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- [00:00]
Farnoosh Tarabi
My dad works in B2B marketing. He came by my school for career Day and said he was a big roas man. Then he told everyone how much he loved calculating his return on ad spend. My friends still laugh at me to this day.
- [00:14]
Irene
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- [00:30]
Farnoosh Tarabi
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- [00:48]
Irene
And the more gifts I give, the.
- [00:49]
Farnoosh Tarabi
More perks and rewards I earn. To learn more and take your gift giving to the next level, visit 1-800-flowers.com acast. Then that's 1-800-flowers.
- [00:59]
Irene
Com acast. So many episodes. 1785 ask Farnoosh. You're listening to so Money with award winning money guru Farnoosh Khourabi. Each day get a 30 minute dose of financial inspiration from the world's top business minds, authors, influencers and from Farnoosh herself. Looking for ways to save on gas or double your double coupons. Sorry, you're in the wrong place. Seeking profound ways to live a richer, happier life. Welcome to SEW Money. Welcome to SEW Money everybody. I'm Farnoosh Tarabi. This week we have something very special. We have a listener from our audience who has been very dedicated to the show, listening for the past seven, eight years and in that time frame has really turned around her financial life. We'll hear how she's managed to triple her income, pay off $100,000 worth of student loan debt and grow her retirement to over $400,000. And she's just 37. This week I went back to my roots in New York City and I stopped by New York One News, where I was a producer in my early 20s. New York One is sort of like the CNN for New York City. It's a 24 hour cable news channel that covers all the different goings on in the city. The politics, the economy, the culture, the arts. I ran the business news desk and it was 21 years ago this month that I started that job. I was there for two and a half years. I learned about leadership, I about failure, and I Wrote about it, actually. I was so kind of moved, I got to see my old desk and a lot of memories flooded my mind. But if I could go back in time and talk to my 20, I don't know, was I 23, 24 year old self, I'd say Farnooch, four things you need to stop doing right now. One is you gotta stop internalizing every damn problem. I thought I was the problem with every mistake, with every. And I made a lot of mistakes with every battle. Sometimes the system is broken. And I think when you're a younger person within an organization, you think that everyone else knows what they're doing, the system is perfect, and that if you're messing up, you're the one who needs to really figure things out. And yeah, of course I needed to figure out a lot of things. I had a huge learning curve. I owned my mistakes. But I think there were often times when I was set up to fail because there wasn't a support system. There weren't people that were open to answering my questions. People were not patient. With the new hire, there was a lot of dysfunction as well. Not stuff that I was really able to change or manage or control. And anyway, I internalized a lot of that, created a lot of avoidable anxiety and just carried a lot of weight, you know, with, with that feeling of failure more, more days than I should have. Second thing I would tell myself back in the day is, Farnoosh, get a notepad and get a pen and write things down. Because I thought I could multitask in my head. I thought that I could just remember things without needing to reinforce them on paper somewhere. Part of my problem, and this is like, actually I have thought about this and I thought, well, was I like combating my adhd? I don't know actually if I have adhd, my son does, my brother does. It runs in my family. Why wouldn't I have it too? Back then, I struggled a lot with the executive functioning that being a producer really demands, like to the nth degree, you have to be so. So on top of your information, you have to be organized. You're balancing so much and at the same time, and I wasn't helping myself by not writing things down. I would forget things. I would forget a step and it would totally blow up in my face. So write things down. It's a basic tip, but I needed to, I needed to learn it. Third thing I tell myself back then is don't care so much about other people's opinions. I was very sensitive to what other People thought of my work what other people thought of me in general. And, and I think that's just part of growing up. You start to care less the older you get about a lot of that stuff. But if I had been able to understand that in my 20s, I think I would have given up a lot of grief and a lot of unnecessary feelings of self doubt. Just let that go. And then finally a fourth thing is that I would have told myself, you don't have to quit to be happy. There were definitely some days and weeks that I contemplated just giving up because I had so much self doubt out that things weren't going my way and I wasn't getting all the high fives. I was doing actually my dream job. But it hardly felt like a dream, it felt like a nightmare many times. And I did actually get this advice