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- [00:00]
A
It's great to like, officially chat.
- [00:03]
B
I actually, you're like my mentor. You're like my social media mentor. Like, I think you convinced me to start posting on LinkedIn and that went really well. Um, but yeah, I, I've been following your stuff for a while, so thanks for all the value that you create.
- [00:21]
A
Okay, wait, I love that because around the time this episode comes out is when my next LinkedIn cohort is going to be. So I'm curious, what results have you seen from LinkedIn demo requests?
- [00:31]
B
And having a strong opinion about a strong point of view, pissing people off only generates more leads. So.
- [00:42]
A
Yeah, I love that. Awesome. Yeah, that's. That's amazing. I think personal brand is so important for salespeople because you especially salespeople that have to do a lot of outbound, you can surpass outbound and just go to inbound you. If you build a personal brand and build thought leadership around your thing, which seems like the most obvious thing ever, but there are still people that don't know it and they can't get through their head.
- [01:06]
B
I know, I know. I don't do like, I, it's all my content. I don't even need marketing. Like, I, I'm just doing my content and that generates my leads.
- [01:15]
A
Do sales folks that you interact with hang out with in your vibe, are they building personal brands and posting on LinkedIn or are they.
- [01:25]
B
No.
- [01:26]
A
Why?
- [01:27]
B
Everybody thinks it's like this hard thing, you know, and, or they don't like being on camera. And I'm like, okay, well, do you like cold calling more? Because that's not fun either.
- [01:41]
A
And do you like money or no, you don't like money?
- [01:43]
B
Yeah.
- [01:43]
A
Do you like money?
- [01:44]
B
Do you like to just wake up in your calendar, be full like.
- [01:48]
A
It's funny because I, I, my past life is working in sales consulting and I would help people build like sales teams, build personal brands. And this was in like 2018 and we were like, oh my gosh, this is like so new. But we feel like everyone should know this. And I'm like, oh, yeah, definitely in two, three, four years, everyone will have a personal brand. Every sales professional. It is a no brainer. It's gonna happen by like 2020. Oh, no, no, no, no. It still hasn't happened.
- [02:13]
B
I don't know. We can convince people though. That can be our thing.
- [02:17]
A
We can. I'm like, I'm just trying to help you. But McKenna, you studied elementary education and you had a whole career pivot and now you're in sales, which is Crazy. And I get a lot of people coming onto my podcast comments in my social media comments and they're like, I'm in health care or I'm a teacher. I can't seem to break into the corporate world. And you have shown that sales is such a good path for this. So do you think sales could be a good career path and like, what was your journey of going from elementary education to tech sales?
- [02:53]
B
Yeah, 100%. It's one of the best career paths for teachers and I'll tell you why. First of all, I've helped. There was a series as a period of time where I did a lot of career coaching on TikTok for about a year and I met with over 120 some people, 90% of those were educators and helped them transition into customer success or sales within tech specific specifically. So I've seen it happen time and time again, that transition and the. And I've also worked with a lot of teachers alongside them who have also made the same transition as me. So people are doing it. And I think the biggest stigma about sales, especially for teachers, that they, they've only been exposed to certain types of sales like door to door salespeople or they have this like Persona of what, you know, what salesperson is. And, and really what a salesperson is, is a consultative person that likes to understand where you are today, where you want to be and help you get there. And your goal is to educate your prospect or your customer on how they can accomplish their goals with your software, with your service, with your product. Right. And teachers are so, so good at that because they're great communicators and they know how to break ideas down into really understandable language for customers. And they also know how to build good rapport with customers. So it's such an easy transition. The biggest thing is getting in with a company that offers a valuable product or service where you know you're not responsible for just like grinding like crazy. Right. And so that's the biggest thing is finding the right company to work with and not just trying to get in with some element MLM sales job or whatever. Like you really want to get in with like a corporate sales sort of scenario for your first type of sales job. So it is possible people are doing it every single day. I've helped people do it myself and with ChatGPT now it can rewrite your resume for free. So there's no excuses.
- [04:53]
A
Yeah, something I, whenever I was like in high school, I was interested in sales, but I thought it was this like Scammy, spammy thing. The only people I had seen as an example was like, people that sold cars. So I would also encourage people that are watching this thinking, oh, maybe I want to get into sales. The vision that I used to have in my head is that you have to like, call everyone. You have to go to your friends, you have to whatever. For people that convince people that don't want the product. No. There's something in sales called qualifying. And in that you see if this person is actually a good fit and if they're not, you don't waste your time. And I know that's such an obvious thing for people in sales, but for people curious about it, like, that is so important here. So no, you don't have to be like, scammy spammy. These are people that have said, yeah, I want your thing, or they're in the target audience that wants your thing.
