Podcast Summary

Podcast: Something You Should Know
Host: Mike Carruthers | OmniCast Media
Episode: Why You Are Predisposed to Worry & How Fonts Influence Our Feelings - SYSK Choice
Date: August 16, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of Something You Should Know features two insightful interviews:

• First, Dr. David Carbonell, clinical psychologist and author of "The Worry: How Your Brain Tricks You into Expecting the Worst," explains why humans are predisposed to worry, how it becomes problematic, and strategies for coping with chronic worry and anxiety.
• Second, Sarah Hindman, graphic designer and author of "Why Fonts Matter," unpacks the surprising psychological effects of fonts, how typefaces shape perception and communication, and practical tips for using fonts more effectively in daily life.

In addition, Mike Carruthers sprinkles in quick, research-based life-improving facts about exercise and music's addictive qualities, all delivered in his signature approachable style.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Segment 1: Why Do We Worry So Much? (w/ Dr. David Carbonell)

[07:08-27:54]

Defining Worry and Anxiety

• Worry is the cognitive, "thinking" part of anxiety, consisting of repetitive intrusive "what if" thoughts.
  • "Worry is basically the cognitive part, the thinking part of anxiety... typically intrusive 'what if' thoughts."—Dr. David Carbonell (07:19)
• Anxiety also includes physical symptoms (e.g., racing heart, sweating), unpleasant emotions (apprehension), and anxious behaviors (avoidance, nail-biting).

When Worry Crosses the Line (08:28–09:49)

• Worry is helpful if it prompts us to take action (e.g., prepare for a meeting).
• Problematic worry persists even after the problem is solved or when there’s nothing actionable to do.
  • "All too often... the worry persists and it functions like an annoying neighbor who keeps coming around tapping me on the shoulder."—David Carbonell (08:37)

Predispositions: Nature, Nurture, & Family Patterns (10:03–11:25)

• Genetics play a significant role; anxiety runs strongly in families.
  • "Anxiety disorders tend to run strongly in families... odds of finding others [in the family] are something like three to four times as high."—David Carbonell (10:29)
• Early experiences and responses to first episodes of anxiety can set lifelong patterns.

Children & Worry: Will They Outgrow It? (11:25–12:45)

• Ordinary childhood phobias are normal and often outgrown.
• Chronic worrying in children, especially those who are hyper-aware of health and safety messages, usually requires intervention.

How Some People Handle Uncertainty Better (12:45–14:10)

• Chronic worriers treat doubt like danger, feeling compelled to resolve all uncertainty.
  • "People who have this tendency towards anxiety... are much more susceptible to doubt than the average person... they treat it like danger."—David Carbonell (13:15)

The Inability to Learn from Past Non-events (14:10–15:55)

• Even repeated evidence that worries are unfounded rarely soothes chronic worriers, partly due to the use of "safety behaviors" (e.g., compulsive checking).

The Illusion of “Productive Worry” (15:55–16:46)

• Many feel if they stop worrying, they’re not taking life seriously.
  • "If I'm not worrying, then I'm treating life too casually."—David Carbonell (16:03)

Why Worrying is Hard to Give Up (16:46–17:16)

• Chronic worriers wish they could worry less but find attempts to suppress or fight worry backfire.
  • "People do not enjoy their worry. They wish they had less of it. Unfortunately, that leads them to oppose and resist their worry in ways that are counterproductive."—David Carbonell (16:55)

How to Manage and Reduce Worry

• Don't struggle to suppress worry; accept and "play" with anxious thoughts.
  • For example: Making a joke of a recurring worry or switching to a less familiar language to alter the internal narrative.
    • "That's a way of taking the thought and joking with it, playing with it and then moving on to the next thing rather than arguing or struggling with it."—David Carbonell (21:07)
• Postponement as a coping strategy: Reschedule worry for a later time, often relieving the urge to ruminate.
  • "How about I come back to this in half an hour?... Postponing is a powerful way that people can influence this."—David Carbonell (25:04)
• Recovery, not cure: Worry is a habit to be managed, not a disease to be “cured.”
  • "I always like to talk about a recovery rather than a cure, that this is a habit you learn to inhibit rather than a disease that you overcome and leave behind."—David Carbonell (24:08)

The False Reward of Worry (26:11–27:13)

• Some feel relief when what they feared doesn't happen, and may (falsely) believe their worry contributed to the positive outcome.

