← Built in Public
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- [00:00]
A
You have it all. Why invest in this now?
- [00:03]
B
The trick to being an incredible entrepreneur is two things. One, knowing what your talents are and your skill sets and then applying them to a game. A business that you can win a lot with. Fitness. People. Like, I want to come try it first for free. And I always thought that was, like, such a. Because you don't get to go to a restaurant and, like, order something for free and see if you like it and then pay, great. Next time, I'll pay. When you're the type of leader that people know, you expect excellence from them, and you also show up with your most excellent self. It makes people rise. They want to see what they're made of. Why does everybody live like this? Is there has to be a different, better way to do life. You don't want to do any education on money. You don't want to read any books, but you want to be people. Like, what's the fastest way for me to make money? I'm like, I didn't want to talk to you. Like, you have no interest in actually learning. You're looking to get rich quick, which is not possible. Instead of thinking, I can, it's like, why not me? I never, like, forget to tell myself that.
- [00:59]
A
Mic drop moment. Welcome to Slay the Gatekeeper. I'm your host, Courtney Johnson, and I am here to un gatekeep the gatekept. Thank you so much for being here. Enjoy. Ann. Welcome to Slay the Gatekeeper.
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B
Thanks for having me, Courtney.
- [01:19]
A
So excited you're here. I actually made a list of like 50 people, 50 dream guests on my podcast, and you're on that list. So to see this come to fruition is really, really amazing.
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B
Yeah, well, check it off. Now there's 49 left.
- [01:33]
A
Maybe now there's 49 left. Love it. So, Anne, welcome.
- [01:38]
B
Thanks.
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A
You founded Solidcore. You served hundreds of thousands of clients, opened 100 plus location, exited for 90 million, founded a super successful, impactful nonprofit. You are such an inspiration to me and my community. And I just want to first thank you for being here.
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B
Thanks. That's so nice. Thank you.
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A
So, something that I've noticed is you have really invested lately in your giving back, in your personal brand, your own personal content creation, your talking, your podcasts, and I want to know why you have it all. Why? Why invest in this now?
- [02:18]
B
Well, I think, you know, there's different chapters to different points of your life. And first starting in the nonprofit, and then Solidcore, you know, there isn't really a big desire that I have to start another Business right now I feel like I know too much and, you know, maybe later on down my life when I feel pulled in that manner. But you still want to feel like you're contributing and that you're adding value. And so I figured the best thing, you know, that I can do that gives me the lifestyle that I'm looking for right now is to. To share, to give advice, to try to empower people who are on the same path as I was about wanting to be an entrepreneur and live life on their own terms. I share a lot about money. Just anything that I feel like has enhanced my life, whether it's doing that through social media, through podcasts, through public speaking, to try to educate as much as I can. So that's why I do it. It's a form of contribution. Yeah.
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A
Beautiful. Well, thank you for doing that. It's really impacted me and again, a lot of my community. And what's your, what's your vision for the world? Like, why are you doing all of this?
- [03:28]
B
Yeah, I think, like, when you, when you think about whether it's your legacy or what makes you feel even as small as, like, what makes you feel good, I'm putting your head on your pillow at night. I think that comes back to feeling proud of who you are and how you spent your time. So again, these different chapters of when I found back on my feet, I had felt like, oh, cool. I found my purpose and I did it young and I'll do this for the rest of my life. It was really eye opening. When I felt it was time to move on from that venture, I didn't expect that. Again, I think we look for, when we search for so long of this thing that we think we're meant to do with our life. And so when that comes to an end and you're like, oh, I have to go do something else, that was really interesting to me. And so when you open yourself up to what could possibly be next. I didn't expect it to be a high end fitness boutique concept because it was so different than, you know, spending six and a half years helping the homeless. But it was the same in that I wanted to empower people. I wanted to build community, authentic community around making people's lives happier and healthier. It was just more in a for profit way than in a nonprofit way. And so when you think about, like, why I'm doing anything, I again, like, I don't know if you are into Tony Robbins, but Tony Robbins has these sort of six human needs that all of us have and he's like, I've never found a human who doesn't have them. They're just in different orders. I'm probably going to get them wrong, that I'm sitting on the spot. But it is, it is love, security, variety, growth, contribution. And the other one is around like significance. And so mine has always been growth and contribution. They go back and forth sort of at the top. And I've always felt like I want to contribute in some manner. So whatever I'm doing with my life, even though I'm not building a big company right now, contribution still sits at, at number one for me. And that makes me feel good about how I spend my time.
- [05:30]
A
That's so beautiful. Was there a moment, like a lightning strike moment for back of my feet and for Solid Core or was it a slow build where the picture was, you know, slowly revealed?