- [05:37]
B
Exactly. And with modern marketing, right, People are, companies are running ads, they are doing podcasts, they're doing branding. Like there are inbound leads coming into your company. Your job is just to meet with those people, be consultative and figure out if it's a good fit. Right. And so it's not. Sales does not have to be this old school, cool, grindy, pounding the phones type of thing. If you're working for a company like that, go find a company that is doing modern marketing with ads and all of that and your, your stress level will change and you'll be able to focus on creating value rather than hitting your head against the wall picking up the phone.
- [06:14]
A
Yeah, I, I also find sales is just such an amazing tool to have in your life because you're always negotiating. Whether you're negotiating boundaries with a partner or a friend or whether you go to a thrift store, like you're always negotiating. Everything in life is negotiation. And it's important that you have those skills so that you can use them in lots of areas of your life. But I want to get to some of our cheat codes. And these are some cheat codes that you've put out, McKenna, that I have. Honestly, my mind has been blown by. And the first one is, so I like to say, heart centered, manipulative. When you are being a little manipulative, but not for evil, for good. Right. And this one is kind of heart centered manipulative. So what is the sizzle, sizzle, dopamine drizzle, drizzle. Wait, wait, let me say that again. Sizzle, sizzle, dopamine drizzle.
- [07:02]
B
Yes, yes. So the sizzle, sizzle, dopamine drizzle is. Well, first of all, I made that name up literally while I was making that video. But what that essentially is is so it's all psychology based and it's based on the chemicals that are happening in your brain. This is something I learned a couple years ago that's forever transformed my sales and also my personal life when I'm meeting new people. So when you are meeting somebody new, one of the first things that people assume is like, oh, my job is to impress them and tell them all about myself. And that's what makes people like me, is because they'll see how cool I am when an actual edit is exact opposite. So when you meet somebody the first time, your goal is to ask them questions about themselves, show interest in what they're saying. Maybe you ask them about their job. Oh, hey, what do you like about that? How did you get into that? And just really peeling back the layers. And when people have the opportunity to respond to you and share more about themselves and you're responding with interest in what they're saying, you're paying attention, you're nodding and you're asking follow up questions. Dopamine is releasing in their brain because they got to tell you about something they're passionate about. Okay. And now even if you say nothing about yourself, you're like, wow, that's amazing. You go and end up talking to somebody else, they will like you more. They won't understand why they like you more. They'll just be like, I like that person. I do. And it's because they have now associated you with the dopamine. Release that positive feel good feeling in their brain.
- [08:32]
A
I love that. So you want somebody to like you. You ask them about themselves.
- [08:36]
B
There's.
- [08:36]
A
They say, I like skateboarding. And you're like, oh, my gosh, that's so cool. Like, what do you like about it? And they're like, oh, I just like moving through the wind. I like learning cool tricks. And you're like, cool tricks? What cool tricks are you working on? Oh, I'm working on this kick flip. And it's so cool because this person I love does it. And you don't say shit about yourself.
- [08:53]
B
Yeah.
- [08:53]
A
You leave the conversation and they're like, wow, I really like her. Like, we're unconscious to it. Yeah. I talk a lot on my podcast about just starting to explore your subconscious mind and how the subconscious mind works. That's a great example of something that is not conscious and people wouldn't immediately catch up on it, but it's happening behind the scenes for a good cause. I love that. And I also would recommend asking about people's goals and dreams, especially when you're on. I always do this when I'm on sales calls. When I'm selling my products is just really tapping into like okay, McKenna, well, what are you really excited about for 2025? What are you working on? Or like what is your dream? What is your dream when it comes to your business or your TikTok? Oh, your dream is to have a million followers. Tell me more about that. You're also getting them into this emotion thinking big, thinking about the things that they love and yeah, it makes, it makes them like you.
- [09:46]
B
Yes, it does. Does.
- [09:48]
A
Okay, we have cheat code number two. Oh, this is a good one. This is, this is a probably a controversial one too. And that is if you are a woman in sales, sell like a woman and not like a man.
