← So Money with Farnoosh Torabi
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- [00:02]
Farnoosh Torabi
Looking for a high yield savings account or car insurance. I've curated my Go to Financial tools all in one place@somoneylinks.com these are the resources I trust, presented in partnership with Money Magazine. So Money Links is no overwhelm, no fluff, just solid vetted options to help you save more and stress less. So moneylinks.com check it out foreign.
- [00:30]
Montclair Film
This episode of the Montclair Pod is brought to you by Montclair Film, our town's hub for film, storytelling and community connection. From thought provoking indie screenings and Q&As with acclaimed filmmakers to improv nights, live performances and classes in filmmaking, screenwriting and much more, Montclair Film offers something for everyone who loves the power of a story. It's also home to one of the country's premier film festivals each fall drawing audiences and talent from around the world. Right here to Montclair. Want to see what's playing or sign up for a class? Visit montclairfilm.org for the full calendar of events and ways to get involved. Now on with the show.
- [01:12]
Sanibel
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- [01:40]
Farnoosh Torabi
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- [03:23]
Sanibel
When there aren't really consequences for your actions and there's always a way to like pay your way out of getting expelled from school or like literal crimes. Right? I do think it kind of messes with like your decision making faculties because you don't understand that like if you do X then Y will happen.
- [03:40]
Farnoosh Torabi
Welcome to Sew Money, everybody. I'm Farnoosh Tarabi. If you've ever been curious about the behaviors and dynamics of the ultra wealthy that go beyond terms like quiet luxury or Nepo baby, you're in for quite the conversation with our guest, Sanibel. Sanibel is a journalist and author of the forthcoming novel to have and have More. Her essays on class, privilege and race appear in New York Magazine, Elle and Lit Hub. Sanibel earned her MFA from the New School and her BA in Classical studies from the University of Pennsylvania. I first discovered her on social media where she was dissecting really interesting concepts about the ultra wealthy. Terms like casual wealth, stealth privilege, rich people, cheat code. Topics we'll definitely unpack in our conversation today. I was also curious to ask her about our cultural relationship with the idea of class. Middle class, upper middle class, rich wealthy. Is getting too rich too quickly a problem in our culture? Does having a lot of wealth and a lot of privilege make you inherently less empathetic, less kind? Here's Sanibel. Sanibel, welcome to SEW Money. I'm so happy to finally be chatting with you. I've been following you online. Love your work.
- [04:55]
Sanibel
Thank you so much. I'm so happy to be able to talk to you today. So many bad things on social media, but this was one good thing to come out of it. Oh, really?
- [05:02]
Farnoosh Torabi
Oh, I feel I'm, I'm honored. Well, let me tell you, you're doing Something that I have never seen or heard anyone do in the money space online in the way that you do it, it's so precise, very thought provoking. And so I just want to start by saying I really admire your work and what you're doing. Just to let the audience in on this is you explain and you shed light on the subtle and sometimes not so subtle dynamics of wealthy people and how they use wealth sometimes as a symbol of their class, their status, their privilege, their power. You know, often in the traditional media, the. The closest we ever get to pointing out the interesting behaviors of the ultra wealthy is when we throw around terms like quiet luxury or nepo babies. But you get into like stealth privilege and coattail riders and the quote unquote cheat code. These are all terms that you have more or less coined. What Sanibel, inspired you to examine the world of the ultra wealthy so thoughtfully and through what I think is sort of this anthropological, social, behavioral lens?
- [06:07]
Sanibel
Well, I so appreciate your kind words about my content because that is not a space I was in until a few months ago. Foremost, I'm a novelist and one of my friends urged me to start making videos to promote my book. So really what I'm riffing on my video are like the themes that are in my book. So when I'm talking about privilege, like, a lot of these ideas come from I went to a prep school, my book is set at a prep school. And a lot of these things I didn't really think about because this was so normal in my world and amongst my friends. And then when I was at Penn, it was a lot more of the same. But I think when I went to grad school, I attended the New School in Manhattan, and I was in sort of a different world and with a lot of different people. It made me examine privilege in class and especially race much more. And I think also like, the culture changed. And my book in large part is about microaggressions, which we didn't even have a word for when I was in high school. So in my videos today, when I'm unpacking, cross class relationships and friendships are of great interest to people. A lot of what I'm bringing in is also from my day job as a journalist, which I'm not speaking about things like in an editorial way there usually it's not like my opinion. It's usually just like roundups of products and trends and what is trending in a big way for a long time is like stealth, wealth, succession, type of style, quiet luxury. And these are such Interesting concepts and I kind of bridge like the thematic content in my book and then these more like clickbaity terms to come up with the ideas for my videos. And it is interesting to see the responses because, yeah, like it's one thing to talk about status symbols and you're talking about a Birkin bag or a Mediterranean vacation, but I think what's more interesting are the things that you don't just like buy with money. It's like these, these wealth indicators and signals that are more low key.
