← Something Wrong With The Podcast
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- [00:00]
A
Nothing wrong with the pussy. Nothing wrong with the pussy. What's your. What's your electricity bill?
- [00:08]
B
Oh, my God.
- [00:09]
A
Electricity. But like, during the utility bills, especially.
- [00:12]
B
Right now, it's been insane. Like this winter, I think January was like 800, $900.
- [00:18]
A
Just utility.
- [00:19]
B
Yeah.
- [00:20]
A
Because this is your home too. This doubles as. As home.
- [00:23]
B
Yeah.
- [00:24]
A
Jesus, dude. Well, beyond the camera here, I'm sitting with a new friend, Keely. Ryan Keely. Incredible artists. I mean, you'll tell everybody what you don't want to, like, do that whole thing, like, tell me about your life. But this is sick. Like, met very quickly and now we're here already recording. So this is like amazing. Pretty sick that. I love New York for that.
- [00:46]
B
Jump into it.
- [00:47]
A
Jump right into it. We have Ghost will be coming in and out of frame here. Ghost is. I think that's just a great story to start with. What's the story of ghosts newest addition?
- [00:56]
B
The story. Story of the ghost ghost. You want to come here and get in? I'm sure he'll show us.
- [01:00]
A
Yeah, he'll pop in.
- [01:02]
B
Yeah. It's pretty insane. He. You know, it was actually. There's so much like, crazy symbolism and how he arrived and what's going on with it. It's like, pretty much changed my life. So, like. Yeah. On. What was it? April 2, which was Passover weekend, I get an Amazon delivery and the Amazon driver comes up and he hands my package and he's like, yo, there's a dog sitting outside your door bleeding. And I was like, what? So I go downstairs and this beautiful white dog is just covered in blood, and he's got a. Like a iPhone cord around his neck as his leash. And I'm like, what the hell's going on? Where did you come from?
- [01:45]
A
Got to be charged. Yeah, he's trying to charge his phone.
- [01:50]
B
Definitely is unplugged. Definitely unplugged and unhinged and who knows what the was going on. But yeah, so he had no. No collar, no tag, no chip, no nothing.
- [02:01]
A
Yeah.
- [02:02]
B
And so I bring him to the vet and they were like, yeah, we'll hold on to him for, you know, a week and see if anybody claims them. Nobody claimed them. Then they bring him to the acc and nobody. So nobody claimed them. So they told me they're going to. They're going to off them if I didn't come, kiddos. So I feel like I was compelled. There's a reason he showed up at my door. And of all the doors in New.
- [02:23]
A
York and the world, what if you. You're out walking him one day and like, the. I'm assuming the person that has. Is his is like, unhoused homeless. What if that person runs up on you and is like, yo, that's my dog.
- [02:36]
B
I'm gonna be like, yo, I. I feel for you. And like, I mean, you should maybe come pay him visits or figure something out, but he left him for dead. He was gonna die if I didn't, you know.
- [02:48]
A
Yeah.
- [02:48]
B
Didn't take them. And, you know, maybe. Maybe the fact that he had an iPhone cord around his neck. The guy's phone has just been uncharged.
- [02:57]
A
Since he's trying to call the. Yeah, yeah.
- [02:59]
B
He just hasn't been able to charge his phone.
- [03:01]
A
He wasn't mad he lost Ghost. He was mad he lost the iPhone cord. Like, I didn't charge my damn phone.
- [03:05]
B
If only there was another iPhone cord in New York, he could find his dog. But yeah, I mean, the fact he. He still had. He. He had his balls. He had no tag, no chip, no nothing.
- [03:17]
A
He still has balls that he eclipsed.
- [03:19]
B
So that's the one thing that they had to do before they delivered him to me was give him a shot, neuter him. And I begged him not to.
- [03:27]
A
It's America, man. They're taking all the men's balls away. It's just a state of Biden's America.
- [03:32]
B
Yeah. Yeah, it's horrible thing. It's. It's very sad. I'm sure he had a great set of nuts on him, just, you know.
- [03:40]
A
Just staring at half the man he used to be. Well, I'm glad Ghost has a great home here, but you did mention me, and I haven't really asked you about it in depth yet. I want to save it for this. You're somehow involved in the process of acquiring Kanye's home.
- [03:55]
B
Oh, so this is in which home? The. The Malibu.
- [04:00]
A
Malibu.
- [04:01]
B
Yeah. So I have a. You know, I don't know. I. We have. I have a long, weird history with him. Anyway, I was in, you know, we've done certain projects in the past and just had very, you know, different run ins. And this time I. I had a friend who was involved in the sale of the house, and he called me and we did a couple, like, marketing tactics together. So in. In a weird way, I helped promote the house. And then. Then that led to a sale.
- [04:33]
A
How did you. What was your involvement with the promotional pieces?
- [04:37]
B
They hit me up and I did, you know, the first idea was we were going to do an art show in the home. You know, in the raw space. It was a Tadao, you know, Tadao architecture space. And he took all the windows out and the plan was to turn it into like a, like a bomb proof bunker in. Right, right on the beach in Malibu. Which apparently didn't work out. I don't think the people at Malibu.
- [05:02]
A
No, it's a bit of an eyesore.
- [05:04]
B
Yeah. So that, that happened and then they actually, it changed hands a couple times. So it's, it's more so in developers hands right now. And I think the goal is probably still this summer. We're still going to exercise doing an art show and something to, you know, raise the value and raise awareness.
- [05:20]
A
Would the art show be in protest of Kanye or what would the nature of the art show be?
- [05:25]
B
You know, I, I, I, I admire the guys.
- [05:28]
A
Turned it into a holocaust museum.
- [05:31]
B
I've actually gotten presented with the idea.
- [05:34]
A
By, I mean, in Malibu you'd have a lot of people that would be like, you know.
- [05:37]
B
Yeah, that's, that's, I actually, I got presented with the idea to do that not too long ago and I think it's, you know, I, I, I would love to do something like that. I think the idea is to do like a, like a, like a Malibu fish fire benefit. Instead of that. I kind of want to steer clear of doing anything too racially motivated or anything to make, you know, I feel like giving it some good energy and doing something positive in there is probably the right move.
- [06:06]
A
Yeah.
- [06:07]
B
You know.
- [06:07]
A
Yeah, the people, yeah, the people of the Palisades need the, the money. No, I mean, it's like you want to make fun of them and shut them, but it's like if you, and no matter who you are, no matter how well off you are, losing your home, like all your possessions is like, that's, oh yeah, that's the hard reset. No matter like how well off you are. That's awesome.
- [06:23]
B
I had, I had a lot of good friends that lost their homes in the fire and it was like, holy, you know, like I can't imagine, you know, losing everything. I had a good friend who had a amazing house right on the beach in Malibu and it just is went to dust. Like literally not a thing left in there.
- [06:43]
A
Jesus.
- [06:44]
B
So, yeah, it's pretty insane to see.
- [06:45]
A
So, so when it's not acquiring a home from Kanye, where else? Just so people that are listening know who you are and what you've done and how you've gotten to this space as an artist. Like, also you've worked closely with Lauryn Hill forever. Like, how did that relationship come about?
- [07:04]
B
So I've been an artist pretty much my entire life. You know, my earliest memories were drawing and painting as a child since I was like, like, you know, three, two, three years old. My, you know, since I was a, you know, little kid. And then throughout school growing up, I basically was a kid that just sat in the art room, didn't have to go to any other classes, started doing that and then, you know, moved on and just been an artist my whole life. And through that I've met a lot of amazing people, a lot of people in the music industry and entertainment industry. One of my good friends introduced me to Lauren 10, 12 years ago and we were just supposed to sit down and have a 30 minute meeting and we ended up staying up all night and talking all through the night. And then next thing you know, I was doing her stages and putting artwork, you know, into all different types of projects with her.
- [07:58]
A
Yeah, I mean, I'm sure that, I mean, any time working with Lauryn Hill was probably just like open doors into that whole like, industries. Like how, I don't know, like what, what, like made it just kind of stick or like connect with her where she was like, oh, I really like this guy. Like, I can see this becoming a now like a 10 year long relationship.
- [08:17]
B
I mean, I didn't really foresee it, us rocking this long because we are very much, you know, we are complete opposites, right? Yin and yang, but it works perfectly. We complement each other great. You know, every time I love working with people that I love presenting myself with a challenge. And if you know anything about her, she's notorious for like, you know, certain people can get along with her and she's, she's just a, you know, she's a enigma of an artist that not a lot of people can handle. But I saw it as a challenge and I stepped up to bat and helped her facilitate some of the, you know, wild ideas that she has. And I'm always down to, you know, to rock with, you know, crazy ideas. And, you know, after I completed one thing, she threw me another, threw me another, threw me another, and we just kept making cool.
