S10 E2: Papier Maché

Summary

Someone Knows Something (CBC) Season 10, Episode 2: "Papier Maché" Host: David Ridgen Release Date: March 16, 2026

---

Main Theme

This episode continues the investigation into the disappearance of Jacqueline Furlund Smith in Costa Rica on August 17, 2021. Host David Ridgen conducts an in-depth interview with her husband, Sebastian Furlund, seeking to move past rumors and accusations to focus on facts, relationships, timelines, and perspectives from both Sebastian and those involved in the case. The episode explores mental health struggles, marital conflict, the complexity of truth in cold cases, and gaps in the police investigation.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Arriving at Sebastian’s Home (01:00 - 03:25)

• David Ridgen arrives at the home Jackie shared with Sebastian in Costa Rica and is greeted warily by Lorraine and then Sebastian.
• Sebastian, aware of public suspicion, quickly states:

  "I know that if I say no to the interview, you're just gonna bullshit something...your intention is to make money, right? So obviously you're gonna make me look bad." (03:25, Sebastian)

• Ridgen sets the tone: aiming to cut through rumor and focus on verifiable facts.

2. Sebastian on Public Suspicion and Mental Health (04:48 - 06:40)

• Sebastian addresses the public narrative, noting Jackie's mental health issues and social media accusations against him.
• He expresses frustration:

  "People just want to have like a guilty person and they just want to accuse me because yes, I'm the person who was with her." (05:03, Sebastian)

• He emphasizes that much of the negative commentary comes from people who never knew either of them.

3. Sebastian and Jackie: Relationship History & Stressors (06:40 - 09:14)

• They'd been together nearly 11 years; initially happy, things fell apart after job losses, financial instability, and moving from Canada to Costa Rica.
• Sebastian describes both of them experiencing significant mental health challenges—his (PTSD from military service), hers (episodes worsened by stress).

  "She was someone who needed stability and my job could not really offer that to her...Moving into a different country...I thought would be less stressful...but my plan completely backfired." (08:07, 09:14, Sebastian)

4. Violent Episodes and Marital Conflict (09:26 - 11:14)

• Sebastian claims he was abused by Jackie, describing physical violence and injuries:

  "She used to smash my head on the ceramic tile and stuff like that. She was an athlete. She was strong...there's a lot of [men], they just don't speak up." (09:56, Sebastian)

• He admits he never reported injuries to authorities but claims others saw bruises or had photographic evidence.
• He recalls calling Jackie's parents as her outbursts intensified, which further worsened the situation.

5. Last Known Day: August 17, 2021 (14:03 - 25:30)

Timeline as Reconstructed from Messages and Accounts:

• Jackie had a physiotherapist appointment with Tatiana in Tamarindo before lunch.
• Sebastian usually accompanied her but had a phone appointment with his psychologist in Canada that day.
• Jackie became agitated after her physiotherapy visit—sending Sebastian a series of distressed, paranoid, and suicidal texts.

  "I'm ready to die. Goodbye. That's 12:20. There is no help for me." (18:00, Jackie text) "I deserve to commit suicide. I'm a horrible person who needs to be punished." (12:21, Jackie text)

• Sebastian recounts driving around Tamarindo searching for her (estimated departure ~1pm, arrival ~2pm); did not visit the physio clinic, believing he would get no info due to privacy.
• Tatiana confirms the session was tense, Jackie left angrily after expressing pain with a needle, and that Sebastian never contacted her nor did police.

  "She was aggressive in the way she talked to me. She doesn't do any, don't touch me or push me...she just told me, I want to finish the session. I don't feel well, please. And we're finished. And she just. She gone." (24:52, Tatiana)

6. Evening of Disappearance – Conflicting Accounts and the "Papier Maché" Incident (29:14 - 34:58)

• Sebastian returns to the house near dinner time, describes Jackie as still upset. Claims to have left again to eat out to avoid conflict.
• Multiple versions exist about whether he ate with Jackie or alone; conflicting memories from others (friends, Jackie's parents).
• Upon his return, Sebastian describes an altercation: Jackie throws toilet paper at him (hence, "papier maché"), then punches him in the mouth while he’s in the shower.

  "She started to take toilet paper and like throw it at me in the shower...Then she, she would not stop. She got towards me and punched me in the mouth and my four like top teeth like, like went through my lip..." (31:25, Sebastian)

• He claims she leaves the house soon after, leaving behind her engagement ring and phone.

7. Neighborhood Witness and Sightings (37:44 - 40:54)

• Despite public suspicion, Sebastian references a neighbor who allegedly saw Jackie leave the house between 7 and 9pm with a small bag, dressed as Sebastian described.
• Sebastian says she’d previously left for short periods; sometimes left her ring but not her phone.

8. Credit Card Use and Alleged Sightings (42:34 - 44:55)

• Purchases were made on Jackie’s credit card at Walmart (~4:33pm) and a surf shop (~6–6:50pm). Store clerks recognized her and mention she was seen with a man, but cannot confirm specifics.
• Jackie's parents are skeptical Jackie made these purchases; the signature didn't match, and they believe someone else used her card.

9. Mutual Accusations – Abuse and Gaslighting (46:08 - 49:29)

• David reveals texts and stories suggesting their mutual violence and volatility.
• Jackie confided in her sister about Sebastian pushing or knocking her down, and feeling gaslit.

  "Jackie told us that he was a narcissist and gaslighting her...she was a pretty bright lady there. And like I say, she had that struggle with anger issues there sometimes." (49:02, Gordon/Colleen)

• Sebastian maintains he never escalated conflicts, only pushed to remove himself from situations, but admits that at least one such incident occurred.