- [08:07]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah, I watched one of your videos. It's like the women in the pilates class at 11am with a giant diamond ring. You know, having lived in New York City myself for almost 20 years and I eventually became self employed and so I could take those 11am Physique 57 classes and I would see celebrities and I would see very. I mean like it's subtle, right? But you notice it like their cars are picking them up. They're. They're not Ubers. These are their drivers. Let's talk about your book. It's called to have and have More. Is it fiction based on true stories based on true events?
- [08:45]
Sanibel
It's fiction. It is very loosely inspired by my experience at prep school. But I mean at the time I was not very self reflective or self critical because you're 15, 16, 17. So I really enjoyed my prep school experience. But I think that what I'm writing about is sort of what was going on that I wasn't aware of. So my book is a satire about privilege, class, wealth. And you can't talk about class without talking about race. So my main character is this girl, Emory, and she's Korean, but she's adopted into a wealthy white family. And when she goes to this prep school which I've named Derrymore Academy, she is like fully equipped to succeed. And she has money and she has status and her dad is a trustee and she's a great tennis player. But she's unhappy and it's sort of this inchoate disillusionment that she starts to experience. And some of it has to do with like microaggressions, but she doesn't have a name for it. And like what is this discomfort? What is the dissonance between her and the white friends that she grew up with? Like she's feeling some kind of like weird shift though, and this pushes her into a friendship with someone who she like initially despises. Lila is like uncool and dresses terribly and she's middle class. Like God forbid, right?
- [10:05]
Farnoosh Torabi
God forbid.
- [10:07]
Sanibel
She doesn't like her at first. She, like, bullies her. But they have this begrudging, toxic friendship. And that is sort of what the book is like, mostly about this really toxic friendship where when there's alpha and a beta and they stay in their roles, it can be functional even while it's toxic. But I think what arises and the conflict in my book is that Lila sort of starts to come into her own, and she is smart, and people are saying, you have such a bright future ahead of you. And this really threatens Emory. And the friendship can't really hold when Emory feels like, okay, I'm rich and popular. Why are you not deferring to me? And so, like, the ups and downs of this friendship have a lot to do with class and privilege. And so, like, that's sort of the case in which, like, I'm able to talk about all these different ways that privilege manifests and can be really deleterious for friendships.
- [11:02]
Farnoosh Torabi
Who are you? In the book?
- [11:05]
Sanibel
I think both of these characters, there's pieces of me because I think the thing that I was so, like, unaware of when I was in high school was, like, how race factors into the way that your privilege is perceived. And, like, I love Nella Larson's book passing. And after I read that, I was thinking about, like, cultural passing, because if you have money, you will be like, let past certain gate kept markers, but, like, at a certain point, you hit a wall.
- [11:38]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yes.
- [11:38]
Sanibel
And just the fact that Emory, even though she. Her dad is a trustee and she's from a wealthy family and she has the right family name just because she looks Korean, she's, like, not fully accepted. And her peers will, like, gossip about her and say, like, she's not really like a Hooper. She's adopted.
- [11:55]
Farnoosh Torabi
Right. Already, I can tell you have opinions in writing this fiction book that come through in the writing commentary about race and how it factors into wealth status. What are some of the other insightful things that you want people to walk away with?
- [12:11]
Sanibel
It's very much a sad rich girl book because I love the gilded cage phenomenon. And what I mean by that is, like, I think a lot of these wealthy students, especially when they're teenagers, and I, in my capacity as a college essay consultant, I work with them closely. Every year for, like, the past five years, I help these prep school kids write their admissions essays. And maybe if you watch my content, you already see this. I'm sort of like a rich kid apologist. And yes, they have first world problems, but they're very big problems. And I think the tremendous pressure and anxiety they have is because they're kind of told like, you already have everything you need to be successful. So you can either like maintain that.