- [10:00]
B
Yeah. So most sales trainers that exist out there, most programs for sales were created by men for, for men because largely majority of people in sales are men. It's a higher pressure. Can be a higher pressure type of job. You have to be a little bit more assertive depending on what industry you're in. Right. There might be higher sales reps in like medical sales for example. Anyways, I've worked for female sales leaders and I've also worked for male sales leaders. And my first job, I actually was trained by a female and she took me on all of her meetings with her. We did all in person type of sales and she was so. It was so subtle. People didn't even realize what was happening. That like that's the level of judo that she was doing. And then when you're taught by men, you're taught to be like super assertive and taking control and setting all these like up we're going to do this and the structure and you know, this boldness. And I think there is something to be said for controlling the call. But you know you're good when you're controlling the call and they don't even know you're controlling the call. And that subtle piece and also understanding like aggression is seen differently in men versus as women. Like men is admired and respected women, it can kind of come off as bitchy or we're not you say socialized to be that way. Right. And so there's a balance in that. If you are going to be super aggressive, you have to do it with some swagger and with some sass so that it's funny. Right. Because it's, it's not going to be perceived the same way. So I'm always thinking about that when I'm. I work on a team of all male, male sales reps today, which is very different from the last company which was primary female. So we all have different styles that work best for us. The other thing to think about is when you're a woman, people, especially when you're a young woman, people don't always assume that you know what you're talking about. And so you really have to be in the discovery phase. You know, extra like really good on top of your questions. Asking really intelligent, really pointed like questions that show that you know your stuff because they're not going to give you that trust right away or assume that you are successful, competent. You don't get that by default. So it's something that you do have to work for over the course of time. But you can also use that to your advantage because they might not view you as a threat. They're going to tell you way more than they should. You would not believe what people tell me. I mean, they're showing you their dashboards, all of their metrics, sharing their screens, their credit card numbers. I mean, it's insane because I come off as super non intimidating and non threatening. You want to use that to your advantage as well instead of trying to be just like the boys because we're not, we're different.
- [12:46]
A
Mm. This has been a huge learning for me this year when it comes to productivity. I have read every productivity book written by men and I read the book Period Power this year which is like how to sync your workouts and your work with your cycle. And that was such so mind blowing. You should read it.
- [13:04]
B
I want to read it.
- [13:05]
A
Oh my God. Yeah, you should. I'll send you the link because I'm like, oh my God, of course this hasn't been working for me. I'm not a man. Like that's why, that's why these books written by men don't always work for me. And I think there's two ways you can go about this. You can be like, oh, I'm a woman and that's so much harder and I have all these disadvantages and be in like very victim mentality about it. Or you can say this isn't good or bad, it's just different and I can use my different differences to my advantage.
- [13:33]
B
I liked your post that you did about. You were talking about how a lot like the books, a lot of books are dedicated. Productivity books are dedicated to their wives and their families and the people that are handling everything at home so they can go focus on business. And I saw that. I was like, oh, my gosh, that's so true. Because I tell my co workers all the time, I was like, I wish I had a wife. Because then she would just be like, managing my home for me and she would be doing all. And then I was like, well, my alternative is to hire a personal assistant, housekeeper, and blah, blah, blah. Like, three people in one. I know that's stereotypical for traditional male, female roles, and not everybody has that experience, but my life, I could produce so much more if I had somebody running my household.
- [14:19]
A
Same. It takes so many hours. Oh, my gosh. Even just like, yeah, it's. It's crazy. The labor I encourage. That's why I encourage people to start delegating as early as humanly possible for you. Like, if there is. If you have a kid and the Neighbor is like 16 and she will babysit for $10 an hour, and you can dedicate $20 a month just for two hours. If you can go on upwork and find someone to manage your inbox for $10 an hour, five, five hours a month, just dedicate $50 to it. Like, a lot of times people think that money is a barrier to that, but there is so many ways, if you start small, to start to learn to delegate. And man, that is important. Yeah, McKenna, we got to get you, like, a staff.
- [14:57]
B
I'm working on it. That's like my 20, 25 vision board. I finally hired, like, a graphic designer and somebody to do, and I'm like, oh, my gosh, why didn't I do this sooner? Philippines is saving lives. Truly.
- [15:11]
A
I'm so happy. I'm so happy for you. That's gonna. It's. That's gonna be a huge level up. Like, you have such a ceiling when you're only. When it's on only yourself.
- [15:19]
B
Yes. And, like, all your weaknesses, like, hire somebody to do your weaknesses. Cause for the longest time, I just wasn't creating digital downloads or presentations because I'm not good at art or graphics. And it always looks like complete crap. So I'm like, always hindered by that. And now I'm like, okay, we have gamma AI and we have VAs. And I'm like, I'm not going to let that be an excuse anymore.
- [15:42]
A
Yes, please, everyone here, if you don't have anyone helping you, you must. You have to. Again, it's not as inaccessible as you may think. Again, if you're talking about Philippines, you're probably talking about even less than $10 an hour. So go forth and please delegate. Before we get into our third cheat code, something that you noted as a difference between men and women in, in closing is that when you're closing, you actually like to make men feel like it's like their idea to buy. How do you set that up?