10. Lack of Police Follow-Up (24:44, 42:47)

• Multiple witnesses (the physiotherapist, surf shop staff) say police never contacted or interviewed them.
• OIJ investigator Ulysses Guevara confirms handling the case but declines comment due to agency policy.
• David plans to contact higher OIJ and RCMP officials.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On public suspicion:
  "People just want to have like a guilty person...they just want to accuse me because...I was with her." (05:03, Sebastian)

• On violence in the marriage:
  "She used to smash my head on the ceramic tile and stuff like that...But as a man, what do you do? You just let yourself being beat up." (09:56, Sebastian)

• On mental health & suicidal ideation:
  "I was basically staying alive because I think my parents deserve better...if I did not have my parents and a few friends...I would have used a propane tank probably before calling the cops." (35:14, Sebastian)

• On the day’s emotional texts:
  "I'm ready to die. Goodbye." (18:00, Jackie text) "I deserve to commit suicide. I'm a horrible person who needs to be punished." (12:21, Jackie text)

• On police investigation gaps:
  "Did police come and talk to you? ... Never ever." (24:44, Tatiana, physiotherapist)

• On conflicting timelines and versions:
  "What Sebastian tells me is different from what others say he told them about what happened when he first got home..." (30:08, David)

---

Important Timestamps

• 03:25 — Sebastian confronts the nature of press coverage and suspicion.
• 07:39 — Sebastian discusses own PTSD and rationale for relocating to Costa Rica.
• 14:07 — Sebastian recounts the day's timeline.
• 17:28–18:38 — Jackie's distressed text messages read aloud.
• 24:00–24:44 — Physiotherapist Tatiana’s recollection of appointment and lack of police follow-up.
• 31:25 — The "papier maché" toilet paper/shower incident and resulting altercation.
• 35:14 — Sebastian discusses his suicidal state following Jackie’s disappearance.
• 42:34 — Discussion of suspicious credit card activity after Jackie disappeared.
• 46:08–49:29 — Accounts of mutual abuse, and gaslighting allegations, from both parents and partner.

---

Tone and Atmosphere

The episode maintains a somber, investigative tone, with deep empathy but also a journalistic focus on corroborating evidence and personal testimony. David Ridgen weaves personal interviews, direct quotations, and critical analysis into a measured narrative designed to expose the texture and contradictions within the case, while giving voice to the pain and uncertainty of all parties—without shying away from complexity or ambiguity.

---

Summary

Episode 2, "Papier Maché," delves into the critical events surrounding Jackie’s disappearance, as described by her husband Sebastian and cross-examined via text records, witness statements, and family contributions. It exposes deep marital turmoil, the toll of mental illness, and the difficulties of achieving certainty in a cold case rife with personal biases and incomplete investigations. The episode ends with Ridgen planning to push further into witness interviews, police records, and conflicting accounts in the hopes of bringing the facts—and perhaps Jackie herself—into clearer view.

Transcript

[Safeway/Albertsons Announcer]

Safeway and Albertsons have made saving easier than ever with great savings on family favorites this week at Safeway and Albertsons. USDA Choice Beef, boneless, tri tip, whole or flankin style ribs bone in our $6.99 per pound member price and asparagus or $1.99 per pound member price plus 16 ounce strawberries, 6 ounce raspberries or blackberries are $1.97 each. Limit three member price with digital coupon. Hurry in. These deals won't last. Visit safewayoralbertsons.com for more deals and ways to save.

[David Ridgeon]

This is a CBC podcast. The following episode contains difficult subject matter, including references to suicide. Please take care while listening.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Good morning. How are you?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Good.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Is Sebastian here?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Yeah.

[Sebastian Furlund]

How are you?

[David Ridgeon]

Oh, thanks. It's around 8:30am but the woman who has answered the door in bare feet, green tank top, dark blue shorts and paisley house dress seems well into her morning routine. Cheerful, with shorter black hair. She's wary of me now. At least I don't think I'm the person she was expecting. Sorry, come so early.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Sorry, I got my shoes on here.

[David Ridgeon]

I don't want to get your stuff. I'm David.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

David, I'm from Canada. I'm from cbc.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Oh, just come see.

[David Ridgeon]

Sure. Lorraine goes into a back bedroom and I can hear low voices. I've come here to speak to the man she lives with, Sebastian Furlund. As the story goes, his wife Jackie disappeared from the house I'm standing in right now on August 17, 2021. And since then, Sebastian has been the subject of much intrigue and suspicion as people in Jackie's family and the community try to make sense of what happened that night. But trying to make things make sense in a cold case can be tricky. It can lead to a new truth, one perhaps more compelling or convenient, but also potentially unfactual.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Sebastian, good morning. How are you?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Good.

[David Ridgeon]

I'm okay. Sebastian has come around the corner, seeming to have just woken up. He's bald and lean in black shorts with colorful triangular patterns and a gray tank top, tattoos visible on both arms. I'm from CBC in Toronto. Here's my card. This is a beautiful place. Sebastian says nothing, but beckons, then silently leads me, downcast and slow, back out the front door and then along the side of the house toward the back. Lorraine stays behind with a kind of polite but tense smile on her face. We arrive at a flourishingly overgrown backyard area with an adobe red cement patio surrounded by painted yellow walls, and Sebastian drags over some lawn chairs across the concrete pad we're standing on.

[Sebastian Furlund]

I got drag and dirt enough. And I know that if I say no to the interview, you're just gonna bullshit something.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

That's not the intention.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Like. Yeah, but it's not. But your intention is to make money, right? So obviously you're gonna make me look bad. There's always a new person who get in the picture and it's like, oh my God, what did happen? Did he investigate the husband and stuff?

