Wizard of Oz vs Mary Poppins

Summary

Smash Boom Best: Wizard of Oz vs Mary Poppins

Podcast: Smash Boom Best
Host: Molly Bloom (Brains On Universe)
Debaters: Alex Nader (Mary Poppins), Andrew Barbado (The Wizard of Oz)
Judge: Rita from Long Island
Date: January 8, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this colorful and laughter-filled debate episode, Smash Boom Best pits two magical and iconic childhood stories against each other: The Wizard of Oz and Mary Poppins. Each champion gets a passionate debater—Andrew Barbado argues for Oz, while Alex Nader stands up for Poppins—as judge Rita listens, weighs facts, hears both silly and serious rebuttals, and ultimately decides which classic reigns supreme. Expect fun facts, witty jabs, surprising history, and a finale that’s too close to call—until the very last second.

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Main Discussion Points & Insights

Meet the Participants (01:25–05:11)

• Debaters introduced:
  • Alex Nader (Mary Poppins): “Like Mary Poppins, I'm about to be practically perfect in every way.” (02:03)
  • Andrew Barbado (Wizard of Oz): “Strap on your ruby slippers because we're about to follow the yellow brick road straight to the winner's circle.” (02:15)
• Judge Rita:
  • Hobbyist crocheter, chemistry lover, tennis player. Shares a story about seeing a cat with newborn kittens in Turkey.
  • Discusses how good arguments need both “facts and also emotion...the debater really, like, understands their topic 100% and really believes in it.” (04:13)

Round 1: Declaration of Greatness & Rebuttals

Mary Poppins’ Case (05:35–11:22)

• Alex positions Mary Poppins as the ultimate magical nanny—a character teaching joy, imagination, and meaningful lessons to the Banks family.
• Emphasizes Poppins’ literary origins, Disney’s pivotal adaptation, and Julie Andrews’ Oscar-winning, iconic performance.
• Blends of animation/live-action, British and American actors, and an irrepressible sense of whimsy and heart.
• Fun fact: Mary Poppins’ success financed Disney World (“Without Mary Poppins, who knows if we would even have Disney World.” 09:45)
• Elevates “supercalifragilisticexpialidocious” as “objectively the greatest word of all time.”
• Memorable quote: “We all need role models in this world, and truly, Mary Poppins is one of my role models. She shows us the way one spoonful of sugar at a time.” (11:13)

Reactions & Rebuttal (11:22–12:53)

• Judge Rita: “Who wouldn't want to have a magical babysitter? Like, imagine like a woman just flying down from the sky and she just mends your family all back together.” (11:31)
• Andrew’s rebuttal: Acknowledges family focus, but asserts, “Sometimes you don't have the opportunity to get a nanny. You need to go on a magical adventure. And that's what happens in the wizard of Oz.” (11:55)

Wizard of Oz’s Case (14:58–20:31)

• Andrew crafts a rhyming, rapid-fire summary: highlights Dorothy’s journey, moral challenges, and enduring appeal.
• Explores Wizard of Oz’s roots in L. Frank Baum’s books and its “allegory about the politics of the time.”
• Argues Oz’s characters show personal growth: “Dorothy learns she's strong and capable... Scarecrow learns he's smart without a brain… Glinda learns you can't judge a book by its cover. And Elphaba learns that people in power aren't always good.” (17:02)
• Praises wizardry of the film: black and white to Technicolor transition, movie magic still impressive 80+ years later—including live events like screenings at the Las Vegas Sphere.
• Cites enduring musical legacy: “Somewhere Over the Rainbow,” “If I Only Had a Brain,” “They’ll never bring us down.”
• Dismisses Poppins as “a tale about some rich kids with everything they could ever want, getting even more nice things.”
• Memorable quote: “If you want complicated characters, pure movie magic, and a soundtrack that just, you know what it is, it’s gotta be the Wiz.” (20:28)

Reactions & Rebuttal (20:31–21:37)

• Judge Rita: “The beginning song really sold me.” (20:39)
• Alex’s rebuttal: leverages star power—“I would challenge you in the original [Oz] movie to think of another star that came out of it other than Judy Garland. I bet you can't. But Mary Poppins had Dick Van Dyke. The sequel had Lin Manuel Miranda, who I think you personally insulted.” (21:15)

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Microround: Fact-Off (25:36–31:02)

Each debater presents three quick fire fun facts:

Wizard of Oz Facts (Andrew)

• The real ruby slippers from the film were stolen in 2005, recovered by the FBI 13 years later, but with no arrests made. “The theft could make its own hit movie.” (25:56)
• Actor originally cast as Tin Man was replaced due to illness caused by makeup. “The drama of this can only match the drama of the best movie of its time.” (27:11)
• Toto the dog (real name Terry), starred in 16 films; Judy Garland wanted to adopt him but was turned down. (“Judy Garland desperately wanted to adopt this dog...she's going to star in about 10 more films.” 28:41)

Mary Poppins Facts (Alex)

• Inspiration for “A Spoonful of Sugar” came from giving the polio vaccine to children on sugar cubes—a real public health win. (26:35)
• Julie Andrews only got the role of Mary Poppins after being passed over for My Fair Lady. Her heartbreak led to an Oscar-winning breakout instead. “What’s meant for you is meant for you.” (27:47)
• Dick Van Dyke’s famously “worst accent on record of any American playing an Englishman,” but he remains iconic. (“Now if you ask any English actor, they will say Dick Van Dyke had the worst accent on record.” 30:08)

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Sneak Attack: Fantastical Fitness (32:09–35:30)

Debaters improvise as characters from their chosen stories, leading a themed fitness class.

