Slate Money: Super Pumped (Air Date: September 21, 2019)

Host: Felix Salmon (Axios)
Co-hosts: Emily Peck (Huffington Post), Anna Szymanski, Guest: Mike Isaac (New York Times)

Episode Overview

This episode of Slate Money revolves around the explosive rise and messiness of Uber, based on Mike Isaac’s new book Super Pumped: The Battle for Uber, with wider discussions on Silicon Valley culture, new labor laws in tech, WeWork’s bizarre saga, and the resurgence of worker power across industries. The hosts and guest explore how outsized personalities shape companies, the underlying mechanics of tech business models, and the shifting sands of modern labor relations.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Mike Isaac’s Book: "Super Pumped" and the Uber Story

[01:05 - 04:43]

• Mike Isaac, NYT reporter, discusses writing Super Pumped, a deep dive into Uber’s ascent and infamous founder, Travis Kalanick.
• Felix notes the book’s narrative style and its use of footnotes for personal asides.
• The group discusses how Travis’s brand of “bro culture” at Uber was simultaneously a selling point and, ultimately, his downfall:
  • Quote [03:43] (Mike Isaac): "I think people don't really realize how bad it was until you look at how condensed the number of gnarly things that came out happened, you know, like, in very short order."
• The hosts link the Uber implosion to the increased scrutiny tech companies faced post-2016 Trump election, referencing events like #DeleteUber.

2. Techlash and the Role of Cultural Reckonings

[04:43 - 08:45]

• Emily Peck observes that behavior at Uber echoed patterns in other tech companies, but Uber’s exposure was catalyzed by heightened media attention and shifting cultural attitudes toward misogyny.
• Mike asserts that Trump's election fundamentally changed public scrutiny of tech, making Uber a prime candidate for backlash.
  • Quote [05:14] (C): "I really do think the election of Trump gave people more...scrutiny of tech just increased after that."
• Travis Kalanick is often described as "Trumpian" for his reality-distorting charisma and command over his environment.
  • Quote [06:52] (C): "They kept calling him Trump, Trumpian, weirdly...he created his own reality, but had this charisma that kept people around him..."
• The group debates whether Uber’s troubles were unique or symptomatic of a broader tech reckoning.

3. California’s AB5: Employment Status, Gig Economy, and Uber’s Existential Threat

[08:45 - 13:44]

• Discussion turns to California’s AB5 law, classifying gig workers as employees.
• The hosts ponder whether anti-Uber sentiment helped get the law passed and explore its ambiguous consequences.
  • Many gig workers value flexibility but crave better pay and consistency.
  • Mike notes Uber might be forced to schedule drivers like employees, undermining the core gig model.
  • Quote [13:03] (C): "The whole company is based on the idea of paying people less and not giving them the benefits of an employee...extrapolate that out...it's a death blow, you know."
• Uber’s global business model relies on low labor costs; the threat of similar laws elsewhere could become existential.

4. Uber’s Unprofitable Pursuit of Growth and Ride-Hail Economics

[13:44 - 17:06]

• Despite taking a hefty cut of each fare, Uber has never achieved profitability, largely due to heavy subsidies of both drivers and riders—first with rides, now with food delivery (Uber Eats).
  • Quote [14:21] (C): "They just moved into food delivery as their major area of growth and they're like setting money on fire trying to subsidize that sort of growth."
• The hosts note that ridehailing in mature cities is marginally profitable, but investors expect growth, pushing Uber into other loss-making ventures.
• Felix suggests a merger with Lyft; Mike recounts how Lyft's near-demise was averted after Travis's departure and the #DeleteUber campaign.

5. WeWork and Adam Neumann: Hubris of Silicon Valley Leadership

[17:06 - 24:48]

• The focus shifts to WeWork’s disastrous IPO and the erratic, grandiose behavior of founder Adam Neumann.
  • Memorable moment: Neumann’s ambitions: "Trillionaire baby, President of the United States, President of the world." ([17:48])
• The Wall Street Journal’s revelations of Neumann’s personal excesses (smoking weed on a private jet, self-dealing real estate) tarnished WeWork.
  • Quote [19:02] (D): "No, he comes across as an idiot, I think."
• Discussion of dual-class shares and how investors failed to learn from Uber, repeating mistakes regarding founder control.
  • Quote [21:09] (A): "We're not going to give Adam Neumann super voting shares of 20 votes per share. We're going to give him super voting shares of only 10 votes per share. That's fine."
• The crew reflect on how excessive venture capital (SoftBank’s Vision Fund) led to reckless investments and reinforced outsized founder personalities, observing that sociopathy can now get rewarded even without profits.
  • Quote [21:36] (A): "Business and capitalism reward sociopaths...And especially very charming sociopaths who can persuade people to give them attention and money..."