- [09:07]
A
Are there any other artists that you have worked with? Not because of like any other like hip hop, R and B or any other artists, like music artists that you've.
- [09:17]
B
I did, I did a. I had a friend just, he hit me one day and I had a studio right up the street and he's like, yo, I got this young guy, he needs a place to shoot a music video. You know, you think we could just Slide through and shoot a couple of scenes in your studio that ended up being Kendrick Lamar.
- [09:35]
A
Like, oh, when was this?
- [09:37]
B
This is like 2010 or 11. We did the video for Rigor Mortis in my studio.
- [09:43]
A
Holy shit.
- [09:44]
B
Yeah. So if you go back and look at that, you know, all the artwork that's in the background is all my artwork. And he was just. It was one of the first. You know, I think this is off of section 80.
- [09:55]
A
Yeah.
- [09:56]
B
Came into town and he did. He did one other video of Ashti where they were, like, running around in an office building. Can't remember the name of the song that was for. And then Rigamortis was the song that we had. And basically he came and my friend was directing it and producing the video. And then I kind of stepped in and I was, like, designing the set and giving them ideas. We had him out rhyming in the middle of Bowery, like, just looking like.
- [10:21]
A
Oh, so that video. I never knew that video was shot in New York. Yeah, right here, like, right outside, right up the street.
- [10:26]
B
It was at my old studio at. Across the street from Bowery.
- [10:29]
A
Hotel is in. Wow. That was Ali's. One of my good friends. I know a few guys in that. In that camp, but that. Those. It's crazy. I've heard, like, more early Kendrick stories recently because of. Some of the guys have gotten to know more, like, in that. In that. In that camp in particular. But I never knew that. I love that piece.
- [10:48]
B
On the wall right there is the sign that he was holding in the middle of Bowery. It says. What does it say? Please help will kill your favorite rapper for money. Trying to get back to la.
- [10:58]
A
So I actually have him sign that or.
- [11:01]
B
So I tried to hit Dave, and I haven't been able to get in touch with Dave. I hit his manager. I had a couple other people, but I was trying to, like, tell him to come out at the super bowl holding it. But I don't think that. I don't think they want something that says, like, kill your favorite rapper for money. I mean, you know, you could call someone a pedophile at the super bowl, but, yeah, I think they wanted to talk about killing.
- [11:22]
A
Yeah. Murders. Crossing the line. Pedophiles. Chill. Yeah. That's Jesus, dude. That's.
- [11:28]
B
And my boy Daryl Filth, he. I. When all this started happening, I just happened to. With all the Drake stuff, I just put a photo up of him holding that, and I was like, oh, this photo aged well. And then Darryl was like, yo, you know what? I still have. And he's got like. Daryl's got like. Like, you know, like the. The time capsule of all this old artifacts from all these old hip hop videos and stuff. So he brought that over and I framed it.
- [11:53]
A
Oh, so he had it. Okay. Sick.
- [11:55]
B
Yeah.
- [11:56]
A
What does Daryl do it in the.
- [11:58]
B
He's. He does like, a lot of music video production.
- [12:01]
A
Oh, cool.
- [12:02]
B
Now he actually runs ASAP foundation for yam's mom. He's involved in that. So we did a bunch of work with that. That's actually a piece over there of yams that I did for his mother.
- [12:15]
A
Sick.
- [12:15]
B
I've got a couple other pieces for. For asap stuff that we've done in here as well.
- [12:19]
A
Did you. I was going to ask. I mean, being in New York and being an artist here for so long, like, I feel like that's a crew that would naturally make sense with, like, your kind of art.
- [12:27]
B
I. I used to be. My studio was right over by the Black Scale store tour.
- [12:31]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [12:32]
B
On Elizabeth Street. So Mega was a friend of mine and he was. And all the ASAP kids used to come through there and grab up gear from him and so we would hang out with him.
- [12:40]
A
That's awesome.
- [12:41]
B
You know, I actually ran into him not too long ago and it was like, you know, I hadn't seen him in years and it was like, you know, good little reunion.
- [12:49]
A
Is the music space your preferred, like, collaborative space for your art or.
- [12:54]
B
I mean, it just kind of happened naturally. Like, I think I always wanted to be a musician, but I just sucked at playing instruments. And I was. I was so much more of a visual person. But doing stages and getting to go on tour with musicians, like, you know, I. I did Gary Clark junior's art direction for a long time and he's like, you know, blues guitar player, the sickest guitar player on the planet. And he would always say, be like, oh, you're the sixth member of the band, you know, and like, as I was. So that was like. And I was like, oh, sick. Like, finally get to be. Finally get to be a rock.
- [13:27]
A
Didn't you do his. You mentioned you. You designed the fit he wore to the Grammys.
- [13:32]
B
Oh, yeah. The only piece of high fashion that I've done just yet. I might be doing another one.
- [13:36]
A
What year was this?
- [13:38]
B
This was. It was right before the pandemic.
- [13:41]
A
So 18 or 19.
- [13:43]
B
No, this is the Grammys. 2020.
- [13:46]
A
Oh, wow. Yeah.
- [13:48]
B
So like two weeks before the Grammys, you know, we were just making all kinds of stuff for him and I was like, yo, what are you going to wear? He was like, I don't know. And I was like, why don't I make you a suit? And he's like, do you know how to make a suit?
- [14:00]
A
Do you know how to sew?
- [14:01]
B
I was like, no, but I'll figure it out. Just like everything else, you know. So I. I was in LA at the time, and, you know, with all my artwork, I, I, you know, I use a lot of printers and stuff, so it's like a mixed media, paint, print, paint, print, paint, print process. So I was like, oh, if I can do this on canvas, I can do this on fabric as well.
- [14:21]
A
Yeah.
- [14:21]
B
So. So I bought a bolt of Laura Piana velvet, and I. I was at. I was staying at the dream hotel. I'll never forget, like, my boy gave me. Yeah. And so I destroyed this hotel room with paint. I had, like, you know, the fabric laid out across the bed, and I.
- [14:37]
A
Was like, you did it in the hotel room? Oh, my God.
- [14:41]
B
So I've got video of it all, too. So I. I do this bolt of.
- [14:45]
A
How much in damages was that?
- [14:47]
B
I. Yeah, way exceeded the budget. Way exceeded the budget. I don't think I ever got charged for that one. I think somehow I weaseled my way out of that.
- [14:56]
A
Yeah.
- [14:57]
B
But, yeah, we did. I made the bolt a Laura Piano velvet, and then I found a flatbed UV printer in, like, you know, somewhere in Studio City or something like that and brought it back and forth. So the process was like, paint, print, paint, print, paint, print. Do multiple levels. And then. So I get the. The fabric done, and then I find this guy down in, you know, somewhere like Koreatown or something that did the cut and sew. I took one of Gary's old suits and I traced the pattern.
- [15:26]
A
Yeah. Oh, so you had the measurements. You were like, all right, this is. Yeah, it's gonna be some old.
- [15:30]
B
You know, it wasn't the hardest thing, you know, I've ever had to figure out. I had, like, the pattern and everything. So then I found a guide to help me sew it. I couldn't learn how to sew within a couple.
- [15:39]
A
Yeah, that's fair.
- [15:40]
B
So. So he put it together, and we did a couple fittings, and I think we literally. We delivered it two hours before the Grammys started. They were bugging. I remember we were sitting at.
- [15:51]
A
Rightfully so.
- [15:52]
B
We were sitting at the hotel, and he was like, yo, I don't have a backup outfit. He was like, this thing is going to be delivered in time. And I'm sitting there like, dude, calling this Guy like, a thousand times. And then he delivered it, and it was. It looked amazing. And I'll never forget, like, you walked the red carpet in it.
- [16:07]
A
Yeah.
- [16:08]
B
Everybody was like, who are you wearing? And he was like, oh, this guy.
- [16:12]
A
Made it for Dumbass friend that delivered it 10 minutes ago.
- [16:16]
B
And then he performed that night with the Roots, and it was amazing. He performed, like, the, you know, this epic song with fire in the background.
- [16:24]
A
And all kinds of.
- [16:25]
B
And it was great. And then I thought, like, I was like, oh, this is my big chance to be a fashion designer.
