Podcast Summary: “Why Companies Should Embrace Remote Work”

Podcast: Solutions with Henry Blodget
Host: Henry Blodget (Vox Media Podcast Network)
Guest: Prof. Nicholas Bloom, Stanford Economics Professor
Date: December 15, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Henry Blodget interviews Stanford economist Nicholas Bloom, one of the world’s leading researchers on remote work, to discuss the future of work-from-home and hybrid office models. They unpack the myths and realities behind the recent push by major companies to bring employees back to the office five days a week, what the data truly says about remote productivity and culture, and what an optimal, sustainable work environment looks like. Bloom also provides practical insights on best management practices, office design, economic and social impacts, and why remote work is here to stay.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The State of Remote Work: Data vs. Media Narrative

• Return-to-office mandates are overhyped: Media and some CEOs proclaim the end of remote work, but data paints a different picture.
  • Quote: “We have all these companies telling everyone you gotta get your asses back in the office five days a week. We just don't see it in the data.” — Nicholas Bloom [03:02]
• Stable hybrid adoption: After an initial surge back to office post-COVID, the return plateaued around 2023. Roughly 25% of American workdays are now remote—a dramatic increase from 7% pre-pandemic.
  • Long-term growth of work-from-home is a clear, pre-pandemic trend fueled by better technology, now permanently accelerated by COVID.
  • Quote: “It was growing a lot...the pandemic has given it a permanent kick up…people just realized, hey, this actually works a lot better than we thought.” — Nicholas Bloom [08:54]

2. What’s the Optimal Work Policy?

• The case for hybrid (3:2): For most professionals, the best balance is three days in the office, two days remote.
  • Supporting Data: Major study at Trip.com found no performance difference between employees in three days versus five days a week, but 33% lower quit rates for hybrid workers.
  • Quote: “Coming in three (days) looks like it's enough...And if you only come in three days a week and work from home two, the quit rates were down a third...So what's best for the company is hybrid.” — Nicholas Bloom [04:08]
• Fully remote vs. fully in-person: Some jobs (call centers, back office) are suited to full-remote. For professional, collaborative work, fully remote can hurt productivity and culture. Being in-office five days is rarely necessary or optimal.

3. CEO Motives: Downsizing, Culture, and Disconnect

• Some companies, like Amazon, use strict return-to-office rules to encourage voluntary attrition and reduce headcount.
  • Quote: “A group of companies see it as a cheap way to downsize...but you don't get to choose who walks out. For Amazon, a lot of AI and cloud folks left.” — Nicholas Bloom [05:43]
• Others (JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs) cite culture and mentorship as key reasons for five-day mandates, with varying validity.
  • Quote: “There is some real benefit of being in person...But there’s a big upside for, you know, one day a week of quiet time, deep work, recharge... employees really like it.” — Nicholas Bloom [07:02]
• Many CEOs are out of touch with ordinary workers’ realities.
  • Quote: “One of the problems...these CEOs...they just don’t live like the rest of us. They’re so out of touch.” — Nicholas Bloom [01:00, 43:11]

4. How to Do Hybrid Well

• Two essential practices:
  • Performance evaluation: Output, not presence, must be measured. Remote requires robust, clear performance management.
    • Quote: “If you have an employee that you’ve no idea what their performance is, I probably would not let them work from home…” — Nicholas Bloom [11:09]
  • Coordinated office days: Team-based (not individual) scheduling ensures the benefits of in-office interaction. “Network effects”—the value of being in when others are—outweigh pure flexibility.
    • Quote: “Choice isn’t always good…If I come in, it’s much more valuable if my colleagues are in…So because of that network effect, it makes sense to coordinate, which means…remove choice.” — Nicholas Bloom [13:18]

5. Real Estate & Office Design Implications

• Real estate is underutilized: Three days in means 40% office downtime, but productivity & culture trump pure space efficiency.
  • Companies with distinct teams can stagger schedules for better utilization, but for cross-team synergy, co-location on the same days is preferred.
    • Quote: “When innovation, creativity, productivity are the most important...they have them coming in on the same day.” — Nicholas Bloom [15:01]
• Redesigning office space:
  • The “Dilbert cubicle” is out. Modern hybrid offices need more open space, varying meeting room sizes, and collaboration zones.
    • Quote: “Cubicle land is empty...the big trend: cubicles out, meeting rooms (small, medium, large) are in.” — Nicholas Bloom [36:14]

