Slate Money: Succession, S2E3, “French Kissing an Armadillo”

Summary

Slate Money: Succession S2E3 “French Kissing an Armadillo” Recap

Date: August 26, 2019
Hosts: Felix Salmon, Emily Peck, June Thomas

---

Episode Overview

This episode of Slate Money dives into Season 2, Episode 3 of HBO’s Succession, titled “Hunting.” The hosts analyze what they call the darkest and most brutal episode yet, in which the Roy family’s corporate retreat devolves into psychological warfare, humiliation, and Machiavellian power games. Themes of betrayal, loyalty, dynastic legacy, and real-world media parallels are explored, with special focus on standout scenes (particularly "Boar on the Floor"), Logan Roy’s leadership style, sexual politics, and the continued farce of Connor’s presidential ambitions.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Literary Allusions and the Power of Ulysses

• June brings a printout of Tennyson’s “Ulysses,” which is inscribed on a watch gifted from Logan to Frank. This allusion is seen as central to understanding Logan’s late-career restlessness.
  • June: “It’s indeed a poem ... about a lion in winter ... getting one last deal in before you get snuffed out.” (01:18)
• The hosts muse on how this reflects Logan’s hunger for a final legacy-defining move, and the show’s frequent literary and historical nods.

2. Real-World Media Parallels

• The potential acquisition of PGM Pierce is dissected, with comparisons to the Wall Street Journal, the Bancroft family, and the Sulzbergers.
  • Emily: “The parallels did seem to me a little bit like Rupert Murdoch going after the Wall Street Journal. ... He wanted it for a really long time. It's very prestigious.” (07:14)
• Discussion includes why the $20 billion price tag is wildly exaggerated for a news company, and how these dynastic power plays evoke mergers like Tribune’s acquisition of Times Mirror (08:18).

3. Logan’s “Hunt” – Literal and Metaphorical

• The retreat to a Hungarian schloss underscores the “hunting” theme—in both the boar-shooting and Logan’s search to root out traitors.
  • Felix: “This episode is about Logan hunting for snakes and rats in his house...” (02:56)
• Greg’s opening scene with the journalist sets the tension for who is leaking, and foreshadows Logan’s paranoia and violence.

4. Connor Roy and the Art of the Absurd Presidential Campaign

• Connor’s video announcement and willful tax evasion become comedic highlights.
  • Connor (quoted by Felix): “Who's there? Uncle Sam. And where's his hand? In my pants.” (15:34)
• Hosts attempt to draw parallels to real-world figures: Steve Forbes, Howard Buffett, Donald Trump Jr., but highlight Connor’s lack of charisma and political acumen.
• Emily: “He’s the only one who doesn’t seem to care about succession. ... The elites are scared. I can see them down there.” (40:38)

5. Roy Family Sexual Dynamics & Transactional Marriages

• Shiv’s relationship with Tom is labeled as utilitarian, with Shiv herself referring to Tom as her “meat puppet.”
• Roman’s ambiguous sexuality and chemistry with Jerry is dissected, suggesting that for the Roys, partnerships are as strategic as dynastic marriages.
  • June: “They don’t make partnerships for sex. They make partnerships for—it's like old royals... monarchical marriages.” (11:43)

6. Boar on the Floor: Power, Ritual, and Humiliation

• The episode’s most infamous scene is unpacked as a display of Logan’s control and the willingness of his inner circle to endure degradation for favor.
  • Felix: “He does this super kind of lore-of-the-jungle thing where he picks on the weakest people around the table and just humiliates them ... Boar on the floor. Oink for your sausages, piggies.” (23:39)
• The ritual is compared to fraternity hazing—necessary punishment for betrayal and a public reassertion of dominance.

7. Logan’s Leadership & the Impossible Standard

• Hosts note the impossibility of satisfying Logan’s shifting criteria for succession, exemplified by his sudden demand that his children know the price of a gallon of milk.
  • June: “Ultimately the kids are never going to please him because he’s the man who made this company and they’re just the fuck ups who are going to fuck it up.” (34:19)

8. Tom and Greg: Sympathy in the Den of Wolves

• The only emotional moment: Tom protects Greg after he confesses to talking to the biographer—showing fleeting loyalty amidst widespread self-interest.
  • Emily: “That was like, the first actual touching thing that’s ever happened.” (20:22)

9. Female Power and Marcia’s Quiet Influence

• Brief but sharp speculation on Marcia’s (Logan’s wife) real influence and the gendered glass ceiling in dynastic families.

10. Favorite Lines and Succession’s Comedy DNA

• Felix, Emily, and June nominate their top one-liners:
  • Greg (Emily’s pick): “It’s like I'm in a band. A very white, very wealthy band. It’s like I'm in U2.” (41:37)
  • Logan (Felix’s pick): “That’s about as choreographed as a dog getting fucked on roller skates.” (41:37)
  • Roman (June’s pick): “Who drinks milk anyway? Kittens and perverts, that’s who.” (42:22)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Greg’s Self-Identification:
  “I'm a time-pressed executive.” – Greg (03:19)
• On Succession Planning:
  “The kids are never going to please him... There is no happy succession.” – June (34:19)
• On Utilitarian Family Ties:
  “They have all got transactional relationships.” – June (28:42)
• On Real World Parallels:
  “There’s a kind of, what you might call, investment banker gene, which involves just being able to do things like call up the Pierce family in a way that doesn’t cause them to just hang up the phone.” – Felix (35:46)
• On Boar on the Floor:
  “You see the people who were very close to being in the corner and being made to act like boars, snuffling around on the floor, fighting over sausages, full of glee because they escaped ... Everybody’s weak. Everybody except Logan is weak.” – June (23:45)