• Alex (as Mrs. Banks, Mary Poppins):
  • Advocates for exercise and women’s suffrage:
    • “Throw your hands in the air, fists up, like a cheerleader, and I want you to say, women should have the right to vote!” (32:54)
    • “Kick one leg out... Absolutely everyone should have the right to vote!” (33:13)
• Andrew (as the Mayor of Munchkin City, Wizard of Oz):
  • Cheerily leads group to do cleanup exercises and campaign for office:
    • “As mayor...stretch up to the sky and say, vote for me in the next election!” (33:43)
    • “Take some of that wood [house debris] and remove it from the center of Munchkinland... Not only have we gotten fit today but we've beautified our land.” (34:28)

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Final Six (35:32–36:22)

Each side sums up their entire case in exactly six words.

• Wizard of Oz (Andrew):
  • “Somewhere over the rainbow. Transform.” (35:58)
• Mary Poppins (Alex):
  • “A bag. Feed the birds.” (36:07)
  • Alex quips, “There you have to think about it. But when you really think it's gonna get you, you know what I mean?” (36:15)

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Decision and Closing (36:24–39:40)

• Winner Announcement:
  • Rita crowns The Wizard of Oz the winner, but says “It was a tie until the final six.” (36:49–37:04)
• Gracious Exit:
  • Andrew praises Alex’s skills: “To know that Mary Poppins...was neck and neck speaks to the power of my friend Alex... I would love to do a rematch of any topic!” (37:10–37:38)
  • Alex: “I will have nightmares about my last six words for a really long time.” (37:38)
• Shoutouts:
  • Alex: “I would love to give a shout out to Mary Poppins. Girl, I love you.” (38:33)
  • Andrew: “This is going all the way to Turkey. A single mom who works two jobs, who loves her cats and never stops. The single mom cat.” (38:40)
  • Rita thanks the team and her family. (38:54)

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Notable Quotes & Moments by Timestamp

• “I never explain anything.” – Alex as Mary Poppins, perfectly channeling the character (07:46)
• “Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious is the exact feeling of hanging out with your favorite babysitter.” – Alex (10:19)
• “Dorothy learns she's strong and capable...people in power aren't always good.” – Andrew on character growth (17:02)
• “Like a rainbow exploded in my eyeballs.” – Andrew on the Technicolor switch in Oz (18:10)
• “Feed the birds. Tupin Sabag.” – Alex closes with classic quirky Poppins sign-off (39:37)
• “There's no place like winning.” – Andrew celebrates the Oz victory (36:52)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Debater & Judge Intros: 01:21–05:11
• Mary Poppins’ Opening Case: 05:35–11:22
• Oz’s Opening Rebuttal: 11:43–12:53
• Wizard of Oz’s Opening Case: 14:58–20:31
• Poppins’ Rebuttal: 21:02–21:37
• Micro Round (Fact-Off): 25:36–31:02
• Sneak Attack (Fitness): 32:09–35:30
• Final Six Words: 35:32–36:22
• The Verdict: 36:24–39:40
• Memorable Quotes & Wrap-Up: 37:10–end

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Tone & Style

The episode is bursting with friendly rivalry, playful banter, and creative improvisation. Both debaters blend solid facts and pop culture references with humor and warmth, keeping things accessible and fun for kids and families—while judge Rita offers thoughtful, spirited, and genuine feedback throughout.

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Summary for New Listeners

If you missed this episode, you can expect a rollercoaster of magical arguments, engaging personality-driven facts, and a finale that comes down to just six words. Whether you prefer your stories with dancing chimney sweeps or flying monkeys, you’ll leave this episode with a newfound appreciation for both Mary Poppins and The Wizard of Oz—and probably a song or two stuck in your head.

Transcript

[Narrator]

Hey, grownups. We're taking a moment out here to share a great podcast from bestselling author and PBS host Kelly Corrigan. We think you'll love. It's called Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Kelly Corrigan Wonders is built around thoughtful, in depth conversations with people whose lives reflect curiosity, creativity and humility. For the past five years, Kelly Corrigan has been sitting down with big thinkers and doers, and she has some great guests coming up, including NBA coach Steve Kerr r writer George Saunders and father Greg Boyle. Each episode is both inspiring and practical, offering ideas and perspectives that feel especially useful as we look ahead to a new year. These conversations explore how people think, how they make meaning, and how they approach life with intention. The show is sponsored by the John Templeton Foundation. Kelly Corgan Wonders has more than 20 million downloads and thousands of five star reviews. With past guests ranging from Melinda Gates to Judd Apatow to Bono, Bryan Stevenson and Jennifer Garner. You can listen to Kelly Horrigan Wonders in your favorite podcast app now.

[Molly Bloom]

Lemonade.