- [12:57]
Farnoosh Torabi
You'Re not allowed to complain, you're not allowed to be upset, you're not allowed to have any other emotion except gratitude and happiness. Yeah, I get that.
- [13:05]
Sanibel
And, and like the only other option is like, you might fail. And like what you really cannot do is anything different than what's expected of you. And I think that if you're, if you're lucky enough to want to go to an IV and want a career in finance, then like that's, that's like the best case scenario. Like then you'll be able to do that successfully. But I think they also feel like there's, there's a lot of threat. And what they have to do and what they're like scrapping so hard to do is to maintain a foothold in their success. And they're told like, if you can't, like some people have to be socially mobile, they have to go from here up to here. Whereas like, if you're already starting at the top, then all you have to do is maintain it. And like they're kind of told like, that's easy. Can't you just maintain it? But it's not, it's really scary. And when you have like with these gilded cages, you actually have the key. Like you could let yourself out. But I think you're told so many times like, you have what everyone else wants, so why would you even consider any other life? And I think like, that really crushes your self belief that gives you like no sense of autonomy. And I always think of the, like that deeply toxic Patek Philippe slogan that's like, you don't ever own a Patek, you take care of it for the next generation. Something like that. And it's like this family heirloom, this watch that's going to be passed down from generation to generation. But like, it kind of speaks to the fact that like, you are not an individual, you're just like a member of this dynasty.
- [14:37]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [14:37]
Sanibel
And you don't get any individuality.
- [14:41]
Farnoosh Torabi
So you say you're a rich kid apologist, but do you also think that being too rich and I don't, I'm not like trying to lead you to an answer here, but I'm just curious, you think that there's something called being too rich and that you've. I don't know if I saw it on your profile or somewhere else expressed, but that when You're. When you're really, really ultra wealthy and you're kind of detached from the quote unquote real world, you become inherently less empathet. What's your experience with that?
- [15:06]
Sanibel
I know, and I've worked with plenty of like rich kids who are definitely entitled. And I'm. Right now I'm first going through like the things that spark humanity or that I'm sympathetic to. One of my recent videos, which was inspired actually by a friend who said he was bad at relationship commitment and he thought it might have something to do with growing up wealthy where you don't ever have to make like a binding decision. And in a way, I think this is territory that my book traverses also. It's like when there aren't really consequences for your actions and there's always a way to pay your way out of getting expelled from school or even literal crimes. Right. I do think it kind of messes with your decision making faculties because you don't understand that if you do X, then Y will happen. And I also think about, there's that scene in American Psycho where I think he murders two women and then he has to flee the scene and he goes back the next day to clean it up, but like someone else has already cleaned it up. Like there's a new coat of like fresh white paint on the walls. And like that's the most disconcerting thing because it sort of means like, your behavior is excused and someone's going to quietly mop up your mess and you can't ever like be reprimanded. And I think there's times that like rich kids act out, they want attention from their parents, they get expelled from school so that they get some attention, even if it's negative. And the parents treat it kind of like, oh, this is just like a nuisance, this is a parking ticket. Like we'll just like pay for you to get into another school.
- [16:40]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah. The idea of class is such a. It evokes so many different feelings and people this idea of middle class, especially if you grew up middle class, but maybe grew up middle class in like the 2000s, not in the 50s. You know, it's like you had less probably than those before you. And so you want more, you want, you want to strive for more. What do you think, what do you think about the just the word class and why it creates such a visceral reaction? Lower class, middle class, upper class. Yeah, yeah.
- [17:12]
Sanibel
It's an interesting question because I do find that people are so defensive, especially if you're say Instagram comments I think because almost no matter what, whether you're where you sit on the financial socioeconomic spectrum, you have defensiveness. Either maybe your scared people are attacking your privilege and you're rich or you're poor and you feel insecure about that. But like it immediately taps into insecurity. So if you make any kind of finance related content, you're like accidentally also making rage bait. And people love to tell their entire story in the comments, right? Like, well I grew up like this and I'm not entitled or whatever it is. But like this idea of striving. I feel like everyone feels like other people have more and it's that comparison is the thief of joy idea. But everyone kind of falls prey to that.