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & Literary Allusion Discussion: 00:00–02:25
• Greg’s Interview & Foreshadowing: 02:56–04:54
• Pierce Family, Boardroom, Real-World Media Parallels: 05:17–08:18
• Family Jet to Hungary, Corporate Retreat: 09:21–11:18
• Roman, Tabitha, and Sexual Dynamics: 11:34–13:41
• Connor’s Campaign & Relationship with Willa: 14:41–16:41
• Tom and Greg’s Moment: 19:15–20:22
• Boar on the Floor Scene: 23:33–25:02
• Logan’s Gallon of Milk Test: 31:12–34:09
• Favorite Lines & Closing Speculation: 41:07–42:22

---

Additional Observations

• The hosts continually point out the show’s embrace of “Veep-style” comedic DNA—elevating its satire.
• There’s pointed discussion of privilege, insularity, and self-importance within the Roy family, contrasted with the “real world” they so little understand.
• The episode is lauded as a high point in Succession’s blend of darkness, cruelty, and incisive wit.

---

For Next Week

The hosts speculate if Shiv will finally take her place “officially” in Waystar Royco, but bet that Logan will keep her on the sidelines for a while longer:
“He’ll string her along for a good many episodes to come.” – Emily (43:06)

---

This episode recap captures the biting humor, bleak power dynamics, and fierce intelligence of both Succession’s writing and Slate Money’s cultural analysis, providing all you need to know if you haven’t seen the episode (or just want to savor its best moments again).

Transcript

[A]

Foreign. Hello, and welcome to episode three of the Slate Money Succession recap mini season special. I'm Felix Hammond of Axios. I'm joined by Emily Peck of the Huffington Post. Hello, and excitingly, we have the queen of all Slate podcasts, or possibly the empress, June Thomas is here.

[B]

I just want to be clear, Felix, that this is not a podcast. It's just a precursor to see if I might be open to podcasting.

[C]

Perfect.

[A]

Well, okay. One of these days, June, I'm going to teach you about what off the record means.

[B]

Oh, okay, okay.

[A]

But June is a poor naive who doesn't really understand the ways of the world.

[B]

No.

[A]

You have brought in a piece of paper. What is your piece of paper?

[B]

It is a printout of the poem Ulysses by Alfred Lord Tennyson, which clearly is the key to all of succession.

[A]

I am so into this because when.

[B]

We'Re getting a little ahead of ourselves in this episode, but at a certain point, Logan brings back Frank and he gives him a watch. And on the back of the watch is a quotation from this poem. I believe it says, some work of noble note may yet be done. And of course, I mean that immediately. Suggested to me, ulysses by Alfred Lord Tennyson. It's indeed a poem. It's a kind of poem about a lion in winter and kind of raging against the light and, you know, getting one last deal in before you get snuffed out.

[C]

That's Logan.

[A]

I did not realize that it was Tennyson because there was all of that talk before he got invited back to the corporate retreat in a Hungarian schloss of something, something Shakespeare something. So I just assumed it was a Shakespeare line. I didn't know. But it's not.

[B]

No. And it's my in depth research. You know, Googling just before we came into the studio revealed that Tennyson actually wrote this after a close friend died. You know, and so it's about the end of life, but it was written 50 years before Tennyson died, so it's maybe a little bit premature, but, you know, there you go.

[A]

And Frank, of course, knew it. He immediately recited the following line as a kind of subtle flex.

[B]

That's the charming fuck that he is. Yeah, that's why he's been brought in again. Cause he's gonna charm those pierces.

[C]

So should we start at the top and make our way to that? Beautiful, beautiful.

[A]

Okay, we're gonna make our way to that point and we can speculate about the real life equivalence of Frank. But yeah, this is pretty much the darkest and Cruelest episode of succession I think I've ever seen.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[C]

I mean, the episode is called Hunting and ostensibly that's a reference, you know, to the retreat. But really this episode is about Logan hunting for snakes and rats in his house and finding those who betrayed him. And it's. The opening scene is Greg, as June was alluding to, sitting with the journalists, saying, you know, we're not meeting. This is just a precursor to meeting.

[A]

And can I, I want to jump in here because of course we're just going to be like quoting lines the whole time. But I think my favorite line of the entire episode comes right at the top where Greg says, I'm a time pressed executive.

[C]

Yes, of course, he's very important. And I think she reassures him at some point. She says, I know you've been in many meetings and have done many things, but I feel like Greg has this one line which sort of sets up the whole episode. Essentially when he calls his uncle Logan, he calls him scary, vindictive, paranoid and violent. And basically that's what this episode is, or that's what the big scene, you know, builds to.

[A]

Oh my God, is it foreshadowing?

[B]

Paranoid and violent?

[C]

Could it be a little foreshadowing?

[A]

A little bit of foreshadowing here in episode three? I don't think it's too self aggrandizing to hope I might have some wisdom to impart.

[B]

There's no time like the present.

[A]

Right. But it would need to be discreet. I don't want to make my uncle mad because he could be. Well, he can be scary, vindictive, paranoid and violent.

[C]

Scary, vindictive.

[A]

Wait, sorry, none of this. I'm not actually saying that yet.

[C]

Oh, would you like this meeting to be on background?

[A]

But this isn't. You can't say I said anything.