[David Ridgeon]

There is a lot of talk about Jackie's husband now lawn chaired in front of me, but not much real reporting about him or the case. I want to get past all that and the numbing hum of rumor. It's distracting and deflective and like a kind of propagand that can shield what's actually underneath. What facts can Sebastian provide? Was he or the case investigated and by whom? What was his relationship with Jackie like? And most germane. Does Sebastian know anything more about the day or night of Jackie's disappearance? I'm David Ridgeon and this is season 10 of Someone Knows Something. The Jacqueline Furlan smith case, episode 2 paper mache.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Technically. Okay, like in that story, okay. A lot of like the AIDS that I got like from people is just because I said that she had like mental issues.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

I've seen some of the stuff on Facebook. There's been a lot of accusations and

[Sebastian Furlund]

a lot of hate. It's just that your wife like leave and stuff and it's not seen again. You need to explain why she left. People just want to have like a guilty person and they just want to accuse me because yes, I'm the person who was with her. Yes, we all heard those things, right? Like if you want to know the guilty person look like for like the closest to them or look at the husband. Right. Like all those stereotypes. Right. And the people that I get the comments from are all people who never met me, never met her. Which is kind of sad. But it's. I guess that's the courageous people of Facebook. It's not like, oh, the beautiful princess was walking in the park and left not to be seen again. Yes, she was beautiful, she was intelligent. But she was also mentally ill. It's diagnosed and disproves.

[David Ridgeon]

Despite his misgivings, Sebastian is sitting more across his chair rather than in it. Relaxed and listening to his deep voiced tone. I make careful note of not only what he says, but how he says it. In the YouTube video Sebastian appears in just a couple of weeks after Jackie disappears. He starts off by talking about Jackie's mental state and Here with me, he. He also starts the same way. I push further, asking for a bit of history between him and Jackie in the run up to her disappearance.

[Sebastian Furlund]

At the beginning, okay, 11 years, because we've been together almost 11 years. I think close to that. She was like, perfect.

[David Ridgeon]

According to Sebastian, Jackie lost work in Canada, making their finances more reliant on his income.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Right. So she became more stressed and then had few bad experience at work. Different jobs, right. Like, and she started to have like a bit more like episodes, if you can call them. Right. Like, if she had no stress and. Or doing great, she was the best wife ever. Like, she was nice to be around and everything. Like, I really enjoy, like the years I spent with her, except obviously when she was sick because it's difficult. Right. She's someone who needed stability and my job could not really offer that to her. Right. I'm just honest about that.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian says he convinced Jackie to take basic training and join the Canadian military to access benefits and job security. But that again, with his own job in the military as a sergeant mechanic and frequent absences, he. Even more stresses were caused in their relationship. Eventually they made the decision to live and basically retire early here in Costa Rica. Sebastian himself left the Canadian Forces in 2019.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Yeah, I have PTSD, okay. And my PTSD is basically the stuff that I seen, basically. And just the general stress related to the army is disturbing my sleep pattern, basically. So I don't sleep like a normal person at all. I end up having a bit more like social anxieties and stuff. Like that example, if I'm in public and there's too much noise or like a bit people pushing around, like, I'm really not comfortable, I need to leave, or just being at the restaurant with people behind my back, I'm not comfortable. I still do it. So I keep my comfort zone bigger because if you don't do that, you end up like a hermit. You're going to live in your basement and not see anyone.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

You become agoraphobic.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. So, yeah, maybe my mistake. Okay. But moving into a different country where it's more relaxed, tropical, I thought would be less stressful and help her because the more she had stress, the worse she was. Right.

[David Ridgeon]

But Sebastian says it didn't work out to be more relaxed, especially when they got out of their Playa del Coco condo and started building this house we're now sitting behind in the Cacique development.

[Sebastian Furlund]

So then we end up building the house here and building a house in a third world country with language barrier. And stuff obviously ended up being stressful. Basically, like, my plan to reduce her stress level completely backfired and, like, end up being much more stressful for. Yeah.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian says that stress often manifested itself in violent outbursts.

[Sebastian Furlund]

But nobody speak about, like, men who are abused and beat up. There's a lot of them, they just don't speak up. Right. She used to smash my head on the ceramic tile and stuff like that. She was an athlete. She was strong. And as a man, what do you do? Like, you can't do anything. You call the police because you get beat up and the police are gonna take you away. They don't take the wife. It's the way it works. You can't do anything. You just let yourself being beat up.

[David Ridgeon]

So you never went to the hospital

[Interviewer/Reporter]

with any of the injuries?

[Sebastian Furlund]

No, but there's actually tons of people who saw me with huge bruises, like in my face, neck, head and stuff. And even Gordon and Colleen, if they are honest. Seen pictures of that.

[David Ridgeon]

I press forward and Sebastian continues telling me a bit about the time before Jackie disappeared.

[Sebastian Furlund]

After I called her dad to ask for help. That's basically when, like, everything really started to go downhill. It may be up to a few months before I was like, I really need your help. Like, it's going out of control.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian says things got worse after he called Jackie's parents a few months before she disappeared. While Sebastian was paying for most of the house construction, documentation I've seen shows that Jackie was managing many aspects of it. Slowdowns and shoddy workmanship led to regular disputes between contractors and both Sebastian and Jackie. Sebastian says that Jackie's mental health worsened during this period. To the extent that he decided to call her parents and ask for help.

[Sebastian Furlund]

It was more like, obviously, building a house in Canada is stressful, but it's still pretty straightforward, right? Like, you expect people to do a good job. But here was like, basically there was a bunch of stupid stuff. Example, you install ceramic tiles. If there's one that have a chip on it or it's damaged, you don't install that. So you tell them, hey, this is chip. Like, you need to replace that. So you get them to replace the tile. Then you come back, they replace it again by another tile that's damaged, another chip. Okay, that gets a bit annoying. I basically spend my old days here, like, supervising them, because otherwise there's just mistakes after mistakes after mistakes. But at some point, like, Jackie started, like, to lose her shit on those guys, and it's bad. And obviously taking care of someone like that is not a single person's job. And put that in a foreign country where she don't speak the language makes it much difficult.

