Podcast Summary: "What Nature Reveals About Living Longer & Why Smart People Believe Irrational Things"

Podcast: Something You Should Know
Host: Mike Carruthers
Guests:

• Dr. Steven Austad, Professor of Biology, University of Alabama at Birmingham
• Dr. Dan Ariely, Professor of Psychology and Behavioral Economics, Duke University
  Air Date: October 4, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of Something You Should Know explores two riveting topics:

1. What animal longevity can teach us about living longer and healthier lives as humans, featuring Dr. Steven Austad, whose latest book, Methuselah: What Nature Can Teach Us about Living Longer, Healthier Lives delves into how long-lived species may hold secrets for human aging.
2. The psychological phenomenon of misbelief—why smart people believe irrational things, with insights from Dr. Dan Ariely based on his new book, What Makes Rational People Believe Irrational Things.

The episode offers a mix of captivating science, real-world anecdotes, and practical advice on both longevity and belief systems.

Segment 1: Lessons from Nature—How Animals Unlock the Secrets of Longevity

Guest: Dr. Steven Austad
Timestamps: 05:51–30:13

Key Discussion Points & Insights

• Humans and Longevity

  • Humans are the longest-lived terrestrial mammals, but some animal species massively outpace us in longevity.
  • "Some animals are very good at resisting the damage of aging, and some are not so good. Humans happen to be quite good, but there are animals that combat the destructive processes of aging even better." (Dr. Austad, 06:07)

• Turtles and the Value of Slowness

  • Giant tortoises can live 150–200 years.
  • Their extreme longevity is partially attributed to slow heart rates and a slow metabolism.
  • "A turtle that's going top speed can cover about four miles in a 24-hour period…this link between metabolism and longevity is so strong." (Dr. Austad, 08:32)
  • Notable quote: "One of the early aging researchers even wrote an article called 'Why Lazy People Live the Longest'…He died at 62 of a massive heart attack." (Dr. Austad, 08:55)

• Clams: The Champions of Longevity

  • The ocean quahog clam can live at least 507 years; one individual ("Ming the Mollusk") was documented as such.
  • The clam's heart beats as slow as a tortoise's, and its low metabolic rate is key to its longevity.
  • "There is somewhere out there, hearts that have been beating for over 500 years, which I find pretty remarkable." (Dr. Austad, 12:03)

• Birds: Healthy Until the End

  • Some parrots and albatrosses are known to live well into their 70s and 80s.
  • Birds maintain physical fitness and health right until the end, in contrast to humans who often experience long declines.
  • "Veterinarians say about pet birds: 'They're fine, they're fine, they're dead.' Which is kind of like what we'd like the humans to do…if we could stay healthy right up until the end of our lives." (Dr. Austad, 13:39)

• Breakthroughs in Genetics

  • Scientists transferred a gene from the naked mole rat (can live 40 years vs. 2–3 years for mice) to mice. The mice stayed healthier and lived longer.
  • This raises the possibility of gene therapies to reduce age-related diseases in humans.
  • "We're not going to take the genes from long-lived animals and put them in people...but we might inject it into some parts of people." (Dr. Austad, 18:46)

• Preventing Alzheimer’s: The Protein Connection

  • Long-lived clams have anti-clumping proteins that may hinder degenerative brain diseases.
  • "If we can figure out what that is, that’s a good example of how we might use knowledge from long-lived animals to keep people healthy longer." (Dr. Austad, 19:44)

• Ailments in Old Animals

  • Wild animals do get arthritis, cataracts, etc., but don't linger long once afflicted, due to natural dangers.
  • "They don’t live very long once they get those maladies, because if your vision is compromised...something bad is going to happen to you quickly." (Dr. Austad, 20:26)

• Bats and Extreme Memory

  • Some bats, despite their tiny size, can live up to 40 years and maintain health, memory, spatial awareness, and muscle function even after months of hibernation.
  • "If we could transfer any of these capabilities to humans, it would be quite remarkable." (Dr. Austad, 24:48)

• Whales and Cancer Resistance

  • Bowhead whales live over 200 years, facing high metabolic demands but with surprising cancer resistance.
  • Elephants and whales, with huge numbers of cells, rarely contract cancer—an insight with "massive implications" for human health.
  • "Animals like elephants and whales can survive for decades or centuries without getting cancer…that’s something we’d like very much to understand." (Dr. Austad, 29:09)

Notable Quotes & Moments

• Counting Growth Rings in a Clam Shell
  Mike Carruthers: "How could you possibly know that a clam was born in 1499?"
  Dr. Austad: "They have growth rings in their shells that...you can count." (11:32)

• Vampire Bats and the Social Sharing of Blood

  • Bats avoid starvation by sharing blood with each other.
  • "If one individual has not been successful at finding anything to bite...they'll actually share blood. The ones that are successful will share with the unsuccessful." (21:21)

Segment 2: Misbelief—Why Smart People Believe Irrational Things

Guest: Dr. Dan Ariely
Timestamps: 32:52–52:30

Key Discussion Points & Insights

• What is 'Misbelief'?

  • Misbelief is not just being wrong but clinging to ideas proven false, even in the face of evidence.
  • "If we have the consensus scientific notion pointing to one direction...and a few people holding out, that's misbelief." (Dr. Ariely, 34:31)

• When Misbeliefs Become Dangerous

  • Misbeliefs can have trivial or severe consequences, particularly when involving health, medicine, or public policy.
  • "People have all kinds of beliefs about cancer treatment...and many of those are wrong." (Dr. Ariely, 33:30)
  • Example: Eschewing conventional medicine in favor of unproven alternatives can lead to wasted money, lost hope, and public health costs.