[C]

But you did. Look, Greg, if you want this to be anonymous, you have to say that from the outside. You can't do that retroactively.

[A]

But no, because this isn't a meeting. This. You can't. That's not fair. That's unfair.

[C]

Yeah. And then basically this is all built up to getting to that retreat. We go to the boardroom, we learn that Logan now wants to make another run for this company, PGM Pierce, which I think is the, in the real world, is the Wall Street Journal, basically. And the Pierce family is the Bancrofts. Isn't that what you think also, Felix, I feel like you told me that.

[A]

So I have been very careful and diligent about not watching the episodes before we Talk about them, of course. However, I have read various things in the Hollywood Reporter and by Ed Lee and the New York Times about how there is going to be some kind of salzburgerish Bancroft ish clan turning up later on in the season. And I believe Holly Hunter is the matriarch.

[B]

Although I saw in the preview that Cherry Jones seems to be matriarchal too.

[A]

Or maybe Cherry Jones is the matriarch. I'm not entirely sure we will find out. Given how much talk we've had of Pierce and pgm, one has to assume that this big newspaperish, liberal, ish respected news organization, ish family is modeled on those. Of course, the big difference being that neither the Sulzbergers nor the Bancroft had a. Nor the Bancrofts had any. Any semblance of a TV network.

[B]

Right. That's why I had elements of B Sky B coming in, which obviously is not a direct parallel. And they're never going to make direct parallels, but there's.

[A]

Oh, they make direct parallels.

[B]

Well, yes, but they obfuscate them slightly.

[A]

Ever so.

[B]

Ever so slightly.

[C]

Slightly.

[A]

But yeah. I mean, there was also talk about PS Being like the amount they were going to have to pay was going to be $20 billion. And part of the reason to buy PS is that if they load up with $20 billion of debt in order to do so, that makes them too big. You know, Sandy to Sandy and Stewie to stomach.

[B]

Because you know why, Felix? It's a snake taking on a crocodile. It's too big. It won't fit.

[A]

Another awesome line. Which again, just to you know, in terms of real life, neither the New York Times Company nor Dow Jones was ever worth anywhere near $20 billion. So, you know, we're not clear exactly what the parallels might be. Unless, Emily, you have something in mind?

[C]

I mean, the parallels did seem to me a little bit like Rupert Murdoch going after the Wall Street Journal. It's the same kind of thing. He wanted it for a really long time. It's very prestigious. You know, his company is kind of this trashy.

[B]

What.

[C]

What's this whole thing that Jerry brings up in the boardroom? Logan served a party.

[B]

Warm white wine and effectively a sort of a bad review of a charity party in one of their publications. I think somebody else also suggested that it's what Uncle Ewan watches.

[A]

So, you know, we haven't seen Uncle Ewan yet in this season, but I miss Uncle Ewan. The other thing.

[C]

And then Tabitha says to Roman, my parents watched that. That's like actual news. And then another point, I Think Shiv kind of says something like, if we buy Pierce, it's like, who's gonna actually report the news? Like, this is a real. I just feel like it reminded me of back when Murdoch was hunting the Journal. Or you can Journal at the time.

[A]

You can go back. I would actually go back a few years before that to 2000, when Times Mirror, which was this kind of schlocky media chain, spent $8 billion mostly in debt, to buy up Tribune, which at the time was a highly respectable media organization which owned not only the Chicago Tribune, but also the Los Angeles. And I feel like it's more similar to that, but again, the parallels. Maybe it's a little bit of a stretch, but in any case, this is the new MacGuffin. This is the big MacGuffin, which is driving the whole season, at least so far. Is Logan really going to put his entire company at risk and raise $20 billion of debt to buy Pierce? And he decides in the middle of this massive proxy war that he has going on with Sandy and Stewie, that he's going to put, like, the entire family basically on the corporate jet, which I'm sure would not be allowed according to, you know, corporate safety rules.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

You know, like, I'm sure there'll be someone saying, no, you can't put every single member of your family on the same plane.

[B]

Okay, Shiv's at home. And Connor, leave.

[C]

Shiv back at home.

[A]

Shiv's back at home.

[C]

We have to talk about Conor, you guys.

[A]

We have to talk about. Of course we have to talk about Conor, but. So he puts them all on the jet, all of his senior executives on this jet, and they all fly off to this schlossing hunger, hungry for what is being billed as a morale boosting corporate retreat.

[B]

It made me realize how every corporate retreat I've ever been on was doing it totally wrong. And while Mohonk might have been mad at us sometimes, they had no reason to. We were so good. Never. Never shot a boar. Also never made people act like boars. So obviously totally failing at corporate retreating.

[C]

There was no scramble for sausage on the floor, therefore, no morale was boosted.

[B]

No.

[A]

So, yeah. So basically, Logan brings everyone to Hungary, where he has two things in particular that he's angry about. One is that someone has talked to his biographer, and he's angry about that because he doesn't want to anyone to talk to his biographer. And number two is that someone has leaked to the Pierce family that he's interested in buying them. And in another one of those wonderful Lines when his banker's talking to him about, well, if we're going to try and buy ps, it's going to be very. He quotes. It's delicate, like French kissing an armadillo. Like, he's like, we need to be very, very, very, very careful about how exactly we approach them. But of course, Roman, being like the complete up, just barges ahead by getting his girlfriend to, like, do something with her ex girlfriend.

[B]

Yeah, he. So he's like, one of. One of her many exes is a Pierce. And so he gets her. He gets that Pierce, his contacts from Tabitha. And he said, how do you know her? Oh, you her. And he says, did you everyone. And she, of course, says, well, not you.