- [16:12]
B
I. So they. I get them to talk about their ideas of, like, how they're going to use the product and where they see it working. So then they're selling me on how they're going to use it. And then I tell them it's a great idea. I'm like, oh, yeah, that's a great idea. Like, oh, that's so good. Oh, my gosh. You're. That's gonna. You. You're just brilliant. Like, you're killing it. That's gonna be amazing for you guys. Um, and then I'm basically just there to. Let me help. I mean, help use your idea. Like, let me. Let me just give you this contract. Here's link to the contract, so you can go execute your goals and your vision. I'm just, I'm just here to sling contracts. And so that's kind of like how I, how I position it and just make them feel good about themselves. Because a lot of times if you're dealing with high ego executives, especially high ego males, they need to feel like it's their idea. They hate being told what to do by a woman. And this applies in business and in relationships. So, like, you have to, like, make them. You have to think twice as hard to figure out how to get them to think it's their idea and then just affirm it. And it's exhausting. And I don't know why we have to do this. And it's fine if you're. If you have a man with that's humble or that's self aware, you don't have to do this. But with high EO executives, you absolutely do. And it just is what it is. Yeah.
- [17:35]
A
This is why you can't be like, take out the trash. Take out the trash. You have to be like, babe, it's so sexy when you take out the trash.
- [17:40]
B
Exactly. Exactly.
- [17:43]
A
Yep. Play the game. You know, I love this. Cheat code. Cheat code number three. Good salespeople are like therapists. Oh, my gosh, that's so good. What does that mean?
- [17:52]
B
Yeah. So a big part of selling is understanding people's business pain. Like, why are we even talking today? What's going on in your business that is making us have this conversation? And you Know Sandler sales method is very much based on identifying the pain point to basically drive the rest of the sale. And so in your discovery phase, which if you're not in sales, discovery is basically this period of your sales call or you're just asking questions. Help me understand how you're doing this today. How is that working for you? How many people do you have devoted to that? How much time is it taking you really getting them to open up about their, the problems in their business? In the same way that if you were sitting in a therapist's office and you had a problem with your mother in law, your family or whatever, they're going to ask you and you're just going to spill the tea. And I say, I'm like, I'm just here, you spill the tea about that, about your business and I'm just going to hear, to kind of navigate that conversation to help open, open you up and listen and so people will share that. And so once I've gathered their pain, how much that pain is costing them or whatever and then understand where they want to go and what their goals and how they define success, then I, then I move to that. But a lot of old school salespeople or people have never been trained in sales at all. Especially like the 80s pre ed. Like they thought that sales was about pitching and so they would just pitch slap people. They wouldn't ask the customer anything about themselves. They'd be like here's our slide deck, here's how awesome we are. Just pitching in people's faces without knowing anything about them. And then the pitch would be wrong or it wouldn't be custom to that, to that prospect at all. And then they just wasted an hour for what? You know, just because they didn't take 10, 15 minutes to really understand why the customer is even open to have a conversation in the first place.
- [19:50]
A
Yeah, this is a very powerful tool and I think you can use this for good or evil. I wish I would have known this earlier in my career going back to you saying McKenna like you gotta really have a good product, a company that you like doing ethical stuff so you don't get, so you can feel confident about that. You can feel confident positioning the solution because it's not about selling, it's about solving their problem. And that person may have 10 block onto why they don't think that their problem can be solved. And it's your job to unearth and help them, help them solve the problem because they are coming to you for this problem to be solved. And yeah, I think that's super important to position yourself as like a therapist, a consultant rather than a salesperson. Even in your own mind. It frames it for a better conversation.
- [20:36]
B
Absolutely.
- [20:37]
A
Do people ever get emotional with you?
- [20:39]
B
No, not yet. Sometimes I get people like in follow up calls, like off the record, like I'll call them and they'll like vent to me about their boss. Oh my gosh. My boss is just so outdated and he doesn't understand modern business processes and automation. And they'll just like vent to me about their leadership. And then I'm like, oh my gosh, like how, like what can we do? Like what can we, like how can we like position. Like I'm like strategizing with them about how to sell it up the chain. Anger is mostly what I get. Not sadness or anything like that. But I don't know if I was doing more in person sales and not over zoom, maybe like two drinks in. I mean, who knows?
- [21:19]
A
It probably happens more with like selling to individuals rather than companies. But I find that I get. You just go a couple of questions a couple of layers deep and people start to get really emotional, which is good.
- [21:31]
B
You get people that are emotional on.