- [18:06]
Farnoosh Torabi
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They work directly with top factories, cut out the middlemen and pass the savings to us. Most pieces cost half as much as similar luxury items, and they're made with premium fabrics in safe, ethical factories. Elevate your fall wardrobe essentials with quince. Go to quince.com sewmoney for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's Q-U-I-N C E.com somoney quince.com somoney it's just really fascinating and I think it's probably its own episode as we unpack it. But yeah, your content is just. This is why your content's so great, because it is so thought provoking. It's not common where I come across financial content where I'm like, oh, I want to like, learn more here. And she's really saying something that's either like making people unsettled, but let's dig into that. Why is that? I'm curious how history, and specifically in the U.S. sanibel, you think has shaped our relationship with money and specifically our fascination with wealth. I don't know if you caught this clip, but Jerry Seinfeld, who's practically a billionaire, said recently that when he was starting out in his career in the 70s, he said, back then you pursued what you loved and the coolness of your job was what gave you status. It wasn't about the money back then. This is just one guy's perspective. Right? It's Jerry Seinfeld. And I'm not sure how accurate that is, but his criticism was really about how you could suddenly today make so much money fast. Right. With the Internet and influencer work that it has, quote, unquote, poisoned our culture, he said, around money and sort of our relationship to money. What do you think of that? And how do you think our culture's relationship to money has evolved as we've become this country that not everybody, but there are new ways to make money. And in some ways it's fast than in previous generations. How has that impacted our perception of wealth?
- [23:52]
Sanibel
In a way, I've only been an adult thinking about money for less than 10 years. So my historical perspective is very short. But I think there's no way you can avoid talking about social media. And I think wealth is just so much more visible these days. And that's maybe where, like, the toxic reactions come to it, because immediately you're comparing yourself. But I also think there's like, okay, you know in the Devil Wears Prada, when Miranda Priestley says something like, everyone wants to be us, right?
- [24:24]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [24:25]
Sanibel
And there's like this smugness in that statement, though, because it's not really true because at the end of the movie, the Anne Hathaway character decides, like, I don't want to be in that world at all. Like, she doesn't want to Be us. And I feel like the. The thing that is impossible to impart to, like, say, my high school students, because they're too young and you have to learn it for yourself, is that when your entire life revolves around, like, okay, I want that house in the Hamptons. I want to be able to go on lavish vacations whenever I want or fly private, like, you kind of have to orient your entire life around that. And if there's something else that you want to do, like, say, creatively, that becomes a non factor. And I think, like, for me personally, it was really difficult because I'm freelance journalist. I also do this consulting on the side. I'm trying to be a novelist full time. Like, that's my goal. But, like, my career started in finance because I was at Penn and we had OCR and that was on campus recruiting. And that was. That was like, very fun. I was very familiar with that, like, competition, like, we're all fighting to get jobs the same way that you were applying to get into colleges. And like, I was kind of trained to succeed in that. Sort of like pitting yourself against others. But then, like, once I got to that job, I had like, zero interest in staying there even for a year. I think I quit after like 14 months. And then I'm sort of like starting from scratch and I'm not really prepare for the. What was difficult when I was post MFA was like, my friends were in tech, they were in finance, they were like climbing the ladder. They were getting direct reports, and I was like, trying to pitch an article and get one accepted a month. Exactly. For absolutely no money. And it's like, you have to decide for yourself, like, okay, I'm gonna walk away from this, this kind of like, steady, surefire path. And I'm talking about this as like a child of privilege. And I'm gonna choose to do something that people are not gonna really validate, and they're gonna be like, what are you doing? Why would you do that? Especially my parents too. And so, like, you have to sort of have that realization yourself. But I think that with sad, sad rich girls, these guilded cage, you have the realization and then you, like, tamp it down and you think, I would. I would rather have the handbags and the vacations especially, because if I chart out in this, like, unknown territory, who knows what's going to happen? I'm probably going to fail.
- [26:52]
Farnoosh Torabi
Mm. Let's talk about some of these terms that you express on your fantastic Tik TikTok and Instagram casual wealth. What do you mean? By casual wealth. Depict that for us.
- [27:05]
Sanibel
Okay. A lot of the terms, like I said, are borrowed from like, e commerce journalism, where I'm picking up on trends, but casual wealth is maybe one I came up with more on my own word. I. I think it's just like this sort of casual spending of disposable income. And so when I'm talking about it, I think it's in the context of like at boarding school, so many of these kids will order doordash every night instead of eating at the dining hall. You can buy whatever you want on Amazon. You don't have to ask mom or dad. And like, as you get older and as maybe it's your own money that you can spend, I think it's the not wondering or thinking about budgeting.