- [16:30]
A
Yeah.
- [16:30]
B
Talk to a couple people. And I got offered a studio in New York and a bunch of, like, a team and infrastructure to do this line to continue on with it. And then, boom, the pandemic happened. And, like, the next week and side railed all that.
- [16:44]
A
So how did. When the pandemic happened, I'm always curious to know, like, how creatives pivoted or, like, what their. What their source of income. What? Because, like, what do you do? I mean, you could still paint and sell pieces, but, like, what does that look like?
- [16:58]
B
Went and drank ayahuasca in Brazil.
- [17:02]
A
So you said work?
- [17:04]
B
Yeah.
- [17:04]
A
I thought, I'm detaching from the world.
- [17:06]
B
I thought. I thought reality was just over as we knew it. And I was like, yo, if I'm gonna. This is the end of the world. I'm going out strong.
- [17:13]
A
Tell me about that. How was that trip? I've never done it. Always been curious. I don't think I have the. Obviously, I. I was gonna say the word tolerance, but, like, that's one of those drugs that doesn't matter.
- [17:23]
B
It's really. Honestly, like, I feel like it's very tame. Like, I've done it many times and a lot, and some of the times I've done it, I've done it with, like, a mother and daughter.
- [17:33]
A
Like, like, you know, people that it's always, like, communal. Right. You never just, like, dolo. You and a shaman. I hate that, like, and bricks throwing up on each other.
- [17:41]
B
Well, I never get. I never would get violently ill, really. Other people.
- [17:46]
A
I feel like I would.
- [17:47]
B
I think that's because I just wasn't full of. But like. Yeah, that's one of the things is, like, I hated sitting around. Like, I'd be having this, like, glory, glorious epiphanies and breakthroughs, and then you got to listen to some throwing up next to you, and I would just go off.
- [18:01]
A
Yeah. Wouldn't that, like, break your.
- [18:03]
B
That's what it completely distracts.
- [18:05]
A
Yeah.
- [18:05]
B
I feel like some People need, like, a communal. Communal experience to get through it and, like, have, like, somebody holding your hand. But I've done so many psychedelics.
- [18:13]
A
When you went to Brazil, was it alone, or did you, like, go with someone to say, hey, let's. We've always wanted to do this. Let's do this together? No.
- [18:20]
B
Well, I. That was kind of a different. I. I started. I was going upstate with a friend of mine. Like, we lasted, like, I lasted in the city like, a month or two into the pandemic. And then when the riots and all that started happening, my friend was like, yo, I got this place upstate. Do you want to come hang out up there with me? And then we just ended up, like, I was hanging out with him, and then I was just like, yo, I went to Walmart and bought a tent and pitched it by the river.
- [18:45]
A
This went full Walden. Yeah. Yeah.
- [18:48]
B
I was like, this is the perfect time. I just need to go, like, hang out by myself and just chill. And then I did. I was upstairs state with him for maybe, like, a month or so through the summer, and then I came back, and then I had a really good friend of mine. He just randomly called me one day, and he was like, yo, my. We're down in Brazil. His fi. His. His family is from there. And he was like, my buddy's like, he just. He loves your artwork. He's like. He thought it'd be cool for you to come down for a week or two and just make some art. And so I'm like, I intended on only going down there for, like, two weeks and then ended up staying there for a couple months.
- [19:25]
A
Wow.
- [19:25]
B
And that was amazing.
- [19:26]
A
Did that. Did the ayahuasca and all that, did it change or develop a new type of art or a new spectrum on a life at all?
- [19:34]
B
Yeah, for sure. I mean, every time you do it, you have, like, amazing breakthroughs and just, like, you know what?
- [19:41]
A
Like what?
- [19:41]
B
Tell me. I don't know. Anything's too specific, but it just makes you. I feel like I'm much more aware and in tune with, like, you know, the universe. And, like, it kind of gives me a little bit of a God complex. I feel like, you know, I go through this, like, invincible stage when I'm kind of done with it.
- [20:00]
A
But they always say it's like the drug or the experience of. Not even to that extreme. Ayahuasca and those, like, hard psychedelics, but even, like, a drug like Molly or, I guess in some cases, shrooms. Like, if you're. If you're a narcissist or if you're someone that's like very, like you said, like a God complex type of thing, it's like it. It's the one drug that can shake that. And it's terrifying to people that have those things because they're not used to being so affectionate and outwardly showing love that they have like a breakdown from the thought of releasing, not seeing themselves as the center of the universe and like giving themselves to the universe, so to speak. I did acid in South Africa with Boz 2022. He. We. He just. We flew out for like a month. And I did it once in the bush. First time. Only time ever done acid. First and last. I would do it again. I just don't want to do it here. Yeah, it's like I come back to New York, I'm like, I'm not trying to do this on Bowery. Like, I was in the acid in.
- [21:00]
B
The city is like, I've. I mean, I've done it a million times. And it's definitely a whole different. You know, you can't. Like you. I do feel like being connected to nature when you're doing it is important.
- [21:09]
A
Yeah.
- [21:10]
B
It's a whole different trip when you do it in the city. It's.
- [21:13]
A
So when you're in the bush, it's you, you get there, you do an afternoon ride. And then we have 10 villas. There were 10 of us out there. We each had our own private villa. And it was beautiful. It's. And we do. We had dinner, like, private chef, the whole thing. And then you do the sunset ride. And then it's like we were like, all right, it's nighttime. We're safe in the villa. We're not going out, like, after the nighttime ride. But it's like, let's all just fucking. There's bonfire. Let's take acid for the night ride. Catch that on the ride. And then it'll hit us, like, at the. You know, throughout the night. We'll stay up until the morning ride. That's kind of the whole thing. Stay up through the night. I. I mean, I went through so many stages. Like, I was fearful because I'd never taken it. So I went through, like, fear. And then I went through the purest joy and laughter. I was laughing like a baby. Like, it was like I was so happy. And then I cried, but like a happy cry and then an emotional cry about, like, my family. And then. And then I started to see, like, our humans connectivity with the universe and the earth and like all the animals that were surrounding me in the. In the wilderness. Like, it shook my entire neuron. Like, my neuro. My neurosis were just synapses were just firing at levels I couldn't even process. And it was just like, the coolest thing ever. But I don't think I could do it again unless I'm in a setting like that.
- [22:30]
B
Yeah, I mean, I've. I've done it in multiple settings, and some of the best. I mean, every time is so different. Every time teaches you something different. Amazing.
- [22:39]
A
Yeah.
- [22:40]
B
I started doing it when I was pretty young, and I had a lot of amazing breakthroughs. And that's kind of like what propelled me into, like, you know, being an artist or actually, you know, deciding that that's what I was doing for my life.
- [22:54]
A
Yeah.
- [22:55]
B
Thing. But, yeah, I mean, I think it's, you know, I think everybody needs to experience it at some point. It definitely changes your whole view on.
- [23:04]
A
I think there's like an. The. Obviously, like, the Reagan era, politics was very scare, scare, scare. Do this, you'll fry your brain. Do this, you'll die. But then at the same time, they were seeing the, you know, actual benefits and scientific advancements that it could do to people that. Treating, like, Alzheimer's and, like, all these other neurodegenerative diseases. So it's like you're vilifying it to the public, but behind closed doors, you see the benefit of the value of it. So I think it's like unlearning the scare tactics. Like, I've spoken to my mom pretty openly about this stuff. She's, like, anti all this stuff, but she can. She can now come around and see. It's like, all right, like, I get it. It wasn't for our generation. We were scared shitless. But, like, it makes sense in terms of, like, where it's.
- [23:50]
B
Yeah. Well, I mean, I think they definitely vilified it for a while because it's, you know, definitely relinquishes control over, you know, people in the population. Once you see you can be free, you know, you can't. Can't have.
- [24:02]
A
Yeah. Once you realize how stupid all of this is.
- [24:05]
B
And that's kind of like, you know, even I was talking to a friend of mine is very, like, you know, just tuned into the whole political climate day in and day out. And I was like, bro, you gotta check the. Out of this. Like, turn the TV off for a little bit.
- [24:19]
A
It's during the pandemic that was tough for me because it was so. Especially during the BLM stuff, I was like, oh, like this directly relates to me and. But it's also using awful. It's just so like scary and dark and just like, you know, blacks versus whites every day. Is this person right? Is that person right? And you just scroll. It's just like. It was too much. Yeah, it was way too much.
- [24:44]
B
Like, even, even recently I've just been like, oh, like, I gotta turn this off.
