1817: Why Your Network Is Your Net Worth and How to Build Rich Relationships

Summary

Summary of So Money Episode 1817: "Why Your Network Is Your Net Worth and How to Build Rich Relationships"

Release Date: April 23, 2025

Introduction

In Episode 1817 of So Money with Farnoosh Torabi, host Farnoosh engages in a profound conversation with Selena Su, an acclaimed publicity and marketing expert and the author of the insightful book, Rich Relationships Create a Million Dollar Network for Your Business. The episode delves deep into the pivotal role that networks and relationships play in personal and professional success, offering listeners actionable strategies to cultivate meaningful connections.

The Essence of Rich Relationships

Farnoosh opens the discussion by highlighting the effortless way some individuals attract opportunities and build influential networks. She introduces Selena Su, emphasizing her expertise in helping entrepreneurs forge authentic connections that thrive beyond superficial interactions.

Selena Su emphasizes the transformational power of relationships:

“[A] rich relationship massively increases the quality of your business and life. They create more abundance, connect to your biggest goals and dreams, and help you become the best version of yourself.” (06:37)

Defining a Rich Relationship

Selena outlines the core characteristics that define rich relationships:

1. Abundance Creation: These relationships foster various forms of abundance—financial, emotional, and more. Whether it's someone referring clients, offering invaluable advice, or providing emotional support, rich relationships contribute significantly to one's growth and success.

2. Alignment with Goals and Dreams: Rich relationships are intrinsically linked to one's aspirations. The individuals within these networks are invested in each other's success, often having achieved what the other aspires to, thereby providing inspiration and guidance.

3. Personal Growth: Such relationships encourage personal development, pushing individuals to become more disciplined, generous, and overall better versions of themselves through mutual inspiration and support.

The Six Circles of Connection

A pivotal part of the conversation revolves around Selena's Six Circles of Connection, a framework designed to manage one's network effectively while avoiding burnout.

1. Circle One – Innermost Relationships: These are your closest connections—family, life partners, or best friends—who are deeply involved in your daily life and offering unconditional support.

2. Circle Two – Treasured Connections: Important individuals who might not be involved in your daily activities but are always there when needed, such as long-time friends or trusted colleagues.

3. Circle Three – Active Network: This includes acquaintances and professionals you trust and respect. They are reliable for business referrals or personal support but may not be as intimate as Circle One or Two.

4. Circle Four – Distant Relationships: These are relationships that exist but lack trust or alignment due to factors like values mismatch or infrequent interaction.

5. Circle Five – Disconnected: Individuals with whom you have no meaningful relationship, often due to incompatibility or unreliability.

6. Circle Six – Unknown Connections: People you know of but have never interacted with personally.

Selena explains the purpose of the circles:

“The circles are really based on trust and proximity. You're just identifying where you are and moving them too.” (31:13)

Generosity as a Strategic Relationship Builder

One of the standout strategies discussed is the concept of a Generosity Fund, which involves allocating resources—be it money, time, or expertise—to support others within your network without expecting immediate returns.

Selena shares her personal example:

“I invested $200 in a friendship by purchasing money coaching sessions for a friend, which led to significant financial savings for them and strengthened our relationship.” (22:18)

This approach, termed "breathtaking generosity," emphasizes thoughtful, impactful giving that makes recipients feel genuinely valued and supported.

Selena defines breathtaking generosity:

“It's when someone is so generous, it literally takes your breath away. They feel seen, special, and prioritized.” (12:04)

Overcoming the Fear of Rejection

Farnoosh and Selena discuss the common hesitancy people face when reaching out to build or deepen relationships, especially for introverts. Selena offers practical advice to make this process less daunting:

1. Lighthearted Asks: Frame requests in a casual, non-pressuring manner. For example:

   “Hey, I wanted to run something by you,” or “This might be a total long shot, but I wanted to see if you were potentially interested in this.” (40:54)

2. Relaxed Abundance Mindset: Approach relationship-building from a place of giving rather than expecting immediate reciprocation. This fosters a more genuine and stress-free interaction.

Nurturing and Activating Relationships

Building a robust network involves three key components:

1. Building Relationships: Initiate connections through meaningful interactions without the pressure of immediate benefits.
2. Nurturing Connections: Consistently engage with your network, showing appreciation and support over time to strengthen bonds.
3. Activating Networks: Effectively leverage your relationships when you need support, whether for business opportunities or personal challenges.

Selena emphasizes the importance of nurturing:

“Just because you know someone doesn't mean it's an active relationship. You have to nurture your connections.” (40:09)

The Role of Self-Knowledge in Relationship Building

Farnoosh highlights the importance of understanding oneself in the relationship-building process. Selena concurs, noting that knowing your own strengths and limitations—such as being an introvert—can help tailor your approach to networking in ways that feel authentic and sustainable.

Selena shares her approach as an introvert:

“I’m probably 80 to 90% introvert, like 10% extrovert. But I spend time putting myself out there to build relationships that count.” (06:33)

Maintaining Integrity in Relationships

Selena touches upon the necessity of maintaining authentic relationships aligned with one’s values. She warns against keeping connections that lack integrity or emotional stability, as these can hinder personal and professional growth.

