Jimmy Whisman (2:55)

I just want to be there.

James Petregallo (2:56)

Phoenix is sold out. Except for your stupid opinions. There's still some tickets left for that. Salt Lake City sold out. Denver has some tickets. Buffalo sold out. Royal Oak, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, Dallas, San Jose, Sacramento, Tarrytown and Boston. Get your tickets right now. Shut up and give me murder.com and then get your tickets for our funeral afterwards because that will kill us both. Yeah, so that's a lot of fun.

Jimmy Whisman (3:18)

Be there relationship in our lives.

James Petregallo (3:21)

Oh yeah. It'll a little ruin everything. Then definitely get yourself some Patreon. That's what you need. Patreon.com CrimeInSports is where you get all of the bonus material. Anybody $5 a month or above, you are going to get everything. We put out hundreds of back bonus episodes immediately upon subscription. New ones every other week, including this week, which we're going to have for crime and sports, which of course you'll get. We're going to do crazy old newspaper stuff, old weird ads, things, strange stuff from times past for small town murder. Those are always so much fun. Small town murder is going to be Dean Coral Part 2. We have 27 bodies out of the ground, a dead murderer, a child who has been involved in it and a connection to John Wayne Gacy. It's getting wild everybody. So you definitely want to be there for that. Patreon.com crimeinsports and you get everything we put out, anything, your stupid opinions, crime and sports, small town murder all ad free with your Patreon ad free ad free. And on top of that, you get a shout out at the end of the regular show. That said, think it's time everybody. I think it's time everybody to sit back. What do you say? Here, you got loosened up a little bit here. Let's do this. A little loose. Let's clear the lungs. Arms to the sky. Let's all shout out. Shut up and give me murder. Let's do this. Everybody. Let's go on a trip, shall we? We gotta do it. You gotta. And more importantly, we need to. We gotta.

Jimmy Whisman (4:57)

More importantly, we fucking will.

James Petregallo (4:59)

We will. Damn it. Yeah, here we go. We're going to Oregon this week. Oh, we love it country up there. We're going Grants Pass, Oregon.

Jimmy Whisman (5:06)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (5:07)

I don't Know if you know where that is? Down in southwestern Oregon. It is about 3 hours and 50 minutes to Portland, so nowhere near there. About 40 minutes to Medford, Oregon. That's the closest spot you're gonna get there. And about four hours to our last Oregon episode, Oak Grove, Oregon, which was the episode 631, the Forest Serial Killer. Oh, pretty self explanatory. Oh, was that a lot of weird killing in the woods? That was after that. Episode 631.

Jimmy Whisman (5:36)

Okay.

James Petregallo (5:36)

That was after the pig. The pig lady was the one before that. So that's the last Oregon before that. This is in Josephine county. Area code 541 and 458. Sure. And population here, that's not too small. 38,902.

Jimmy Whisman (5:55)

Good size.

James Petregallo (5:56)

But still very rural, though. That's the thing. So it's interesting here. Median household income here, $49,355. That's pretty low.

Jimmy Whisman (6:07)

It's not great.

James Petregallo (6:07)

But 20,000 under the national average.

Jimmy Whisman (6:09)

That's if you're rural Oregon, though, it's probably fairly affordable. Yeah.

James Petregallo (6:13)

Well, let's find out. Median home cost here, $376,000. So no. Oh, no, not good. Not great at all.

Jimmy Whisman (6:20)

That's not easy.

James Petregallo (6:21)

Nope. We have mottos and nicknames here. The town motto is, quote, live Rogue. That's because the Rogue river is nearby. Oh, yeah. So they're very much into that. And they have another one. I don't know what this means. Quote, it's the climate.

Jimmy Whisman (6:39)

Is it?

James Petregallo (6:39)

That's why people are here? I suppose. Or that's why you're miserable or I'm not sure exactly which one that is.

Jimmy Whisman (6:46)

That's what therapists say a lot.

James Petregallo (6:47)

What's wrong with this goddamn place? It's the climate. I've been telling everybody since I moved here. God damn climate.

Jimmy Whisman (6:53)

Don't be so sad. It's just the climate.

James Petregallo (6:55)

Yeah. So the reason it's called Grant's Pass is because there was a stagecoach stop on the Sacramento to Portland route named Grant to honor Ulysses S. Grant's. Not just him, a very specific thing. His 1863 Vicksburg victory, where there was a siege of Vicksburg and they sat out there for a long time.

Jimmy Whisman (7:18)

That was Virginia, wasn't it?

James Petregallo (7:20)

Vicksburg is Mississippi, I believe.

Jimmy Whisman (7:22)

Oh, okay.

James Petregallo (7:23)

Yeah, I think so. Now they added paths to the name to distinguish it from Grant County. They actually tried to make it less confusing for us, which is nice of them. Way up there, it's pretty confusing. The area grew a lot after the railroad Was completed to Medford, and it became a bit of a shipping hub by the 1880s. There's a railroad depot, a courthouse, a jail. It's a real old west town by then. Yeah, whole thing. The town was originally part of Jackson county, and then they moved it to Josephine county. Also in 1874, the discovery by Elijah Davidson of the Oregon caves, which are 24. We talked about that. Our Cave Junction episode. Way back. 24 miles southwest of Grants Pass, they have all these caves and it's now a national monument. In 1909, they made it a national monument.

Jimmy Whisman (8:14)

All these caves, like, underground or like in. In the side of a mountain.

James Petregallo (8:18)

It could be in a tree for all I know. There's caves, man. It's pretty cool. Reviews of this town. We have five stars. Here we go. Grants Pass is the perfect town to raise kids in. Start it perfect. Start a career or retire. A, B or C. That's the stages of life, babe. That's what I was going to say. Cradle the grave. This is the joint. I would recommend it. Love the nature, hiking and all sorts of other things to do here. Yeah, all sorts of them. Three stars. This is a nice enough town. If you're looking to retire in a rural area. That's very specific. Nice enough if these two very specific things.

Jimmy Whisman (9:00)

But aren't those. Isn't that what people want? Don't people want to retire in a rural area?

James Petregallo (9:06)

No, not always. Sometimes they want to be around things that are closer to hospitals and social things and shit like that. I've heard nothing about people.

Jimmy Whisman (9:14)

Yeah, I've heard nothing.

James Petregallo (9:15)

But I want to.

Jimmy Whisman (9:17)

That's what I mean.

James Petregallo (9:18)

Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (9:18)

Every time I hear somebody retiring, they're like, I'm getting away from all of this. I don't care.

James Petregallo (9:23)

Some people need to be like, you know, senior centers and shit like that. They want to hang out. I don't know. They want to play pickleball. Canasta with the other old people.

Jimmy Whisman (9:30)

Pickleball and checkers.

James Petregallo (9:31)

I need them. That's right. Pickleball is going to kill so many old people, by the way. They're going to be dropping like flies.

Jimmy Whisman (9:36)

Probably has. We should check the mortality rate of pickleball.

James Petregallo (9:41)

Geriatric orthopedic surgeons are like, play pickleball. Yeah. Your hips and pelvises are fine.

Jimmy Whisman (9:48)

Heavy, slow ball.

James Petregallo (9:49)

So are all your knees. They're all great. Okay. The people here typically enjoy football, hunting, mudding, going to the dunes and fishing. If that doesn't sound like you, it can feel too small. There isn't much Else to do.

Jimmy Whisman (10:07)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (10:07)

Outside shit.

Jimmy Whisman (10:09)

Yeah. Sounds great.

James Petregallo (10:11)

I mean, yeah, if that's what you're into, that's fun.

Jimmy Whisman (10:13)

But if you got no money, you can't do any of that.

James Petregallo (10:15)

Any of that. Those are all expensive activities, very expensive hobbies. Here's four stars. Don't get sick.

Jimmy Whisman (10:24)

Okay.

James Petregallo (10:24)

Health care is crap. They're not saying specifically health care here. That's a statement for a lot of states in general. Yeah. Had to go out of state for specialists. Everything, all caps. Takes time. You will die before doctors figure out what the problem is. She wrote this from her deathbed.

Jimmy Whisman (10:43)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (10:44)

Dying with her children around her. She was like, okay, things to do.

Jimmy Whisman (10:49)

I'm not getting any help.

James Petregallo (10:50)

Nope. Things to do here. The Boatnik festival.

Jimmy Whisman (10:54)

Boatnik.

James Petregallo (10:54)

Boatnik. N I K. Like if you're a beatnik instead of a beatnik, it's a boatnik.

Jimmy Whisman (10:59)

Oh, got it.

James Petregallo (10:59)

So this is interesting here. So if you don't want to mud or fish or play football, you do this. Lots of stuff going on here in this thing. There's a midway with rides and all sorts of shit. First night On a Friday, May 23, Queens Reich will be there. So. Hell yeah. That's.

Jimmy Whisman (11:16)

Hell, yeah. I haven't seen them.

James Petregallo (11:19)

Nor 1989. Maybe mid silentity video.

Jimmy Whisman (11:24)

Even mid 90s. Was like being nostalgic about the 80s, man.

James Petregallo (11:28)

Yeah. With guest emissary.

Jimmy Whisman (11:31)

I don't know.

James Petregallo (11:32)

That one beats the shit out of me. Then there's a boat show after that. Queens Reich is opening for a boat show. Isn't that nice?

