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- [00:01]
Commercial Narrator
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- [01:02]
Farnoosh Torabi
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- [02:25]
Rose Hahn
Just to be perfectly honest, I reached the point where I was actually not happy. I made all this money. And that's what I. That's what I was supposed to want. But I was also burnt out. And I felt, yes, I had a team that was helping me in my business, but I felt like I was working for them because showing up to all these meetings and managing them and there were all these responsibilities, because when you make more money, then you have more investments, and then you have higher tax bills, so then you have more advisors and more insurance. And my life, like, got complicated, and I was losing peace. And because I was working a lot, I didn't have a lot of time to hang out with friends and spend on my hobbies. And I just drifted in that direction. And then one day I woke up thinking, wait, I don't want this.
- [03:09]
Farnoosh Torabi
Welcome to Sew Money, everyone. I'm Farnoosh Tarabi. What if doing everything right still left you broke, burnt out, and quietly panicking about money? Today's guest followed the traditional financial script perfectly. She got an elite degree, got the Wall street job, big bonus, the kind of career that looks wildly successful from the outside. But behind the scenes, she was carrying nearly $100,000 in student loan debt. She was living paycheck to paycheck and realizing that the life she worked so hard for wasn't giving her freedom at all. And that moment of reckoning became her financial awakening. My guest today is Rose Hahn. You may know her. She's a famous YouTuber, money educator, and the author of a new book called add. Rose went from six figures of debt to building a seven figure net worth not by chasing flashy investments or overnight wins, but by radically rethinking her relationship with money, work, and freedom. In this conversation, Rose shares the mindset shifts that helped her escape debt, why income alone doesn't equal wealth, how she built assets from scratch with almost no capital, and why, even after making it, she chose to recalibrate her definition of enough. We talk about rewriting the financial rules that many millennials have inherited, betting on yourself in a very uncertain economy, and how to build a life that feels rich, not just one that looks rich. Here's Rose Hahn. Rose Hahn, welcome to Sew Money.
- [04:48]
Rose Hahn
Thank you so much for having me. I did mention before you hit record, that yours was one of the first podcasts I ever started listening to when I started learning about money. So it's just an unreal full circle moment for me to be here talking to you.
- [05:02]
Farnoosh Torabi
I am so thrilled and really honored. Rose, you have so much to teach us about your financial journey and also your entrepreneurial climb. You've risen to such heights with your career. You have so much to teach us about how to choose your own path. I think that's why so many of your followers admire you is like you have really just chosen your own adventure and you've afforded your own adventure. You are in this kind of, would you say, millennial cohort. Yeah.
- [05:31]
Rose Hahn
Solidly in the middle Millennial cohort.
- [05:33]
Farnoosh Torabi
Like solidly millennial. Yes. And you have this book that came out in September called At a Zero. It's I want to talk all about your philosophy around building wealth in this moment, but also your own personal comeuppance as the daughter of immigrants and your own getting out of debt journey. You went from having a hundred thousand dollars in debt to a net worth of seven figures. How you did that and then your advice for everybody else. So let's talk about the moment everything shifted. You are a graduate with six figures in debt. Take us back to the moment you realize something had to change because so many of us, and myself included, you were following this script that was handed to you. Be a good girl, get a good education. Study hard, get the good job. You did all the things, you followed the rules, and yet you ended up with a big price tag to pay for all of those things, and you had to bear the price of that.
- [06:35]
Rose Hahn
Yeah. I graduated from nyu finance degree and was all ready to climb that corporate ladder. And I was probably around 25 years old. And I started having these realizations that whatever I was doing, like this path that I'm on is just, it's clearly not working for me. And one, one of the earlier signs was I got my annual bonus. And if you work on Wall street, that's the big deal. That's the moment that all your hard work pays off. And sure, it was a pretty decent bonus at 25. Like, it was 30,000 or something. That's awesome. But I remember walking out of the room and they gave me the obligatory 5% cost of living adjustment, raise. And I remember walking out of the room where they announced that to me and thinking just like, vaguely unsatisfied. Like, that still just doesn't feel worth it to me. Like, I gave my entire year of my life waking up at 5am because I had to work, like Brazilian market hours.