- [05:41]
B
Yeah, I'm not really a slow build kind of girl. I've been that way in my personal life. Like even my husband, like I knew I was going to marry my husband before I even met him in person. Like I told my family, I was like, this is, this is the guy. So when I sort of know, I, I, I know and I go all in and I, you know, give it a hundred percent back on my feet was easy because I had been searching for two years in my 20s on like, what it is I was supposed to do with my life. And I was really frustrated that I couldn't figure it out, knowing I was supposed to do something big and special and unique. And I think a lot of people feel that way. They at least want to find their purpose, but they just, you know, it's like, where do I look like someone just tell me what it is and I'll go do it. So when I discovered, you know, these guys outside the shelter that I built this rapport with, they reminded me a lot of my dad who has his own addiction issues. And it's just like, oh my God, this is it. Like I'm supposed to start a running club and I saw the vision for it to be so much more pretty early on and I just like knew what I was supposed to do. And same thing with Solid Core. Honestly, when you and it, I'm not a very woo woo person, right? But like, you do have to open yourself up. You do have to be like, I'm looking for what's my, what's my next thing. I'm looking for where else I can make impact. And when you start to open yourself up in that way, I think that there are opportunities that, that either pass you by or present themselves. And it's up to us to be ready for them. So when I was in Los Angeles, four back on my feet. I walked by this Pilates studio and I thought it looked cute, right? I thought I was super fit. And I was like, I'll go do this LA workout. And it was really, really hard. And what struck me the most about it was like I had never worked out like that. I had always jumping, pounding, running and thought that being fit, you were injured every six months. And I just had never experienced something like that. And I'm like, if I haven't, that means most other people haven't either. And then I started taking Pilates back in New York and just realized no one's really built the community in a way that I know how to do around a workout like this. And no one's really scaled it, which is also what I'm good at. So the trick to being an incredible entrepreneur is two things. One, knowing what your talents are and your skill sets and then applying them to a game, a business that you can win. And, you know, there's a reason that I didn't start a tech company. Like, I'm not a behind the scenes, you know, build sort of a product that people are going to use. I like to bring people together and I like to do it around health and fitness. So this just felt like, I can win this game. So it was another moment like that where the marketplace seemed really open to it. I moved back to DC, opened my first studio, and like back in 2013, there wasn't boutique fitness really like it is today. I mean, now you can't literally walk down a block without seeing some sort of concept or studio. So we were really sort of first to market, especially in dc. There was no Soul Cycle yet. There was no Orange Theory, there was no rumble, there was no berries. We were sort of first on the scene there, so we had a big education to do to the market. But we also had a lot of white space to be able to be first. And that really propelled the company forward.
- [09:02]
A
Something that I find really interesting and would be a challenge when it comes to fitness studios is for a lot of your clients, your customers, they're building habits. How do you enroll them or inspire them into habit building?
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B
Honestly, our intro offer a lot with fitness people, like, I want to come try it first for free. And I always thought that was such bullshit because you don't get to go to a restaurant and order something for free and see if you like it. And then okay, great, next time I'll pay. And so our intro offer was like, it's a two week unlimited. We discovered that if we can, if we can get people bought in for two weeks and they get on a schedule, right, Habit forming schedule, where they found a time that works for them and they found a coach, then maybe they found a couple clients that they connect with, that two weeks is enough for them to actually start to see some results from this new way of working out and build a habit. So our retention was so much higher than having people come in for just one class or buy one, get one free, like two times wasn't enough. But when you tell people our only intro offer is either you buy the full price, you know, class for 40 some dollars, or you can get two weeks from 99. Most people choose that and then they're like, ooh, I'm going to come as often as I can because I want to get my money's worth. And we're like, yeah, we definitely want you to do that so that you then purchase a membership. So that's really a big part of how we did it was through our intro offer.
- [10:25]
A
That's so smart. Yeah, I would assume too. I mean just being in class, Solid core is definitely not for beginners.
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B
Yeah, it's not for, and if you, I mean again, we always, we had this great marketing campaign that it was like, it's not for everyone, but who it's for is people who like to challenge themselves, see what they're made of, you know, be around other people who are super ambitious and want to work hard and want to sweat and like, want to feel good about the effort that they just put into, you know, 50 minutes of their workout. This isn't like a check the box, you know. Oh, I kind of worked out. Like there's no real hiding in solid core. Like, like you have to do the work. And so in the back of people's minds they're like, oh, I want to be that person. So it attracts a certain type of individual who is just like so ambitious and wants to be around other people who are having the same mindset.
- [11:12]
A
That's so great. Yeah, the confidence in the messaging and who it's for and who it's not for.
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B
Yeah, exactly.
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A
So good. Well, let's get into some cheat codes. You have some amazing, incredible cheat codes. And first cheat code, you hold people high. So something that you've shared before is in Back on my feet. So it's a run club. It's a running Community for homeless folks. And if they show up late, if they're not committed, you kick them out.
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B
Yeah.
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A
Tell me more.
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B
Yeah, that happened from like the inception of the idea and when I went in there and met this was in 2007, the first nine guys who were, you know, the original mind guys of back on my feet, that was the standard that I'm going to hold you to this state of excellence and you need to show up on time. You need to come three days a week. I'm going to track your attendance and if you're tardy, I'm going to track that too. You need to come with a positive attitude and you have to be willing to respect and support your teammates. And nobody runs alone. So when you create standards, this is culture, right? So that means I can't be late. That means that I need to be there three days a week and that means I need to come with a positive attitude. And it was really my first without knowing it. Lesson in leadership is when you're the type of leader that people know, you expect excellence from them and you also show up with your most excellent self. It makes people rise. They, they want to see what they're made of. And I had felt that these particular individuals who found themselves in a homeless shelter hadn't had anybody look at them like that in a really long time. If ever in their life, look at them with complete clean slate and say, you're capable of excellence. So I could, I can still see like the guys looking at me and nodding and like finally someone sees something in me. And if you can apply that to your business and you can again lift people up, I think you'll be pretty amazed at what people are capable of.
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A
How did you bring that culture into solidcore?
