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- [00:00]
Amanda Montel
The views expressed on this episode, as with all episodes of Sounds Like a Cult, are solely host opinions and quoted allegations. The content here should not be taken as indisputable fact. This podcast is for entertainment purposes only.
- [00:13]
Chelsea Charles
Did you know, Tyler, that Jeep owners have a secret wave called the Jeep Wave solidifying their membership in Jeep hood?
- [00:22]
Tyler Yasmin
I am a big fan of the Jeep wave and there's some unwritten rules as well. The newer Jeep waves first out of respect for the older Jeep. There's also another layer past that and it's how modded and dirty your Jeep is. Say there was someone driving the same Jeep as me, I would then go is their Jeep bigger than mine? Is it dirtier that they've taken it off roading? And if so, then I need to wave first out of respect that they're using their Jeep for what it's intended.
- [00:46]
Amanda Montel
For Cult hierarchy is alive and well in Jeep Culture. This is Sounds Like a Cult, a show about the modern day cults we all follow. I'm Amanda Montel, author of the books Cultish and the Age of Magical Overthinking.
- [01:01]
Chelsea Charles
And I'm Chelsea Charles, an unscripted TV producer.
- [01:05]
Amanda Montel
Every week on this show we discuss a different group or guru that puts the cult in culture, from chiropractors to K Pop to try and answer the.
- [01:13]
Chelsea Charles
Big question, this group sounds like a cult. But is it really?
- [01:23]
Amanda Montel
And if so, which of our three cult categories does it fall into? A live your life, a watch your back, or a get the fuck out? After all, not every cult y seeming group these days is equally nefarious. On this show, we scrutinize and poke a little bit of fun at the contemporary cultish spectrum. How, in an age when affiliation with traditional religion is declining, people are directing their worship toward all kinds of other stuff up for better and for worse, like cult followed celebrities or wellness brands like Goop and Lululemon, or niche Internet cults like family vloggers or culty rubber.
- [02:01]
Chelsea Charles
Duckies and car clubs?
- [02:05]
Amanda Montel
If the words Jeep wave, ducky and winching mean nothing to you, they're about to this cult goes deep. It is. It is rich. It is a bastion of rituals. Jack Daniels is proudly served in fine.
- [02:17]
Tyler Yasmin
Establishments, questionable joints, and everywh in between.
- [02:22]
Chelsea Charles
So no matter where you go in.
- [02:24]
Tyler Yasmin
Every bar, you'll always know someone by name.
- [02:28]
Amanda Montel
Jack Jack and Coke Shot of Jack Jack Daniels please.
- [02:32]
Tyler Yasmin
Right away.
- [02:32]
Amanda Montel
That's what makes Jack Jack please drink responsibly.
- [02:36]
Tyler Yasmin
Responsibility.org Jack Daniels and old number seven are registered trademarks copyright 2025 Jack Daniels Tennessee whiskey. 40 alcohol by volume, 80 proof.
- [02:44]
Amanda Montel
With the Venmo debit card, you can Venmo everything. Your favorite band's merch. You can Venmo this or their next show.
- [02:49]
Chelsea Charles
You can Venmo that.
- [02:50]
Amanda Montel
Visit Venmo Me debit to learn more. The Venmo MasterCard is issued by the Bancorp bank and a pursuant to license by Mastercard International Incorporated, the card may be used everywhere MasterCard is accepted. Venmo purchase restrictions apply. Let's get into it.
- [03:00]
Chelsea Charles
Yes, today we're talking about the cult of Jeeps. Jeeps aren't just any vehicles. They're a lifestyle, a mindset, and dare we say it, a religion. Jeep owners belong to an exclusive club and listeners have been requesting us to cover it forever.
- [03:19]
Amanda Montel
You're finally getting your due, Jeep owners. I love how the culties just want to be roasted. It's very bdsm.
- [03:26]
Chelsea Charles
And then they get mad.
- [03:28]
Amanda Montel
It's a complicated show.
- [03:30]
Chelsea Charles
Yeah, it's very complicated. I love it. From their rugged design to their off road adventures, Jeeps have become symbols of freedom and rebellion.
- [03:39]
Amanda Montel
They are. They're a symbol. And you're about to learn so much more about what that means because today is an interview, a listener formatted episode. We did a couple of these last year. We did one for the cult of cruise ships. We did them for the cult of teachers. It's so fun interviewing culties.
- [03:56]
Chelsea Charles
Ye. But also, this is honestly, I'm not gonna lie, my favorite style because I just love having that outside perspective. Outside, but inside.
- [04:06]
Amanda Montel
Inside, Inside. Inside perspective. No. There are so many different potential kinds of guests on the show. Sometimes we have on other podcasters and that's great because they're used to being on a microphone and they kind of have a bit that they do and it's easy to edit and then sometimes we have a journalist. And the tone of those episodes is a little more educational. But I'm with. I love it when we interview someone who's like actually in it. Because it's juicy.
- [04:32]
Chelsea Charles
Yeah. And you know, I live for the actual tea. I want a man on the inside to give me all the good goods of what's really going on in jeep culture.
- [04:43]
Amanda Montel
Not someone who's like media trained. Someone who's here with the unfiltered 41 1.
- [04:48]
Chelsea Charles
I am an unscripted person.
- [04:50]
Amanda Montel
Oh, very. That's what it is. That's it. That is it.
- [04:53]
Chelsea Charles
So in order for us to talk about the history of Jeeps, we've got to go way back. And I'm talking Way, way back, back to World War II. In 1940, the US army needed a light recountenance vehicle. So the US government sent specs over to 135 companies, but ultimately only three responded. Bantam, Willys Overland and Ford. Not long after, Willys Overland eventually won the bid. That's the company that ended up producing Jeeps for both soldiers and civilians. And this military origin story really set the tone for Jeep culture and lore for decades to come. However, in the post war years, Willys struggled financially and was acquired by kaiser Motors in 1953, leading to the brand being renamed Willys Motors Incorporated. By 1963, the Willys name was dropped entirely and the company became Kaiser Jeep Corporation. In 1970, Kaiser Jeep was acquired by American Motor Corporation, which expanded Jeep civilian lineup and solidified its rugged off road identity. The Jeep brand continued to evolve through further acquisitions with Chrysler purchasing AMC in 1987, ensuring Jeep's legacy and continued under a major automotive powerhouse. The origin of the name G is still up for debate.
- [06:19]
Amanda Montel
Okay, etymology. Let's go.
- [06:21]
Chelsea Charles
Go ahead. Etymology. Some believe the name comes from soldiers mispronouncing gp. General purpose vehicle.
- [06:29]
Amanda Montel
That's how the name of Goop came to be, because it was a play on Gwyneth Paltrow's initials gp.