- [21:33]
A
Your calls every single time.
- [21:35]
B
Really?
- [21:36]
A
Wow.
- [21:38]
B
Wait, what am I doing wrong? I want to make people.
- [21:40]
A
Okay, this is, this is what I do. I'll give you my strategy. So I start with like goals and dreams. What is your dream? What is your dream? Because I'm, I'm selling personal brand services, I'm selling courses, I'm selling coaching of personal brands. So I'm like, what's your dream? And McKenna, you're like, well, my dream is to one day I want to move to Chicago and have like a really cool condo and maybe I'll have a beach house in la. And my dream is to retire my spouse and blah, blah. And you're telling me your dream. And I'm like, okay, great. Like what is holding you back from stepping into that dream tomorrow? And you say, well, I don't have enough money to do it and. Cause I can't buy a condo right now. And let's see, if I wanted to be a speaker, I'd probably having have to have a strong personal brand and I'm kind of afraid to be seen. I'm like, great. Okay, so now we've isolated three objections we have. Not having enough money, not having a consistent personal brand, and fear of being seen. And then I can tailor my coaching to overcoming those three things. But once you start getting into like emotional side, like, oh, I Have this money block because, like, I grew up really poor, blah, blah. Let me tell you the story. Oh, I have fear of being seen because my parent was abusive, blah, blah, blah. I don't have a strong personal brand because I'm just so disorganized that I don't know how to post every day. And then it's like a whole other layer you just unlocked and tying that back to the dream. But I don't think that would work for companies, but it works well for individuals.
- [22:57]
B
Yeah, yeah, no, I can see that. I mean, if I have a CEO or a business owner, I probably could get to that level. I think maybe, just maybe digging deeper into the actual emotional impact and not the time, money, or headcount. I'm always going for data instead of feelings.
- [23:15]
A
Yeah, it's. It's powerful. But I feel like a lot of people use that method in like, coaching. But I also think it's more efficient because a lot of times people will give me bullshit objections. They're like, oh, I just.
- [23:27]
B
Whatever.
- [23:27]
A
Like, I don't know, they'll give me bullshit stuff. But that, that's truth. Like if you're attaching to your dream and your desires, that's. That's going to be the deepest objection. That's going to be the truest objection. And a lot of times it's like mass with like a bullshit objection of like, I have to ask my partner or something, you know?
- [23:41]
B
Yeah, yeah, go deep.
- [23:44]
A
We could do a whole cheat code on objection handling. Okay, so cheat code number four. You talk about our voices as women, make sure we're not having like the up speak or the question tone. And instead, like having a strong voice. Like, what are some things that people do? Or what does that even sound like to have a strong voice?
- [24:01]
B
I can give you an example. It's so socialized with women because we are afraid to be direct in some. I'm not. You're not either. But there's. There are women that are socialized to be softer and more delicate, especially if they grew up in like, households where there was a parental dynamic that had them kind of tiptoe around or on eggshells. Right. So, but women will be like, hi, good to meet you. My name's McKenna. I don't know, like they'll, they'll just go up. It's called up talk at the end of each of their sentences. That sort of makes it sound like they're asking a question, not making a statement. Right. Like if I say my name is McKenna, Elizabeth, or I go hey, my name is McKenna. Elizabeth. Like, it sounds like, I'm not sure. Right. And people are less likely to trust my expertise if I say it like that. Right. And so it's so unconscious. People don't even realize they're speaking that way. And they don't realize how. How people perceive them and their competency differently. And so I actually learned this on. It was like a podcast that Mel Robbins was having. She was interviewing somebody who specifically talks, studies the data around communication styles and actually does case studies on it. So uptalk is a big one that women especially have to eliminate or work on fixing. The best way to do that is honestly do. Do what you and I do is create videos and listen to yourself back, or create a voice note and listen to yourself back. Watch your zoom calls back and see how do you end sentences? Do you go down like this or do you go up sentences? Right. Really, really work on optimizing it because it will take your credibility to the next level just by that tweak.
- [25:46]
A
Oh, my gosh, watch. Rewatching zoom calls is brutal. But you're so right. And yeah, social media creating content is like this infinite mirror where you're always re watching your work. You're doing it better next time. Even if you're not consciously improving, you're going to at least unconsciously improve because you're going to say, you're gonna think like, oh, I didn't really like that lighting. Like, something is off about this, and the next time you're gonna have better lighting and you can contrast them and you're like, I sounded weird. Maybe you were talking too slow or too fast. But I have a similar cheat code to this upspeak cheat code, and that is to not have qualifiers at the end of your sentence. For example, McKenna asked me what I want for dinner.