Jimmy Whisman (11:39)

That was not the dream.

James Petregallo (11:40)

Nope. I don't think that's how it was going. In 88 Junior Jet Boats exhibition. We have.

Jimmy Whisman (11:45)

That's cool.

James Petregallo (11:46)

Sprint Boat exhibition. Those are. Someone's gonna die. Let's get the medical staff ready for. I don't know. Sounds dangerous, though.

Jimmy Whisman (11:54)

Crooked spoiler on it, maybe.

James Petregallo (11:55)

Yeah, it goes a little bit faster. I'm looking for more. Oh, here we go. There. And closing out the entire thing. On Sunday will be a Trey Lewis concert.

Jimmy Whisman (12:05)

Oh, boy.

James Petregallo (12:06)

Do you know who that is?

Jimmy Whisman (12:08)

No.

James Petregallo (12:08)

No. That sounds country. If Jimmy doesn't know who it is, that's bad. That's bad.

Jimmy Whisman (12:13)

Trey Lewis. It's probably very, I don't know, divisive.

James Petregallo (12:19)

At least they're not opening for a boat show. They're doing better than Queens Reich at this point.

Jimmy Whisman (12:24)

I can't imagine anybody on a boat playing Queens Reich, though.

James Petregallo (12:27)

No. It's a weird yacht rock. No, no, not at all. It's just like metal or sad or.

Jimmy Whisman (12:33)

Whatever the fuck a sprint boat is. And a junior jet boat will certainly play some queens.

James Petregallo (12:38)

Right. They'll jack that shit through the roof. All right, let's talk about a murder.

Jimmy Whisman (12:42)

Here we go.

James Petregallo (12:43)

Let's do this. Okay, we have to go back in time a little bit here to the 80s.

Jimmy Whisman (12:48)

Oh.

James Petregallo (12:48)

When queens Reich was ruling the land.

Jimmy Whisman (12:51)

The amount of bloat you had to fucking. They needed crowbars to get the women off of them.

James Petregallo (12:56)

Oh, yeah. We said, we're going to 1988. And Queens Reich said, fuck, yeah. Load us up.

Jimmy Whisman (13:00)

We miss it.

James Petregallo (13:01)

Where's this time machine so we can pay our mortgage?

Jimmy Whisman (13:03)

Shit.

James Petregallo (13:04)

Holy shit. So let's talk about a woman first. Lynn Ann. Goes by Lynn because Lynn Ann is. Sounds like you're stuttering and nobody wants to know.

Jimmy Whisman (13:14)

Just sounds like you're mispronouncing the closet.

James Petregallo (13:17)

Yeah, the Lyn. That's where they kept her. Lynn Ann Sapienza. So Lynn Sapienza, she's born 1966. She'll grow up. She's a very kind woman. She's a special needs teacher.

Jimmy Whisman (13:31)

Wonderful.

James Petregallo (13:31)

And if you've ever had a special needs kid or anything like that, you know, these people, for the most part, are literally angels.

Jimmy Whisman (13:40)

They're the patience on these people.

James Petregallo (13:42)

They. Patience. And just to want to do that and then actually be able to follow through on it is hats off to you. Because I couldn't do it. You know what I mean? I couldn't have the patience.

Jimmy Whisman (13:53)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (13:53)

And I have two. I would go home and cry every day. I think that's the other thing.

Jimmy Whisman (13:59)

Sounds like a job you get as like it. I'll just do this. But it's like you. If that's your attitude going into this, you're gonna. You're gonna hurt yourself.

James Petregallo (14:07)

No, no, no. That's maybe like bedpan changing and stuff like that. Yeah. No.

Jimmy Whisman (14:13)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (14:13)

You gotta be into that shit. So she wants to help others now. She's born into a Catholic family and that's important. You might go. Who cares? Well, it's important here because she ends up going to college at La Sierra University, which is in Riverside, California. That's where you want to go away. Spring break in Riverside, everybody. Whoo. Let's go get those long brown titties out and sit by a river. Sounds great.

Jimmy Whisman (14:41)

I don't think Riverside is riverside even near a river.

James Petregallo (14:44)

I don't think so.

Jimmy Whisman (14:45)

Not really.

James Petregallo (14:46)

It probably dried up long ago.

Jimmy Whisman (14:47)

If it was, it's halfway between the Colorado river and LA. It's not even. There's no river.

James Petregallo (14:52)

In 1835, there might have been a river when they people went by it, but since then, I don't think. I think it's probably all dried up.

Jimmy Whisman (14:59)

It's called Tropical California, like a lot.

James Petregallo (15:01)

Of the Arizona rivers. As you drive up north and you're like, must have been something there someday because there's a name for it.

Jimmy Whisman (15:07)

It's only a river when it rains.

James Petregallo (15:08)

Yeah. Now, she went to this college as a Seventh Day Adventist college. Oh. Which. That's very specific. The Seventh Day Adventist.

Jimmy Whisman (15:17)

That's interesting. Yeah.

James Petregallo (15:19)

You can blend a Lutheran and a Methodist and you can mix them together. Seventh Day Adventists are their own thing.

Jimmy Whisman (15:24)

They hang out with Seventh Day Adventists.

James Petregallo (15:27)

Yeah. Well, in a religious sense, anyway. Definitely. So at college she meets a young man named David Green Jr. Green with an extra E on the end there. He's born in 1957, so a little bit older than her. Now they get together. He is from a strict Seventh Day Adventist family.

Jimmy Whisman (15:50)

Oh.

James Petregallo (15:51)

So I don't know about bringing the Catholic girl home and how that's going to work, but I don't know what.

Jimmy Whisman (15:55)

Their entire religion is. I do know that strict means.

James Petregallo (15:59)

Oh, boy. That's what they're into. Well, his father. His father leads a prayer group and all that kind of thing, so they're super into it. His Father's Day. David Green Sr. Obviously. David Green Sr. Apparently, based on accounts at some point in time, thought that angels spoke to people. He wrote down his own religious doctrines and then would teach them to people if they would bother to listen. So that's interesting. Very weird. Now, as we'll talk about it, the prayer group is eventually going to lead off and we're not church people, so we're not going to get too deep in the weeds on all this type of thing. But apparently got away from official church doctrine enough to where religious leaders called it spiritualism. Oh. They questioned his prayer group or voice ministry, which are endorsed, not legit, by the church while you're doing shit you're not supposed to be doing. Yeah, yeah. You're not teaching it right. Like the Mormons. They excommunicate like a son of a bitch. Oh, boy.

Jimmy Whisman (17:04)

Right now. Yeah.

James Petregallo (17:05)

Remember the whole Lori Vallow thing? This really reminds me of the Lori Valo thing, by the way, that we're going to talk about today. That was a big part of it was, was. That was.

Jimmy Whisman (17:14)

You know, she was enchiladas, James.

James Petregallo (17:16)

She were green chili chicken enchiladas. Didn't. Weren't they good?

Jimmy Whisman (17:21)

Have you not had.

James Petregallo (17:23)

That's a question in an open court, your honor.

Jimmy Whisman (17:26)

This is gonna matter.

James Petregallo (17:27)

Yeah. This will matter later. They have some friends that they hang out with, of course, that are pretty close to them. One couple is Richard and Jodi Halstead. I've been friends with the Greens for years. And they literally came to Grants Pass specifically to be near the Greens for the prayer group. No, just to be near them.

Jimmy Whisman (17:48)

Okay, got it.

James Petregallo (17:49)

They're friends and the family's children grew up together and all that kind of thing. Now back to Lynn and David. They met. Meeting in college. They aren't from the same religious background, which is a big deal for at least one of them. But regardless, they fall in love and have a relationship because there are people. Yeah. And this is a long distance relationship for a while because David is older and graduates and they maintain a long distance relationship because he goes back to Grants Pass from Riverside, which is fine.

Jimmy Whisman (18:21)

She stays in Riverside.

James Petregallo (18:23)

She stays and goes to college.

Jimmy Whisman (18:25)

It's the stretch of the country.

James Petregallo (18:26)

Yeah. And this is. We're talking, you know, early 80s. You can't. There's no, like, long distance relationship is crazy. There's no text messaging, no WhatsApp, no fucking social media. No email.

Jimmy Whisman (18:40)

Right.

James Petregallo (18:40)

There is long distance phone calls that cost a shitload of money. That's what there is. Yeah. Or writing a physical letter and mailing it. Those are your options here. So it's. It's rough on April 12, 1981, they get married. By the way, she was born in 57, not 67, like I said earlier, in 81, they get married April 12th. Now Lynn converts to Seventh Day Adventism. Terrific. Right away. That's part of the deal. You have to. There's no doubt about it. And she gets involved in the prayer group that David's father's leading. And she eventually becomes a leader in the group herself and starts. People in the group start saying that she's like a conduit to God.

Jimmy Whisman (19:25)

For him or for them?

James Petregallo (19:28)

For anybody. For her, God visits her. She's a conduit. I guess you can speak through anybody. And also they claim that Jesus visited her in her home multiple times and that she could communicate with angels. That's what other people are saying. Wow. Jesus comes over for coffee.

Jimmy Whisman (19:47)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (19:47)

Maybe to watch a football game on Sunday. Well, yeah. You keep a crumb cake out for.