- [06:35]
Chelsea Charles
Oh, I didn't know that.
- [06:36]
Amanda Montel
Goop and Jeep. Oh, there's gotta be, there's gotta be.
- [06:40]
Chelsea Charles
There'S a connection, gotta be. And others claim it was inspired by a character from Popeye, the sailor named Eugene. The Jeep.
- [06:49]
Amanda Montel
Let's see. Sweet.
- [06:49]
Chelsea Charles
Over 640,000 Jeeps were produced during World War II. They became legendary for their ability to handle any terrain, earning nicknames like the soldier's best friend. Whoa. Jeeps were so reliable that soldiers joked that they were the only thing that could survive the war without a scratch.
- [07:10]
Amanda Montel
Oh, that's a big promise.
- [07:11]
Chelsea Charles
That's a huge promise in my mind.
- [07:14]
Amanda Montel
I guess it's because we live in Southern California and forgive me, I'm not in the cult of jeeps. So I'm learning, I'm growing and I'm sure this is going to sound silly, but I think of Jeeps as like the Malibu Barbie vehicle of choice. But they are. They're like a utility military vehicle.
- [07:33]
Chelsea Charles
You can do anything with a Jeep. In 1945, the first civilian Jeep was born. Named the CJ2A. What a wonderful name.
- [07:43]
Amanda Montel
Equipped, rolls off the tongue.
- [07:46]
Chelsea Charles
Equipped with tailgates and side mounted spare tires. It was marketed to formers and outdoorsy types with ads showing Jeeps crossing streams, climbing Mountains and even plowing fields.
- [08:00]
Amanda Montel
Rugged.
- [08:01]
Chelsea Charles
Exactly. By the 1950s, the Jeep had made its way to Hollywood through TV shows and movies. They were famously often featured in the TV show mash, a sitcom set in an army hospital during the the Korean war. Finally, in 1986, the beloved Jeep Wrangler was released.
- [08:21]
Amanda Montel
Yeah.
- [08:22]
Chelsea Charles
The one we all know.
- [08:23]
Amanda Montel
The Chariot.
- [08:24]
Chelsea Charles
Yeah. Yeah.
- [08:25]
Amanda Montel
Now, Chelsea and I can look up all the info that we want about Jeeps, their origin story, the lore. But in order to truly understand this cult, we knew we really needed to interview someone in it. Enter the listener that we hinted about earlier. Tyler Yasmin. We put out a call on our Instagram for listeners who are in the cult of Jeeps to email us, submit why they wanted to be on the episode. Thank you to everybody who emailed us. We love you, we perceive you, we respect you. But we hope that you enjoy this interview with Tyler, who is here to spill that unfiltered, real authentic tea about the cult of James. Here we go. Today, joining us on our exploration of the cult of Jeeps is a listener and a follower of the Sounds like a cult cult, Tyler. Hello, Tyler, and welcome. Thank you for joining us.
- [09:22]
Tyler Yasmin
Hey, guys. Thanks for having me.
- [09:23]
Chelsea Charles
Tyler, do you want to tell us about your personal relationship with the alleged cult of Jeeps?
- [09:30]
Tyler Yasmin
Yes. I guess a really important story of my Jeep history is I grew up in Metro Detroit, which is the office automotive capital of the US So in Detroit, everybody has a brand. Generally, people are working for those brands, but it's one of the big three, so it's Chrysler. Which Jeep falls under, Ford or gm? My family was very loyal to the Chrysler brand, and so I grew up all around Jeeps. My dad, he works as a pilot, which he has a really weird schedule. He flies a week and he's home a week. So growing up, he would actually restore Jeeps. So as a kid, I would help him work on Jeeps. I would do inventory out of our basement selling old Jeep parts. When I was 14, we picked up a Jeep from the junkyard and restored it for my first vehicle. Ever since then, I'm now 26. I just sold my Jeep, so it's the first time in my adult life that I haven't had a Jeep.
- [10:18]
Amanda Montel
How does that feel?
- [10:20]
Tyler Yasmin
It's a weird feeling. It was tough to do, like, take that step, but I'm glad I did it. It made sense. But, yeah, I've been around Jeeps for most of my life, working on them, driving them, off, roading them, et cetera.
- [10:30]
Amanda Montel
Got it. Okay. So for your family, it was very much like, this family grew up Episcopalian, this family grew up Methodist. Like, we grew up crisis.
- [10:40]
Tyler Yasmin
I mean, that's kind of how it is around Detroit. It's like, oh, you're a Ford family. Oh, you're a GMC family. And I mean, you could tell because, you know, everyone's house, they have more or less the same brand. It's less like that now. I feel like brand loyalty was more of a thing in the early 2000s, late 90s.
- [10:56]
Amanda Montel
That's very true. It's interesting though, that, like, so many life milestones can be marked with a certain car brand's culture. Like, getting and restoring your first Jeep was like a coming of age for you.
- [11:09]
Tyler Yasmin
It totally was.
- [11:11]
Amanda Montel
So we would love if you could just off the bat, give your hottest take out of all of the aspects of Jeep culture. The rituals, the pride of driving a vehicle that lends itself to danger, the sort of like, carefree get up and go anywhere attitude, the sexual status symbol element. What do you think sets Jeep owners apart from other car enthusiasts as members of a cult?
- [11:39]
Tyler Yasmin
Oh, that's such a good question. One of the big things with Jeeps is compared to other car enthusiasts, specifically, like in the off roading world, you know, Toyota Tacomas, all sorts of pickup trucks. Jeeps are extremely customizable. You can really make a Jeep your own. You can build it any way you want. Every Jeep can look different, and there's all different generations of Jeep wranglers or even cjs going back. CJ stands for civilian. But really, I think it's this Americana aspect. You know, Jeep was started for World War II or during World War II. And still to this day, Jeep is kind of pushing that Americana aspect in their messaging and their marketing, and I think that's a big draw. At least it was for me. It was for my dad. Other brands don't do that as much. So I think that kind of what sets Jeep apart.
- [12:24]
Amanda Montel
Yeah. Chelsea, I don't know if you feel this way. From what I've gathered so far, just like thinking about Jeeps, reading about Jeeves, I pick up this, like, sense of heroism that Jeep owners tend to have. Little bit. It's like, oh, you need help hauling your stuff. You want to go surfing, you want to go sledding, you want to get out of town, you want to survive the apocalypse. I got you. I got the Jeep.
- [12:51]
Chelsea Charles
I got it. I also think just kind of breaking the fourth wall a little bit. I think it's super interesting that you know, so much about the history of the car that you Dr. And I feel like that plays into the allure that is driving a Jeep. Right. Because I drive my car. I don't know anything about the history, but the fact that, you know, that it was started in World War II just says something about the culture of owning a Jeep.