[A]

So, June, I'm glad that you're here for this episode because you can speculate wildly about Roman sexuality.

[B]

Well, I think the sexuality of all of the Roys is basically, they don't make partnerships for sex. They make partnerships for. It's like old royals. Right. You just have to find somebody who's the right religion and looks. Right. And unlike the royals, can breed. I mean, it doesn't seem like any of the scions of the royal family are married for love or family. It's all, you know, they're monarchical marriages. Right?

[C]

Yeah. But it does seem like Shiv, I think, at some point in this episode, calls her husband Tom a meat puppet, making it very clear what she actually thinks of him and his role. But then she does go out and kind of like, have this, I guess, one night stand with this kind of this actor dude who has no screens at home and gets his news only from comedians. So she does have some kind of, like, sexual appetite, it would seem.

[A]

Yeah, I think she has a sexual appetite. I'm interested in whether Roman has a sexual appetite and if so, what it might be.

[B]

Did you guys catch.

[C]

He had that moment with Jerry towards the end.

[A]

They had that chemistry. Right?

[B]

That was interesting.

[A]

Yeah, there was some chemistry with Jerry.

[B]

That was lovely, actually. And when he asked if people often make moves on you, and she said, well, yeah, but they're usually over 80. Like, that was actually a very sweet. Like, Jerry is the greatest. I mean, obviously.

[C]

Obviously, obviously.

[A]

You know, if I were capable of any sudden movement, I would totally pounce.

[B]

On you right now.

[C]

Yeah.

[A]

Yep.

[C]

I actually hear that a lot, usually from men in their 90s. We have to do that one. How are you doing?

[A]

Terrible.

[B]

Pretty awful. Mm.

[A]

I'm blaming Tabitha, by the way. It was her idea.

[C]

Next time you need business advice, ask.

[A]

Someone who knows what they're talking about what, you? Yeah. Like me?

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

But I feel like. I don't know, there. There's definitely something between them. I guess maybe it's a little more maternal than anything else, but there's a lot going on there. Like when he was being chastised by his father. And I'm sure we'll get to. To this scene in more detail.

[A]

In the boar.

[C]

In the floor scene, there's this shot, you know, where she's sort of looking at him like. And it almost seems like she's concerned about Roman. Maybe I'm reading it wrong because everyone. No one is concerned about anyone on this show. It's all strategy and moves.

[A]

But Roman clearly relies on her. Remember last episode when he like, phoned her up and she's like, roman, I have 52 seconds. And he's like, can you come here and help me? And she's like, no, I can't. Fuck off.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I'm not sure I completely agree with June in the sort of royal marriage thing, because royal marriages are utilitarian. And I don't really see any of the people who married into the Roy family as being particularly useful. Least of all Tom.

[B]

They're pretty. Yeah. Tom is an. Except for the men. It seems that they ally themselves with pretty women. I mean, or women with their own reasons for being with them that have nothing to do with sex. Connor and Willa. Willa wants to be on Broadway and it was lovely to, you know, Shiv, who is actually smart, suggesting that, you know, if Conor spends all this money on getting to the White House, that won't leave very much for you to get to Brock.

[A]

Yeah. Which I feel like didn't really ring true. It's not like. It's not like this is a finite pot of money and he's going to spend it all. But, I mean, Schiff was. Schiff was pretty desperate at that point to stop Connor from doing this completely insane thing where he records this video and he says my. Another one of my favorite lines. Who's there? Uncle Sam. And where's his hand? In my pants.

[C]

I ranch, I ride, I earn and.

[A]

I give just like you.

[B]

But ding dong.

[A]

Who's there? Uncle Sam.

[C]

And where's his hand?

[A]

In my pants. Hey. Is there anyone in my house?

[B]

Hey, have you seen this?

[A]

Yes.

[C]

He said he's beta testing it before he Instagrams and enters the ideas primary.

[A]

Maybe he's a genius.

[C]

That's one word for it.

[A]

A genius rancher. All I want is a fair flat.

[C]

Tax safe for all Americans.

[A]

But Headed down to zero within a decade or so. What am I going to do?

[C]

Well, I tell you, I ain't paying. Oh my God. And if you want to arrest me, go ahead. No, really, just go ahead and try.

[B]

Quick question.

[C]

Do you think he even knows what a jail is? He literally only knows it from Monopoly.

[B]

Connor is next level. I mean, he's next level clueless. He makes the second wife's kids look brilliant and in touch. I mean, Roman and Kendall, who could be a bigger fuck up than them? Oh yeah, Connor. I mean, Connor.

[A]

I mean, so the question. So who is Connor? Right. I feel like Connor is some weird sort of combination of like Donald Trump Jr. Or perhaps Lachlan Murdoch. Who's the conservative one? Steve Forbes or Steve Forbes is another really good one. Or possibly I was even thinking Howard Buffett.

[B]

I don't. Is it Warren's son?

[A]

Warren's son Howard, who's also a kind of like neocon.

[B]

Does he hyper decant?

[A]

I almost certainly hyper decant.

[B]

Well, maybe.

[C]

One thing I was thinking about that scene was like, Shiv is supposed to be such a smart strategist. But even I realized that the way to get Connor to pull the commercial wasn't by just saying, you'll embarrass the family. Like that obviously wasn't going to be enough. I felt like she kind of screwed up that whole mission, but it didn't matter somehow. And that actually upset me. It's my nitpick with this episode actually.

[B]

Was there any.