[David Ridgeon]

Colleen and Gordon say that Jackie did most of the project supervision and not Sebastian. And they also say that the framing of Sebastian's phone call for help was around the difficulties of the construction project and how stressful it was. But Sebastian implies that it was about Jackie's mental state in particular. Regardless, Jackie, Sebastian says, became very upset that he had called her parents.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Then, like, she basically got furious, and she never cooled down from that. She was, like, literally enraged. And she was so angry at me that I called her dad, and she basically had the feeling that I pretty much took her family away from her because, like, now her family was like, oh, our daughter is sick and stuff, and, like, that kind of stuff.

[David Ridgeon]

I want to keep moving deeper here. There is an obvious gulf between Jackie's parents and Sebastian in both directions that can tend towards what I will call an unhelpful bias against each other. And I don't want to dwell too much too soon on anything that might take me away from the central question on everyone's mind.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

So then the day of the 17th, what happened that day?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Yes, the 17. Okay. That day. I'm not gonna say hours. Okay, Exactly. But just, like, the logical order where, like, stuff happened. Okay. In the morning, she had the physiotherapist. Okay, I'm saying morning. It may be around noon, but, like, before lunch, she had a physiotherapist appointment in Tamarindo. Tamarindo is about, what, hour? Fifteen minutes from here.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[Sebastian Furlund]

So I myself normally go with her for appointments because most of the time, everybody speaks Spanish, so it makes it easier. And she had, like, a really big tendency to be anxious and stuff. So normally, if I'm with her, I can, like, avoid some of the triggers and stuff and get stuff to go easier and smoother or. So that specific day, I checked my calendar before she leave and add an appointment with my psychologist.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian is referring here to his own psychologist, whom he would call in Toronto, Canada.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[Sebastian Furlund]

At about the same time that she had hers. So that kind of started, like, right there, actually, because when I told her I have an appointment and I can go, she kind of became, like, really, like, jealous. And she was like, yeah, conveniently. And stuff. Like, as if, like, I had a fake appointment, like, to cheat on her with, like, someone while she was gone or whatever. So that was already a bad start. So she went to her appointment.

[David Ridgeon]

And you stayed here, went to the

[Sebastian Furlund]

hospital My appointment was on the phone. So while I was having my appointment, she started to send me texts and stuff. Okay. And the text that started, if I'm right, it started, oh, they got the physiotherapists. So I was like, who's they? She's like, whoever's trying, like, to ruin my life. I was like, okay. But, like, then I was like, what's going on?

[David Ridgeon]

Across the day, Sebastian says he and Jackie texted each other. And the messages that Sebastian eventually shows me are screen captures from a phone he no longer has. From the screencaps, which do not show the sender's full name. I'm still able to construct a rough timeline of the texting. I cannot confirm that Jackie or Sebastian wrote any of the messages or on what device they were composed on, but my opinion is that the messages were likely written on Jackie's phone and on the phone Sebastian had at the time. I read the messages as I am shown them because Sebastian declines to give them to me as files, although he says he gave these exact text copies to Costa Rican investigators because this is

[Sebastian Furlund]

a new iPad, and it's when all my data transferred there because that's not even the right year.

[David Ridgeon]

Jackie's message is first composed just after an appointment with her physiotherapist in Tamarindo, whose name is Tatiana.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

So I told you they got to this physiotherapist now. 1213. Who they? That's you who they, right? Whoever's destroying my life, it was not fine today what happened. That's you. No. They got her to put the needles in nerve spots, and she said it was the same. She always does, but it wasn't. She did one spot, and it was with severe pins and needles all over my foot twice.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian tells her his appointment is now starting, and Jackie continues saying what happened during her appointment.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

My appointment starts now. 12:19.

[David Ridgeon]

She said she was doing the same

[Interviewer/Reporter]

thing, and if it was responding like that, she can't do them. Then I said I was not paying. Plus, she had her assistant do everything else who answered the phone during the appointment without any explanation. I'm not coming back. I'm ready to die. Goodbye. That's 12:20. There is no help for me. 12:21, please come back is what you say here. The green one says I deserve to commit suicide. I'm a horrible person who needs to be punished with an E at the end, severely, for everything I ever did. 12:21, no, you are not. The green says, this person is just leading me to the right answer.

[David Ridgeon]

They Are right.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

I don't deserve anything good to ever happen to me. I'm done. Sorry for wasting your life. They did this after I told

[Sebastian Furlund]

the

[Interviewer/Reporter]

doctor yesterday about the needles working. They must have paid her to do this to me. 12:23 I can't win and I can't live.

[David Ridgeon]

They win.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Everyone wins. I'll be gone. Take care and enjoy your life. Don't look for me. 12:24 no. You say, do you want me to meet you somewhere? And then it's Fuck you, asshole. Keep all your shit and find someone else to torture. 145 Right. So it jumps from 1224 no. And then you say, do you want me to meet you somewhere? At 116 she says fuck you asshole. At 144 keep all your shit and find someone else to torture.

[David Ridgeon]

At 1:45 the Jackie side of these messages shows someone in obvious distress with signs of paranoia. Then Sebastian comes back and at 2:31

[Interviewer/Reporter]

it's the green comes back. I just want to help. I'm not having anything to do with those things. Where can I meet you, please? I'm in Tamarind. Oh, I guess Tamarind looked everywhere and can't see you.

