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Somebody Knows Something
Episode 10: Closing the Case
00:22:26
Detectives Andrew Houghton and Matt Vartanian from the Elgin Police Department Cold Case Unit wrap up Karen’s cold case investigation by detailing the final steps in Karen’s case and they discuss what they believed most likely happened to Karen on...
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- [00:00]
Narrator
This podcast is based on information sourced primarily from police and media reports, but certain names and other identifying details may have been changed or altered for privacy and security reasons. While the events and cases discussed are based on real investigations, some aspects may be simplified for time and for narrative purposes. Voice actors have been used to read from statements or documents. All information presented is intended solely to inform and raise awareness. Hosts may discuss theories regarding the cases examined in this podcast, but such discussions are not intended to and should not be considered by the listener to be legal. Conclusions all persons discussed are considered innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Listener discretion is advised.
- [01:03]
Chief Anna Lally
This is Chief Anna Lally. Welcome to Somebody Knows Something, a podcast from the Elgin Police Department's Cold Case Unit. In this podcast, we will shed new light on cold cases in the city of Elgin by sharing untold details and by encouraging anyone with information to come forward. And you will come along with real cold case detectives as they investigate active cold cases in real time and seek justice for the victims and closure for their families. We believe that the Elgin Police Department and our community can work together to bring closure to cold cases because we know that in these cases, somebody knows something.
- [01:47]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Hello and welcome to Somebody Knows Something, the Elgin Police Department Cold Case Podcast. My name is Detective Andrew Houghton.
- [01:54]
Detective Matt Vartanian
And I'm Detective Matt Vartanian.
- [01:58]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Over our last two episodes, we chronicled our search of the Fox river, where we located and recovered Karen's 1980 Toyota Celica and even more importantly, Karen. We also spoke with Chaos Divers about the exceptional work that they did on Karen's case and that they are continuing to do for families all around the country.
- [02:15]
Detective Matt Vartanian
I know for both of us, the past few weeks have been emotional and we appreciate the support that the community has given to the Elgin Police Department and us, but even more so to Karen and her family. Finding Karen and her car was one big step in this investigation, but it was not the end of this case.
- [02:34]
Detective Andrew Houghton
That's right. Finding Karen's car was a huge piece of this puzzle, and then recovering her remains was another giant leap forward for us. But over the past few weeks, we've continued to meet with forensic experts, Toyota experts, and even some new witnesses. We answered the question, where is Karen? On March 24th. But now we want to answer the question, what happened to Karen Scheepers?
- [02:55]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Like you said, Andrew, we now have two giant pieces of evidence that we did not have when we started this investigation. We have Karen's 1980 Toyota Celica and we have Karen. Both required us to bring in experts to try to help Figure out what happened to Karen on April 16th of 1983. But before we get into that, let's talk about a new tip that came in just after we found Karen and her car.
- [03:21]
Detective Andrew Houghton
A former employee from first car named Jane, who no longer lives in Illinois, Reached out to us when she learned about our investigation. Jane worked in a different department than Karen, but she was actually at p.m. bentley's on April 15 and never spoke to the police because she was in a different department than Karen. Her name didn't appear on any of our lists of employees for the party. Jane unknowingly had a really big piece to the puzzle that helped us put the night's events into perspective even more.
- [03:48]
Jane
Well, I didn't per se work with Karen in her department, but we all considered first card as family. So she was very, very near and dear to me. She was always so friendly and kind, and I would interact with her whenever I would see her. And. And she was just a wonderful person. She had gotten a promotion, and I was invited to attend because it was, like, five minutes away from where I lived with my first husband. And so we went and we went in. We had a good time. Karen did do the hula hoop contest. And I had noticed her out in the very beginning of the bar, the vestibule that you go into before you actually go into the bar. She was on. She was at the pay phone, and she was crying. And when she had got done, I asked her, karen, are you okay? And she said, no. She was sad because her boyfriend wouldn't come out and party with her.
- [05:03]
Detective Matt Vartanian
You had mentioned before that you had seen her in the parking lot later in the night. Can you describe that for us?
- [05:11]
Jane
Well, she was in the parking lot to get into her car, and I could tell that she was still upset. And I just said to her, karen, please be careful going home. Make sure that you're safe. And, you know, I'd see her at the next day of business.
- [05:32]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Yeah.
- [05:33]
Jane
And she smiled and waved at me and said, thank you.
- [05:37]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Jane went on to describe Karen's car to us, and she was certain that Karen was alone when she got into the car. And then she saw Karen turn south on Illinois Route 25.