Selena advises:

“Maintaining a friendship not rooted in your truth keeps you out of integrity.” (35:31)

Practical Tools and Resources

To assist listeners in implementing these strategies, Selena offers a free gift for readers:

• Free Chapters and Scripts: Visit richrelationshipsbook.com/Farnoosh to access the first four chapters of her book for free, along with a bundle of rich relationship scripts for emails, texts, and conversations.
• Contest Opportunity: Enter for a chance to win $1,000 by signing up at the provided link.

Selena promotes her resources:

“Visit richrelationshipsbook.com/Farnoosh to get free chapters and scripts, and enter to win $1,000.” (44:11)

Conclusion

Farnoosh Torabi wraps up the episode by reiterating the significance of building and nurturing rich relationships as foundational assets for both personal fulfillment and financial success. She commends Selena Su for her invaluable insights and encourages listeners to adopt these strategies to cultivate a thriving network.

Farnoosh concludes:

“Your network, your relationships, they're your assets too. This system requires patience and belief, but it's a way to protect your boundaries and invest in your community.” (38:33)

Key Takeaways

• Rich Relationships Multiply Value: Authentic connections contribute significantly to both personal well-being and professional success by fostering various forms of abundance.

• Six Circles of Connection: Categorizing relationships helps manage and prioritize your network effectively, ensuring meaningful interactions without burnout.

• Generosity as a Strategy: Thoughtful, impactful giving strengthens relationships and creates a supportive network without the pressure of immediate reciprocation.

• Overcoming Networking Fears: Adopting a relaxed, abundance-based mindset and framing requests casually can make relationship-building less intimidating, especially for introverts.

• Integrity and Authenticity: Maintaining relationships aligned with your values is crucial for sustaining trust and fostering genuine support within your network.

Final Thoughts

This episode serves as a comprehensive guide for anyone looking to enhance their networking strategies through authentic relationship-building. Selena Su’s frameworks and practical advice provide listeners with the tools needed to create a million-dollar network grounded in trust, generosity, and mutual growth.

Additional Resources

• Book: Rich Relationships Create a Million Dollar Network for Your Business by Selena Su
• Website: richrelationshipsbook.com/Farnoosh
• Contest Deadline: May 30th

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This summary captures the essence of the conversation between Farnoosh Torabi and Selena Su, highlighting the importance of rich relationships in building a successful network and offering actionable strategies to cultivate and maintain these connections.

Transcript

[Capital One Bank Guy]

Banking with Capital One helps you keep more money in your wallet with no fees or minimums on checking accounts and no overdraft fees. Just ask the Capital One bank guy. It's pretty much all he talks about in a good way. He'd also tell you that this podcast is his favorite podcast too. Ah, really? Thanks Capital One Bank Guy. What's in your wallet? Term Supply See capital1.com Bank Capital One NA Member FDIC.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

This episode is brought.

[Selena Su]

To you by after the Fact, a.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Podcast by the Pew Charitable Trusts on SEW Money. We talk a lot about informed decision making and after the Fact is the.

[Selena Su]

Perfect companion for that mindset.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

This podcast offers data driven insights into today's big issues, from housing to Internet.

[Selena Su]

Access, health and the environment.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Each episode features expert insights with real stories so you're not just getting the numbers, you're hearing how people and communities are working toward real, lasting solutions. If you're curious if you're curious, thoughtful and want just the facts, this is.

[Selena Su]

The podcast to add to your rotation.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Listen to after the Fact wherever you get your podcasts. So Money Episode 1817 why youy Network Is yous Net how to Build Rich Relationships with Selina Su.

[Selena Su]

You're listening to so Money with award winning money guru Farnoosh Torabi. Each day get a 30 minute dose of financial inspiration from the world's top business minds, authors, influencers and from Farnoosh herself. Looking for ways to save on gas or double your double coupons. Sorry, you're in the wrong place. Seeking profound ways to live a richer, happier life. Welcome to so Money.

It doesn't happen often, but occasionally I'll want to help someone and I can tell that all kinds of emotions come up and they're like, afraid that I'm giving them something so that I can like get something in return or they're gonna get entangled in this thing when really I'm coming from a place of no strings attached. I just want to be a helpful person.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Welcome back to Sew Money everybody. Have you ever wondered how some people seem to kind of effortlessly attract all the opportunities? They connect deeply with influential mentors. They've built friendships that propel their lives forward. They're just people. People. What if I told you the secret to all of this lies in cultivating rich, meaningful relationships? And yes, you can too. Today we are lucky to have Selen, an acclaimed publicity and marketing expert and author of the new compelling book Rich Relationships Create a Million Dollar Network for your Business. Selena has built her career on helping entrepreneurs like myself forge authentic Connections that don't just last, they thrive. In our conversation today, Selena will talk about how true relationship building goes far beyond networking events and superficial interactions. She shares transformative insights on how genuine generosity and authenticity can become your superpowers for building relationships, as well as how to initiate meaningful conversations with people that you don't know, but deeply admire. And effective strategies for overcoming the fear of rejection, turning that into an empowering part of your growth. This is a really important conversation today as so many of us are worried about our job prospects, our career paths, so much uncertainty. And as I always say, your network, your relationships, they're your assets too.

[Selena Su]

Here's Selena Su.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Selina Su welcome to so Money. Such a good time we're gonna have. Yes, it's always a good choice to have Selena on your podcast and we've been friends for I was trying to do the math about 12, 13 years luck had me find you 2012.