[David Ridgeon]

I will stay a few hours.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Let me know where you are, please. Then Jackie replies The answer at 2:41 I'm not in Tamarindo. I told you not to look for me. 02:42 what do you want me to do? This is not a solution. 2:42 There is no solution, Sebastian. 243 this and then my phone will die. Just forget about me. My phone will die. Just forget about me. 244, 246 no. Let me help you. And then at 5:53 I got an email message that my dymex cannot be processed.

[David Ridgeon]

No message from Jackie between 2:46 and 5:53. Dimex is a digital identification issued to foreigners by Costa Rica and is required for banking and other official expat activities.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

You've done numerous things to me over and over again while I'm the one punished. 635 so fuck you and your perfect mom and ex girlfriend. Which is better than me And Wooks. Never do or say anything that I do. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck with a bunch of Fs and a bunch of Us and then that's it.

[David Ridgeon]

According to what I am shown, Jackie's texts to Sebastian stop at 6:35pm if these texts are from Jackie, we have a sense of her being extremely upset. She makes threats that she will kill herself and not to look for her. Tells Sebastian to fuck off. But then what happened? I want to know more about what was going on while these messages were being exchanged. And of course, afterward, across this period of messaging, Sebastian says he tried to call Jackie.

[Sebastian Furlund]

I tried to call, yeah, multiple times. And she would not answer. She was like, I told you not to, like, call me, like, all that stuff. So at some point after, let's say, an hour, whatever, like, the time for her to drive back, she was not here. So I went to Tamarindo and check, like, all around. Like, I know normally the place she likes to eat or, like, stuff. So, like, I check all around. Right.

[David Ridgeon]

Tamarindo is a small tourist developed town of around 6,000 people about an hour and 20 minutes south of Playa Coco in good traffic. Sebastian took his scooter and I estimate that the timing of this departure would have been around 1pm with arrival sometime around 2 or 2:30pm I asked Sebastian if he went to the physiotherapist's clinic since that was where Jackie had been when she went into town. It seemed an obvious place to start, but Sebastian says he didn't bother. Oh, physio. So did you ever speak to the

[Interviewer/Reporter]

person in Tamarindo and say, did she come here?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Those people are like doctors, right? So, like, unless you're the police, they're not going to tell you stuff, right? They have, like. They have to respect people's privacy.

[David Ridgeon]

I find Tatiana and call her to hear her perspective on what might have happened during this appointment with Jackie.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Hi.

[David Ridgeon]

Hi, Tatiana, can you hear me? It's David.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

How are you, David?

[David Ridgeon]

I am good. Thank you very much for doing this again. If you could just tell me what your memory is of that day when Jackie. First of all, had Jackie been to see you before?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Yes, that was. I don't remember exactly, but was the fifth or sixth session that I saw her. That was the fifth or the sixth.

[David Ridgeon]

Okay.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Comes to my office because she had in that time a plantar fasciitis. That was. She said. And, and, yeah, just. We're, we're working on, on that issue for, for the last three weeks before that day.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[David Ridgeon]

And did, when she came before, did Sebastian, her partner, come with her?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Yes. Don't remember how many times, but I remember once she came alone.

[David Ridgeon]

And did he. We'll circle back. But did, did Sebastian come to see you that day?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

No. That day? No.

[David Ridgeon]

And do you remember, did Sebastian come to see you any other day after that day?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

No. Never again?

[David Ridgeon]

He never came back to talk to you?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

No.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[David Ridgeon]

And did police come and talk to you?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Who?

[David Ridgeon]

The police. O. I j.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

The police. No.

[David Ridgeon]

Okay. Like ever.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Never ever.

[David Ridgeon]

I asked Tatiana to describe specifically what happened during the appointment.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

I used a needle in the posterior tibial muscle. And that hurts her. I remember. And she told me, stop doing that. That hurts. And. And yes, that. That was. And actually we finished the session after that because she told me that hurts. We finish with a massage and then she goes. When she told me that her. Tatiana or whatever she told me, she just told me, I want to finish the session. I don't feel well, please. And we're finished. And she just. She gone.

[David Ridgeon]

Okay. So when she left, did you. Did she say she was leaving because of pain or did she tell you why she was leaving early?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

She was like very, like very angry with me. Was. Was super. A surprise for me because she was super relaxed. Always say had. I mean, always say hi with good mood. And was I. She. She was upset that day and just she's. And she told me, I don't pay you for this session. Etc. I told her, no problem.

[David Ridgeon]

So Jackie, when she was saying she was upset, I mean, did she seem upset when she came into the office before you started? Was she upset then?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

No, no, no. She. She doesn't talk. She doesn't talk too much, actually. Just, hello, good morning. That's it. And that morning, no, was normal. Like the other days.

[David Ridgeon]

Okay.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Was at the end.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[David Ridgeon]

And at the end of the session when she started to feel pain and she said, stop, that hurts. Was she.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

How.

[David Ridgeon]

What was her behavior like? Was she aggressive towards you or did she say things that you didn't understand to you or.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

He was. She was aggressive in the way she talked to me. She doesn't do any, don't touch me or push me or whatever. That kind of. Not. Not kind of like behaviors, but she. She talking like never I hear before.

[David Ridgeon]

Okay. And when she left, did she say something rude to you, like, you know, off, or was she mean to you? Or did she just say goodbye, I'll see you next time? Or how did it end?

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

No, just. No, just a goodbye. I mean, she left,

[Sebastian Furlund]

So that's what I did.

[David Ridgeon]

And then taking a breath, Sebastian prepares himself to get into the last crucial part of the day. The last time that he says he saw Jackie alive,

[Safeway/Albertsons Announcer]

Jack Harndale was helping his daughter Emily lift an awkward dresser up a staircase when he slipped and fell backwards. A week later, Emily asked him how he was doing.