- [05:47]
Detective Matt Vartanian
We now have an independent witness who says she actually saw Karen leave in her car alone that night. I have to say that this type of witness information Is what we have been looking for during our investigation this entire time. When she heard that Karen's car was found during our search, she simply chose to contact us because she wanted to be sure we had her information. Like we have always said, no tip is too small, and this one was certainly a big one. We now feel even more confident that Karen did leave the bar on her own based on this new tip. And we spoke with some other people associated with the tipster who confirmed her information. So we have confidence, Knowing that this tip is valid, Figuring out that Karen did leave on her own really paints a much richer picture for this case for us. And what happened that night.
- [06:34]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Yeah, it shows us that she left in her car and was alone, which is huge. But that isn't all we learned over the past few weeks. Like we said, the two biggest new pieces of evidence that we have in this case are Karen's remains and Karen's car. Matt, I think we should start by talking about what Karen was able to tell us about what happened to her 42 years ago. When you work any death investigation, it is important to remember that the decedent in this case, Karen, is a person. We always strive to be as respectful as possible, but we also want to assess everything so that we can give answers to the family. That's why the coroner's office conducts autopsies and exams after many death investigations that we work.
- [07:14]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Thankfully, through the exceptional work of chaos divers, we were able to recover extensive skeletal remains, including dental remains. Because we recovered dental remains, this allowed the forensic odontologist to identify Karen in days rather than in weeks.
- [07:31]
Detective Andrew Houghton
I just have to say that the Kane County Coroner's office treated Karen with the utmost care, respect, and dignity, just like they do on every case. They also helped us bring on multiple experts to review the case and examine Karen's remains so that we could try to provide as many answers as we could. We really do appreciate the care they showed, the expertise with which they do their work, and the number of resources they brought in for us. It is through their thorough work that we were able to tell several things about what happened to Karen.
- [07:59]
Detective Matt Vartanian
After the coroner's office was able to conclusively say that the remains we recovered were Karen and only Karen's, we were able to learn a few more things. For one, Karen was able to tell us where she was located inside her car. We now know that all of Karen's remains were located in the front seat area of the passenger compartment of her vehicle, consistent with her driving the vehicle prior to the car entering the Fox River. Based on this, Karen was able to tell us that she was alone in her car and in the front seat area when both she and the car entered the river.
- [08:35]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Also, just because we were able to identify Karen didn't mean the Kane County Coroner's office was done. The Kane County Medical examiner, Dr. Marta Helenowski, reviewed Karen's remains and she performed an autopsy. Then the coroner's office went the extra mile. They brought in a forensic anthropologist from Northwestern University, Dr. Aaron Waxenbaum. She assessed and documented every single bone that we recovered and confirmed that the human remains belonged to only one person, Karen.
- [09:03]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Most importantly, all the experts agreed that there were no significant structural injuries, breaks, gunshot wounds, trauma, or anything else suspicious on any of Karen's remains. The other new piece of evidence that we now have is Karen's car that, like Karen, can tell us information that is vital to understanding what happened to Karen. First, the physical location of the car is very important. We have had a number of people asking if Karen could have driven off the boat ramp at Slate Avenue. And we can say to that the answer is, no, she did not. The car is several hundred feet north of there, which is upstream. So the car absolutely did not enter the Fox river at the Slade Avenue boat ramp.
- [10:00]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Also, in talking to chaos divers, they told us that Karen's car, especially in high water, could have been carried upwards of a mile, maybe even further, if all the windows were up and the tires were inflated. We now know that all four side windows and the windshield were intact. When Mike McFerrin and the Elgin Police Department dove and checked the vehicle prior to us removing it on March 25th.
- [10:22]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Andrew. We had actually talked extensively about the car and the windows Even before we did the search. We expected that the windows would be up in Karen's car Because it was unseasonably cold and because Karen, well, at least to our knowledge, was not a smoker. So she wouldn't have had a window down to smoke or anything like that. Now, because it was cold, it would also make sense that her windows would have been up as she drove from PM Bentley's to Elgin. So we know going into the search that it was likely that Karen's car could have traveled a significant distance downstream if it did go into the Fox River.
- [10:57]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Yeah. And we actually measured the distance between Duncan Avenue just north of I90 to the site where Karen's car was actually located. From the furthest point north on Duncan, where the river is extremely close to the roadway, to the location near Slate Avenue is about a mile and a half. So we can safely say it is entirely possible that Karen could have entered the river in that general area and the car could have been carried a little over a mile before finally settling where we Found it. Additionally, the location where her car was resting was kind of along the edge of a deep spot that then got more shallow. It's possible that the car settling in this deeper area just simply couldn't be pushed by the current to get out of there. And we know the same area is where we found a lot of other cars.