• Role in Scientific Progress

  • Open-minded skepticism, or "intellectual humility," is crucial for progress, not rigid misbelief.
  • "One of the nice things about science is that people are able to hold multiple hypotheses at the same time." (Dr. Ariely, 36:23)

• How Misbeliefs Form

  • Often spring from personal stress, adversity, or confusion about one’s circumstances.
  • People seek meaning, a villain to blame, and a narrative that restores control and self-worth.
  • "People start with a stressful situation...and now I have a need for an explanation. And that need...is a need to fulfill something." (Dr. Ariely, 41:30)

• Social Dynamics of Conspiracy Thinking

  • Conspiracies often grow within groups that offer mutual support and validation, especially as individuals become ostracized from mainstream society.
  • "They found a great group of people who supported each other and helped each other, and that was incredibly important, some at my expense." (Dr. Ariely, 48:08)

• Dan Ariely’s Personal Story

  • During the pandemic, Dr. Ariely was targeted by conspiracy theorists—accused of collaborating with Bill Gates and the Illuminati to "kill as many healthy people as possible." (43:33)
  • "I got lots of death threats in the first few years of COVID...People were very much convinced that I conspired to bring about COVID." (Dr. Ariely, 44:24; 44:38)
  • Attempts to engage and reason with his detractors were fruitless; their beliefs were fully entrenched.
  • "They were not there to find out the truth. They've decided what the truth was and nothing changed." (Dr. Ariely, 48:47)

• The Emotional Impact of Being a 'Villain'

  • Dr. Ariely describes the emotional toll of being the focal point of intense, irrational hatred, having nightmares, and a sense of helplessness.
  • "It's terrible to feel so hated." (Dr. Ariely, 49:51)
  • He even met with one of his detractors, sharing a candid moment of vulnerability that temporarily touched her perspective, though social stigma remained.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On the Need for a Villain

  • "What do I want? I want to find a villain that would, I could blame them, it would not be my fault...and the story has to give the person...that they are actually knowledgeable and smart." (Dr. Ariely, 42:33)

• Attempts to Reason with Conspiracy Theorists

  • "I thought I could just explain to them that they were wrong. I thought, okay, this must be a matter of misunderstanding. Let me just fix it. I called some of them. I joined some online discussion groups…I only did myself damage." (Dr. Ariely, 48:47)

• Personal Context: Dan Ariely’s Life-Altering Injury

  • At age 18, Ariely suffered burns on 70% of his body in a military accident, spending years in the hospital—a formative experience that changed his outlook.
  • "Life in hospital is very tough, and life with burns after it is very complex…gives me perspective on everything else and lots of lessons, but very, very tough." (Dr. Ariely, 51:14)

Segment 3: Quick Life Tips

Timestamps: 52:34–53:52

Key Discussion Point

• Why You Shouldn’t Toss Prescription Bottles in the Trash
  • Labels contain sensitive information that could be used to fraudulently obtain medication.
  • "Your name, prescription number, pharmacy and doctor are all usually listed. That could give some unauthorized access..." (Host, 52:34)

Notable Quotes—At-a-Glance

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|-----------------|-------| | 06:07 | Dr. Austad | "Our fundamental biology is very similar between animals and humans...life itself is a damaging process, and gradually it kills organisms. But some animals are very good at resisting that damage." | | 08:55 | Dr. Austad | "One of the early aging researchers even wrote an article called 'Why Lazy People Live the Longest'...He died at 62 of a massive heart attack." | | 13:39 | Dr. Austad | "Veterinarians say about pet birds: 'They're fine, they're fine, they're dead.' Which is kind of what we'd like the humans to do." | | 19:44 | Dr. Austad | "One thing we discovered about really long-lived clams is they seem to have something in their bodies that keeps proteins from clumping together." | | 34:31 | Dr. Ariely | "If we have the consensus scientific notion pointing to one direction and then we have a few people who are holding out...that in the current context is defined...as a misbelief." | | 41:30 | Dr. Ariely | "People start with a stressful situation...a need for an explanation...I want a villain...an explanation that would make me feel in control." | | 44:24 | Dr. Ariely | "I got lots of death threats in the first few years of COVID..." | | 49:51 | Dr. Ariely | "It's terrible to feel so hated." |

Memorable Moments

• Dr. Austad’s story of the 507-year-old clam that was killed by accident—emphasizing the unexpected longevity in the animal kingdom and the sometimes-unlikely nature of scientific discoveries. (10:08–12:03)
• Dr. Ariely emotionally describing the pain of being a public villain and trying to reason with his accusers, only to find they were uninterested in evidence or dialogue. (48:47)

Episode Takeaways

• We can potentially learn much from long-lived animals, both in terms of extending healthy human lifespans and developing approaches to prevent degenerative illnesses.
• Misbeliefs are not simple ignorance, but complex psychological responses that can have far-reaching consequences, particularly under stress and in times of crisis.
• Engaging with those who hold deeply irrational beliefs is rarely effective—what’s needed is understanding the psychology driving such beliefs in order to address them.

Additional Resources

• Methuselah: What Nature Can Teach Us about Living Longer, Healthier Lives by Dr. Steven Austad
• What Makes Rational People Believe Irrational Things by Dr. Dan Ariely