[David Ridgeon]

I'm good.

[Safeway/Albertsons Announcer]

Truth was, he wasn't good. Jack needed Help. Then the darndest thing happened. Emily called Pacific Source my health plan. Jack learned that Pacific Source provides members with support beyond health care. In Jack's case, we got him in touch with the local food bank.

[David Ridgeon]

You guys do that?

[Safeway/Albertsons Announcer]

Yes, we do, Jack. Pacific Source Health plan.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

After winter stillness, spring invites you to open things up.

[David Ridgeon]

With Pura's spring collection, you can explore

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

scents inspired by place. Sunlit terraces, blooming gardens, open air drifting through familiar rooms. It's not about starting over. It's about layering in something new.

[Sebastian Furlund]

A small sensory shift that refreshes your space and how it feels to be in it.

[Tatiana (Physiotherapist)]

Open the door to spring this season and shop [e-mail].

[Sebastian Furlund]

I kept messaging and checking if I had, like, message from her, like, basically saying that she's back or whatever and. Not sure about what time I came back by that time. I think I got back here about, like, dinner time, maybe around that time.

[David Ridgeon]

So dinner time. I'll map out the timings as I go and figure out when this dinner time might have been.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

So you came back and she was here, and then what happened after that?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Okay, she was here. Okay. And normally. Okay. Like, when people are, like, really, like, angry and stuff, it's not the right time to have a conversation. So since I didn't eat anything all day at that moment, I just went in town and eat, like, just to get her, like, a time bit, like, to cool down. Because, like, to be honest, like, I hate fighting, so I don't want any part in that. Like, anybody who knows me know I don't like fighting, and I don't want to fight, like, period. So. Yeah.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

So you went alone into town down here in Coco and ate at a restaurant?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay.

[David Ridgeon]

What Sebastian tells me is different from what others say. He told told them about what happened when he first got home from searching Tamarindo. In this version of the story that he tells me, he comes home, sees Jackie, assesses she is still upset, leaves for town to eat around dinner time, he says, then returns again sometime after that, over an hour later. In a different arrival version, Christa recalls hearing that Sebastian arrives and stays home to eat with Jackie. Gordon says he heard that when Sebastian returned home, nobody was there. So he went into town and picked up some food and brought it back, and Jackie was there when he returned with it. In the version, Sebastian tells me where he goes to town to eat. Sebastian mentions the name of the restaurant he went to as being the Palms. But I haven't yet been able to find anyone who worked there at the time or who knew Jackie or Sebastian. In any version of the story I have heard so far, Jackie has returned home after texting Sebastian her I'm ready to dies her don't look for mes her fuck offs and her goodbyes.

[Sebastian Furlund]

When I came back, she was still in the same condition. Basically like pissed off. Like to the point where like her green eyes were literally black. Like so. And I seen that multiple times obviously. Okay, again, when she's like that, it's not the right time to talk. So I just went to shower and while I was in the shower, she came and started to take toilet paper like from. Because the toilet obviously is right beside the shower. She started to take toilet paper and like throw it at me in the shower. Like, like balls like paper mache basically. Right, okay. But like in a shower, like toilet paper make quite the mess, right? So I was like, like what the fuck is going on? Like it's like nobody expect that, right? Yeah. So I just like took like a piece of paper and just throw her, throw it her way. Like stop doing that. It's like it's a disaster. Then she, she would not stop. She got towards me and punched me in the mouth and my four like top teeth like, like went through my lip like. So I was like stun obviously. Right. You don't expect to be hitting them out when you're in the shower and getting thrown toilet paper.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Was it like a fist punch or.

[Sebastian Furlund]

A fist punch? Yeah, so. And she's an athlete and she's almost tall like me, so she's strong like that, that hurt right after that I was like, basically what the fuck happened? There's nothing else to say. Basically you're like, this is bad.

[David Ridgeon]

Did you start to feel yourself getting angry at that time or just upset

[Sebastian Furlund]

in a way that she was upset, obviously. But anybody who knows me, I spent 20 years in the army and I can't even scream at people even though I was paid to do it. By the time I cleaned the mess, I came out of shower dry myself and I look, she was not there. So next thing I notice is in front of the, the couch we have an ottoman or whatever you call that like to put your feet. Her engagement ring was there and her phone. So I was like, this is like really weird. But like it's not the first time too that she get angry and leave and spend a day or two at the hotel. Right? Like, or just park herself like a kilometer from here.

[David Ridgeon]

Would she leave her phone and ring

[Interviewer/Reporter]

it on most occasions too?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Or Just this time she left her engagement ring before. Okay, but not the phone as far as I know. So obviously there was no way I could contact her. She had no phone. I took my bike and went like everywhere to look and stuff. It's about what time at night this was. I would say between seven or nine. Like around that time it was already dark.

[David Ridgeon]

A lot of different things are said to have happened in. In this afternoon to late evening window of Sebastian arriving home and Jackie arriving home and thereafter. I'll have to do more digging to see if I can figure out which, if any, version is 100% true. I wonder again about the punch in the face. Sebastian has already said he would not be the type to escalate and you're

[Interviewer/Reporter]

not the type that would fight back in that situation. You say no.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian goes on to tell me that he made preparations for his own suicide immediately after Jackie disappeared.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Okay, like right beside my bed, I have the two things of alien, like to commit suicide. Oh, because I was okay. Like I'm basically like hanging from that like, like, like before. Like, like somebody's say or do anything and push me over the edge. So I was like, I might as well be ready. So that's awful. It's mostly Gordon and Colleen who pushed me there basically at that for like months before my bed, beside my bed, like I was like, I was basically staying in life at that time, staying alive because I think my parents deserve better. And that story almost killed them, like basically even some. So if they lose me on top of that, like they're bad, right? So that's. If I did not have my parents and a few friends here, like I'm telling you, I would have used a propane tank probably before calling the cops. Right? That was at that point. Right?