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B
Same sort of thing, right? Our tagline of create the strongest version of yourself wasn't, wasn't like just for kicks. I had felt that in order for an in person fitness business like that to be successful at first, right. It really, the founder is really crucial, right. It can't just be this inauthentic. Like, who is this girl? Oh, she doesn't work hard. Oh, she doesn't, you know, push herself in class. She doesn't even do the workout. Like I was one of the strongest people in class. I was taking class four or five times a week, sometimes twice a day, you know, running. I was super fit. I was going to grow my business. I'm opening two, I opened five in the first year. So by holding myself to this standard and also like not being late for classes. Like not, not canceling classes I signed up to coach or that I signed up for. I really think sometimes people try to create culture through words and what they want it to be, and they forget to show up in that manner. And so we started to build our team through our client base. So when I would meet some client who I would just be impressed by, whether it's their energy or how they were interacting with clients and how they were showing up in the workout, I would get to know them and if they would be a fit for the business, I would hire them. You know, whether as a full time employee in operations or as a coach. And most of our coaches, people always ask like, where did you guys find talent? I'm like, from our client base. And most of them never had any background in fitness because that was something that we could teach them. I could train them on how to deliver the solid core workout, how to keep clients safe. But what you can't teach people is how to be affable and how to have great EQ and social, you know, awareness to make sure everybody in the room feels comfortable and that they like you and want to be around you and that you're a positive. Because that's what people go to these group fitness classes for. Like their coach has to mu or has to project just this again, authentic positivity that you want to work hard for that person. So it was our client base that really, I think, propelled the brand forward.
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A
Yeah, that's so, so genius. I feel like you are a person of very little excuses and not excited about other people's excuses. With back on my feet with Solidcore, your staff, the team, the commute, the run club community is coming to you with a really good excuse. How are you responding to them?
- [15:37]
B
Yeah, I'm not, I'm not really an excuse person. Listen, things happen and people have bad days and they need moments and all these things. I think I have a pretty good, you know, radar for people who are, are bullshitting or who have a propensity to always play the victim card or, you know, always like, oh, that won't work. And you know, I remember, I remember hiring people in that, in that way. And it's like one, you know, one time you let it go. But like, if you hear somebody talk negatively about themselves or other people or they discredit other people, like, well, yeah, I could run that fast of XYZ or like, well, yeah, I could do that too. If XYZ and just up play their disadvantage and downplay somebody else's skill set. I don't have a big tolerance for that. I mean, I can distinctly remember letting this one particular person go at Solidcore who was just a naysayer. And, you know, I reminded them it was just like, well, that's just not the way things are done. Like, we can't do that. Like, you know, the landlords won't xyz. And I'm like, listen, you know, I have built this company to 25 locations in four years, doing things completely differently than anybody else has done them. I've done it with pretty much zero funding. And so the way that things are done or that landlords or whoever, whatever. If everything I say sounds new and different, it's because it is. And it's because the old way doesn't allow for a company like ours to scale at the pace that we're scaling. So if I present an idea, I want people to say, how can we get that done? Versus, well, that's not possible because it's, you know, we're on the same team. Right. Like, when you have your executive team or somebody who's working closely with you constantly trying to tell you why something won't work and you allow that person to continue to stay in the culture, you're saying, like, it's okay. And, you know, I want to be like, at least you're gonna try. And if you come back and you run into roadblocks, one, you're going to try to solve them yourself, but two, bring them with solutions that you've tried, and then we'll get more people involved to try to solve them together. So I learned pretty quickly of, like, I need people who are on board with doing things differently. And any problem solvers, like, I don't. I don't care if it feels like it hasn't been done before. Someone has to go first. Yeah.
- [17:55]
A
100% is possible. 100% of the time.
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B
Yeah.
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A
No victim.
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B
Yeah.
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A
So you obviously have a very strong eq, have built very strong cultures, something that. A theme that we've been talking about in the podcast over the last few weeks is self development and the fact that a lot of times, self development doesn't happen by. By accident. So what have you invested in yourself? Workshops, coaches, books, resources? What have you done to develop your EQ, your leadership, your entrepreneurial skills over the last 10, 20 years?
- [18:29]
B
Yeah, I mean, I feel like I've been this way since I've been a kid, and the first thing comes from asking questions and curiosity. So I grew up in North Dakota, and I thought that everybody, you know, when I look around at all the adults that were there, it's like, man, like, why does everybody live like this one? Why does everybody stay here? It's so. It's so cold in the winter. Like, it's crazy. It's crazy cold. Like, you can't really even be outside for more than a few minutes. And everybody seemed to be going to a job, getting a paycheck, you know, rushing around at night, chores. It just kind of felt exhausting. And I'm like, why does everybody live like this? Is there has to be a different, better way to do life. So that curiosity of just starting to ask questions, you know, and then you start to say, well, how do other people, you know, live? Sounds silly, but like, when I would watch a sporting event, I'd be like, who are those people that have courtside seats? You know, how do they have courtside seats? And then most of the regular people are sitting in the nosebleed sections. You know, it's. You start to sort of be like, I want to sit courtside. What do I have to do to sit courtside? So that's the first part of it is asking questions. And then I just became kind of fascinated with the personal development world. Even pretty young, so reading stuff like how to Win Friends and Influence people just still one of my favorite books. You know, I've gone to Tony Robbins Date with Destiny, which is six days of immersive, pretty intense, you know, personal growth. Again, no excuses. I love Tony Robbins because he is definitely not like, allows you to. You're gonna blame people for your life. Like, give me, give me a break. You're going to be in the same situation forever, and the only person who loses when you blame other people is you. So I've always just been drawn to that kind of stuff and anything that would gonna was gonna put me in a position to again win. So after selling Solidcore, I started educating myself as much as possible around investing. You know, it's my job to make sure I'm taking care of my own money and doing. Growing my money in the ways that I want to. I can have advisors around me, but those people are there to advise. And it's my decisions that I have to take owners over on what that money grows and how it makes impact. So it's. Right now it's. It's focused on podcasts, like money wise and, you know, reading. I went back and read Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Even even though I've read that before too, it's still a mindset. Perspective, you know, talking to people who have the same amount of wealth that I do and listening to them and being like, oh, that's a good nugget. Or like, man, I'm glad I don't think like that. You know, knowing the state and relationship that I want to have with money, which is a state of abundance, I don't want it to stress me out. I don't want it to control me. So I sort of start with the goal that I want, and then I work backwards to say, okay, what do I. What do my habits need to look like then? What does my mindset need to look like? When am I going to catch myself if I start, you know, behaving differently? That isn't in support of that goal?