- [27:41]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [27:42]
Sanibel
And like, I had a friend who we recently went on a trip and afterwards I said, venmo me for the. You picked up the tab and we're all gonna split it for some restaurant that we went to.
- [27:52]
Farnoosh Torabi
And.
- [27:52]
Sanibel
And he was like, how am I supposed to remember how much that cost? And then I was like, look at your credit card statement. And then from his face, I could tell that this man had never once looked at his credit card statement. He was like, oh, yeah, that exists.
- [28:05]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah. It's kind of like a synonymous with relaxed wealth. When I ask people sometimes what does it mean to be wealthy? They'll say, the ability to go to a restaurant and not have to look at the prices and not care about that. Right. And I can order an appetizer and I can get a drink and I don't have to be penny pinching until I get home or going to the grocery store and just taking. Putting things in the cart that I need and not worrying about what it's going to tally at the end.
- [28:31]
Sanibel
Right. Or if you're sick or you have a toothache, like, the fact of money does not even enter your mind about making that appointment.
- [28:39]
Farnoosh Torabi
Right. Especially for these things that are categorically necessities. Right. Food, health care. Yeah. Stealth privilege. I think we kind of touched on this.
- [28:48]
Sanibel
Okay. Stealth privilege was fun. I think I was trying to make content that was different because I know people love to click on the content about status symbols, Birkin bags, like I said. And I was like, how do I not just replicate that? Because frankly, that's not interesting to me. But I think, like, when we're commenting on other people's privilege or judging it or just like tallying it up, like, there are little giveaways that tip you off, right? And so like with stealth privilege, I was like, what are the things that someone does or possesses that indicates to me like someone who is like pretty fluid in this. This is what I think about and talk about a lot. And like that 11am Pilates class that you mentioned is one of those things. But I think it's so interesting because I do think there's much more so self consciousness about wealth these days and more of an effort to maybe not hide it, but not to be like flagrant about it. Yeah, I think it's considered deceptive to pretend like you're poor if you're rich, but there's such a fine line and I think there's so much like discomfort and fear about like, if you're wealthy, what is the right way to present it? Like, what are you allowed to show? And a lot of it also has to do with like, is your money generational wealth? Because then you should be somewhat ashamed. If you're self made, then feel free to flaunt it. Like there are different rules for different parties in this.
- [30:04]
Farnoosh Torabi
Wow, it's so complex. You know, can there be a rule that says if you're not wealthy, don't flaunt fake things online that you know, that you bought on credit or. Seriously, there, There is so much of this cosplay going online where it's like, I'm rich, but I'm really, you know. But you're not there. There are huge accounts, young men, I would say, who are sort of these entrepreneur wannabes, aspirational, rich, aspirational guys. It's always some gu muscle T shirt talking about how, why would I ever cook myself any food? You're telling me that I need to get into my Hummer, drive to the grocery store, pick up food, wait in line, wait for it to get bagged. I'm like, how long have you been. You haven't been to the grocery store in a while, have you? Because you don't. They don't bag your groceries anymore. Get back in my Hummer. He's like, why would I do that if I can just like, you know, order in from the restaurant next door? And he's trying to make the point that like, my time is money. But he's basically also telling us about how wealthy he is through this, this little narrative and this little soliloquy of his. This was just yesterday on social media. As you said, there's a lot of junk online.
- [31:11]
Sanibel
I mean, the cosplay thing you bring up is a great point to talk about because I think people think that they're building their brand. Like I'm gonna invest in these outfits and in this vacation because then like I will seem more rich and then people will offer me more opportunities because so many people are trying to be content creators, right? And if your brand, if you're a lifestyle influencer, your brand is sometimes just being rich, the appearance of being rich. And in keeping with that, the quiet luxury aesthetic, which performs very well in my commerce articles. And that is also an aesthetic that is all about appearing rich. It has nothing to do with fashion as an art or self expression. It's like I want people to look at my beige outfit and my neutrals and think that I'm rich because of that. And it's like this kind of warped these like self identities where something that is supposed to be self expression ends up just being like class indicators.