[Selena Su]

Okay.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Yeah, before when she Makes More came out, I wanted to work with someone. I didn't know if she existed, but she did. It was you. Someone who could help me figure out how to take this book to new audiences. I was pretty good at pr, but at the time there was this thing called the Internet and influencers were just starting to crop up and email newsletters were becoming a thing and I knew nothing about that. And you not only helped me connect those dots, but I think what is going to be the topic of our conversation today is you really demonstrated the importance of establishing relationships where we all have goals. We want to get to a certain place in our lives. You want this certain job. We want to get our books to be successful and we just think about the result as opposed to how we're going to get there, which often involves relationships.

[Selena Su]

Yes.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

And that's not the best ones are not transactional. The best ones are not short lived. You really believe in and I've seen you do it and I've seen you teach it and I've learned from you the importance of nurturing relationships. And I think also for a lot of us listening, maybe we're in our 30s, our 40s, our 50s. We're like, I got all my friends, I've got all my relationships. This requires some effort and I, I don't know if I have it in me or if it's worth it. It's like I just like being in my home in my jogger pants, scrolling on Instagram. And this requires a little bit of work and commitment on our ends. But to your point, Rich relationships, it's the best investment you can make.

[Selena Su]

Yes. And it's the fastest way to get from where you are to where you want to be. And as humans, we always have problems and challenges and struggles. And rather than thinking about what do I need to do, I think that it's really powerful to think about what's the rich relationship that I need? Right.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

It's the relationships that make life again, to use your words, fulfilling. And it brings abundance, financial abundance. I'm trying to bring it all back to so money here. But it's so true that relationships are often an abundance overlooked, underappreciated asset in our lives.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. And I think it's worth noting that I am a massive introvert. I think that many of us have an introvert side to us. And so I don't people to think, oh my gosh, I need to be a social butterfly. I need to be running around to all these events and conferences in order to be successful. Actually, one thing that I would really love to share with your listeners first of all, is just like defining what a rich relationship is and then my six circles of connection, because that's the number one way I believe, to manage your network and avoid burnout.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

All right, so how do you define a rich relationship?

[Selena Su]

Yeah, so a rich relationship is one that massively increases the quality of your business and life. And so these rich relationships have three primary characteristics. So one, they create more abundance for you. And there's different forms of abundance. Right. It could be financial abundance, where you've got someone who is always singing your praises and sending the perfect clients your way. Someone that is introducing you to a media opportunity, a speaking opportunity, someone that is giving you advice that leads to a single six figure stream of new income. Right. But it could also be someone who is a confidant, who is there with you through the highs and lows and gives you your confidence to go out there and rule the world. Right. So there's different types of support, like financial, emotional, all the things, but ultimately it creates more abundance for you. And then number two is that your richest relationships are going to somehow be connected to your biggest goals and dreams. These are people that want to see you win. They want to support you with your goals and dreams. Maybe they've achieved the thing that you want to do. And then lastly, last but not least, rich relationships help you become the best version of yourself. I don't think of rich relationships as, oh, it's a person with the biggest following, the most money, the most fame, the most power. These are people that really Inspire you. Oftentimes we see a piece of ourselves in them and we're like, wow, you inspire me to be more disciplined, be a better person, be more generous. So impressed with all the things that you've done. And by being in relationship with them, they help you step into your best version. So those are like the three core characteristics of rich relationships.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

I want to get to your six principles. I want to also talk first about you. And you said, I'm an introvert. I may not be the person that screams putting myself out there, but you have. And I would imagine that in some of those cases, some of those instances where you have. For example, you open a book about walking down the street in New York City on the phone with your mom, and you notice Ramit Sethi. This was many years ago, and you were a big fan of his and he inspired you. But a lot of us, like, living in New York, you see a lot of famous people or a lot of people that have influenced you, and the fear kicks in and your instinct is to freeze or flee. You chose to go forward.

[Selena Su]

Yeah.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

What was the voice in your head that encouraged you to do that? Especially as an introvert?

[Selena Su]

Yeah. I think for me, I thought, this is my shot. We all have people that we admire. We read their books, we listen to their podcasts. They have deeply impacted us. One of my favorite sayings is the mind once stretched by a new idea never returns to its original dimensions. And that's so much what you do. Introducing new ideas to help people live richer lives. They start to operate differently, think differently. Right. It's life changing. And Ramit was one of those people for me, where I would read his newsletter, his blog, and I became like a new person. And so I was excited to introduce myself. And it's not every day that someone that you admire is standing in front of you. And I knew that if I let the moment pass, he would go into the doors of his apartment building and would be gone forever. Who knows if I'd ever see him again. So I just thought to say, hey, I'm Selena. I'm a reader of yours. I love your stuff. And then we just had a five minute conversation which led to me. I was already on his newsletter list. He had moved to New York recently and he was hosting these casual in person meetups with readers. And so I started to go to those meetups and I met his friends and other readers of his, and I became that star student who bought, like every course and took action. And yeah, I mean, there were a lot of Things that came from it. Rich relationships are also win, win. When you become a star student, people do like to showcase you as someone that represents results that are possible and got in front of a lot more people. And yeah, there's just so many different ways that we've enriched people's lives. But I will say you don't have to be a social butterfly. If you see me at an event, I'm probably the person in the corner talking to one person and having a great time. I'm not the person in the center of the room cracking jokes, getting everyone to, like, circle around me. And so I just want people to know that you can have any kind of personality and still be successful, but there's a certain number of things that you can do to really increase your success massively. I will say that you do have to be able to take initiative. If you're just sitting on the sidelines and you're never doing anything and you're never reaching out, you're never expressing gratitude, you're never thinking of others and giving, it's just. It's not going to happen. But there's different ways to take initiative. One of my big ideas in my book is that one rich relationship is more valuable than a hundred casual connections. So all of us can think we're connected. Oh, my gosh. I've got thousands of friends on Facebook and all these followers. The question is, if you are in a time of need, are those people are going to show up for you? And so with the six circles of connection, we talk about six different levels of relationship based on proximity and trust and how they show up for you. And I think that's really the best way to organize your network.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

You talk about characteristics. You don't have to be an extrovert, but you do have to be generous.