- [26:21]
B
What do you want for dinner?
- [26:24]
A
I think maybe like faux, but I don't know. Like that. I don't know. I think we should do this. But like, I don't know. But like that. Somebody told me one time, Courtney, that is equivalent to saying, I'm a little pussy. Oh, I think I might want Thai food, but I'm a little. It's basically negating your entire statement and saying, but I don't believe in the statement I just said. So every time I hear people say that, especially men, I'm like, they're saying, I'm a little pussy.
- [26:49]
B
Yeah. Or just that, like, hey, I'm a people pleaser and I'm too afraid to state my opinion because I'm Afraid of what you're going to say or how you're going to perceive, receive it. And so I'm willing to forego my preference if you don't agree with it because I value you, your opinion more than my own.
- [27:08]
A
Yeah. So stop saying that.
- [27:10]
B
Yeah, tell them what you want.
- [27:13]
A
Yes. Yes. Say what you want. Cheat code number five. I love career cheat codes and I feel like this is just a really strong career cheat code, and that is to have a homie in all, every department. What, what does that mean?
- [27:25]
B
Your department homies, you got, you got to have people that you have relationship with, especially working larger companies, because there's a lot of layers of red tape and bureaucracy that are going to keep you from doing your job efficiently. So there is a time and place for processes, but sometimes you need something and you need it now or you need to know, you need to know something very specific and you can't wait for like a day or two for a response from, from a team. Right. From an inbound. So having people that you meet and you do coffee chats with, you get to know them. You're like, hey, I'm just trying to understand a little bit more about what you do in your department so I can better work with you. I did this at my last company. I did it with every single department. So I had a department home in every single department. I also asked them how much money they made and like all that. So I like, knew what everybody was making in every department.
- [28:18]
A
How did you, how did you tee up that question?
- [28:20]
B
Well, it's kinda not proud of it. Okay. I mean, it depends on the situation. Like if it's another woman, I'm like, like, woman, a woman. Like, you know, I'm thinking about maybe moving into a role like yours next year. I want to make sure that I, I don't get, you know, worked over by the company, like, what do you think I should ask? Or like, what are most people making in this role? And then they tell you, oh, the base salary is this commission is this. I make this. Yeah, girl like you, you advocate for yourself. They're like all over it. Especially Millennials and Gen Z are very, very open to that. I don't know. People just tell me, I only had one person push back. And it was because he was like the highest performer in the company. So he knew he made more money than everybody else. Like not just from a commission standpoint, but from base. So he didn't want to share that because he knew other people would be like, well, I, you know, if that got out, everybody would be renegotiating their salaries.
- [29:15]
A
Yeah, I love that. Yeah. Corporate red tape is so annoying. And you do have to kind of play the game, but that's a way to circumvent the game. Like if you have a webinar coming up and you have your marketing homie. Yeah, it takes like putting together a proposal and having to go through the marketing team or whatever, but you can be like, hey, can you connect with the social media manager? Because I just need the story posted today because the webinar is coming up. We need four more signups. Like, having that person without having to go through all the layers is so genius.
- [29:45]
B
Yes. Did you. So did you do that? Was that one of your things that you did at your previous company and you're working?
- [29:51]
A
I did, I positioned. I was always in social, so I would position it as like, okay, McKenna, you're on the sales team. I like, as social media. I really want to make sure I'm enabling your goals. So what is your goal for 2025? And I would love to see where social can help amplify that goal. And you're saying we need more qualified leads. Okay, great. Well, how can we adjust our social media strategy? And then immediately you're like buying into my. My goal.
- [30:15]
B
Yes. I love it.
- [30:17]
A
Sneaky. Well, McKenna, is there any other cheat codes we didn't go over? Anything you, you want to share that might be helpful for listeners?
- [30:25]
B
This is not psychological or psych. You know, I'm a big fan of like automation and integration. One of the things I've really gone through a huge probably the past two years is like looking at how to use software to make your job easier. Whether it be just a software that you can use that's like a browser or actual software your company can purchase. But like as a salesperson, right. Like I used to send out manual email follow ups to all my customers and then like send out manual case studies. And like, I didn't have automated drip campaigns to put my customers in like after a demo or before a demo to like warm them up. I've been doing that recently and it's been so, so helpful for me because now I don't have to spend my time doing something that can be automated. And so I think so many people even just like automated scheduling, using calendly, for example. Right. That shows your calendar and availability. There are still people out there that look at their calendar. Then go Thursday at 2 or Friday at 1 still for every single person they meet with, which makes me Want to cry like no, you don't have to live this way. Like there are better ways and it's for 799 or whatever. I don't know what Calendiclossi says your life could be changed and it's just like the little things like that does move the needle and save you 20 minutes a day. What does that add up to in a week, in a month, in a year? That's time that you could be spending on higher level tasks.