- [13:17]
Tyler Yasmin
Totally. And I think car enthusiasts in general seem to know the history of their vehicles, but there seems to be a particular emphasis on Jeep history, and I think that's because it's part of the brand. Definitely more so than I would say other car brands or car enthusiast groups.
- [13:33]
Amanda Montel
Yeah. And I also find the juxtaposition so interesting between its origins as this rugged, you know, military vehicle that could save lives through a potential apocalypse and the kind of romance of, like, let's ride down Route 66, you know, like, it's almost like Jeep is there for you in good times and bad times. No matter what you're going through, Jeep will be there. And that has, like, a sort of religious, ritualistic undertone to it. Dare I say. There's just, like, so much lore.
- [14:09]
Tyler Yasmin
Totally.
- [14:10]
Chelsea Charles
Tyler. I have a friend who drives a Jeep, right? And one day I was just riding passenger with her, and she does this, like, secret little thing with this other Jeeper. And for a second I was like, oh, do you know that person? And she was like, no, it's just, like, a thing we do. So did you know, Tyler, that Jeep owners have a secret wave called the Jeep Wave, solidifying their membership in Jeep hood? According to a blog post by Brand Jedco, there are a few theories that can explain where the wave originates, but I just want to know if you've ever experienced that.
- [14:48]
Tyler Yasmin
Yes, I am a big fan of the Jeep wave, and there's some unwritten and rules as well when it comes to the wave that we can dive into.
- [14:56]
Amanda Montel
Tell us.
- [14:57]
Chelsea Charles
I want to hear.
- [14:58]
Tyler Yasmin
Okay, so first I want to clarify saying Jeep. We're talking about, like, Jeep Wrangler and Jeep CJ is not necessarily like, the more SUV vehicles. Those are the ones with the Jeep wave. First up is the age of the Jeep. So the newer Jeep waves first out of respect for the older Jeep. And any Jeep enthusiast could tell the age of a Jeep by just looking at the grill and, like, which generation it is.
- [15:19]
Amanda Montel
Okay.
- [15:20]
Tyler Yasmin
I remember as a kid, I would, like, get upset when a new Jeep owner would pass me, and I was driving an older Jeep at the time. It was a 1997, and I would have to wave first because I would still want to get the wave and so the last second I would wave if they didn't wave first, you're like.
- [15:34]
Amanda Montel
I want you to bow, bitch.
- [15:37]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah. When I drove my dad's old Jeep, he has an 85. I mean I was always getting waves first in that because no one was driving any older than that.
- [15:46]
Chelsea Charles
So I didn't know that layer that's so dope.
- [15:48]
Tyler Yasmin
There's also another layer past that and it's how modded and dirty your Jeep is. So say there was someone else who is driving the same Jeep as me. I would then go another layer, be like, okay, is their Jeep bigger than mine? Is it dirtier that they've taken it off roading? And if so, then I need to weigh first out of respect that they're using their Jeep for what it's intended for.
- [16:08]
Amanda Montel
Thank you so much for this. Cult hierarchy is alive and well in Jeep culture. I love that it's unspoken. I love that it's grassroots. It's not like anyone from the top down is mandating that so and so wave or praise hands this Jeep for this reason. It's kind of this like self authored cult dynamic that is hierarchical.
- [16:35]
Chelsea Charles
Sure.
- [16:35]
Amanda Montel
But so far I kind of dig it.
- [16:37]
Tyler Yasmin
It's really interesting because in 2008 Jeep released the Four Door Wrangler, which made Jeeps become a lot more accessible to families. And so as a result, the Jeep wave actually started deteriorating because a lot of people were buying into the Jeep community without realizing that it was specific community that had these sort of rules as well. So I would notice that certainly like newer Jeeps would tend to waive less just because they necessarily just bought a Jeep because it was a good family vehicle that you could take the top off and it was fun rather than like realizing that there's also this community that comes with it.
- [17:07]
Amanda Montel
Oh, so they're like removing the good culty bits from it.
- [17:11]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah.
- [17:11]
Amanda Montel
Chelsea, do you want to talk about some of the theories as to the Jeep wave's origins?
- [17:19]
Chelsea Charles
One of the theories, according to this blog post by Gedco, says that the Jeep wave started back in World War II when soldiers would wave to one another in solidarity while driving Jeeps on patrol or for transportation. The second theory is that the Jeep wave started after the war when returning soldiers purchased their first CJ or VJ models and waved to acknowledge one another for their honorable service. And then the last theory is that the wave started much later in the 1960s and 70s with the event of off roading culture as a way to salute another kindred spirit. So I don't know, pretty interesting. Who knows where it started, but yeah, it's a little culty.
- [18:04]
Amanda Montel
Totally. A much discussed backstory adds to the richness of the ritual. If you are listening to and even enjoying this episode of the podcast and want to go deeper, I have a book recommendation for you. This is your host Amanda by the way, and the book is called the Age of Magical Overthinking and I wrote it. I poured my heart into this book and I really think you might like it. It's about delusion and obsession in the information age and how the ways in which our minds naturally work are clashing with our current culture. Every chapter explores some confounding irrationality from contemporary society, including extreme cycles of celebrity worship and dethronement, mass embrace of Instagram manifestation gurus during times of crisis, and why our bodies sometimes enter literal fight or flight in response to something as objectively non threatening as a curt email from a co worker. The book blends social science with pop culture analysis and personal stories. And if you prefer audiobooks, I recorded mine myself. So it's kind of like an extension of the podcast. Again, the book is called the Age of Magical Notes on Modern Irrationality and it's available wherever books are sold, your local indie bookstore, bookshop.org, barnes & Noble, or even that one massive online book retailer run by a cult leader. You know the one. So if you enjoy this podcast, I really hope you'll consider checking out the book after zoomies at the dog park, it's time for Drive up at Target.
- [19:34]
Chelsea Charles
In goes a big bag of kibble and one squeaky chicken toy for the good boy. Drive up that's ready when you are. Only in the Target app, just tap Target. This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Knowing you could be saving money for.
- [19:50]
Amanda Montel
The things you really want, like that.
- [19:52]
Chelsea Charles
Dream house or ride, is a great feeling. That's why the State Farm Personal Price Plan can help you save when you.
- [19:58]
Amanda Montel
Choose to bundle home and auto bundling.
- [20:00]
Chelsea Charles
Just another way to save with a personal price plan. Prices are based on rating plans that vary by state. Coverage options are selected by the customer, availability, amount of discounts and savings and eligibility vary by state.
- [20:13]
Amanda Montel
Tyler, you're already using in group terminology like modded. Can you talk a little bit about you know what that means and why off roading or evidence of off roading would make a certain Jeep owner more elevated within the cult.