[Selena Su]

Yes, Yes.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

I think that is something to double click on because you actually wrote about. You have this idea of a generosity fund, allocating money to actually help people in your network. As a strategy, it's deeply human, but it's also strategic. Can you walk us through how you identified who to invest, how to. How to measure it, how to measure the return beyond just, of course, dollars?

[Selena Su]

Yeah, absolutely. So the first thing I want to do is define a term that I put together called breathtaking generosity. So it's what it sounds like. It's when someone is so generous, it literally takes your breath away. You're like, whoa, she actually did that. Wow. You feel seen, you feel special, you feel prioritized. Like, I even think we had Lunch in New York. I think we were at Pastis. And then I was like, oh, my gosh, Barnouch, I love your dress so much. And it was a dress that you bought a while ago, so I don't think it was even available, like, on the store's website. And you knew that I loved it. And then you found it online in my size on a special website, and you sent me, like, the direct link. I'm like, oh, my goodness. Like, she really listened. So that's a good story. Story to share. Because being breathtakingly generous, it doesn't even require money. It just requires that you paid attention, you listened, you care, and the person feels like, wow. So there's a couple ways that you can be breathtakingly generous. Sometimes it's a small things that someone just drops a hint. Oh, like, this would be amazing. I'm looking to do this. And you're like, you pick up on it, and you give them the exact same thing they need. But two really powerful ways are, number one, to get clear on what someone's biggest goals and dreams are. Right? Because we all have them. And if you're like Selena Farnoosh, I'm not a mind reader. How would I know what someone's goals and dreams are? I would really challenge you and say, I think you do know. If someone, let's say they're an entrepreneur, most likely they want to get more clients for their business. They probably want visibility, they want prestige. They want to be connected to people, like minded colleagues, peers, people that they could hire and do things in their business to take work off their plate, especially people who are good at what they do. And people are looking to save time. They're looking to discover things that are fun, that are going to enrich their lives. So we know what people value. And a lot of times people put their top goals out out there, whether it's, this is a cause I'm so passionate about. My goal is to raise $10,000. I have a book coming out. I have a new podcast. I'm reinventing myself. Like, they're sharing, like, what they're doing right? And so how can you really align yourself with someone's top goal? And I would say for me, like, honestly, I spend so much time by myself. Like, I think I'm probably, like, 80 to 90% introvert, like, 10% extrovert. And so I'm, like, by myself a lot. Like, reading my books on my computer, like, doing all these things will say that I'm one of the most connected people and I think it's because the time that I do spend putting myself out there and building relationships, I really let it count. Right? So that part of building rich relationships is knowing who do you pour your time and energy into? Because we don't want to run ourselves ragged and feel like, I need to give to 200 people at once, you're just going to shut down. But it's also showing up in the times when it matters. So that's one of them. It's like getting clear on what someone's top goals and dreams are. So I think, for me, I will say this is one of my natural strengths, is it's very intuitive to me. I automatically know this is important. This would make someone's day. This would move someone emotionally. And so I'm not the person, like, running to all these events and whatever, but I notice those, like, golden moments, and I show up when it matters. Another type of golden moment is when someone is in pain. And Joe Polish talks about being a pain detective. I'm definitely this kind of person. Like, I'm very attuned to when people are in pain. And if you're like, I don't know when people are in pain, I'm like, okay, you probably do. If you're in the US you probably know someone who was affected by the LA wildfires. You probably know someone whose home was affected by the hurricanes in Florida or North Carolina, whether it was hit by it or they had to evacuate. Right? You probably know someone who is going through financial hardship, maybe, whatever, even maybe the terrorists right now is causing them to freak out, understandably. Or maybe, you know, there's changes in their industry and their revenue has been cut in half. Maybe they are going through a divorce and they have to give up 50% of their company or network worth. Right? I think if we look all around us, like, there are people in pain and there are people that have goals and dreams, right? And if you can really zero in on those things and be the first to show up, not the last to show up, people will really, like, appreciate you. So as an example, I think Pat Flynn, he has a smart, passive income podcast, and he was online and he was sharing about his book. And I was, like, thinking, oh, that would be a book that, like, me and a group of my audience would really love. And so I was like, hey, like, like, I would love to buy 20 copies of your book. And he was like, oh, my gosh, I love you. You're my favorite person as an author. When someone's, I'm gonna buy 20 copies. You're like, oh my gosh. Cause I'm trying to even just sell one copy, like one by one. And I think about how people, whether it's they're joining like these masterminds or they're doing different things, or they're traveling across the country and they're spending all this money, which I think is a very good idea. We need to have that in our plan. But there's also things that you can do for $100, $200 or more where someone is holy cow, I can't believe it. Or things that are free, like literally, oh, here's a resource. Here's a link to something that I know that you were talking about and thinking about.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