later from my father. If you read A Healthy State of Panic, you know, there was that very pivotal moment where my family were standing outside in New York City. It's starting to rain, I've had a bit of a panic attack, and they're trying to calm me down and I'm trying to tell them about work and all of the things and the distress. And my father says, you know, you could quit. You actually can quit. You know that, right? And I thought, can I though? Can I quit? And I thought about it. I thought that would be. That would probably solve a lot, but also it wouldn't, because what am I going to do? You know, this is actually a fantastic opportunity for me. And I think that in that moment I realized I have to start to reframe my understanding of success and how I'm going to measure my success at this one job. It's just one job. It's not a forever job. It's a stepping stone. So once I saw my role at New York 1 as a stepping stone, as opposed to this place where I was hoping to get tons of validation, maybe rise through the ranks, it just clicked, you know, I was like, okay, I'm here to learn a set of things. And once I've learned them and once I've grown, I will leave. But now is not the time. You know that when you're. And we talk about this on the show a lot, when we talk about burnout, often people assume the first thing they have to do is just quit. And sometimes you do. But I think it's important to really assess what is fueling the burnout. Is it really the job or is it how you're approaching the job because you're not Creating boundaries. You're not saying no, you're not tuning out some of the chaotic noise and the judgments. I wasn't doing any of those things. And so then I went back to work with a different lens. I was like, I'm here to get a job done. I'm here to learn. And I would put on, I literally put on big headphones and I would just listen to music while I was doing my work because it allowed me to tune out, actually physically tune out. So that all came to me this week. I was back at my job at New York 1. I came there to actually to be on air there and talk about New Year financial tips, how to think about managing your money this year, all the sort of stuff we talk about on this show. So I wanted to just start the show with that because maybe it'll be helpful to anyone listening. This week was all about travel for those of us gearing up for the spring break or maybe going away later this month. How to Travel the world on $75 a day. That was on Wednesday with Matt Kepnes, who's the author of the book, best selling book how to Travel the world on $75 a day. And then on Monday we invited Brian Kelly back on the show. He is the points guy and he has a new book out called how to Win at Travel. I learned so much in both of these interviews. Just one about how to game the points system and how some credit cards are better than others when it comes to optimizing maximizing your points to get those first class seats or to get that free ticket business class to Europe. If you have any travels on the horizon this year, you definitely want to go back and listen to those episodes. We have one question from the Mailbag today and then I'm going to bring on one of our listeners, Irene. If you remember Irene, last week we read aloud one of her questions regarding her 5 to 9 plan for her newborn. And Irene was also kind of nervous about going back to work. But what really caught us was her list of accomplishments since listening to SO money, paying off debt, growing her investments, multiplying her income. And I thought I need Irene on the show. And she obliged. And so she is on standby ready to talk to us about all the things. Before we bring on Irene, let's answer someone's question in the audience. I want to it's actually a perfect timing to answer this question because Irene's experience with paying off her student loans might inspire our listener here. Kristin writes in and she says, hey, Farnooch, I'm a huge fan. Recently purchased your new book and even getting a copy for each of my sons. Kristen, thank you so much. I'm so happy that my book continues to make an impact. It came out October 2023 which feels like forever ago. Of course it wasn't, but it really makes me so happy to note that the book is still out there and being introduced to people. So Kristin goes on to write. She's 45, she is single and she's juggling a full time job with three part time jobs. So do the math, that's four jobs. She got divorced three years ago and she was left with some debt. Currently she's got one $10,000 in student loans and for the first time in her life she's taking control of her finances. This is what I've been talking about. Women in their midlife needing to getting reacquainted with their finances or just acquainted with their finances. This is an underserved market and I am here for you. I talked about that last week. Maybe I should write my next book about midlife money. Many of you have reached out to me saying yes, please do that. I gotta get over the PTSD of writing my last book. But on my to do list Kristin says that she's now supporting her 16 year old daughter without any child support, occasionally helping her older, more self sufficient