- [24:49]
A
Yeah.
- [24:50]
B
And really in reality, it's like once you turn it off and you get out of that like, zone of like paying attention to every bit of news, it's like, how much does this really affect my life? You know, like I've been realizing like a lot of people, it's like, you know, it weighs them down and kind of takes their focus off of what really matters.
- [25:09]
A
Yeah.
- [25:10]
B
So I'm trying to, you know, cleanse my, like going to go on a political diet where like I can. I only want to know enough that like, affects me directly.
- [25:21]
A
And like, you know, I was, I was reading a article. It was like the, or watching something. I don't know where I've heard this or read it. It was something like the, the greatest myth ever. And talking about, you know, the religion and all these different things that, you know, keep people in check or control people. And it's like the greatest myth in this country. Like developers basically just any form of currency, money in itself just means, I mean, quite literally nothing we saw again during the pandemic, like housing markets. I paid a. A quarter of what my apartment's worth. It's like none of this is real. Like, it doesn't, it's all, it's all.
- [25:57]
B
Social, you know, socially developed perspective and you know, it's like really like if you can change the perspective of all the people people, you can change the trajectory of everything.
- [26:07]
A
Yeah.
- [26:08]
B
So, you know, even when I'm watching like markets go up and down, like, you know, I'll get trapped into that. Like, you know, I'll get trapped into.
- [26:14]
A
Like, you know, the whole crypto markets ghost is chilling.
- [26:18]
B
Yeah, it's good like getting, getting something like this completely take like to get your, get your attention away from dumb shit like that.
- [26:25]
A
Yeah.
- [26:26]
B
You know, have a dog just show up at your front door.
- [26:29]
A
How does. Because like with, especially when it. When you're in a crew, a creator and an artist, I mean, in terms of creating, you have to set your own value. How did you scale up the value of your business as you want to? Like, okay, I worked with this person. Now my rates this or like I'm using this Expensive fabric and paint. Now my rates, this or what?
- [26:47]
B
I mean, I think it's all perceived value. It's like, yeah, I wish I, like, early on, if I would have just known to set your prices high from the get go. And you don't really got to climb a ladder. Like, I see artists today, just like, they'll start, you know, start painting, and then two months in, they're like, oh, yeah, 100k, 500k. And you're just like, people are like, oh, okay. He says, that's. That's the price.
- [27:10]
A
That's the price. Yeah.
- [27:11]
B
Like, I used to be like, you know, actually have some type of morals, and I want to charge people, like, exuberant amounts for my artwork. And now it's just like, you know, you got to get what you can for it sometimes.
- [27:24]
A
But, you know, is it like in the. In when you're creating a piece? Is it when you're, like, determining the value of something? Is it the materials and the. The paint and the. In the canvas or whatever itself? Or you're like, if I'm spending this much time on something, it means I'm not making money doing these other things, or is it all those things? Like, what's the.
- [27:44]
B
It's. It's a very weird science when you. When you price something out. I kind of justify it now. Not so much on time, you know, time. Every time someone's like, how. How long did this take you? I'm like, oh, my whole life, you know?
- [27:58]
A
True. Yeah.
- [27:59]
B
I think what I really price it on is how it makes me feel. And if I love it, then I charge higher for it. If I'm like, oh, like, I. I didn't put my all into it, then I. I'll give a couple. I'll give a little discount on it.
- [28:13]
A
You know, have you had those pieces in the past where you're like, I don't want to give this away, and then someone offers the right price and.
- [28:19]
B
You'Re like, early on, when I was first starting it, like, I was in love with every piece and I never wanted to sell anything, and it was like taking a piece of my soul or, like, taking my baby away.
- [28:29]
A
Yeah.
- [28:30]
B
But now I'm just like, yo, I can. Like, the next one is always the best one. So I could.
- [28:35]
A
That's a good place to be in. I mean, even down to your. Your pants. The pants that you sold the other day.
- [28:40]
B
Yeah, that's good. Yeah, we can sell the byproducts. That's what I. I mean, I can. I. I always say like, even the paintings are a byproduct. Like, you know, your life should be the piece of art and everything else kind of just flakes off.
- [28:55]
A
And you know, how would you describe, like, what type of art do you. Do you do like what are these type style of paintings?
- [29:01]
B
Well, I guess like early on I had to come up with a name for it. So we, we started calling it hybrid Expressionism because it is expressionist work. Yeah, expressions paintings are just kind of stream of thought. And then I started calling it hybrid because I use printing machines and analog paint methods and basically whatever's in the room. So I had one of my early, like one of my best friends and my early collectors buy me this large format printer. Not this one.
- [29:29]
A
Oh, it's a different one. Okay. That thing is huge, by the way. That is.
- [29:33]
B
So I have like, that's like, I have like eight of those in store. So I just keep them for parts and whatnot.
- [29:39]
A
But it's like a 12 foot printer. I just laying up. That would, that would just. That's my whole living room. Yeah, that would take up my whole living space.
- [29:48]
B
If you saw how many people it took to get that up these stairs.
- [29:51]
A
Oh, my God. Yeah.
- [29:52]
B
And it's probably never going to leave this room.
- [29:54]
A
How heavy is that? That thing is giant.
- [29:56]
B
They're not too heavy, they're just very cumbersome to like move around.
- [30:00]
A
Yeah.
- [30:00]
B
But yeah, one of my, one of my early, one of my best friends, he had the idea, he was always very entrepreneurial and he was like, yo. He's like, you're making these great paintings. He's like, I'm going to buy this printer and then we'll make 100 prints of the paintings. And he wanted to like, you know, invest in, you know, printmaking. And the printer just sat in the studio forever. And I never really was into making prints. Yeah, I kind of, you know, just wasn't my thing.
- [30:27]
A
Wasn't that Warhol kind of like revolution? Didn't he. He had, he played a big part in like, just press it out.
- [30:33]
B
Yeah, Well, I mean, this is more so like, you know, we're just going to make digital editions of. Of it. So it sat in the studio forever. And then late one night I was on a bunch of acid and I come back and I was like, I wonder what happens if I paint on canvas and then run it through the printer. And it lasted for maybe like, you know, printed for five minutes. And then it just clogged and broke and shut down. And so like the next day or two Once I come back to reality, I call my boy and I'm like, yo, you know that printer? You bought it up? He's like, you idiot. So he's like, all right, it's going to take, like, two to three weeks for the. For the tech to come out, look.
- [31:10]
A
At it, and fix it, unclog it.
- [31:12]
B
And so during that time, I started just taking screws apart and getting inside of it, and I realized what caused it to break. And then I had a couple ideas of what I could do to make it not break the next time, and then augmented the software a little bit. So what I achieved was a way of being able to run wet paint through the printer. So it's kind of like how.
- [31:33]
A
Oh, wow.
- [31:34]
B
It's kind of like how Warhol used to paint first and then screen print on top of the painting.
- [31:38]
A
Yeah.
- [31:39]
B
I can paint first and then digitally print, and then I paint again and print again and paint again. So I'll, like, roll. I'll. It'll print out. I'll paint and then roll it back up and then let it go again.
- [31:49]
A
Wow.
- [31:50]
B
Crazy is like, very, like, you know, these are all very much unfinished, so these are not the best examples, but I like to create these, like, real, dynamic layers of depth, so you can always, like, look more and more and more. And I feel like if you're going to collect a piece of art, you want to be able to look at it forever and always find new.
- [32:09]
A
Something different. Yeah.
- [32:10]
B
You know, my favorite thing is when I'll have a collector, like, move, move homes or something, and then hit me and be like, yo, I just hung this piece in this new room, and now I see this, and I see this.
- [32:22]
A
The way the light hits it is different now.
- [32:25]
B
It's like there's so many layers underneath it. And I'll, you know, print photos and then completely cover them to where, like, it might not be the first thing that you see when you look at it, but if you look like, you know, look at it for 10 years, you always find something different. And I feel like if you're going to collect a piece and you're gonna have to look at it for your whole life, maybe have. Have a couple of Easter eggs in there.
- [32:45]
A
Yeah.
- [32:45]
B
You know.
- [32:45]
A
Do you ever play with texture?
- [32:47]
B
Yeah, I mean, that's like I use. So one of the other things I was telling you earlier is we just. I created my own paint company.
- [32:54]
A
Yeah.