[C]

She messed that up.

[B]

Do you know what might have persuaded Connor to stop with this nonsense?

[C]

I feel like there had to be a way to sort of appeal to his ego, maybe get him to put it off and get the timing better or something like that. Appeal to his read, you know, how he does his readings. I don't know. There had to be something that could have been done that was more artful. I'm not a big political machinator, but I don't know, I thought there could be something better.

[A]

But really none of the siblings have ever been able to persuade any of them to do anything. They just don't listen to each other.

[B]

Well, nobody is that good at persuasion. I mean, we saw when they were at the Schloss and everybody is trying to get some word to Logan that his obsession with the Pierces, his white whale, is destructive. None of them thinks it's a good idea. None of them is able to even really communicate that as close as they can get is blessed. Jerry saying, I have to admit I have had my doubts.

[A]

Although it comes out at the end. Right. Who is it at the end who says, actually, no one thinks it's a good idea.

[B]

Yeah, I don't know who that was, but maybe one of the kids.

[A]

Was it Roman?

[C]

No, it was Kendall. I think Kendall at the end says, like, everyone here thinks it's bad. You know, this one thinks it's bad. Jerry's playing both sides.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah, right. It was Kendall. Right, right. So that's how Kendall shows himself to be trustworthy somehow after, you know, I mean, that unbelievably craven scene where Tom sidles up to Logan and says, I'm going to say something, but I don't believe it. You're like, that's not going to work, Tom. That. That. Honestly, that's just not going to work.

[B]

Of all the people, I have to say, Tom is the most pathetic, because, of course, Cousin Greg, the greatest. But if he's gonna be your conciliary, if he's your, like, your smart person that you use, I mean, come on. At least Kendall's got a smart woman who, you know, can figure things out for him. But, I mean, if Tom's big conduit is Greg, it's hopeless. There's never gonna get.

[C]

But I felt like Tom and Greg had their moment this episode, which I found it was like the first emotional moment that made me feel sympathy for any of these characters, which was, you know, Greg tells Tom, oh, I spoke to the biographer. And Tom's, why are you telling me this? Like, you're not supposed to trust anyone. Like, three minutes after telling him, he can totally trust Tom.

[B]

To a point.

[C]

And it's a total. To a point. To a point. But then, of course, Tom keeps Greg secret, even through this whole humiliation of the scramble for the sausage and everything. And then the next day at breakfast, you know, Greg says to Tom, thank you. And he just does this thing where he puts his hand on his arm. That was like, the first actual touching thing that's ever happened.

[B]

It was sweet. But of course, we also know that everybody has talked to the biographer. We saw Greg, and Greg was dumb enough to tell someone, but they've all talked with her. They've all met with her, and they didn't even just have precursors. Everybody's talked to her.

[C]

Right, Right. I still found it. I thought it was nice. It was like, maybe these two have some more shenanigans that they'll get into in upcoming episodes.

[A]

I'm not sure that everyone's talked to her. I feel like the way that Greg gets Let off the hook at the end is when Logan finds out that his. Who was it? Brother who just died? Mo. Who's Mo?

[B]

I don't know who Mo is.

[C]

Who is Mo?

[B]

Yeah. I don't know. I mean, obviously I knew.

[A]

He's clearly an older person. He's an older generation.

[B]

He's the person who Logan wouldn't visit. He would visit him in a couple of weeks.

[A]

This also explains the lingering question I had about episode one, which, if you remember, at the beginning of episode one, Roman and Jerry are in a hospital. I'm like, why are they in a hospital?

[C]

I thought they were in a hospital in Japan because of the satellite thing.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I think. Yeah, that was the rocket that blew up.

[C]

Yeah, that was my theory.

[B]

Yeah. So Mo is obviously somebody with a close ish connection, long connection to Logan. At the beginning of the episode, the person was. His assistant was trying to make him go visit Mo in the hospice. And he said, how long has he got? And she said, oh, a week or two. And he said, I'll go in a week or two. But yeah, I can't figure out who is he? But, yeah, he is a But.

[A]

It turns out that he had spoken to the biographer. And so that, like, now means that Greg may or may not be safe. Greg strikes me as the only real. I mean, I guess Greg and Jerry are the ones who just have no sort of real cruelty gene in them. But Greg. Poor Greg.

[B]

Poor Greg. He's so sweet and it's poor.

[C]

I don't know. I feel like this is all building to Greg taking over. Did we say that last episode too?

[A]

Yeah. No, not gonna happen. No.

[C]

Okay.

[B]

I wonder. I wonder.

[C]

So we haven't actually talked about boar on the floor.

[A]

Yeah, let's talk about the boars because, I mean, this is where the show really gets dark. First of all, they all take out these guns and shoot just a ridiculous number of boars at sort of point blank range with super high powered rifles for no obvious reason. They then pose for this photograph on the, you know, back steps of the Schloss with the boars all arranged in this sort of semicircle around them. And it's super, like, nasty. And then all of that is just a foreshadowing for what Logan is going to wind up doing to the weakest members of the family. And he does this super kind of lore of the jungle thing where he picks on the weakest people around the table and just humiliates them as a show of force and power. And you're like, wow, like, they went there on the floor. Boar on the floor. On the floor. Come on, Frank. Frank, why am I in this? How the fuck would I know, Greg? You think I have a rational explanation for this? Frank, Feed the piggies, guest of honor. That's it.

[B]

Pour on the floor.

[A]

Pour on the floor. Oink for your sausages, piggies.