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A
Yeah. What I, what I want to call out from your. Your answer there is how accessible a lot of these things are. You've mentioned Sam Par, Rich Dad, Poor dad, how to Win Friends and Influence People. I mean, Tony Robbins has zillions of zillions, podcasts, YouTube videos, all online for free. So I, I'm gonna link all that in the show notes. But I want to surface that a lot of people, a lot of my listeners have the perception of you have to spend a lot of money, it has to be expensive. It's inaccessible for me. And everything you just named is very accessible.
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B
I mean, books cost 20, $30. Podcasts are free. YouTube is free for the most part. If you want the ads like this, there's just no excuse to, you know, when people like, I don't know anything about money or like, what do I'm like, guys, like, if you go on chat, GPT, like, there's just, like, you're not even putting any effort in. I equate it to. I just posted this today of like, somebody who says, you know, well, I don't really want to work out and I don't want to have any boundaries for what I put in my body, but I want to be super fit. But, like, you don't want to do any education on money. You don't want to read any books, but you want to be mean. People are like, what's the fastest way for me to make money? I'm like, I didn't want to talk to you. Like, you have no interest in actually learning. You're looking to get rich quick, which is not possible. Like, that's gambling. And I'm not for that. So if you're not going to put any time or effort into something, then, like, I don't have any interest in Working with you or. Or you're going to be broke the rest of your life. I don't know what to tell you.
- [22:49]
A
Yeah, I think of it like learning an instrument. A lot of people have this idea that they're just going to strike gold and some miracle is going to happen, but you would never. A miracle wouldn't happen to where you go from never picking up a guitar to shredding the guitar. Right. It's practice, it's education, it's so many reps. And it's the same for money.
- [23:06]
B
Entrepreneurship, Building real wealth takes a decade, honestly. Like, it takes a decade of making a lot of money and being really diligent about it and learning like it's. It's never gonna happen overnight. Sure. Do people get lucky and win the lottery? Yeah, that happens. And most of those people end up losing all that because they have no financial, you know, literacy or education or management. And they don't respect the money that they have because they didn't have to, quote, unquote, earn it. And it wasn't sort of a slower, you know, a slower build and it's not meaningful to them. So, yeah, having a very. Another great book is Jen Sincero. I think I'm saying her last name right. You're a badass at making money. You know, that's a really great book to understand your relationship with money and if you respect it or not.
- [23:47]
A
Yeah, that's such a good book. I think it balances the practical with the emotional. Slash. Boo boo.
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B
Yeah. Yeah. Very well.
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A
Okay, our next cheat code. When you have a plan B, you might as well have a plan to fail.
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B
Yeah.
- [24:00]
A
What does this mean?
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B
So the best I can give you two examples of this. One is, one is with Solid Core. When I was offered $75,000 for 30 stake in Solid Core, like, before I even had my first studio open, I was putting all my own money in, and it was going to take every bit of it to get this thing going. And I was nervous, you know, I was like, oh, God, is this being stupid? Am I being irresponsible? So when I got that offer, you know, I originally thought, maybe this is smart. Like, this is actually something I should consider. And as soon as I uttered those words, I was putting a quarter in what I call the doubt jar. That when things were going to get hard, and they frankly did get hard quickly, that I was going to put another quarter in that doubt jar and say, like, oh, I'm so smart. At least I didn't put all my money in. And I would have probably leaned more into how do I get out of solid core versus I'm all in. I don't have any other option. If this thing fails, I'm going down with it. And so I knew in that moment that if I have all of the money to do it myself, but I'm going to take an investment. All I'm saying is I really don't believe I'm capable of doing this. And if that's the case, I shouldn't do it at all. So I turned down the investment and went all in and I got to see what I was made of. And things did. I mean, I got sued twice in the first, you know, 15 months of the, of the business and I got evicted from my first studio. And you know, again, when you don't have a plan B, you show up and you fight and you outlast the competition. And both of those lawsuits, you know, went in my favor for all intents and purposes. And yeah, we got evicted from the first location, but I negotiate another, you know, four to five months of staying there so I could get another location open in the same neighborhood. And I had four other locations, you know, open. But because it was like, I have to figure this out. And so, yeah, when you're forced to figure it out, you'll be amazed at what you can achieve.
- [25:54]
A
Burn the boats.
- [25:55]
B
Yeah. And the second one, I'll tell you is personal, was with my husband. You know, Brett and I were long distance and, you know, he had just come out of a relationship that, you know, didn't, didn't go well or didn't end well. And I was about a year out of a relationship and engagement that I called off. And I was in New York at the time and he was in San Diego. And it wasn't easy. Like, we were flying back and forth every couple weeks and it, you know, there was a little bit of us that kind of kept our foot in the five. We called it the 5% of like, well, if this doesn't work out, I don't want to go all in. Like, we had both been hurt before, so we were like, fool me once, right? And we both were like, listen, if we don't go all in on this when it gets hard, there's three hour time difference. There's a six hour flight every two weeks. Like, it's going to get hard. You know, we're going to lean in more and find reasons that like, we shouldn't do this. It doesn't make logistical sense. Like, it's too challenging. Why wouldn't I just find somebody in my own city to date? So we just decided to shut the door on the 5% and, like, go all in. We moved in together and got engaged, and we've been married for almost a couple years now.