Jimmy Whisman (19:52)

Jesus, Maybe some pirouettes and a coffee.

James Petregallo (19:54)

You never know when Jesus is going to stop by. That's why you keep that kind of thing in your house. You just never know. He could Pop up at any time. I mean, doesn't give away a pirouette.

Jimmy Whisman (20:02)

And coffee is like the body of Christ in a Folgers. That's amazing.

James Petregallo (20:06)

That's not bad. Keep a little. He likes ice cream, too. You got to keep that in there. And also communicating with angels. Yeah, I don't know if they come over or not, but she communicates with them.

Jimmy Whisman (20:16)

Oh, boy.

James Petregallo (20:17)

1985. They have a son named Nathaniel. Yep. Okay, that's them. So there's little. Little Nate here now. The prayer group. We'll talk about it. It is called the New Light Bible Study Group. New light?

Jimmy Whisman (20:32)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (20:32)

I don't know. That old light, it's burned out. Shit's all. All messed up.

Jimmy Whisman (20:36)

Needs batteries.

James Petregallo (20:37)

All fucked out, as we say here. Now. David is really into it. He's an active participant. Apparently. They said that David. I don't know if this is senior or junior, but one of them claimed they could see angels. Apparently, according to some people here. Allegedly. I don't know, they could see him and perform spirit travel, where your soul would leave your body and travel to other places, including other planets. Oh, you could just. You become light.

Jimmy Whisman (21:10)

See the angels.

James Petregallo (21:12)

I guess the angels can take you. I don't know. I don't know if that's part of the angels. Angels seem like they would have a lot on their plate. I don't know if spirit travel is going to be. Seems like it's just too much, right?

Jimmy Whisman (21:23)

Are they helping the angels win the pennant?

James Petregallo (21:27)

You wouldn't even want to be an angel at that point. It's like, listen, I'd rather just have nothing happen and I could hang out because, I mean, they say heaven and it's pictures of people, like, hanging out on cloud couches with, like feathers and everything. And these people are. There's a lot of busy shit here. I'm not doing this.

Jimmy Whisman (21:43)

A lot of smiles. Very little sex I've seen in heaven.

James Petregallo (21:46)

That's going on. That's got to be going on.

Jimmy Whisman (21:49)

It's gotta be.

James Petregallo (21:50)

Yeah. If it was real, that's what would be happening. Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (21:54)

Never been depicted.

James Petregallo (21:55)

He also, apparently, other people said, described an invisible sword that can ward off evil and create safe boundaries. Okay. Spirit travels. Invisible swords. Okay. Now, David and Lynn would lead the prayer group that met in the home. This is when they get there, they kind of take it over from dad. And they initially meet once a week for Bible study and snacks.

Jimmy Whisman (22:21)

Yeah, that's nice.

James Petregallo (22:23)

Cakes and pie. That's what I mean. Keep your crumb cake out. Sure. But they grew to, like, two and three times a week.

Jimmy Whisman (22:30)

Oh, getting greedy on the snacks.

James Petregallo (22:32)

That's a lot. Yeah. I think at that point, you got to start a snack rotation. Yeah, I'm not providing snacks every three times a day. Jesus Christ.

Jimmy Whisman (22:42)

This is too much house and home.

James Petregallo (22:44)

He just said, Jesus Christ. He's like, yeah, I'm here. I came for the snacks. You guys got crumb cake still, I heard. I'm checking.

Jimmy Whisman (22:52)

That's when you need to do it on rotation. When somebody gets so exasperated, they start using the Lord's name in vain.

James Petregallo (22:58)

Bible study. That's a lot. So they became really into this idea that God's the New light teachings, as they called it. The idea that most of God's teachings had been withheld from Christians for too long and that you could ask God to bestow upon you the privilege of seeing and talking to angels. It's like, people only use 10% of their brain. They always say it's one of those things. They're like, there's 10% of your faith. God's just like, no one asked me to talk to angels. You know what I mean? If you want to talk to angels, you got to fucking ask me. What are you going to. I'm supposed to. When you ask, read your minds that you want to talk to angels. Listen. You want to talk to angels, you come see me. All right.

Jimmy Whisman (23:40)

That is interesting that of all the powers he's got, he can't read my mind.

James Petregallo (23:45)

I guess not. Apparently not. Free will. What are you going to do? Doesn't know you want angels. So we don't know. I mean, how many of them actually believe that or how deep into it, or if one person believes it and everyone else is like, yeah, great. And then everybody was like, yeah, everyone believes it. We don't know. So by 1983, the Greens joined forces with another group led by a woman named Jean Ketzner, who, she's an interesting lady, regularly performed exorcisms and claimed she could cast out demons and speak directly to God. You know, full of shit. Or as we say in the secular world or even in the religious world, I think about 99% of us can all go full of shit. Full of shit. Yeah. They're like the Warrens. You know what I mean? You guys are just charlatans. Yeah. So here's some members of the group. By the way, we have Sharon Lee Halstead. Now, Sharon Lee Halstead is the daughter of the Halstead family that's friends with the Greens, the parents, and followed them to Grant's Pass and all that like we talked about. So that's them now. She's the eldest, she's born in 52. Sharon Lee Halstead. She's the eldest of the three Halstead siblings. She's got her brother Michael who comes after her, and then younger sister Deborah. And all these people will come into play here. This is strict Seventh Day Adventist household. Obviously they're hanging out with their buddies there and friends with the Greens for many years. The family knew each other and had known each other when they all lived in Southern California as well.

Jimmy Whisman (25:24)

Right.

James Petregallo (25:25)

So there's a Southern. Yeah, so no, this is another place in California. They all lived, they played together, they went to church together. That's what's going on now. Sharon, when she was an adult, started drifting away from the church as a lot of kids do when they're deep in it as kids, they're adults. They're going to try to exercise some individuality or whatever, get a little bit.

Jimmy Whisman (25:48)

Of space between us.

James Petregallo (25:49)

Yeah. So when she's 27, her family hated what she wanted to do, which is marry a guy. Yeah. And so she eloped with him. And he is a. He's a guy who's in his early 60s when she's 27.

Jimmy Whisman (26:05)

Okay.

James Petregallo (26:06)

His name is Tex Shively.

Jimmy Whisman (26:08)

Oh, Tex.

James Petregallo (26:09)

Tex. Tex is a blacksmith who.

Jimmy Whisman (26:12)

In what year?

James Petregallo (26:15)

Jesus christ. The fucking 70s and early 80s. So he's a 60 something year old blacksmith who's more than twice her age and also has no religion at all. So not what the family was looking for, as you might say. So well done, gang. They immediately have a son named Harry. Yeah. His boys can swim.

Jimmy Whisman (26:38)

Tex is making babies.

James Petregallo (26:40)

Tex is making horseshoes and babies. These are two things Tex can do.

Jimmy Whisman (26:43)

My.

James Petregallo (26:44)

He produces iron and sperm. Those are two things that he can muster.

Jimmy Whisman (26:48)

Sperm as strong as iron.

James Petregallo (26:50)

I guess so. So then they had a second son named Leo a couple years later. All right.

Jimmy Whisman (26:56)

He does it twice. In his 60s.

James Petregallo (26:58)

He's a huge gun collector. Tex, you can't have the name Texas and not have a collection of weapons. You need to.

Jimmy Whisman (27:05)

He's got at least seven.

James Petregallo (27:06)

You have to. Guns and boots you have to have. If you name Tex, he has like over 300 guns. Shitloads.

Jimmy Whisman (27:12)

Oh my God.

James Petregallo (27:13)

That's a lot. Yeah. So the marriage to Tex not good. Didn't work out. No. Lynn Green, David Green jr's wife Lynn Ann, who we talked about now Lynn, she kept in touch with Sharon and knows Sharon. She's known her for a long time and she urged Sharon to Divorce Tex? Yeah, divorce him. But the reason isn't because he's not a good provider. He's mean to me, doesn't pay attention to the kids. She said you need to leave because demons are inhabiting him.

Jimmy Whisman (27:48)

Oh, boy.

James Petregallo (27:49)

So now we're in demon country here. Hey, everybody. Just going to take a quick break from the show to tell you about a much better way to eat and cook and everything else with Tavala. Tovala.com oh, you know what? You know what you do on weeknights? You stare at the fridge and you're like, what if this stuff just made itself? Wouldn't that be great? How about that? What if it made itself? It's not gonna make itself.

Jimmy Whisman (28:12)

No.

James Petregallo (28:12)

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Jimmy Whisman (29:05)

Love that.

James Petregallo (29:06)

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Jimmy Whisman (30:31)

Now back to the show New year.

James Petregallo (30:35)

Same extra value meals at McDonald's. So now get two snack wraps plus fries and a medium soft drink for just eight dol for a limited time only. Prices and participation may vary. Prices may be higher in Hawaii, Alaska and California. And for delivery, she enlisted help from her brother Michael. Sharon does the middle child in her family to get out of the marriage and he helps her to escape. And she takes the boys with her when they leave. And so she's gone. Gets away from Tex, which is nice. Okay, so getting away from Texas. Now, Michael Halsted is obviously, like we said, the middle sibling. He helps her and then he kind of goes back to his own life. He lives a couple hundred miles away from Grants Pass. He got his big sister out of that. The divorce is finalized in 84 and Sharon moves to Grants Pass to be near her parents who had moved there to be near the Green family. So once she's back in this orbit, she is way back into religion again like she was when she was a kid. And to her it's almost like proof that she should have been doing it because of text.