- [20:31]
Tyler Yasmin
So Jeeps are highly customizable when you go and buy your Jeep. One of the big things Jeep owners do is they'll lift their Jeep so they'll change the suspension out so it can have bigger tires. Which, one, makes it better for off roading? Gives you more ground clearance so you can go over larger rocks, obstacles, et cetera. And two, it just makes your Jeep look really cool. And then you can do all sorts of other things. I had a roof rack on my Jeep. You could put lights on your Jeep. You could change out bumpers. There's all sorts of physics into why this is better for off roading. But to be honest, I think most people do it because it just looks cool and it makes the Jeep look like your own. I've had two different Jeeps. One was a 1997, and then one was a 2015, and I customized both of them. And honestly, I wasn't off roading much at all. I was still using it as my daily vehicle. So whenever I did go off roading, it was super fun. But in terms of the time commitment to off roading versus, like, on road driving, it was like 98 to 2%.
- [21:26]
Amanda Montel
And what does it feel like to drive a car like that? Like, are you hoping that other people's see you with reverence? Are you concerned that people are gonna gape at you agog, like, watching the Hare Krishnas chant through the street? Like, what does it feel like?
- [21:42]
Tyler Yasmin
I think it feels super cool. Especially, like, in the summer, being able to take the top off and the doors. I was definitely an annoying teenager and would, like, blast music driving around with the top off. But my most recent Jeep was a bright yellow Jeep, so that seemed to get a lot of attention.
- [21:59]
Chelsea Charles
So, Tyler, do you have any ducking stories that you could share with us for my Jeep?
- [22:04]
Tyler Yasmin
No, because no one would duck my Jeep. And it made me feel kind of self conscious. I don't know why.
- [22:09]
Amanda Montel
Why wouldn't people duck your Jeep?
- [22:11]
Tyler Yasmin
I don't know. And it was bright yellow. Most rubber duckies are yellow. I don't know if it's a thing out here in Washington or not. I'm more in the city. Maybe that impacts it. But my dad has certainly gotten a handful of ducks on both his old Jeep and his new Jeep as well that he drives daily. My mom bought him a little rubber duck that is flying a plane that he has on the top of his Jeep. So.
- [22:34]
Amanda Montel
All right, but for those who have no fucking idea what we're talking about, Chelsea, like, please help us out.
- [22:39]
Chelsea Charles
Ducking started as a random act of kindness by a Jeep owner named Alison Parliament in 2020 during the COVID 19 pandemic while traveling through Alabama, Alison purchased a pack of rubber ducks and documented herself randomly placing ducks on parked Jeeps. This trend was pretty popular, and many Jeep owners across the US Joined in on social media, creating hashtags duck, duck, Jeep, and Jeep ducking.
- [23:09]
Amanda Montel
Yeah, so it seems to me. I mean, we've gotten requests to do the cult of jeeps sporadically over the years. It does come up every few months. You know, the Jeep owners are like, perceive us. And the number one thing that they always talk about, the number one ritual or evidence that jeep culture is cultier than the average community of car owners, is this ducking thing. And to put it simply, it's literally just like Jeep owners putting rubber ducks on other people's cars for free. As what? Like a little talisman of, like, solidarity and belonging and loyalty and whimsy, you know, it's just like a rubber duck. Like, it's so cute and sweet. Could you maybe analyze a little bit what this. This ritual symbolizes about Jeep culture at large?
- [23:55]
Tyler Yasmin
Oh, that's such a good question. So if you like another person's Jeep, putting the rubber duck on it symbolizes it. So as a Jeep owner, if you come back to your Jeep and there's a rubber duck on it, you're like, oh, that's so cool. Someone drove by and they saw my Jeep and they liked my Jeep. I had a bag of rubber ducks that I would use and put on other people's Jeeps. Generally, it'd be if it was a Jeep that was more lifted or, like, modified, but it's kind of similar to the Jeep wave in a way. It's just acknowledging another Jeeper and saying like, hey, I like your Jeep. That's cool. And I guess differently this time. Like, they usually your jeep's park, so you don't see the person looking at your Jeep, and so. Oh.
- [24:29]
Amanda Montel
So it feels almost like a ghost. Elijah on Passover. It's spiritual because you can't see who did it, but it's new, right? Like, it just came up during the pandemic. So that's very interesting that Jeep culture is evolving.
- [24:42]
Tyler Yasmin
Totally. Yeah. Very new.
- [24:43]
Chelsea Charles
Dang. I want to start a ritual now.
- [24:46]
Amanda Montel
Start one.
- [24:47]
Chelsea Charles
You know what I'm saying? Think about the legacy that Alison has left. The ducking thing. I think it's cool.
- [24:54]
Amanda Montel
It's very cool. And it's, again, so cute. Like, they're just little rubber ducks, you know? And I think the fact that it's inspiring you to want to start a cult ritual says something about this cult in General so far. I don't know. Actually, now that I'm talking it out, I'm like, maybe I'm a little suspicious. Like it's almost too cute. You know, it's so cute that it's making other people want to start cults. Like, what? What's going on?
- [25:18]
Chelsea Charles
So, Tyler, a large part of the Jeep cult is the car club culture. And I have a lot of good friends who are in Jeep clubs. Were you a part of any Jeep car clubs?
- [25:32]
Tyler Yasmin
I did have this experience where I accidentally joined a Jeep club in Utah. That was like a one time thing, so I wouldn't call myself a member of that club, but I happened upon this club while renting a Jeep and just kind of self integrated into their culture.
- [25:46]
Chelsea Charles
You went in a Jeep club, Tyler.
- [25:48]
Amanda Montel
Wait, how did you trip and fall into a Utah Jeep club?
- [25:52]
Tyler Yasmin
There's this more extreme version of off roading called rock crawling, which is you take your jeep up these steep 60, 45 degree inclines and you go like half a mile an hour. And it is the most terrifying thing in the world. It's very popular in Utah or really out west in general. And it's a big aspect of the Jeep culture. You see it a lot on social media when you start looking at jeeps. And we spent a year in Utah, my girlfriend and I, and we went down to Moab where there's lots of off roading trails, and we rented a big lifted Jeep and I was like, oh, let's go try one of these intermediate trails. I had no idea how hard it was going to be. And we showed up and it's just like straight down and you could feel the blood like rushing to your head as your foot is like on the brake and you're going super, super slow. And all of a sudden I was like, wow, this is really extreme. In front of us there was 15 or so j all lifted, all modified. Some of the craziest customizations I've ever seen. And interestingly, it was all older people in their 50s or 60s, people that do it for a retirement activity. And some of their jeeps were over $100,000. They're extremely customized and they're just like, oh yeah, hey, come join us. And we off roaded them for a few hours. I think we went like two or three miles. It was very slow going and then we would just stop and get out of our jeeps and talk. It was a really interesting experience. But after a couple hours we decided to leave because we thought it was a little extreme for us.
