Slate Money: Movies – Wall Street
Podcast: Slate Money
Episode: Slate Money: Movies: Wall Street
Date: March 9, 2021
Host: Felix Salmon (A), with Anna Szymanski (B), and guest Josh Brown (D/E)
Special Focus: Review and discussion of Oliver Stone’s film Wall Street (1987)
Episode Overview
This episode of Slate Money: Movies dives into Wall Street, Oliver Stone’s iconic 1987 film about ambition, insider trading, and corporate raiders. Felix Salmon, Anna Szymanski, and guest financial expert Josh Brown discuss the film's realism, its relationship with 1980s finance, the glamorization of greed, and its ongoing cultural relevance. The episode also explores the moral ambiguities of finance—then and now—through the film’s lens, with comparisons to real-life figures, other finance films, and the evolution of financial markets.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. The Film’s Context and Cultural Impact
- Wall Street would not have been greenlit without the success of Stone’s Platoon and the cultural focus on financial excess and scandals in the ‘80s ([04:14], [05:09]).
- The film’s September 1987 release coincided with a historic market crash, amplifying its resonance ([04:39]).
- Scandals like Ivan Boesky’s and the rise of corporate raiders created the backdrop for the film ([05:22], [06:10]).
Quote
“You had moviegoers who had no idea how the stock market works. Gotta remember: almost no one has a 401k at this time. Individuals are not generally interested in Wall Street... the market crash, I feel like, gives this thing a pop culture urgency.”
— Josh Brown [04:39]
2. Glamorization of Greed – Gordon Gekko & Moral Ambiguity
- Although intended as a cautionary tale, Gekko’s “greed is good” persona became an aspirational anti-hero ([06:40], [06:46]).
- Parallels are drawn to modern financial pop culture—the idolization of morally compromised figures like The Wolf of Wall Street’s Jordan Belfort ([06:59]).
- The film largely omits the impact on regular people—unlike later films, it shows few visible victims ([08:01]).
Quote
“The wrongdoers are the protagonists. We’re rooting for them.”
— Josh Brown [06:00]
3. The Realty (and Myth) of Wall Street Jobs in the ‘80s
- Josh relates first-hand experience: “smile and dial” cold-calling was then the entry point to finance, mirroring Bud Fox’s job ([08:49], [09:06]).
- The broker’s business model: 2.5% commissions on each trade, incentivizing high churn and risk for retail clients ([21:01]).
Quote
“You pay a two and a half percent commission on each trade. It was a great fucking business for decades and decades.”
— Josh Brown [21:01]
4. Shareholder Capitalism, Activism, and the “Greed Is Good” Speech
- Gekko’s iconic “Greed is good” speech is dissected for its roots in real-life figures like Carl Icahn and for both its seduction and accuracy ([22:37], [26:50]).
- Discussion of how the rise of shareholder capitalism addressed bloated, inefficient corporate management—but also created its own problems ([26:50]).
Quote
“There are parts of it I was like, he's kind of right... Shareholder capitalism developed because US industry was bloated and uncompetitive.”
— Anna Szymanski [26:13]
Notable Moment:
- Gordon Gekko’s famous speech: “Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works… and greed, you mark my words, will not only save Teldar Paper, but that other malfunctioning corporation called the U.S.A.”
— Gordon Gekko [22:37–23:29]
5. Film’s Moral Trope: Success vs. Soul
- The narrative of compromise—gain wealth, lose your soul, regain it by renouncing money—is critiqued as a tired Hollywood trope ([13:48], [14:19]).
- It’s suggested the film might be more interesting if Gekko’s actions were legal but morally questionable ([15:48]).
- Discussion around how insider trading law is, and was, far from clear-cut ([16:08], [17:05]).
Quote
“There's no law against insider trading. There is no statute. It's all just a cobble together bunch of random jurisprudence that no one really understands.”
— Felix Salmon [16:08]
6. Changing Nature of Financial Markets
- The “smiling and dialing” retail brokerage model was ultimately obviated by technology and the rise of the internet and discount brokers ([18:45], [20:28]).