[B]

And you see the people who were very close to being in the corner and being made to act like bores snuffling around on the floor, fighting over sausages full of glee because they escaped. And so now they're taking videos and. And rejoicing in their not being the weakest three. And you can see everybody's weak. Everybody except Logan is weak. You just weren't among the three.

[A]

Well, I think on some level, there's certain people who would not have done that. Like, none of the kids would have done that. Jerry wouldn't have done that. Like, there's certain people who have just a smidgen of pride to just say, no, I'm sorry. But, like, he manages to pick on the people who ultimately will just grovel. Like, wow.

[B]

Yeah, it was.

[C]

Yeah. I mean, they're all enthralled to his money, and they'll pretty much do anything to stay in his orbit. I think Frank coming back, and I think at one point Jerry is like, what are you doing? Why are you back? And he just. He doesn't really give a good reason.

[A]

And then Logan. And then Logan, like, even after he's been bucking up Frank and giving him this watch. And the whole thing needs to do, like, a ritual humiliation of Frank at some point just. Just to demonstrate this.

[B]

Just because he can.

[A]

Just because. Yeah, he has to. It feels like this compulsion.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[C]

It's like a fraternity. It's like hazing or something and bullying to get. To get the loyalty of the group.

[B]

Right. And. And to punish him for. You know, he was punished before for his sort of treachery by being expelled from the circle. And if you're going to bring him back, you have to have some kind of ritual punishment. You can't just get away with it. You can't just be forgiven it. You have to give a sign to the others of, you know, stay. Stay loyal.

[C]

So what was Kendall's ritual punishment to come back?

[A]

Well, I mean, that's a good question. Kendall. Kendall is the prodigal son. Right. Kendall is family. It's different for family. Although certainly Roman and Shiv kind of assumed that he was gonna get, like, torn to shreds, and then he wasn't But I think one of the things that this scene does is just remind us or underline that Logan is not in any way a nice guy because for the first couple of episodes he kind of looked like he could just be a sort of smart and ruthless corporate raider. And you're like, yeah, no, he's worse than that.

[B]

Yeah. Although we did get that little sign at the beginning of the episode when he's having a medical examination and the guy says, you know, how's this medicine treating you? You know, it can make you paranoid. And, you know, there's a yes, you paranoid. And if you are a paranoid motherfucker, certainly will. But, you know, I guess it's just ramping up the lyrian aspects of it. But yeah, he's not a nice man.

[C]

And the strategy of, of what he did at the end, if you saw, he got out some kind of terrifying strong Hungarian liquor of some sort to give to everyone and he served himself water.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

To stay sober while he got everyone else drunk and then messed with them. It's just very creepy. And he had his body man usher out the wait staff in the room. So there were no witnesses. It was like, he's done this before.

[B]

Yeah, he's the smartest man in the room. And I mean, that's ultimately the problem. The others are not equal to his evil. I mean, they just cannot, they're not on the same level. They're.

[A]

Although I need to ask you, who is more cruel to Tom Logan or Shiv?

[B]

I don't know that Shiv is cruel to him. I mean, they do have an open relationship. He, when he gets home.

[A]

I mean. No, but that's the whole point, Right? Like, he never wanted that. And he comes back from this, you know, utter humiliation in Hungary to his wife, and he's like, I need you to sort of have some sympathy for me because this was the worst thing that could possibly have happened. And then he's like, oh, and how was your weekend? And she's like, do you want me to tell you?

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, but he doesn't, he doesn't want her to tell him.

[A]

Maybe it wasn't totally great what you sent me to do, which is kind of the opposite of what I wanted to do.

[B]

Uh huh. Yeah.

[A]

I mean, we're a team, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I, I, I, I don't want to be a true dick, but maybe I should have a bit more input into team tactics.

[B]

Yeah, sure.

[C]

Of course.

[A]

Thanks. So how's your weekend?

[B]

Me?

[A]

Yeah. Anything to report? Yeah.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Do you wanna know. Oh, I don't. Maybe later.

[B]

I mean, again, he's made a good marriage. He knows that. I mean, he's not worthy and he knows that. He knows he has. He doesn't have any. He doesn't belong on the executive suite. And so, you know, he's made his bed and he sometimes doesn't get to lie in it. That's the deal they've made. They've all got transactional relationships.

[A]

Maybe. But I feel like when Shiv just turns to him and said, she's like, can you tell Logan that this deal is really stupid? And he's like, no. And she's like, my meat puppet has stopped working. Like, wow. Like, you know, when. When someone talks to their husband like that, like, on some level, it's, you know, even worse than being forced to grovel around chasing a sausage. Which also, you know, in terms of the whole Iannucci DNA here was funny.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, but Shiv, too, is surely being strung along. I mean, we know from these families the women never get to the top, even if they're the smartest. Calls her and says he told her.

[C]

In the last episode.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

He said it's not, I don't make the world. You know, it's a downside that you're a woman.

[A]

But this one, at the end of it, he says he's gonna bring her in. And I just feel like the, you know, I've been saying this all along and I might be completely wrong, but I'm still convinced that the real power in this entire family is Marcia.

[B]

Which one is Marcia?

[A]

Logan's wife.

[B]

Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. With her own son who's off doing something. Yeah. No, I mean, the fact that he has an age appropriate wife more or less is surely very telling. She's extremely powerful. The fact that he. He ushered her out of the room in the first or second episode when he was having his conversation with Shiv. Yeah, there's. There's. Marcia is definitely a woman of power. But do you think that Shiv is actually going to be Logan's chosen one? I just don't see it, but I don't know.