- [07:30]
Farnoosh Torabi
Wow.
- [07:31]
Rose Hahn
Just giving all the hours of my time in life and walking out with, okay, 30,000 just because.
- [07:38]
Farnoosh Torabi
Also, like, after taxes.
- [07:40]
Rose Hahn
Yeah. In New York City. So it was really like 15,000. And then of course, with my spending habits back then, just, I spent everything I made. So that Actually even disappeared in a few weeks. So there were these moments where I started feeling like this is not worth it. And I think the moment that it really clicked was when I remember my managing director on my trading desk. He was the height of success in that career. And he would talk on the phone with his wife all the time because his wife would call him and send updates about the kids and what's going on there. She would call all the time. And so he just got off, off the phone and he's wearing a Rolex on his watch like cufflinks, hangs up the phone and says, oh man, when am I ever going to be able to stop working? So I just want to be with my kids. And that just really hit me. And I was like, this man is like the pinnacle of success where I would want to get to. And that's when it clicked. Everyone around me is wearing these nice cufflinks and like Bulgari and all these nice clothes, but they don't actually want to be there. They're just there for the money. And that just fundamentally did not feel right for me. Like I always knew money is important, but like a trading of your life to make money and being somewhere because you have to be, not because you want to be. For my idealistic 25 year old self, I just knew this is not for me. And on top of that I'm like living paycheck to paycheck and not really feeling satisfied. Like you have this whole vision of what your life is going to be when you graduate. Everything's going to be amazing and it's like expectations versus reality. That contrast really started to hit me. So yeah, that was the moment when I started realizing I need to do something different. No options right now. I also don't have any debt. I couldn't leave this job if I wanted to, just like my managing director. So I better do something about that.
- [09:29]
Farnoosh Torabi
Well, to focus also on the fact that you had this debt. That is so many people, regardless of the fact that you worked on Wall Street. But so many people don't even need to have that job on Wall street or have graduated from NYU to have that six figures in debt. So many people have a six figure job and don't feel like they're well off. Talk about that. It used to be once I make six figures, then I'll feel like I have something to show for my hard work. I have, quote unquote, made it to some next level, but that is not the case anymore.
- [10:06]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, definitely there's things that used to Work in the past for our parents generation, and now they are absolutely not working. And I think I was right on the cusp of people starting to realize that. Gen Z, I think now they more and more realize that a college degree is not worth going into a ton of debt for, especially because AI came in. But yeah, my generation, we still were brainwashed into thinking you must get a college degree. And especially me coming from Korean American background, education is everything. And maybe in Korea it still is that way. Like getting into an elite university is your ticket to success in America. It's not. And nowadays it's not, because it's really more about what value you can provide, not what degree or credentials you have. Yeah. And so we're shifting out of an old paradigm into a new paradigm for money success. It's not about a job, it's not about a degree. It's about the value you can provide. And you need to create assets. You need to own assets. Your job is not an asset, it's just a paycheck. An asset is something that you own that will provide you income whether you work or not, either in the form of stocks that you can sell off for money or dividends or rental income, like things that throw off of residual income. That was probably the one big mistake is my parents. They only wanted me to just get that job because they didn't learn about the importance of assets. But rich people, the ones who have financial freedom and options, they have assets. They might also have a job, but they also have assets. That's the thing that you see that you don't see on the outside. That's what actually makes them rich.
- [11:48]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah. And I think you, what you say, which is really a great mindset shift, speaking of assets, is let's start to think about leverage. So maybe you're not into real estate. Right. And certainly we should all be into investing. We talk about that, the importance of that on this show, and you talk about that with your audience. So investing in the stock market passively. But what else can we leverage? We can leverage our time. You can leverage your education, too. These are assets. Whether it's you leveraging your education to then teach or consult or create a course, leveraging your time to create some other benefit for yourself, you're trying to like flex that entrepreneurial muscle, right at the end of the day. So expand on that philosophy. Because I think this is really where you have taught so many people to think bigger and think about how to build wealth in a way that we haven't been. It's not this isn't one plus one is two. It's about compounding really. This is where you're really giving us this exponential philosophy on, on building wealth. How to leverage.