- [27:15]
Chelsea Charles
So obviously we all know that car clubs often offer a sense of belonging and community, which is a common reoccurring theme within cults. On the Hammett Jeep Club website, a Jeep club that's based in Hemet, California, the mission statement reads, the Hammett Jeep Club is a family friendly organization dedicated to off road fun. Our club meets on a monthly basis for meetings, raffles and runs within the California area and sometimes surrounding states. Started in the 1940s, the Hemet Jeep Club is one of the oldest car clubs in America with over 70 families involved and a member base of all ages. So obviously I went on the website and I perused a little bit just to see what kind of initiatives they had going on and I found that they had like a president and an E board. Like this is a well established car club because obviously it's very diverse in a sense of. There are some Jeep clubs that go off roading to what you were describing, but then there are like, kind of like corporate esque Jeep clubs. They had events and community service. They would meet up monthly to do road cleanups, which I thought was super cool. And then they did off road runs obviously and then scavenger hunts, holiday scavenger hunts. So I don't know, I thought it was super cute as well. Like similar to the ducking aspect. Like in dissecting this cult so far I've only found fun loving.
- [28:46]
Amanda Montel
I know I like wanna buy a Jeep low key, but I would feel major imposter syndrome. But here's the thing, and this is what I wanna get into next is I feel like from the impression I've gotten, there is a valid way to participate in Jeep culture. That's a little bit the pop culture inspired side and I wanna talk about that. So Jeeps, as listeners may know, first made their grand debut in Hollywood in the mid-1950s and have remained in the spotlight ever since. So my first time I ever saw a Jeep and felt kind of enamored by it was In Steven Spielberg's 1993 film adaptation of Jurassic park, where Jeeps were one of the main focal points of the film. Also Yellow rubber ducky, quack quack. It's said that Jeeps were chosen because of their durability, their functionality and iconic design. That's why they felt like the right car to fight dinosaurs. And they have since become a beloved part of the Jurassic park fandom in general, with enthusiasts of the film restoring and customizing wranglers to match the movie's designs. We found in a blog post on motor design that Karen Lichtenberg, who's a member of NPR's coined term the Jurassic park generation, admitted that as a five year old, she watched the beloved Jurassic park series and became obsessed. So much so that she promised herself as a little girl that one day she would have a Jeep Wrangler of her own. Quote, they drove across the screen and I said, I want one of those. And so it was. Lichtenberg built her very own Jurassic park replica Jeep after finally purchasing one in 2014. So I would love to know from you, Tyler, how do you think Jeep's prominent place in pop culture has contributed to a its cult following for better and for worse?
- [30:33]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah, I think it's really broaden it to a wide set of audiences. Obviously I come from more of like the camping background of Jeeps, but there is this beach community. There's Barbie as well, and then there's Jurassic park as well. And it's the coolest thing. Whenever you see Jurassic park replica Jeep. I've seen a few just driving around before and just like, holy cow, it is super cool.
- [30:53]
Amanda Montel
So Jeepers think it's cool. Jeep owners are down.
- [30:55]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah, especially cause that generation of Wrangler, it had square headlights, which is the only Jeep to do that. And it's just this really wacky Jeep. And Jurassic park just adopted it and brought it into their movie and kind of, I guess saved that generation of the Wrangler because that generation, the Wrangler wasn't selling super well. I think it's brought in a lot. You know, within the Jeep community there's all these different sub communities and different ways to get involved, whether it's just taking your Jeep to the beach or like you said with Jurassic Park. So I think it's positive.
- [31:23]
Amanda Montel
That's beautiful to hear.
- [31:31]
Chelsea Charles
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- [32:01]
Amanda Montel
On WhatsApp.
- [32:02]
Chelsea Charles
No one can see or hear your personal messages.
- [32:05]
Amanda Montel
Whether it's a voice call message or.
- [32:07]
Chelsea Charles
Sending a password to WhatsApp, it's all just this.
- [32:12]
Amanda Montel
So whether you're sharing the streaming password.
- [32:14]
Chelsea Charles
In the family chat or trading those late night voice messages that could basically.
- [32:19]
Amanda Montel
Become a podcast, your Personal messages stay.
- [32:22]
Chelsea Charles
Between you, your friends and your family.
- [32:24]
Amanda Montel
No one else, not even us. WhatsApp message privately with everyone.
- [32:30]
Chelsea Charles
So, Tyler, as with any super successful cult brand, there will be controversy. And Jeep is not exempt. You know that already. Are you aware of any scandals that have befallen the Jeep brand or community?
- [32:45]
Tyler Yasmin
Scandals, no, but I certainly have my opinions and experiences with cons, I would say, but I'm not aware of any scandals.
- [32:54]
Chelsea Charles
Okay, enlighten us. I want to hear.
- [32:56]
Tyler Yasmin
So one of the big things with specifically the off roading Jeep culture is there's this well known, I guess, fact within the Jeep community that Jeeps are kind of money pits. And you can spend so much money not only repairing, but just customizing your Jeep, and it just seems like it never ends. And that was one of the big reasons why I wanted to get out of the Jeep community temporarily. I'll probably end up back in it at some point, but I was spending a lot of money customizing my Jeep and I felt like I've always was like, kind of chasing this dream Jeep build. And then in general, I'd say more modern Jeeps have had some reliability issues and build quality issues. And it's interesting because Jeep has this marketing aspect of being this built, tough, dependable, reliable vehicle that comes from World War II. And then historically, I would say as a consumer, I've noticed, like, quality decreasing over time, which doesn't really align with that. That.
- [33:50]
Amanda Montel
So, yeah, when you were describing the car club that you accidentally joined and how there were these like $100,000 modded builds. Am I getting the terminology right? I was just thinking, like, this could literally be like the Winchester Haunted Mansion. You know, that mansion in California where that, like, widow just built it her whole entire life and it was never finished and she became like, cursed by it. Or to make a culty comparison, this is not the same. But it's like in Scientology, you can never clear. Like, they will find a way to make sure you never go clear. And so I can see how, like, if your identity and your hobbies and the way that you spend your time is really wrapped up in achieving that perfect Jeep that doesn't exist, you could find yourself flailing at a certain point and also maybe even in debt.
- [34:42]
Tyler Yasmin
Totally. I feel like that does happen a lot. And certainly I think if you go on boards or communities, you might see some people really losing money on their Jeeps because, you know, you can invest all this money into it, but then you go and sell it, you're never going to get the Money back on the upgrades and customizations that you built because you did that for yourself.