Segment 2: Fonts & Feelings – How Typography Shapes Us (w/ Sarah Hindman)

[29:50-49:43]

The Science of Readability and Typeface Selection (31:12–32:45)

• Huge body of research using tools like eye-tracking and neuroimaging shows that font size, spacing, and style all affect readability and comfort.
• No one-size-fits-all font; audience and context dictate the best choice.
  • "Some typefaces are much more readable than others, but a lot of the time it depends on who the audience is."—Sarah Hindman (31:35)

Most Readable Fonts for Everyday Use (32:54–33:45)

• For emails, Verdana (in a decent size) is considered the most universally readable.
• Georgia is perceived as more intellectual due to its serifs.
  • "If you use Verdana and you make it a decent size, then that's probably about the most readable choice that you can make."—Sarah Hindman (32:54)

Emotional Impact of Fonts and Cultural Associations (33:45–34:09)

• Fonts evoke emotions and expectations, interpreted by the reader.
  • "It's going to be interpreted by the mind of the reader. So both of you have an idea, but it's like the clothes that you decide to wear."—Sarah Hindman (33:51)

Font Trends and Why They Exist (35:01–37:44)

• Times New Roman and Arial are so popular mainly because they are modern defaults, not for readability reasons.
• History: Fonts began as an attempt to replicate handwriting; style has shifted with fashion and technology over the centuries.

Serifs vs Sans Serif: Influence on Perception (37:44–39:06)

• Serifs (the 'feet' on letters) make text seem more academic and credible.
• Experiments show serif fonts influence readers’ perceptions of text’s character, e.g. more satirical, more authoritative.

Type Size, Spacing, and Digital Contexts (39:06–40:19)

• Tiny fonts alienate older readers; oversized fonts can seem like “shouting.”
• Designers seek a “sweet spot,” but optimal size varies by device and environment.

Practical Defaults and Common Mistakes (40:19–42:08)

• Avoid using rarely-seen or decorative fonts not installed on the reader's device; default fonts ensure consistency.
• Avoid using all caps—it’s interpreted as shouting.

Cluttered Documents and Cognitive Overload (42:12–43:44)

• Too many fonts, styles, and conflicting alignments create stress (“frowning”) for readers and reduce communication effectiveness.
  • "It's like being in a really noisy nightclub. Everybody's clamoring for your attention."—Sarah Hindman (43:11)

The Business of Fonts (43:44–45:05)

• Font designers typically aren’t paid royalties for inclusion in word processors but may receive payment from large font foundries.

Fonts Influence Perception, Even Taste! (45:26–49:13)

• The style of a font can influence perception in surprising ways, such as perceived product quality and even taste.
  • "A font can nudge your perception a little bit... but it can never convince you that something is what it's not."—Sarah Hindman (49:05)
• Examples: Movie posters, soda can branding, and even taste-test experiments with chocolate and jelly beans.

Brief Bonus: Music as an Addictive Experience

[49:48–50:57]

• Listening to favorite songs triggers real dopamine highs in the brain, giving music its “addictive” qualities.
  • "Music is in essence, addictive because listening to our favorite tunes or catchy new songs triggers the brain to release dopamine."—Mike Carruthers (49:49)
• Brain imaging can even predict hit songs by observing pleasure centers’ responses in listeners.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the futility of chronic worry:
  "The repeated experience of discovering the thing I worried about didn't happen will not really do anything to soothe the chronic worrier."—David Carbonell (14:36)
• On productive worrying:
  "One of the phrases I hear so often from my clients: it helps if I expect the worst. Well, actually, it probably doesn't."—David Carbonell (16:03)
• On typographic “shouting”:
  "Uppercase letters, all caps. It just shouts... if you want somebody to read your email, maybe you don’t really shout it."—Sarah Hindman (41:06)
• On style and meaning:
  "The letters actually tell you what it's going to be... we don't think about that because when we read... the meaning gets beamed straight into your head."—Sarah Hindman (46:24)

Timestamps of Key Segments

| Timestamp | Topic/Quote | |------------|---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:35 | What exercise does for your health (facts & figures) | | 07:08–27:54| Dr. David Carbonell on worry: origins, why it persists, how to manage it | | 16:03 | "It helps if I expect the worst. Well, actually, it probably doesn't..."—Carbonell | | 21:07 | Playful responses to worry; using humor or another language to shift mental patterns | | 25:04 | The power of postponement as a tactic for worry | | 29:50–49:43| Sarah Hindman on font psychology: readability, emotional effect, practical tips | | 32:54 | Verdana = most readable email font; Georgia = intellectual serif (Hindman) | | 37:44 | How font trends follow cultural and technological shifts | | 43:11 | "It's like being in a really noisy nightclub..."—Hindman on cluttered documents | | 49:48 | Music “addiction”—the dopamine effect and brain imaging |

Summary / Takeaways

• Worry is wired into us, but managing it is possible—not by fighting thoughts, but by accepting and redirecting them, or even playing with them.
• Fonts do more than convey information: they signal emotion, credibility, intention, and can influence our responses unconsciously. Use defaults wisely, prioritize readability, and avoid over-styling.
• Everyday design choices matter: Both in how we communicate our thoughts (by managing worry) and in the fonts we choose, small changes can have outsized impacts on clarity, mood, and perception.

Recommended Action:

• Try scheduling worry time instead of struggling to stop worrying; experiment with more readable, thoughtful font choices in emails and documents.