- [12:57]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, I think the ultimate leverage. There are many kinds of leverage and I want to get into at least two of them. But the one that I want to start with is the leverage that only you can offer, which is what you're good at, what you're passionate about, and the intersection of those two things with what people will pay for. I think if you really get to the heart of what I did right, is I found that and I used that to milk. I really milked it and made a ton of money from that. Because something about this concept of just get a job or do work that because it pays. Something about that never resonated with me. I always had this, I call it idealistic, but this determination that I will do something that I enjoy and that I really love doing, and I can make money from that. Like, I always was guided by that belief. And that led me to me quitting my Wall street job without a backup plan and not knowing what I would do next. But I knew that I needed to create some space to find something. And I went on this four or five year meandering journey of freelancing and trying different jobs. Like, I got into real estate to really look for that thing. And I even did a dance apprenticeship. I explored hobbies. And eventually that's how I landed at, okay, I'm gonna start an online education company and make YouTube videos. And yeah, that's why I've created, been able to create success. Because first of all, if you don't love what you're doing, you're not going to stick with it long enough for it to be successful. And if you're not good at it, you're not going to be able to stand out. So you.
- [14:28]
Farnoosh Torabi
And there was a market for it. Like, you also did the work to know that there was a viable market for it, right?
- [14:35]
Rose Hahn
Yeah. So that's where the strategy part comes. That's why there's three things that must intersect. What you are good at, what you love, and what people will pay for. If you don't have that third one, you're going to be a starving artist. And there are many people who are doing what they love and. But they're not making any money from it. So I really, I studied different business models and different entrepreneurs and people that had the life that I wanted and to see what they did. And I did notice they Were all in their element. They loved what they did and they were good at it, and they were in the right business model. And so I was literally thinking, okay, I have a lot of debt, I have no money, and I want to make a lot of money. How do I make a lot of money with no money? So one, the most obvious business model was an online business where you can sell information versus, like, physical products, where you need inventory and you need to invest in a warehouse and all these things. But the idea that you could create value by just packaging information and ideas together and create a digital product which costs nothing, just something on your laptop, that was like. It just clicked for me, oh, I can. That's how I'm gonna do it, because I have no money. It's very. It's very enlightening to. To know what your constraints are and then work from those constraints. So, yeah, I think. I don't wanna say I got lucky, but also, right time, right place, you have to work hard to get lucky. But it was also the intersection of the fact that there was the COVID happened and all these people were hungry for information, and then the rise of the creator industry and just YouTube as a platform. So all those things converge. But the part that I did and that anyone listening can also do is let what you love doing and what you're good at, let that be your guiding light. You may have to make some hard decisions that other people might not understand and sometimes might not even make sense to you. So when I quit my Wall street job, like, imagine I. I'm. I got six figures in debt to be in this career, and I'm going to quit that. And all of my NYU Stern peers, they're like, getting promoted to VP and going to Harvard mba. And here I am doing this dance apprenticeship and applying to be a cocktail waitress at the same rooftop bar that my Wall street colleagues would go to for happy hour. Because just to make the freelance life work. So there were choices that I made that were hard to kind of have faith in. But I just knew, like, I need to. I cannot settle for a life where I'm doing something that I don't like doing. Like, I will find a way to make a lot of money doing what I love.
- [17:06]
Farnoosh Torabi
Did you have a role model? Did you have a vision of who you wanted to be because you saw it represented somewhere?