sons. Kristen has spent 15 years as an educator, but after the divorce struggled to support herself. So she completed a master's degree the same year as the divorce and worked various part time jobs, eventually landing a job at a Fortune 500 company. She also started teaching college classes at a university, became a faculty lead, and now serves as an as an administrator of a program at the university, all of which are part time contractual roles. She says It's a catch 22 really, when you have to leave education to pay back your loans, but then you can't apply for pslf, which is Public Service Loan Forgiveness anyway. That's her background. She says she's consulted with a financial advisor and started investing in the stock market. She's got CDs, high yield savings accounts, a Roth and a 401K to which she contributes 10%. But these student loans are really the sticking point for our friend Kristen. She says they cause her immense anxiety because they're over a hundred thousand dollars. She's not sure how to manage them. Her financial advisor has suggested putting all of her extra money towards them, but she doesn't want to do it, especially after listening to one of my podcasts. So what would I recommend in terms of handling these loans? All right, Kristen, thanks so much for writing in. I know I've said in the past on this show that student loans may not be a priority always, especially if you're trying to play catch up with your retirement. If they're not high interest loans, meaning they're not more than, you know, 7. 8% that there may be other better use cases for your money to help you out more in the future. I'm happy to hear that you're working with a financial advisor. So glad that they've directed you towards investing. You're contributing 10%. Here's what I would say and I think as I mentioned, Irene, who you're going to hear from shortly, has also worked her way through $100,000 worth of student loan debt and hopefully she'll offer some inspiration. But I would just say first that, you know, you mentioned leaving public education and losing the eligibility for pslf, but I would still recommend exploring whether you qualify for any income driven repayment plans idr. These plans base your payments, as you probably know, on your income and family size and they forgive any remaining balance after 20 to 25 years of payments. The new save plan, which was introduced by the Department of ed, may offer more favorable terms with lower payments and interest relief. So just looking into these other federal plans, who knows what the future holds for them as Trump has mentioned wanting to dismantle the Department of ed. So I say this all with that major asterisk, but don't completely give up on any federal options, any federal savings options for the debt. Secondly, love that you're contributing to your 401k and your Roth IRA. This is a great place to channel your money. But you know, I think there is a balanced approach here that you can still take with addressing your retirement and also being a little bit more aggressive with the student loans. Maybe you don't want to put all your extra money towards it like your FA suggests, but could you make one or two extra principal only payments a year? If your loan interest rates are above 7.8percent, then for sure I would do this. I would definitely take some of my disposable income and put extra principal payments towards the student loans just to knock down that balance faster, all while still Investing in your 401k and in your Roth. The other thing I want to talk about is all the jobs that you have, you're doing a lot. You're juggling multiple income streams. Are any of these jobs such that you could get more than what you're currently making. Can you ask for more with any of these jobs? I know that the part time jobs, maybe there's less, maybe there's less room for negotiation there or not, I don't know. But if you sense that there's any additional wiggle room to make more, of course that's going to help to address your student loans more aggressively. The other thing is, you know, if you've got these four jobs and three of them are contractual, is there one contractual job that you could just call my student loan payoff job? Like every penny that I make with this one job is going to go towards knocking down the principal. When I was in a lot of debt in my 20s, that's how I looked at some of my income streams. I thought I knew that I couldn't make ends meet just by making the, you know, $18 an hour at my first job and the second job wasn't, you know, that much more. And so I had bills, I was living in New York, I had student loans, I had credit card debt, I got freelance jobs. And I looked at these jobs as basically as direct payment plans for the student loans. And so I just got out of my head that I could use any of that money for recreation or expenses that weren't necessities. It was like, nope, this is my get out of debt job. And just that mental SW was very powerful. And finally, with regards to a healthy state of panic, I know you're reading that. I would just say if you're feeling this nagging fear around the student loans and never getting out of them, use that fear as fuel to learn