- [32:54]
B
With one of my best friends, Matt, that I've known. So I was like, you know, 10 years old, and that's One of the things that we're doing now is playing with all different types of textures and stuff. So, like, I have, you know, this new suede paint where we're taking sand from famous surf beaches all from all over the world. So, like, the. The main ingredient in suede suede paint is basically sand, which isn't the most. You know, you could get it on a sandbox if you wanted to, but, yeah, I think it's cooler to, like, you know, if you have a memory from a beach where you met your wife or something, then you can put that sand into the paint and then paint your home. And it's like, you know, creating.
- [33:36]
A
Would that create, like, a grainy or how would it sit?
- [33:39]
B
Like, you've seen it before in certain places. Like, you might not notice it, but next time you go into a place and it has, like, a very rough texture, you know, if you rub your.
- [33:47]
A
Hand, it feels almost like a sandpaper.
- [33:49]
B
Yeah, that's just basically just sand additive to paint. But it's cool if you go to, like, you know, I'm doing a project this summer where we're. I'm painting a famous sculpture at Montauk Beach House. And so we're taking paint from Montauk and Costa Rica and Pipeline and other places and shipping it in and making, like, like, special batches of paint.
- [34:10]
A
Oh, that's awesome.
- [34:12]
B
Yeah.
- [34:12]
A
What's like. Yeah, you mentioned the. The Montauk, like, project. How do most of your products come in? Like, do you kind of, like, say, all right, I want to do this or I don't want to do this? Like, what's the process of, like, picking? It's like a vibe thing. It's like, all right, I could spend a week or two in Montauk or, like, what's the. You know, I mean, that.
- [34:30]
B
That doesn't sound too shitty.
- [34:31]
A
Yeah.
- [34:32]
B
But, yeah, I mean, I guess it's kind of like. Like, you know, sometimes. I don't know, you gotta weigh it. Like, sometimes, like, I always say, if you have. If you're. If you're learning something or if you're making money or, you know, you have to have, like, you know, a good mix of things. Like, sometimes I'll. I'll myself out for cash if it's the right amount for a shitty project that I don't really want to do, but I like to limit that. Like, if I'm, like, you know, having fun or, you know.
- [34:58]
A
Yeah.
- [34:59]
B
Learning something. That's the best. Yes. You know, if you're making cash, that's great. Too.
- [35:03]
A
How much clothing have you destroyed in the process of.
- [35:06]
B
I.
- [35:06]
A
This is the first time I've seen you with no paint. Yeah, the sbs are clean, so I love that.
- [35:11]
B
And thank you for my. It's funny because my. One of my childhood friends that used to work. I used to work at a skate shop together in North Carolina, and now he's managing the Supreme Store, which is two doors down.
- [35:22]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [35:23]
B
So I. Every time I need something not covered in pain, I just run over there and he hooks it up.
- [35:28]
A
I was a big SB kid.
- [35:29]
B
Yeah.
- [35:29]
A
I gotta get back into the.
- [35:31]
B
Dude. These I actually ordered. I. I got these off of ebay. I was just, like, bored the other night, and I was like, I want some old school sbs. We were actually one of the first stores in North America at Vertical Urge in North Carolina to carry sbs.
- [35:45]
A
Where in North Carolina did you grow up? Where was this?
- [35:47]
B
I grew up in Raleigh. Raleigh?
- [35:49]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [35:50]
B
Yeah. But I lived all over. I went to school. I tried to go to school. I dropped out after two weeks at Appalachian State.
- [35:56]
A
Two weeks?
- [35:57]
B
Yeah.
- [35:57]
A
Did you even go? Like. Well, how did that have. Like, what's the.
- [36:00]
B
It's. Oh, man. Yeah, So I. I moved up there. Was it like the summer two or a year or two after. After high school? And then I was supposed to go to. I had, like, a waiting period because I applied late. So I was supposed to go to the community college, do a few classes, and then go. And then start going to the real university the next semester. And then I just. I got an A plus and eating acid and psychedelics.
- [36:29]
A
Wait, so is that. Okay, so back to the. Is this still very much, like, prevalent? Like, how often are you. You know, not too much.
- [36:35]
B
Like, I, Like, I. I feel like I've eaten so much LSD and in the past, you know, it always spins you in a. In a direction. And. Yeah, I'm in a great direction now, so I don't want to get spun or turned around, you know, so, you know, that's. That's limited. You know, every now and then, like, you know, even though, like, I feel. Yeah, it's like, you know, when you're. It's. It's a tool. So, like, if you. You don't need to. You know, if you got a great car, you don't need to spend a lot of time in the garage working on it, you know?
- [37:07]
A
So I'm going through. Not via the psychedelic route, but I've taken on therapy three weeks ago now. I'm on my third week. Yeah, it's it might as well be a drug, dude. I'm, like, I'm hooked. Like, I'm obsessed with the process and, like, obsessed with, like. And now I've just become. I mean, to the extent that, like, on the. On the show or with my family or whoever, like, I'm just like, all right, so then, like, this is what I was thinking. Like, this is actually what's happening, and I'm seeing this pattern here. Like, I went in with one's very specific thing in mind, and it's just, like, become a. Pull the string and just, like, revealed so many more things I need to work on that I've just been ignoring for my whole life. My. Literally, my.
- [37:45]
B
I've never gotten into. I feel like I've. I've. I've always had. I mean, not. Not professional therapy, but what I consider therapy is like, you know, my art and, like, all these. I've had some of the most amazing mentors that have kind of, like, led me in the right direction. But, yeah, that's 1, 1, 1. One road I'm yet to go down is crack open all the. Crack open all the trauma in my life.
- [38:10]
A
I mean, yeah, like, the art. I. I write a lot. I never. I used to draw and paint a bit, but never, like, to the extent that I. I really should just get back and do it, but. But, yeah, I kind of similarly would just get lost in my thoughts just putting it on a paper or, like, putting it in a paper or like, going to the gym or just, like, just putting it outward. Like, any outward physical showing of emotions. I feel like all artists.
- [38:34]
B
Yeah. I mean, if I didn't do it, I would fucking explode. Thank God for paint, because I would probably be in jail or something, you know?
- [38:44]
A
Yeah.
- [38:45]
B
Yeah. I think everybody has to have an outlet to get stuff out, whether it's, you know, doing a. Like, this podcast is an art for you. You know, it's like, no matter what you're doing, as long as you're creating, you know, some people do it in a visual, you know, textural form and painting. Some people do it this.
- [39:04]
A
Yeah, whatever. But even with this, like, I mean, like, everyone's had bad experiences, no matter how great or cool their job is, like, have you had a. A shitty dealing with, like, a client or with an artist, and you're just like, maybe not to the extent of, like, this. I'm done. Like, as. As an artist, I'm shutting it all down. But, like, even when you're younger and you're like, I don't know if this is gonna work, like, what about like, any of like, the doubting phases?
- [39:28]
B
Yeah, I mean, as an artist, I go through that. Like, maybe even not like a daily basis, but there's like a lot of ups and downs, you know, Know, like, there's no consistency. There's, you know, I've been through hell and back a million times, or I'm like, you know, how many times I've been like, fuck this, I'm gonna. I should just get a regular job. And that. That ended a long time ago. There's no turning back now. But when I was younger, it was like, okay, am I really gonna do this? And like, you know, it always. There's never really a question, but it's like something that's always on your mind. Like, is this the right step? Is this. This the right path? Is this gonna.
- [40:04]
A
Yeah.
- [40:04]
B
You know, obviously I've always wanted comfort and stability, but I've always wanted chaos and, you know, chaos and the insanity of living a great life to look back on.
- [40:19]
A
I feel like you operate well within the chaos. I mean, that's also like a great artist. That's the whole beauty of it. It's like no matter what the levels of financial success are, it's like, you still need to operate in some level. Even if I do have degeneracy, I.
- [40:34]
B
Used to be the king of, like. Once I did get to a great, comfortable place and be financially stable, I would self sabotage just to get myself back into the.
- [40:43]
A
Pull the Kanye, throw it all away.
- [40:47]
B
Yeah. I mean, but that's also what like, I. I used to do it and now it. For a while it became kind of a drug. Because once you could throw it all away and come back from it, then you're like, oh, like, I can't.
- [40:59]
A
That's when that invincibility really kicks and you're like, I can say anything. Print a T shirt with a swastika on it. Like, I'm still gonna be fine. Yeah, I listened to Donna too today, by the way.
- [41:10]
B
Oh, yeah, I. I like Donda too. It has a lot of. I think the Bully was my favorite of the last releases.
- [41:19]
A
Really? That first track on Donda 2 is very good. I'm not trying to give Kanye any praise, but. But yeah, one song is good.