6. Employee Experience, Productivity, and Equity

• Employees value flexibility: Hybrid is equivalent to a ~7-8% pay raise in perceived value.
  • Quote: “When you survey people...the numbers...are about 7 or 8%.” — Nicholas Bloom [26:51]
• Commute savings: The average remote worker saves 70 minutes a day; about 40% goes back to the employer as extra work time, the rest to personal life. - Quote: “If you save 70 minutes, 30 of that you get back...the other 40 the employees keep.” — Nicholas Bloom [19:49]
  • Less time on grooming and laundry: At-home workers are more casual.
• Productivity remains stable: On average, hybrid work maintains productivity (“roughly netting off” less mentoring with more deep work) and reduces costs through lower turnover and real estate needs. - Quote: “Productivity or on trends for before in the pandemic, we don't see any net productivity effect...hybrid has become kind of the default.” — Nicholas Bloom [21:26]

7. Economic and Social Impacts

• Shifting spending patterns: The average NYC office worker now spends $7,000 less in the city annually; spending migrates to suburbs and local neighborhoods. - Quote: “...the average office worker in New York is now spending $7,000 less...” — Henry Blodget [39:24]
• Cities evolving: City centers are shifting to offer more amenities for leisure, entertainment, and living—echoing a more “mixed use” model rather than all-business. - Quote: “The city center...is more about, you know, consumption and leisure and a little bit less about work.” — Nicholas Bloom [38:00]
• Leisure activity surge: More golf, gyms, and mall visits on weekdays, changing patterns of local business demand.
• Crime migration: Less suburban burglary as more people stay home.
• Fertility increase: Hybrid work enables more kids for dual-earner couples. - Quote: “For each one of them that works hybrid, you see on average about 0.2 more children...that’s just an enormous effect.” — Nicholas Bloom [39:51]

8. Why Return-to-Office Mandates Likely Won’t Win

• Labor market competition: Flexible workplaces have an advantage—top talent can leave for companies offering hybrid policies. - Quote: “If you like work from home, you like hybrid, you should be a fan of capitalism...if you tell (your best people)...come in five days a week, you’ll probably have to pay them 7 or 8% more.” — Nicholas Bloom [29:58]
• Not everyone is returning: Some top companies (e.g., Microsoft, Instacart, Zillow, Dropbox, Upwork) embrace hybrid or remote-first for innovation and recruitment flexibility, not just cost. - Quote: “The big majority are hybrid. So remote first tends to be rarer...Rich Barton (Zillow): ‘It's really helpful for innovation...If teams aren't pinned down by geography.’” — Nicholas Bloom [31:38]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On CEO out-of-touchness:
  “It's all alright for Elon Musk that has 15 chauffeured flying Teslas...the rest of the world, we have 45 minute commutes and we don’t have eight nannies per child.” — Nicholas Bloom [43:11]
• On structuring hybrid policy:
  “Choice isn’t always good...You wouldn't want to let people choose which side of the road they drove on...there's a network effect.” — Nicholas Bloom [13:18]
• On performance measurement:
  “If you have an employee that you've no idea what their performance is, I probably would not let them work from home till you can set that up.” — Nicholas Bloom [11:09]
• On the value of flexibility:
  “Being able to work two, three days hybrid is equivalent to a pay increase of about 7 or 8%.” — Nicholas Bloom [26:51]
• On office design:
  “Cubicles out, meeting rooms in...when you go into the office, you’re not going there to quietly sit in a cubicle...When you go in now, the aim is...meeting with people.” — Nicholas Bloom [36:14]
• On long-term impacts:
  "Hybrid work can increase total fertility...it’s a really large effect. If so, it could take us from U.S. to Mexican fertility rates." — Nicholas Bloom [39:51]

Suggested Timestamps for Key Segments

• [03:02] — Media hype vs. reality: What the data says about work from home
• [04:08] — Results from the Trip.com hybrid work experiment
• [05:43] — The real motivation behind strict RTO at Amazon
• [07:02] — Why mentorship matters but full-time RTO isn’t necessary
• [11:09] — The two keys to making hybrid work: performance measurement and coordination
• [13:18] — Why scheduling hybrid days as a team (not individually) is crucial
• [19:49] — How employees use the time saved from commuting
• [21:26] — Productivity impacts and hybrid as the new default
• [26:51] — Flexibility as an “8% pay raise” and hiring for hybrid roles
• [36:14] — Rethinking office design for hybrid work
• [38:00] — The impact of hybrid work on cities and local economies
• [39:51] — Surprising effects: leisure, crime, and rising fertility

Tone & Language

The episode is lively, informal, and data-driven, with both host and guest using wit and dry humor (often self-deprecating) to illustrate points. Bloom’s responses are full of specific statistics and blunt assessments of corporate leadership and media incentives, while Blodget keeps the conversation practical and accessible.

Conclusion

Nicholas Bloom’s research makes a compelling, evidence-based case for the hybrid work model—three days in, two remote—as the emerging workplace “sweet spot.” Real adoption is less about corporate mandates and more about what maximizes productivity, reduces attrition, attracts talent, and strengthens company culture. As remote and hybrid work mature, focusing on how to do them well is now the key challenge for businesses and cities alike.