about what options you may actually have that you're not exploring, that are federal outside of pslf. Use that fear as fuel to ask for more money to then be able to channel that towards the student loan principal. And I just also want to say that you're doing amazing. I don't know if you're hearing this enough. The fact that you had a master's degree while you were getting divorced, the fact that you are caring for your 16 year old full time, that you are holding down four jobs. If there's anyone out there that's gonna be able to get out of a hundred thousand dollars worth of student loan debt, it's you. You're the person, remember who you are. It's not gonna be overnight, it's gonna be a little painful, but you are resilient. You've proven that to yourself. And if that was all you needed to hear, then I'm happy to have relayed that message to you. And I'm being very honest. I'm being very honest. This is why I love helping. Because they've been through things and they just sometimes forget who they are and how they have managed to gracefully work their way through the challenges and the struggles of their lives. And yeah, they've now arrived at a place in their financial lives that feels heavy and scary and it's an unknown. But you have proven time and time again to be able to work your way through the mess. You will get on the other side of it. And I'm here for you. Continue to send me your questions. Thank you for sticking with this show. Thank you for reading A Healthy State of Panic and passing it on to your children. I'm rooting for you. I recently stayed at an Airbnb with my family up in the Pocono Mountains near the ski resorts. It was a spacious home that accommodated our whole family. A sauna for me and even a game room for the kids. It was such a lovely experience that it got me thinking again. How nice would it be to manage a property of my own? The extra cash would be amazing. But then reality sets in. Managing bookings, messaging guests, guests handling all the little details sounds like a full time job. Thankfully, Airbnb's new co host network takes the stress out of hosting. With this feature, you can hire a high quality local co host to handle all the work for you. They can set up your space, manage guest communication, oversee bookings, and even provide on site support if needed. Some co hosts even offer design and styling services to make your property stand out. So whether you've got an unused space or you're traveling for work, co hosting makes it easy to earn extra income without the hassle. Want to get started? Find the right co host for you@airbnb.com host let me ask you something. Have you ever experienced a dry, itchy scalp? Or like me, wondered why your hair color isn't lasting as long as your stylist promised? Well, unfiltered mineral filled water could be the reason why. Did you know hard water is a leading cause of damaged hair and dry, irritated skin? About 85% of the United States uses hard water filled with dissolved minerals and added chlorine. And that's where Canopy's filtered shower heads come in. Canopy, known for their beauty hacks and reimagined humidifier, has revolutionized the filtered shower head space with not one filtered shower head, but a handheld version as well. I'm obsessed with mine. Dermatologists recommended this unique three stage filtration system greatly reduces contaminants and odors in your shower water, leaving you with healthy hair and glowing skin. Best of all, the canopy's filtered shower heads are hassle free, installation is a breeze, and its unique filter replacement feature allows for seamless filter changes unlike any others on the market. Go to GetCanopy Co to save $25 on your canopy filtered shower head purchase today. With Kanopy's hassle free filter subscription and even better listeners, you can use the code SOMONEY1WORD at checkout to save an additional 10% off your canopy purchase. If you're a maintenance supervisor for a commercial property, you've had to deal with everything from leaky faucets to flickering light bulbs. But nothing's worse than that ancient boiler that's lived in the building since the day it was built 50 years ago. It's enough to make anyone lose their cool. That's where Grainger comes in. With industrial grade products and dependable, fast delivery, Grainger can help with any challenge, from worn out components to everyday necessities. Call click grainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done.
- [20:28]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I used to think buying foundation online was impossible. How am I supposed to find my shade when I can't even get it right in store? Then I discovered IL Maquillage.
- [20:36]
Irene
I took their AI powered quiz to.
- [20:38]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Find my custom match and wow. This foundation is literally my skin in a bottle. The undertone and coverage are spot on. It's so neutral and weightless I can't even tell I'm wearing makeup.
- [20:47]
Irene
Plus, with Try before youe Buy, you.
- [20:49]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Can try your full size at home for 14 days. Take the Power Match Quiz now at ilmaquillage.com Quiz I L M A K.