- [41:25]
B
Yeah. Was. That's the one. That's the true love Sex.
- [41:28]
A
Yes. That's dead. He's actually saying some stuff on that. And then he. Like the next few records he talked about.
- [41:34]
B
I haven't really had. I haven't had time. I listened to it the other day. I haven't had time to sit with it, but I think I've listened to Bully probably like, like on. On repeat.
- [41:43]
A
I haven't given that one. What is it, what is it with his obsession? I mean, I don't know. Who's this? The bags. He love bag so much. He always talks about the. I got a bag for the good Birkin, Seline, all this. That's all he talks about.
- [41:57]
B
I mean, it's just. I think it's more of just like status symbol. Like, you know, just he's always been like, you know, all about the chains and all that.
- [42:08]
A
Yeah.
- [42:08]
B
You know, which I've, I've never been like a, like a, you know, luxury. But, you know, certain some people are.
- [42:16]
A
You know, what are you in terms of like musicians? Who do you think has like the best taste, art wise or just even fashion wise?
- [42:33]
B
Best taste, like fashion wise? I don't know. I mean, I've got to give it to Lauren and our. In our. Sorry, Ms. Hill. In our stylist team. I always get in trouble for. If you're not calling her Missile. Sorry about that. But yeah, no, I mean, she's got impeccable taste and I've just, I've really learned to appreciate like, you know, her choice of when and where to show up or what time to show up. It's not like, you know, it's very, you know, I always used to be like, I feel like I was too accessible and like out in the world and out at all the clubs and out at every event. And now I'm trying to take a. Take a step back from that and, you know.
- [43:13]
A
Okay, so you're learning from taking a page out of her?
- [43:16]
B
Yeah, I think so. I think just recently, like, I kind of like I stepped into a space where all of a sudden I was just like out all the time. And you know, it wasn't like I wanted to. I want, I want, I want it to be a treat when people see.
- [43:27]
A
Me build that level of mystique. I feel like that's really been robbed in terms of celebrity, artist, culture. Everyone's too over exposed saying this as we're on a camera now, but it's like everyone, there's too much visibility. There's too much like, you know, I can see you on my phone every day if I really want to and what you're doing in that exact moment. Whereas, like, I mean, the golden era of celebrity was just like the, you know, like the early, the pussy posse days. It was in New York with Leo fucking Toby Maguire, David Blaine and E. From Entourage. I never remember his name. What is that guy's name?
- [44:09]
B
Man, that just made me.
- [44:11]
A
My brain go, yeah, I don't know, is it Kevin something? It doesn't matter. But like, those guys were like terrors of New York. Yeah, still are. Yeah. And they still. They move like it's still the 90s. There's no cameras anywhere they go. Yeah, but I missed that. I wish we could experience that.
- [44:28]
B
Yeah. Yeah. I remember like when I first moved up here, going to all the clubs and. And stuff and like with a lot of those guys and there wasn't like, weird just be out of our minds. But there was. No, really not now I feel like everybody's like, knows that there's cameras around. You gotta. Got guarded. You can't really go too crazy.
- [44:47]
A
Yeah, because when did you move to New York? Like, when did you start going out here?
- [44:50]
B
I got moved to New York, so I was, I was moved. I was in the midst of moving to Hawaii and then one of my ex girlfriends from high school, she introduced me to Peter Beard, the photographer, and I came. And I came to New York with her at one point and I met him and a bunch of his friends and we were like, yeah, we should work together sometime. And then at one point I just got a random phone call and they were like, yo, we got a project for you. We want you to bring one of your printer machines to New York. And they gave me a place. They had a. It was kind of a rundown building, but it was on Houston, West Broadway. And I didn't really. And I knew New York, but I didn't really know, like, oh, this is like the spot.
- [45:33]
A
Yeah, you're in a great location.
- [45:34]
B
Set me up there. And then I was only supposed to come for two weeks, and then two weeks turned into I've been here. That was 2007 or 2008, so.
- [45:45]
A
Oh, wow. So you've been. Yeah, yeah.
- [45:48]
B
I always say it's like, oh, I've been in New York for like 10 years. That's like closer. It's been a while.
- [45:55]
A
So when you're not here, where do you usually spend, like, your time?
- [45:59]
B
I. Well, I've got family in North Carolina still. I'm still down there. I did have a house in Montauk for quite a bit and then I got rid of that like before pre pandemic.
- [46:09]
A
Good.
- [46:09]
B
I got. I. I have a long history of like, I've got. I lived in Costa Rica for a long time with a bunch of my friends. And we all have houses down there, some there. And then Brazil has become another place where I'm down a lot too.
- [46:21]
A
So it's a great circuit.
- [46:23]
B
Yeah.
- [46:24]
A
How often you in Costa Rica?
- [46:26]
B
I haven't been going. I used to go like every other couple months, but now I'm there maybe like a few times a year.
- [46:32]
A
How you gonna travel with. With this guy?
- [46:34]
B
I mean, he's got a. I don't.
- [46:36]
A
Know, I feel like he's gonna be a terror on a plane.
- [46:39]
B
Yeah, he's. I don't know. We're gonna figure that out. I keep. I'm like, I'm like, I gotta just make more money so I can fly private.
- [46:47]
A
Yeah, just get him on a plane. Get him on his own plane.
- [46:50]
B
I thinking about, I gotta get like. I just got a studio in South Carolina to make all the paint and stuff. It's like a big massive warehouse, a couple buildings. So I think I'm gonna get a truck again so I can road trip it down there. Yeah, I love driving. It's like I get my best thinking done behind the wheel. So it's like an eight hour trip. But I'm used to. I. When. When I was in high school, I used to drive from North Carolina to New York, like.
- [47:13]
A
Oh, really?
- [47:14]
B
Every weekend? Yeah.
- [47:15]
A
Oh, so you started coming to. It's crazy because I grew up upstate, like right outside of Albany and I. I hardly came to the city ever. My parents, we just didn't. We just didn't do it. And then I lived in Chicago and I knew I had to end up here at some point. I knew it was just gonna happen. But like, I. I wish when I was younger I had like that like experience of New York from, You know, I didn't come.
- [47:37]
B
Like, I mean, I came here quite a bit, you know, when I was. It's funny because even before I moved to New York, I just got in New York. Like when you could pick your cell phone number, I just got a New York number because I was like, yo. Like, I'm gonna. I just had a feeling I would end up here as an artist. It's like, you know, I. I kind of like. I knew I'd get here one day and then one time I just got the. Got the opportunity and I just took it.
- [48:01]
A
Never left 917.
- [48:03]
B
Yeah.
- [48:03]
A
Yeah. I just had to get a new phone and I'm so lame. I made sure I could get. I just wanted to keep my 518. It makes. It's like why I've been here. I'M never. I'm never gonna live upstate again. But like, I just wanted to hold on conduit.
- [48:16]
B
But I tried to get the 2 one too, but now you can buy.
- [48:20]
A
Them for like, really? Oh, yeah, because they. Yeah, they don't. They don't give those out. But you can like. Or.
- [48:25]
B
Yeah, you can't get one from like AT T. But there's like a service where I'm just like it.
- [48:31]
A
I don't know.
- [48:31]
B
I have like three phone numbers at this point now.
- [48:34]
A
Yeah. How big do you have, like your. I know you have artists come in here and work a lot. Do you have like a team or how many people are helping you on projects?
- [48:42]
B
I have like, I have a. I have a really amazing team. Like, I'm painting this building this week and I've got, you know, my buddy Louis that helps like a lot of other big artists fulfill their big projects. It's like he's like the go to guy for like big murals and walls and stuff like that. I don't do a lot of big murals and like our full buildings. This is going to be the biggest thing that I've done.
- [49:07]
A
Is this like a city side, Like a building in the city or.
- [49:10]
B
So I. A friend of mine just put a lease down for a new company. Can't really say what yet, but yeah, he leased this building that's in SoHo. So hopefully this week we get the green light. We're still going through permitting and all that stuff, but I'm just going to be up there for the whole week just throwing paint on. It's like the three sides, like a full, full building.
- [49:33]
A
Oh, wow.
- [49:34]
B
Front, back, inside.
- [49:35]
A
Oh, I will. I want to watch. I want to see some of that process. I always wonder, like, it's going to be fun.
- [49:40]
B
I mean, we got like, you know, the lifts and the whole nine going.
- [49:44]
A
Do you know a lot of the artists that do that stuff around the city? Like, how. What's that? That I'm trying to. That the connectivity amongst the artist community.