Jimmy Whisman (31:43)

Good boy. Yeah. When I pushed back, I got that.

James Petregallo (31:45)

I didn't listen. And this is what I got. I got text.

Jimmy Whisman (31:47)

Was he abusive? Why did she want out?

James Petregallo (31:50)

We don't know if he was abusive or what, but he wasn't what she was. I mean he's a 65 year old blacksmith probably. Maybe that's why she's like 30 at this point.

Jimmy Whisman (32:00)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (32:01)

So Harry, she has. Harry and Leo are the two kids. They're three years apart and she ends up having a live in boyfriend while she's there, which I know is probably the Seventh Day Adventists are really in favor of. But this is about 1985. His name is John Gentry and he's one of the early members of the prayer group also. And Lynn Green apparently had told Sharon that God wanted her and John to be together. So they started dating and moved in together. All right, this is, you know, it's God's will. What are you gonna do, Jimmy? Sit around, thumb up your ass? Jesus wants some entamins and I'm supposed to get with this person. That's what's going on. So John is very much in love with Sharon. Loves Sharon a lot. The group becomes more serious. Apparently some of them, they all claim to have some kind of special powers from this group. And we're talking, a lot of them say they either speak to God directly or with angels.

Jimmy Whisman (33:10)

One way or another, the message is getting through.

James Petregallo (33:12)

Yeah, it's like going to like a Hollywood studio. Like you got to get through the receptionist and then you got to get through this person that before you get to anybody that has any decision making power that can write a check, you're going through eight layers.

Jimmy Whisman (33:23)

Yeah, it's very rare that the casting couch is right there with the executives.

James Petregallo (33:28)

It takes a minute, it takes a long time. Some said they saw angels. Some said they could read minds. And guess you know what, too here for new listeners, we're not. If you want to be religious, great, go ahead. It doesn't hurt me any. I don't give a shit what anybody does. Don't care. No religion gives you superpowers. That's the thing.

Jimmy Whisman (33:50)

You're not the fucking suicide squad. You're congregation.

James Petregallo (33:53)

No, that's the thing. You can't space travel. You can't just a belief in something. And I think, like I said, 99% of people are going, yeah, that would be frowned upon if I went to church and said I could do that.

Jimmy Whisman (34:05)

We've got the crocodile guy in the back.

James Petregallo (34:07)

So we're not talking about you out there. We're talking about these people. And if you're one of these people. Wow, awesome. Thanks for watching. I don't know why you're here.

Jimmy Whisman (34:15)

I can't believe it.

James Petregallo (34:16)

But great, keep hanging with us. We'll continue to evaluate.

Jimmy Whisman (34:19)

I'll tell you friends or do.

James Petregallo (34:22)

I don't care. As long as they listen. I don't give a shit if they like it or not. Some of them, I guess they believed in space travel and spirit travel too. And some believe that if they asked angels and got permission on the Sabbath, that they could. So, you know, there's a form you got to fill out ahead of time. They could actually visit heaven for a short period of time. You get a tour, it's a brief visa, like, not long. You can't just go there indefinitely. It's like, how long? What are your plans? Business or pleasure? You got to, you know, go through the. You gotta go through the border first. And. Yeah, it's a thing.

Jimmy Whisman (35:01)

Ah, shit.

James Petregallo (35:02)

It's tough. They gotta check your papers over. It's rough here. 1988. Here comes Deborah Halstead, the youngest, Michael and Sharon's younger sister. She's also obviously raised in the same family. Also drifted away from the faith in adulthood. She had moved to LA and worked secretarial jobs in Hollywood. So she did the exact opposite. Like, couldn't be more opposite.

Jimmy Whisman (35:25)

She went and met the devil himself.

James Petregallo (35:30)

She's also involved with her married boyfriend who won't leave his wife for her. So she's very upset. So she ends up moving back to Grant's past since she's crushed by this relationship. And, you know, generally Hollywood in general will beat you down to a. You know how remember on a cartoon when one of those steamrollers would just roll over a person and they'd be flat and you'd have to peel them up. Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (35:56)

And then they would put them in the mouth or whatever.

James Petregallo (35:59)

That's Hollywood. Yeah. That does that to you.

Jimmy Whisman (36:01)

That's just every day.

James Petregallo (36:03)

That's all the time. So she got real. She moves in with Sharon and Sharon's two sons and gets real into the prayer group really. And really, really into her sister's crazy shit here. Okay. At this point, Sharon's living on welfare and food stamps and Deborah's unemployed. So they're doing great. Yeah, they're doing great. No one is working. No one is doing anything except for this prayer group. Now, here come all the angels. The angels are going to enter into this story. They claim they keep a book called the Black Book of Angels, which sounds like something like a Marilyn Manson album title, doesn't it? The Black Book of Angels. Or some, like, Rob Zombie fucking movie.

Jimmy Whisman (36:47)

But it sounds like a book that's in a priest desk, though. It's. Yeah, you're not allowed to have this Rolodex.

James Petregallo (36:53)

Little black book is what they're going for. Full of angel names.

Jimmy Whisman (36:57)

It's in a.

James Petregallo (36:58)

Somewhere. They say they have over 160 named angels. They've communicated with that are in their little book. 160.

Jimmy Whisman (37:06)

Yeah. How many are in? There's a lot in the book, right? In the actual book?

James Petregallo (37:11)

Me? You're asking? I've read a lot of books, Jimmy, but that's not what I'm really up on that much.

Jimmy Whisman (37:16)

Yeah. John Travolta's one in that one movie. That's all I know.

James Petregallo (37:20)

Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (37:22)

Michael.

James Petregallo (37:22)

Michael. Yeah. Including the angel of motherhood, the angel of mystery.

Jimmy Whisman (37:28)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (37:29)

Ooh, I think that's Agatha Christie. When she died, she became the angel of mystery.

Jimmy Whisman (37:34)

The Indians.

James Petregallo (37:35)

Yeah. The angel of truth. And of course, the angel of was, is, and is to be the angel of the past and future.

Jimmy Whisman (37:45)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (37:45)

Rather than Christmas Carol breaks it up into three separate jobs. This poor angel has to be present and future. One guy, we got one for present. You do everything else. That's it. So the angels thing, now, what they end up finding out is much like this is where the Lori Vallow connection comes in. When people start going off in their own crazy religious beliefs. Beliefs of anything religious or otherwise, things get weird.

Jimmy Whisman (38:15)

Yeah, but it's never fucking original.

James Petregallo (38:18)

No.

Jimmy Whisman (38:18)

Well, that annoys me.

James Petregallo (38:19)

But it's like if someone pushes a little bit, and then everybody's okay with that, so then someone else might push a little bit more. And after a while, if you have this big group you've all kind of pushed and you've made this giant area that you can operate in now in a belief system. That's.

Jimmy Whisman (38:35)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (38:35)

And that's what happened with Lori Valo. If you don't know that story. She. They. Her and her new husband killed their ex hus. Her ex husband, their kids, her kids, everything. It's goddamn crazy. People died because they were. They were dark. Right.

Jimmy Whisman (38:48)

Because they went.

James Petregallo (38:49)

They went dark. And they had a whole rating system with this person is 0.25, and if he gets up to 4 0. That was wild. They have a similar thing.

Jimmy Whisman (38:59)

I'd never. In the. In the trial, they never showed the meter that gave them those numbers.

James Petregallo (39:04)

No, no, no. They didn't have a meter. They just said it.

Jimmy Whisman (39:06)

It was never spoken to them.

James Petregallo (39:07)

They never claimed to have a meter. They would just literally talk and they go, your brother's up to 0.32. And they're like, really? Oh, my God. Well, that's. That. Like, they're like, oh, man.

Jimmy Whisman (39:16)

That does that.

James Petregallo (39:17)

Yeah. Like they looked at a temperature. Like they looked at a thermometer and was like, it's 36 degrees outside. Like, it was a fact.

Jimmy Whisman (39:22)

A map for that.

James Petregallo (39:25)

So what they would do is they would identify people who were in their mind, possessed by demons and they would label them much like an insurance company, as, quote, totaled.

Jimmy Whisman (39:37)

Oh, is that right?

James Petregallo (39:38)

Like you ran your car into a fucking telephone pole. Same thing. Totaled.

Jimmy Whisman (39:42)

The damage value exceeds the cost of this vehicle.

James Petregallo (39:44)

Throw it out. What do you do? You put it in a junkyard. That's what they're doing with people. And apparently the person they believe who is receiving the message from God and his angels telling them who is totaled and who needs to be dealt with is nine year old Leo.

Jimmy Whisman (40:03)

What?

James Petregallo (40:04)

In 1988, the blacksmith's kid. Sharon's nine year old Sharon in Texas, nine year old Leo, Okay. The adults all say his mother is Aunt the. They all did it saying, yes, he.

Jimmy Whisman (40:19)

Knows if somebody's totaled or not.

James Petregallo (40:21)

He was like their prophet, essentially. They would go to him and say, what's God saying now? What's God want now?