- [34:58]
Amanda Montel
Yeah. All right, so we've been glowing about Jeeps. This is starting to feel like a Jeep commercial. This is a sounds like a cult episode. And so we've got to get the dirt. No pun intended. Let's talk about some culty Jeep controversies. We do want to touch on two scandals that have befallen Jeep that kind of made their way into mainstream news. Obviously, like so many brands that I use every day have more scandals that I can even name. But for Jeeps, we're just going to talk about two that we were able to find doing our due diligence of exploring every culty corner of this brand and what that could mean. So the first sort of scandal, if you will, regarding Jeeps has to do with a criminal conspiracy. So like many other automakers, Jeep has faced criticism for its role in contributing to greenhouse gas emissions, particularly as it specializes in SUVs and off road vehicles which do historically have lower fuel efficiency. However, in 2022, there was a little bit of a PR crisis. William Stafford for Car Expert reported Jeep and Ram were fined more than $400 million for diesel emissions cheating. So Fiat Chrysler Automobiles, which is, as we know, the parent company of Jeep, pleaded guilty to criminal conspiracy after the company had been charged with making false representations about diesel emissions. And more than 100,000 US 2014-2016 Jeep, Grand Cherokee and Ram 1500 diesel vehicles. So I guess my question for you, Tyler, is we're just really curious about the relationship between Jeep owners and the company itself. You know, about the history and like, there's obviously a lot of solidarity among Jeep owners. But is there a relationship to the company Jeep and does it serve as a cult leader role of sorts at all?
- [36:50]
Tyler Yasmin
I would say no, at least in my personal experience. What I was tied to, what my dad was tied to, was the historic story behind Jeep, the Americana aspect, the World War II vehicle that could do it all, and then the CJS too. I wasn't really tied too much to the modern Jeep brand, especially because, I mean, new vehicles are so expensive. So I was always buying an older Jeep. So, yeah, I didn't feel very tied to it.
- [37:12]
Amanda Montel
That's interesting. Deep, deep in the cult of Jeeps and have like a lot of reverence for it. You might value vintage cars more than someone who like just became interested in Jeeps and wanted to buy something new that ended up being one of those vehicles that was wrapped up in this scandal. Can you think of another Car brand where like there's a. Well, as I'm asking the question, we.
- [37:35]
Chelsea Charles
Already know, can we think of another.
- [37:39]
Amanda Montel
Car brand where the people who drive that car have a cult leader of worship for the leader? And ironically, it's the brand that is purporting to save the world from greenhouse gas emissions. And of course that is Tesla. So that is an interesting comparison because Jeep, the company is not portending to be saving the world. They're just like, oh, we're like the this all American World War II birthed boy next door kind of vehicle. Whereas a brand like Tesla is portending to save the world. And that is another level of cultishness beyond just like, oh, the Jeep wave. That's weird.
- [38:25]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah, totally. And with the brand of Tesla, obviously you have Elon Musk too, and there's no Jeep person equivalent of that.
- [38:31]
Chelsea Charles
Oh, you're right.
- [38:32]
Amanda Montel
Which is all of that. That point that we're kind of making now is not to say that our car brands should not be accountable when they lie about emissions or when they're manufacturing cars that are contributing to the climate crisis that is now burning down Chelsea's in my city. But analyzing it through the lens of a cult, a brand is taken to another level when it has that charismatic leader who is forward facing, clearly power starved and is kind of like dominating the culture. Whereas we've been making the point this whole entire episode, a lot of what's culty about Jeeps was governed by the people. That said, we do have to address one other controversy that can't really go unsaid with regard to Jeeps. So since the 1970s, Jeep has used the words Cherokee and Grand Cherokee as names of its models. In more recent years, the Native Cherokee Nation has called for Jeep to cease usage of the name, stating that it perpetuates racial appropriation. In an article on CNBC written by staff writer Michael Wayland, the principal chief of the Cherokee Nation, Chuck Hoskin Jr. Says that regarding the brand, quote, I think we're in a day and age in this country where it's time for both corporations and team sports to retire the use of Native American names, images and mascots from their products, team jerseys and sports in general. I'm sure this comes from a place that is well intended, but it does not honor us by having our name plastered on the side of a car. And then in an emailed statement from Jeep, the company stated that they are, quote, committed to a respectful and open dialogue with Cherokee Nation principal Chief Chuck Hoskin Jr. And that the names have been carefully chosen and nurtured over the years to honor and celebrate Native American people for their nobility, prowess and pride. So it was kind of like, we hear you and we're ignoring you. So I guess has there been, like, discussion among Jeep owners about this aspect?
- [40:25]
Tyler Yasmin
Totally. So my thought is, you know, the Jeep community is the Jeep Wrangler community. That's where a lot of the revenue comes from, that's where all marketing is, etc. Era so it's weird that they said, you know, we hear you. We're not going to change it. Because, I mean, changing it isn't going to have much of an impact within the community or I don't feel like it would be negatively perceived because they're kind of subset vehicles. Like, the main Jeep is the Jeep Wrangler.
- [40:46]
Chelsea Charles
That is super interesting because I was just thinking about Jeep, the brand. But to your point, the camaraderie and the club culture that's associated with Jeep is 1000% the Jeep Wrangler. And so that wouldn't encompass as those other ones.
- [41:00]
Amanda Montel
I wonder why. Like, but I guess this is like a larger question about leadership at Jeep and values that the average Jeep owner might not be aware of or might not be connected to. Because I just keep thinking about Elon Musk, right? There is not a single Tesla owner who doesn't know what Elon Musk believes. Weirdly, this is a culture that is, in a way, just as fanatical, just directing that fanaticism in a very different way. Way that is more, again, grassroots. They're not looking up Jeep owners from what I can tell. And that might not always be good. I mean, worshiping the leader of a car company is absurd in my opinion. And look how far it's gone in the case of Elon Musk. But turning a total blind eye to the leadership of this brand that you do buy and support and whatever. I'm not saying you, Tyler, but I'm saying, like, for all of us, I do feel like as we become a more conscious culture, it is our responsibility on some level, like, not to just, like, totally ignore the people and the values that are manufacturing the products that we consume. But it's hard. It's so hard.
- [42:09]
Chelsea Charles
Okay, Tyler, I have one more question for you before we transition to playing a little game. And that is, what do you think the number one cultiest thing about Jeep that you've personally witnessed is in a negative sense? And what is the number one cultiest thing you've witnessed in a positive sense?
- [42:26]
Tyler Yasmin
I feel like there is a pressure in judgment based on how much you off road your vehicle and how built it is within the community. And I would say that's more of a negative aspect. The positive aspect is whenever I see someone who has a Jeep, I know instantly I have something in common with this person and I can talk with them. Last year I was driving by my favorite restaurant and this guy was parked on the street with another bright yellow Jeep, the same generation as mine. I was just driving by and I decided I have to pull up over. So I pulled over and I got out of my car and I started talking. We Talked for like 30 minutes. He ended up having like a YouTube channel about his Jeep. Our Jeeps looked very identical in terms of like, customizations. So just having like something in common with another person, being able to talk with them, this sense of community is I think, the most positive thing. And that's another reason why eventually get like an older Jeep would drive around for fun, be part of that community again.
