invaluable support adult children provide:

  "Adult children show up really, I think, add an incredible sense of...a cushion as age—if you have the privilege of age."
  — Anna Sale (17:05)

• On digital-age challenges:

  "The scam...don't reply to that text...That is a very important role of an adult child."
  — Anna Sale (17:55)

5. Intentional Childlessness: Priorities, Freedom, and Legacy

• Felix discusses his decision not to have kids:

  "Partly it was selfish...I was actually quite happy with my priorities."
  — Felix Salmon (21:25)

• The trade-offs:

  "It’s not just money, it’s time...both of my co-hosts on Slate Money, parents...basically neither of them had left the country in over a decade."
  — Felix Salmon (22:20)

• Anna notes the different kinds of creativity and engagement possible without kids.

6. Aging Without Children: Who Will Care For Me?

• Felix’s concern:

  "I'm placing no faith in my nieces and nephews to be able to look after me when I'm old and doddery..."
  — Felix Salmon (23:35)

• They banter about whether AI or robots could provide elderly care, agreeing that empathy and physical assistance are irreplaceable (24:12–25:18).

7. Children, the Economy, and the Future Workforce

• Anna wonders if societal emphasis on having kids as an economic necessity is justified; what happens as AI disrupts work?

  "...do you think that's—I should continue to assume that in an AI future?"
  — Anna Sale (28:05)

• Felix offers a big-picture, Bayesian prediction: we can’t know if the fundamental link between population, work, and prosperity will change in the coming decades, but it hasn’t yet (28:09).

8. Leaving a Legacy: Beyond Biological Inheritance

• Felix reflects on consumption vs. inheritance:

  "...all doing this very selfless thing which is like having kids...I am now that future generation. And what am I doing? I’m...spending it on foie gras at a Manhattan restaurant and what the hell is the point?"
  — Felix Salmon (29:02)

• Both agree that supporting the arts and building community can be another form of legacy.

• Beautiful moment:

  "Every time we buy art, we have a dinner party for the artist…and it feels love. It's a great way of just saying, you know, thank you."
  — Felix Salmon (31:18)

• Anna:

  "...When I think of, like, what we're all doing this for, it's like relational care."
  — Anna Sale (31:53)

9. Social Worlds: Kids, Friendships, and Changing Community

• Felix observes the social insulation of parenthood, how friendships narrow into circles based around children (32:27–33:05).
• They discuss how evolving family structures change social visibility (e.g., LGBTQ+ families becoming more mainstream in community life) (33:05–33:43).

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “Your children ate your income.”
  — Felix Salmon (06:50)

• “The two best days in your life are the day you buy your child and the day you sell your child. Wait, hang on.”
  — Felix Salmon (07:18) [Joking about yachts vs. kids]

• “I love parenting. I find my kids to add, like, immeasurable joy to my life. And I feel so glad that I'm a parent.”
  — Anna Sale (11:31)

• “I think that that's a...when I think of, like, what we're all doing this for, it’s like relational care.”
  — Anna Sale (31:53)

Important Segment Timestamps

• 00:34 — Introduction and podcast crossover banter
• 02:50–07:26 — Are kids an expensive luxury? Anna’s jewelry metaphor and household budgeting reality
• 09:41 — Anna on the financial anxiety after first child
• 10:43–12:41 — Family size, money, and “the Manhattan flex” of multiple kids
• 13:44 — Detailed costs of child care
• 15:00–17:55 — The long-term “investment” in children as future caretakers
• 21:25 — Felix on intentional childlessness and lifestyle choices
• 23:35–25:18 — Aging without children—AI, caretaking, and what matters most in elder care
• 28:05 — Will AI change the economics of reproduction and work?
• 31:18 — Art, legacy, and community-building for the childless
• 32:27–33:53 — How kids re-shape adult friendships and community, including for queer families

Summary Takeaways

• Having children can shape both financial and emotional lives in deep, perpetual ways—beyond even what many expect.
• The affordability of child-rearing impacts not just the number of children families choose to have, but also how parents envision their futures, their communities, and their legacy.
• Choosing not to have children is not just a financial question, but one of values, priorities, and what matters most for personal fulfillment and social contribution.
• Caring for future generations can take many forms: parenthood, creative patronage, building relationships, or community support—all are valid legacies.
• The episode balances practical realities with philosophical reflections and offers compassion and validation for whichever path listeners choose.

Final Note:
This thoughtful, unscripted conversation is rich in both laughter and honesty, offering listeners a nuanced look at money, family, and meaning—whether you’re calculating the cost of diapers or dinner parties.