[Alex Nader]

Brains on Universe from the brains behind Brains on, it's Smash Boom Best, the.

[Rita]

Show for people with big opinions.

[Molly Bloom]

Hi, I'm Molly Bloom, and this is Smash Boom Best, the show where we take two things, smash them together, and ask you to decide which one is best. Today, we're pitting two beloved and cherished childhood stories against each other. One travels along a yellow brick road, the other floats in with her magical umbrella. It's wizard of Oz vs. Mary Poppins. There will be wonder, there will be whimsy, and there will only be one winner. Let's meet our debaters first. She's supercalifragilisticexpialidocious and more than a little precocious. Its sing actor and story pirate Alex Nader.

[Alex Nader]

Like Mary Poppins, I'm about to be practically perfect in every way.

[Molly Bloom]

Ooh. Next, he's a comedian, singer, actor and writer. It's the great and powerful Andrew Barbado.

[Andrew Barbado]

Strap on your ruby slippers because we're about to follow the yellow brick road straight to the winner's circle.

[Molly Bloom]

And here to oversee this fantastical face off is our judge, Rita from Long Island. Rita plays tennis, she loves chemistry, she likes to crochet, and she recently went to Turkey and saw a cat have three babies. Hi, Rita.

[Rita]

Hi.

[Molly Bloom]

So how did you end up seeing a cat have babies while you were traveling?

[Rita]

So when we went to Turkey, I had a hotel room and it had a backyard and it was just a single mom cat. And she would live there with her three babies and she would feed Them and we would see them every morning.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, that's like a real bonus in a hotel room.

[Rita]

I think it was so cute. I would like pet them all the time and their faces were so small.

[Molly Bloom]

So you like to crochet, which is very cool. I like to knit. They're different though. I think crochet is harder. So what do you like to make?

[Rita]

I usually make, like, clothing or bags for like my cousins and my siblings for birthday presents.

[Molly Bloom]

That's so cool. So what kind of clothing do you make?

[Rita]

Shirts that have like little holes in it. I think they're like fishnet looking ones and I think they're like they were trending last year. Last year or something. So I made that for my sister and for my little cousins. I would make them like dolls and plushies too.

[Molly Bloom]

So what is it about chemistry that fascinates you?

[Rita]

Just like how it's the building block of like, life and it can be found in anything you do. Like we're made up of chemistry and I think that's pretty cool.

[Molly Bloom]

That is pretty cool. Do you want to do something with chemistry, like when you're a grown up?

[Rita]

Yes, I do want to do something in the medical field, so I think that'll help me.

[Molly Bloom]

Very cool. So you love talking smash moon best debates with your family. I know. So what do you think makes a good argument?

[Rita]

I think a good argument has, like, facts and also emotion in it. So the debater really, like, understands their topic 100% and really believes in it.

[Molly Bloom]

Will Rita choose Alex and Mary Poppins or Andrew and the wizard of Oz? Let's get to it. But first, here are the rules. Every debate consists of four. The declaration of greatness, the micro round, the sneak attack, and the final six. After each round, our judge Riedel will award points to the team that impresses her the most. But she'll keep her decisions top secret until the end of the debate. Listeners, we want you to judge too. Mark down your points as you listen. At the end of the show, head to our website, smashboom.org and vote for whichever team you think. One. Okay. Andrew, Alex, and Rita, are you ready?

[Rita]

Yep.

[Andrew Barbado]

Oh, yes, I'm ready. Like the Tin man after a full can of oil.

[Alex Nader]

Ready, ready, ready.

[Molly Bloom]

Then it's time for the declaration of greatness. In this round, our debaters will present a well crafted immersive argument in favor of their side. Then they'll each have 30 seconds to rebut their opponent's statements. We've hooked a coin and Alex, yo up first. Time to Pop off for Mary Poppins.

[Alex Nader]

Have you ever had a really awesome babysitter? Maybe they were your cool neighbor who taught you how to make pancakes. Or an older cousin who picked you up from school. Or even a big sibling who showed you music that absolutely blew your ear holes. You know, in a good way. In a good way.

[Molly Bloom]

What are you listening to? This.

[Andrew Barbado]

Only the sickest band of all time. Elbow cheese.

[Alex Nader]

Turn it up. As a kid, an awesome babysitter can open up your world. They can make you feel seen and teach you lessons you didn't even realize you needed. They can change your life. And that is exactly what Mary Poppins does. Technically speaking, Mary Poppins isn't a babysitter, but a magical nanny extraordinaire. But please, let's not split hairs. She floats in with the wind, umbrella in hand, swooping in to bring families together with a level mix of traditional manners and whimsical flair. In the movie, Mary Poppins takes care of the Banks children, teaching them the joy of using their imaginations. And she also helps remind the always busy Banks dad about the importance of family. In fact, everything about Mary Poppins puts families at the center. Poppins started as a book series created by the author P.L. travers. Now that was back in 1934. Travers based Poppins after her own great aunt, who balanced a certain firmness with a heart of gold. Travers series went on to catch the attention of another family, the Disney family. You see, Mary Poppins was Walt Disney's daughter's favorite series, and he promised her that one day he would turn it into a movie. In 1964, Walt fulfilled that promise.