[David Ridgeon]

At this point. Sebastian takes a few deliberate breaths and adjusts in his chair. It's a moment we all need and I take it before continuing through speaking to Jackie's friends and family, I've discovered that when Jackie left on two or three occasions, she would return. Sebastian himself has left before for periods of time and admits this to me. Some messages from Jackie to her Sister Candace in October 2019 talk about Sebastian leaving and also are suggestive of an outburst he had. Jackie's version of the event reads as Oct. 24, 2019, 8:02pm Sebastian left me at a restaurant in town tonight for a reason I have no idea about, without money. And so I got a ride with a local to our condo. He left me with no money at night and didn't even care. Then when I came back and asked what happened, he lost it and threw his phone on the floor and then left on the Vespa without a helmet. Wtf. Hopefully he returns. Okay, geez, can we just have a normal life, please? Sebastian has told me that this incident 100% happened. He threw his phone down so he couldn't be reached, he said, and he left. Because the situation with Jackie was escalating back to August 17, 2021. So she leaves here.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

What's the option here if you leave?

[Sebastian Furlund]

What.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

What would happen? Like if he.

[David Ridgeon]

She walked out the door? She take her car? The car is a gray Nissan Micro four door registered to Jackie, but both she and Sebastian drove it.

[Sebastian Furlund]

No, she did not take the car actually. So the thing, okay, that was again hidden in social media. And I'm gonna say it at the beginning, okay, like that's where like people like were like, like accusing me of bullshit and stuff. But it was confirmed by the neighbors there on that side. And she saw her leave the door with a small bag like that looked like a small grocery bag or something. And the description, she was dressed exactly like I said and her hair were exactly the way I said. So our neighbors are leave the house

[David Ridgeon]

at that time between 7 and 9.

[Sebastian Furlund]

And this is confirmed. And even my former in laws are like aware of that. So they won't see it online or anything. But obviously I did not like do anything.

[David Ridgeon]

A few weeks later, when interviewed by Pepito Live, Sebastian provides an exact description of what he says Jackie was wearing that night. And now he says something similar to me. Do you remember what she was wearing?

[Interviewer/Reporter]

I know that there's been descriptions of her. I just want to get it from you to know what the description is.

[Sebastian Furlund]

Her hair were in a bun like always pretty much. She was wearing a tank top, like a sport tank top, like fast drying fabric, like basically right about that color, like teal or with short shorts. Some flip flop

[David Ridgeon]

photos of the teal flip flops were circulated on Facebook around August 29th. I make a note to talk to the neighbors about what they might have seen. Sebastian also says there were sightings of Jackie over the following days in playacoco.

[Sebastian Furlund]

The other thing, okay, like following that like in the next I believe three days she was seen by people in Coco here, like people who know her for like years. So it was obviously her. It was not like some random person who was like, oh I seen her. It was people who known her. But that's why like the three person who known her personally obviously know it's her. Because they were. No, no. We're not talking about that girl who's drunk on the beach. We're talking about your wife. Yeah, one of them. Okay. Was. His name was Keith. I don't know his second name. He used to be the chef at Coconuts. And then the other was waitress at the restaurant Santorini. Her name is Carol. Yeah.

[David Ridgeon]

My questions for Sebastian will continue. So far, I found him open and motivated, but also deeply frustrated with his points, often emerging from a place of anger. But to get some clarity on Jackie's disappearance from another perspective, I reach out to the Costa Rican version of the FBI or oij. Oijota. After several attempts, an officer named Ulysses Guevara answers his phone. He's one of the men in the room. Jackie's parents say when they were told that Sebastian was a viable suspect. I was the investigator who handled the case. He tells me and CBC producer Mandy Sham. We ask if he's able to talk to us about it. Ulysses says, no, we're not allowed because of politics and that I need to contact the director of the OIJ in Costa Rica, a fellow named Randall Zuniga. So I make plans to do that and also to contact Canadian police, including the rcmp. But until police can talk to me about Jackie and what might have happened to her, its family, friends, eyewitnesses, and Sebastian. There's also something else in Jackie's timeline.

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

We had the amount right? Yeah, it was $99 or $100 at both places.

[David Ridgeon]

Some receipts on Jackie's credit account late on the day she disappeared. Do they offer something? One at Walmart for about US$17 around 4:33pm and the other two receipts for a total of about US$65 at Tienda La Nueva, a popular surf shop about 45 minutes from Coco. The first receipt there comes, according to the OIJ at around 6pm and then another around 6:50. But the RCMP review of Jackie's credit card statement shows only one charge at the surf shop at 6:33pm Regardless, Jackie's card was used at the shop in the same approximate window. We call down and talk to salespeople who say they worked in the surf shop in 2021. They remember seeing Jackie in their store. We ask if they remember anyone else in the store with Jackie, and they do remember seeing her there with a man, but cannot be sure what he looked like or the exact date. I asked Sebastian whether he and Jackie had ever been to the store, and he said they had visited it together about four or Five times. It's difficult to say for sure that it was Jackie using her card on 17 August, but they did know her as a customer and recognized her when they saw her missing person flyers. They say that police never spoke to any of them. Jackie's parents, Gordon and Colleen believe that Jackie wasn't the one using the credit card.

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

At Walmart and another store first. Yeah.

[David Ridgeon]

Do you know what was purchased there

[Interviewer/Reporter]

on those at that time?

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

Apparently it was it.