6. Private Market Madness and the Limits of Capital Glut

[23:42 - 24:44]

• The SoftBank Vision Fund’s magnitude has changed the game: "If you have $100 billion and you need to park it places quickly, you need to go to the companies that require the most capital..."
• The WeWork debacle threatens confidence in SoftBank and signals cooling capital enthusiasm.

7. Adam Neumann: Entrepreneurial Oddities & Shifting Corporate Narratives

[24:21 - 26:29]

• Neumann’s prior ventures were wild (e.g., baby knee pads, collapsible high heels)—described as "stoned fever dreams."
• The "no-meat" policy at WeWork is cited as an example of arbitrary, ego-driven management.
  • Quote [26:26] (C): "He just wanted to, like, dick measure that much more than the last guy. Basically."
  • Emily Peck: "It's like woke dick measure." ([26:37])

8. Rise of Worker Power: Unions and Collective Organization

[27:00 - 36:38]

• Turning to real labor — GM’s worker strike and AB5 signal a turning point for employee leverage:
  • GM workers strike over temp hiring, benefits, and a sense of broken promises since the Great Recession.
    • Quote [28:36] (D): "We've had more strike activity last year than we have had in a decade at least or more..."
• Discussion of tech labor: Kickstarter’s unionization push may become the first in tech, exposing the hypocrisy of "public benefit corporations."
• The debate over whether tech workers want or need old-school union contracts, and how collective action might take new forms in modern companies.
  • Quote [32:15] (C): "Workers are starting to figure out that they have power...they're starting to really recognize that coming together and pushing for that for change is something they can do."

9. Profits, Public Companies and B Corps

[36:10 - 37:03]

• Felix and co-hosts discuss the pressure for public companies and B Corps to pursue not just profit but growth, and challenge whether perpetual profit growth should be a requirement for all public companies.
  • Quote [36:38] (B): "The ability to just continue to be—to not be profitable in the newer economy, I think is going to be challenged more and more."

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Uber’s Dysfunction:
  • "It was like misogyny, like sprayed with Axe body spray or whatever." (Mike Isaac, [07:40])
• On Adam Neumann’s Leadership:
  • "His businesses are all like stoned fever dreams." ([25:02])
• On WeWork’s governance:
  • "We're not going to give Adam Neumann super voting shares of 20 votes per share. We're going to give him super voting shares of only 10 votes per share. That's fine." (Felix Salmon, [21:09])
• On Silicon Valley founders:
  • "Business and capitalism reward sociopaths...especially very charming sociopaths..." (Felix Salmon, [21:36])

Important Timestamps

• [01:05] Introduction of Mike Isaac and his Uber book
• [03:43] The collapse of Uber’s culture
• [05:14] Impact of Trump’s election on tech scrutiny
• [06:52] The “Trumpian” style of Travis Kalanick
• [08:45] Discussion of California’s AB5 and gig work
• [13:03] Uber’s existential threat from employee classification
• [14:21] Uber subsidizing food delivery
• [17:06] Introduction to WeWork and Adam Neumann
• [19:02] Neumann’s effect on WeWork’s IPO perception
• [21:09] WeWork’s dual-class shares governance farce
• [23:42] Discussion of capital glut and Vision Fund
• [26:26] "Woke dick measure" moment with WeWork policies
• [27:00] GM strike as a sign of worker power resurgence
• [32:15] Tech worker organizing for collective action
• [36:38] Discussion on profitability in the "new economy"

Numbers Round ([37:27 - 44:54])

• 2020: Year of Airbnb’s planned IPO; motivations and timing discussed ([37:29])
• €80 million: Amount scammed by using a lifelike mask of a French defense minister on Skype ([39:15])
• 2.9 billion: Number of birds lost in North America in 50 years—lament on environmental decline ([40:43])
• $500 million: Adam Neumann’s personal credit line, now at risk as WeWork’s valuation collapses ([41:48])

Final Thoughts

This episode masterfully weaves together tales of tech excess, structural weaknesses in new economy business models, and the re-emergence of worker solidarity. With salty anecdotes, sharp industry analysis, and candid humor (not least “woke dick measure” as a corporate strategy), Slate Money makes financial headlines vividly accessible and relevant, exposing how personal foibles and macro forces interlock in today’s economy.