- [32:10]
Farnoosh Torabi
And the irony, Sanibel, is that when I see somebody online who seems to be putting on a wealthy show, I don't trust them. I start to get suspicious of their motivation and what they're really putting out there. And at the end of the day, if you want to build a brand, it comes down to can you be trusted? Do you come across as someone who's authentic, who's being original? My friends have said, you know, who have online accounts. Like when I go online and I'm not wearing makeup and I'm doing a reel, I get more engagement than when I'm all dressed up and quote unquote, showing off. You know, the restaurant that I'm eating in. So be yourself. You don't need all the accoutrements.
- [32:49]
Sanibel
I mean, it's funny how authenticity has also become twisted. I feel like that was like the word for the past six, seven years. But authenticity is also a facade now, right? Because it's like, okay, if I hear that advice, I'm like, okay, I'm going to make sure that I look my absolute worst to like draw people in in a way that's, that's like a pervers of authenticity also.
- [33:08]
Farnoosh Torabi
Right, right, right, right. Hey. Oh my gosh. Rich people cheat code. Do you remember talking about this?
- [33:15]
Sanibel
I remember coming up with that, that headline. I mean, sometimes the word like cheat code is. There's like an Instagram vernacular and I notice like, if I play into it or I use like the word like unhinged or like X topic needs to be studied, there's certain phrases that will just like grab people's attention. And that is more like my journalist training. But like, would I much prefer if I could just Say things like straightforward.
- [33:39]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [33:40]
Sanibel
Yes. And like for the rich people cheat code, someone, I think it was like quitting, right? Like I'm saying, like the cheat code is like that you can just quit whatever you want whenever you want with no consequences. And someone commented like, that's just a luxury. And like I never reply to the comments, but it's like, yeah, but no one would click it if I wrote rich people luxury. Like that's, that's not as rich people. Right, right, right, right, right.
- [34:05]
Farnoosh Torabi
You're so talented. So you want to be a novelist. You want to be a novelist, but I feel like you can. And that's, that's a really hard pursuit. That's a really hard pursuit and you're doing it. But you seem to have a lot of different interests. Do you see yourself as sort of a multi hyphenate down the road?
- [34:21]
Sanibel
To be honest, I'm so glad that, that my content connected us. But my goal, and maybe I'm, I'm too vocal about this on my Instagram is like, I would prefer because everything is reductive, it's a bit and a half and I never get to make the full point that I want to make. And when sometimes when I see like people saying like, oh, but you forgot this or forgot that, it's like, I would have loved to mention that, but you don't have the attention span to handle it. So like I deeply despise social media. I hadn't posted, I think since 2015. And then when my friend said like post and you've got to do everything you can to support your book, I was, I agree with her. So I started doing it. But I, I feel like it caters to, you know, the term brain rot. It's on TikTok more than Instagram, but it's like it's, sometimes it's an insult or someone will comment like, brain rot. This video is just straight up brain rot. And, and it's true, like that is the best description.
- [35:19]
Farnoosh Torabi
Your content is not, I mean, I, I, it is so good. And I'm not just saying that because you're a guest on my show and I want to fluff your feathers. I really, I mean, I reached out to you. I very rarely proactively reach out to, to people to be on my show. A lot, lot of it is inbound and we go through a lot of queries. But I was like, oh my gosh, I, because I got so curious watching your content. I know you can't go on and on and on, but it's quality and what you say, you have a script like it feels like every word counts and has been selected carefully. But that's probably the writer in you.
- [35:53]
Sanibel
No, I mean, I. I definitely sketch it out and I try to have like. I'm hoping that people will be enticed by like the way that I think. Not necessarily the topic itself enough to buy my book. Because in my book I get to explore these things at length and I can tell an entire story. But it's not nonfiction, it's fiction. But I feel like thematically it's so much better to get at questions about class, race, and wealth through fiction because you can read as many articles as many scholarly papers, but it doesn't show you how it affects people on a day to day. And that's what fiction does. But yeah, I mean, I plot them out pretty carefully. There's usually like a metaphor or like an illusion or like something that I want to connect it to. And one of my friends, she like commented something. I had like a Pokemon card as a background because I was like, I was talking about Rarity. And like, I just remember like when I was growing up, like that Charizard Pokemon card was like, everyone wanted it. And like, in my mind, that is still the symbol of rarity. She was like, I can't believe you worked that into this video.