Some people don't appreciate the generosity, though. Selena, what do you do with those folks? I know you. Maybe this gets us into our six circles, right? Where you've got your innermost relationships and then all the way to unconnected. And I feel like sometimes, and I think you write about this too, that not everyone stays stuck in that circle. That people. It's a fluid circle.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. So that's such an interesting point. So I think some people are uncomfortable the generosity for a couple of reasons. Perhaps because of their upbringing. When they were given something, there was always strings attached with it or drama. And so they're like, you know what, I don't want to accept this gift because I don't know, like, what comes with it. Right. So I'm also someone who, I'm so passionate about elevating people and getting them connected. And so when I get like an amazing podcast opportunity, I know the host is looking for other great guests. I love to recommend friends or I love to connect people to an editor or a writer, whatever it is. And I have had. It doesn't happen often, but occasionally I want to help someone. And I can tell that all kinds of emotions come up and they're like, afraid that I'm Giving them something so that I can like get something in return. Or they're gonna get entangled in this thing when really I'm coming from a place of no strings attached. I just want to be a helpful person so that that happens sometimes and is what it is. But to circle back, because I didn't fully answer the question of a generosity fund. So it's this idea that you want to carve out resources, financial resources, or it could be time, resources. Right. To help other people. So we'll just use the example of a business owner. So let's say you're an entrepreneur. Let's say you make $100,000 a year. Perhaps you're like, you know what, I want to give 10% of that or not 10%. 1% in my generosity fund. Right. 1% is a pretty small amount in the grand scheme of things. So that would be $1,000. Right. So you could help 20 people in a meaningful way for $50.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Right.

[Selena Su]

Or you could do something like really breathtakingly generous for $200. So in my book, I share the example where I was working with a money coach and I just thought that she was the best thing ever. We all know what it's like to have one on one support, and especially in an area that's so important, like money. And I would tell all my friends, like, you gotta hire this person, she's amazing. And I was literally having the conversation seven times with like my best friend and other people, and they just weren't doing it for whatever reason. And so I was like, what if I just bought the sessions for you? And. And so I went to my coach, Jenna Rose, and I was like, if I just did like bulk sessions, I just got you like dozens upon dozens of like your ideal clients. Could you create some kind of like discounted package so I can just give away sessions? Because I want to help my friends and I love gifting people things. And so she basically gave me four sessions. With her, it's so low, it's $200. But she was just getting started at the time. And she also knew that sometimes it can take two conversations or more for someone to become a paying long term client. And so she was like happy to do it for me. And it was like, okay, at that rate, like I can just like anyone that I care about, if I feel like they need it, I'm just gonna give it to them. So I gave one person the four sessions and by the second session she was like, Jenna Rose showed me how to save fifteen hundred dollars a Month, right? So if we do the Math, that's like $18,000 a year, $36,000 for two years. So I got creative, right? Because you have to create these opportunities. And it was like, I invested 200 dol friendship. This person is now saving $18,000 a year. So she's obviously happy. Jenna Rose is happy because this person's going to probably want to give her a testimony or keep on working with her beyond the sessions I purchased. And for me, I'm happy because I've strengthened an important business relationship. Now think about putting $200 in the stock market, right? You might get a $14 return. I don't want to say. I'm not saying don't invest in the stock market. Do that is like a very important part of your plan. But what I'm saying is, in addition to investing in the stock market and whatever else, you do estate, right? What about setting aside a portion of that money? Whether it's $1,000, $5,000, $10,000, it depends on your business, your career, what you have available to you to pour into people. But for me, that $200 that I spent on my friend and many other friends far exceeds any kind of stock market return. And it's not that, like, I need them to, you know, then provide something to me of equal value or even anything. It's more this idea that like. Like when we are a generous person and we think about others and generosity is our lifestyle and we pour into our network is also going to love us, support us. So it's not about investing in one person and then getting why back. It's just investing in your network overall and, like, prioritizing people.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

What I love too, about that investment in particular is that it wasn't flowers, it wasn't cookies. And I look, I love when people send me gifts, but wow, you really thought about what could change the lives of the people you cared about. It was a win. A win for you, a win for your friends who were receiving this money coach, these money coaching lessons, and then the money coach who was getting referrals and potentially new clients. It's brilliant. If you had to codify that. What is it? What is the sort of like the strategy behind that?

[Selena Su]

Yeah, I was talking to actually our mutual friend Ramit Sethi, and he was also saying that, like, for $100 or $200, you can do, like, pretty. That's a good dollar amount. Right. So the strategy is really setting aside money so that you're not having to debate every time, do I do this, it's automatic, right? For the year, I want to pour $2,000 into my network or I want to gift 20 sessions of my own, right? So first of all, you're deciding, like, how much money or what kind of resources to set aside over the course of a year. And then you're identifying who are the people that you. You want to pour into. The people that you pour into are going to be circle 1, 2, and 3. And we'll go into that later, because there's six circles, but 1, 2, and 3 are the ones that you invest in. And then you want to think about what would be breathtakingly generous. And so that's paying attention. So for me, I know that she's a single mom, and there were just things like were happening in her life. And you have these people, and then you think about how. How can I support them? And it's something that comes naturally. It's like you have. I actually believe. And maybe I guess it's natural, and it's not natural. I actually believe that people should create a list of their top relationships, because I think that sometimes we can forget. It's, oh, my gosh, I haven't talked to you in five years. You haven't talked to you in three years. But for all of us, there are people that really matter to us, and we want to remember, like, we want to show up for them. So you decide who the people are. You have the money set aside, and then, you know, you are either that dream amplifier or that pain detective, and you give people things that can really benefit them.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Dream amplifier, pain detective. All right, let's talk about the six circles. The first three are where you are investing. Circle one, two, and three. That's innermost, treasured, and active.