- [11:39]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Yes. Plus, that area where we had found Karen's car was the same general area where we found two additional vehicles and other debris. That spot in the river seems to be where a lot of larger debris was deposited by the current. Things like pipe, larger tires, and other types of debris.
- [11:56]
Detective Andrew Houghton
We also know that the area of Trout park and the area of North Spring street could potentially be entry points to the river that we didn't really discuss in our prior episodes. Trout park is just south of I90 and could be a location where Karen could have turned or lost control or maybe entered the river around the I90 corridor area. Similarly, North Spring street, just north of River Bluff Road, is close to Slate Avenue, where Karen's car was found. That road is currently a gated roadway, but in the 1980s, it was a steep, brick roadway which was open to the public. A number of former police officers and other people from the community have reached out to us and told us that that road would be slick. It would be somewhere that maybe people would drive if they were just kind of going to clear their head. And it was in close proximity to Karen's house, just a few blocks northwest of there. If Karen had decided to drive around a bit before going home, maybe just to kind of clear her head. People suggested that North Spring street spot is a spot that she could have got in the river. Trout park is also another potential entry point. Like we said, needless to say, there are several points where she could have entered the river upstream from Slate Avenue. Matt, we will likely never know the exact one, but we do feel like the Duncan Avenue area close the river, is the most likely possible location. And there are others as well.
- [13:07]
Detective Matt Vartanian
In addition to the location of the car, we also physically needed to assess the vehicle body and the mechanics of Karen's Toyota Celica to determine what information we could gather about that car prior to it entering the river. Again, we needed to bring in experts, so we ended up bringing in two different groups. The first was the Elgin Police Department's traffic crash reconstruction team. And the second was a Toyota master technician from Elgin Toyota who had over 30 years of experience. We want to thank Elgin Toyota for helping us assess Karen's car and for providing a detailed report on the vehicle that was immensely helpful and giving us some new, very valuable information.
- [13:49]
Detective Andrew Houghton
First, let's start with the Elgin Police Department crash team. The team did not observe any major dents or impacts on the body of the car that would suggest it was struck by another vehicle run off the roadway or that Karen struck a deer or tree or other large object. In fact, they noted that while the tires were deflated, the four rims were basically pristine with no obvious dents or other damage on any of the rims. Plus, we know all the windows were intact and there was no penetration to the passenger compartment that would suggest any type of impact. At this point, we feel like we can rule out any major crash or impact involving Karen's vehicle. We should also note that the rear hatch window being broken could be explained by some tree debris and other logs that the diver, Mike McFerrin, had to move off of the vehicle. There were no impacts on the rear bumper, the lights, or anywhere else that would show some kind of impact from behind to break that window. Overall, the car was actually in remarkably good physical condition for being submerged for almost 42 years.
- [14:41]
Detective Matt Vartanian
The Elgin Police Department traffic crash reconstruction team's report and review was very helpful. But we both feel that our Toyota Master technician's report, which documented the car similarly to the Elgin Police Department's traffic crash reconstruction team regarding the lack of body damage, provided the most insight into what happened to Karen. He also noted upon inspection that the two front tires had been deflated. When they went to put air in those tires, they actually held air after all this time. That helps us to know that it is that much more likely that Karen's car could have floated a longer distance. And it shows that those tires were not damaged even after 42 years. These details were important to understanding how Karen's car could have floated further into the river and to also confirm that there were no major impacts involving her car. But it was his mechanical report that really gives us the best picture of what happened on April 16th of 1983.
- [15:37]
Detective Andrew Houghton
The technician documented a few other very important mechanical facts about the car. The first was that the key was in the ignition and in the on position. This indicates that Karen's car was running and on when it entered the Fox River.
- [15:51]
Detective Matt Vartanian
The second was that Karen's vehicle, which had a five speed manual transmission, was in fourth gear and seized in that position, likely due to the extensive time in the water. This indicates that Karen was driving her vehicle at a speed consistent with fourth gear prior to the car entering the Fox River. The technician also Noted that the front brake lines were fully intact and that while the rear brake line hose was broken, he did not find that to be suspicious. In fact, the rear brake hose was separated from the metal block Due to extensive corrosion on the crimp fitting. The front brake line showed consistent corrosion in the exact same locations. Basically, the brake line did not appear to have been tampered with or cut or anything in that manner.