- [43:14]
Chelsea Charles
That is so wholesome.
- [43:20]
Amanda Montel
So now we're gonna play a game.
- [43:21]
Chelsea Charles
So obviously Jeep owners have a lot of quirky behaviors. We're gonna read you a list of Jeep related anecdotes and you're going to determine in your opinion if one is a red flag, a green flag, or a beige flag. AKA something that may be odd, but not necessarily bad.
- [43:41]
Amanda Montel
Round one. This example comes from from the Kendall Judge Chrysler Jeep Ram blog. And the example has to do with the endless modifications. So the blog post reads, quote, a true Jeep lover's work is never done because it's not just about the Jeep you buy, it's about the one you build. From lift kits to lockers, winches to sliders, there are just so many goodies to be had. Hence the extra respectful wave given to drivers of seriously modified Jeeps. All Jeep lovers understand the work that goes into it, and they know that's all part of the fun. Well, clear, not all, because Tyler deserves more waves. Anyway, the sort of endless modification aspect, do you think it is a red flag, a green flag, or a beige flag?
- [44:25]
Tyler Yasmin
I think the endless modifications is a red flag. I'm more of the school of thought that you should just modify your Jeep however you want. And maybe that's not modifying it at all if you just buy the Jeep and that's good for you, or if you just want to add a lift kit or a roof rack to it. But this idea of endlessly modifying your Jeep and always improving it, I think can just be toxic and lead to never being happy with Your Jeep never being happy.
- [44:47]
Amanda Montel
Yeah, that's a red flag.
- [44:49]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah. But if you're able to put it in, just like customize the Jeep however you're liking. If you want Green flag.
- [44:55]
Chelsea Charles
Dang. I'm not gonna lie, I'm a little shocked by that red flag. You came in hot.
- [44:59]
Amanda Montel
Tyler, get ready to play.
- [45:01]
Chelsea Charles
Okay, so the next one has to do with Jeep bumper stickers. It's extremely common to don your Jeep and bumper stickers at red prints. All kinds of insidery buzzwords and mantras. For example, and these also come from the Kendall Dodge Chrysler Jeep Ram Blog. It's a Jeep thing. You wouldn't understand. Stock Jeeps worry me. I'd rather be winching than working. Paved roads are a fine example of needless government spending. Life is simple. Eat, sleep, Jeep. I love that one because I rhymes. I may be topless, muddy, and lost, but never stuck. And the last one following me. Good luck with that.
- [45:43]
Amanda Montel
Oh, my God. Some of those have like a very sort of like anarchical, low key, like libertarian. A little bit energy. Just like. I don't need roads. Roads. All right, red flag, green flag, beige flag. What do you think?
- [45:59]
Tyler Yasmin
I think that's green flag. They're pretty funny. I mean, some of them are kind of cringe, definitely, but I mean, my dad had it's a Jeep thing on all of his Jeeps for so long.
- [46:09]
Amanda Montel
It is an amazing tagline. Did some advertising agency come up with that tagline? It's a Jeep thing.
- [46:14]
Tyler Yasmin
I don't know where that came from, but it's been around since I was a kid. I remember one year for Christmas I got it's a Jeep thing sticker to put on my first Jeep. But yeah, there's all sorts of like funny bumper stickers. I think they're green flags. They're funny.
- [46:28]
Amanda Montel
I feel like, like there's a new wave of obsession with, like putting stickers on your water bottle and your laptop. They're kind of like bumper stickers. And I really feel like when I was a teenager, I didn't have a lot of bumper stickers on my car, but I thought it was cool when other people did because it told me exactly who they were. And so if your identity is all wrapped up in being a member of the cult of Jeeps, how could you resist covering your car? Bumper stickers.
- [46:52]
Tyler Yasmin
Yeah.
- [46:53]
Amanda Montel
Okay. The next three Jeep anecdotes come from listeners who just like you wrote in for this episode. Episode. Oh, wait, one of these is from you, Tyler. We're going to make you categorize yourself.
- [47:07]
Tyler Yasmin
All right, let's see.
- [47:07]
Amanda Montel
I'm very excited. But the first one is not so. The first one is from a listener named Zoi, or maybe Zwa. Not sure. But they say I am a culty Jeep wrangler owner. He, he. My grandpa owned an LJ two door Jeep for decades. So the cult runs deep in my family. The single most culty thing about Jeep Jeeps are the people who buy a 100% stock Jeep and buy their own ducks. I know this is true because I have owned my Jeep for three years and never once been ducked. So this listener is claiming that there are people who just buy stock Jeeps and duck themselves. Is that a beige of green or a red flag?
- [47:43]
Tyler Yasmin
I mean, I think it's a green flag, actually, because I guess that's what my dad did. My mom ducked my dad with this specific plane duck. And then actually when I got my Jeep, my girlfriend and her friend put like 50 ducks on my Jeep. So I've been ducked by people I know, but not by other people in the community. Also, that two door LJ is like the coolest Jeep in existence in my opinion.
- [48:05]
Amanda Montel
Okay.
- [48:05]
Tyler Yasmin
It's very specific. They only made it for two years. So the fact that this listener's grandpa had that super cool. They're really valuable and just really cool Jeeps.
- [48:13]
Amanda Montel
All right, shout out Zwoz grandpa.
- [48:17]
Chelsea Charles
This next one comes from Lily G. Jeeps in Edna, Minnesota, where she's from, are a classic example in showing off wealth. Often I would see rich private school kids with Jeeps putting all the windows and top down, blasting country music out of the car like they were not kids from the Midwest. Moms of rich kids would have Jeeps similarly as a status symbol. There were particularly a lot of white ones, moms and Jackson Jeeps. And the moms who had them usually would be accompanied by a matching white tennis skirt and visor. So what do you say, Tyler?
- [48:54]
Tyler Yasmin
Beige flag? I think that culture exists certainly within Jeep community, especially in 2007 when they released the Four Door Wrangler because families started buying into it. Where I grew up, there was certainly some of that. I wouldn't say it's a positive or a negative thing. It's people making the Jeep their own thing. But I mean, I'd like to say Jeeps are for everyone and there's all these sub communities within it.
- [49:13]
Amanda Montel
Yeah. If you want to make your Jeep toxic, make your Jeep toxic.
- [49:16]
Tyler Yasmin
And that's literally do it you want with your Jeep.