[Andrew Barbado]

Choosing a nanny for the children is an important and delicate task. It requires insight, balanced judgment, and an ability to read character.

[Alex Nader]

First of all, I would like to make one thing quite clear.

[Molly Bloom]

Yes.

[Alex Nader]

I never explain anything.

[Andrew Barbado]

Mary Poppins, you look beautiful.

[Rita]

We better keep an eye on this one.

[Alex Nader]

She's tricky. As I expected. Mary Poppins, practically perfect in every way. Just like how Mary Poppins, the character, seamlessly blends two seemingly opposing things. The prim and proper sensibility with the over the top imagination. The film does exactly the same. It's a cinematic musical masterpiece that blends live action with animation. The story combines unwavering silliness with a serious dose of morals and heart. We even get a mix of actual British actors and American actors with the most atrocious Cockney accents of all time.

[Andrew Barbado]

When you're with Mary Poppins, suddenly you're in places you've never dreamed of. And quick as you can say Bob Drunkle. The most unusual things begin to happen.

[Alex Nader]

And of course, you have international treasure Julie Andrews, who got rave reviews as Mary Poppins herself. Just a spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down in a most delightful way. Did you know that Mary Poppins was actually Julie Andrews first film? You wouldn't know it, because much like Mary Poppins, Julie Andrews is practically perfect in every way. And she even won an Oscar for Best Actress for her first film ever.

[Andrew Barbado]

Julie Andrews and Mary Poppins.

[Alex Nader]

Mary Poppins was nominated for a whopping 13 Academy Awards, taking home five. Oh, what's that?

[Molly Bloom]

A little birdie just told me that the wizard of Oz only got five nominations and three wins, but who's counting?

[Alex Nader]

Mary Poppins wasn't just a critical success, but a blockbuster hit. It was the highest grossing film of the year and the highest grossing film of Disney's to date. It made so much money that Walt Disney was able to buy a piece of land in Florida for his next big project. I wonder if you can guess what that project was. That's right. Disney World. You heard me right, little birdie. I said Disney World. Without Mary Poppins, who knows if we would even have Disney World. No Julie Andrews movies? Maybe no Epcot. No Princess Diaries. No Sound of Music. That's so not supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, which, if you didn't know, is a very important word in the movie. Speaking of supercalifragilisticexpialidocious, that is objectively the greatest word of all time. Saying it feels like blowing bubbles or skipping down the sidewalk. You can't help but smile while you're doing it. Supercalifragilisticexpialidocious is the exact feeling of hanging out with your favorite babysitter. There's an easy, natural joy that you just want to sit with forever. We all need role models in this world, and truly, Mary Poppins is one of my role models. She shows us the way one spoonful of sugar at a time.

[Molly Bloom]

Wow. A heartfelt declaration of greatness there for Mary Poppins. Rita, what stood out to you about Alex's argument?

[Rita]

I just want to say, like, who wouldn't want to have a magical babysitter? Like, imagine like a woman just flying down from the sky and she just mends your family all back together.

[Molly Bloom]

It does sound very magical. Andrew, it is time for your rebuttal. You have 30 seconds to drop a house on Alex's arguments, and your time starts now.

[Andrew Barbado]

Okay, first of all, incredible work there. I did love that Alex and You know that I myself has have been a magical nanny extraordinaire and I respect that you mentioned that family is at the center of this story. I love that. But sometimes you're a single mom cat raising three nameless kittens with tiny faces in Turkey. Sometimes you don't have the opportunity to get a nanny. You need to go on a magical adventure. And that's what happens in the wizard of Oz. Who was that bird that popped in and read me for Phil saying the wizard of Oz didn't win nomination?

[Alex Nader]

Okay, let me tell you, it's not as if these banks children don't go on adventures of their own. In fact, I remember a very specific scene where they go into a chalk painting and then sort of come out the other end and there's animated characters all around them. I'm thinking kids and can have wonderful adventures. It's okay if they're just adult supervised. Andrew, what are you trying to say?

[Andrew Barbado]

No, I'm saying it's more fun when you go down the yellow brick road just sort of as a preteen and discover yourself without your family involved.

[Molly Bloom]

Okay, Rita, we have a lot to ponder. We're gonna take a beat and we'll be right back after this. Today's episode is sponsored by Bombas. Okay, this is the time of year where people keep asking about your 2026 resolutions. I've got a bunch. I'd like to be more patient. I want to eat more fiber. But let's be honest, at the top of my list this year is to get comfy. And that's where Bombas comes in. They're bringing serious comfort to all my everyday go tos. My family has been a Bombas family for years. And the all new Bombas sports socks are engineered with sport specific comfort for running, golfing, hik hiking, skiing, snowboarding and you know, just walking around the neighborhood. This year I'm going to take my dog on longer walks and these socks are perfect for it. They're cushioned where I need it most, sweat wicking and loaded with other tech features to keep me comfy and locked in. And for my resolution to hang out at home and read more books. Well, Bombas has me covered with the comfiest footwear imaginable. There's the luxurious Sherpa Sunday slippers that feel like walking on clouds. The perfect cozy slipper to keep my feet warm while I cuddle up with a good book. Head over to bombas.com family26 and use code family26 for 20% off your first purchase. That's B O-M-B-A-S.com family26 code. Family26 at checkout.