- [49:53]
B
I was never really like, big into the art world. Like, I kind of like, you know, I always hung out with like, you know, skateboarders and musicians and stuff, stuff like that. Like, the art world where I was from was kind of more of like, nerdy.
- [50:06]
A
That's fair. It's true.
- [50:08]
B
Academic artists and stuff like that. And I was never a graffiti artist, so a lot of like, you know, the kids that like, I hang out with, a lot of them now that I know them. Yeah, like a lot of the academic artists and Stuff like, nothing against them. I wish. I wish I would have done it because those are the ones that are making more money than anybody. But it was just never my thing to, like, go hang out at galleries and go to art talks and like that, you know?
- [50:31]
A
Yeah. Do you have favorite artists or, like.
- [50:35]
B
Yeah, I've got a. I mean, I. I feel like every artist should. Every artist, they should be their favorite artist more than anybody. Like, if I had to. If I had to have a choice, I would look at my own stuff. Like, that's what I. Yeah, you have to make stuff that you love first. But I have a lot of other artists that I admire, like living and dead, you know?
- [50:56]
A
Who's the ones that are dead? I'm. I probably don't know. A lot of the current. The contemporary artists.
- [51:02]
B
I mean, like, I. You know, who. Like, past. I mean, all the greats. Like. Like, oh, man, I could give you, like, a whole list of people. It's off the top of the head. Like, I've been loving, like, looking at Rauschenberg's, like, he has a big influence with, like, printing and mixed media works. I love Richard Prince right now. Like, I've been looking at a lot of Richard Prince. He's great. I just love his attitude. Like, he's. I like. I like artists that have, like, more of, like, their. I like their. Their Persona more than their work.
- [51:37]
A
Okay. That's. I feel like that's a very. Yeah. Is there. Do you do a lot of gallery showings here in the city or.
- [51:43]
B
Not so much done in a long time. Like, I. I started, like, I always used to do, like, I would spend some time doing, like, you know, my fine art and then commercial art, fine art. And then, like, they would balance each other out. And in the last few years, I've just gone so commercial.
- [51:57]
A
Yeah.
- [51:58]
B
You know, but I consider, like, if I do a stage for a musician or I design a tour, that's my gallery show instead of doing, like, a white wall gallery. And I think it's much more fun for people to come and enjoy the artwork if I have, you know, Ms. Hill performing in front of it and like. Or do a music festival or something.
- [52:17]
A
It's more, you know, what sets are, like, festival shows or things that you've done for her or anybody else that you like.
- [52:24]
B
Well, my favorite thing I've done recently, we did. I did a thing with Angus Cloud right before he passed in Rockstar Energy Drinks, where we took over Lot 11 skate park in Miami during our Basel. And I brought in like half a million dollars worth of lights and LED screens and, like, basically turned the skate park into a music venue. So we had all the best skaters and everybody, like, skating the park while we had DJs and musicians. So it was like combining, you know, all my favorite into one.
- [52:56]
A
Did he skate? Angus.
- [52:58]
B
Angus. He could skate a little bit, I think.
- [53:01]
A
You still skate?
- [53:02]
B
I don't skate at all. I fucking. I tore my ACL like, a couple years ago and I was like, all right, I think I'm done. I'll roll around a little bit. But definitely nothing.
- [53:12]
A
How was he? I feel like he's, I mean, obviously awful. He passed like. I feel like he was one of those that was just about to hit a stride.
- [53:20]
B
Oh, yeah, that was like, definitely, definitely was just. Yeah, that was unexpected because he was on such a great, like, trajectory with everything. Like, he had so much upcoming and then it just out of nowhere, which is really sad. But a lot of those people that are like that, like, I think he. He was so effortless with everything that he did.
- [53:41]
A
He was, yeah, he was just. That was just him. Yeah, yeah.
- [53:44]
B
There was no acting for any of his characters. That's the best thing is, like, he got to play himself in all these roles. I actually just went back and watched Euphoria like, a couple weeks ago, just like out of nowhere. Like, I'd only watched it when it first came out.
- [53:59]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [53:59]
B
And I never, like, done the full whole thing, like all at once. And then I just like, I happened to see it and I pressed Play and I just got stuck on it. Like, that's such a good show.
- [54:08]
A
Yeah. There's two types of, like, actors. The ones that are so authentic and it works. And there's others that are authentic and they become a success. Become. They pop. But then we turn in turn. See that. Oh, they're just a one trick pony and it's not good. Like, I want to basher, but it doesn't matter. What's that? The Twilight chick. Kristen Stewart.
- [54:28]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [54:29]
A
Everyone's like, oh my God, she's so good as Bella. She does this beautiful job in Twilight. Her and Robert Pattinson, they're like the it, you know, acting duo. And then we obviously have seen Pattinson's trajectory. He's a fucking superstar. And then you would just see her act in other things and it's just. Oh, her range is just that. It's just her and it's not a good thing. Meanwhile, Angus, you could put him in anything and he'll be himself, but it's just there's something different where it's just, like, so purely authentic. It's like, you can't teach. Teach that. Yeah, that's just. It is. It purely is like, some dude, like.
- [55:02]
B
You know, most guys that, you know, like, that you're just like, oh, like, I can't even spend, like, hang out with you too long. But there's something about him. It's just like, yeah, he's just, like, so chill and so laid back and just like, those little nuances are just like.
- [55:15]
A
Yeah.
- [55:16]
B
So lovable. He's such, like, a lovable, like, you know, a lovable, unlovable dude.
- [55:21]
A
You know, in those corporate. The, like, opportunities. Who else have you worked with or, like, met with in that capacity?
- [55:32]
B
Like, as far as, like, personalities.
- [55:34]
A
Yeah.
- [55:37]
B
Like, I don't know. So many different people. Like, you know, I've done stuff with, like, a lot of, like. I don't know, more like, as far as, like, art projects. I did a lot of stuff with, like, a lot of, like, different models and stuff. I went through a period weird where I was, like, you know, doing a lot of beautiful women artworks and stuff. And then I got out of that because, like, I realized a lot of collectors have wives, and their wives don't want pieces of artwork of other women on their walls. So I got out of that for a bit. But I'm trying to think of who else. I don't know.
- [56:13]
A
Yeah. Like, how many phases. If you were to line up, if you were to pick a piece from, like, each phase of your career, like, you know what I mean? In terms of, like, Picasso was, you know, this phase, the blue phase, this. Like, do you have. Do you have, like, moments that represent where you were specifically at one point during your career?
- [56:32]
B
I think they all kind of trail into each and, like, they're all. They all build on top of each other. So when I first started using the printing machines, yeah, that was my first thought was, like, okay, like, if I can get beautiful women and work with model agencies and stuff like that, then that'll get the outreach of the artwork out to people. And then from there, I started working with a lot of photographers. And then once I got that style known, then I started getting offers from a lot of other amazing photo collections.
- [57:09]
A
Hmm.
- [57:09]
B
Like the. Something that is just coming back around my. One of my close friends and collectors, he bought all of Astrid Kircher's photographs, and that was George Harris. Like, she used to date Stuart Sue Cliff, who was John Lennon's best friend. They started the Beatles together.
- [57:27]
A
Yeah. So checks out.
- [57:29]
B
Yeah.
- [57:30]
A
How they do. Yeah.
- [57:32]
B
So then. So Stuart was known as, like, when they were 18, and then he was also a painter. And then he. He passed away when they were very young. And then Astrid stuck around, and then she started dating George. And she was known as, like, the first. She was the one that was credited with giving them their, like, their dumb bowl cuts and stuff like that.
- [57:52]
A
She was also their aesthetic.
- [57:54]
B
Yeah, yeah. So she, like, took the first studio shots. She was on tour with them. You know, they would travel together. So over the course of. I can't remember how long, maybe like eight to 10 years, maybe even less than that. I need to do the research. But she took like 3, 000 photographs on film.
- [58:11]
A
Yeah.
- [58:13]
B
So one of my good friends, we started working together and doing some blue chip sales. I would just help him find collectors or, you know, liaison different sales. And then he came to me and he was like, wow, I really like this printing process that you have going. I have this collection of photographs. Could you do something with these?
- [58:30]
A
Never before seen. Right.
- [58:32]
B
Well, a few of them have been published. A few, like, maybe like, you know, 10 to 15 of the photographs have been published, sold through Morrison Hotel Gallery and whatnot. So then we had the idea, like, you're sitting on 3, 000 photographs. And so he had gone to Astrid. Astrid was getting a little bit older, and she started entertaining the idea of, like, selling off her collection.