[Selena Su]

Yes. So circle one. So these are your innermost, your closest relationships. This is someone who is doing life with you. They're on the pulse day to day or week by week of what's happening. So for many of us, this will be our life partner, perhaps our very best friend. It could potentially be your mom or sister. It might be a business partner. But these are people that, you know, see your highs, see your lows, who love you unconditionally, and they're there on the journey for you. They are a witness to your life. That's circle one right now, circle two. These are people that are very important to you. These are your treasured connections. But they might not know what's happening day by day or week by week. But these people feel like soul, family. These could be Dear friends that you know that if you texted them and said, hey, can I speak to you tonight? Like I need 20 minutes of your time, they would be like, yes, I'm there. Right. For circle two, it's a pleasure and a priority to show up for the important people in their lives. That is for circle one. And so this could be, this would actually be team members, it could be longtime friends, it could be certain peers that go into circle two. And you really do trust them and care about them. And then there's circle three. Oh, and so circle one, just to be clear, some people have zero people in circle one. Other people maybe have like maybe 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5 people. It's small circle one. Right. It's not everyone. And then circle two is usually half a dozen to a dozen, maybe a little more. And then circle three, there's going to be quite a number of people, Multiple dozens and dozens of people. So this is your active network. And so these are people who care about you. You care about them, you respect them. It's the kind of person that if they had to crash for a night at your place, they're coming to town, you would be comfortable actually letting them into your home. That's like a, what do you call it?

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Like a litmus test.

[Selena Su]

Litmus test, that's the word. Yeah. If you're comfortable letting them into your home, you're comfortable maybe sharing something with them in confidence and you know that they will keep it private. Right. These are people that you also feel comfortable referring business to or introducing to others. Right. So with circle three, there's a lot of people, there's mutual respect and care. You're not necessarily each other's number one priority. But if you did reach out to them, they would absolutely get back to you. If not right away, then with a follow up message. Right. But these are active connections of yours. Now then there's circle four. And so there's a couple reasons why someone might be in circle four, which.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Is the distant relationship.

[Selena Su]

Yes, thank you. Yeah, distant relationship. So you'd have known them for a long time. But you're like, ah, there's a little bit of a values misalignment. Maybe every time you get together with them, they're down in the dumps. They're always complaining about things or criticizing people. Maybe they're unreliable and you're like, ah, I can't count on this person. And there's just something about them where you're like, I don't feel like an alignment with them. Right. So that's one reason values misalignment. Another reason might be you literally just met them. And so even though you're like, oh my gosh, like they're so cool, but if you've only had one conversation or two conversations, the reality is they're still a stranger. And therefore there isn't that trust. Right. Because trust gets built over time. So the circles are really based on like trust and proximity. So they're still. They're going to be in circle four until multiple additional interactions. Interactions. Another reason why they might be in circle four is if you're honest with yourself. Like your circles one, two and three are full. You're like, I'm maxed out with kids, with my existing friends, with everything happening in my career that I don't really have the headspace to make someone else active. Connection. I'm just, I'm at a place where I'm maxed out. And studies have shown that the human brain, the neocortex, like they can really only manage about 150 meaningful relationships at a time.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

And it's a lot. I feel like that's a lot. Like I thought maybe like 30.

[Selena Su]

30. Yeah. And I say the time. It's like they can be someone that you connect with every six months or. Yeah, like that kind of.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

They're not all showing up to your house that night, right?

[Selena Su]

Yeah. Yeah. So there, there's just a real limit right now. Then there's circle five. So this is disconnected. And this is someone that basically you don't feel safe with, right? It could be someone where it's not even a relationship.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Like why even put it in a circle? Circle.

[Selena Su]

Oh no, I think it's good to put it in a circle because it's like, it's like far.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

You're identifying, right?

[Selena Su]

You're identifying like where. You're moving them too, right? So it could be someone where it's. I don't know if you've been in this situation for anoosh, but I know you've like me. You've been around the block, right? You've done a lot. It's like you have a conversation with someone and nothing ever seems to change. Maybe they gaslight you. Maybe it's just a dead end. You know what? This isn't going anywhere. You're done. You tried and now you're done. Another thing could be maybe, maybe they're nice to you, but you know that other people said that they're a harmful, dangerous person. I know someone who's very litigious and loves to sue people. And even though this individual has tried to get close to me, like, personally, I don't feel safe. And so I just, like, I'm kind, I'm respectful, but I don't, I don't engage. I don't try to meet up or anything like that. So that's like a circle five for me. And then circle six are basically unknown connections. You might know of each other online, but you haven't connected and had a real conversation. So everyone in the world falls somewhere into the six circles of connection, but you pour your energy into 1, 2, and 3.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Someone was like, I was at the gym and I, I follow random people online. Like I follow Mark Wahlberg. And I was telling the girls at the gym, I was like, oh, my gosh, do you follow Mark Wahlberg? He's so funny. Like, he. It's all about showing his outfits and his meals and there. And this woman said, oh, do you have lunch with him? And I said, no, of course not. He's not like a real person in my life. She goes, no. That's a saying where if you follow someone enough online and you know so much about their lives and you do scroll and watch them during your lunch hour, it's like you're having lunch with them.