[Narrator]

Best.

[Molly Bloom]

Smash. Smash. Boom.

[Andrew Barbado]

Best.

[Molly Bloom]

All right, back to the debate. Andrew, it's your turn to tell us why the wizard of Oz will always be pop u ler.

[Andrew Barbado]

Nice and go. Okay, I've printed out all 432 pages of my case for the wizard of Oz. Now, there will be an intermission after the first hour of arguments. So.

[Molly Bloom]

What's that?

[Andrew Barbado]

I have less than five minutes. Are you kidding?

[Narrator]

Okay.

[Andrew Barbado]

Okay, Andrew, speed arguments. I've come to tell you all about the glory of this righteous tale. It starts in Kansas. Things are drab. It's sort of like some undressed kale. We zoom in on our heroine. A gingham dress. It's Dorothy Gale. She's whisked away, crushes a witch and somehow doesn't go to jail.

[Molly Bloom]

Hmm.

[Andrew Barbado]

She skips us down a yellow way. Meets a fellow made of hay. A metal dude. A lion may kill another witch who's green. And everybody says hooray. And again, she is not even arrested for it. Laws are like very lax in the land of Oz. Dorothy Leaf seems like the end. They made a sequel. Back again. The magic never starts to fizz. Cause Michael Jackson makes the wiz. Later, someone writes a book. It gives us all a better look at the witch we all mistook as an evil wicked crook. People love that story, so it gets many, many fans made into a musical with catchy songs and lots of dance. Hollywood. It loves a tale that comes from old familiar brands. So they make a two part film starring Ariana Grand a. It all started as a book series. Written in the early 1900s by Frank L. Baum. The Wonderful wizard of Oz was both a fairy tale and an allegory about the politics of along the way, it introduced us to some of the most interesting characters in fiction, like Dorothy, Scarecrow, Glinda and Elphaba. Part of what makes them stand out is that they grow. Dorothy learns she's strong and capable. Scarecrow learns he's smart without a brain. In Wicked. Glinda learns you can't judge a book by its cover. And Elphaba learns that people in power aren't always good. Meanwhile, what do the kids in Mary Poppins learn, huh? That fun is nice. Sugar makes things taste better. Quality child care is really important. Not exactly deep. My second point. The wizard of Oz is better. Movie magic. In the original 1939 film, the first scenes are all in black and white. See that was normal back then. So people were blown away when Dorothy lands in Oz and everything is suddenly in color.

[Alex Nader]

Toto, have a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.

[Andrew Barbado]

Oh, come on.

[Molly Bloom]

What?

[Andrew Barbado]

Like a rainbow exploded in my eyeballs. You also had elaborate sets, flying monkeys, skywriting. It's such a spectacle that in the summer of 2025, the movie began playing again at the Sphere in Las Vegas, which is a giant dome where the screen wraps around you over a 80 years. 80 years since its release and it's still wowing crowds.

[Alex Nader]

Toto, I have a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore.

[Andrew Barbado]

Full color. Yes, it's still like a rainbow exploded in my eyeballs. If that was all to Oz, it would be enough. But it's not. You have the 1970s take the Wiz, the creepy 1980s sequel return to Oz, who gives me chills just thinking about it, and of course, wicked parts one and two. Meanwhile, did you already forget there was a Mary Poppins sequel? Because I did. Lastly, we need to talk about the.

[Alex Nader]

Song Somewhere over the Rainbow.

[Andrew Barbado]

Stone Cold classic, or how about and my head I'd be scratching while my thoughts were busy hatching. If I only had a brain. I sing that daily while trying to solve my wordle or this.

[Alex Nader]

They'll never bring us down.

[Andrew Barbado]

I'm sorry. That gets me every single time. So if you want a tale about some rich kids with everything they could ever want, getting even more nice things, pick Poppins. But if you want complicated characters, pure movie magic, and a soundtrack that just, you know what it is, it's gotta be the Wiz.

[Molly Bloom]

A soaring and singing declaration of greatness there. Rita, what did you think of Andrew's argument? Anything surprise you or stand out?

[Rita]

I think he's absolutely right about, like, the sequels and how many different, like, musicals and variations there are. But the beginning song really sold me.

[Molly Bloom]

Very impressive. All right, Alex, it is time for your rebuttal. You've got 3:30 seconds to destroy Andrew's arguments with a Spoonful of sugar. Your time starts now.

[Alex Nader]

I also really loved that opening song. It was a great way to center Andrew in the argument. Unlike Mary Poppins, who really centers the kids. You know, Mary Poppins is a selfless character. That's why we absolutely love her. And I would challenge you in the original movie to think of another star that came out of it other than Judy Garland. I bet you can't. But Mary Poppins had Dick Van Dyke. The sequel had Lin Manuel Miranda, who I think you personally insulted. And.

[Andrew Barbado]

I think you personally insulted me, Alex. I Mean, the whole. Maybe the first 15 seconds of your rebuttal was just focused on me as a person. First of all, you're getting down in the muck. You're getting dirty. You're slinging mud in this debate already, Alex, and I don't think Mary Poppins would like that. Maybe you should take a trip down the yellow brick and learn something.