[Sebastian Furlund]

They asked us if this was her

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

signature on the receipt. They had that, but it wasn't her signature. It was just scribble and she just signed like that. I already showed that the police up her usual signature. You can read her name and try and Smith.

[David Ridgeon]

Jackie's phone would have been texting Sebastian about Dymex at the time. The 6pm and 6:50pm receipts were documented at the surf shop. I'll need to check into this carefully. It's unclear from the receipts what was purchased and if we assume Jackie used the card, what does shopping on the way home, probably for upscale clothing, mean for her state of mind? Also, where is Jackie's phone that was left behind and what might it reveal? Pings off towers her locations across the day. Sebastian's version of events shows Jackie to be the aggressor and he the victim. But was that always the case? My investigation has surfaced that this dynamic may at times have been two sided. In a text from Jackie to Candace, her sister, dated December 2019, Jackie describes a pushing incident and says, Sebastian also grabbed my breast and twisted it and pushed me. Tonight after I asked him about the towel and he denied that it smelled, I asked Sebastian about this fight

[Sebastian Furlund]

that.

[Jackie's Sister Candace or Friend]

Yes, I remember that

[Sebastian Furlund]

she did not

[Jackie's Sister Candace or Friend]

want, like to let me go out of the bedroom. Okay. So she always thought, okay, that the towels were like, basically, I don't know, that people were coming when we're not there and opening the door and stuff. And like for whatever reason, they managed never to be seen by anyone. And they would do stuff to her toothbrush or her clothes, making holes in her clothes and stuff or like wiping their ass with their towel or stuff. So yeah, at some point, like, yeah, like she was arguing and like, oh, you're doing that to me. You're doing that to me. Like always the same story, right? And I tried to sleep and she was like getting all wound up and like aggressive and stuff. So she pushed me on the floor, like in that ceramic floor, right? So I know it's just falling from her bed, but it's not fun. So I came back on the vet. She did that three times, if I remember well. And then, like, I gave her, like, a bit of a push, like, hey, stop that. And yes, like, my aunt ended up where, like, her breast was.

[David Ridgeon]

And Colleen and Gordon also have a similar story that they say they heard directly from Jackie.

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

Well, they had a night when they went out and were drinking and came back all the key knocked her down. She said, Sebastian knocked her down. He said, no, I pushed her. And Jackie said, no, he knocked her down. That's the second time I said, I talked to Sebastian a few days later. I said, that better not happen again, you know.

[Sebastian Furlund]

And.

[David Ridgeon]

And so what was his explanation? What did he tell you at that incident when you say he pushed her

[Interviewer/Reporter]

down or she told you that, what

[David Ridgeon]

did he say to you? Did he.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

As an explanation for that?

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian tells me that he only remembers one such incident and that Jackie ended up falling down because he says she was screaming at him and in his words, was out of control. He says Jackie at one point blocked the door and then she fell down when he opened it. He says that he did not push Jackie.

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

Well, he said, oh, yeah, okay, sorry, you know, yeah, it won't happen or whatever, but, you know, so. And one thing before we. He phoned us once or twice in the middle of the night her that he was going to commit suicide too, or something, you know, that the one lady called and he said he was going to commit and we had to talk him out of a situation. I just tell him, you'll feel better in the morning. And I did say, maybe you two have to go your separate ways. And then it was okay.

[David Ridgeon]

Sebastian says he was suicidal because Jackie was, in his opinion, increasingly going nuts. And the call to. To her parents was a cry for their help more than anything, and it was fine.

[Gordon or Colleen (Jackie's Parents)]

So Jackie told us that he was a narcissist and gaslighting her. And I didn't even know what gaslighting was. I had to look it up and try to figure out from the explanation, you know, saying one thing and then changing it after and trying to gaslighting her and trying to make her think she was losing her mind or something, you know, so. And she was a pretty bright lady there. And like I say, she had that struggle with anchor issues there sometimes.

[David Ridgeon]

When the OIJ told them to leave Sebastian's house, Colleen and Gordon searched for a place to stay. They found a condo for sale owned by a man who said he was a retired local investigator who promised to help them look for Jackie. They bought the condo, but I'm not sure how much investigation this fellow did and I'll try to talk to him. In the back of their minds, Colleen and Gordon said was that if Jackie returned, they would be there to offer her some support and a place to stay. I'll be trying to find and speak to the people who Sebastian says saw Jackie and also to a person named Frank Sebastian suggests who knew them well at the condo they used to have to get his thoughts on what might have happened.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Do you think she wants to be involved?

[Sebastian Furlund]

Yeah, that's why she's there.

[Interviewer/Reporter]

Okay, so can I involve you in this?

[David Ridgeon]

And what about Lorraine, the woman who answered Sebastian's door? Over the course of my interview with Sebastian, she's appeared in the background, listening, patient, concerned, and I think she wants to say something. Sam Someone Knows Something is hosted, written and produced by me, David Ridgeon. The series is also produced by Maria Jose Burgos. Sound design by Evan Kelly. Natalia Ferguson is our transcriber, Emily Cannell is our digital producer, Chris Oak is our story editor, our executive producer is Cecil Fernandez, Tanya Springer is the senior manager and Arif Noorani is the Director of CBC Podcasts. You can binge all episodes of Someone Knows Something early on the CBC True Crime YouTube channel, or for early and ad free listening, subscribe to the CBC True Crime Premium channel on Apple Podcasts. Just click on the link in the show description. If you're looking for another series to listen to, check out Understood from cbc. From the Making of Elon Musk to the pornhub Empire, Understood goes deeper than the daily headlines and find stories at the intersection of business, technology and culture. Find Understood from the CBC everywhere you get your podcasts.

[Safeway/Albertsons Announcer]

For more cbc podcasts, go to cbc ca podcasts.