- [31:58]
A
I think that's also such an amazing asset that Gen Z has that maybe they're not even aware of it. I was mentoring this guy, he was an sdr, he kind of sucked at it but he was really good at automating and turns out, whatever. He didn't want to continue in sales but he got a promotion. They created a role for him just to help create automations for the sales team. And he had no, he didn't go to college, he didn't have any experience beforehand. He just liked to play around with ChatGPT and all these tools and whatever. And like that was something he was like, that's so obvious. I can't get a job doing that. Whatever.
- [32:30]
B
No, no, no.
- [32:31]
A
If you're a Gen Z and you're like these things are obvious. It's not obvious.
- [32:34]
B
No. That's so crazy that you say that because literally that's exactly how our sales ops guy ended up in sales operations was because he wasn't that good at sales but he was really good at automating stuff. So they're like, hey, why don't you go do sales operations and automate everything? So he did and he loves it. And you can learn anything on YouTube or you know, online these days and you don't have to have a college degree anymore because now we have the Internet and it's an amazing thing.
- [32:57]
A
Yeah, that's so, so true. I love, love that automation is so important similarly to delegation. Like you need to learn to automate. It's a non negotiable start as early. You're probably already doing it. But start as early as you possibly can to experiment and test out and learn in automation. Honestly, that's probably going to be even more important than delegating in the future because we'll just be able to automate.
- [33:20]
B
More and more and more things know, you know, a whole podcast on just AI.
- [33:25]
A
Seriously? Well McKenna, what's, what's your goal? Goals goal dream for 2025 dreams.
- [33:34]
B
Oh my gosh, wait, I should show you my whiteboard. So I drew out my whole like, revenue plan for like FTE socials and then all of the things that I needed to like, outsource to people in Fiverr, people in. In the Philippines needed to automate in order to get to my. My goals essentially for 2025. So I think it's important to like, map out everything of like, what's feeding what, what do you need to delegate, what do you need to automate? And I swear, like, I write it down and I draw a line and I have no idea the name of the person that I'm going to write in that. And then it just. They dismiss disappear. Like all of a sudden there's in my DMs or like I run into them somewhere or somebody introduces them to me. So I just like, I needed a video editor and then I drew a line and then this girl named Princess messaged me on LinkedIn like, oh. And then I needed a graphic designer. I drew a line where their name should be. Boom. Chris came. I don't know. It's just write down who you need and the universe brings them to you.
- [34:38]
A
That's so true. When I was trying to hire an ops on ops lead, I like wrote down almost like it was like my dream partner. Like, I know some people do that with like a vision board for your. No, literally, I'm like my dream ops lead. And I'm like, must be someone that like vibes with me in this way. Like, must be someone that lives in Austin. Must be someone that has this type of background. And next. The next morning, she was in my Instagram DM or not my Instagram, my LinkedIn DMs. Literally the next morning, we got coffee an hour later and I hired her on this box. It was like less than 10 hours between making the list and posting about it. So yeah, go manifest your team. Yeah, you're also, also, you're. You're single, right? Have you done this with a. The partner?
- [35:20]
B
I am single. I have not written down the list of like dream traits. I know most people do do that. I think I have like in my head, I know I said for the longest time I'm going to marry a CFO or somebody in that like, like that mindset brain sort of thing. Because that's like the balance to me, which is like very sales marketing focused and it'd be way cheaper than hiring one when I go full time is. So it's also like a money save. But. But now. So I swear the only thing with that is like CF finding somebody the CPA Accounting, cfo, sort of background with a good personality. That's where, you know, that's. That's the hardest mashup. But I did. Did meet one recently, so we'll see where that takes us, you know?
- [36:10]
A
Oh. Oh, my God. Can't wait.
- [36:13]
B
Yeah, it's early days, so, like, by the time this podcast launched, I don't even know where we'll be. So.
- [36:20]
A
Love coming in 2025, question mark, maybe.
- [36:23]
B
Well, I do on my, like, step by step board. I do have social. My only bullet point under social is date. Like, it's your job. I learned that on the Diary of CEO podcast.
- [36:37]
A
Oh. Honestly, dating has given me some really good connections, too, and some really great mentorship and really great, like, yeah, highly recommend being really strategic about dating. Like, be like, oh, well, maybe I. This wouldn't normally be my type, but he owns this really big company, so I'm just gonna go on a date, see what happened. Like, I'm not kidding.