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A
And they're expecting a baby.
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B
I know. Yes. If you cannot tell, I'm eight months pregnant.
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A
When's your due date?
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B
December 27th.
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A
Oh, my gosh.
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B
Christmas baby. Yeah.
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A
I love it. Okay, our next cheat code. The ultimate test of a highly skilled entrepreneur is showing that the company works without you and is not dependent on. On you. How do you even get to this point? I feel like this is the biggest challenge for entrepreneurs. Oh, my gosh.
- [27:26]
B
Yeah, it's. It's not. It's not easy. And these are great questions because these are the things that I spoke recently in New York to a bunch of entrepreneurs, and I opened my speech asking people, have you thought about what your last day at your company is going to look like? And like, two people raised their hands and I was like, well, now are you thinking about it? And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, if you're not planning and thinking about that day, one, you're gonna want that day and realize, I didn't do anything to prepare, so that day is gonna be really hard to come by because your business is gonna be dependent on you. Or two, you know, you may end up having a really messy ending with your company, meaning you may bring on an investor and they have too many rights and they end up kicking you out. Or you have to do an earn out. And now you're working for, you know, venture capital or private equity, getting the money that you want for your business, and they're trying to pad expenses, and it's just messy and complicated. And you leave your company and you're just resentful and you're glad it's over. I wanted to have the ending that, like, I get to have a celebratory last day. I get to sell on my terms, all of my terms, my financial terms, my how I want to leave, how I want the Met. I mean, everything. And that was really important to me. And you can't do that if you're not succession planning and you're building a company that is revolving around you. If the business doesn't work without you, one, I think you're going to have, for those of you who are like, oh, I want to sell my company someday, but your company revolves around you. That's a really almost impossible feat. So you have to check Your ego. You need to delegate and systematize and playbook every possible thing that's responsible for the growth happening in your business. So, so we had a process for how we opened studios, how we picked locations, you know, language that belonged in the LOI and the leases. These are all teachable things, right? Negotiations with landlords bring more people into the conversation so they can see how the negotiation style works. You know, marketing operations, the training team for all of the new coaches. This was all systematized and it wasn't reliant on, well, so and so needs to do it. That doesn't mean you don't need great talent or. But the. But the process can be transferable. So every, you know, I think about when I first started Courtney, the best use of my time was coaching in the studios. Because infiltrating the culture of what we talked about, create the strongest version. That was the biggest responsibility that I had and no one was going to do that better than I did. So once enough people saw stuck and I could then start coaching less and go on to really focus on growth. Studio openings, branding, you know, marketing, inspiring the team to do a lot of these things. And then, you know, as the company grew, I was obviously doing a lot of management and leadership with our C level people. And then at some point I removed myself from all of the meetings and let these people make decisions. I can still remember that one of the meetings I was in where our COO was like, great, we're opening in Seattle. And I'm like, awesome. Like, I got told that, yeah, I didn't, I didn't choose that market. I wasn't a part of those leases. But I trusted that he took our playbook, made sure the market worked, made sure the lease terms worked, and like, great. That's a decision that he needs to be able to make at this point. And so you have to graduate every time. And so by the end of Solidcore, I was sitting in the executive chairwoman role. I was no longer the CEO. I promoted our CEO. I didn't get pushed out. I went into the exec chair role and I let him lead. And so when our last private equity deal got done, you know, I wasn't in those meetings because if you're in the meetings, then they think that you are still operating the business and that you're still calling the the shots. And I had to show the new owners of the company that like, this is the leadership team. You are buying them, you are getting them with this transaction. You are not getting, getting me. So with that, you get leverage. I was able to get, you know, I know you said I sold for 90 million, actually sold for 98.4 million. I was able to get another 10 million out of that deal because I had so much leverage in the negotiation and not having to go with as.
- [31:51]
A
Part of the deal, so powerful. I think it's so, so important, what you said about ego. It is an ego conversation. I. This happened to me a few weeks ago. I was gone for four days. There was a couple of breakdowns in my business, and I. I clocked my ego being like, oh, my God, I'm so important. I'm so needed. I'm so needed. It's such a. It's such a ego hit to realize, like, this has gotta be okay without me. I just want to feel important.
- [32:17]
B
Yeah, exactly. And we all have an ego, and we all just need to be like, you know, does my ego. Does my ego get served today? And, like, what's the outcome that I want? And, you know, sure, it was hard not to be in those meetings because I'm like, gosh, I built this thing, and I love to talk about it, and it feels good. Like, I did a really, really good job. But that's when I'm gonna go back to what I said earlier in the podcast, which is like, what's the outcome you want? And I wanted to. I was ready to move on. I wanted to close the chapter with a happy ending, and I wanted to get paid. I wanted $100 million for my efforts at Solidcore, and. And if I want those things, I have to let this happen. I have to turn over the reins. I have to, like, let the people shine who deserve to shine and let them run the next chapter of this company. So, yeah, I'm not saying it's easy, but, like, you have to just keep yourself in mind of, like, what do you really want?
- [33:10]
A
Do you have tools or, like, an internal process to overcome breakdown? So, you know, you're getting evicted. This sucks. Like, these things are happening. You have. You're getting sued. Like, how do you shorten the time between your breakdown and getting to the next breakthrough? Getting back on your feet?