Jimmy Whisman (40:29)

Dangerous.

James Petregallo (40:30)

Yeah. Leo's older brother Harry, which. Imagine that your little brother is the.

Jimmy Whisman (40:35)

A little nine year old.

James Petregallo (40:36)

Everybody's kissing his little ass and you're 12 going, nobody talks to me. Perfect.

Jimmy Whisman (40:40)

Nobody gives a shit.

James Petregallo (40:41)

Yeah, you're just learning about jerking off. And this, this is crazy.

Jimmy Whisman (40:44)

He's in sixth grade.

James Petregallo (40:46)

He remembered waking up one night here and sneaking a peek through his cracked bedroom door at what was going on in the living room. He saw his mother asking Leo questions from a sheet of paper. And every time Leo would answer a question, they would put money in a jar for him. They were paying him. And each time he interacted with his personal angel, by the way, his personal angel's name was the Naked Truth, which is also a 90s sitcom with tea Leone, but in this case, an angel. Who's going to tell it like it is.

Jimmy Whisman (41:23)

It's a lot of things too, right? Naked Truth isn't.

James Petregallo (41:27)

I just remember it popped into my head as a 90s sitcom. I could see De Leone's face for some reason. I remember that one.

Jimmy Whisman (41:33)

It's a drink by naked drinks too.

James Petregallo (41:35)

I'm sure it is. Yeah, got to be. Yeah. So this naked truth would tell Leo who was totaled, which is completely possessed and overwhelmed by evil forces and no longer really alive because they're just controlled by demons anyway.

Jimmy Whisman (41:49)

Not a viable person.

James Petregallo (41:50)

No. And once they were declared totaled, they had to be eliminated. We can't have these total demon people out here. Just like Lori Vallow did with Chad Dabel. There was supposedly a concept of the, quote, seven doors that you had to pass through. See what I mean? They have to set up arbitrary guidelines. This person can't get to negative 4 dark because then they're whatever. And this is. You have to go through seven doors to become fully totaled. Yeah. Now by the way, this is not Leo's fault. Leo is nine. He's nine year old.

Jimmy Whisman (42:25)

He's manipulated.

James Petregallo (42:26)

Well, if a nine year old told you, hey, the angels are telling me, you take him to a goddamn psychiatrist. You know what I mean? That's what you do when you go, jesus, what's going on with this kid? Or you tell them, hey, shut up. If you just think they're lying and trying to go to your room. Yeah, hey, Shut up. No PlayStation. That's it. How do you like that? Tell your angels about no PlayStation but these. They're conditioning him. They ask him a question, he answers it, they give him money. What does that tell a kid?

Jimmy Whisman (42:56)

There's a reward for what?

James Petregallo (42:57)

You're saying I'm doing the right thing. This is what the adults want me to do. And it's almost like there's a lot of times you can get kids to say things that didn't happen. You know what I mean?

Jimmy Whisman (43:10)

Oh yeah.

James Petregallo (43:11)

There's a way to make them, they want to impress you as an adult.

Jimmy Whisman (43:16)

Well, I mean the difference is when they're wrong, they're punished or not rewarded. Whether they're punished or not, they're not rewarded. And that's the goal.

James Petregallo (43:27)

Yep. I mean he could read between the lines of what they want. So here we go now. Summer of 1988, John Gentry, who is Sharon's live in boyfriend, says that Leo threatened his life. Oh, dang badass. Telling him that quote. You're, you've already gone through four doors, man. You're close. You're on the border, bro. I'm dead serious. You're through door four, buddy. You got three more to go and it's total time.

Jimmy Whisman (43:57)

You're knocking on five. You better watch yourself.

James Petregallo (43:59)

That's right. And he said that you better watch your back. Or Leo said, according to John, that he would have John's throat slit. Oh, a nine year old, so now.

Jimmy Whisman (44:09)

He'S a nine year old, threatens violence upon knockback.

James Petregallo (44:13)

He's there, you get three more doors. You have no choice. One of the other group members claimed a some point that an angel told them that Sharon shouldn't be with John and is actually should be with a former Catholic priest. That's what the angel said. That's going to be her thing. So she dumped her boyfriend. She dumped her live in boyfriend of three years. Because someone said, God told me that's bad.

Jimmy Whisman (44:39)

I'm going to dump him and try to court a celibate man.

James Petregallo (44:44)

That's right. So Michael, the middle child who helped Sharon escape from Tex there, the guy with the pillow, he's totaled now.

Jimmy Whisman (44:50)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (44:51)

Oh, is he? They say Michael, he's all totaled out. He works in Yamhill county in the Phoenix Horse Farm where he works and has an apartment. 9 year old Leo said that Michael was totaled and we gotta kill him. There's no choice. All seven doors. The group also did other things. When people were bad and were demons, they would go out and like slash their tires. As a group. Yeah. They stole shitloads of merchandise and motorcycles from people. And according to the naked truth, the angel, they said committing crimes against these people don't count because they're taken over by demons. They're not even. It's fine, just take their motorcycle. They don't need it anymore. Demons hate motorcycles.

Jimmy Whisman (45:35)

It's obvious they don't got a lot of balance.

James Petregallo (45:38)

So they would slash tires and claim that the owners of the cars were crooks and they were teaching them lessons and all this type of shit. It's wild. One incident at a local park. Apparently Leo said there's all drug deals going on in the park. He's nine. Someone had to plant that. So allegedly here, the Halsteads, Deborah and Sharon went over there with flashlights, big mag lights, and Harry, according to what people say, allegedly here, attacked a couple trying to hit them over the head with a flashlight.

Jimmy Whisman (46:15)

Oh my. They were just in the park.

James Petregallo (46:17)

Yeah. They wanted to take their money out of their wallets, but the couple got up and ran away and that was that. So. Wow. Sharon and Deborah were there egging it on. So the Greens flee their own group. This is getting too weird for Lynn and David. It is. They didn't, like, they thought it was a nice prayer group at first and now it's, you know, we don't even have snacks anymore. Now it's just demons. This is crazy.

Jimmy Whisman (46:41)

This is sending us mag lights as we come in the door.

James Petregallo (46:44)

This is wild. So they started the group to, you know, just to have a nice prayer group and it didn't happen. And they were like, we're not into this. So they leave the group. It's at this point here when the Greens brought up their concerns about Leo's messages and these outrageous things and we can hurt people. What is going on here? So the Halsteads take off for a while. They're just gone for like a Week.

Jimmy Whisman (47:09)

All right.

James Petregallo (47:09)

They just leave the area. On October 31, 1988, Harry and Leo go to visit their dad, Tex. Sharon drops the boys off with Tex. Seems like a nice thing. That's. They're gonna go, you know, he's gotta get done with that.

Jimmy Whisman (47:25)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (47:26)

November 3, 1998. Michael comes home to his apartment on the horse farm. And his apartment is trashed. Trashed. Everything in there is just completely ransacked. It doesn't even look like a robbery. It looks like somebody just totally said, let's fuck this place up. Yeah, let's total it. So he said, God damn it. And then he went to talk to a ranch hand that works there, who also is called in a newspaper a horse wrangler, which sounds way cooler than a ranch hand. Yeah, that sounds badass.

Jimmy Whisman (47:57)

That better be on your LinkedIn. That's pretty good.

James Petregallo (47:59)

Totally. So he. Absolutely. He goes to find him to see if he saw anything. His name is Marston Lemke. He's 58 years old. He goes by Mike. Mike Lemke.

Jimmy Whisman (48:10)

Okay, fine.

James Petregallo (48:12)

So he's the caretaker and lives on a small property. A small trailer on the property. Nice guy. Nobody hates old Mike. Old Mike's a good horse wrangling cuss there. Nobody hates him. So Michael finds Mike here. Michael the brother finds the caretaker, finds him in his home in his trailer. But Mike is slumped over in his bed, shot three times.

Jimmy Whisman (48:35)

Oh, no.

James Petregallo (48:36)

Shot once in the back, once in the shoulder, once in the neck.

Jimmy Whisman (48:39)

And we came to just ask Mike who did this to my place?

James Petregallo (48:42)

Yeah. What's going on? And there's other shit going on. There's missing items of Mike's, including a red truck belonging to Mike, not Michael, Mike the wrangler. A horse trailer and a fucking horse that was in the trailer.

Jimmy Whisman (48:56)

Oh, shit.

James Petregallo (48:57)

They made off with a whole setup of a horse and everything.

Jimmy Whisman (49:01)

Hotwired the truck that was connected to the horse trailer with the horse inside it.

James Petregallo (49:05)

The keys are probably in it. It's on a horse farm? Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (49:09)

Didn't know how to disconnect the gooseneck.

James Petregallo (49:11)

No, he said, fuck it. Just take the horse too.

Jimmy Whisman (49:13)

I don't know how to get it off of there.

James Petregallo (49:15)

So the police investigate this, and Tex is a suspect. Oh, really? That's the ex husband. Police knew he has tons of guns. And they know that Michael had helped Sharon escape the marriage. So they think that Tex is getting some retribution. Right, but Tex had a great alibi. Had no part of any of it. No, no. That was only for that day. It was a couple Days later this was going on. November 4, 1988, Halsteads are back in Grants Pass. They show up at the Green home on that day. The next day, I mean, November 5, 1988 is David Green Jr. S birthday. So Lynn and David and Nate, the two or three year old son, they go to David's parents house, celebrate his birthday and then they come home, they're getting ready for bed. Baby Nathaniel's in a high chair having a snack, pre bed snack there, 9:40pm Somebody knocks on the door.