[Molly Bloom]

Rita, it is time to award some points. Please give one point to the declaration of greatness that you liked best and one point to the rebuttal that won you over. You get to decide what makes a winning argument. Did one team's jokes make you giggle? Was another team's logic impeccable? Award your points, but don't tell us who they're going to. Have you made your decision?

[Rita]

Yep.

[Molly Bloom]

Excellent. Andrew and Alex, how are you two feeling so far?

[Andrew Barbado]

I'm feeling full of brains, full of heart and full of courage.

[Alex Nader]

Oh, I honestly am having so much fun. I really feel like I am on a carousel of joy, seeing a lot of, like, wonderful horses going up and down because I'm, you know, really with the people that I love.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, that's so sweet. All right, it's time for a quick break. Feed your flying monkeys or sweep your chimney.

[Rita]

And we'll be right back with more smash. Boom. Best.

[Alex Nader]

You're listening to State of Debate, home to rage and rhetoric and awe inspiring argumentation.

[Molly Bloom]

Hello, you logic loving lovelies. It's me, all star debate champ, Taylor Lincoln, here with everyone's favorite debate duderino, Todd Douglas.

[Andrew Barbado]

Hello, friends. And boy, oh boy, do we have a doozy of a debate to play for you today.

[Molly Bloom]

That's right. And this one is chock full of logical fallacies.

[Alex Nader]

Those are bad arguments that make it easy for your opponent to poke holes in what you're saying.

[Molly Bloom]

And these two have fallen into the same trap. They're using the appeal to ignorance fallacy. That's when you say something must be true because there's no evidence showing otherwise. Let's take a listen.

[Alex Nader]

Admit it, Maggie.

[Molly Bloom]

Admit what, Maxine?

[Alex Nader]

The cookies. They're gone. So? So you stole them. You stole the cookies from the cookie jar.

[Molly Bloom]

Who, me? Yes, you. Couldn't be.

[Alex Nader]

Then who? What?

[Molly Bloom]

I don't know. Maybe it was you. Me? Do you have any proof I did it? No, but do you have any proof you didn't do it? Well, no, but do you have any proof you didn't do it? Well, no, but do you have any proof you didn't know that you didn't do it?

[Alex Nader]

Well, no, but do you have any proof? You didn't know that I didn't know that you didn't do it?

[Molly Bloom]

Well, no.

[Alex Nader]

So it must be you.

[Molly Bloom]

Wow.

[Andrew Barbado]

Not only are they all out of cookies, they're all out of logic too.

[Molly Bloom]

Talk about adding insult to injury, right? Mmm.

[Andrew Barbado]

Chocolate chip.

[Molly Bloom]

Todd, did you take the cookies?

[Andrew Barbado]

What? Of course not.

[Molly Bloom]

You have crumbs all over your shirt.

[Andrew Barbado]

Well, that's all the time we have for today. We'll see you next time on State of Debate. Smash.

[Rita]

Boom.

[Andrew Barbado]

Best.

[Molly Bloom]

You're listening to smashboom Best. I'm your host, Molly Bloom.

[Rita]

And I'm your Judge Rita.

[Molly Bloom]

And we love getting debate suggestions from our listeners, like this one from listener Journey.

[Rita]

Hi, my name is Journey. I'm from Burleson, Texas. And my debate idea is Detectives versus Spies. Ooh, a super sleuthy and sneaky smackdown. I love it.

[Molly Bloom]

We'll check back in at the end of this episode to see which side Journey thinks should win.

[Rita]

And now it's back to our debate. Wizard of Oz versus Mary Poppins.

[Molly Bloom]

That's right. And it's time for round two, the micro round. It's time for a fact off. Andrew and Alex will each get three chances to make a micro argument backed by a cool fact or idea. Alex went first last time. So Andrew, please start us off with your first fact.

[Andrew Barbado]

All right, so not only a great movie, but a great mystery. One pair of ruby slippers was stolen from a museum in Minnesota in 2005. Okay. After 13 years, the shoes were recovered by the FBI. But to this day, there has been no arrests and officers are still trying to find information about the great ruby slipper heist. Honestly, the theft that could make its own hit movie. If anyone, anyone has information regarding this theft, please reach out directly to me. Andrew Barbado.

[Alex Nader]

Rita, I remember you said that maybe you one day wanna be in the medical field. Well, the song Spoonful of Sugar was actually inspired by a public health win. One of the song's writer's children got the polio vaccine at school, and it was an oral vaccine and they had to put it into a sugar cube in order for them to take it. So that was actually the inspiration around the song Spoonful of Sugar. And nowadays kids have sweeteners with their medicine all the time. So that was actually inspir inspired by Mary Pete.

[Rita]

Oh, that's so cool. I did not know that.

[Andrew Barbado]

That is really cool. Yeah, there was a lot of medical tie ins to the wizard of Oz that we're not really talking about as well. Kind of on the Negative side, and this isn't even in my notes, but the actor. I just know this off the top of my head. The actor who was originally supposed to play the Tin man had to get replaced because the makeup that they used on him made him extremely sick and they had to stop filming. The drama of this can only match the drama of the best movie of its time, the wizard of Oz.