- [33:27]
B
Yeah, great question. And frankly, I'm so glad that those things happened early on in. In Solid Core, because I did freak out. You know, I'd never been sued before. Like, I had ex boyfriend sue me for equity in my business, and I was furious, and I was so emotional, and I was just like, who does this guy think he is? You know, Never put in any money, never did like, how can this even be happening? And once I went through those things, like, it just takes so much to rattle me. So frankly, the best formula for it is going through, like, you can't. You can't escape that. It's just going through it and then using that as experience to know, like, wow, that thing was really, really hard. And here are some things I could have done differently that I'm gonna make sure I take with me of. Like, and I had really great advisors. Like, my lawyer said something smart to me. It was just like, ann, do you. Do you wanna be right? Like, how much are your. How much are your principles worth here? Because we can fight this, and we can take it all the way, and you can pay me 400 grand in legal fees, and we can go sit in front of a jury, and you can put the fate of this in front of nine people who are probably going to have sympathy for your poor boyfriend who you broke up with. You know, they're going to paint you as the big, bad, you know, woman who kicked her boyfriend out. And they may give him decide, like, just give him a million dollars. Because by the time that trial comes around, you know, you've opened three studios in the matter of the last four months. This trial might be a year. And now you're going to be sitting with a. A company that has 20 studios. They're going to give him something, and it's going to be more than if we just figured out a settlement agreement. So it was like having somebody so rational in my. In my ear when I was going through those tough times was really, really valuable to me who wasn't as close to, you know, the personal side of things.
- [35:12]
A
So the cheat codes are. Have someone rational around you, and you just got to go through it. It's a boot camp.
- [35:18]
B
Yeah, I know. It's like, someone like, how do you avoid getting your heart broken? I'm like, I would never. And, like, it sucks to go through that, and I would never want that for anybody. Getting your heart broken shows you just how powerful, like, love. Love is. And it meant. It means that you, like, we're all in with somebody and you really, really love that person, even though it didn't work out the way that you want to. I think everybody needs to get their heart broken at some point.
- [35:41]
A
Yeah, it's a. It's a rite of passage.
- [35:43]
B
Yeah.
- [35:43]
A
Well, this brings us to our next cheat code, which is you cannot outsource your hard.
- [35:48]
B
Yeah, tell me more. Well, doing hard things has always been a part of my DNA. And I think, again, that's how you build up resilience. And you cannot be successful personally or professionally if you don't build up your resilience muscle. So going through hard things. And I also think it's kind of like if you ski or snowboard, you know, people who ski or snowboard, but, like, they haven't fallen down in the last several times they've went, I'm like, it's time to, like, go to the blue or the black, you know, and see what you're made of a little bit. Because you're not going to get any better if you stay at the same level and nothing feels hard. That means you're not growing, that means you're not challenging yourself, and that means you're probably not going to fulfill whatever potential that you have. You're staying in your comfort zone. So things should feel. You should be like, I don't know if I'm going to finish this, or, like, I don't know if I'm going to be able to do this. So last year we went and did 29, 029, which is the equivalent of the Everest elevation. So Brett and I and a few friends, you know, we're like, we're going to go do this hard, difficult event, and you have 36 hours to complete it. And I think it's like 70% of people do, 30% of people don't. And it was. It was just one of those things, like when you're in your head the whole time and. And pushing and you're sore and it's middle of the night and it starts to rain and, like, what are you gonna do? Are you gonna quit? Are you gonna, like, look for an excuse? Or are you gonna, like, find the beauty and the joy in the work that you're doing and finish the job that you said that you would start? So you've gotta, like most things in life, up your hard ceiling. I always. I do that with money, too. I up my expensive ceiling, my giving ceiling, my impact ceiling, because it's the only way that you're gonna, you know, I think, get the most out of your life experience.
- [37:37]
A
So somebody listening to this right now, being like, okay, Anne, I'm gonna get uncomfy today. What is one thing I can do today after I put this podcast down, or maybe as you're listening to it, that I can challenge myself to start to get comfy with the uncomfy zone.
- [37:50]
B
Oh, there's all kinds of. There's all kinds of things and some simple ones that a Lot of. If your audience is in their young twenties, go have dinner by yourself tonight. And don't bring a book and don't bring a phone. Just go sit by yourself and have dinner. And you're going to have to fight through the, the idea or frankly, wait till Friday night and go do it. People are going to think, oh, God, everything's, I'm a loser. I don't have a date, I don't have any friends. That's what you're going to think people are thinking. And like, can you work through that? Or like, maybe it's time for you to go cut your hair, change your hair color. You know, I cut my hair super short when I was 30s. That was like 15 years ago, 31, 14 years ago. Nobody that back then, you know, and it was super short, way shorter than this, you know, And I was like, that was one of the smartest things I did because no one ever forgot me. It's like, oh, the girl with the short hair, right? So it was like, that was an easy one. And I always tell people to, if. If you've never lived anywhere but your home city, it's probably time to move, right? Like finding a place where you haven't been before, that you have to make new friends, that you have to figure out how to, you know, use Google Maps because you don't know where to go yet. Like, everything becomes so predictable and familiar. It's hard to grow in environments like that. So those are just like, again, the moving one is a big one. I know, but it's just like, that's the only way for you to start to trust yourself that you are able to figure things out. And I always tell people when they're like, how did you have so much courage to, to walk away from at a six figure job offer? When I started back on my feet that I never went to, I was like, I'm going to do back on my feet instead and I'm going to try to build and grow this thing. And people like, how did you have the courage to do that? I'm like, honestly, it was all of the small risks decisions that I had made up to that point. Moving away for college, going to grad school in D.C. moving in with three people I had never met before. You know, not having a car for the first time, having to go work at a place of employment where I didn't know anybody. It was just like over and over and over and over again. And what you do by doing that is you learn to trust yourself. You have so Many examples of. I figured it out. So it prepares you for the big moment when I'm like, I'm gonna walk away from every ounce of security I have, and I'm gonna try to build this thing against everybody else's, you know, doubts that they have about this idea because nobody thought it was a good idea. They're like, you're gonna run with people at homeless shelters for your job. I'm like, you don't. You don't see what I see. And you don't have the belief in yourself that I have in myself from all of those moments leading up to that point.