[C]

He will.

[A]

Well, I mean, we need to, you know, there has to be space for season three.

[B]

Yes. Please, God.

[A]

I don't think Logan's gonna go anywhere. Ultimately. Yes. That all of this sort of positioning is just going through. It's always going to be positioning. None of them are actually going to take over. As Logan says in this episode, I am surrounded by snakes and fucking morons.

[B]

He's not wrong, is he? My big question, I guess, is whether any of his children are ever going to take the management training course. I mean, that's obviously the path to power, but none of them are going to do it.

[A]

I kind of have a feeling that at some point Kendall actually did that.

[B]

Yeah, he does know the jargon. But does he know the price of a gallon of milk?

[A]

Yeah. What the hell was that about? Suddenly Logan feels that like anyone who is worthy of succeeding him has to have like the common touch.

[B]

Although that also reminded me of another dynastic family, the bushes. Didn't George H.W. bush once have a problem? Like it was a scanner thing and apparently it was one of those stories that wasn't accurate. But he didn't like, he was surprised by scanners. He didn't know the price of the milk.

[A]

The milk thing is like a famous thing that all politicians need to know. Price of a gallon of milk because it shows that they're in touch with something which. Okay, I guess, but yeah, but like.

[B]

Also like I'm a slightly BO but nevertheless journalist and I don't know because like, who pays? Like who sees an actual price anymore? It just goes beep, beep, beep, beep, beep. It's not like the person in the grocery tots it all up on a piece of paper. Like, who does know?

[A]

It is a general.

[B]

Unless you're really poor dollars.

[C]

You guys, I think it's like 2ish or 3ish dollars. If it's organic, it's like 4ish dollars.

[B]

I googled it. Apparently it's like 3:30, but I had no idea.

[A]

Well, I can tell you that it's like 3.30 for a pint where I get mine. I don't drink that. What? Oh yeah. I'm telling you, the Alibaba 24 hour grocery store on Worth street, man, is not cheap.

[B]

We're not talking bodega prices.

[A]

Yeah, but it's also the one thing it does show is what generation Logan is. Because, you know, if I can sort of just do a little bit of a digression into Slate money. Nerdy. We have had probably basically since the end of the Second World War, so a good 70 years or so of consistently declining food prices as a percentage of household budgets. If you were around in the 60s and the 70s, you actually cared about the price of food and you would buy like the cheaper cuts of meat because it would save on the household budget. And the price of a gallon of milk was a significant proportion of how much, you know, of your total budget. Now it's all housing and healthcare and stuff like that. But like back then, there was a time when people really cared about the price of food and they would economize on food and that kind of thing. And it's people of Logan's generation who have this idea that the price of a gallon of milk really matters.

[C]

I'm gonna say that what you just said is true, but there are still a lot of people who care about the price of groceries, judging by the supermarket and the specials there and the way people shop. And just real people still care about the price of groceries. Let's just be clear about that.

[A]

Well, I definitely care about, you know, the price of eggs at the farmer's market, because that's ridiculous. Who pays like $7 a dozen eggs?

[C]

But Trader Joe's is really popular and a gallon of milk at Trader Joe's is like much, much cheaper than a gallon of milk at the grocery store.

[A]

That's the right answer, by the way. If Logan, if Logan Roy ever, like, corners you and says, what's going on? The price of a gallon of milk, you'll be like, well, okay, at Walmart.

[B]

But ultimately the kids are never going to please him because he's the man who made this company and they're just the fuck ups who are going to fuck it up. I mean, he's. There's nothing that they can do. They memorized every price in the grocery store. If they took every management course, if they worked in a slaughterhouse, they're never going to please their father. And I just fear that that is the ultimate sad message of succession. There is no happy succession.

[A]

There is no happy succession, but like, there are slightly more successfully Machiavellian people. So. Okay, we need to talk about some real world parallels here. First of all, Frank, who gets brought into French Kiss the armadillo, and who on the private jet on the way back actually successfully does so Roman's meddling notwithstanding, he manages to get the meeting with the Pierce family.

[C]

Nice work, Frank.

[A]

Is he Peter Chernin?

[B]

My knowledge of the Murdoch world is not enough to, is not good enough to say, but there is always some. I mean, that's why they go to these fancy schools, right? That's why they send these rich kids to fancy schools to meet some, some charmers who can quote Tennyson and can belong to the right clubs and can, you know, make phone calls and get these people on the phone. I mean, that is the point. They all have lots of these. Right?

[A]

Right.

[C]

Wait Felix, who's Peter Chernin? Can you remind us?

[A]

So Peter Chernin is. He now has his own media company, but back in the day, he was a key Murdoch lieutenant who would charm people and do deals. There's a kind of what you might call investment banker gene, which involves just being able to do things like call up the Pierce family in a way that doesn't cause them to just hang up the phone and then.

[C]

Is there evidence Frank can do that? Like, he hasn't?

[A]

Well, yeah, that was the evidence. Because the evidence that he can do that is not only that he has memorized Ulysses by Alfred Lord Tennyson, but also that he manages to get Logan the meeting at the end of the episode.

[C]

Right, okay, fine.

[B]

Fair.

[C]

I'm just saying, in any other scene he's ever been in, he comes across as kind of like polyan uncle. Yeah, just Blair. He comes across as Blair, but then the.

[A]

The other character who I love so much, Sid Peach. The. The female Roger Ailes turning to Tom in the morning, saying, I'll eat your sausage, Tom. I mean, yeah, she. She. She would never, ever grovel on the floor. You know that. No.