- [20:56]
Irene
I A G E.com Quiz all right, I've got her everybody. Irene, a longtime listener of so Money, may have heard her question on last week's AskFarnouche and we tried to help her out, but we were mostly just so impressed with everything that you have accomplished in what is a short period of time. We're going to run through it all again and see how we can continue to help our friend Irene. Welcome to so money.
- [21:24]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Thank you. Such a delight to be here.
- [21:26]
Irene
We should let everybody know that you are a new mom and just six weeks. How has it been going? How are you today Irene?
- [21:35]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Oh man, I'm very sleep deprived but otherwise can't complain. Otherwise it's going well.
- [21:42]
Irene
Yeah, that's sleep deprivation. Thank you so much for making time for us, we're gonna hopefully make this worth your time. And I know everyone listening is gonna really appreciate all that you're gonna share. So from my understanding, you started listening to the podcast 2019. I think it was before the pandemic. I think you wrote.
- [22:01]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I was thinking about. I think it might have actually been a little bit earlier, like 2017.
- [22:06]
Irene
Oh, wow. Technically, original gangster listener to the so Money podcast. Where were you in your life when you decided, I'm gon committing to listening to a financial podcast?
- [22:16]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Let's see. I found myself back in around 2012 when I was first out of college. I had a degree in communication, and I was working in my dream job, which was at a nonprofit. I absolutely loved it, but I was making around $20,000 a year. I was really forced to think about money at that time just because every dollar was really important. I was struggling to survive. And at the time, I had a friend who. A really close friend who worked as a software developer. And I was like, teasing him, saying, can't you get me a job at your office? Don't you have a job as a receptionist or something? Anything's going to pay more than what I'm making right now. And I was ready to give up on the nonprofit thing just because I was struggling so much.
- [22:58]
Irene
Just to interrupt, though, what. How does $20,000 look like in real life? Were you living with family?
- [23:05]
Farnoosh Tarabi
So I was making $28,500 a year at the time. And I did actually live on my own, but I lived in a very small, very rundown apartment. I just didn't spend a lot of money. I bought groceries and I paid my rent, and I had a very old car, and that was about it.
- [23:24]
Irene
What was the job?
- [23:25]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I worked at an animal shelter, so I'm a big animal lover, so.
- [23:29]
Irene
And you had student loans?
- [23:32]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Yeah, at that time, I had about $40,000 of student loans from my undergraduate degree. And then when I was talking to my friend who worked in tech, he was saying I should try to get a job maybe working at a tech company, just because that was his frame of reference. And he was like, I know you like to write and draw and be creative. And it's not just jobs coding. Like, there are lots of jobs for designers and project managers, and you can use those more soft skills. So I would, again, wouldn't recommend this, but what I did was I got a. I signed up. After that conversation, I signed up to get a master's degree in computer science.
- [24:07]
Irene
You wouldn't do that again. You wouldn't do that again.
- [24:11]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I would just say that you can learn a lot of the skills you would learn getting a master's in computer science. You can learn a lot of them on your own. There's so much on YouTube now, Coursera or Udemy. There are just so many other paths. I don't know that the cost of a master's degree is worth it if you're just trying to see if you even like being in that industry. A couple years later, I got my first job in tech. So at that point, I was making $55,000 a year, so felt like I was rich at the time.
- [24:40]
Irene
Those are all huge leaps. And then I understand, though, you were also dealing with a hundred thousand dollars in student loans.
- [24:48]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Yeah, at that point, I think I had racked up about $97,000 of student loans, but it was over a hundred at. Because of interest? Yeah, because I was paying about 500 per month. And, like, I just didn't understand compound interest at that time. I thought if I paid it every month, it would just eventually go away. I didn't understand that your balance could actually go up as you were making regular payments. How I got interested in personal finances. I was at the library, and on a whim, I just picked up Nicole Lapin's book, Rich Bitch.
- [25:18]
Irene
Oh, yeah.