- [40:26]
A
It's so funny. It's so crazy how ahead of your time you were with running Community. I mean, there's always been running communities, but running Community and solid Core, like, you're on the. You know, I feel like Pilates and run Community is now becoming ubiquitous in 2025.
- [40:41]
B
Yeah. I mean, yeah, you can't, like, literally. It's like you. You're gonna trip over a Pilates studio. They're literally everywhere. And it's just now getting. I think it's still just the beginning because people realize how. I mean, I wasn't injured. I still haven't been injured for, like. It really strengthens muscles in your body that you're not getting. And I'm. I'm. I also lift heavy weights, too, but. But Pilates especially. You've done solid core, obviously. So, like, solid core is not your grandma's Pilates. Like, it is an athletic version. So you are getting a really intense workout, but you are tapping into your slow twitch muscle fibers, your smaller muscles that just get ignored. That actually would end up causing a lot of injuries around your joints and your ligaments. So anyway, I just. Yeah, I think it's just getting started. And the boom is just beginning. Yeah.
- [41:29]
A
That's amazing. Okay, our next cheat code. Your perceived disadvantages could actually be your unique positioning if you just choose to see it that way.
- [41:39]
B
Yeah, you're funny. You're, like, going through all the chapters in the book that I'm writing. Oh, really? Yeah.
- [41:44]
A
How perfect.
- [41:44]
B
Yeah, but exactly that, right? You couldn't easily. Like, I came from a family where my dad is a, you know, an addict, and he'll ask my dad, what are you addicted to? And he'll say, everything.
- [41:56]
A
Right?
- [41:56]
B
Drugs, alcohol, gambling, food. It doesn't matter. Usually when someone has, you know, an addictive tendency or disease, however you want to look at it like, it. It applies to all areas of life. My dad fishes more than any other man on the planet. And I think he's addicted to fishing, but, like, I'd rather have him doing that than doing some of the other activities. And so, you know, my. I didn't come from a lot of money. My dad's an addict. My parents got divorced. It would have been really easy to just be like, oh, well, I'm never gonna be somebody. But it actually makes me interesting because of all of that. It's like, oh, that's interesting. She had all those challenges, but she's still rising, right? It can make me relatable to a crowd when I'm giving a keynote where someone says, oh, that, like, my dad's an addict, too. And Ann's now my inspiration or an example for me to know that I don't have to be a victim or a statistic, right? So I use that to my advantage to connect with people. Being from North Dakota, being a white blonde woman, right? Like, when I went into that homeless shelter, these guys were sort of like, who is this girl? She's this white blonde girl from North Dakota. It didn't fit. They were like, why are you here connecting with us? You know, even the media attention that I got of, like, here's this white blonde woman with all of these, you know, they were black men for the most part. And I'm like, it's because my dad was an addict. And, like, these guys also were facing their own battles with addiction. And I authentically had, like, I'm like, these are my people. Like, I'm trying to heal myself. I never was able to help my dad. Running helped me. I thought running could help these guys, but, like, it didn't go together. And that got so much media attention. I used that and milked that for everything I could to raise awareness and money and try to show people that these guys are not who you think they are. They are working their butts off to try to have a different life. And I got a lot of attention and money for an issue that's really difficult to get attention for. So I'm like, I'm going to use everything I got here to try to raise awareness and money and try to give these guys a different life than what they thought that they could have. So that was helpful. When I went into private equity meetings, you know, I, again, short hair, I have tattoos I wore, you know, see through crop tops, whatever. These guys are all in suits, and I'm just like. At least it made them be like, okay, like, what is this girl gonna say? And then if I can be charming and funny and know my numbers and impress them with business, it's sort of we all get attracted to what is real. And so I just was going to lean in hard to like, this is who I am. I'm not really fancy, you know, Again, I grew up in North Dakota. I still eat sunflower seeds. Like, it's, it's this, this weird thing of like, people gravitate. I think they just want real. And when you pretend to be somebody that you're not, people can sense that thing out and they don't trust it and they don't want to invest in it and they don't want to work for somebody that they think is, you know, there's just something off about that person. I don't trust them. So I've just always found it works in my favor of like, I'm just going to own every part of my story and where I'm from and who my parents are and everything.
- [45:11]
A
Yeah. So tactically, I would encourage our listeners to think about what stories we're telling ourselves about why we can't do something. Oh, well, I'm from a small town. I don't have the expanders, I don't live here. I look like this, I am this. And try on shifting the story to a more empowering story. That's actually what makes me unique. I feel you so hard on North Dakota. I was born in Texas, but I grew up in a tiny town in Minnesota.
- [45:36]
B
Yeah.
- [45:37]
A
And yeah, definitely similar culture.