- [36:54]
Farnoosh Torabi
No, it's. It's fantastic. And your book is coming out in the spring of 2025 and is it available for pre order yet?
- [37:00]
Sanibel
It is, yes.
- [37:01]
Farnoosh Torabi
Okay, great. So we'll link it in our show notes. It's called to have and have More. I can see this on the. On like an adaptation too. I'm sure you thought of that.
- [37:10]
Sanibel
I would love that. Definitely.
- [37:12]
Farnoosh Torabi
Screenplay.
- [37:12]
Sanibel
Great series.
- [37:14]
Farnoosh Torabi
Totally. It's like Gossip Girl, but way better. More thoughtful.
- [37:19]
Sanibel
The character that I always compare my main character to is Meadow Soprano because I feel like she's the type of like, it's that Corleone. Like every time I get out, they. They pull me back in. And it's like you. You want so badly to escape the clutches of your privileged family, but it's so hard to walk away.
- [37:37]
Farnoosh Torabi
We didn't even get into this. But I sort of feel sometimes I think about Rob Kardashian and I don't know if you. Okay, so you're smiling, right? Because you talk about, you know, how when you're in this vortex of wealth and these expectations that are put upon you, it's not that you just have to succeed. You have to do great things and I think he came out with, like, a sock company. Like, I don't know, maybe. But meanwhile his sisters. One's already a billionaire. Yeah, I don't know if that. If that tracks with your thesis, but he, to me, feels like the poster child for a child of privilege who is lost because of the pressure. And I. Maybe I'm being too kind. Maybe he's just lazy. But I don't know.
- [38:18]
Sanibel
I mean, I feel like we could have an entire conversation just about, like, whether it's like, sibling rivalry within.
- [38:24]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [38:24]
Sanibel
Within wealthy families and how that can be so toxic. But, yeah, he's a tragic figure. He has my sympathy, but also he.
- [38:31]
Farnoosh Torabi
Has a bed to sleep in. He has money. He has his health.
- [38:35]
Sanibel
I see it so up close with my college essay students that I like. I have so much pity for them. Also, I think that it's. It's so difficult because I think hearing that constantly, like, you have a bed to sleep and you have, like, more money than you could ever spend in your lifetime, but it's like. But still you're so deeply unhappy. Like, what. What do you do? How do you get out of it? Like, being told that you should be happy is never something that, like, no one has ever, like, snapped to and thought, like, you're right. Okay, I'm good.
- [39:03]
Farnoosh Torabi
Right. Right. Sanibel, please come back. I have so many more questions, and I think as this airs, I'm sure. Audience, send in your questions for Sanibel. We would love to have you back because this is. I. I feel like I just got a whole education.
- [39:17]
Sanibel
Oh, thank you so much. It was. It was so much fun to talk to you. I. I have, like a million more opinions too, as you'll see on my Instagram.
- [39:24]
Farnoosh Torabi
Thank you so much. Appreciate you.
- [39:26]
Sanibel
Thank you so much.
- [39:29]
Farnoosh Torabi
Thanks so much to Sanibel for joining us. To learn more about her and her book, check out to have and havemore.com we also have links for her Instagram and TikTok in our episode notes. I'll see you back here on Friday for a fresh episode of Ask Farnooche. It's not too late to send me your questions. You can email me farnooshomoneypodcast.com you can send me a DM on Instagram and you can go to the website somoneypodcast.com and click on the button on the right that says Ask Farnoosh. If you enjoyed this episode or had thoughts about this episode, subscribe Leave a review forward to a friend. It's the best way to support the show. Thanks again and I hope your day is so Money.
- [40:24]
Montclair Film
This episode of the Montclair Pod is brought to you by Montclair Film, our town's hub for film storytelling and community connection. From thought provoking indie screenings and Q&As with acclaimed filmmakers, to improv nights, live performances and classes in filmmaking, screenwriting and much more, Montclair Film offers something for everyone who loves the power of a story. It's also home to one of the country's premier film festivals each fall, drawing audiences and talent from around the world. Right here to Montclair. Want to see what? See what's playing or sign up for a class? Visit montclairfilm.org for the full calendar of events and ways to get involved. Now, on with the show.
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Sanibel
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Sanibel
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Sanibel
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Farnoosh Torabi
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Sanibel
Yes, Chef. This is so nice.
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Farnoosh Torabi
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