- [58:54]
A
Yeah.
- [58:54]
B
So she was going to sell one photograph for this much, one photograph for this much. And he went to her and he was like, no, let me buy the entire collection and I'll maintain the collection and maintain the integrity of it and, you know, make sure it just doesn't dissipate into the world of collectors. So we bought the entire lot of photographs, all her negatives, everything, and we did a show together in Bologna, Italy, at Plaza Favas Museum out there. And Astrid is still alive at this point. She'd never let anybody ever touch her photographs. And so she was timid at first to let me do this printing process to them. And then I did a couple samples and she was like, sick. I love them.
- [59:34]
A
Really.
- [59:35]
B
Let's go. Yeah.
- [59:35]
A
So.
- [59:36]
B
So I got her approval. We put this whole museum show together, and it was like the biggest show of the summer in Bologna, Italy.
- [59:43]
A
What was the. Like, what, what. What was done to the photos in that process?
- [59:48]
B
So basically her whole. So the song, the Beatles song Babies in Black is about her. So after Stuart passed, she only wore black. Her whole aesthetic was black and white. Very like, you Know, thought it was.
- [60:01]
A
About babies in blackface.
- [60:05]
B
Maybe. Yeah, that's the newer version. So anyway, so I did very much like black and white only remixes of the photographs, like we call them. I started calling them like the. When I would take old photographs and then do my style to them. I call it remixing the photographs. So I did a whole series of these and then we took. And then we also had the first floor of the museum was all her big blown up photographs, a more classical photo show. And then the whole second floor of the museum was all my remixes of them.
- [60:38]
A
Oh, wow.
- [60:39]
B
And then we had like video content and whatnot. So we did the museum show. And she loved it. It was the only. It was like the last time she ever ventured out from her hometown and went to go visit something. And it was like a huge hit. And then she passed away, I think right before the pandemic or right. Like right at the start of the pandemic. So we still have this whole collection. And then after she passed, we kind of were like, what do we do with this? We kind of sat on it. So that's one of the biggest things that I'm trying to resurrect right now. I mean, it's the most amazing collection of photos. Like behind the scenes shots of John Lennon, like all these guys like that people have never seen. I think Scorsese actually used a couple of them. He licensed a few of them for the last film that he just did. He just did a Beatles doc that came out a couple months ago. But yeah, we're actually trying to resurrect that project and get it out there.
- [61:34]
A
That's awesome. Is that. I mean, would you consider that, like. And it sounds like at this point you have a lot of people bring opportunities to you. This is like a, like, kind of like a side, like a passion project sort of thing, knowing like the historical context of.
- [61:50]
B
Well, I've had so many other amazing likes from that. Once people saw the I. I got the blessing to take to remix photos of the Beatles. Like, that's the. That's one of the last shots of David Bowie right there that before he passed.
- [62:05]
A
Oh, wow.
- [62:06]
B
The photographer that took that, he granted me, you know, the photos to do whatever I want with. I've done stuff with like, you know, Jonathan Manion's one of my good friends. He's like, you know, he shot all the covers of Jay Z's album covers and stuff. We did a show together. A bunch of big photographers have like, come to me with their collections. They're like, yo, do something with these. So it's like it opened up a whole new door of, like, breathing life into photographs, you know?
- [62:33]
A
That's sick. I love that. I love the, the term too. Like, kind of bridging the music world. Like saying just remixing a photo is such like, a familiar term. Yeah, it's like, it's the, the same. This is, the product's the same. It's just a, you know, there's a breath of fresh air put into it.
- [62:50]
B
That's why it's weird because, like, I, I, I told you, like, I think I always wanted to be a musician. I just sucked at playing instruments or never took the time to learn them.
- [62:58]
A
Yeah.
- [62:58]
B
But everything with my visuals, I kind of like, have, like, I equate it to, like, in musical terms. Like, even when I'm layering the different paintings, like, you know, the way that they're structured, it's like the base layer is kind of like, like a drum, drum stem. And then like, the layer on top of that is kind of like a base stem. And then as I'm building layers, it's kind of like building layers in the song. So, like, I can, I think about that, like, oh, like, I should have like, a very heavy, like, bass layer for this. And I'll think about it in terms of like, oh, I'm laying down a drum track.
- [63:32]
A
That's awesome. Is there, speaking of music in the studio, what do you usually create too? Who's usually playing on the.
- [63:39]
B
Yeah, so I, I, I thrive on just hitting shuffle and letting it go, go most of the time. And I've been recently. I mean, if you look at my, my catalog, it's everything from soundtracks to classical music to hip hop to rock to heavy metal to crazy, weird, experimental. And I think that I love just like, the randomness of, like, pressing shuffle and just letting it take me wherever it wants to go. And then a lot of the times I'll, I'll. If I choose something, it just kind of like, I'll, I have to choose a vibe and like, it's either jazz or, like, heavy metal.
- [64:21]
A
Yeah. We walked in today, we're playing some, like, jazz. I was like, this is like kind of what I would play at home too.
- [64:26]
B
I've been listening to Coltrane's A Love supreme, like, religiously, like, before I go to sleep and when I wake up.
- [64:34]
A
It'S a great, I mean, it's like.
- [64:35]
B
One of my favorite albums. And I, like, I've, I, I listened to it so many times in the past and Then recently, I. It's just I. I like, kind of like delved into the whole story about how he produced it and how he made it when he was like in a very like, dark place and he just locked himself away and out came this God sent gift. And that's kind of like, you know, with a lot of my artwork, like, I don't have intention of what I want to make. I just kind of like open myself up to, you know.
- [65:03]
A
Do you believe in that, that. That like, old artist idiom? Like, out of the darkest times comes the brightest light. You need to feel like you need to go through some to put out your best piece of. Yeah, anything.
- [65:13]
B
It's like, that's why I used to like, be like a very, like have like a bad case of self sabotage.
- [65:19]
A
That's exactly where I was going.
- [65:21]
B
I used to do that all the time. So I feel like I could make my best work. I really. I think the ultimate goal is to get into a place where you can be good and make great happy. Yeah. Be happy, make great work and be consistent. But yeah, even, like, you know, recently, like, I've just gone through like a lot of dark periods and, you know, out of that, like, like what? You never know how high you can go until you hit the bottom kind of type.
- [65:47]
A
Yeah.
- [65:48]
B
You know, sometimes a dog just shows.
- [65:51]
A
Up and gosh, go. I wish Ghost was more active on this. He's been.
- [65:56]
B
He was hyped earlier.
- [65:57]
A
He was hyped before we hit record.
- [65:59]
B
Now he's just sleeping. It's like, shut up.
- [66:02]
A
Yeah. He's like, whatever, dude. Man, I want to take too much time. This is awesome, bro. Like, I love this. This is sick. And I'm super excited to, like, see first of all, the building that you're working on.
- [66:12]
B
Oh, yeah, that's gonna be good. We should get some. Get some footage of that film that. Yeah, I've got a lot of cool coming up this summer. Like, I'm doing the building, then the Montauk stuff. Stuff also, which is going to be like programming all summer. So we're gonna do. We might. I'm trying to fast track stuff so we can get the sculpture done by Memorial Day.
- [66:32]
A
Yeah.
- [66:32]
B
And then I'm doing something with a motorcycle company and a surfboard company and we're gonna have like, different rollouts and then, you know, all kinds of other fun.
- [66:43]
A
How many projects is too many projects at once or like, you know, when does it become too much?
- [66:48]
B
I feel like I'm. I try to. I always try to take on too much. Like, if I just had one project that gave me enough money, I'd be happy, you know, if I could just sit back and just splatter, paint and just be, you know, content. I don't know. I'll never be content.
- [67:06]
A
But you should. That's the artist. That's it. That's the whole thing.
- [67:09]
B
I always want more. No matter how much I get, I want more.
- [67:12]
A
You always want more. I want more, too. Yeah, man. Well, bro, this is awesome. I'm so glad. This is a very New York situation. Just a mutual friend and brought us together, and now we're fucking Shout out doing this. Shout Out. Kiki. It's the homegirl. French Kiki, bro. Appreciate you, man.
- [67:30]
B
For sure.
- [67:30]
A
Thank you. All right, sir. Some wrong with the podcast. Episode 16, I think. No voicemails in this one. Ghost, come on, get in the shot. We've got Ghost here. Show us your face. All right, guys, peace.