- [17:15]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, absolutely. My probably my biggest mentor was Marie Forleo, who I'm sure you've heard of. Sure. It's so important to have role models. So she was one because she was, she had this cool personal brand where she would talk about how she loves dancing and silly skits in her videos. And I was watching her videos, so that's how I knew I was watching her YouTube videos. And every evening after work I'd sit there and just be so hungry to learn. And I'd feel her like I'd really connect with her through the screen. So that was also my first hint that I might also want to make videos one day. And another role model I had was my college professor. And I met him early on, before my whole money journey. But I guess I didn't make the connection that, oh, I could also create that life. But it still was an anchor of an example of what's possible, something different from what my parents showed me. He was my statistics and real estate professor and he made great money as a tenured NYU professor, I'm sure. But he wore the nicest suits and would fly to Vegas for these high roller poker games and had a boat in the Hamptons. And a professor's salary was not funding that. He had real estate investments. And I ended up interning for him at his office too. So I got insight into his world and I saw, oh, he loves what he's doing, his professor work, because he loves it. But he also has all these assets and that gives him freedom to go play at high roller poker tables in Vegas. And during the course of the internship, he let me stay after hours to join his, him and his friends for one of these like poker games on a Thursday night. And I didn't have any money to play, so I just sat there and watched. And they would, they were all like high roller guys. So they would talk about business and just talk shop and talk about money and investments and throw around all these numbers like ROI and like risk, I don't know all these numbers. And it was just like a whole different world to me. Like they felt so comfortable just throwing around big figures and like betting thousands of dollars on a casual Thursday night. So that, that opened up my mind to like, there's this different world of rich operate. Like they use a different language and they just think about money so differently. So yeah, there were these little insights and then these like anchors of possibility that I had in my mind as I was going through this whole journey of finding my way when it comes to holiday gifting.
- [19:47]
Farnoosh Torabi
I really want to give things people will love. Pieces that feel special. They'll we years. That's why I'm going with Quint this year from Mongolian Cashmere sweaters to Italian wool coats. Everything is premium quality at a price that actually makes sense. Quince honestly has something for everyone. Those Mongolian cashmere sweaters I was talking about? They're $50 but look and feel like the designer versions. They've got beautiful silk tops and skirts if you're dressing up perfectly, cut denim for every day and outerwear that actually keeps you warm. And and I'll just say the cashmere feels incredible. It's soft, structured and it doesn't pill. It's the kind of quality I'd expect from a $200 sweater, not $50. And they're not just about clothing either. Quince has amazing home bath and travel pieces. I've been eyeing their set of hotel quality towels and honestly, I might be gifting those to myself this year. Fine Gifts so good you'll want to keep them with quince. Go to quince.com sewmoney for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E.com somoney to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com somoney I'm Farnish Tarabi, host of so Money and this episode is sponsored by Gelt. Feeling like your CPA is always one step behind, causing you to miss valuable tax advantages? Questioning if your tax plan is truly as optimized as it should be? That's where GELT comes in. GELT is a tax tax planning and strategy solution for you and your business. They're the modern alternative for entrepreneurs who feel like their CPA is reactive, not tech forward and maybe not asking the bigger strategic questions about how your business is growing. What I love about Gelt is this they make taxes part of the business plan. With G, your Partner in taxes, CPAs and AI align your tax strategy to how your business grows. That includes the real levers that matter, choosing the right entity structure, maximizing retirement contributions and uncovering hidden credits and deductions. All handled alongside your business and personal compliance. And Gilt is proactive. Your tax strategy gets revisited every quarter by a dedicated cpa, not just a tax time. No more slow replies. No more surprises. No more spreadsheets and email chaos. Just a slick dashboard, clear next steps and year round support. Schedule a call@joingelt.com today and learn how your taxes can become a lever for growth. That's join G-E-L-Com and schedule your discovery call today. Farnooche torabi listeners get 10% off their first year of service. Just mention my name on your intake form.
- [22:30]
Rose Hahn
Psoriatic Arthritis Symptoms can be unpredictable.
- [22:34]
Farnoosh Torabi
I had joint pain and I couldn't move like I used to. I needed relief. I got Cosentyx.
- [22:42]
Rose Hahn
It helped me move better.
- [22:44]
Cosentyx Medical Spokesperson
Cosentyx Secukinumab is prescribed for people 2 years of age and older with active psoriatic arthritis. Don't use if you're allergic to Cosentyx. Before starting, get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur like tuberculosis or other serious bacterial, fungal or viral infection infections. Some were fatal. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms like fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough had a vaccine or planned to or if inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, serious allergic reactions and severe eczema like skin reactions may occur. Learn more at 1-844-COSENTICS or cosentix.com.