- [25:19]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I think just because the title grabbed me. And I thought, but if he'd asked me before that, I would have said finance. Probably not for me. But I thought, okay, the title grabbing me, maybe as a millennial woman, I could be the audience. One thing she has you do in the book is calculate your net worth. And I didn't really have any assets at the time, aside from my very old used car. And so I was like, oh, shoot, it's negative. A hundred thousand dollars. Like, I don't know much about personal finance, but that doesn't seem good. So that was a discouraging moment. And then I started Googling how to get out of debt, and I had a little foray into Dave Ramsey's podcast. And then through the magic of Apple podcasts, I. I came across so many.
- [26:01]
Irene
Oh, my gosh. And never looked back. You have tripled your income. You have grown your investments to over $400,000. Let's just start with the negotiations that went on and changing the employers. Like. Like when you Googled how to get out of debt and you started listening to the podcast, was the first thought, I have an income problem. And not so much a debt problem, because although it sounds like a monstrous amount of debt, like a hundred Thousand dollars of debt is not for the faint of heart, but unfortunately, it's not uncommon, especially, you know, with someone with a master's degree. So was your first thought, I need to earn more. Where did you go from there?
- [26:43]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I think as I was listening to so Money and other podcasts and just reading as much as I could, I realized, okay, I made a big mistake. And then I didn't negotiate in the first couple jobs I had out of school. And actually, at the time, I found out that somebody else at my company with the exact same title was making $10,000 more than me per year.
- [27:05]
Irene
Wow.
- [27:05]
Farnoosh Tarabi
And so once I learned I should be negotiating, I think I just. Just researched everything I could about it, and I started talking to friends in the same industry and learning what my market value was more accurately. And then just after that, every time I had a performance review, even though it. This was really hard for me because I never want to come off as, you know, greedy or ask or whatever. I know it's the. But every after that, even though it was so hard for me to do, just every time I had a performance review, I would. Would bring up my accomplishments from that year and just, you know, lay out the research of, here's what I've done, and here's what I think my market value is. And I also got a. A pretty significant salary bump at one point because I got another job offer from a different company. But I loved my current company, so I wanted to stay. So I just approached them to say, hey, I got this other offer. I really want to stay. Is there anything you can do to help me out by matching it? And then ultimately, a few years later, I got another bump by actually moving to another company and negotiating harder with that one before I started.
- [28:14]
Irene
And this was all in the span of how many years I've been in the space.
- [28:19]
Farnoosh Tarabi
For about 10 years, I've been at four different companies. One of those moves is because I got laid off, but I purposely moved jobs three times.
- [28:25]
Irene
This is the thing, everybody. We have to keep moving if we want to keep making more money. That's huge. So you paid off those. A hundred thousand dollars worth of student loans. You've tripled your income. You've grown your investments to $400,000. How did you do that? Let's talk about the investment piece of this. Like, at what point did you realize I should start investing? I suspect it wasn't when all the debt was gone, which is a good thing.
- [28:50]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Yeah. I was still contributing to my 401k, always. At least Enough to get the match and then just throwing every extra dollar I had at the debt. I did open a brokerage account while I was still paying off debt and just put a small amount in it just to start building that muscle of investing. And not just in my 401k. While I had the loans, I paid off as much as I could toward the loans every month, prioritized investing a little bit less. But then once I was done with the student loans in 2020, just every extra dollar I've been shoveling into my investments, like maxing out my 401k and putting it into my taxable brokerage account.
- [29:30]
Irene
How did your relationship with money change over the 10 years? Going from living in that shoebox apartment in that beat up car, to then having a lot of student loan debt but then making more money. I feel like there were a lot of wins, but then there might have been some setbacks, but then two steps forward, three steps back, now you're providing for another human. That's a huge financial accomplishment. A lot of people don't have kids, aren't having kids because they are worried about how they're gonna afford it. How do you feel? How proud are you?