[Alex Nader]

That's so interesting, Andrew, because I have. My next fact is actually, like about actor drama. Julie Andrews, who played Mary Poppins, was actually at the same time passed over for the lead role in the movie My Fair lady, which I'm sure you remember, Andrew, and some of us know this, but. But My Fair lady was a musical turned into a movie, and Julie Andrews actually originated the part on Broadway, the leading part, and was heartbroken when they passed on her for the then Audrey Hepburn that played it in the film. But if that hadn't have happened, Julie Andrews would have never gotten the opportunity to play Mary Poppins and go on to win an Oscar for the role. So it's just an amazing lesson on what's coming your way is coming your way.

[Andrew Barbado]

What's meant for you is meant for you. Yes, I completely agree with that. That is very cool. And Alex, I remember earlier you said something like, there were no stars to come out of the wizard of Oz. You kind of backhanded and rudely said that to me, if I remember correctly. But guess what, hon? The movie was full of stars, including Toto. The terrier was named Terry. And Terry was a veteran dog actor by the time she filmed Oz. Okay. She even starred alongside Shirley Temple. By the end of Terry's career, Terry had been in 16 films. And guess what? Judy Garland desperately wanted to adopt this dog. But they were like, no, you can't do it. This dog is like a big moneymaker. She's going to star in about 10 more films. I wish that she was able to adopt that dog.

[Molly Bloom]

Terry and Judy.

[Andrew Barbado]

Oh, Terry and Judy.

[Rita]

There's so much drama. I'm so, like, confused on what to pick. I don't know.

[Alex Nader]

I have so many facts prepared. But what I really want to talk about is the other iconic thing to come out of Mary Poppins, and that was Dick Van Dyke's accent. So Dick Van Dyke is an American actor, honestly, an icon in so many spaces, and actually just celebrated his hundredth birthday.

[Molly Bloom]

Wow.

[Alex Nader]

Shout out Dick Van Dyke.

[Andrew Barbado]

Truly.

[Alex Nader]

And he took on a cockney accent at the time, which actually was sort of like My Fair Lady's accent. When you find that character. And Dick Van Dyke at the time was critically acclaimed for the part. And now if you ask any English actor, they will say Dick Van Dyke had the worst accent on record of any American playing an Englishman.

[Rita]

That is a crazy fact.

[Molly Bloom]

Infamy. Okay, Rita, this is tough. You just learned a lot of great facts. They were pretty juicy, honestly, but only one of them can get a point. Have you made your decision?

[Rita]

Yes. It was very hard.

[Molly Bloom]

Perfect. All right, keep it a secret. We'll be right back. Want smashboom without the ad breaks? Join Smarty Pass and get an ad free feed of this and all the other brains on Universe shows. Plus hangs with me and the crew and discounts on merch. Sign [e-mail] thanks.

[Andrew Barbado]

Boom. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

[Narrator]

Smash.

[Molly Bloom]

Boom.

[Andrew Barbado]

Best.

[Molly Bloom]

We're back and the debate must go on. Time now for a surprise. It's the sneak attack. This is our improvised round where debaters have to respond to a challenge on the spot. Today's sneak attack is called Fantastical Fitness. Pick a character from your side and pretend you are them leading a fitness class. What activities do you want us to do? Are there special exercises make us stretch, fly, lift umbrellas or broomsticks? Whatever it is, it's up to you. Does this make sense?

[Andrew Barbado]

Yes. I love that.

[Molly Bloom]

Yes. Great. So, Alex, you're up first. When you're Chim Chima ready, please tell us the character that you'll be embodying and do your fitness routine, please.

[Alex Nader]

I'm so excited to be here today. I am Mrs. Banks. Yes. You don't hear about me very much. You see, I am actually out most days fighting for the women vote. That's right. That's what I do during this movie. I am a mother who's out there with my sash fighting for the women's right to vote at this time. I think that's what I'm doing. So here's what I want you to do, my friends. I want you to throw your hands in the air, fists up, like a cheerleader, and I want you to say, women should have the right to vote.

[Andrew Barbado]

Women should have the right to vote.

[Alex Nader]

Women should have the right to vote. Thank you so much, dearies. And now I want you to kick one leg out to the side and kick one leg out to the other side and say, absolutely everyone should have the right to vote.

[Andrew Barbado]

Absolutely everyone should have the right to vote.

[Molly Bloom]

Absolutely everyone should have the right to vote.

[Alex Nader]

Oh, thank you so much, dearies. I am going to go to my women's meeting now because that's what I think I do during the day as Mrs. Banks.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, wow. I worked up a sweat and I was fighting for rights for everyone. That's very satisfying. Okay, Andrew, it is your turn. Please tell us your character and show us their wonderful work out of Oz.