[Selena Su]

Oh, okay.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Oh, is that a thing that Gen Z is saying now? But I just thought that was funny that we do feel like people will stop me on the street and be like, oh, my God, how's your kids? Because they would listen to the podcast or now locally, I have a Montclair pod. So people really know what I'm doing. Like, they know I'm at the gym every day. And like, people come by and they're like, we knew we'd find you here. And they're not stalking me. But it's. I think the Internet has made it with podcasts and logs. We are learning about people constantly. And so when we see them in real life, we see. We feel like they're a rich relationship. Maybe they're not.

[Selena Su]

They can still be a rich relationship and that they've poured into you. Right.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

It's one sided, but it's one sided. Like, in a way.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. Circle six.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

This is fascinating. And again, I think you're right to point out that sometimes people aren't always in an active circle. Sometimes they're distant, sometimes they become treasured. It just depends on. What does it depend on, actually?

[Selena Su]

Yeah. So it really depends on trust, you know, who you feel comfortable with and also how they show up for you. There's certain People, you meet them and you just feel there's a connection. Like, I feel like they love me, they care about me, they are interested in what I'm doing, they're supportive of my work, and they show up consistently over time. Those are the relationships that you really want to nurture and prioritize. And what I love about the six circles is it's not about, oh, I prioritize the people that have the most power, the most money, or the XYZ status. Right. It's not going to prioritize people who show up for me, who I feel safe with, who I trust, and I'm going to know what circles they fall in. So just to be clear, like, this is a framework for you. It's not something that you tell others, right? You're not like, I moved you from circle two to circle four. But sometimes you're like, hey, like, I thought this person was circle two. And the way that they're acting, it's because if we're in circle four, huh?

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Do you ever get. Do you ever get comments from people like, I've never thought to put people in circles and to create a system around relationships and, like, almost science to it. It's not instinctive for us to do this.

[Selena Su]

No, it's not. It's not. I think that me and my bestie, Heidi, we came up with this together, and it's because we were also spending time with certain people, and it was like, she can come to the big party, but we're not going to get close. We can't rely on this person anymore. So it's really a mental framework for yourself. Some people know my bestie. Okay, you're my circle one. I also, Sherry Salata, who I believe you know, too, who used to work with Oprah, I remember her saying once, maintaining a friendship not rooted in your truth keeps you out of integrity. When I heard this four years ago, I just had, like, shivers, like, just up and down my arms because I was actually living out of integrity. I wasn't trying to, but the reality is I was maintaining relationships with team members, with contractors, with friends that, like, I wasn't in alignment. I think that sometimes we can get excited about people or things start off great. I know for me, once I let someone into my inner circles, I find it in the past at least, like, hard to move them out to different circles, right? Oh, they really care about me. Duh. They're so good at what they do. But I feel like today I have this new standard. I'm personally very sensitive to Emotional volatility. And so if I see anyone, like, volatile, it's just not for me. There are people online that they love to get into, like, arguments regularly and just create all kinds of drama. And I don't think that needs to be a deal breaker for everyone. And some people like that. For me, if I just see that someone is very emotionally charged all the time and, like, drama and chaos surrounds them, it's just. I'm like, I'm not. For me, that's not. Some people like, oh, my gosh, that's entertainment. And for me, I'm like, okay, that's. They can do them, but I don't want, like, any of that. Yeah, yeah.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