Jimmy Whisman (50:14)

Who's that?

James Petregallo (50:15)

David opens the door and it's Sharon, Deborah, Harry and Leo. Okay, the two sisters and the two brothers there, the two kids. So David was like, oh, how nice. We've known them for years and years. They're here to wish me happy birthday. Isn't that sweet?

Jimmy Whisman (50:30)

Isn't that great?

James Petregallo (50:32)

That's so sweet. So he let them in and they're chatting and they're like oh this is really nice. What a nice end to the day. He said at that point, people were saying that at that point for about a half hour. The whole Halstead family here, the two boys and Sharon and Deborah are quote whispering and snickering. And this is while the Greens are going about their business watching tv. One's paying bills at the dinner table.

Jimmy Whisman (50:56)

Came over to my house to roast us together but not to our faces.

James Petregallo (50:59)

Just to each other. Weird. So you know the kids, they're playing with the kid in the high chair, all that kind of shit. It's very strange. Then they told the Greens that God had given them a message. Oh, that's what happens here when they start getting into this. Apparently the Greens kind of, they're not real into it. They had told them earlier they don't really believe in all this type of shit. So Greene said later that he and his wife had several discussions with the Halsteads during the past three weeks about a series of messages going to Leo and all that kind of thing. And they said they didn't really go along with what they were saying. Now about a half hour into this visit, the boys, the two boys ask to go to the bathroom together. I don't know why. All right, so they say yeah, sure, they're in there for a while.

Jimmy Whisman (51:50)

Oh.

James Petregallo (51:51)

So Lynn is suspicious and goes in there and checks to see what's going on. And when she opens the door, 12 year old Harry is finishing writing something on the wall in red lipstick on.

Jimmy Whisman (52:04)

The wall in red lipstick in somebody else's house.

James Petregallo (52:08)

And he wrote quote, trust in Jesus on the wall okay. All right. Now, Lynn freaked out. Said you all need to go. Yeah. All right. You gotta go. So rather than leaving, they circle around the Green family. They get closer to them. Deborah grabbed the phone that they had and held it so they can't call anybody. Sharon pulls a gun out of her purse.

Jimmy Whisman (52:34)

Oh, boy.

James Petregallo (52:35)

Okay. Harry tells them the gun's loaded. So David said, fuck, I gotta run. I gotta get out of here and go tell somebody. So that's what he does. He runs. And he said he thought that if I don't survive this, no one will ever find out who's doing this. So he made a run for the sliding glass door in the dining room into the backyard. Sharon shoots at him, hits him in the back near his left shoulder. Wow.

Jimmy Whisman (53:02)

Good shot.

James Petregallo (53:03)

Bullet fragments into the rest of his body, too. And his lung and everything else. But he keeps running. Adrenaline. He's got adrenaline keeping him going here. He could hear more gunshots behind him as he's running. And his wife screaming. This is horrifying. How do you.

Jimmy Whisman (53:17)

What the hell?

James Petregallo (53:18)

Yeah, I mean, I don't know how your body would. You're shot, so you have to.

Jimmy Whisman (53:21)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (53:22)

This is the worst thing. What do you do? Do you attack the gun or do you go for help? What do you do? And that's just a split second decision. You don't have time to sit and write the pros and cons down.

Jimmy Whisman (53:33)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

James Petregallo (53:34)

This guy's just.

Jimmy Whisman (53:34)

Generally speaking, if somebody's got the gun and you don't have one at all.

James Petregallo (53:38)

No run. Yeah, you run. But some people might grab their wife and boy and cover them up and you don't know. Depends on what you're doing then.

Jimmy Whisman (53:47)

Yeah. Feeling sinking.

James Petregallo (53:49)

Shit.

Jimmy Whisman (53:49)

If you survive.

James Petregallo (53:50)

There's no right answer here. Basically. There is no right answer to this. It's whatever your body reacts to doing. You have no idea.

Jimmy Whisman (53:56)

The Survivor's Guild is ugly.

James Petregallo (53:58)

Oh, it's bad. So David, bleeding, stumbles across the neighborhood, knocking on doors.

Jimmy Whisman (54:03)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (54:03)

One guy's in his home office. He hears three gunshots in rapid succession. Then hears cries for help at his front door, recognizing it as David.

Jimmy Whisman (54:13)

Right.

James Petregallo (54:13)

But it still takes him a few minutes to get to the door. He had to finish something up, you know what I mean? Gotta send this email when he gets there. Just a pool of blood. No David, no guy. So David had gone to another neighbor, Evelyn Drake, and she opened her door and he just collapsed into her house. Yeah.

Jimmy Whisman (54:30)

Cause he's now almost empty.

James Petregallo (54:31)

Yeah. So she called the cops, apparently, when the police arrived. And they were trying to help him and revive him. All that Green said was, quote, they were friends. Why would they do this? And then passed back out. So they're like, oh, this is interesting. We gotta hear the rest of this story.

Jimmy Whisman (54:46)

Wake back up, dude.

James Petregallo (54:47)

So the police arrive at the Green residence and discover horror.

Jimmy Whisman (54:52)

Right?

James Petregallo (54:52)

Har. Lynn is dead on the floor.

Jimmy Whisman (54:54)

Oh, boy.

James Petregallo (54:55)

Lynn has been shot twice. Once in the chest and once in the head at point blank range.

Jimmy Whisman (54:59)

Golly.

James Petregallo (55:00)

Put her down and finished her off like a mob hit. Nathaniel was shot in the face while sitting in a high chair.

Jimmy Whisman (55:08)

Two years old.

James Petregallo (55:10)

Totaled.

Jimmy Whisman (55:11)

Three. Yeah, totaled.

James Petregallo (55:12)

Must have been totaled already. It's a bit. This is. That baby's not a witness.

Jimmy Whisman (55:17)

No, he can't say anything.

James Petregallo (55:19)

He can't say anything. He can't tell. Oh, it was the hall. It was the Halstead family. Let me draw you a sketch. He's a fucking toddler.

Jimmy Whisman (55:26)

He doesn't even get the marshmallows in the Lucky Charms.

James Petregallo (55:28)

He just take them out.

Jimmy Whisman (55:30)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (55:30)

Here's some oats. Enjoy this. Poor kid. But he's still breathing. He's alive. They rush him to the hospital, into surgery. He remains in critical condition for several days, but wakes up and lives.

Jimmy Whisman (55:45)

Get the fuck out of here.

James Petregallo (55:46)

He fucking lives. Shot in the chin, right in the face, point blank range, lives this kid. Wow. Wow.

Jimmy Whisman (55:54)

Unbelievable.

James Petregallo (55:55)

That's incredible. Now we'll find out. He's gonna have a condition here.

Jimmy Whisman (55:59)

Lifelong problem, for sure.

James Petregallo (56:01)

That's amazing. He's alive.

Jimmy Whisman (56:03)

Breathing is incredible.

James Petregallo (56:04)

Yeah, he's alive. Now the scene. Scattered all around the dining room. There's pools of blood, several.38 caliber bullet casings. Lynn's purse is missing. They find trust in Jesus written in red lipstick in the fucking wall in the bathroom wall. The investigator said it was the strangest case I've ever investigated. Who would do this? So this is crazy. Initially, the police thought this must have been a drifter came through town on the i5 like Randall Woodfield style. But no. Now David, they can't talk to him. He's in surgery. So they don't know what happened. They're hoping he lives. You know what I mean?

Jimmy Whisman (56:40)

Fingers crossed. Yeah.

James Petregallo (56:42)

Multiple witnesses reported seeing a Chevy 4X4, a red Chevy truck, 4X4 fleeing the scene after gunshots, dragging a trace, dragging a trailer just coming from the back. That's it. So police are trying to find.

Jimmy Whisman (56:57)

Hanging out the back.

James Petregallo (56:58)

Yeah, yeah. Just looking around. They ran the license plate on the truck because they knew where it was and discovered it was stolen recently.

Jimmy Whisman (57:06)

Right.

James Petregallo (57:06)

That's Lemke's truck. So they said there's. That's when they find out from the other county that there was another homicide a few days earlier up north where that truck had been stolen and the red truck had been taking along with the horse trailer, a horse and saddles and $50,000 worth of equipment. And38 caliber round was found at the murder scene on the horse ranch. Same as in the green shootings.

Jimmy Whisman (57:31)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (57:31)

David survives.

Jimmy Whisman (57:33)

Unbelievable.

James Petregallo (57:35)

The doctors do not remove the bullet fragments from his chest because they fear it would cause more damage than leaving him in. He still the rest of his life. He has bullet fragments.

Jimmy Whisman (57:44)

Wow.

James Petregallo (57:45)

David gives a statement after surgery. He kept saying, is everybody okay? And nobody will tell him anything because they don't want to upset him, obviously. He just got out of surgery and he said that when they finally told him his wife was dead and his son was in intensive care, he said, I couldn't even cry. I didn't realize what happened. I was just numb. But he knew who did it. And he said, it's the goddamn Halsteads. Go get them. So they search Greene's home just to get any clues about anybody else. And also it's a murder scene. So they find the 175 page diary that Lynn kept. The black Book of Angels.