- [30:03]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Yeah, I'm really proud. I think before I became more educated about all of this, I used to decide whether I could afford things just based on emotions and a gut feeling. And so whenever I would spend money, I would feel bad about it. But now I think what's been really helpful for me, I'm a numbers person. I like visually seeing everything. So I just have a Google sheet that I, I make a copy of every month. And it's pretty simple, but just at the top I have my income and then I have all my expenses, like my mortgage and childcare will be an expense in there going forward. I just have everything deducted so I can see exactly how much I have left over. And then I don't feel bad when I spend money because I know that I've, I'm doing it thoughtfully. That's a big difference from back when I was living in that apartment. Like I'd feel feel guilty going grocery shopping and that's just not a good way to live.
- [30:57]
Irene
And I remember being in my 20s and living paycheck to paycheck. And I think that the financial obsessions that I had back then were more around consumer purchases. Oh, how one day I'll be able to like walk into Bloomingdale's and buy whatever I want. And then as I got to earn more and I started to invest And I started to also become a mom. It was less about the things. It was more about how can I build security with my money, how can I invest more, how can I create more meaningful experiences? And I don't know what that's about. But it could also just be maturity. Like when you're younger, you just want the shinier objects. Now, last week we read a couple of your questions on the show. We didn't have you there with us, but Georgia Lee Hussey, one of our favorite financial planners on the show, she and I, we were trying to help you out. You had a question about 529 plans and you also had a question about going back to work. Because right now you are on paid family leave for your newborn and you were not sure how to navigate the reemergence into your career and even if to do it. I think we basically said you gotta get back to work at some point.
- [32:06]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Oh, yeah, I'm doing it. It's a necessity. I just am struggling with feeling. Feeling bad about it.
- [32:13]
Irene
That's normal. How much time do you have at home until you have to go back to work?
- [32:18]
Farnoosh Tarabi
I am six weeks in and I have six more weeks.
- [32:21]
Irene
What is going to be your childcare arrangement?
- [32:23]
Farnoosh Tarabi
My baby will be going to daycare. I have a daycare. Luckily, since I'm in an urban area, I have a daycare right across the street. We'll just be able to walk across the street and drop her off.
- [32:33]
Irene
I'm not going to lie. It's going to be hard in the beginning, but being across the street, you can visit your baby anytime. They'll send you lots of videos and photos. You can even still go and like, probably feed if you wanted to. But I think you'll also. What you're not expecting right now is another feeling that's going to come. I think, I hope this for you that you're going to feel like you're getting a little bit of your old life back. Just having that freedom for yourself to be independent a little bit more is something that I undervalued. Just quiet time going back to. Even as. As mundane as maybe your job can be sometimes, like sometimes that's. It's great. Because taking care of a human is very difficult.
- [33:15]
Farnoosh Tarabi
When I originally wrote to you, I was feeling bad about it, but now six weeks in, I'm like, you know what? It wouldn't be the worst to take a lunch break.
- [33:22]
Irene
Yeah.
- [33:22]
Farnoosh Tarabi
And actually be able to eat without somebody needing something from me.
- [33:27]
Irene
I think it's important to compartmentalize like having a life outside of caregiving, whatever it is, if it's work or if it's volunteering or just, just going to the gym for an hour, then coming back and resetting, I think is important because caregiving, it's a huge mental load. And so to have that kind of energetic break is really important. But obviously it's also financially important. Can you even imagine if you weren't bringing an income? You'd probably make ends meet, but it would be very different.
- [33:56]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Yeah, absolutely. And I think I grew up with a single parent in a single parent household. My mom raised me by herself after my dad died when I was 6 and, and she was a stay at home mom before he died. And I saw firsthand how difficult that was for her to get back into the workforce and take care of us by herself. And I think just having had that experience, I never want to find myself in that. So I'm trying to plan ahead and make sure that I always have a way to make income and take care of myself and take care of my baby.
- [34:30]
Irene
So bravo to you. And you're going to just be such a. When she's old enough, she'll, she will realize, you know, like you are today, realizing the efforts of your mom. So, Irene, what's your biggest money goal right now? You've got investments up and going. Your career sounds like it's going strong, you've paid off the debt. What's next?