- [16:41]
Detective Andrew Houghton
The final mechanical detail about Karen's car is something that we both feel is very, very significant. The emergency brake in the center of the vehicle was pulled completely up and rusted in that position, Indicating that the occupation occupant pulled the emergency brake prior to the vehicle entering the river.
- [16:59]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Because of several factors, including the amount of time that has passed since her death and the fact that we don't have 100% of Karen's remains, the Kane County Coroner's Office can't 100% say what happened to cause Karen's death. So from a medical and legal standpoint, her death has been classified as undetermined. That being said, both Andrew and I have some opinions that we would like to provide as we wrap up this criminal investigation.
- [17:28]
Detective Andrew Houghton
From the beginning of this case, our goal has always been to find Karen and provide answers to her friends and her family. On March 24th of 2025, we found her car in the Fox river. And on March 25, we recovered both Karen and her vehicle from the river. Now, after 42 years, we believe that we can answer what we think most likely happened to Karen Shepers in the early morning hours of April 16, 1983.
- [17:55]
Detective Matt Vartanian
First, we now know from witness statements that Karen left PM Bentley's on April 16th of 1983 in the early morning hours alone in her canary yellow 1980 Toyota Celica with red accent stripes. The windows were up. And we know it would have been common for her to take Duncan Avenue to drive back to Elgin. We also know it was dark, cold and slick. And we now know that the Fox river and other bodies of water along her route were severely flooded. It is entirely possible that Karen's Toyota could have traveled in the river from the area of Duncan Avenue to its final resting place.
- [18:34]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Based on the expert assessments of Karen's Toyota, we know that Karen was traveling at a speed consistent with her vehicle being in fourth gear. On the low end, we've been able to estimate that in the low to mid 20 mile an hour range, and on the high end, it could be significantly faster than that. We also now know that at some point, the emergency brake was pulled in the car for some reason. Matt and I both also want to note that just because Karen was at a bar and driving home does not mean that she was impaired. From a number of the people we've spoken with, Karen was not a heavy drinker and she was very responsible. And literally no one who was at the bar described her as being drunk or stumbling or acting drunk even into the late evening hours. While it is possible that she was impaired or slightly impaired, it's just as likely that she was tired, given it was such a late hour and she was up early on April 15 to go to work. It's also possible that regardless of being tired or any type of impairment, the weather conditions and road conditions were simply a major contributing factor in a crash that could have happened regardless. Additionally, if she did drive into standing water, Karen's car sits very low to the ground and it wouldn't take much water to lift her car up from the pavement and cause her to begin drifting out into the river.
- [19:44]
Detective Matt Vartanian
The last thing that we also know is that based on the assessments of several forensic experts, we believe that Karen Shepers suffered no significant structural injuries to any of her skeletal remains. She wasn't shot or beaten or anything that would cause any alarm. Based on the condition of her remains that we had recovered and that our multiple experts assess for this case, and she was found in the front seat.
- [20:08]
Detective Andrew Houghton
Of her vehicle at this point, based on our extensive investigation, we also know Karen was alone in her car when it entered the Fox river at some location north of Slate Avenue. There was essentially no major body damage to the car or the mechanics of the car. The lights were intact, the windows were intact, even the tires were intact. That, along with the information that the car was in fourth gear and the emergency brake was pulled, we both strongly feel that options like suicide or someone pushing Karen's car into the river are eliminated from this case. All in all, based on the totality of the circumstances, both Matt and I believe that Karen's death was simply a very tragic accident.
- [20:51]
Detective Matt Vartanian
Next episode will be the final episode for this season. While we may have a bonus episode or additional information to release over the summer, we plan to wrap up season one by sitting back down with Karen's close friends and family to hear their reflections on the past few months and to hear what bringing Karen home has meant to them. I am sure it will be an emotional episode, but Karen's friends and family deserve to be heard one more time. Please join us next time as we remember Karen Lee Sheepers here on Somebody Knows Something Foreign.
- [21:38]
Chief Anna Lally
If you or anyone you know has information about this case or any other cold case in Elgin, please contact the Elgin Police Department Cold case email@coldcasetipslginil.gov or the cold case tip line at 847. You can also review cold case information on the Elgin Police Department's Transparency Hub by going to Elginil.gov and navigating to the Elgin Police Department's transparency hub, where every cold case, homicide and missing person's case is listed with photographs and information about each case.