Jimmy Whisman (58:23)

She left it?

James Petregallo (58:24)

Yes. So she was the one writing it down Originally. Now they find all these angels and they're like, what the fuck are we walking into? Trusting Jesus on the wall. All this shit.

Jimmy Whisman (58:36)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (58:37)

November 6th, 1988, early morning. They find the sisters. Oh, they're at Sharon's home. So it wasn't that hard to find them. That was close. Nope. Southeast street. Southeast I Street in Grants Pass. There they are. By the way, what's parked in the driveway?

Jimmy Whisman (58:53)

A red truck.

James Petregallo (58:54)

Stolen. Red truck, Yep. So they were like perfect. At 1:30am they got a search warrant. They brought the SWAT team in, evacuated all the neighbors to a local boys and girls club. They didn't know if it was gonna be a shootout. They had a hostage team ready and there's a neighbor who's a journalist who's like hanging out, trying to take pictures of it and shit. So they ended up eventless. Just. They go in, they get em out, they pull them in cuffs, put them face down on the grass. The other two adults there, their parents. Right. They let them go. They were cleared of everything. And they get the kids too.

Jimmy Whisman (59:30)

Harry and Lee, they got the boys. Yeah.

James Petregallo (59:32)

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Jimmy Whisman (60:45)

Oh, fuck him.

James Petregallo (60:46)

And he said, we've been friends for so long. I don't understand this. He said they've known David Green since he was a baby. I can't believe they did this, right? Or did it. So dad is like John Gentry. They talked to him. Remember the ex boyfriend who got kicked out for going through four doors? He talked all about the Book of Angels. Corroborated it. He was present for all this shit. Then they find the horse trailer also. And the horse? The horse is fine too.

Jimmy Whisman (61:16)

It's hungry.

James Petregallo (61:16)

The kid and the animal? No, no, they boarded it at a barn in Grants Pass. It's being paid for.

Jimmy Whisman (61:23)

What is that?

James Petregallo (61:24)

I don't know. The horse is fine. It's eating oats. Feeling great. Like a little kid with Lucky Charms with no marshmallows.

Jimmy Whisman (61:30)

That is fascinating.

James Petregallo (61:32)

Wow. The kids are taken into protective custody, Harry and Leo. But not before there's a chat when they interview the boys. They spoke about how Leo had been told by the women that he could talk to angels and God. He said, I never said that. They told me I could, so I thought I could.

Jimmy Whisman (61:47)

Okay.

James Petregallo (61:48)

He said, I never actually said I could hear angels. Or see them.

Jimmy Whisman (61:53)

Okay. Was it Harry that was writing on the wall or was it Leo? It was Harry.

James Petregallo (61:57)

He probably had better penmanship at 12. Probably.

Jimmy Whisman (61:59)

Yeah. He can write recursive.

James Petregallo (62:01)

Yeah. Yeah, it's good. Loops. Not bad. Trust in Jesus. With a big.

Jimmy Whisman (62:07)

Don't even pull the Maybelline off the wall.

James Petregallo (62:11)

So the murder weapon's a.38 snub nosed handgun that was stolen from Tex's collection by Harry and Leo when they went to visit. That's why they went to visit. To steal their gun from them to bring back to their mother.

Jimmy Whisman (62:24)

You little scumbags.

James Petregallo (62:26)

Well, she said, go steal a gun from your dad and bring it back to me.

Jimmy Whisman (62:29)

And they did it.

James Petregallo (62:30)

Yeah, their mom told them to. Thought it was right. Their mom's telling them that there's demons everywhere. You have to do this to stop the demons. If you're nine, you go, yeah, great. Stop the demons.

Jimmy Whisman (62:39)

Take a gun from dad.

James Petregallo (62:41)

I thought wrestling was real. You know what I mean? We all. What the hell do we know when we're nine? So what ended up happening? The whole thing is 10-31-88. Sharon dropped the boys off, had them steal the guns. Then they went up to the horse farm there to kill Michael. That's why they went there. Michael wasn't around and Mike saw him. So they trashed the place. They poured out all of his booze on the floor, ripped up his magazines. They threw leftover food on the walls and floor and everything. And then Harry wrote on the walls after his mom told him to. You are dead, Mike. J.C. like, Jesus.

Jimmy Whisman (63:20)

Jesus Christ.

James Petregallo (63:21)

J.C. was here and things should be the big man. So they went to try to steal some gas somewhere on the property. That's when they ran into Lemke. And they. That's when they shot Lemke.

Jimmy Whisman (63:33)

Marston saw him? Yeah.

James Petregallo (63:34)

He assumed they were there to see Michael because he knew them. Yeah, but Sharon brought up that they have to kill him now. And Lemke's like, hey, hold on a minute here. I'm not involved in any of this shit. But they said they had to. Later on. They had knocked on his door and told him they let him in. He let him in and she said, we got to kill you. She shot him in front of the 12 year old son, by the way. They stole his truck and drove off. November 5th. Leo had delivered another message from the naked truth that the Green family is totaled.

Jimmy Whisman (64:08)

Okay?

James Petregallo (64:09)

So that's when they shot up. They showed up, shot David. He escaped apparently after. This is according to the boys here, right after David escaped, Sharon turned the gun to the two year old first.

Jimmy Whisman (64:22)

Whoa.

James Petregallo (64:23)

And shot him in the fucking face.

Jimmy Whisman (64:25)

The fuck out of my life.

James Petregallo (64:27)

Harry later said that she did it with no hesitation. And he was shocked by it, that she just shot a Baby in the face.

Jimmy Whisman (64:33)

Unbelievable.

James Petregallo (64:35)

Then Lynn tried to jump at Sharon and tackle her. After that, as you would probably try to rip her fucking eyes out of her head. And Sharon shot her. That's it. Shot her in the chest. Lynn dropped down and then she shot her in the head at point blank range. Just.

Jimmy Whisman (64:51)

Good Lord.

James Petregallo (64:53)

So the sisters are going to be charged with. Sharon is charged with four counts of aggravated murder, one count of murder, two counts of attempted murder, two counts of first degree assault. Deborah, one count of murder, two count of attempted murder, two counts of First Degree Assault. Yeah. So they allowed a bail to be set for Debra, but not for Sharon. She's the trigger person here. Now the prosecutors will seek the death penalty against Sharon.

Jimmy Whisman (65:20)

Hell yeah.

James Petregallo (65:21)

Yeah. You shot a baby in the house.

Jimmy Whisman (65:22)

You shot a baby, man.

James Petregallo (65:23)

I don't. Fuck you.

Jimmy Whisman (65:24)

I got nothing for you.

James Petregallo (65:25)

The Halsteads are gonna claim insanity. We're crazy. I mean, it sounds crazy the whole time out there. Everyone listening is going, this is crazy.

Jimmy Whisman (65:35)

I'm convinced.

James Petregallo (65:35)

This is insane. They want to do the Lemke case first. The state does, because it's not a death penalty case. So it's less complex.

Jimmy Whisman (65:43)

So they could hold that one.

James Petregallo (65:45)

Then. May 12, 1989. Deborah pleads guilty to conspiracy to murder. And she is sentenced to. You, ma'. Am. Hold on, I got my gavel. People have sent us here may fuck off. Two 20 year terms, but that's not consecutive. That's concurrent.

Jimmy Whisman (66:03)

So it's 20.

James Petregallo (66:05)

It's 20. And she's eligible for parole after about 40 months. For some reason. What? I don't know. Sharon follows suit. She pleads guilty to avoid the death penalty.

Jimmy Whisman (66:18)

Yeah.

James Petregallo (66:19)

Cause that's out there Also trying to.

Jimmy Whisman (66:21)

Get less time than Diddy.

James Petregallo (66:22)

Yeah. All these people are. Yeah. Crazy. She pleads guilty to murder for killing Lynn Green. Murder for killing Mike Lemke. Two counts of attempted murder for David and Nathaniel as part of the plea bargain. The county prosecutors will not seek a conviction for aggravated murder, which is the death penalty 1. So no matter what. Because you can make a deal. But the judge does not have to abide by a sentencing deal. They can go. I know the prosecutor said that, but I'm sentencing you to this. So you take the aggravated off the table, and then you can't do it anymore. So to be convicted of aggravated murder, prosecutors would have had to prove that Sharon wanted to kill the Greens for some reason other than her religious convictions. I don't know why, but you would. So it has to be like, wanted to steal from them. Wanted to whatever. So she never admits guilt, Sharon.

Jimmy Whisman (67:15)

Is that right?

James Petregallo (67:17)

Never does. She said she felt bad for what happened to Nathaniel, but pretty much said that David and Lynn deserve it. Whatever they needed to go. They're controlled by demons and, you know, my son told me all that kind of shit. According to the findings of fact, Sharon had believed that if she did not comply with her son's instructions, she would be possessed by demons and then she'd be all totaled out. So.

Jimmy Whisman (67:41)

Oh, my.

James Petregallo (67:43)

That's how it goes.

Jimmy Whisman (67:44)

You gotta drive defensively in his life.