It sounds like a lot of this comes down to knowing yourself first. And I hope no one walks away from this thinking. Like, we're talking about how to create. People are people. We're not saying these are like chess parts on a game that we're like, we're putting people in circles. And this is a game. No, this is a way to protect your boundaries, to invest in your community. I love your idea of generosity and that being the motivation. It's planting seeds. And I will say that now, 25 years into my career, I'm not somebody that has the biggest TikTok following. I'm not the most famous in my industry. My podcast is successful, and there are others that are more successful, and I am still able to have a thriving career because of some of the metrics, but mostly because of relationships and the reputation that you put out there in the world. Your brand is your reputation. It is your relationships. And that is huge. It's so huge. I don't think we appreciate that until time. Time. We allow time to do its thing. So I think the other thing I would just remind people is that this system, this strategy, your book, it requires patience and a belief in the system, but really patience, too.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. But here's the thing. For Anoosh, like, we are in relationship with people every single day of our lives. And so I think it's so powerful for people to read this book and adopt the principles, because it's about how to do what you're already doing, just better, with more ease, more success. Yes, it does require patience. And we can't. We don't want to rush things, but you're going to be in relationship. You're going to be talking to people every day anyways. So what if you could connect with people in a way where they feel more and more that they matter, that they're seen that they feel cared for and that you're sharing your goals and dreams with each other. A lot of people. And that's something that they can. We could talk about now. They can also read the book. But. But there's. So there's really three parts to relationship building. Right. And building that million dollar network that we talk about. So one is like building the relationships, like having them knowing people. The second is the nurturing. So that's where the patience is. Right. Cause just cause you know someone or had one conversation doesn't mean that it's an active relationship. It doesn't mean that there's goodwill. It doesn't mean that they're gonna show up for you. So you have to nurture your connections. And then last but not least, you need to have the skills to activate your network when there are things that are important to you. You want people to rally behind you and your goals. You have needs, whatever it is. Knowing how to ask for help. Because there are some people who are like, oh, I'm really good at giving and giving is the nurture. Right. But I really suck at asking for help and only giving and never receiving anything from anyone. That's not really, that's not rich. That's not a rich life. You also want to be supported by people you know and by the network that you pour into.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Yeah. I think that's where relationships break sometimes because there's this expectation that there'll be reciprocity, your generosity will be repaid without you needing to ask for help or ask for what you want or demonstrate what your pain is or talk or articulate what your goals are with these people. That's on us to do. And you're right, it can feel uncomfortable sometimes. So what's your number one, one tip to make it less icky for those who feel uncomfortable, unsettled by putting themselves out there, even with their closest relationships. Even with your innermost circle. Right. You feel sometimes, I don't know, just it's hard to ask for help. Put yourself out there. No 100% show vulnerability.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. A lot of people don't know how to ask for help. So I would say my number one tip is in how you ask for it and asking in a light hearted like no expectations way. So. So when I make an ask, I usually use a phrase like hey, I wanted to run something by you, or this might be a total long shot, but I wanted to see if you were potentially interested in this. Or hey, I'm curious what you think about this or what do you ever consider because when I make asks, I never expect that anyone's going to do anything. And I really believe in win wins. So I think that people will say yes if it's something that they feel inspired to say yes and that it also benefits them. And so if I think of something that is natural and win win, I think there's a good chance that I could get a yes. But it's never expected for sure. I also, this is counterintuitive and one of my someone that came to one of my talks was like Selena, I realized something, you don't believe in reciprocal relationships. And that's really unique because I hear a lot of people, they do say, oh, we need relationships that are reciprocal. And I think to some extent it's semantics, right? So. So for me, I believe in relationships that are energetically abundant and feel good for both people. But I don't believe in reciprocity because what happens is that a couple things. One is if someone gives you something really generous and you believe in reciprocal relationships, you might be like, eek. I don't know if I want to accept that because I don't know if I have the bandwidth to show up and give the person the same thing back. I think also when something is really has a reciprocal focus, there's a bit of a short term focus. I did this for you, so what are you doing for me now? And I don't know, there's plenty of people that I've helped supported where I get an idea or I see a connection, I just do it. And I'm not thinking, okay, when are they going to do that for me? So I just approach things more as coming from a place of what I call relaxed abundance, being a rich giver, generosity as a lifestyle. And I do, I will say that I do expect my network to pour back into me, but it might come from a place that I don't expect. Now we talked about the six circle. So now I feel like we can have an even more advanced conversation. If someone is in circle one or two, it is healthy to expect expect. You know, if you are in a time of crisis and you ask a circle two, can you get on the phone? Or this is my number one goal and dream, I want to share it with you. You should expect that they will listen and care and show up. That's what circle one and two is for the other circles like maybe yes, maybe no. It is healthy to have relationships that we can count on. The whole thing about relationship building is very nuanced. And that's why I've got the whole book for them to read about because, yeah, when we give, obviously we create circumstances where we're more likely to to get. But it's not about giving to get, it's giving to give.

Yes. Yes.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Selena, congratulations. This is such an important book, especially right now. And I don't know anybody who's ever really taken this deep look at relationships. How to build them, how to nurture them, how to activate these relationships. And you're the best person to write this. I really. You are. Rich relationships, everybody. Create a million dollar network for your business. It's going to help and change a lot of lives. Thank you.

[Selena Su]

Thank you so much, Farnooche.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

And before we go, tell us about your free gift for readers.

[Selena Su]

Yes, absolutely. So I'm all about getting this message out into the world. I want everyone to have these ideas in their hands. So I'm doing some exciting things. So number one, you can go to richrelationships book.com Farnoon so richrelationshipsbook.com Farnoosh and you can get the first four chapters for free. You are also going to get a bundle of my rich relationship scripts because as people go through the book, they're like, oh, my gosh, the scripts are so good. Because a lot of rich relationships is knowing the words to use to start a relationship, to nurture a relationship, to even say no without damaging the relationship, and how to activate and make ask. And so I put all the scripts in the book together in a bundle that they're going to get for free at that link and then they're also going to be entered to win 1000. And I know your audience is all about money, so yes, we like that. Yes. Yeah.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Thousand dollars. Wow.

[Selena Su]

Yeah. So they can go to richrelationshipsbook.com Farnoosh the contest is open until May 30th, so I know that we're dropping this in April, so be sure to sign up. Also, one of the surprising things, maybe you know this farnish, if you've ever run giveaways, a lot less people throw their hat in the ring than you expect.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

I know what's up with that. People. People.

[Selena Su]

Yeah.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Selena, thank you so much.

[Selena Su]

Thank you.

[Farnoosh Torabi]

Thanks so much to Selena sue for joining us. Visit richrelationshipsbook.com Farnooche For a chance to win $1,000, get the first four chapters of Rich Relationships for free and over two dozen scripts for emails, texts and conversations to start building your rich relationships today. I'll see you back here on Friday. And I hope your day is so Money. This episode is brought to you by.

[Selena Su]

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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[Selena Su]

Perfect companion for that mindset.

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[Selena Su]

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Each episode features expert insights with real stories so you're not just getting the numbers, you're hearing how people in communities are working toward real, lasting solutions. If you're curious, thoughtful and want just.

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[Farnoosh Torabi]

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