- [23:25]
Farnoosh Torabi
ASTRODERMATOLOGIST About Cosentix.
- [23:30]
Cosentyx Medical Spokesperson
Hey Ryan Reynolds here wishing you a very happy half off holiday because right now Mint Mobile is offering you the gift of 50% off unlimited. To be clear, that's half price, not half the service. Mint is still premium unlimited wireless for a great price.
- [23:46]
Rose Hahn
So that means half day.
- [23:49]
Cosentyx Medical Spokesperson
Yeah, give it a try@mintmobile.com switch upfront.
- [23:53]
Commercial Narrator
Payment of 45 for 3 month plan equivalent to 15 per month required new customer offer for first 3 months only speed flow after 35 gigabytes of networks busy taxes and fees extra.
- [23:59]
Rose Hahn
Cmnobile.com.
- [24:03]
Farnoosh Torabi
Okay, tell me about your if you're comfortable like your revenue streams today and because I have many different revenue streams and every year it shifts and I will say that when I think about in 10 years I have no idea what it's going to be like. I don't think it concerns me. But there is uncertainty and there's a little bit of like nervousness in that versus I suppose if I was working in a nine to five. Although there's a lot of uncertainty there too. You can guess more maybe. Okay in 10 years I'll be in a senior role doing this and that's my salary versus when you're, when you're on your own, you're on your own. So first question what is the architecture of your income today and what kind of keeps you up at night because of that?
- [24:53]
Rose Hahn
First of all I think it's interesting that you said it would might be less stressful having a job because I actually think, I don't know, I go back and forth.
- [25:01]
Farnoosh Torabi
I go back and forth with it. I don't know.
- [25:04]
Rose Hahn
Look, I think everything is changing. Everyone is nervous.
- [25:08]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [25:08]
Rose Hahn
Like we are in a time where we need to get really comfortable with uncertainty because that's just the reality. As an entrepreneur or employee, I have friends who've gotten laid off from their very cushy six figure tech jobs. So there's uncertainty everywhere.
- [25:21]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [25:22]
Rose Hahn
And so my revenue breakdown from the start has always been my own products and programs. So online programs, I would say 90% of my revenue comes from that and then a little bit from YouTube AdSense revenue, which I don't rely on and wasn't even something that I knew you would make. I just wanted to make videos. I didn't even go into this knowing like what the financial opportunity was. So that's probably, I would say 8% and then the remaining 2% would be affiliate income and brand deals that I do once in a while, but I don't like to because then I feel like I'm working for other brands. Yeah, I went into this to work for myself. So that's the breakdown. But just like you, Farnoosh, I also, I'm nervous too. Like AI is changing everything. So whenever there's times of, there's uncertainty everywhere in life and you have to increase your tolerance for uncertainty to get any gains. That's how it works with investing too. And what I always come back to is let's focus on what we can control and what we do know for sure. There's things that never change. So with investing, for example, of course we're scared. What if I put my money in and then the market crashes tomorrow? That's happened to me that that could happen to you too. But what we do know for sure is that over a 16 year time frame, the S&P 500 has never lost money. So we can rest in those kind of timeless truths that if you stay for the long term, don't sell in a state of panic that you will be okay. So knowing those things and when it comes to entrepreneurship, what I keep coming back to is AI is going to change a lot of things and revenue streams and what makes money and what the market wants. But what's not going to change is human behavior, like human connection. People want to feel understood and they want things that will make their lives better. So maybe I think as content creators, podcasters, YouTubers like kind of these public figures, what we can count on is as long as we have our audience's trust, that's where it all comes from.