James Petregallo (67:45)

That's what it is. You do. You really do. The insurance companies are right. So they also said that including all these religious beliefs is the theft of a horse and all that kind of thing. You know, Jesus needs horses. Obviously you hear that a lot in the Bible.

Jimmy Whisman (67:59)

That's a very. Is that Grand Theft Equestrian or something? They're very expensive, man.

James Petregallo (68:05)

It's a very expensive item. Yeah. And also, she believed that stealing people's possessions who were possessed was fine because their things were, quote, available to them at that point. They don't need them anymore. Prosecutors said they're satisfied. They said if the case went to trial, he didn't believe the jury would impose the death penalty on this lady anyway. Got two kids and all this. They're not gonna do it. They said that she's, quote, not likely to be released for a very, very long time and frankly, probably never is what he said. So we don't care. So she's gonna. She pleads guilty to all that. At Sharon's sentencing, her ex comes back to haunt her.

Jimmy Whisman (68:46)

Is that right?

James Petregallo (68:47)

Remember John Gentry?

Jimmy Whisman (68:48)

I remember him. Yeah.

James Petregallo (68:49)

Oh, yeah. He shows up and talks about the Black Book and about firsthand knowledge of the boy's behavior and all that. He said that. I've been through four doors. Leo told me a quote, I better watch my back or I'll have your throat slit. This is not good. He says that if Sharon hadn't broken up with him shortly before the murders, he's sure he would have been on the kill list. And he said the only thing that saved him was not some other person's craziness who thought a Catholic Church. No, an angel broke them up. An angel saved him, he said.

Jimmy Whisman (69:23)

I mean, that is their job.

James Petregallo (69:27)

He just did it real circuitously around the whole thing there.

Jimmy Whisman (69:32)

Did he give it the name?

James Petregallo (69:34)

Didn't give the particular. This angel's not getting credit, which is bullshit. You're gonna save a life. Get some. Take credit for it.

Jimmy Whisman (69:40)

Stole a meme, bud. Credit the Author.

James Petregallo (69:43)

So the defense attorneys. Yes, the defense attorneys tried to show that Sharon was passive and a dependent person and could easily be led by a nine year old. No, you do the leading. The defense attorney said the religious gathering she had participated in had a powerful effect on her. This guy had the balls to say this about a woman who shot a baby in the face. Quote, she was a victim too. Her life was turned upside down by this cult.

Jimmy Whisman (70:10)

Pull the trigger in a baby's face.

James Petregallo (70:13)

The prosecutor said, no, no, no, no, no. These religious beliefs were radically different from anybody else around them, including the Greens. And this is crazy. And says, you wacky asshole may fuck off. 75 years to life with no possibility of parole for 75 years.

Jimmy Whisman (70:31)

On a plea deal.

James Petregallo (70:32)

On a plea deal. Ooh, boy. So if she lives to be about 115, she'll get out. Otherwise she's fucked. This is 30 years minimum for the murder of Mike Lemke. 25 years minimum for the murder of Lynn Green. Consecutive 10 year minimum sentence for each of the two attempted murder charges. There's your 75 right there. sentencing, the judge said, anything to say for yourself? And she said, nope. Wow. I'm good. Don't want to say sorry I shot a baby in the face. Oh. And the Seventh Day Adventist Church kicked him out. Excommunicated. Gone. Revoked. Pulled your card. So prosecutors said they were satisfied with the sentences because. Because of her will. The Deborah's willingness to make a statement on Sharon. That's how they. Yeah, that's how they did this. So they were happy with that. Now, Leo and Harry were placed in state custody after the murders. Not charged with anything.

Jimmy Whisman (71:30)

Those boys have seen so much bad shit.

James Petregallo (71:34)

They need help. They need help. You need to help these boys. It's not their fault, their children. And especially if it's your parents and your mother telling you to do things.

Jimmy Whisman (71:41)

A 70 something year old blacksmith ain't gonna be around long enough to take care of those boys.

James Petregallo (71:46)

Nope. David survived, has damaged nerves. Has fragments of bullet in his lung and elsewhere in his chest. But he goes on. He ended up Nathaniel. He was left paralyzed from the chest down.

Jimmy Whisman (72:01)

Ah, damn it.

James Petregallo (72:03)

He had years of surgeries and treatments, but it never paralyzed from the chest down. But he clipped his spine, right? But he has use of his arms and apparently full mental faculties and everything like that also. Wow. Yeah, he had difficulty for a while when he was in the hospital. He was able. He recognized his father at first, which was nice. By 2012, one article written about the case. Nathaniel was 24 years old and attending Southern Oregon University.

Jimmy Whisman (72:32)

Holy shit.

James Petregallo (72:33)

So, hey, this kid is tough, man. Nathaniel.

Jimmy Whisman (72:37)

Better than I am. Good for you.

James Petregallo (72:38)

Holy shit, man. Hats off.

Jimmy Whisman (72:40)

Imagine if he had his legs.

James Petregallo (72:41)

This poor. Yeah, he'd be on the track team probably. Yeah, he'd be the quarterback. This poor kid, man, he's. Wow. His father said he's had all these operations, but he still remains paralyzed. David since remarried, works in Grant Pass and lived there for a long time. He said he dealt with a lot of guilt afterwards, which I can't imagine when he.

Jimmy Whisman (73:01)

The survivor's guilt's gotta be crazy.

James Petregallo (73:03)

Poor bastard, man. He said, I had no idea they were planning to execute Lyn, much less why shoot a 2 year old. What mother could do that? I didn't know they had this dark side.

Jimmy Whisman (73:14)

Vile.

James Petregallo (73:15)

According to him, he thought they were just going to kill him. So if he ran away, they might follow him and the threat would leave. So that was what he thought. He didn't know they were there to kill everybody. He said, you might say I was lucky, but I would attribute it to other things. The bullet entered my body. It's still there. He said, if I had only grabbed Nathaniel. He said we had a home life. We like to go camping and do all the things everyone likes to do. A future, more kids. Then this whole thing hit a wall.

Jimmy Whisman (73:41)

If he grabs the kid, though, he might be a step or two closer and she might have hit.

James Petregallo (73:45)

She might have got him again. Might have been too. Or you might have dropped him or who knows? So Michael Halstead ended up dying in his 40s, but we don't know why. Oh, really? Yeah, he wasn't murdered, so that's good. Harry has found some stability. He was charged with theft in 1994, but now he's fine. Apparently, though he's actually spoken publicly and even did the investigation discovery documentary. Twisted Sisters. Really commented on it and yeah, gave a talking head. Leo has had some problems over the years. Is that right? He's incarcerated several times. Shocking. He gave an interview for an episode of Snapped about his case, but then apparently went to jail shortly afterwards, according to this report. We don't know. Allegedly, probably. His brother also referenced his continued struggles. Harry did when he did the interview. Deborah got released from prison pretty promptly. She moved to Portland and got married like it never happened. Sharon incarcerated at the Coffee Creek Correctional Facility in Wilsonville, Oregon. And they have made investigation, discovery, made an episode of Snapped and an episode of Twisted Sisters about this case as well. That everybody is Grants Pass, Oregon. Discuss amongst yourselves because we have to get through this real quick. Thank you for enjoying. Hope you enjoyed that. Thank you for listening. Head over to shut upandgivemerder.com get your tickets for live shows, everybody. Starting out with February 21st in Nashville. Then we go March, March 6th and Durham March 7th. Atlanta, Phoenix, sold out on the 20th. Your stupid opinion still has some tickets for the 21st. Salt Lake City, sold out. Denver has tickets. Buffalo, sold out, sold out, sold out. Royal Oak, Milwaukee, Minneapolis, Dallas, San Jose, Sacramento, Tarrytown, Boston. Get your tickets right now. Shut up and give me murder dot com. Do that. Follow us on social media. Small town murder on Instagram, Smalltown pot on Facebook. Do that for sure. Definitely get patreon. Oh yeah. Patreon.com crimeinsports is where you get all the bonus material. Anybody $5 a month or above, you're gonna get everything. We put out hundreds of back bonus episodes immediately upon subscription. New ones every other week. One crime in sports, one small town murder. You get it all. Get it all this week for crime and sports. Old time weird ads and stuff from newspapers. It's so much fun. Small town murder. DEAN Coral part two. You got 27 bodies out of the ground, a dead murderer, a teenager with a gun in his hand and a connection to John Wayne Gacy. Need we say more? Patreon.com crimeinsports and you get everything. We put out all the shows, all ad free and you get a shout out ad free at the end of the regular show. So do that. Keep coming back and hanging out with us each and every week. If you want to follow us on social media, shutupandgivemerder.com do not shoot any toddlers in the face.

Jimmy Whisman (76:35)

God damn.

James Petregallo (76:36)

Now till next week everybody. It's been our pleasure. Bye. Marketing is hard, but I'll tell you a little secret. It doesn't have to be. Let me point something out. You're listening to a podcast right now and it's great. You love the host. You seek it out and download it. You listen to it while driving, working out, cooking, even going to the bathroom. Podcasts are a pretty close companion. And this is a podcast ad. Did I get your attention? You can reach great listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering host endorsements or run a pre produced ad like this one across thousands of shows. To reach your target audience in their favorite podcasts with Libsyn ads, go to Libsyn ads.com that's L I B S Y N ads.com today.