[Andrew Barbado]

All right. I think what's coming to me right now is that I. I would like to attend a workout class given by the mayor of Munchkin City. I love that man. So you walk in. Here we go. As the mayor of the Munchkin City in the county of the land of Oz, my constituents have told me we need to get fit here in Oz. There's a lot of fun here and a lot of beautiful outfits, but we need to put health first. So what I want everybody to do is stretch up to the sky and say, vote for me in the next election. Yes, that's right. That's right. Now, my friends, I know we've had a hard time with a big house falling in the middle of this, but I want everybody to take some of that wood and remove it from the center of Munchkinland. I know it seems like I'm just putting you all to work, but somebody's gotta do it. So I want us to happily march. We're marching as mayor of the Munchkin City. I'm telling you to lift it up and clear it. This looks amazing. Not only have we gotten fit today, but we've beautified our land. I want to thank you. And I'm gonna go back into my home. You're not gonna see me for a long time, but vote for me next election in Munchkin Land. Goodbye.

[Molly Bloom]

A multi purpose workout there.

[Alex Nader]

Yes.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, wow. I think I pulled something, but it was fun. All right, Rita, please think about which side's workout you liked best. Was one a real sweat fest? Did one make you giggle? Did one amaze you? Have you awarded your fourth point?

[Rita]

Yes.

[Molly Bloom]

Perfect. Then it's time for the the final six. In this round, each team will have just six words to sum up the glory of their side. A small but mighty argument. Andrew, let's hear your six words for all things Oz.

[Andrew Barbado]

Okay, let's do this. We're gonna say somewhere over the rainbow.

[Molly Bloom]

Go.

[Andrew Barbado]

Transform.

[Molly Bloom]

All right, Alex, it's your turn to sweep us off our feet for Mary Poppins Poppins.

[Alex Nader]

A bag. Feed the birds.

[Molly Bloom]

A real thinker. A real thinker.

[Alex Nader]

There you have to think about it. But when you really think it's gonna get you, you know what I mean?

[Molly Bloom]

It's gonna sneak up on you thinking really hard.

[Rita]

Thinking really hard, Rita, on what I said.

[Molly Bloom]

Rita, it is time to make your decision. Please award your final point for. Tally up those points. Are you ready to crown one team, the Smashboom Best?

[Rita]

Yes.

[Molly Bloom]

All right, drum roll, please. And the winner is.

[Rita]

The wizard of Oz.

[Andrew Barbado]

There's no place like winning. There's no place like winning. There's no place like winning.

[Molly Bloom]

So, Rita, was there a moment that decided it for you?

[Rita]

It was a tie until the final six.

[Molly Bloom]

Oh, so close.

[Andrew Barbado]

Alex, I love. Okay, okay. I love to know this. Alex.

[Alex Nader]

Oh, my gosh.

[Andrew Barbado]

Knowing that it was. I will say this. I will say this. I felt like wizard of Oz, just by the nature of how much it is in the zeitgeist right now does have a bit of an edge. So to know that Mary Poppins was. We were neck and neck speaks to the power of my friend Alex. I think Alex, I'm going to say this to. I would love to do a rematch of any topic with Alex again on Smashboom Best. Nothing is as fun as debating with that person.

[Alex Nader]

I just have to say thank you so much for telling us how the points really shook out. I. I will have nightmares about my last six words for a really long time.

[Molly Bloom]

You know, you're gonna have a rematch. You and Andrew are really good friends in real life, so I'm sure you'll have plenty of opportunity to continue this debate.

[Rita]

She was just feeding the birds.

[Molly Bloom]

Well, that is it for today's debate battle. Rita crowned wizard of Oz the Smashboom best. But what about you?

[Rita]

Head to smashboom.org and vote to tell us who you think won.

[Molly Bloom]

This episode was produced by me, Molly Blume, Mark Sanchez, and Sandon Totten. It was sound designed by Mark Sanchez, and he also wrote our theme song. We had engineering help from James Calandrino. Our announcer is Marley foyer worker. And we want to give a special thanks to Austin Cross and Taylor Kaufman. Alex, is there anyone you'd like to give a shout out to today?

[Alex Nader]

I would love to give a shout out to Mary Poppins. Girl, I love you.

[Molly Bloom]

How about you, Andrew? Any special shout outs?

[Andrew Barbado]

Absolutely. And this is going all the way to Turkey. A single mom who works two jobs, who loves her cats and never stops. The single mom cat.

[Rita]

I love that. I love that.

[Molly Bloom]

And Rita, do you want to give any special things or shout outs?

[Rita]

I want to thank you guys for letting me come on here and shout out to my siblings and my cousins and my parents.

[Molly Bloom]

Before we go, let's check in and see who journey thinks should win the debate between spies and detectives.

[Rita]

I think spies would win because they use more technology and are more modern, while detectives are old school.

[Molly Bloom]

If you are between the ages of 13 and 18 and you'd like to be a judge, or if you're any age and you have an idea for a knockdown drag out debate, head to smashboom.org contact and drop us a line. And if you're a fan of the show and want to keep it going, head to smartypast.org to subscribe. We'll be back next week with a new smashboom Best episode, Spaghetti versus Ravioli. Bye.

[Rita]

See ya.

[Alex Nader]

The Birds, Tupin Sabag.

[Narrator]

Bye.

[Andrew Barbado]

There's no place like home.

[Rita]

Goodbye.

[Molly Bloom]

Better than the rest it match the weather.

[Alex Nader]

For safety. Let's get you saying Mary Poppins, you know, just in case, you know.