[C]

And when you asked her, was it you, she just says, no, get out of here. Like, it's just clear She's. It's not her. Obviously she would never. I mean, never betray him.

[B]

Or she would, but she'd be smart enough to do it without leaving a trail. I mean, that's the thing. I'm absolutely confident that they will all. Because as somebody, as Michelle, the writer said, do you want me to tell your story? Do you want to tell your own story, or do you want to let the others tell it? They all have a motive to talk to her, but the smart ones will not leave any trail so that Sam the. The rat fucker can't trace them. So I'm sure Sid has a backchannel with Jessica Hecht's character, but she's much too smart to let it go. And also Logan's too smart to really press her on it.

[A]

So, Emily, where are we going here? What's gonna happen to this whole, like, Connor running for president subplot? Is that gonna wither and die, or is he gonna, like, wind up going to jail? What's gonna. I feel like it takes a long time to not pay your taxes and then get investigated by the IRS and then go through all of the appeals and. I mean, it probably takes, like, five or six years before you end up in actual jail.

[B]

No, I feel like.

[C]

I don't think anything's gonna happen with that specific plot of him not paying his taxes and, and going to jail. And there was a great part where Shiv says to him, do you know what happens to rich guys in. In jail? And he basically is like, yeah, they get a deal and they're out early because they're rich. But I think the sub, the subplot of him running for president, I feel like they're gonna Dr. Season because it's so delightful and wonderful.

[A]

Oh yeah, there has to be, there has to be a debate between him and Gil. Right.

[B]

Although here's the thing, however, could an unqualified but rich person. Like how could that they could never become president. That's ridiculous.

[C]

Oh, totally absurd. Yeah, I think he'll catch on.

[A]

Right?

[C]

I mean, he decants the wine so beautifully.

[B]

He hyper decants.

[A]

He hyper, hyper decant.

[C]

You don't hyper decant, Felix June.

[A]

I've never hyper decanted. I feel like there's a whole world of decantation out there which is just waiting to be discovered. Yeah, I mean, hyper decanting is. I mean, like it's such a wonderfully perfect touch because it's one of these like weird wine gimmicks that no one entirely. Like genuine wine people don't do it. But like, you know, rich people who.

[B]

Have pretensions of wine, even just rich people.

[A]

It's also like just it's heat. Like I think Colin on some level is quite sort of middle brow. And you do find people taking like two buck chuck and putting it in a, you know, VitaMix for like five minutes and blending it up and on the ground. So this will help do something to the tannins. I have no idea. But like it's a weird like. Yeah, it's just, it shows just a kind of basic level of credulousness, I guess.

[B]

Yeah. And I mean he is like the thing with Conor is he's dumb, he's basic, but he's not unlike a certain dumb, basic person who did maybe have some political success. He has no charisma. He has no personal charisma even in a grotesque way. Like he's just, he's intensely boring. And so like there's either he's not meant to succeed as a politician or they've not revealed his. Because he has no. He isn't a man of the people. Even vaguely. He really. Like, he doesn't even know what milk is, much less how much it costs.

[C]

He's the only one who doesn't seem to care about succession. He doesn't have a stake in, you know, taking Logan's place. He doesn't seem to be competing for his love the way the other. The other three are at all.

[A]

No, the wonderful lack of self awareness. And that great line where Shiv comes to see him and he walks over to his penthouse window and he goes, the elites are scared. I can see them down there.

[B]

And she says something about, yeah, you get a great view of them from the penthouse.

[A]

Which I feel like she didn't need to say that. Like, it was all there in the original line. I'm like, did you? Nah, you didn't need that line sometimes.

[B]

It was gilding. It was.

[A]

So, Emily, what was your favorite line in this episode?

[C]

Yes. Let me find it in my notes here. It's, oh, yes. On the plane going to the retreat. Of course, everyone else is jaded and just hanging out, but Greg is super excited to be on the private jet. And he looks around and he says he's all excited. He says, it's like I'm in a band. A very white, very wealthy band. It's like I'm in U2. I love that. I watched it a few times. It's like, I'm in U2.

[A]

In true, like, veep fashion, I'm gonna do another one of these, like, great Logan lines where he talks about the leak to the Pierce family. And he goes, that's about as choreographed as a dog getting fucked on roller skates. June.

[B]

Well, I'm tempted to quote from Ulysses, which how dull it is to pause, to make an end, to rest unburnished, not to shine in use. I feel like that is true of many Roys. But I think my favorite line, not one that we've already mentioned, is when Roman is just exasperated by his dad's obsession with the price of milk and he says, who drinks milk anyway? Kittens and perverts, that's who.

[A]

That is a good line. On which note, we will, I think, leave episode three behind and anticipate episode four. Is Shiv going to finally enter the what I always still think of as Chase Manhattan Plaza that, like, is apparently Waco Royster Royco hq. You think? Is she actually gonna make it in there after her, like, midnight phone calls with Logan? Is she gonna be officially introduced?

[B]

I don't think he's ever gonna tell people that she is the chosen one or even that he's winked at her. I think she's still gonna be meeting in his apartment without an appointment where there's some reason that they can't really speak. So in short, no, no.

[A]

All right.

[C]

I think he'll string her along for a good many episodes to come.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

No, there's only. There's only 10. Right. We're already, like a third of the way through here.

[B]

Well.

[C]

Well, we'll see. We'll see you next week.

[A]

We'll see you next week on Slate Money Succession.