- Modern finance—SPACs, tech, and venture—generates wealth vastly exceeding that of ‘80s “corporate raiders,” legally ([46:39], [47:01]).
Quote
“There are ways to make so much more money than those characters made back then that's completely legal… Why would you ever need to resort to insider trading?”
— Josh Brown [46:39]
7. Realism, Plot Holes, and the Mechanics of Takeovers
- The actual mechanics of hostile takeovers are more complex than depicted—big banks, lawyers, lengthy processes are omitted for cinematic simplicity ([33:10], [34:09]).
- Activities that appear obviously illegal in the movie are, in reality, often legal or at least ambiguous, further dramatized for clarity ([42:48]).
Quote
“If you work something out and buy a thesis, that's how efficient markets are supposed to be efficient.”
— Felix Salmon [44:38]
8. Female Characters & 1980s Gender Tropes
- Daryl Hannah’s character is critiqued as a “naked ambition” gold-digger, but, as Anna notes, is given consistency and parity with Bud Fox’s own mercenary ambition ([36:14]–[39:39]).
- Her choices reflect the limited options available—and are written with a rare, if problematic, honesty about ambition ([37:51], [39:20]).
9. New York as Character & Nostalgia
- The film is lauded for its authentic depiction of New York City in the late ‘80s ([53:47]).
- The visual details (on-location shots, office life, pre-9/11 skyline, crowded subways) evoke nostalgia for a lost era ([54:27]).
Quote
“It gets the geography of New York City right... It's not one of those movies which… gets filmed in Toronto and they have back alleys... There’s none of that.”
— Felix Salmon [53:53]
Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)
Gekko’s Greed Speech:
[22:37–23:29]
“Greed, for lack of a better word, is good. Greed is right. Greed works…”
Lou Manheim’s Wisdom:
[11:45]
“Man looks into the abyss and there’s nothing staring back at him. At that moment, man finds his character, and that is what keeps him out of the abyss.”
Josh on The Evolution of the Business:
[18:59]
“The heyday of the smiling and dialing cold calling stock brokerage kind of thing was probably 1985 to 2000... and the Internet obviously ended up killing that…”
Anna on Shareholder Capitalism:
[26:13]
“There is a reason that shareholder capitalism developed... managers were not acting in the interest of shareholders... businesses were not working in their interests.”
Key Timestamps
- [00:10] – Introductions & guest background
- [02:19] – Overview: Gekko as corporate raider, themes for discussion
- [03:08] – First encounters with Wall Street
- [05:41] – The film structure: anti-heroes as protagonists
- [08:49] – “Smile and dial” brokerage life, compared to film
- [22:37] – Gekko’s “Greed is good”
- [26:13] – Shareholder capitalism, activist investors discussion
- [33:10] – Film’s depiction of takeovers vs. reality
- [36:14] – Daryl Hannah’s character & gender tropes
- [42:14] – Insider trading: what’s actually illegal?
- [46:39] – Rise of modern legal mega-wealth (SPACs, Silicon Valley)
- [53:47] – New York-as-character, authenticity
- [52:17] – Final verdict: star ratings and lasting legacy
Final Verdicts & Ratings
- Josh Brown: "Four and a half stars. It's just a great movie—eminently rewatchable. I don't think there's a better movie about Wall Street." [52:24]
- Anna Szymanski: "Four out of five. ...It is just a well made movie and it holds up surprisingly well." [52:55]
- Felix Salmon: Agrees with the high rating, credits the film’s “repeatability” and “sense of New York.” [53:20]
Conclusion: Why Wall Street Endures
The hosts unanimously praise the film’s style, energy, and enduring relevance—despite (or perhaps because of) its plot holes, glamorization of financial ambition, and quirks of late-1980s finance. With its memorable lines, engaging anti-heroes, and honest portrayal of moral risk, Wall Street remains a cinematic touchstone for discussions about money, ethos, and the evolution of American capitalism.
[Listen to the episode for a full deep dive! Skip Wall Street 2, but don’t skip this classic.]