- [34:51]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Oh, gosh. At one point I said, I'm 37 right now. @ one point I said, I'd love to be a millionaire by the time I'm 40. I'm not sure that's gonna happen. But I am also a big fan of setting big, audacious goals. And even if you get close to them but don't exactly hit the target, that's okay too. Yeah, that would be. In a perfect world, I'd love to hit that.
- [35:15]
Irene
Like any goal, you gotta make it specific and measurable. And if you reverse engineer it, you're a spreadsheet person, maybe you can figure that out. It would take a little bit more investing, I would say, and earning more. But you're in your prime earning years. That's the other reason why I fear when moms become moms, typically now in their mid-30s, especially in urban areas like you are and I am. I had my first at 34, I had my second at 37. So if I were to leave my career, I'm giving up a lot of potential, starting to get into these prime earning years. And when Women leave the workforce for five years and then want to go back. They're not starting at where they left off. Right. They have to almost like climb, claw back to where they were salary wise. Sometimes it's not easy. You lose a lot of earning potential. So that's great. Millionaire by. We'll have you back on when you're 40. How about that? And we'll see how things are going. Are there any lingering questions you have while you have me?
- [36:22]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Let's see. I think we Talked about my 529 question and about how to decide how much to invest and everything. And in terms of just choosing, since you can choose one from any state, it doesn't have to be the state that you live in. Would you just be looking at expense ratios or what the fees are?
- [36:41]
Irene
I would start by seeing if your state has a state tax deduction. Some plans offer investors in their plan who are residents a state tax deduction. So that would be an, that would be a great place to start. I think if your state does that and the expense ratios are good and the historical returns have been pretty, pretty good, although they won't predict the future. Those are important data points. Then go with your state. But if your state doesn't offer that state tax deduction. The other thing is you could just open up a Roth ira. Sometimes families who don't know if my child's gonna go the traditional college route or what. Roth IRA has more flexibility.
- [37:26]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Actually I was thinking that is one benefit to having a child later in life is I'll be 59 and a half when she's 22. So I could always use my retirement accounts if I have enough for my own retirement.
- [37:40]
Irene
Before we go, any advice for those of us listening who want to be Irene? Maybe advice you would have given your 20 something self?
- [37:49]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Just the, the most important thing I think for my career and, and my success has been about relationships and just maintaining good relationships with people you've worked with because that's how I've gotten all, even the first job I got in tech was because I knew somebody who worked at a company who could refer me. And out of the four companies I worked at in my current industry, one of them I got through a recruiter on LinkedIn. But the other three have been because I was friends with people. And I wouldn't even say networking in terms of like how people think of it, like going to conferences and schmoozing, like not that kind of networking but just like having lunch with your coworkers, just taking an interest in their lives and building genuine friendships. Like even if you maybe you're not like hanging out on the weekend, but just becoming friends with people and staying in touch, even if it's just to wish them a happy birthday or, you know, stay in touch. And that's how I've really been able to find the opportunities that I've had.
- [38:49]
Irene
I'm so glad we could make this happen. When your question crossed my inbox and then we read it last week, not only I was impressed, but Georgia Lee Hussey, who manages the portfolios of very wealthy people, she was like, this woman is a gem. And so thank you for making time for us. Given all that's going on in your life. We really appreciate you. Thank you for listening to the show. Thank you for the advice, thanks for pulling back the curtain on your financial life. And I know I'm certain people listening will be inspired. They're going to be sharing this to their daughters who are in college and even for anyone else, wherever you are in your financial life, I think what you've taught us is that believing in yourself, making a plan, advocating for yourself, it goes a really long way. And notice I didn't say like spreadsheets. This is all internal, most of it, although keeping a good spreadsheet helps too.
- [39:44]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Thank you so much and thank you for everything you've taught me over the years. I've loved listening, so appreciate everything you do for all of us listeners.
- [39:52]
Irene
Thanks for tuning in everybody. I hope your weekend is so money. If you're a facilities manager at a university, you know students rely on the cafeteria for breakfast, lunch, dinner and the.
- [40:15]
Farnoosh Tarabi
Occasional late night snack.
- [40:16]
Irene
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