- [49:19]
Amanda Montel
Okay. Before we booked you for this episode, when we were just, like, putting together these different examples. We did pull one from your email, so we're gonna make you categorize yourself. Some listener named Tyler says, I had a cool experience in Utah, where I was adopted into this group of hardcore Jeepers for a day when they saw us off roading alone, getting adopted by a random Utah Jeep car club. Red flag, green flag, Beige flag, green flag.
- [49:45]
Tyler Yasmin
I know I already talked about it, but. But it was just so much fun. And the fact that these people do that, like, regularly, and it's like how they spend their weekends and their time, and it was just cool to see that part of the community.
- [49:55]
Amanda Montel
Okay. Famously, though, you were like, this is too much, and you left.
- [49:59]
Tyler Yasmin
True. So I know my boundaries. It's a little too extreme for me, but it's cool to experience.
- [50:04]
Amanda Montel
Tyler.
- [50:05]
Tyler Yasmin
I'm not a rock crawler.
- [50:06]
Amanda Montel
Boundary king. All right. It's starting to feel like a watcher back. I don't know. That is so funny. Tyler, thank you you so much for joining us for this interview. We really feel like we explored the many facets of this call. Where can listeners keep up with you and your antics? Tyler?
- [50:24]
Tyler Yasmin
So I don't post a lot of Jeep content, but I do post a lot of outdoors and, like, hiking content on Instagram. You can find that at Tyler. Underscore Yasmin. T Y L E R Underscore Y E Z M A N Maybe I'll post some Jeep stuff. There's certainly some stuff on my YouTube if you're curious to see. My. My Jeep builds. I had a 97 TJ and a 2015 JK, and then my dad had a 85 CJ.
- [50:51]
Amanda Montel
So, Chelsea, out of our three cult categories, live your life, watch your back, and get the fuck out. Which one do you think the cult of Jeeps falls into?
- [51:03]
Chelsea Charles
Okay, I feel like Jeeps will fall into the watch your back category for me because of just the scandals that are associated with it, but also, I think they can be a little unsafe because of the unsafe driving practices that the brand promotes.
- [51:20]
Amanda Montel
Oh, yeah. We didn't even get to talk about this, but we did come across an article from, like, 10 years ago in the Guardian. It's titled Jeep Cherokee ad banned for encouraging unsafe driving practices. That was basically like glamorizing off roading in a way that is not safe or recommended for the average driver. And that just goes into the whole culture and messaging of Jeep as this larger than life, capable of anything type of car where it's like the Titanic sank.
- [51:49]
Chelsea Charles
Babe, and that it did. It's also so interesting, the personification that even storytellers give Jeeps because in TV and we talk about in Hollywood, in mash, in Indiana Jones, in Jurassic park, the Jeeps deep represents the heroism. It represents something that's strong, it's indestructible. And people see that in movies and think that you can behave that way in actual real life. And totally that's not real.
- [52:22]
Amanda Montel
Yeah. And this reminds me of something that you were saying that I found so compelling and continues to live rent free in my head. When we were recording the Hallmark Christmas movies episode, which was like, as our culture in general gets more polarized and high temperature and fraught, brands that might have been a live your life 10 years ago or even two years ago are off roading into watch your back territory, like high key. Because I think when people feel lost and scared and uncertain, they put more and more stake and trust into brands, especially the ones that make larger than life promises like Jeep. I think honestly the things that make Jeep look culty on the outside are a live your life, the wave and the ducky and the whatever, even the little clubs and stuff. That's a little bit live your life because it's sweet, it's community, it's belonging. But everything is just starting to get a little watcher back here in our culture right now. It's so silly to like use that terminology, seriously. But like maybe it is a watcher back.
- [53:26]
Chelsea Charles
I'm just saying.
- [53:27]
Amanda Montel
But I also appreciate not always being so aware of the things that the brands you patronize are doing that might be problematic or unsafe or fucked up. We can't be so hard on ourselves when we don't know that we might be participating in a cult brand like living in the information age.
- [53:43]
Chelsea Charles
I just personally feel like you don't know what you don't know. You can't beat yourself up about not having the information. But what's most important is, is when you have that information, what are your next steps?
- [53:56]
Amanda Montel
There's a lot to keep track of.
- [53:58]
Chelsea Charles
There is so much. But also we all have iPhones with the knowledge of everything that's happening in the Congo. But what are we going to do? Are we not going to have devices that, that we rely so heavily on? Yeah, what, what happens next?
- [54:11]
Amanda Montel
You know, I know. And this is another piece of evidence that our culture is getting cultier. It's so hard to avoid not supporting a cult followed brand these days when like late stage capitalism is out here. Late stage, amazing. You know, like that's the dumbest thing I've ever said. But like, brands that become household names become household names for a reason. It's because they gained a lot of power and they leaned into a culture and odds are if everyone has heard of a brand, they've done some pretty up shit. What are we to do about that? It's not that there's nothing to do about that.
- [54:43]
Chelsea Charles
No, there's definitely something to do. But you have to have the information first in order to make an informed decision on what your next steps are.
- [54:52]
Amanda Montel
Are.
- [54:53]
Chelsea Charles
It's not about just being blind to what's going on, but it's about, okay, now what? What are the next steps?
- [54:59]
Amanda Montel
Yeah, it can really get you down. Like trying to be an ethical consumer in 2025.
- [55:05]
Chelsea Charles
Yeah.
- [55:06]
Amanda Montel
You know. Yes, I won't be buying a Tesla. That girl. No, no.
- [55:11]
Chelsea Charles
Musky is not getting my business.
- [55:14]
Amanda Montel
Yeah, I'm gonna stick with my 12 year old. Busted. You see how you see my car?
- [55:18]
Chelsea Charles
No, but it's great for the environment.
- [55:20]
Amanda Montel
The fact that I never leave my house is also great for the environment. Anyway, that is our show.
- [55:27]
Chelsea Charles
Thanks so much for listening.
- [55:29]
Amanda Montel
Stick around for a new cult next week, but in the meantime, stay culty, but not too culty. Sounds Like a Cult was created created by Amanda Montel and edited by Jordan Moore of the Pod Cabin. This episode was hosted by Amanda Montel and Chelsea Charles. This episode was produced by Chelsea Charles. Our managing producer is Katie Epperson. Our theme music is by Casey Kolb. If you enjoyed the show, we'd really appreciate it if you could leave it 5 stars on Spotify or Apple podcasts. It really helps the show a lot. And if you like this podcast, feel free to check out my book, Cultish the Language of Fanatics, which inspired the show. You might also enjoy my other books, the Age of Magical Notes on Modern Irrationality and Word A Feminist Guide to Taking Back the English Language. Thanks as well to our network studio 71. And be sure to follow the Sounds Like a Cult cult on Instagram for all the discourse. Sounds Like a Cult Pod or support us on Patreon to listen to the show ad free at patreon.com soundslikeacult.