- [27:35]
Farnoosh Torabi
You're 100% right. That, that is what I was saying. Especially I think as social media too was starting to infiltrate a lot of and blur to the lines between what was real and what was fake. Before AI started to do that. Like, social media was also starting to distort truth from what was real and what was not, fact from fiction. So I was telling my clients and who a lot of people I work with who are learning from me about brand building and I was like, to the extent that you can tell your community, your audience about you source things and you amplify your credentials and you talk about the truth. And again, your credentials and your sources, like that is not a small thing anymore. It's not to be taken for granted. And storytelling will never die either. Since the first day of life, like when the cavemen were drawing in the cave, like that was the first sort of day of storytelling. And that is something that AI can't really replace. So I'm with you on that. So let's talk a little bit about going back to your own personal story, Rose, about how you went from that young woman in finance to now creating your own path and you are now running your own business. When did you have your first hint, your first sign that betting on yourself was the right move? Because I'm sure there was. Like you said, there were a lot of, there's a lot of pessimism around you. And I can only imagine what your, your sort of Korean culture around you was, the doubts that were around you at that time, your own, even your own inner voice. I don't know if this, if I have it, if I'm doing the right thing, but when you started to see the signs of, oh, I might be onto something, what was that? What were those moments? What was the one moment? Maybe.
- [29:37]
Rose Hahn
Can I share two moments? Oh, yeah, A buildup moment.
- [29:40]
Farnoosh Torabi
All the moments.
- [29:40]
Rose Hahn
The second was like the moment.
- [29:42]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [29:43]
Rose Hahn
The first hint was before I even started making YouTube videos. I was just, I was really scared. So I just started doing these free meetups in the basement of a co working office. Like that I got for free. I threw up something on meetup.com oh, wealthy women Investing Meetup. Like something along those lines. And 15 women showed up and it was for free. And I was just up there with my little PowerPoint slides and preaching about the importance of investing and how to get started. But the fact that 15 women showed up on a Wednesday night just for this, that was like my first little boost of confidence, like little breadcrumbs that, okay, you should keep going. This isn't making any money. I don't know where any of this is going, but you should just keep going. So I kept doing that for two years until I finally got up the courage to start my first to make my first video. And even with that, it took a year for me to gain any traction on my YouTube channel. Looking back now, I know so much better how to do it faster and better. But for me it took a year every single week, 50 hours a week, doing all the editing, filming everything by myself with five views per video to. And I stuck with it for a year. So imagine how much like self belief that you need to just hold on to. But for me it was like I don't have anything else. I need this to work. So that also helped like not having plan B. This is what I want to do. This is what I need to do. And I don't have anything else. No backup.
- [31:14]
Farnoosh Torabi
Sorry.
- [31:14]
Rose Hahn
Had to keep going. I had like freelance gigs and whatever. Yeah, yeah, pay the bills. But like career wise, this is the only thing I could imagine myself doing.
- [31:23]
Farnoosh Torabi
When did. What was the video that took off?
- [31:27]
Rose Hahn
Things started taking off at the end of the first year. Like I started beginning of 2019. And then end of December there was some investing video. I think I was reviewing an app called ellevest which doesn't even exist anymore.
- [31:41]
Farnoosh Torabi
No.
- [31:43]
Rose Hahn
And then I made another video called Fidelity index funds for beginners. And that one was the first video to reach 10,000 views by the end of December. And then January I had another video, 8 Money Habits that keep you poor. And then by April of 2020 like Covid happened and so everybody to watch videos. And so I think my channel would have grown regardless. But that made it really exponential. But I want to share that the second moment when I really knew oh, I've got something here is was in February when I got my first YouTube AdSense direct deposit in my account. And it was like A$30 cents.
- [32:21]
Farnoosh Torabi
Yeah.
- [32:22]
Rose Hahn
But it was something like there's money in this, like passive income. It's not a myth. Like it landed in my account. So yeah, there were these little cool moments. But yeah, I've got to say I.
- [32:35]
Farnoosh Torabi
Thought you were going to say thousand dollars, but a dollar is a dollar. Yeah.
- [32:39]
Rose Hahn
And from there it just grew so quickly. Like second month it was like 500 and third month it was like 5,000. And then the fourth it was 15,000 and it just grew so quickly. So a lot of things changed super fast. It almost seems like overnight success. Right. But what you don't see is those four or five years that I was trying out different things, like really searching, looking for something. And the year of showing up week after week with no external validation, nothing to keep me going other than this vision I had within myself and an inkling that the world had something or the world needed what I had to offer.