- [36:54]
B
Play the game.
- [36:55]
A
Like, being single is, like, the best time for business networking. I'm not kidding. I. Yeah, especially, you know, especially you're a young girl.
- [37:04]
B
Like, great tip for the girlies. Use it to level up.
- [37:08]
A
Literally use it to level up.
- [37:10]
B
Like.
- [37:10]
A
Like, men want to help you. Like, true. Oh, my God. One of my favorite authors of all time, I post about his book all the time, and he invited me to his conference, and then he was like, oh, do you want to get coffee? And I real. I'm like, why is this person, like, like, wanting to mentor me? And I'm like, it's because men don't, like, they want to help, like, have an instinct to help pull women up. Like, it's so true. So even if you meet someone and you're not even vibing in, like, that way, you can be, like, still have a relationship, and men love to help, like, cute, cute young women.
- [37:36]
B
It's about they do, you know. Okay, I'd be interested in your take on this because you literally saying exactly what I'm always saying. Like, women don't hardly ever reach out to help me, ever. I've never had a woman call me, message me on TikTok and saying, Hey, I want to mentor you, or, hey, I want to introduce you to this person, or blah, blah, blah. Men do it all the time on LinkedIn, on Instagram, ever. All the time. And I'm just like, why? I. I really make an effort to, like, try to support other women on socials and on their content. If I think they have a lot of potential, I'LL reach out to them and say, hey, like, keep going. Like, you're doing so great. But no one ever did that for me. Like, it was so men. I owe men for a lot of the success I have in my career, and I feel that makes me feel sad to say that, because as women, why do we view each other as competition? We should be viewing each other as, like, hey, how can I pull other people up? Because that's what men do. That's. Yeah.
- [38:30]
A
I think it's probably because men see things as, like, there's. Men see more of, like, oh, there's room for everyone at the top. And I think women are conditioned to not see that. So that could be where that comes from. So maybe there's some unconditioning that needs to happen.
- [38:45]
B
Yeah. Yeah, I agree. I like that.
- [38:49]
A
Well, solving all the. All the problems. Well, yeah, I feel like we could have, like, five more conversations about this. You need to come to Austin. Like, I know I do.
- [38:57]
B
I want to go to that whatever Airbnb that you posted. What was that? Yeah, we're in Utah. No, no, no, I do.
- [39:04]
A
I do have two Airbnbs here, and they're really crazy. I have a tram.
- [39:07]
B
That's right. Was the one. What was the one that you vacationed to recently that you said you rented out the whole thing for, like, 500. It wasn't yours. It was like, oh, that was mine.
- [39:17]
A
Yeah. No, no.
- [39:17]
B
Oh, was yours. Oh, okay.
- [39:19]
A
Yeah, that. That was, like, close by. I did a little writing retreat. But no, literally, you need to come to Austin. Such a good vibe. I'll. I'm literally sending you, like, you're getting your flight after this.
- [39:27]
B
Like, draw a line drop. Write me down and draw a line. We should do an in person podcast because I feel like the in person ones do, like, really well on socials, too. Like, the graphics and, like, the, you know, the whole. The video looks so much better, too.
- [39:43]
A
Okay. I actually have this idea where I think I should get a group of women content creators together. We will go rent an Airbnb, whatever, hang out. But we'll also have my friend there who's a videographer, and we all pay her, like, a thousand dollars or something to get us, like, 50 clips that she's, like, doing throughout the weekend.
- [40:00]
B
I love that. That's brilliant. No one's doing that.
- [40:04]
A
I know, I know. Okay, so. So we must do this. Okay, that's happening.
- [40:09]
B
Okay. We need a Google sheet. Who do we want? Okay, well, we can talk. We can discuss that later, but. Okay.
- [40:16]
A
McKenna where can people find you? How can people work with you? Maybe book a demo with you too? Okay, so here's if they're qualified here.
- [40:23]
B
If they're qualified, here's the deets. My handles on YouTube, TikTok and well, yeah, are @ McKenna Elizabeth, M C K E N A H. Because my nana picked that spelling that. So it's, that's the wonky thing. McKenna Elizabeth. On LinkedIn, I'm McKenna Elizabeth. And yeah, if you want to book a demo, it's literally linked in all my bios of sales AI, which is an AI calling platform where you can have full bidirectional conversations with your prospects, qualify them and book them for meetings, both outbound and inbound calls. So super fun slinging AI software, going to 2025. So if you're looking to replace your SDR team or just want some meetings booked, let me know.
- [41:12]
A
Okay, your meeting's booked. Love that. Well, thank you, McKenna.