- [45:39]
B
Yeah, exactly. But I love how you're breaking that down. Because when I get on stage, when I speak and I'll be like, I'm from North Dakota. It makes people be like, oh, I'm interested, you know, like, she's gonna have a different perspective. And I think a lot of times, you know, we don't want to be noticed. We just want to fit in. Well, getting fitting in doesn't get remembered right. So when we see something that like, oh, I'm gonna, you know, dress like everybody else or have the same hairstyle as everybody else because I don't want to be made fun of or I don't want the attention, you know, getting comfortable with. Like, if, if. No, if you didn't worry about what people thought of you, you know, what would you wait? Like, think about like a 4 year old who gets dressed in the morning and they're like, you can wear anything you want to wear. And there, if it's a little girl, maybe she's going and picking out like the tutu and the bright colors and just like because she saw some rainbow bright on TV and wants to look like her, she doesn't care. At some point we start to care what people think. And I really do believe when we, when we care so much, people sense that and they don't trust that you're being real with them and they don't think that they know you. And if they don't think that they know you, they're like, I'm not really sure if I want to invest in you. I'm not really sure if I, if I trust what you're saying because I think you're saying what you want, what you're saying what I want you to say. So it doesn't get you very far. Yeah.
- [46:56]
A
What a beautiful permission slip for authenticity. Yeah, I, I just finished a book. It comes out in March and it's around.
- [47:03]
B
Thank you.
- [47:04]
A
It's around this concept. It's a career book for Gen Z. Around the concept of A players and B players. And A players. Their parents were in the corporate world. Maybe their parents were entrepreneurs. They were passed down the cheat codes at the dinner table.
- [47:16]
B
Right.
- [47:16]
A
To business, entrepreneurship and career. And then we have the B players. B players like me, my dad worked at grocery stores. My mom was like a preschool teacher. I lived in small towns. I didn't have any expanders. And what I find really interesting is these B players turning into A players. And what I'm hearing from you is you grew up as a B player. You didn't have the family, the environment that fostered these things as, oh, I obviously know, that's how I get a job. That's how entrepreneurship work. That's how business works. And so what I really admire about you is your ability to not. You didn't enroll yourself in that narrative of I can't do it just because I'm from this background. And I find it. It's just so rare to find other people that didn't come from that environment. You know, a lot of people, like I'm self made or whatever, but their parents were entrepreneurs, they got the codes. So I just, I'm appreciative to you of telling your story and, and sharing this information. You are un. Gatekeeping the gate kept. And I think that's amazing. Like I was on your money webinar. It was so great.
- [48:18]
B
Okay.
- [48:19]
A
Yeah, yeah, it's. It's amazing.
- [48:21]
B
Yeah. And you're, and you're right. And that's why, you know, again, feeling so compelled to try to teach people about money because of just that we, our school system and Our parents, right? Nobody. And our parents, parents didn't teach them, so they didn't teach us. And it's not out of trying to make our kids fail. It's just we were told how to do this one thing this way. And when we look at how many people live paycheck to paycheck or we look at the divorce rate and we don't stop and think, I don't want to end up like that. So you have to do things differently. And like I said, it's the curiosity to start asking questions. And, and I again can remember from a young age, and this is the one thing that is so important, it doesn't mean everything but what you tell yourself about who you are and who you can be, right? So if you say things, I had this retreat at my house and this guy, I was asking like, what are your guys's fears about your business and yourself? And he's like, I'm afraid I'm gonna mess it all up. And I'm like, do you want the truth? He's like, yeah. I'm like, you are. I'm like, trust me, you think I'm nice enough for me to be up here and be like, oh, don't say that. You're not going to screw it all up. I'm going to tell you that you are. Because you, you, it's a self fulfilling prophecy. It's what you think about every day. You're going to look for opportunities to screw up so that you can be right and then you get to be right. But then you now have this massive mess to clean up. So how we talk to ourselves, it's not everything, right? You have to, you know, there's hard work, there's execution. Some of these things, playing a game you think you can win. All of those things come into play too, for success. But I can 100% tell you if you do not believe in yourself, you're not going to make it. So you might as well choose to speak to yourself in an empowering way that at least gives you a shot to make it, you know? So, like, tell yourself, no, I'm capable. Yeah. Why can't I sit courtside at a Knicks game? You know, like, why can't it be me that starts the business? Why does everybody else get, you know, access to it and I don't? So instead of thinking I can't, it's like, why not me? And I just always, I never like, forget to tell myself that.
- [50:21]
A
That's so powerful. Mic drop moment. Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Tell me about the book. When does the book come out?
- [50:29]
B
Oh, my gosh, we're still in draft phase and I don't know. You're done, done, done.
- [50:33]
A
You know, tying up the loose end.
- [50:35]
B
It is so difficult. Like, oh my God, I am an executor. So, like, I can open 30 studios in a year, no problem. But sitting down and doing the deep work and then you go back and you write and I'm like, I can't believe I wrote that. Like, you, you. You get like. It's a lot of. It's a. It's a lot of work and it's work that I'm not used to doing. So it's hopefully going to be done in draft form. Like manuscript done by end of January is my goal. And then I'm deciding if I want to use a publisher or frankly, self publish. So we'll see.
- [51:06]
A
Exciting. We'll be on the lookout for that. Yeah.
- [51:09]
B
Thanks.
- [51:09]
A
Congrats to you. Thank you. Where can we find you and follow you?
- [51:13]
B
Well, one, you can find me on the volleyball court for sure. But too my Instagram is Annmalam. It's really the only. I think the social channels are just out of control. Like the number of unread LinkedIn messages I have is out of. I just to get off of it because I don't use it. So like, Instagram is just what I'm consistent at.
- [51:31]
A
Yeah, okay. Love it. Well, yeah, I highly recommend everyone follow your Instagram because you got some gems every day. Thank you so much.
- [51:39]
B
Thank you.