- [33:18]
Farnoosh Torabi
Wow. So you have your finger on the pulse of so many millennials, I would imagine. Is that, would you say that's the. The biggest portion of your audience, given that you are also right in that cohort?
- [33:31]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, 33rd, 30 to 45 is. Yeah, 25 to 45, but mainly in the 30s.
- [33:40]
Farnoosh Torabi
And how would you say this generation is in some ways rewriting the financial quote unquote rules? I have an episode coming out, it might have already aired, about how millennials are having fewer children. And that is in part because of the financial aspects of that. But it's also a lifestyle choice for some. That's one thing. There's also fewer are able to buy homes. That's not necessarily by choice. That's also a supply demand. That's a supply demand constraint. And then when it comes to retirement, it's a big question mark. We have some that are in the fire movement, some that are rebelling against fire because they tried it and they burnt out. Or now we're talking about mini retirements, taking small breaks from work. And to me, it just seems like they're experimenting with a lot of different rules, as maybe they should be, because they also, I think some of those in the millennial cohort have experienced a number of financial downturns. Right. They maybe depending on their age, maybe they experienced the dot com bubble bursting. They. Then they experienced a financial crash and then there was Covid. So they had a lot of kind of setbacks throughout the years of their professional lives. So they're just like not. They're not drinking the Kool Aid and they're writing their own rules. What are you seeing and what are you recommending right now to them?
- [35:07]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, so I mentioned this earlier. Our parents, the baby boomers, they lived in a completely different time. Things were a lot more predictable. And now millennials and future generations, there's really not much we can count on will be the exact same even a year from now. So more than ever, we have to place faith in ourselves. Like bet on ourselves. Don't put your eggs in one basket being like the government or your boss or your job to save you. You need to find your own way. So one thing is like creating your own Job. The job that you're in right now probably won't even exist in two or three years. So finding ways to create value, like, whether you're an entrepreneur or in a job, know what the market needs, what the world needs, and find ways to get those skills to provide that. If you know how to do that, you will never have financial issues, because people will pay money for what they find, valuable for what solves their problems, whether it's a company looking to hire or customers looking to buy from a business. So don't just be comfortable showing up for a paycheck. Like, even if you do show up for a paycheck, really understand that value equation. What are you bringing to the table that they are paying you for? And milk the shit out of it. Is it okay to curse?
- [36:27]
Farnoosh Torabi
You're like the 20th person this month who's asked it. I think that says something about where we are in the world. Yeah, I'm allowing it. I'm allowing it.
- [36:36]
Rose Hahn
Yeah, like, just. And milk it. Ask for the raise. If you know that you are helping the company raise their bottom line, keep asking for the raise. Don't give up till you get it. Show the case and then move to a different company if you're not getting it and you find that, ooh, I feel insecure. I don't think I deserve to ask for a raise. Then you better find ways to make yourself indispensable. Find out what your company needs and figure out a way to give that. Then you'll always have a job. Right? So more than ever, we need to really be proactive about that, like making sure you're constantly upskilling and being valuable to the marketplace as it looks right now. Hey, and as entrepreneurs, that's what we're also trying to figure out, right? We don't have the answers, but this is what we need to do. And then secondly, I think more than ever, we just really need to get clear on what we find valuable to us personally. Because there's all these philosophies, like, you mentioned fire and mini retirement, and, yeah, my mom keeps telling me to buy a home. And yeah, maybe all of these. There's valid aspects of all of these. And then we've got social media and everyone showing off what they're doing. So we're like, maybe I should be doing that too. So we have so much input from the outside of what we could have and what we should want and what we should do. There's, like, more noise than ever. So I think really, like, one edge right now is Clarity, Clarity from within about what you value, what's important to you. Like, most of us are just like running around and now we have AI. Now we're like outsourcing. What do I want to AI? Because in some ways, ChatGPT knows us better than we know ourselves because we don't sit down to do that reflection.
- [38:17]
Farnoosh Torabi
And journaling between now and the end of the year when everyone's signing off. You know what? Do yourself a favor and just get quiet and figure that out. I think that's a good. That's good homework and that's accessible to all of us. We can all just get a little quiet and ask ourselves what we want and what would be enough for us. Because I think you're right. I think we. It can definitely feel like a lot of days we're just on this hamster wheel. We make more and then we want to make more, and then we want to make more. It never feels like enough. What do you feel like is enough for you, Rose? Do you feel like you've. You feel like you've mastered that?
- [38:58]
Rose Hahn
Definitely not. And I'm really happy you asked me that because that's. I'm in that calibration right now. After I reached all these milestones and seven figure net worth and all these things, I actually, just to be perfectly honest, I reached the point where I was actually not happy. I made all this money and that's what I. That's what I was supposed to want. But I was also burnt out. And I felt, yes, I had a team that was helping me in my business, but I felt like I was working for them because showing up to all these meetings and managing them and there were all these responsibilities because when you make more money, then you have more investments and then you have higher tax bills, so then you have more advisors and more insurance. And my life, like, got complicated and I was losing peace. And because I was working a lot, I didn't have a lot of time to hang out with friends and spend on my hobbies. And I just drifted in that direction. And then one day I woke up thinking, wait, I don't want this. So since last year, I moved to LA and I've been, like, just recalibrating. Yeah, I even scaled down my business. Like, it's not making as much as it was last year. And I'm okay, I'm okay with it. Because what I'm gaining in return is work, life, balance, and time to finally work on my hobbies, like fire dancing. Something I've worked yay for so long. And I had this like fire dancing toy that I bought last year and I didn't touch it once because I was just working all the time. But now I'm like doing it every day and feeling so fulfilled. And I'm very clear that even if all the money goes away, like just having those moments in the morning, like waking up with my boyfriend and my dog and just cuddling and being like, I love you guys and having a peaceful morning, like that's the heart of what is enough for me. Yeah, it's good to come back to that. Like, yeah, it's great to have the camper van. Don't get me wrong, I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed with my camper van. And it's great to have assets and be able to like book flights last minute and all these things that money gets you. But the core of it is like to be healthy and to have those moments with your loved ones. So, yeah, like I said, it's really good to come back to that clarity. You realize it doesn't take that much to have some of those things that are most important to you.
- [41:14]
Farnoosh Torabi
It's the antidote of the story you started with, which was that guy on the phone who was getting just updates from his wife on his family over the phone.
- [41:23]
Rose Hahn
Gosh.
- [41:24]
Farnoosh Torabi
And you were like, I'm never gonna be that guy. And you are not. You are far from it. And you worked hard for that. And you're getting updates in real life, in real time, on your own terms. So congratulations on everything. Thank you for teaching us. I'm so glad we got to connect. And congrats on your book. It's called At A Zero. Everybody. Check out Rose Hahnosehan.com on YouTube. She's got freebies on her website. Thank you so much for stopping by. Appreciate you.
- [41:57]
Rose Hahn
Thank you. This is so fun.
- [42:01]
Farnoosh Torabi
Thanks so much to Rose Hahn for joining me. Her book again is called add a zero, A step by step guide to financial freedom and getting to your first million. That link is in our show notes. I'll see you back here on Wednesday. And I hope your day is so money. Mic check, one, two. Are we recording? Hi, I'm Michelle Bernstein, an award winning chef, restaurateur and mom.
- [42:39]
Rose Hahn
I have a lot on my plate, including my psoriatic arthritis symptoms.
- [42:43]
Farnoosh Torabi
That's why I was prescribed Cosentyx.
- [42:46]
Rose Hahn
It helps me move better.
- [42:48]
Cosentyx Medical Spokesperson
Cosentyx Secukenumab is prescribed for people 2 years of age and older with active psoriatic arthritis. Don't use if you're allergic to Cosentyx before starting get checked for tuberculosis. An increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur. Like tuberculosis or other serious bacterial, fungal or viral infections. Some were fatal. Tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms like fevers, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough, had a vaccine or planned to, or if inflammatory bowel disease symptoms develop or worsen, serious allergic reactions and severe eczema like skin reactions may occur. Learn more at 1-844-cosentix or cosentyx.com Ask.
- [43:25]
Rose Hahn
Your rheumatologist about Cosentyx.
- [43:29]
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